WTF were the Koreans smoking when designing the KF-21?

Up your game, chang.

>>63907322 (OP)
They were vaping retard juice. I thought asians were meant to be smart and yet this thing is a total turd.

cargo cult

>>63907337
Name an Asian country that has design aircraft other than the F-2 from Japan

>>63907322 (OP)
Wait, it doesn't have an internal weapons bay? What the fuck ahahahahaha
With this level of idiocy I'm assuming they also have no idea how RAM coatings work.
Which means the Su 57 finally has a fair competition against another "Gen 5"

>>63907455
I mean, China is right there...

Block 3 should have a weapons bay, block 1 and 2 only have recessed attachment points.
Full combat load F35s aren't running internal only so I don't really see that much difference.

>>63907322 (OP)
Stealth doesn't matter if Russian air defense can't see you anyways

>>63907467
But even so, the plane lacks any integrated sensors beyond radar. Look at that underbelly in the OP. Where is the laser designator? The IR camera? And what happens if this thing needs to carry drop tanks? It must all be carried on external pylons.

>>63907322 (OP)
So if the bays are internal on the ones specifically not orderable from Alexis Press, then on these, what goes into all that extra room? Conceivably I want to say more fuel?

>>63907467
Except full combat F35's are actually stealth and can fly over Iran's S400's unbothered. I doubt this pos can do that with only the 4 missiles in the pic.

>>63907483
Not really.

>>63907455
China?

>>63907322 (OP)
>WTF were the Koreans smoking when designing the KF-21?
Adderall and other brain stimulants, since the only competition it will only face is from 4.5th gens with no stealth capability or F-35 with a huge backlog for at least another decade.
>>63907479
>But even so, the plane lacks any integrated sensors beyond radar.
KUS-LW, already being developed with concealed EOTS and IWB, is literally a test bed for KF-21EX.

>>63907322 (OP)
Couldn't they stick a cover over the missiles that can be Jettson'd when it's time for combat?

A Faux internal weapons bay?

>>63907537
>A Faux internal weapons bay?
It's literally the same launcher used in EF2000

>>63907510
>Don't know what KUS-LW is
>Presume you're talking about integrated sensors (laser and IR) because that's what I was basing my whole post on
>Actually you just meant the drones
Pointless reply.

>>63907586
Yes, they're using drones as a test bed for stealth technology

>>63907590
Whoa a stealth drone prototype haven't seen something like this before.
Asian superiority truly 20 years ahead.

>stealth
>no internal weapon bay
What were they thinking

>>63907590
Where's the integrated lasers and IR sensors? I don't see them on the drones.

>>63907600
It's not just the sensors being developed. The engines that are powering them will also be local.

>>63907322 (OP)
>>63907337
>>63907459
organic

>>63907641
>The engines that are powering them will also be local.
From Rolls Royce, actually.

>>63907490
The external stows are optional, dude.

>>63907649
>From Rolls Royce
Nope. 5,500 lb and 10,000 lb models are developed by Hanwha Aerospace and Doosan Enerbility respectively. The engine that Rolls Royce is pitching at the moment is aimed at KF-21.

>>63907656
>full combat F35's

>>63907666
Six internal air to air missiles, or two internal air to air missiles and two large bombs. Better loadout than an F-117.

>>63907461
>>63907507
Only the J-20 is truly a full Chinese design. The J-10 is a mixture of other designs, and the J-11/5/6 are just Su-27/30/4 derivatives

>>63907669
>full combat F35's
>are actually
>stealth

>>63907674
>full combat
What third world hole are you from lmao

>>63907586
>>63907322 (OP)
I understand the missiles since internal bays are pretty complex but why the hell wouldnt you build the sensor pod into the design? Its always gonna be needed. Its half the combat effectiveness.

>>63907685
>why the hell wouldnt you build the sensor pod into the design?
They were that desperate to just push it out the door. No internal bays or integrator sensors helped with that. This thing is so much cheaper than people think it is.

>>63907679
*taps image*

>>63907699
What's your point? Mission planning isn't the act of packing as much ordnance onto a plane as possible, and they're far from useless if they're utilized at less than absolute maximum capacity.

>>63907455
Taiwan

>>63907685
They were getting help from LM as an offset for the F-35 purchase but the US wouldn't allow them to develop a stealth jet for another country so they settled with 4.5th gen with a room for future upgrades into 5th gen.

>>63907707
>full combat F35
>stealth
Hmm. Interesting.

>>63907712
Big if true

>>63907673
What about the J-36 and the J-50?

>>63907742
Not yet operational. Hell the J-35 is still in the testing phase

>>63907665
>Doosan
Holy fucking shit topkek
So RR then is it?

I'm really curious who keeps spamming these posts and shitting up every thread where the KF-21 is ever mentioned. Everything and the kitchen sink from falseflag "shilling" to just blatant misinformation.
Either a chink or a jeet would be the most likely. But you can't count out seanigs since they are terminally online and indonigs are a particularly brainrotten bunch. I almost always notice these kinds of posts when the euros dogpile on the frogs for fucking up all of their weapons development so it is quite possible that it may be pierre as well.
But it would be so interesting if it turns out that it is a bona fide North Korean who is making these posts. Keep up the good fight, cousin, and when you can't Google translate no more, always feel free to come on South.

>>63907322 (OP)
Produce an F-16 replacement for people to buy without relying on US procurement.
Except they designed it with US engines anyway meaning anyone they sell to has to be on the accepted buyers list anyway unless they end up putting Rolls Royce engines in them.
Same issue as Gripens and how the potential buyers tend to be on the UK procurement bans like Argentina so they don't have a chance due to BAE involvement.

>>63907758
The korean arms industry shill? Yeah he's been here for a while.

>>63907322 (OP)
The same shit England was when designing the QE class to """"eventually"""" be upgraded with catapults, high grade copium. It's not as strong as the premium shit the Russians and Palis have but it's nonetheless very potent. Reminder that Koreans are somehow worse than Japs and Chinks when admitting fault or knowing when to call a bad idea quits, they're the purest distillation of every negative stereotype of Asian culture. Worst Korea in particular has seemingly looked at how shit things are going up north and have taken that as a challenge to run their society through the floor

>>63907745
And the KF-21 is already operational?

>>63907729
You're retarded, and may God have mercy on your soul.

>>63907483
>>63907656
Internal only is not full combat retard.

>>63907848
>full combat
And?

>>63907774
bad deflection, schizoid
does this thread seem like it was made by a "arms industry shill", dumb fuck?

go ahead and tell us, what's your flag? and point to the doll where the KF-21's meteor penetrated you.

>>63907673
>Asks question
>Receives answer
>"No, that doesn't count because... it just doesn't OK?

Many such cases...

>>63907781
>want to replace aging F-4/F-5
>need to develop a cheap replacement on a tight schedule
>make a 4.5th gen jet with a similar performance to EF but at a much lower cost
>fail
I guess thirdies don't understand the concept of failure.

>>63907455
Russia

>>63907337
They were never 'Smart' they were just taught how to be human printers for test scores. Zero abstract thought past this.

>>63907673
>Only the J-20 is truly a full Chinese design
if you're going to move the goalposts don't do it while making yourself wrong anyway.

>>63907455
Much as I hate em. India and Pakistan?

>>63907322 (OP)
>no internal weapons bay
idk maybe doesn't matter if it's designed for Nork air defenses? It seems more like a glorified research program bolted onto a 4.5 design than a serious attempt at a 1st rate stealth fighter.
>>63907459
>the Su 57 finally has a fair competition
The Su-57 has an internal bay tho.
>>63907729
You don't deploy an F-35 with externally mounted weapons/fuel in contested airspace. Doing so compromises your radar signature. Such a loadout is for low-threat environments only.

>>63907479
>And what happens if this thing needs to carry drop tanks?
is south korea even big enough to need them?

>>63908196
Yeah failure isn't a thing in programs properly managed throughout their development cycle, either they realize it can't be done early on after doing feasibility studies and scrap it or lower the requirements, or they actually do it well enough to fulfill the requirements even if it takes 30 years of development.

Worst Korea chose the former, with the "lowering the requirements" ending. So technically it's not a failure because they goalshifted. The result in an of itself might still be a failure if the lowered requirements are retarded, which they appear to be (what fucking modern fighter doesn't have sensors other than radar ?) so it can reasonably be considered a failure as a fighter jet, even if it's program isn't.


Altough you could argue the program is a failure because the lowered requirements failed to yield a usable aircraft.

>>63907656
Without any exaggeration, my seven year old nephew has better reading comprehension than you

>>63909534
>even if it takes 30 years of development.
pic related
Flag wavers pretend it's a glorious success even tho it's <15 years away from being made obsolete by whatever comes out of the NGAD program

>>63909578
In what way will NGAD make the F-35 obsolete? It will be better, but the F-35 is still going to be incredibly potent in 15 years regardless. It will also likely be a much cheaper option than the NGAD given that it's slated to be a much larger aircraft with a much bigger radar and more integration with CCAs

>>63909829
The NGAD fighters' presumed superior range will let the USAF and USN keep squishy support assets like carriers and tankers further away form Chinese rockets and aircraft. The F-35 can't work alongside this aircraft because that would require everything to move closer to the enemy. And without a penetration mission the F-35's stealth is mostly pointless. For non-penetration missions non-stealth combat jets are cheaper to acquire and operate. A modernized F-15 can zip around and sling long-range misses more economically than an F-35 ever can.

>>63909969
The question is whether there will ever be enough of the NGAD aircraft to fully take over a penetration mission profile from the F-35. NGAD is only projected to be procured in the very low hundreds, I've seen 150-200 being stated a lot. That is not going to be enough to replace the already heavily lowered procurement planning for the F-35, which is still likely going to be in the 1000 range. Taking into account readiness rates, battle damage in cases of peer conflicts etc. you're looking at ~100-133 NGAD available at any given time. When you include those losses that will drop. Imagine trying to use 133 aircraft hoping they last for potentially months in a further future US-China scenario (outside of just a Taiwan conflict) on what would potentially be a front 1000+ miles long.

>>63907459
>Which means the Su 57 finally has a fair competition against another "Gen 5"
KF-21 is at least a normal plane

>>63907322 (OP)
South Koreans are much like the Turks and other Indog-Europeons. All talk, no game. Always huffing and puffing about their own superiority on the internet with millions of paid shills, while their country and economy is a glorified open air brothel for US nigger marines.

>>63909578
Actually stealth instead of having a bunch of dead space built in to eventually add a IWB

>>63909984
The NGAD fighters are intended to be augmented by UCAVS, so that fleet is probably equivalent to 600-800 manned platforms. The F-35 could still fill such a command role in 2nd-tier air-forces that can't acquire NGAD-tier aircraft, but It' be redundant in a USAF with the F-47 and B-21. And as I said before, non-stealthy designs are more cost-efficient when not flying into the teeth enemy air defense.
>>63910022
Fair enough, but I meant to cite the F-35 as an example of a program that delivered EVENTUALLY, despite being billions over budget and 15-ish years behind schedule.

Not entirely related to this thread, but I've been wondering lately why there isn't more development going into tanker drones. Seems like an optimal use case, not requiring a cockpit gives extra internal volume for fuel. Also lets you refuel closer to contested airspace as they'd be more expendable

>>63910108
The US Navy has been working on this concept for years. Last I've heard, they're going to start integrating the MQ-25 into carrier air wings as a tanker sometime next year.

it's a cope "5th" gen like everything that came after f-22, f-35, maybe j-20. just so those counties can larp as if they're something. if you're not building a bullshit sci-fi triangle that wrangles many drones now, you're behind.

>>63907758
>>63907853
Armatard clearly.
Pic unrelated.
>>63909485
Yes, since it needs to be able to project airpower into the local sea regions for defence and for the defence of its access to resources.

>>63907490
>>63907848
like comeon
no one is flying these
it will be used MAYBE if an airforce phases out all of its 4th gens
it's a
>well you can still do that technically if you need to
like wranglers removable doors
or towing a load with a tesla

>full combat
>full combat
>full combat
gookshill, this imaginary "full combat" loadout is pure cope, the KF-21's 4 MR AAM loadout is external right now, the F-35 can carry 4 internally. By the time the KF-21 gets an internal bay, the F-35 will be capable of carrying 6 internally. The F-35 can carry 2 MR AAMs and 2 Mk 84s internally, the KF-21EX will only be able to carry smaller bombs internally. All of this and even the F-35B has greater fuel capacity than the KF-21

>>63911019
So you admit that a F-5 replacement is in the ballpark of the F-35 lineup?
Lmao you are literally the biggest gookshill of all time to be comparing a gen 4.5 jet to a gen 5 jet.

Since we're just shitflinging about all of the prototype plens itt, what do we think about the Anduril thing? It's obviously not even attempting to be stealth like General Atomic's offering but if it's priced low enough it might turn out to be pretty neat. If it's feasible to operate them without buying too much extra stuff I could see it being a good export product for all of the poorfag nations who cannot otherwise into air superiority.
I don't know how popular they'll be in the states, though. I know their whole thing is affordability but I was kind of under the impression that the last of the non-stealth aircraft were being retired from active duty. Even if they are super cheap I don't know if the USAF will be willing to spend that much on what is basically intended to be the UCAV equivalent of an F-16 when they could just stop retiring their actual F-16s if they really need a low cost multirole.
I do like the look of it though, very shark like, and the sharkiness of a plane has a direct positive correlation with its combat effectiveness.

>>63910108
It's not that simple, even without a cockpit it needs sensors, and antennas so you can actually control it, which takes up space.

>>63911223
This is just a no cockpit f16 isn't it.

>>63911089
The plane is bigger than the F-35, carries its missiles externally, will carry 1/3 less missiles than the F-35 internally at best, cannot carry more than SDBs for ground attack, and already costs around what a F-35 costs despite the program getting a load of research data from LockMart. You act as if payload capacity, external payload capacity mind you, makes it "ballpark" to the F-35 lol. You know what else carries 4 MR AAMs in a semi recessed manner? F-4 Phantoms gookshill, your shitter, by your standards, is in the ballpark of an ancient gen 3 fighter. Oops.
>muh F-5 replacement
weighs as much as a F-35, dimensionally bigger than a F-35, and yet no internal bay and 1/4 less fuel than the F-35A/C, and only comparable fuel capacity to the jump jet version lololololol

>>63911223
The low AR triangular wings still don't make sense to me on a non-maneuverable subsonic drone. I don't think there were strict packaging constraints so it's just a weird design choice

>>63909534
>what fucking modern fighter doesn't have sensors other than radar ?
You absolutely have no idea what you're talking about

>>63909534
>make 4.5th gen multirole aircraft
>save tons of money by not buying from foriegn mic
>technology can be recycled for a next gen development in the future
>3rd worlders already eyeing it even though it hasn't even entered service yet
>fail
What kind of copium have you been taking, Ivan?

>>63910020
>All talk, no game
KF-21 has been in mass production since last year.
https://defence-blog.com/south-korea-buys-20-more-kf-21-fighter-jets/
>In a press release issued Thursday, KAI announced it signed a 2.39 trillion-won ($1.76 billion) agreement with the Defense Acquisition Program Administration (DAPA) to build 20 additional KF-21 jets.

>The contract also includes logistics support such as technical manuals and training programs.

>The new deal follows an earlier contract signed in June 2024 for the first batch of 20 aircraft, valued at 1.96 trillion won. Under the current schedule, KAI expects to begin delivering the first fighters to the Republic of Korea Air Force in the second half of 2026. A total of 40 jets are planned for delivery by 2028.

you fags always talk shit about every plane that isn't the f-35 but can't justify why. it's either some cryptic dicksucking for some JSF criteria but either way, it's mad gay and unfounded.
>stealth capabilities
like you even know them
>everything else
see above

>>63907747
>So RR then is it?
Nope, RR doesn't even produce commercial grade gas turbines while Doosan does.

>>63911736
The main issue I see with it is the missiles stuck to the bottom. Rather ruins the stealth when you have this big bumpy area for radar to ping off of and as it's cut into the fuselage it doesn't matter if you have them fitted or not, there's still a rough patch either way. If you are going to have external mounts on a stealth jet they should come away clean if required.

>>63911738
They produce military grade gas turbines.

>>63907483
>Iran's S400's

>Iran
>S-400

>>63911781
>They produce military grade gas turbines.
So do the chinks.

>>63911810
they couldn't build the j-36 without 3 engines. they do not have military grade turbines.

>>63907322 (OP)
1st stage = make the airplane fly.

2nd stage = implement internal weapons bay.

There is already a reserved internal space for it.

>>63911710
russian logic is that you should announced super weapon, show plywood mockups for 20 years and then birth barely two dozen of glorified flankers

>>63914142
>There is already a reserved internal space for it.
They literally copied and scaled down the F-22, the internal bay is too small and occupied by a fuel tank. "2nd stage" needs a complete redesign of the airframe besides new avionics and new engines.

>>63907337
One of the bigger redpills on Asians is the realization that, while they are superb optimizers and decent copiers, they are not a creative people. Everything that has made the various East Asian nations great was borrowed or stolen or given from somewhere else.

>>63914207
I think this has more to do with oriental cultural norms of deference to authority and conformity than innate psychology. The annals of Chinese history are littered with new technologies that were suppressed by the authorities and either rotted away or were exported and developed elsewhere.

>>63914163
>the internal bay is too small
as if F-35 has a big internal bay lmao

>>63914483
the F-35 is heavier, bulky and doesn't have to waste space with 2 pancake inlets for the two engines.
The retarded turks were more realistic and made a big airframe instead of copying the F-22 with smaller engines.

>>63914266
That's a reasonable take if you haven't looked deeply into it beyond the typical Western books like Needham's Science and Civilization in China or you took a mainstream Chinese approach which emphasizes the change in government elite social-network structures before the century of humiliation.

But if you dig deeper it's noticeable again. It's not just Asians either. Jews, Arabs, and high-IQ Indian subgroups have the same "issue" (really it's the normal baseline). Whites have more slightly creativity per the same IQ. It's a thicker tail at the end of the distribution.

>>63907322 (OP)
>We can afford to make our own mini F-15s now

>>63907455
>implying the F-2 is different from the F-16

>>63915274
>Japan was literally forced to transfer their composite wings tech to Boeing

>>63907455
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_X-2_Shinshin
Japs made this, only a prototype though. Even uses domestically made engines.

so they designed it to have room for an internal bay
and just didn't add it

>>63915429

>>63915429
Not falling for your A.I. Spongebob.