Ive been doing mma/bjj for a couple of years now, however because of personal circumstances Im going to be moving. The only gym close to my new place is a judo school. Is it worth it to try and learn judo? How does it translate to mma/bjj?

>>76278244 (OP)
It's effective and it will get you fit
Try it, see if you enjoy it. If you've done BJJ before, it will feel very familiar, but with a lot of standup wrestling and less ground fighting

>>76278244 (OP)
focus on foot sweeps
judo is very effective for mma
khabib normagendov is a judo black belt
everyone says he's bjj he hates bjj with a burning passion and has even been seen wearing shirts saying "if it was easy it would be bjj"

I did judo for a few months and it was great. I highly reccomend it. it's very tough physically and will teach you how to easily grab someone and put them in the ground

>>76278244 (OP)
>Opinions on judo as a martial art?
Old school Judo/Jiu Jitsu is one of the few arts that worked great in warfare, especially WW1 and WW2. However, the Japanese Judoka lost in hand to hand to the German Jiu Jitsu enjoyers during the Chinese-Japanese War, back before Japs allied with Germany. Back then, Germany was allied with China. This changed quickly during the war, ofc, but there you go. Modern Judo, however? Well, pic related.

Still interested? Look up the training books by Draeger on archive.org.

martial art styles dont really 'translate' to mma imo. mma is a specific meta and basically its own martial art now. this is in large part because of how its scored and how short the fights are, and how much weight cutting is necessary.

even in like the 2010s judo rarely got utilized and when someone pulled a throw off in a fight everyone would spaz about it and hype it up.

judo is still a cool martial art and one of the better ones to practice. never done it personally though.

it seems like you could get highly varying results training because its not so popular too. what i mean by that is one gym might be a complete waste of time while another might have a solid pool of people to train with. this is as opposed to bjj now which has so many people training that you can get decent training in anywhere.


anyway those are just my opinions

I did it for years but stopped because of the injury potential. In the span of any given year you'd see one or two catastrophic injures, like somebody blowing out their ACL or snapping their arm in half. Also, occasionally somebody would suffer a nasty concussion or straight up get knocked the fuck out. I looked into it once (long after I stopped) and there's research that shoes judo has higher injury rates than BJJ and wrestling which totally doesn't surprise me.
That's not to mention all the tweaked and broken fingers/toes, hip wear, shoulder wear, knees getting beat up, etc.
All that being said, it's very fun though and allows you to completely ragdoll any retard of the street, so don't let me being a pussy discourage you from trying it out.

>>76278562
>pure bjj and judo mma fighters: *exist*

>>76278575
No such thing exists beyond amateur levels anymore - of course striking and grappling specialists exist, but they're always at least competent in the other style as well out of necessity

>>76278571
jamie bring up that video of the random steroid abuser taking down a judo black belt and going even with an olympic judo competitor

>>76278575
idk what this even means. mma hasnt had pure practitioners since the veryt early days

>>76278244 (OP)
Judo is great, and outside of olympic rules is a pretty well rounded grappling style. Despite what a lot of people think a lot of judo techniques can be translated easily to work without wearing the gi. Just make sure that you take the time to learn the techniques that are in the curriculum, but not allowed during competition (eg grabbing the legs, leg locks, certain chokes and joint locks, &c). Some schools won't teach them at all because they're not competition legal, other places will teach them only if you ask to learn them.

>>76278660
>Some schools won't teach them at all because they're not competition legal
I'm pretty sure that's most schools
Tbh the best approach to be a well-rounded grappler is cross-training BJJ (groundwork, submissions) and Judo (standup), if you have the means to do so

>>76279219
>cross-training BJJ (groundwork, submissions) and Judo (standup)
I must have just gotten really lucky with my judo school. Olympic rules are their own separate class, and the standard classes involve all the traditional techniques including leg grabs and the transitions into groundwork. I'm sure the groundwork isn't as intricate as BJJ because we don't spend the whole time on the ground, but we don't stop after an ippon either.

>>76278244 (OP)
Just do greco-roman instead

>>76278244 (OP)
if its good why not check it out? if you wanna improve your skill you gotta be practicing even solo, idk maybe show up with some shit that your teachers dont know or even be able to beat them outright 100% of the time.

>>76278244 (OP)
Try it. Not gay like bjj because you are standing and very few occasions where you have to be in missionary while a middle aged man that smells like piss with shit breath is making you absorb all of his sweat. Because of this Judo gets a 10/10. Probably the least gay grappling martial art and launching people is sick af.

>>76278244 (OP)
Judo is a great sport
>How does it translate
Kindof not great due to the quirks of both sports, but it stands on its own merits and it's well worth training
Learn to break fall and keep your chin tucked when you're thrown to avoid smacking your head off the mats

>>76279914
standing grappling mixed with striking is rarely used but the best muay thai guys are comfy standing and grappling from the same stance, if op has an actually good judo gym he would be a much better martial artist id even go there and im heavily biased on striking.

every single useful technique in judo(i.e. the ones that don't rely on your opponent having convenient handles on their sleeves and collar and not standing straight up chest to chest like a retard) is contained within wrestling and nogi bjj.
it's retarded to train only in a gi and expect it to carry over to situations without the gi. simply training nogi bjj and working with under/overhooks, handfighting, etc. will get you a deeper understanding of traditional "judo" concepts than training judo itself.
thank me in a year

>>76278244 (OP)
what are the risks of judo (wrestling too) on brain health, i know its not as much as striking but head trauma (cte kind) occur from repeated small head trauma and trauma can happend from body slams not necessarily direct head strikes

>>76280197
>what are the risks of judo (wrestling too) on brain health
no where near as high as any striking sport because people don't usually hit their head on the ground. judokas are taught to do breakfalls, and wrestlers are taught to turn to their stomachs. coupled with the fact that both are taught to tuck their chins and shrug their shoulders they largely prevent the head from directly striking the ground. That's why judo has no headgear, and wrestling only uses headgear to prevent cauliflower ear.

>>76278244 (OP)
id really like to add it to my skillset since if someone steps in on me after going for a hard kick i gotta be really good with hands and up close if they go to wrestle, that being said me personally from here id rather learn wrestling then more judo and mt to be able to form it into the style i want.

>>76278244 (OP)
I like it because I hate shooting in.

Trained Judo in 2002 - 2005 as a teen when leg grabs were allowed, got back to it in 2019 (as well as doing freestyle wrestling simultaneously for the last two years).

Judo is fun and gives you one of the most useful skills when living in the area where it snows - the breakfalls. Not sure if you need it for ragdolling people on da streetz unless you are retard starting bar brawls, but breakfalls will help you a lot to avoid injuries during winters.

Moreover, judo compliments wrestling perfectly (uchi mata as a single leg counter, trips to create opportunities for your attacks) and vice versa (changing stances to avoid throws, scrambles).

Moreover, both grappling arts learn you to take dominant positions instead of guard preferred by most BJJ schools. And this blends in BJJ/MMA perfectly since you learn to dominate and constantly pressing your opponent which very exhausting for most butt scooters. Look how Merab Dvalishvily, who trained judo, then switched to MMA and add some wrestling, dominated O’Malley.

>>76278244 (OP)
just do wrestling. it's like judo but more straight badass and tough.

>>76278244 (OP)
It is literally wrestling+bjj but better.
Since a lot of throws put the opponent over your shoulders and you rotate them this will make your punches, specially hooks extremely powerful.
Judo grip strength is superior to every other form of grappling/wrestling because they control the entire body in a explosive manner as opposed to say bjj that lies on the ground holding to the go which is good for isometric strength but not for strength and power.
Wrestling only controls the wrist to move it out of the way and go fo a leg takedown or a bodylock to perform a throw, judo perform the throw off wrist control, well gi control but since the strength requirements are much higher it translates to wrist control effortlessly.

Retards think that you can only do judo with a gi but you can literally do every single judo technique with minor modifications.
Tawara gaeshi and Sumi gaeshi counter double and single legs respectively to perfection.
In mma is very common to get stuck in the clinch against the cage where judo sweeps would mog.

Judo already has tons of submission and something that does better than bjj are reversals and back takes that are perfect to counter wrestling heavy top control but obviously mixing them does nothing but improve them as long as you don't fall into bjj bad habit of just accepting the bottom position which is why they keep losing to wrestlers.
Albeit i would say wrestler are a bit faster i unironically think judokas are stronger because they pull and control the arms.

There's nothing but benefits from training judo.

>>76278244 (OP)
Heavily neutered over time to the point where being defensive and stronger let's you beat anyone under advanced black belt

If you add punches to the face it's even more pointless

>>76278324
Khabib didn't train judo until a couple years ago after he retired and even if he did even back when he competed in sambo he almost exclusively shoot for the legs and would have done the same in judo and then abandon it like merab did when they banned leg attacks.
Even if they competed in sambo or train in judo dagestanis are exclusively wrestlers and the proof is when islam fought volk, the first thing you learn in judo is to break falls and the second thing is that you should use sweeps against manlets and shoulder/hip throws against blankets because those are most effective against them but islam never once tried a single sweep against volk, he kept shooting for the legs because he and all dages are wrestlers, even though wrestling shares some techniques with judo, they almost exclusively shoot for the legs and very rarely do something else.
So while yes judo is very effective for mma, attributing it's effectiveness to dages that hardly ever used judo techniques is retarded

>>76278244 (OP)
Few things are more dehumanizing that launching a full grown man through the air at terminal speeds like he is a small bag of potatoes.

>>76282757
Other benefits of judo for mma is that since you control the arms, most throws allow you to land on side control or kesa gatame effectively skipping the opponent guard as opposed to leg takedowns that make you end on you opponent legs or guard and need to pass it before doing something else, is not particularly hard for wrestler to do that but it's still an advantage to skip the guard.

There's 3 types of grapplers on the ground, what i call rollers, fat fucks and eels.
Rollers are the stereotypical bjj guy that will butt scoot, pull guard and constantly roll over it's back or shoulders to get a better position, this are good against eels but weak against fat fucks.
Fat fucks are guys that are good at top control, they get on top of you and they are heavy and very hard to move, wrestlers are very good at this because in wrestling you win by pinning your opponent on it's back, they mog the shit out of rollers because they don't give them space to move but are weak against eels.
Eels are guys that you can't pin down because they are very good at getting their hooks in and break your posture which allows them to escape and will usually reverse the position getting you in a pin or taking your back.
They are strong against fat fucks because top control can only apply pressure in one direction and they use other areas to get out but because they look to create space this can allow rollers to roll away.

Judo is the only style that teaches all 3 styles of grappling as a single system so it will give you the best rounded ground skills.
To be fair bjj also teaches them to a degree but most bjj schools are almost exclusively rollers and the ones that are good at top control usually have a wrestling background.
Back takes and reversals exist in bjj but this is the least developed skill in bjj.

>>76282757
>>76283010
wrestling is better for mma since besides the obvious that cage fight is happening without clothes wrestler puts much more pressure on opponent and has better understanding of leverages/kinesthetics/throwing out of balance then judo hence why it's much harder to be good judoka then wrestler. Judo is much more situational so it's harder to apply effectively and i am talking about traditional style not castrated olympic rules judo

>>76283253
No.

>>76282035
I don't what it's like in Judo but one of the drawbacks of wrestling is that you fall to the ground in a defensive position it trains your instincts to avoid being on your back. If you are in an actual fight one of the worst positions you want to be in is on the ground with your stomach facing the ground trying to stand up. It leaves you completely exposed. I say this as a former wrestler.

>>76283489
well if you are a real good wrestler realictically there is zero chance you will encounter someone who will take you on the ground on 1v1 situations in the first place and if said someone brought his friends/has some sort stabbing weapon you are fucked anyways spine exposure or not. that's why there is saying wrestling is king of 1v1 duel but boxing does better in 1vs2+ fights since in that case you don't want to close gap and/or take fight to the floor, again spine exposure or not.

>>76283489
Nta but in judo is very common to turtle to prevent pins or submissions which is just a bad as what you describe.
Is common that in martial arts competitions there's instances where the opponent can get into horrible positions that leave them defenseless but can't di anything about it because of the rules.

>>76283253
The only thing I would give wrestling over judo in MMA is that wrestling probably gives you a better toolkit at getting the takedowns that are likely to actually work in MMA. Judo practitioners have and amazing sense of balance and leverage, that is how they pull off those flashy throws. Judo also trains you better for the ground game than wrestling.

>>76282905
>Gracie Barra patch
That about explains it

>>76283542
Judo kinesthetics/leverage are more static and strength based compared to any kind of wrestling really in which contestants apply much more pressure and are more explosive compared to judo. though i agree on throwing part as they are more fleshy in judo, through supplexes and some body throws are no less impressive especially in greco. Judo has submissions and better finger fight necessary for well rounded grappling, but otherwise wrestling is better.

mma is gay

>>76284117
You take that back

>>76284117
No wonder you think about it in a thread about judo unprompted.

>>76284203
Jizzing Unprotected in Dude's Orifices

>>76278244 (OP)
I love fighting grapplers, they always tell you to come at them because they want to put you in a hold and whisper "let it happen" like a creep that kills cats. Just fake them out because you know they're going to try and grab you and when that fails they try to tackle you at the waist, just hop back and they fall on their face. I haven't done this since college but it never failed, grapplers are their biggest pussys on the planet, learn how to strike like a man and get a gun.

>>76283555
Explain it.

>>76284958
They absolutely suck.

>>76280097
I think you're mostly correct, but I wouldn't completely discount judo or the gi.

The gi carries over partially to fighting with clothes on, provided there's clothing worth grabbing.
An ice hockey jersey or a denim jacket is great for grabbing.
A winter jacket can be good for grabbing.
A Georgian grip is legit. A Georgian grip + pant grip is legit.
And on the ground, grabbing basically any clothing is legit.
Obviously it's very different with strikes involved, but it gives you some background knowledge to figure it out when strikes become involved. Combat sambo obviously teaches this better. Maybe kudo would teach you this well. It's very hard finding material or a school from these styles though.

Another thing is isolation. MMA fighters will do punching-only training ie boxing. Apparently this helps them get better punches compared to regular striking rounds. Judo focuses on upper body grappling plus foot sweeps and trips. It may help you focus on those things. I'm not sure how legit this is.

Another thing is theoretical vs in reality knowledge of techniques. Theoretically BJJ could teach you gi standup perfectly. In practice even the best BJJ teachers lag behind the cutting edge of judo, and the average BJJ teacher simply is not good at judo. Theoretically an elite American wrestler could teach you some trip, but he might actually be lagging behind Judo, because Judoka focus on it.

Judo definitely has good naming. Wrestling names are not as good. It is definitely worth learning the judo names for moves.

Also you need to consider the reality that you can't always train in the perfect environment. Maybe you don't care about the gi. But training in the gi could allow you to get in twice as many grappling sessions.

>>76283010
>best rounded ground skills
totally delusional
like 90% of submissions are illegal. what can you actually do? an armbar and collar chokes? most no gi chokes are practically illegal
you can just shell up for 10 seconds in turtle or bellied out and get a reset

>>76278244 (OP)
It's okay if it's the only option. Focus on being aggressive in sparring vs endless grip fighting, and do no-gi after class with other interested students.

>>76282035
Uchimata is not the first counter to single leg you should do, and uchimata as counter is way different from uchimata as throw. Wrestling > judo, I say this as someone who did judo.

>>76283555
Not only this but also judo black belt is also bjj black belt

>>76283010
Man wtf you literally never trained in your entire life

>>76286296
he pops up frequently anytime someone mentions self defense or martial arts.
he usually has no idea what he's talking about and has said before that seeing red lile a gorilla is more valuable in a fight than actually knowing how to fight

>>76284958
Notoriously low quality, belts awarded based on attendance rather than merit
While some individual gyms do put out good quality athletes, on the whole the franchise is a quintessential McDojo

>>76286376
>>76284958
To expand on this a little, they do things like force you to only train in their branded gear and generally monetize absolutely everything, they often ban their members from cross-training in other gyms, enforce gay ass cultish rules like this: https://graciebarra.com/gb-news/the-rules-of-the-gracie-barra-school/ etc
As far as quality goes, you can find testimonies (mainly on Reddit) from GB black belts who went to another gym and got absolutely mauled by their purple or even blue belts

>>76286296
>>76286301
Ywnbaw.