How effective would cope cages be on an armored core or mobile suit?

>>63948777 (OP)
Don't Zakus use their reactors as jammers or something against most radio-based signals?
They are walking anti-drone towers already.

>>63948875
wired drones are supposed to be some sort of wunderwaffe that can't be countered.
so, suicide squad hiding in a hole until the zaku comes within 100 feet.
is it still able to handle that.

>>63948875
>Don't Zakus use their reactors as jammers or something against most radio-based signals?
You're thinking of Minovsky Particles and they are something completely different from the nuclear reactors of mobile suits. However, Minovsky Particles would render drones dead in the water as a concept as both Earth and the surrounding space has been completely littered with the stuff that it has rendered guided munitions to be completely unreliable

>>63948777 (OP)
Ideally, you'd mount a multi-layered cope cage on the forearms, and simply "parry" incoming ordinance by holding out your arm.

>>63948777 (OP)
Minovsky particals absolutely FUCK computers for "some reason" but then they forget TOW's are a thing.

>>63948981
Sunrise's Magical Particles kills any tech that makes melee combat and no-anthropomorphic weapons less important.

>>63949015
>and no-anthropomorphic
and anthropomorphic*
F

>>63948963
The minovsky particles are a byproduct of the type of nuclear reactor mobile suits and space ships use. The difference is the size of the reactor, with a mobile suits reactor being the size of four refrigerators stacked next to each other. The minovsky particles are also used in the anti gravity system that warships like the white base use to be able to fly in atmosphere despite having no visible means of producing lift/thrust, and being about as aerodynamic as a brick.

>>63948777 (OP)
Does anybody else wish that a Battletech/Gundam crossover happened?
If the Federation's M61A5 gave Zeon so much problems things like the Alacorn, Shreck, Partisan, and Demolisher would be nightmares made real.

>>63948875
>>63948777 (OP)
Example of how Tomino and every Gundam staffer is a nogunz, neverserved wanker.
They don't even know the concept "home on jamming" exists.
There's a skirmish in the Universal Century timeline called "The Battle of Solomon," (Anavel Gato's claim to fame) as if the Pacific War analogue weren't obvious enough, they had to literally namedrop The Solomon Islands Campaign in their pinko hack science-fantasy Space Samurai Robot slop.

Picrel: the most Zeon looking fucker in the IJN, a B5N Kate pilot who died around the Solomons.

>>63948981
They'll transam behind the wires and cut it.

>>63949015
Wire-operated weapon systems are a thing in Gundam. You do need to be a Newtype to use them as they run on Psycommu, however.

>>63949029
It gave Zeon problems due to their inexperience in fighting inside a gravity well, and the sheer number the federation had to throw at them. Once Project V produced results the Feds swapped the tank spam to GM spam.

>>63949030
Minowsky particles are not localized to a single location, you can't hone in on them, they are dispersed around the battlefield.
They create a giant deadzone, the mobile suit reactors are not jammers.

>>63949029
Battletech would be a funny matchup since in spite of how much emphasis is placed on mechs, most of the tech they're using is actually pretty badly outdated and stagnant compared to what Zeon and the Federation used by the end of the OYW while on the other hand BT spacecraft blow Gundam fleets out of the water and more importantly are capable of FTL.

>>63948957
even a weak newtype will simply sense the drone and evade

>>63949037
Only the early ones, later systems were able to be operated by baseline humans. And to all the just use TOW missile posters, minovsky particles also fuck up electronic systems that are not sufficiently shielded. You would not be able to fit the requires shielding in a missile without making the explosive payload too small to do any real damage, or making the missile big enough that a MS pilot would be able to see it coming and either shoot it down, or swat it away with it's hands.

>>63949030
>The Battle of Solomon
>a skirmish

>>63949046
The FTL would be a pretty huge advantage, as the BT forces would literally always be flanking due to being able to just jump behind any fed/zeon forces they encountered.

>>63948777 (OP)
Gundams are cool but I hate beam weapons, is IBO the only series I can enjoy?

>>63949060
I liked how 0083 showed that they kept that around and refined it by optimizing the control software and mirror materials so that the next time they deployed it, they needed only half the amount of mirrors to get the same effect.

>>63949043
My deepest condolences, the idea is retarded. There will always be a concentration gradient, which a logic circuit can compare thousands of times per second for guidance.
If Minowsky particles are so unstoppable anyway, then all of our pilots would be showing horror-abomination tier radiation poisoning symptoms anyway. Flesh flayers in under a month.

>>63949072
G Gundam is mainly physical weapons, but that is because the writers decided to make a Kung Fu movie but with giant robots.

>>63949059
electromechanics is more than enough for a TOW missile

>>63949084
That anon meant that the mobile suits are not the ones releasing the minovsky particles in any meaningful density, it's the warships that are doing that. In several instances as battles are starting you see the Captain of the ship giving the order to start releasing minovsky particles at combat density.

>>63949075
Of all the super weapons in Gundam the Solar System is my favorite. The lowest tech thing thing they could make, a bunch of mirrors to reflect the sun but it's so charming

>>63949127
And unlike the space traitors they didn't need to gas a couple million people to make it.

>>63949084
Think of them as a bubble of "no fuck you sensors don't work" - later series are capable of programming a sensor to lock onto a reactor by triangulating the dispersion to its source, but mobile suits can counter this by clumping up.

>>63949084
sure, there is a concentration gradient, but these are particle, not light. They disperse slowly, so if a mobile suit moves like one does, they're basically everywhere and there's nothing for the missile to home in on.
Think about Old Kuznetsov and tracking it using the smoke cloud it releases. You roughly know where it is, but you don't know enough to hit accurately it it.

>>63948777 (OP)
early UC? decent effectiveness since a lot of mobile suits were still using bazookas. past 0087 kinda useless since beam weapons became so prolific unless you're one of the poor fucks in an under equiped zeon remnant unit or a feddie at a bumfuck nowhere base using a GM II against geara doga from a better equipped zeon remnant group. armored cores would just dodge the drone at a million mph

>>63949072
IBO is ass and hating beam weapons is for fags.

>>63949166
>>63949176
I've considered this type of explanation as well.
If you concede that it's possible to get a loose lock or partial solution, then we should see ships equipped with (space-opera styled) agile "spotlights," 40mm pom-poms, hedgehog depth charge throwers, and VT fuses, to cover that last leg of the firing solution.
Since UC is 1941-1945 in a bodykit, they may as well know about these things.

I've made napkin sketches of a rotary prismatic raygun turret, as an idea to diversify & add counterplay to fighterpod-centric space opera scenarios. One day I should finish that...

No comment on the radiation poisoning objection?

>>63949247
>No comment on the radiation poisoning objection?
Minovsky particles are harmless.

>If you concede that it's possible to get a loose lock or partial solution
It's not, at least depending on when you are in UC. Early on, it's hard and later on there's enough Newtype monsters around that won't get got by that.

>>63949288
>and later on there's enough Newtype monsters around that won't get got by that
Tbh I feel like Newtypes get over-represented in later UC works. Neither the Federation or the somehow-more-resource-wealthy-but-smaller Zeon fragments ever had enough of them to make a full corps if I recall.

>>63948777 (OP)
Don't most mech shows and games lean heavily into solid projectiles, even worse, full bore size projectiles? Isn't that like the exact opposite of what a cope cage could even theoretically protect against?

>retards ITT
Muh magic particles are a plot device to justify giant fighting robots you fucking retards. It’s not realistic because it’s not a fucking realistic concept. Giant robots are not and will never be realistic without some plot device explaining them away. Jesus fucking Christ.

>>63948957
The feddies used/use wired AT missiles to fight Zakus initially with moderate success. The problem is two dudes with a bulky obvious missile launcher setup usually do not outpace a giant 18 meter tall highly advanced robot. Also amusingly the Feddy AT missiles require two guys whereas a Zaku only has one pilot. Not a huge difference and the Feds have the numbers but still

>>63949046
> most of the tech they're using is actually pretty badly outdated and stagnant compared to what Zeon and the Federation used
Nah. The only thing they have that’s superior is the beam rifles. And even that depends on how you compare it to a PPC.

>>63949072
My prescription:Xabungle
Not a beam weapon or psychic in sight, just a bunch of cowboys living in the moment

>>63949067
Admittedly I haven’t been keeping up with my Battletech lore. But their FTL isn’t actually that useful since they can’t really do short range point to point jumping like that.

>>63949072
You'll warm up to other series but IBO is a decent place to start
>>63949189
IBO is fine stop paying attention to faggot /m/anchildren

>>63949086
It was created by a wuxia autist who didn't give a shit about robots that sunrise hired based entirely off the pitch: "Hey, this dragon ball thing is pretty popular, we should do a gundam that."
It flopped hard in Japan and mostly just succeeded in giving a large population of impressionable toonami viewers a latex fetish
Still good, clean, dumb fun though. A fine beer anime

>>63949332
>I deliberately entered a thread about something I dont like and now I'm mad. how could this be happening to me?

>>63949573
>he wants a mecha safespace on /k/
not even trying

>>63949573
>I deliberately posted an off topic thread, (again), and now people are mad at me
>How could this be happening to me?

>>63949364
Gundam’s beam weapons are all charged particle guns, so a PPC would functionally be the same thing. The weaponized lasers of Battletech are what’s missing from Gundam, though Cosmic Era beam guns might count as those.

>>63949396
Nah, IBO is bad. More accurately, the second season fucking blows hardcore.

>>63949346
the launchers the federation uses aren't any more bulky than a tow or fagot, even less going by the missile buggies in MSG. they're tactically irrelevant because gundam is about character drama and pilots as knights of the battlefield, not about crouching in a fighting position waiting for zekes to enter your field of fire

>>63949332
>The Giant Robots are all animals and the natives to this alien world never felt the need to develop tanks or fighter planes when they could just put armor and guns on the giant technorganic wolf or pterosaur who already reproduce/feed by killing eachother.
>This is before a colony ship from Earth crashes on the planet due to greedy venture capitalists.

>>63949364
All BT weapons and electronics are clunky as shit and weigh down mechs like an anchor with their heat sinks and multi-ton ballistic computers, even if their man-machine interface is leagues better than the joystick system most OYW-era MS were using.

>>63949770
Kino

>>63949931
Do BT robits have panoramic cockpits?

>>63948777 (OP)

The Z is for Zeon right? RIIIIGGGGHHHTTT????

>>63948963
minovsky particles can't defeat fiber optic drones

>>63950176
now they can
>since when
right now, yes, right now

>>63950185
false, contradicted by the very first episode of the first fucking show
wire guided missiles (and thus fiber optic drones, which are a basic extension of the technology) appear onscreen and work just fine

the problem for them is that it's basically impossible to get something with enough payload close enough to the mobile suits to do damage while avoiding being detected by the impressive optics of the suits and being shot down by their point defense AA or dodged

>>63949931
> All BT weapons and electronics are clunky as shit
Which is irrelevant when battlemechs have a shitload more firepower AND armor on tap. And they also don’t explode when they get so much as a scratch.

>>63950203
>OF GM can achieve better than 10km of range
>point blank
blatant plot armor

> enough payload
A tiny shaped charge (2-5 kg) can mission kill any MS, the average ATGM weights 10-40 kg and penetrates 80-120 cm of RHA. A single penetration is enough to disable something like an engine, hit any joint, power generator/bank, head of a gundam and it will be disabled

>>63950203
>>63950235
For reference, here is the size of a M-101A3 Regina compared to a person, the kind of warhead expected to bust through a Zaku.

>>63950235
The heads and joints would present the same problem as hitting those on a person. Namely that they are a much smaller target than the torso, and unless the MS is standing perfectly still, is constantly bobbing up and down. The torso would be your best bet, but that's also going to be the most heavily armored part because that's where the cockpit, reactor, and main thrusters are.

>>63949072
War In The Pocket is almost entirely kinetic outside of melee.
Beams are cool though, outside of post-Tomino shit where everything suddenly starts shrugging them off with no fancy fragile coating required, instead of having holes melted in them.

>>63949043
>completely ignores the laws of electromagnetic principles
WOT. Mechs are one thing, but Minovsky particals are tied with LOTGH "Seffle particals" in sheer retardation.

>>63950357
https://gundam.fandom.com/wiki/Gundam_Wiki:Technology#Minovsky_Physics

For you, and anyone else unfamiliar with minovsky particles and their applications.

>>63950357
If it helps, you can think of them as chaff that works on active and passive sensors.

>>63948777 (OP)
I don't know what any of those words mean.

>>63949364
The Pulse Lasers, all forms of Autocannons, PPC's and especially Guass weapons are game changers to Gundam. With Battletech's clunky optical computers actually come in clutch here, as they won't be effected by M-particals and Battletech armor would be absolutely broken. In Gundam units survive by not being hit, but Battletech lasers, LBX, and LRM's simply don't make that a option. Even individual hits due to "anti-laser coating" or LBX/LRM scattering add up quickly, and any naval combat is horrifically stacked against Gundam, as any of the main guns of a WarShip could break a colony in half in a single hit, which is why in Battletech orbital colonies didn't happen. Battletech didn't need colony drops or other super weapons to depopulate a world, a single WarShip was enough.

>>63950418
>In Gundam units survive by not being hit

That and knowing that the best way to do so is being able to anticipate where the shot is going to land, and not being there. There's a side story, or it's in the novellization of the original series where some nameless zeon pilot asks Char how he's able to dodge the Gundam's beam shots as well as he does. Char's response is that he's not dodging the beam itself, as it's moving at or near light speed so that would be physically impossible, he's dodging the pilot's aim.

>>63950418
the Gundam's head vulcans are roughly equivalent to autocannon/2
the Zaku machine gun is rougly an AC/5 or AC/10, not quite sure
you could make an argument that the bazookas are roughly AC/20s

>>63950456
> the Gundam's head vulcans are roughly equivalent to autocannon/2
No they aren’t lmao.
They’re machine guns. Or maybe heavy MGs

>>63950467
they're anti-mobile suit weapons, not anti-infantry weapons
really no slouch, although they're specced more for close combat like the IS Rotary (I'm just reading a wiki at this point)
I could also seen an argument for the heavy MG you mentioned

>>63950366
>this explanation
>it just works ok
WHAT. There is NO part of Minovsky physics that would work, this is Dune levels of dumb. There are much easier ways to force close combat and mechs in space than this.
>laser based CWIS
Pretty much a necessity to travel in space, due to Kessler Events and deliberate sabotage of orbitals the lack of thick armor or laser based CWIS makes space travel without either (or better yet both) suicide.
>mechs
Toyota with a TOW vs a tank. After the war the Toyota goes on to do 100 other things while the tank gets scrapped after 10 years due to it becoming obsolete.

>>63950456
>head cannons
Lol those are machine guns are used as such in setting. Rotery AC2's are 30-90mm's and Rotery AC5's are 105-120mm's. Check out MW5's Burst Fire Autocannons, if you go by the Maurader's 3 round Burst 120mm= 5pt of damage you get AC10's that fire 6 round bursts and AC20 does 12 round bursts. The ROF for all those weapons is around 12-1500 RPM. Or you could go the other way and have 180-250mm huge fuckin bullet like the Demolisher or King Crab do.
>Elementals in Gundam
Operation British would have gone VERY differently if the Zeon scum who did it suddenly got pounced by a star of Elementals at the airlock.
>who would win
>some spess notsees who believe that they're superior because they grew up in a can
>vs
>genetically engineered bred for war murder furrys who view Earth as holy ground
The shit Zeon got away with in Gundam would have got them SLAUGHTERED in Battletech.

>>63950596
the head vulcans are 60mm

>>63950418
Early Zeon suits like the ground-types would be like attempting to use Mackies on the modern battlefield, but the moment you get to MS capable of shifting between ground and aerial combat on a whim BT suits would struggle to keep pace with something that can do the mech equivalent of "teleports behind you" even if they have better protection.