Thread 17908714

Origen, one of the most influential early Church fathers, literally castrated himself on account of Matthew 19:12.

>For there are some eunuchs, which were so born from their mother's womb: and there are some eunuchs, which were made eunuchs of men: and there be eunuchs, which have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven's sake. He that is able to receive it, let him receive it.

I've considered cutting myself root and stem. I can trace all my problems back to groundless lust. No more gooning. No more being kicked in the balls by my stepfather. A beautiful, smooth, virgin front. The penis always disgusted me. Tell me why, in this world of nine billion, cutting off my cock n balls is wrong ?

>>17908714 (OP)
>Origen, one of the most influential early Church fathers,
He's not considered a church father by the Catholics, Orthodox or Protestants.
>literally castrated himself on account of Matthew 19:12.
Well no wonder he's not a church father. He's a retard. Nowhere in that verse does it command someone to castrate themselves

There is no more noble endeavor for Christians than chopping off their cocks and balls. It is the ultimate commitment to turning away from the worldly lustful ways and towards the God of the Skies.

>b-but muh hecking wholesome sexosexonakad-
1 Corinthians 7:8
Repent.

>>17908731
>Well no wonder he's not a church father.
Yes he is
> Nowhere in that verse does it command someone to castrate themselves
Yes it does
"He that is able to receive it, let him receive it"

>>17908737
>Yes he is
Citation needed.
>"He that is able to receive it, let him receive it"
He's talking about marriage, not castration.

>>17908737
>>17908742
Also the word "eunuch" was used for anyone who didn't engage in sex, either because of religious devotion, or preference, or for being castrated. But it's not limited to castration.

>>17908747
No it meant castrated person. Look at the original Greek.

>>17908756
>No it meant
It meant celibate, which doesn't necessarily mean castrated.

>>17908759
That's just not true

>>17908731
Origen really is the dumbest of the dumb. All of his writings are free-association drivel.

>>17908714 (OP)
>Origen, one of the most influential early Church fathers, literally castrated himself on account of Matthew 19:12.
... claimed his enemies while coping and seething over his impending nomination for some church-related position.

Origen is a religious Rohrschach-test. ask any theologian what does he disagree in with Origen, then step back from out of spittle range and take notes.

>>17908759
it literally says eunuch lol

why do christjews always ignore the plaintext

>"if it cause you to sin pluck your eye out or cut your member off"
>uhh actually jesus really didn't mean it that way..

>>17908866
>it literally says eunuch lol
Which means, celibate. You massive retard.

>>17908901
It means castrated or genitally deformed you retard

>made eunuchs by men
>eunuchs from the mothers womb

that's what eunuch means. if it mean celibate they would just use celibate

>>17908909
>that's what eunuch means. if it mean celibate they would just use celibate

GOD'S WORD® Translation
>For example, some men are celibate because they were born that way. Others are celibate because they were castrated. Still others have decided to be celibate because of the kingdom of heaven. If anyone can do what you've suggested, then he should do it."

Good News Translation
>For there are different reasons why men cannot marry: some, because they were born that way; others, because men made them that way; and others do not marry for the sake of the Kingdom of heaven. Let him who can accept this teaching do so."

International Standard Version
>because some men are celibate from birth, while some are celibate because they have been made that way by others. Still others are celibate because they have made themselves that way for the sake of the kingdom from heaven. Let anyone accept this who can."

>>17908922
corrupted translations made by squeamish men

the greek literally says eunuchoi lmao

>>17908930
1. a castrated person (such being employed in Oriental bed-chambers)
2. (by extension) an impotent or unmarried man
3. (by implication) a chamberlain (state-officer)

>castrated
>impotent
>unmarried
>chamberlain

https://biblehub.com/greek/2135.htm

Retard.

>>17908934
>impotent
>unmarried
>chamberlain
those only apply to the modern English word 'eunuch', the greek work eunuchoi in the third-century was only used with the meaning of a castrated men

>>17908953
>the greek work eunuchoi in the third-century
We're talking 1st century AD here, anon.

>>17908714 (OP)
Historically, eunuchs held various roles in the management of harems as trusted servants. They were trusted by men with multiple wives. You see this in modern day with "gays" who're focused on helping women stay fashionable, doing their makeup, making them look more presentable for their husband, etc.

>>17908934
how do other men make you a eunuch?

how can you be a eunuch from the womb?

fucking hell you are retarded

you already cut your foreskin you golem might as well cut your dick

>>17908983
>how do other men make you a eunuch?
Castration.
>how can you be a eunuch from the womb?
Some sort of genital deformity, or simply being born with a low sex drive.

>>17908986
there you go

its not fucking celibacy. it's about castration or destroyed genitals

>>17908956
still don't make a difference as all those meanings beside 'castrated man' are modern meanings that were not associated with the word eunuchoi in late antiquity

>>17908993
>its not fucking celibacy
Celibacy is just not having sex, for a number of reasons, maybe you got your dick chopped off, maybe you were born with some kind of deformity, maybe you took a religious vow, maybe you don't have a very high sex drive.

>>17908999
We know retard, that's not the fucking point
the point is that verse is not talking about celibacy but about man making themselves eunuchs for the sake of Christ

>>17909040
>the point is that verse is not talking about celibacy-
You're one who doesn't understand that eunuch includes many things, not just outright castration.

Holy shit you're retarded.

>>17909051
whatever

rabbi yeshua supports castration

get your religion affirming bottom surgery already for the sake of jewlord

>>17909051
No, the koine greek word eunuchoi, during late antiquity only meant castration
The other less conventional meaning you are trying to hold to only happen in modern english

>>17909090
>No, the koine greek word eunuchoi, during late antiquity only meant castration
1st century AD is late antiquity to you?

>>17909051
>>17909090
Also the word used for celibacy in all other parts of the new testament is 'ágamos'
If Jesus was just talking about celibacy that would be the word used in the gospels, not eunuchoi

>>17909092
there's no mention of the work eunuchoi with any other meaning besides a castrated man before the modern period
at this point you are just arguing from pedantry

>>17909097
Don't play this game with them. I've seen this kind of back and forth many times. Show them what the text says with a real dictionary.

The precise meaning of the verb εὐνουχίζω (conjugated as εὐνούχισαν in Matthew 19:12) is “to castrate”. All translations should say “castrate” without obscuring the meaning.
https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0057%3Aentry%3Deu%29nouxi%2Fzw

The reason we know the verb means "castrate" is because that is its only attested meaning according to the citations given.

>>17908714 (OP)
which is why he is not "Saint Origen" in Catholicism or in any sane Orthodox movement.

>>17908722
Bro

>>17909386
Why do you hate enunchs so much anon? Is it so bad to simply want to think about God unencumbered by eros?

>>17908722
Pretty sure LHRH agonists might be a better route to take than genitally mutilating yourself anon

https://medievalhistorygeek.wordpress.com/2014/02/09/did-origen-castrate-himself/
>Eusebius relates that in addition to avoiding suspicion while teaching girls, Origen castrated himself because he misunderstood Matthew 19:12
>The problem is, Origen constantly cautions people not to read scriptures literally.
>I want to offer a specific quote which I consider the key piece of evidence, for my opinion anyway. In On Prayer, XX.1, Origen writes: "Let us suppose there is a difference between church and synagogue. In its proper sense the church has no spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but is holy and blameless. Into it enters no bastard or eunuch or one castrated..."
>the above passage is the deal breaker for me.
>When you read Eusebius’ account, it comes across as contradictory. Eusebius says he did it partly to be free from slander and then says he couldn’t hide it, however hard he tried. If the reason for becoming a Eunuch was to avoid slander, wouldn’t you have to let folks know about it?

>>17909593
>the discussion has to center upon the possibility that this was an invention of his critics, particularly Demetrius. Eusebius specifically attributes the story getting out to the Alexandrian Bishop who, as he was nearing death, seems to have developed a hatred of Origen.

>>17908714 (OP)
>one of the most influential
not really. his works are simply prolific. in the end most people disagreed with him on many important points. his self-castration became a source of infamy forever after (because no one else interpreted the verse that way).

>>17909640
Neither did Origen most likely, see above. But then it isn't surprising that people who follow a religion based around treating anonymous writings as the certain truth would also credulously accept whatever slander is floating around about people.

>>17908714 (OP)

False.

>>17908722
>>17908714 (OP)
based and Klingsor-pilled.