Thread 63849795 - /k/ [Archived: 1020 hours ago]

Anonymous
6/17/2025, 4:23:49 AM No.63849795
anegio
anegio
md5: 33c0c0c16e2cf1b306d6259113fdbba0🔍
Two memes that needs to die. Browning already gave us .380 ACP and .45 ACP, which will do everything you want these to do, but better. We didn't need to import metricslop eurokek chamberings.
Also now that we are about to enter the age of legal and cheap suppressors, there's no reason to use any chambering that isn't subsonic in essentially every loading (like 9mm and 40 S&W).
Replies: >>63849837 >>63849934 >>63849988 >>63850152 >>63850250 >>63850295 >>63850558 >>63851076 >>63851144 >>63851186 >>63854035 >>63855712 >>63856144 >>63857611 >>63858420 >>63858915
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 4:32:46 AM No.63849837
>>63849795 (OP)
>cheap suppressors
Unless you can add a suppressor onto my glock 26 without adding any length or bulk, I think I'll stick with my supersonic defense loads
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 4:57:42 AM No.63849934
>>63849795 (OP)
Fuck ya
mudda
Replies: >>63849963
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:04:53 AM No.63849961
.40 is an extremely good cartridge actually.

The problem with .45 is that it's not loaded anything like as hot as it can be.
Replies: >>63849977
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:05:11 AM No.63849963
>>63849934
why would you say such a thing?
Replies: >>63849969
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:06:03 AM No.63849969
>>63849963
because I like to
fuck ya
mudda
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:09:45 AM No.63849977
>>63849961
Why load .45 hotter?
The best part of the cartridge is how low the pressure is and how slow the bullet flies. You can often see the bullet in flight and it keeps the concussion down.
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:11:14 AM No.63849982
in the coming age of integrally suppressed pistols, we need to have everything we do now but in subsonic. this requires using heavier projectiles but wristlits won't be able to cope so we'll accept external hollow point bullets like extreme defense, um based
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:12:08 AM No.63849988
>>63849795 (OP)
why not roll with .32 ACP
Replies: >>63849993
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:12:54 AM No.63849993
>>63849988
>semi-rimmed
please
Replies: >>63850001 >>63850001
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:14:13 AM No.63850001
>>63849993
>>63849993
thats fair i forgot about that
so why not roll with .25 ACP
Replies: >>63850020
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:19:13 AM No.63850020
>>63850001
25 acp is also semi-rimmed
Replies: >>63850038 >>63850038
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 5:23:40 AM No.63850038
1656044442415
1656044442415
md5: 599c655e06d57802bc254499f3063990🔍
>>63850020
>>63850020
>25 acp is also semi-rimmed
i gotta stop drinking before posting
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 6:00:27 AM No.63850152
357 Sig train coming through_thumb.jpg
357 Sig train coming through_thumb.jpg
md5: e97a8cd7b8fbb4ef83f88f4fa2e92b50🔍
>>63849795 (OP)
Agreed.
Bullet technology has advance enough where .380 ACP has caught up to 9mm terminal performance. 45 ACP is still the gold standard fore reliability, and for punching big holes in people and being a proven man stopper.
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 6:43:17 AM No.63850250
9x18-ballistics
9x18-ballistics
md5: e9f4dce80e688e4d99bbf890526cfb2b🔍
>>63849795 (OP)
.380 and .45 are depreciated and a superior round was already invented to replace them
9x18 and 10mm
Replies: >>63855660
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 6:59:47 AM No.63850295
>>63849795 (OP)
>we are about to enter the age of legal and cheap suppressors
>legal suppressors
Least retarded 9mm hater.
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 8:25:43 AM No.63850558
>>63849795 (OP)
Correct. 185 grain jhp .45 is the best handgun round ever devised
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 12:18:55 PM No.63851076
>>63849795 (OP)
An interesting thing to think about is that 9mmP became the modern default pistol round because it became the default SMG round during the course of WW2, and a lot of that is due to the Brits being slow to develop their own SMGs and self loading pistols before the war. The Lancaster SMG (basically an MP34) was the only SMG in British service when the war broke out, which led to the devlopment of the Sten as a simplified version of it, and there was no reason to change the 9mm chambering as Britain's only other handgun rounds were rimmed revolver rounds, which also led to other wartime SMGs like the Owen being chambered in 9mmP, and post war with all the surplus MP40s, Beretta M38s floating around it just made sense to adopt 9x19 as the NATO SMG round, which then meant pistols also had to be chambered in it.

Before WW2 9mm Kurz and 7.65x17 Browning were preferred as pure pistols rounds, and I think they would still be more popular today if 9mmP didn't get adopted as NATO standard or intermediate caliber assault rifles were developed earlier.

I actually quite like 9mmP but I love shooting suppressed and having subsonic loadings be standard would be great, and 9mm Kurz would be fine for most pistol applications. .45 ACP is a retarded cartridge though and should just die already, its just scaled up 9mm Kurz. It literally only exists because of some retards dick size insecurity projected onto his sidearm, and its kept alive by fudds and fuddy sport shooting power classes.
Replies: >>63851160 >>63851382
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 12:57:07 PM No.63851144
>>63849795 (OP)
>claims he cares about suppression
>spouts the fuddlore that suppressors are only for subs
>thinks 9mm doesn't have sub loading
>thinks 9mm doesn't suppress better than 45
yeah we've seen this movie a billion times before
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 1:04:43 PM No.63851160
>>63851076
>but I love shooting suppressed and having subsonic loadings be standard would be great
What the FUCK are you talking about? Exactly how fast do you think the most standard cheap basic bitch 147gr 9mm you can find anywhere goes? Is 985fps more or less than the speed of sound?

Sometimes I don't know with this place. People can be sarcastic and it's too subtle for me but posts like this read serious yet holy shit, it's not like it's some weird esoteric loading for 9mm it's one of the absolute top 3 most common. It's the super fast light stuff and +P/+P+ that's relatively new. I mean, you CAN find more boutique heavier loads as well, I know at least one company makes 9mm all the way up to 165gr/800fps, and it's not radically expensive at 33cpr. But you can find normal pressure 147gr the world over.
Replies: >>63851199 >>63851253 >>63854141
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 1:09:19 PM No.63851169
9×21mm SP-10 cyки нeгpы
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 1:21:03 PM No.63851186
>>63849795 (OP)
>Also now that we are about to enter the age of legal and cheap suppressors, there's no reason to use any chambering that isn't subsonic in essentially every loading (like 9mm and 40 S&W).
.38 Super would like a word.
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 1:28:35 PM No.63851199
>>63851160
The moment the first Trump/Hillary election happened, this place got filled with shills and faggots who don't shoot. The /k/ommandos who were building bombs in their basement and posting schematics have now left and I don't know where to follow my flock.
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 1:47:38 PM No.63851253
>>63851160
Nigga I live in a country where I can only find a single brand of non hollowpoint 147gr 9mm at only one gun shop in my region. I was overjoyed when another shop recently said they would be importing 140gr Sellier and Bellot. I also pay 45-50c USD for the cheapest 115gr winchester white box 9mm, subs go for 55-60c USD per round.
Replies: >>63851355
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 2:21:29 PM No.63851355
>>63851253
Oh, well in that case bummer and sorry for your difficulties. We all have to deal with our own law shit, good for you for doing what you can regardless. Here you can buy endless 147 starting at 23cpr, about as cheap as 9mm gets anyway. 50+cpr is getting into fancier EDC defense rounds, not that price really matters in that case.

That said, 147gr is still a standard loading. Your own country's weirdness isn't your fault, but it's not a fault of the cartridge either. And fwiw subsonic doesn't make THAT much difference in suppression, not nothing but the supersonic crack is pretty overrated if you look at sound measurement. Assuming taking care of complete burn (and related frp) and everything else that produces more noise subs will help you get you even lower, but you get most of the benefit of a good can with anything. I mostly use supers despite being able to get subs, both for training and edc. Frangible is all super and lots of fun, even useful once in awhile too.
Replies: >>63854141
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 2:29:29 PM No.63851382
>>63851076
>which then meant pistols also had to be chambered in it.

9mm was chambered in pistols for over a decade before the first SMG existed.
Replies: >>63852756
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 7:04:17 PM No.63852756
>>63851382
Yes, retard kun, but I am talking about how it achieved near universal popularity between the end of WW2 and today.

My argument is that widespread use in SMGs on both sides of WW2 led to its adoption by NATO which led to it becoming the standard modern chambering for pistols.
Replies: >>63858967
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 10:01:33 PM No.63854035
>>63849795 (OP)
40 is heavier, larger diameter only gives up a couple rounds in the same frame, out performs 9mm in every fucking way and has very manageable recoil. Yes let's end this nonsense. 9mm can't compete to 40.
Replies: >>63854163 >>63855058
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 10:22:55 PM No.63854141
>>63851160
>>63851355
147 gr uses lead bullets and that's going to be phased out
Anonymous
6/17/2025, 10:26:47 PM No.63854163
>>63854035
based and true
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 1:02:55 AM No.63855058
>>63854035
Most of the reason people accuse 40 of being "snappy" is because the flowchart for making a .40 for most manufacturers involves making the 9mm first, and then fitting .40 in it.

Glock's finally stopped doing that shit and beefed up the Gen5 40's, and as if by magic the "snap" went away. How about that.
Replies: >>63855229
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 1:42:32 AM No.63855229
>>63855058
The recoil spring weight being the same for the 17 and 22 was the issue in my opinion. Easy fix. Its going to feel snappy for the 40 when the same resistance to slide movement is applied to 9mm and 40.
Replies: >>63855654
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 3:22:57 AM No.63855654
>>63855229
They did the other thing; increased slide and barrel mass. Added 3oz to the gun.

The problem with just springing things tighter is that the gun becomes more ammo sensitive.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 3:25:03 AM No.63855660
>>63850250
10mm is a meme round that should've died in the 80s, it soldiers on solely because of people over-compensating.
Replies: >>63857782
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 3:40:37 AM No.63855712
>>63849795 (OP)
Browning wanted the 1911 to be in 9mm. The US government was retarded and refused.
>Also now that we are about to enter the age of legal and cheap suppressors, there's no reason to use any chambering that isn't subsonic in essentially every loading
It's not like it takes effort to find 147gr 9mm. You're too stupid to own a suppressor, you WILL destroy your hearing and burn yourself.
Replies: >>63857616
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 5:38:25 AM No.63856144
>>63849795 (OP)
.380 is just worse 9mm, and .45 is fat and slow.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 2:42:52 PM No.63857611
>>63849795 (OP)
> Also now that we are about to enter the age of legal and cheap suppressors, there's no reason to use any chambering that isn't subsonic in essentially every loading (like 9mm and 40 S&W).

Suppressors are never gonna be standard or even common on pistols. On rifles, yes. But the whole point of a pistol is that is sacrifices in every metric all for the sake of wearability/concealability. So I don’t see a future in which people abandon this and sacrifice wearability as well. Besides, pistol shots aren’t as deafening or painful as rifles, so it’s not like it’s a borderline necessity.

Anyways, even the most rabid detractors of 9mm would never dare call it a meme, as it’s one of the most popular and successful cartridges in history. It’s been the default chambering of pistols for decades now. Actually, technically 9mm is a meme, in that it has gone viral and achieved saturation in every market everywhere, lol.
Replies: >>63857854
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 2:44:32 PM No.63857616
>>63855712
Didn’t he also design the Browning hi-power around 9mm?
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 2:45:06 PM No.63857617
Caliber wars are so fucking boring. Is there a more useless topic?
Replies: >>63857676
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 3:10:22 PM No.63857676
>>63857617
One of these days, a caliber war with birth a new cartridge that everybody’s happy with and then we will all stop arguing. We just have to keep at it, and keep arguing until this happens. Have faith, anon.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 3:48:28 PM No.63857782
>>63855660
I wanted to like 10mm because Jeff Cooper was based, but I kind of agree. It's pointless ever since things like 45 Super and modern handguns that can take it were developed. Really 45 +P is fine as it is with modern hollowpoints. I don't feel like 10mm realistically does anything better unless you are concerned about having one or two more rounds in the magazine.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 4:08:54 PM No.63857854
>>63857611
>Suppressors are never gonna be standard or even common on pistols. ...So I don’t see a future in which people abandon this and sacrifice wearability as well.
I don't agree with you, but mainly because I think you're not really visualizing what tech is actually capable of and how much the NFA has held it all back. Even with a totally traditional baffle stack design, an integral weapon can achieve top class performance while adding very little to OAL. Maxim 9 is a good demonstration: the entire suppressor bit adds like 3" in long mode since it can extend downwards. Now apply that to 380 instead, and with modern 3D printed designs that can go even shorter. Additionally, wipe based designs can also squeeze even more out.

It's the NFA that has fucked all that. Integral designs will never have a real chance while it exists. Neither will all sorts of other possibilities like ultra compact super cheap disposable wipe/gel options with unique geometries. Such a design could be done for like $28 in consumables (I did the math), but NFA means that's $228 minimum so pointless. And even for a reusable, ATF claims that cut neoprene becomes restricted "suppressor parts" if intended for a wipe can and you're supposed to physically mail the fucking can back to the manufacturer every time you shoot a mag through it which is obviously ridiculous. But suppressed pistols shorter then what people commonly EDC right now are definitely doable as a matter of technology.
>Besides, pistol shots aren’t as deafening or painful as rifles, so it’s not like it’s a borderline necessity.
Handguns are still fucking loud anon. 150-165 dB is typical, and yeah that's less then rifles that can go all the way to 175 but way over the 140 threshold of instant permanent hearing loss. Better then whatever threat meant you needed to use it, but bullshit the government keeps us from protecting ourselves if we want.
Replies: >>63857945
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 4:41:51 PM No.63857945
>>63857854
>suppressor can be shorter than 3”

Can volume isn’t all equal. You can not go arbitrarily short aslong as you go wider. A wide but short tuna can will not suppress nearly as well as a 6” long but smaller diamater can. Tuna can might not even suppress at all. The can needs length in order to pressurize.

Maybe it’s possible to make a moderately sized pistol with a very short barrel and a short can that brings the dB below 140, but it’s never gonna be a standard accessory on a standard sized pistol. They will be relegated to specialty pistols like the maxim9

If cans become deregulated, I can see someone taking another crack at boberg style bullpup pistols. That might not be such a terrible idea. Would still be a one trick pony though since those pistols are real complex and really won’t play well with a COAL longer than that of 9mm (the claw+lifting mechanism eats into grip depth quite a bit)
Replies: >>63858244
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 6:15:04 PM No.63858244
>>63857945
>Can volume isn’t all equal
Indeed it isn't, but not just in the direction you're saying. By using 3d flow, wipes and gel you can make smaller volume work far better. No one is going to bother though pursuing that to the limit without a big enough potential market.
>A wide but short tuna can will not suppress nearly as well as a 6” long but smaller diamater can
The Maxim 9 keeps everything well below 140 though.
>Maybe it’s possible to make a moderately sized pistol with a very short barrel and a short can that brings the dB below 140
Gemtech Aurora II which is ancient at this point and plenty of room for improvement has no issues bringing shots below 140 in 3" or so of can. The only issue is cost and ability to replace the wipes. But cost is only an issue because of the NFA, they aren't made of platinum/iridium or something, it's aluminum and rubber.

And again, that's all with 9mm. I think a "Maxim 380" with modern 3D designs, even without wipes+gel, definitely with, could stay under 140 and shave another few inches off the OAL.
Replies: >>63858389
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 6:54:16 PM No.63858389
IMG_6767
IMG_6767
md5: aa59df9a8505cdda8e01b3b75cd459e1🔍
>>63858244
If we’re really all gonna use cans on our pistols in the future, then here’s what I propose, it’s a schizo idea I’ve been rolling around in my head.

Very small caliber, but very long bullets going just under the speed of sound. Super fast twist - in the case of a .224, 1-in-2 or faster - expanding bullets, just like the maker rex 8,6 blackouts. So basically a miniature 8.6 blackout. It would take very little propellant to accomplish this. The point of this is to increase terminal effect without increasing energy. My thinking is that if I was going to punch a hole in you of x frontal area, which is more likely to kill you, a hole, or a star-shape with thin arms but same total area? The star because it’s gonna reach out and touch and destroy more important shit. Arteries and nerves and organs and what not. So the way the bullet’s energy is applied makes a difference. Go aslong as possible with bullet length, whatever will fit in the grip. Place the propellant around the shank of the bullet - it doesn’t even need much. Sort of like how they do with cased telescoped cartridges.

And the whole point of this is to retain penetration and maximize tissue destruction with an absolutely diminutive amount of energy and propellant. The tiny powder charge makes things far easier to suppress, as does the tiny caliber. A 3” can might actaully work quite well. Energy should be 200-250ft*lbs or something like that, like a 22 magnum.

Also, perhaps one could make expanding bullet petals out of mild steel and cut indentations or something at the base to weaken them to facilitate opening, like picrel, my shitty drawing of what I mean. The blue stuff is the base of the petal as seen from the side. If the red angles are 90 it will fold down perfectly horizontally and all of its length turns into final petal expanded width. In theory, the bullet’s expanded width would now be a function of its length, decoupled from caliber.
Replies: >>63858413 >>63858488
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 6:59:23 PM No.63858413
>>63858389
I should add here that 3” is quite a reasonable can length for a <250ft*lb 5.56. The Banish speed k is a 4” long 5.56 can that adds about 3.5” to the muzzle, and IIRC it lowers dB down to <140. The (now nonexistent) Delta P Brevis 2 was even shorter than that, I think, and it also achieved similar suppression. And this is with 5.56.

So if everything is minmaxed to support suppressed shooting, I guess I can now see cops or whatever carrying them - where wearability is a concern but concealability is not. CC guns though are never getting cans, no matter what.
Replies: >>63858567
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 7:01:56 PM No.63858420
>>63849795 (OP)
>Implying this is going to do anything other than make 147gr 9mm the default load for handguns and 158gr the standard for PCCs
.45 isn't coming back because of this, 9mm 147gr is cheaper than 230gr .45. 9mms on mars.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 7:17:22 PM No.63858488
224-Montgomery-Wildcat-Cartridge-25-ACP-Firearm-Wiki
224-Montgomery-Wildcat-Cartridge-25-ACP-Firearm-Wiki
md5: cae70c0e9fbe319f85e88e28d41afec3🔍
>>63858389
https://firearmwiki.com/wiki/.224_Montgomery
Replies: >>63858517
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 7:26:27 PM No.63858517
>>63858488
That’s one solution. Another is like a 9mm or 10mm case head, with a .224 bullet that just barely reaches the primer, and all the propellant crammed between the shank and the case wall. Long OAL too, like 1.5” or more.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 7:35:24 PM No.63858567
>>63858413
>CC guns though are never getting cans, no matter what.
Based on what anon? People cc stuff like Glock 19s or Glock 23s or whatever guns of that size no problem, that's commonly considered a pretty decent average. Those guns are about 7.3" oal. The shortest 380 I can think of is 4.25" long, though it's unsurprisingly not that comfortable, but plenty of very good 380s are 4.5-5" long. Add 2-2.5" of asymmetric can using 3d/wipes/gel and you've got a perfectly decently concealable suppressed gun with no heroics required.

Of course people do already CC suppressed guns, it just takes more effort or more specialized environment than the average person is willing to go through or has. But I don't see any particular reason a properly compact suppressed gun can't be made. It won't be some ultra micro pocket revolver length sure, but that's not what the majority of the ccw market is anyway.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:32:23 PM No.63858879
If I had the option to conceal carry an integrally suppressed pistol I sure as fuck would.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:37:27 PM No.63858915
500236_austria-m7-roth-pistol-01_hero_1200x800
500236_austria-m7-roth-pistol-01_hero_1200x800
md5: ca550867e89af165384a074741876589🔍
>>63849795 (OP)
Broski. Russia is an European country (only Transcontinental country in the world) and besides if you don't believe that the Germans/Austrians are the best in weapons in this globe you probably forgot abt 1940.

That being said. American made is respectable and will not be under but European weapon makers are from a level. You wouldnt even believe it. And than we have ...... Baretta....
Replies: >>63858929 >>63858987
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:39:24 PM No.63858929
maxresdefault (10)
maxresdefault (10)
md5: 8be2a37afcc52a2e52419106344c9bb5🔍
>>63858915
> Bro
Americans aint shit if it comes to the spacerace

Americans aint shit if it comes to guns
Replies: >>63858954 >>63859051
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:42:31 PM No.63858954
>>63858929
> Fun niggerfact #20382
Elon Musk, the most brilliant in-di-vi-dual in the space race only had books abt Soyuz, Soyuz, Soyuz in his library
Replies: >>63858966
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:43:37 PM No.63858966
93e241fd841d8e153bddcb1ee564428b
93e241fd841d8e153bddcb1ee564428b
md5: 93ff58bbf3a37c4e4df2ea9f365aa8df🔍
>>63858954
Soyuz is masterrace, fuck the cunts
Replies: >>63858974 >>63859001
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:43:41 PM No.63858967
Screenshot_20250618_194221_Chrome
Screenshot_20250618_194221_Chrome
md5: 1c6b2877b1f38362b35603e92899d2d8🔍
>>63852756
It was already becoming the standard pistol cartridge anyway, because it was a pistol cartridge from the off.
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:44:39 PM No.63858974
72ffd2cbd6b574bb47a0c7f1e258fa88
72ffd2cbd6b574bb47a0c7f1e258fa88
md5: bcca048ca70faf224e2c96d3b560d46a🔍
>>63858966
Do in need to say more?
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:46:45 PM No.63858987
S01kdbflpudIrs2ovy2NAj1CfTtB4eRPNCxrgI3Z.hcyd
S01kdbflpudIrs2ovy2NAj1CfTtB4eRPNCxrgI3Z.hcyd
md5: 62b8455c5488c2c79fd2d4f320f21512🔍
>>63858915
You mean that era of the nazi scientist the Americunts sucked scientist cock for?
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:49:38 PM No.63859001
28628-0be1b11a13162385b1f41d2f9d7ecee2
28628-0be1b11a13162385b1f41d2f9d7ecee2
md5: 1b60c29bb4107811c1f42679e161fcb2🔍
>>63858966
Ooohhhh Wweee. Those Russian Rockets are a whole other thing bro
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 8:59:33 PM No.63859051
gettyimages-850785762-612x612
gettyimages-850785762-612x612
md5: fc37555f9b360cd70e6a592e8abdf525🔍
>>63858929
Most used weapon by the mob
Replies: >>63859059
Anonymous
6/18/2025, 9:00:35 PM No.63859059
gettyimages-1403124864-612x612
gettyimages-1403124864-612x612
md5: bfbcfd7d763bef494cd0922b8c4167ef🔍
>>63859051
I dont have doubts abt baretta