How do you cope with the fact that we could all be wrong about this? By that i mean, we could all be lifting weights to get healthy and in 10, 20 years, scientists find out that actually it makes you age faster and it's not really that much better for you than just walking a little bit everyday?

I often find myself thinking about the fact that most of the science around the nutrition and exercise is SHIT because you can't have perfect groups for control, testing and placebo. Yeah, they find out that if you eat X you're going to be healthier, but the subjects are random and a 6'2" person with high T could have different results in the long run than a 5'8'' person with low T, or the fact that genetic factors actually make a difference in how people age, in how they gain body mass, in how they store fat (sometimes skinny people clog up their pipes and suddenly drop dead from a heart attack, most of them don't even realize if something's off with their blod pressure or something).

I don't care, i think the benefits of feeling good about yourself and decent self-steem is worth the tiny risk, but it can be a scary thought.

>>76243452 (OP)
I stopped trusting the science years ago when they tried to convince everyone that cigarettes are bad for you

>>76243464
cigarettes are def bad for u lmfao
t.pack a day and some

>>76243452 (OP)
You might die tomorrow, gotta yolo it senpai.

>>76243452 (OP)
who says I lift for health?

>>76243452 (OP)
The QUI guy also looks like them.

why you faggots care so much about aging you gonna get old anyway have a fulfilling 40-60 years of life then drop dead

>>76243471
they were actually sending people into elementary schools in the 1980's to brainwash the children and scare them by telling them smoking causes lung cancer and emphysema

>>76243452 (OP)
Stop following science and experts. They will tell you to ridicule religion because of "no proof", then invent all kinds of scary shit with even less proof and you swallow it no questions asked. Be aware that you only believ in science because you were told to at school. Ralize that all criticism of religion is just massive projection by materialists.

And finally: There is more evidence for divine miracles than there is for climate change, out of Africa and social sciences, yet people ridicule the former and blindly believe in the latter.

>>76243452 (OP)
anon that is basically true, litterally 30 minutes of exercise a day and weight training extend longevity, but when scientists say weight training, they usually mean grandpa lifting 15lb dumbells, the guy squatting 6 plates will almost certainly suffer more injuries and degeneration.

you dont lift heavy to be healthy, drinking protein shakes and bulking/cutting isnt healthy, its for performance , thats it.
peoples idea of fitness these days are grossly out of touch with reality

>>76243464
why is it so fucking hard for smokefags to just accept that your addiction is bad for you? imagine how ridiculous youd sound if you said "a six pack a day is actually good and the science is wrong"

>>76243615
Does the damage cigarettes and alcohol off-set which you would otherwise have from stress? Then i could see it have some benefits, though a six-pack is a bit much. anon, everyone is dieing left and right arround us and then being replaced with foreigners. the schools look darker each year, our world is crumbling. some people don't give a fuck, but for some it gives stress. and we all know stress is the most unhealthy.

>>76243452 (OP)
By doing a minimalist approach it's very effective in natties. Something like mentzer routine with a single set of a compound and an accessory for each muscle in that compound is fairly low stress and high yield if done every 3-5 days. Weightlifting doesn't have linear output for investment most of the results are produced through a couple sets performed at sufficient intensity at frequencies consistent with your physiology. It'll go most of the way to your natty limit in 2-4 years assuming set loading is optimized. You'll get there with something more intensive maybe 8 months sooner but that's only if you don't injure yourself and if your physical recovery lines up with program which is probably the most genetically decided element most people are going to deal with in training. It just doesn't take making lifting a "lifestyle" to get the most out of it.

>>76243585
>Be aware that you only believ in science because you were told to at school.
No? Science is based on the Scientific method which is all about observation and fair testing. There is no "believing" in science, the results garnered from the scientific process simply become passive truths about the world. Not believing in science is like saying you don't believe water is wet.

>>76243452 (OP)
Above certain point it literally is less healthy than just being fit and lean, do you think all that highly vascular muscle mass does any favors to your heart? Do you really care though? Humans have genetic limits for a reason, if you consciously choose to go over it you agree to sacrifice some health for it. If you chronically drop below 10 or so %bf that is not great for you either. Being fit is great, but drop the illusion of body building/power lifting and any other extreme activities being "healthy". And yes, lifting, just like any intensive activity, does make you age faster, you just to it more gracefully.

>>76243621
no, certainly smoking actually causes a greatly increased level of stress hormones and any "relief" from puffing on a smoke just about brings those stress levels down temporarily to what a non smoker feels normally.
as a smoker I can comfortably it fucking sucks dude and I really wish quitting was a little easier.

>>76243752
I think at this point "i don't believe in science" is less literal and means more along the lines of
>i don't believe they're structuring studies to get honest results
>i don't believe the conclusions they're drawing from this information is supported by the study itself
>i don't believe they'll ever repeat or follow up on this study
>i don't believe this is being published for any other reason than it supports its research journal's bias
And so on and so on you science in practice isn't some uncorruptable thing. You can say that's not real science that's not real communism but in practice it is.

>>76243452 (OP)
the real blackpill is that the "moderation and common sense" boomers are probably correct, with their gay-ass powerwalking etc. the fitness field is a great place for grifting and scams since it preys on deep set insecurities

>>76243765
Cytisine pills and a drinking straw cut to length of a cig. You will thank me later anon.

Yeah gymcelling for anything other than naturally raising your T levels or generic self-fulfillment it's typically a lost cause in most if not all departments.
Women aren't really into it, muscle is the last thing they value, they will always prioritize face and height and status before that. What they are really into is how broad your shoulders and neck are and that's it.
Even when we speak of actual physical combat raw strength is completely deprecated given knives and firearms exist, agility/speed/stamina is where it is at if you are looking to survive in some urban jungle shithole, not being a hypertrophic tank.

>>76243752
Imagine saying this after covid

>>76243774
They need lifting. It is the big thing they are missing (that plus dumb diet ideas.) The loss of muscle, bone density, robustness, etc with aging is not accounted for by their approach.

>>76243796
Disagree. Women care about more than neck and shoulders, and every body part is improved with some muscle. Even the almighty 'hands.' As far as fighting strength helps a ton in getting people to avoid starting things with you and in getting out of an encounter intact.

>>76243797
low quality bait

it astoundingly takes very very little to reap the benefits of exercise, and they are weighted towards cardio over resistance training.

and what is considered vigorous activity is the start of zone 2 training, so even doing 20 minutes of resistance training or cardio a day is already double the recommended amount per week.

Fitness is a marathon, not a sprint, you risk injury the harder you go.

>>76243797
just because some evil corrupt bastards abuse the process and lie to people doesn't mean that the principle has changed.
those people are not real scientists and that became clear from the moment they shut down the debates and banned people for asking questions.
asking questions and being skeptical of results is a massive part of the scientific process and as soon as that shit started to happen with covid that just confirmed to me it was all just conmen trying to get me to take poison.

>>76243803
I'll bite anyway because why not?

>>76243802
>Disagree. Women care about more than neck and shoulders, and every body part is improved with some muscle.
True but it's a very small influence compared to face and height

>As far as fighting strength helps a ton in getting people to avoid starting things with you and in getting out of an encounter intact.
This only applies to civilized, high trust, first world societies where you can't carry lethal weapons therefore your size actual matters.
In a degenerated turd world setting it all comes down to who has the best guns.

>man has been recording data about fitness for millennia
>somehow scientists might discover something tomorrow that disproves everything we know about the long-term effects of exercise
make it make sense. We know that light but consistent cardio and resistance training is the best for longevity, and I'd bet my left ball that no scientific research is gonna be able to dismantle this

>>76243821
research shows that the lions share of health benefits come from cardio, to the point where you should probably just lift 2x a week and for the rest of the week do cardio

>>76243831
Yes cardio and resistance are not only the meta when it comes to longevity but also actual physical combat.
Strength is a fucking meme.

>>76243837
no, strength is actually everything in terms of the health benefits of muscle.
But strength in this context is strength to get up from off the ground, or to right yourself when you are imbalanced, it isn't powerlifting 9000 lbs.
Physical combat leads to serious chronic injuries, if not of the body, then of the head, and is very bad for longevity. The benefits of physical combat come from conditioning, which is just cardio.

>>76243492

>>76243803
What the fuck are you talking about you idiot moron? How is that bait? Do you think you're back on reddit? The whole covid hysteria was based on 'trust le science' and what was revealed is le science is completely full of shit.

>>76243809
Idk you sound kind of small and weak and gay

>>76243831
>>76243849
You are just so dumb. Stop talking please.

There are different types of sciences. If your "research" is you talking to trannies, taking notes about what they feel and try to compile whatever your "results" are into something cohesive, that's as much pseudoscience as the flat-earth.
However, how can one be anti-science when we are using stuff that is derived from science, such as computers, monitors or the internet? Some sciences have facts, just like the laws of gravity or that antibiotics made much more easy for people to survive injuries that, back in the day, would get infected and lead to your death...

But there's shit like nutrition, fitness, psychology etc that are mostly taking very educated guesses about health. Just consider what nutritionist recommend, most of them are either following a fad (keto/carnivore/paleo/vegan) or trying to structure people's meal in a way that no one will ever follow (6 tiny meals a day), but, at heart, what they are doing is basic CICO. Every study is either redudant and shows what most people already know or are "revolutionary" and fake paid-off bullshit. Damn, i remember nutritionist wanted people to show the "Super Size Me" doc every class back in the day, now it's pretty much been confirmed by the guy that he's an alcoholic and most of the damage done to him couldn't be 100% confirmed to be from eating MickeyD's because he was drinking himself into a stupor every nigh.

tl;dr: not all science is bad, just gay sciences.

>>76243948
low quality bait failure frustration

>>76243452 (OP)
>we could all be lifting weights to get healthy and in 10, 20 years, scientists find out that actually it makes you age faster and it's not really that much better for you than just walking a little bit everyday?
Doesn't make any sense, unless you're overdoing it. Every other animal gets constant exercise just by living their life. We don't because of modern bullshit so working out is a way to compensate.

Now, if you're going to extremes and doing powerlifting or bodybuilding shit then yes, we already know that these things will shorten your lifespan, especially if you add in all the various performance enhancing drugs. Same for shit like regularly doing aggressive bulking/cutting cycles or refusing to do cardio. But just working out normally? No, absolutely no reason to think it's anything but good for you.


>>76243520
Your mind doesn't change as you get older. Your body will age but the way you feel inside your head at 60 is basically the same as you felt at 20. You don't magically stop being yourself because you get older and you don't magically lose the will to live either. If you ruin your health when you're young because
>lmao it doesn't matter because i'll be old anyway and i'll just die
then all you'll have accomplished is making yourself one of those old people who is in constant pain and misery.

>>76243452 (OP)

>>76243452 (OP)
I don't care about aging. Well actually I do and it feels like something is wrong with the fabric of existence that we all get put here as living beings, and have to suffer through something so incredibly fucked up as aging and declining.

But all I care about is feeling nimble and fluid. I want to feel light on my feet, I want to feel like I can do everything effortlessly, I want to be able to do my kung fu perfectly, I want to be able to climb as fluidly as a monkey. I would rather live as a highly sprung spring for 50 years and die than decline from the age of 40 like a rusty door hinge and live to be 70-80.

Also if you want to use science in the context of exercise, look at human evolution first. Forget about biochemistry and all that shit. The blueprint for how to function optimally is found in how our ancestors lived. Those are the conditions that decided what traits they passed on and how our bodies function mechanically and biochemically. Those are the conditions that you are built for, keep that in mind when you try to improve yourself. The most you can be is brought out by simulating those conditions, mentally and physically. After that, you can start to learn more about human biomechanical morphology, biochemistry, behavioural endocrinology, genetics, etc.

This book is really good: https://wwnorton.com/books/9781324061748

>>76243452 (OP)
Exercise isn't healthy, we've always known that. It's the compensatory effects that can be considered healthy, which are contingent on excellent diet and recovery. People who chronically exercise are just going to age faster and induce health problems. That includes people who gymcel every day. Try training twice a week max and you will find all your health markers improve.

>>76243762
based post

>>76243452 (OP)
>we
Shut the fuck up, nigger
> Yeah, they find out that if you eat X you're going to be healthier
No they didn’t lol. Literally never happened

>>76243452 (OP)
That's a lot of hypotheticals to work your yourself into a tizzy about femboi

>>76243831
Swim every morning
Lift every night

Simple as. I do this so I can eat cupcakes and ice craem.

>>76243452 (OP)
What do you mean? I'm not lifting weights to live longer, I lift because I enjoy being strong and I want to look better.
On top of that we know that being more muscular generally means you are more protected, less likely to hurt yourself as bad when you fall, better able to fight off assailants, muscles aid in fighting off diseases including cancer and even poisons, they drastically help your body control its tempature, lifting heavy weights also strengthens your ligaments and increases your bone density, making a lot of things that kill old people like broken bones that don't heal properly and oesteoporosis much less likely etc.

>>76244132
How rich are you that you can afford the time to swim and lift everyday? If it was just going to the gym or doing the exercise, that would be one thing, but there's the time to prepare your meal, time to eat, washing your clothes, probably time to and from work etc.

>>76243452 (OP)
Despite SOICENCE mostly being retarded bullshit, exercise has actually been studied (using the scientific method before faggots got hold of science) and proven to be good for you since the dawn of humanity. Results can be replicated and there is tons of proof that exercise and longevity go together.

Stay off the weed bro it's making you fucking retarded.

>>76243599
Based and true dubs

>>76244146
I think i could have expressed myself better. I'm just a guy thinking, honestly. Damn, scientists are always proving each other wrong, that's the scientific method - i'm not even saying that exercising is bad or that science will at one point say that exercising is bad.
I'm just taking from point A to point B, point A being "science is always correcting itself" to point B being "what if what we know about fitness and nutrition is wrong". Not that point B is true, it's just one of those ideas that are somewhat interesting to think about a little bit.

Lifting is extremely important. The focus has only been on the cardio system. The exclusion of the muscular system. Training the muscular system is far more important. You can get in good cardio shape in a couple weeks. Building strength takes months at minimum because it overhauls the whole body. The idea that it's just vanity or something is stupid, but also helped by all the vain idiots like (you) who treat it that way.

>>76244138
I'm not rich and I bust my ass as an attorney billing ~8 hours a day. I get up at 5:30 a.m. to be in the pool. I am in the office at 8:30 a.m. I go home, change and go straight to the gym by 7-7:30 p.m. Sometimes a little later depending on work. Then I come home around 8:30-9 p.m., spend an hour eating and pass the fuck out by 10 p.m.

I make good money and will be rich in a couple years. But I am also just dedicated. I don't want anything less than my best. Go hard or go home, pussy.

>>76244138
Also I live with my mommy and sometimes she makes me lunches :)

Dry cleaning for work clothes. Otherwise I just spend Sunday getting all my bullshit done. Figure it out nigga...

>>76243452 (OP)
who the fuck is lifting weights to "get healthy"?
retard, just do a jog a week and few pushups

>>76243452 (OP)
>People have been doing THING for thousands of years, since before recorded history
>AKSHUALLY THE SCIENCE SAYS THIS IS BAD FOR YOU!
This kind of shit is why I take anecdotal evidence over anything some retard learned in "school"

>>76243464
So smoking has been healthy all this time?

>>76243452 (OP)
>scientists find out that actually it makes you age faster
Utter bullshit, my grandad used to be massively into bodybuilding back in the day and though he stopped nearly 20 years ago he still has a fantastic physique for his age (he's in his late 80's), and is also cognatively better than 95% of people his age

>>76245989
Maybe your Grandad smokes 50 a day and that's why he is so healthy?

>>76245989
was he a top or power bottom?

>>76243452 (OP)
>become jacked and strong
>live less
Only benefits.
>uhmm take steroids then to live even less
No thanks, I've seen the cursed physique and stupid opinions of the lolcow Mike Israetel

>>76245964
It's not healthy but compared to things like
>living in a city
>processed food
>high fructose corn syrup
>obesity
>ozempic
>antidepressants
>vaping
And other vile shit smoking is not actually bad

>>76244864
When do you have time to see your wife and kids?

>>76245964
The problem isn't tobacco, it's all the pesticides they spray all over it and they don't have to wash it because it's technically not for consumption.

>>76244864
See
>>76244870

My girlfriend is a classics professor at a nearby university. I see her on weekends.

>>76246162
>Working so hard for a leftist roastie working at Uni
LMAO you ain't ever having kids, and if she decides to adopt she's going to change their gender

>>76243452 (OP)
It does make you age faster.
It does make you healthier.
Until you can figure out how to stop DNA from corruption, humans have a maximum timeframe.
Spend the time you have masturbating and whining about people not finding fat people attractive, or do something else.
Suffer regardless.

>>76243575
They can fuck you up if you smoke a lot, and/or high tar tobacco, and/or intensely like 3 cigarettes in 10 minutes. But then they also kill you with x-rays.

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2025/04/429791/popular-ct-scans-could-account-5-all-cancer-cases-year

>>76246002
Nah he never smoked, he did cut through asbestos pipes with a power saw regularly though

>>76244146
>exercise has actually been studied (using the scientific method before faggots got hold of science) and proven to be good for you since the dawn of humanity. Results can be replicated and there is tons of proof that exercise and longevity go together.

It's like horseshoe theory, but real. If you don't exercise or you're a professional in physically hard sports, you're screwed, but if you lift weights and walk you're good.

>>76243464
what the fuck are you smoking
no matter what smoking is bad for you

>>76246186
Do you even know what classics are? She teaches Latin poetry, not sociology. I thought Rome was based?

>>76246299
>no matter what smoking is bad for you
Where did you learn that lie, medical school? I mean fucking everything is bad for you in some way, but nicotine can prevent brain degeneration. Is Alzheimer's bad for you?

No one gets out alive you know.

>>76246317
They insert ideology into literally everything, you sound out of touch

the meaning of life is mogging and cooming

lifting is good because it helps you do both

>>76243831
No it doesn't

The strongest predictive physical performance metric for longevity is grip strength

>>76246317
Reminder that Maths is racist an sheeeit

>>76246328
You sound bitter and lonely.

Also she literally has to submit a curriculum that supports the "western cannon." The state forces the curriculum to not be onions. I'll reserve my comment on whether or not that is good.... but who sounds out of touch now?

>>76246407
You still do. I've taken these classes. They absolutely have leftist ideology. You probably think "woke" started in 2014.

>>76243452 (OP)
That lifting is good is self-evident by the fact it makes the body beautiful. The Beautiful, the Good, and the Truth are ultimately connected.

>>76246444
I'll be praying for you to find joy. You don't have to live this way. But do yourself a favor and stop consuming /pol/.

>>76246444
Oh ok, you studied Catulus? How was it woke?

>>76246579
So yeah you're a clueless lefty, about what I figured. You probably think it's not propaganda or ideological unless it has black transgenders giving monologues about oppression in it. Somehow an expert in the humanities but blind to all subtlety and messaging that is less obvious than a bullhorn.

>>76246583
What are you, retarded? I have read the classics, on my own. That isn't why you go to university. You can just do it yourself. You go the university to study them as part of the curriculum. The curriculum by NECESSITY is part of a broader worldview. Right? You are trying to make sense of things within a worldview.
Now what worldview is absolutely all-encompassing in universities in the current year?

>>76246401
"Maths"
For when you want to sound like a retard using a single word.

>>76243464
>ash in your lungs is good for you actually

>>76246592
You said you took those classes. As in the courses we were discussing. I'm not reading the rest of your post. You need real help anon.

>>76246678
I took classes on Rome I read the classics by myself.
I see you have nothing to actually say since you are avoiding my point.

>>76243520
Aging incels thinking that if they look young they can still make it.

>>76243772
Correct

>>76246599
Checked

>>76246599
Yeah, thats why I stick with small dose edibles
>but I NEED the high NOW
Fucking addict, have some control.

>>76247625
>addict talking about addictions
Sweet zamn.

>>76247677
Hope you never touched a drop of booze otherwise youre an addict by that logic.

>>76247782
Low IQ comeback. I don't drink at all. You need to take "small" doses, that makes you a bitch.

>>76247346
Why would you go to college and take woke classes

>>76243452 (OP)
It’s not a self flagellation ceremony most of us like going to the gym. Plus beyond the lifting itself, there’s a halo effect to improve other parts of your life too; like limiting junk food, sleep, cutting alcohol, hydration, etc. You can’t convince me a natty lifter on a decent diet is going to have a worse life than an average person who only walks to McDonald’s and back.

>>76243452 (OP)
I don't do it be "healthy". I do it to look good and get stronger.

>>76248328
THEY'RE ALL WOKE. THAT'S THE POINT.
I don't know. MAYBE some obscure math class or something isn't. But they all operate from a basic framework of wokeness. So ANYTHING that has a narrative or opinion will by default have a woke narrative and opinion.
Also, FYI, you are required to take explicitly 'woke' classes as requirements.

>>76248402
And you went in knowing that?

>>76243452 (OP)
Roiding ages guys, going for natty does not.

>>76243452 (OP)
Lifting is healthy. Eating good is healthy. Not being a roidtranny is healthy. Even if not all of the 1000 health benefits related to working out are true, it is still healthy. Everything is a cope and crab propaganda.

>>76243452 (OP)
OP acting like exercise was just discovered a few years ago and thinking studies will start to show it does nothing for your health.
OP also acting like he has never seen people look older than their age

>>76243452 (OP)
You can wake up tomorrow and a tire that flew off a car on the freeway could be skipping over the retaining walls, over the grass, down your street, and doing 95mph directly into your fucking face. It's not really something rational to worry about, but it can happen.

If it turns out in 20 years that lifting weights is actually bad (it isn't), then that's something you can adjust to in 20 years. What's important right now, is does your body feel good about it? Are you feeling good in your day to day life with the only negative drawbacks really being that your muscles are sore?

Of course, if you're on a bunch of gear you're going to die by 42 anyways but that is not relevant to moving weight.

>>76243452 (OP)
>scientists find out
Do scientists lift?

>>76245964
cigarettes increase test and are basically a superfood

>>76248538
No, not really. What difference does that make? What point are you trying to make?

>>76248910
That u r gay and retarded