Batman was kick ass.
Hal Jordan was amazing.

How was Wally as flash?

Was he like Kyle for GL, where he's stronger than og, but not as beloved?

>>149273159 (OP)
suggesting barry is beloved and more so than wally seems like a reach.

>>149273159 (OP)
man calling Kyle less beloved is putting mildly

>>149273159 (OP)
It's largely when I started reading DC so I have a special fondness for that whole era. Byrne was my entry to Superman and the rest.

>>149273248
i don't know. i remember discussion from the time around rebirth not being very friendly to hal daddyfags and a lot of eyerolling when he came back. enough time has passed that it no longer matters because hal has inertia again, but it's not like there was a great clamor for him to be gl. it was seen as johns forcing his fanboy opinions again, like he did in a few other places.

>>149273289
Kyle just had such a a different go of things than Hal.

Also

>Posts about crisis
>Gets primarily gl replies

The gls hardly changed from crisis!

>>149273159 (OP)
Kyle was never stronger than Hal. Kyle got his powers taken away by a subconscious child version of Hal left in Hal's ring. He's that much weaker than Hal.

>>149273159 (OP)
Calling Barry the "og" is next level retarded.
Wally's responsible for nearly everything people associate with the Flash now, and he's more popular among comic readers to boot.

>>149273728
Issue number?

>>149273940
Last Will and Testament of Hall Jordan.OGN by Joe Kelly.

>>149273742
Strong words, from a strong mind. I am eager to see what you could share with me about what all Wally's run did better than Barry. If anything I should've said the OG's were Alan Scott and that helmet wearing jackass.

>>149273159 (OP)
Honestly, COIE kinda sucks.
Like it's a story on a epic scale and important for history, but man. There are just so many fucking plots that go nowhere and it lacks any central characters to follow. Hell, the final issue is follow people who didn't even enter the story till 2/3 into the book.

>>149273159 (OP)
Wally was more popular. Teen Titans was THE biggest DC book in the 80s.

>>149273966
Totally. It's ironic that what it heralded is praised. The whole post crisis, but the story itself sucks ass.

I had a very hard time reading it. It has truly aged like shit.

>>149273966
It had great impact if you were a DC reader at the time
Reading it now? Yeah, it kinda sucks

>>149273947
DAMN what a read. He made Kyle look like a chump!

>>149274446
It wouldn't be the first time, but Hal punking Kyle through his subconscious inner child possessing his old ring set the standard.

>>149273159 (OP)
>>149273993
It's unfortunate that George Perez was such an integral part of two of the most overrated comics of the 80s.

>>149273159 (OP)
Zoomers fucking hate Byrne Superman

>>149274864
So does Gen Y, Gen X, Boomers, ect.

>>149275038
Then who's the fanbase I keep seeing defend it?

>>149274864
>>149275038
Zoomers and Gen Y don't care about superheroes or comics.

>>149275040
I liked it....

>>149274811
you have shit taste

>>149273956
NTA but basically everything having to do with the speedforce and general Flash Mythos came from Wally's run.
Meanwhile the reason the term "Composite Flash" comes up in adaptation talk is that the jokey speedster that we see in things like the DCAU was Wally in personally under Barry's name and design on account of them trying to push Barry again at the time.
If not for the crew of guys who grew up in the 70s and forcibly tried to revert comics back to how they were when they were kids in response to the 90s state of things, Barry Allen would of been a footnote instead of being forcibly pushed, and having his successors feats and character dropped on top of him by the writers and editorial.

>>149273159 (OP)
I grew up on Wally West so I prefer him over Barry. Geof Johns was a moron for bringing back Barry. WW earned his stripes and being demoted is just lame.

>>149274446

The Pros of Post-Crisis:
>Batman
>Wonder Woman
>Wally West
>JLI
>Hal and Kyle... even if it was a bumpy ride at times
>the art from Byrne's Superman
>all the supporting characters that got spotlights going into and throughout the 90s, particularly the works of Ostrander, PAD, Robinson and Brits

The Cons of Post-Crisis:
>Byrne's Superman
>Eliminating all of the silver age elements of Superman and then realizing they were missed and having to ham-fistedly bring it back like Matrix Supergirl
>HEAT
>basically creating a generational "not muh" schism between readers of DC

>>149276140
I think it's funny how Waid and Johns both heavily defined Wally and made him great and then they both fucked him, first with Johns giving him twins and then Waid aging them up, resulting in no one actually wanting to write him any more with all that baggage, leading to the Bart rugpull and Barry.

What is the best Post-Crisis Batman? I've mostly just read the later 90s and early 2000s stuff (so like, No Man's Land, Gotham Central, Legends of the Dark Knight, Dini's run on Detective Comics, Morrison, etc...) and would be interested in reading some of the classics.
Preferably stuff available in trades as I dislike reading comics online and can't afford a billion floppies.

>>149276822
Year One, Killing Joke, A Lonely Place of Dying which follows up on A Death in The Family which wasn't that good as a story, Dark Knight Dark City, the Dixon/Moench/Grant era, their big crossover event stories being Knightfall/Knightquest/Knightsend/Prodigal, Contagion, Legacy, and Cataclysm, Going Sane, John Francis Moore's Poison Ivy stories which include Hothouse and the Poison Ivy prestige format one-shot.

>>149276797
>resulting in no one actually wanting to write him any more with all that baggage

This isn't true at all. Making Bart the Flash was mostly because Infinite Crisis was happening.

>>149276926
Were there any writers clamoring to write the Flash family and disappointed they weren't given the opportunity? Both of these moves were made in an attempt to age him out of superheroism to make way for Barry.

>>149277017
EVS and Didio were the ones who wanted Barry.
Barry wasn't in consideration at the time of Infinite Crisis, because the belief was that Infinite Crisis needed to change up the Flash to get people talking

But Bart as Flash just landed with a complete thud despite not being old or married and they quickly killed him off so they brought Wally back

>>149276822
Legends of the Dark Knight

>>149277054
By Didio's own accounting, they did in fact intend to retire Wally and bring back Barry with Infinite Crisis but they couldn't make it work so they went with Bart as a stopgap measure, never intending him to be a "permanent" Flash.

>>149276822
The Dark Knight Returns

>>149275162
Nope.

>>149275219
>the jokey speedster that we see in things like the DCAU was Wally in personally under Barry's name and design on account of them trying to push Barry again at the time.
How come he acted more like Bart Allen than Kid Wally.

Was it ever confirmed why the gl's hardly changed?

As a matter of fact, what even did change?

>>149273159 (OP)
It was okay, but it was missing a lot of the Pre-Crisis sauce.

>>149279831
They just handwaved it because it would be more confusing to bring it up and actually discuss the implications of Crisis.

>>149279831
Same reason as Flashpoint.

>>149275040
Millennials because Post-Crisis is our DCU, we all started reading around the Triangle Era