Thread 18114461

Even after Manzikert they still had a strong economy and a large, high quality army. In structural terms they didn't look worse than their neighbors.
Were the internal divisions that big of a deal?

>>18114461 (OP)
What's the Greek Empire?

>>18114461 (OP)
>why
fate of empires

>>18114461 (OP)
>why
self destruct

>>18114900
he meant the empire of the greeks

>>18114461 (OP)
>Were the internal divisions that big of a deal?
yes, constant civil wars caused it to fragment from within. hiring roach mercs certainly didn't help either.

They inherited the roman tradition of a general declaring themselves emperor after winning a minor skirmish

>>18114461 (OP)
>Were the internal divisions that big of a deal?
No. They were literally conquered from the outside by the Crusaders and the state was destroyed. The successor states had none of the institutional or military advantages of the earlier state, an annihilated economy as every single part of the former empire was attacked for decades on end and upturning of local society by new feudal manors and structures. That is when it became unviable, with the extra disastrous civil wars by Kantakouzenos destroying what they had left, leaving them unable to even fight back any longer.
>>18114900
He's being a contrarian.

>>18114461 (OP)
Unironically the crusaders, after the 4th crusade its a miracle they even survived at all. Constantinople had turned into a city state and it would’ve fallen decades earlier if Timur hadn’t chimped out on the ottomans

>>18114461 (OP)
80% muslim hordes and 20% being backstabbed by Venice

>>18115473
>>18115507
civial wars is why 4th crusade even happened in the first place. cope harder alexios.

>>18114900
The Empire ruled by the Emperor of the Greeks in Constantinople.

>>18115473
>>18115507
If they were not weakened to begin with they wouldn't be destroyed by a few Crusaders.

>>18114461 (OP)
You mean the Grecoroman empire.

>>18114461 (OP)
You can only be brown and gay for so long.

It's the fault of like the last 5 palaiologos.
They kept selling their position to outsiders to help them overthrow their cousin or brother in civil wars to the point by the end the empire was basically only the city and a few outposts.

>>18115717
>a few Crusaders.
I would not call a massive army and fleet of career soldiers to be 'a few'

>>18116395
4,000-5,000 knights
8,000 infantry
300 siege weapons
10,000 sailors and marines
60 war galleys
100 horse transports
50 troop transports
10,000 Byzantine infantry and city militias
5,000 Varangians

This is not the kind of army that would destroy a huge empire. When that happened the Empire of the Greeks was already weakened.
Compare that to when the Turks besieged Vienna, the capital of the Holy Roman Empire

> 120,000–125,000 (only 100,000 were available during the siege

Consider the Siege of Damascus in the 2nd Crusade where the Crusaders had 50,000 soldiers.