>If every nation had a nuke, they would think twice before waging war against each other.
Is he right?

>>280170714 (OP)
Pain wanted to be the only with a nuke, so he could threaten the entire world into peace.

>>280170714 (OP)
Yes, but it'd make the consequences of any wars that do break out so much worse.

>>280170714 (OP)
Yes. Ukraine wouldn’t have been invaded and Iran wouldn’t be getting bombed if either country had nukes.

>>280170714 (OP)
I think you'll like playing the Metal Gear Solid series of games. Each one of them explores this concept.

>>280170768
He said he wanted to sell them for the nations

Think it this way: is it worth losing most of your capital city at some point (when the war crimes stack up enough hate points to get nuked) to start a war, which would most likely make you a total outcast in the world community and the benefits from the territory you may or may not gain will only start offsetting the costs decades later.

>>280170796
Reallity answered the question
>>280170768
This is what Nardo did. He became a walking nuke and his friend and lover sasuke is just the second most powerful man in the entire world. Btw is funny how a manga with the most nationalistic mc to ever exist in shonen has the most liberal fanbase ever

>>280170714 (OP)
He thought they would nuke each other, which would be a good thing because uh pain or something

>>280170714 (OP)
In theory, in a world where every world leader is an intelligent and rational thinker, they would all understand that the risk of a nuke is not worth any material or ideological victory that could possibly be achieved.
In reality, it only takes one unintelligent or irrational world leader for every nation having a nuke to be a bad idea.

>>280171075
But wouldnt the intelligent ones use all their nukes against the retarded nation?
Although Pain was counting that they would all use it against eachother thus fulfilling his masonic-like goal of a massive war to end all wars. I think just like hiroshima and nagasaki they would throw a few nukes and the entire devastation would force them to never use it again out of fear. A hokuto no ken scneario is very unlikely...I hope.

>>280171075
In reality we already have a handful of unintelligent and irrational world leaders threatening everyone else with nukes.

>>280170897
>Btw is funny how a manga with the most nationalistic mc to ever exist in shonen has the most liberal fanbase ever
Pretty funny.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGxAYeeyoIc

>>280170714 (OP)
He's not wrong but it still wouldn't lead to lasting peace. You'd get a few centuries of peace and progress until something inevitably goes wrong and the whole world is engulfed in nuclear fire. The peace would be bought at the cost of those who come after. Human suffering is a constant, it doesn't matter if the price is paid in small sums or a large one at the end.

>>280170768
cool it with the antisemitic remarks

>>280171423
The fact that they're only using nukes as threats and not actually dropping them shows that they're not as unintelligent and irrational as you think.

>>280170714 (OP)
well yeah, would you have been bullied back in school if you could easily hurt him as much as he could hurt you?

>>280170768
No you're thinking of Sasuke.

If everyone has a nuke then no one has it, then they wage conventional war anyway knowing none of them will ever use it.

>>280173803
Because they have tons of checks stopping them from doing so.

>>280170714 (OP)
Yeah, nukes are the ultimate deterrent
The US and other countries push for non proliferation because they want to maintain military dominance.

It was the façade
The plan he told to the other members and it was basically the plot of metal gear revengeance.
But Nagato was just a bitch who wanted "peace".
Obito was a simp.
Madara wanted some mugen tsukuyomi fake utopia.
Imagine being an akatsuki member and just liking the vibe of war and killing just to find out the leadership is all larping faggots.

>>280170714 (OP)
India and Pakistan are constantly firing rockets at each other.

>>280175632
oh no, the warcucks get bamboozled?

>>280170714 (OP)
No. Israel got attacked decades ago despite having nukes. India and Pakistan had multiple wars since both got nukes.
NATO is waging proxy war on russia while they have nukes.

All that would change is the way war is waged, the pursuit of economic and political advantages via force would continue.
Not even counting the retards who think they can keep escalating under the assumption the other side would chicken out of using nukes.

Nukes are a deterrent, but not a prevention of war. Especially once everyone has nukes, waging war against a "nuclear armed" nation becomes ordinary and the deterrent is largely lost

>>280175632
>>280175816
The leader akatsuki needed.

>>280171075
Sll I'm getting from this is that Israel shouldn't have nukes

>>280174772
Sasuke wanted to be the sole leader of the world

>>280177127
He had become so fanatical in his ideal of Itachi that he wanted to be Super Itachi for the whole world as a boogeyman and traitor to mankind to keep everyone united in fear forever.
So instead of ruling the world as god emperor he would have sat in a hideout and occasionally fuck shit up when thought people were getting complacent.

>>280170768
That was basically the USA's doctrine before the Soviets got the bomb.

>>280170805
Isn’t that basically what hashirama did with the nine tailed beasts?

>>280170714 (OP)
No, after rewatching Naruto recently I realized Pain is a fucking retard. He claims war is a senseless cycle of hatred and destruction and that he wants to break that cycle and his grand plan to end the cycle is by waging more war, yeah blow up an entire village, surely that won't create more angry people seeking bloody vengeance against everyone in your tiny war torn village, fucking moron. Every nation already had nukes, that's what Hashirama did when he tamed the tailed beasts and distributed them out to all the other nations, and it didn't work. Pain's brilliant scheme is to end war is LITERALLY to just continue the cycle of war and hatred and do nothing new. Pain is an actual fucking retard and I have no idea why anybody pretends he's not, I'm convinced nobody has actually watched or read Naruto because every discussion about Naruto is just a bunch of people saying the exact opposite of everything that happens in the story.

>>280178683
>Doesn't want more war
>Wage a final more to kill everyone so there'd be no more war
I don't know, seems like a flawless argument.

>>280178480
Yes. Pain is perhaps the worst villain in Naruto, carried only by having a cool aesthetic, cool powers, and being a pivotal part of Jiraiya's and Naruto's character development.

>>280178683
>Every nation already had nukes, that's what Hashirama did
No, a handful of major villages had nukes. Part of the plan was to dole them out to every nation, big or small.
>yeah blow up an entire village, surely that won't create more angry people seeking bloody vengeance against everyone in your tiny war torn village
Well, in his personal case, he was on such a god complex ego trip that he fully believed he could cut down anyone that came for him over the destruction of the Leaf. He considered the Leaf a sacrifice to enact his plan. As far as he knew, Hachibi was covered by "Madara" and he just needed to do this one last gig, and then they'd be able to roll out their nuclear deterrents.

>>280178763
>Wage a final more to kill everyone so there'd be no more war
It's not even that though, waging the 4th great ninja war was Madara's plan, and his plan was to trap everyone in the infinite tsukuyomi where they'd all live in a pleasant dream, so basically just Matrix them. Pain was just blowing shit up so other people could "feel pain" as if he's the only person in the world to ever experience loss, and to sell nukes to countries who already had them. At least him saying "I just want to kill everyone and end it all already" would have actually lead to an end to war, but that's not what he was doing. Pain is just a retard.

>>280178683
>I'm a retard btw
Yes you are.
He wants to spread war to also spread PAIN.
Through PAIN they will know and understand PEACE.

>>280178936
You have to have a negative IQ to think that that would work and that the world doesn't already understand pain. They already had 3 great ninja wars by the time Pain came around, everyone knows what pain is. Pain is undeniably retarded.

>>280178814
Every nation having nukes just leads to a higher likelihood of one nation getting desperate enough to actually use them. In reality war would continue on as normal and there'd just be more silly rules and treaties that would be put in place and then broken during war. Besides, there's only 9 tailed beasts and more than 9 villages, also the tailed beasts aren't equal in power, each one is exponentially more powerful than the last, which is why Hashirama kept the most powerful one for the leaf village and why other nations had multiples to make up for getting weaker ones. Pain's plan is retarded beyond belief and could only even be explained at all by Pain not knowing anything at all about the world he lives in and is supposedly trying to save.

>>280178480
>>280178814
Plus the beasts werent equal in power with the nine tails being unbeliavable OP. >>280178814
The true is he just hated the leaf village and he knew that, he is just an ordinary man full of hate. Remember that there was no reason to do that shinra tensei on the leaf and short his lifespam he just wanted to make them suffer. And he was right to hate them, everything bad in naruto universe that we know was caused by konoha directly or indirectly.

When he exposed Naruto as the faggot, nationalistic, self centered hypocrite he is, he asked a question of how he would stop the cycle and well... The answer was becoming ninja jesus and Kishi had to resort to an Osymandias solution(Kagura) because Japanese are Cowards and they have to lie to their shonen public instead of admiting there is no answer.

so how come pissrael got attacked despite supposedly having nukes
not to mention their vassal state USA supposedly has the most nukes in the world

>>280170714 (OP)
Yes, the difference in treatment between Iran and North Korea demonstrates it. Iran doesn't have nukes and are subjected to monstrous abuse by the imperialist powers, but NK remains without being assaulted. Sanctions are applied to both, but only a faction without nukes can be openly struck with military force or threatened with regime change operations.

Even nuclear weapons testing falls off as more nations get nukes and treaties are made to limit such things.

Before the Naruto villains managed to unite the entire world agaisnt them, who was starting all the wars?
Also looking into Neji's backstory, there's no fucking way he's not racist.

>>280180921
>monstrous abuse by the imperialist powers
kek

>>280178404
AHAHAHAHAHA

Nuclear weapons are fake and gay.
The jap cities were made of match sticks and got firebombed like every other city at the time.
No actual evidence for a nuke, no giant crater, there are intact bridges. ect.
In Japan it is illegal to deny their existence. Sound familiar to any fellow burgers? Like a certain event we aren't allowed to deny?

>>280170714 (OP)
>they would think twice before waging a total* war against each other
Yes he was right. countries that have nukes tend to get in more conventional wars/skirmishes more often, but their wars are much smaller in scope compared to non-nuclear countries. both sides having nukes scares the other party which helps de-escalation. This is why technology that counters ICBMs (like Aegis) have a major destabilizing force, it encourages the side that have such technology to harass even nuclear countries.

>>280170897
>>280171584
Would you say its Obamacore

>>280170714 (OP)

The war arc should be renamed as whatever the fuck happens arc because whatever the fuck is going on rn

>>280178683
It's funny, because his original plan >>280175632 that got retconned into a lie would've been way more effective at achieving world peace as a side effect. Guess Nagato was a retard.

>>280170714 (OP)
That was Hashirama's idea which worked out wel enough. Kids lived long eonugh to drink and conflict went from massive skirmishes to espionage and assassinations.

>>280182051
>hear stories about men who survived both bombs
>don't think much of it
>In Japan it is illegal to deny their existence. Sound familiar to any fellow burgers? Like a certain event we aren't allowed to deny?
oh no...

>>280170897
>Btw is funny how a manga with the most nationalistic mc to ever exist in shonen has the most liberal fanbase ever
Not really, Naruto is a neoliberal nationalist rather than some kind of reactionary ethnonationalist. He's loyal to his local community, which can be expanded to take in anyone, and doesn't even really care about the actual nation they are part of other than the political/economic dictates of the samurai lords. The village and nation systems in Naruto very much reflect the neoliberal ideals, we even get the ninja wars as a founding mythology in the same way that the US and Japan have WWII as a founding mythology for the postwar order. The treatment of the Sand Village is laughably analogous to a naive neoliberal portrayal of Western(plus the colony of Japan) treatment of Middle Eastern nations where those warlike older generations just couldn't make it work and there's entrenched ideologies that have to be challenged but overcoming trauma together will just make the villages become friends. It'd be easier to call Naruto a globalist than a nationalist because he is patterned after the neoliberal conception of giving everyone an equal nation to facilitate a global system of trade and politics. The last arc is a fucking United Ninjas intervention and they even change their headbands like putting on a blue helmet lol

Naruto's politics are a perfect echo of mainstream sentiment in developed neoliberal democracies

>>280179218
>Hidden villages
>On the map

>>280180921
>monstrous abuse by the imperialist powers
The one we have at home yes

>>280182114
yeah total wars of mass destruction would prob not happen again but things would evolve to 5 generation warfare until something even more powerful than nukes get invented.
>>280183850
Well, that reflects a lot of the old U.S. world order. A powerful nation would support the development of countries within the capitalist system, but only as long as they didn’t become a threat or stronger than the power at the top.
Even the Soviet bloc was considered necessary for the system to work, an enemy to rally against, keeping everyone aligned.
Of course, in Naruto everything works out because it’s fiction. I guess it’s the same idea as the Romans with the Pax Romana, or the Church during the High Middle Ages. Relative peace only comes when someone holds absolute power.
As bizarre as it sounds, even if every nation had nukes and equal strength, the natural tendency would still be for one to rise above the rest and totally screw it up.

>>280183850
Well, that reflects a lot of the old US order. A powerful nation would ensure the development of the countries under the capitalist system, while at the same time preventing them from becoming a threat to the system or more powerful than themselves. Even the Soviet bloc was considered necessary for the system to work. Of course in Naruto everything just worked because it's fiction.

I guess just like the Romans and the Pax Romana, or the Church in the High Central Middle Ages, relative peace can only be achieved by someone with absolute power. As bizarre as it may be, even if every nation was equally empowered with nukes, the natural tendency is for just one to end up on top.

>>280170714 (OP)
No Since It just a cold war lel
It a pretend peace until someone decide and says fuck it

>>280185377
Very amusing that people ITT is all for it.

>>280179218
>>280180728
Pain made it sound like he wouldn't be doling out the beasts themselves, but a new form of weapon derived from them. As someone with the eyes of the Sage of Six Paths, he'd probably have the power to redivide the bijuu however he pleases.

>>280170714 (OP)
>nations shouldn't wage war
brainlet take