>Russia is now drone+missile spamming every 2-3rd day now
>Most likely a 1000 drone attack will happen within the month

So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits? Especially given that western missiles are limited and they're improving the quality of these drones to fly higher and faster, while also upping the quantity. Yes it might not have a particular direct impact on the battlefield but it is a threat Ukies cannot neglect.

I would think spreading the population out to not live in commie blocks and building command centers/factories underground or spread them out would be the best method to reduce impact of these strikes.

>how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits
FlkPz Gepard
a whole lotta them

>>63972822
>only made 570 of them

Not enough to cover a big country like Ukraine sadly. You would need 3-4x times the amount.

>>63972806 (OP)
Thy're basically terror chimpouts. Ukraine decentralized it's power grid and the repair crews got pretty good in keeping everything going.
Those attacks mostly hit civilian targets of questionable value and the idea is to demolralize the west in stopping shipments.
The ukranian populace just gets super pissed and any hope for a "peaceful" annexation of Ukraine by Russia are basically approaching 0 Kelvin.
For rational people nothing Russia does is cost effective, but for a deranged gambler everytyhing makes perfect sense. I bet Putin thinks he's winning and the "rotten structure" of Ukraine is on the brink of colapse, because his flying monkeys tell them how great and terrible the aerial attacks were.
The thousands of mobiks that get mulched every week are just par for the course, because Russia is great. Dattebayo or something.

>>63972806 (OP)
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?
mobile laser systems are the most cost effective, since you're dealing with something only costs around 50 thousand dollars. gps jamming works, though you risk inadvertently causing civilian casualties in some instances since the drone will still land in the vicinity (ins backup works against mid-course jamming). spaa guns are good when hooked up with early warning. missiles for high value defense. anti-drone drones, obviously.

but you need to be resigned to the fact that some will get through and you're going to still spend similar amounts in cost downing them via cheap means.

>>63972856
>They're basically terror chimpouts.

That's well understood but they still need to be countered, especially as they're shooting them off together with missiles with the point of oversaturating the air defense. And it's not like these drones exclusively hit civilian targets, they've also been able to hit infrastructure/military ones too.

>>63972806 (OP)
>thought-provoking graphic
>intellectually engaging question
you're not gonn'a last long around these parts, pard'ner

>>63972843
>need 3-4x times the amount
optimist
or krokodil addict?
>or both..?

none of this matter in the slightest.
especially now that usa is back in the game.
prolonged death rattle.

>>63972870
>now that usa is back in the game
Oh, cool. Orange Fuckface has imposed snaction and tarif fraud ob t3h monke ...? Do sauce. Want read.

>>63972869
I'm an alcoholic optimist that loves seeing shit shot down

These Shaheed "wunderwaffle" attacks have 90%+ failure rate. They get shot down by various means, they are easily dazzled by EW, they don't reach the target due to shitty reliability caused by shitty design/shitty electronics/shitty lawnmower engine/drunk operators and so on. It's a really poor way to terror bomb anything. When you see a retard going AXAXAXAXAAXAXAAAA SHAHEED GERAN DESTROY NATO HOHOLS remember that only 1-10/100 shaheeds resch anything worthwhile, and even then they strike something militarily useless like a playground because the CEP is terrible.

>>63972869
So engaging you didn't answer it.

>>63972806 (OP)
and that doesn't even include last weeks data where we've seen days with >700

they supposedly now also fly much higher to escape flak fire

in total they've launched 25k shaheds since the beginning of the invasion. which is like 1-2 billion dollars.

the only countermeasure is see is doing drone spam on your own

>It's literally the remake of V-2 terror bombing: electric boogaloo

If anything it shows that there won't ever be peace with russia until russia no longer exists

>>63972806 (OP)
>Most likely a 1000 drone attack will happen within the month
Instead of 150-200 daily they're just combining everything into 450-600 every three days.
Somehow you think this means they'll be launching 1000 soon.
Are you retarded?

>>63972888
Yeah because attacking 1000 at a time is different than attacking 200 at a time dumbass. They're trying to overwhelm air defenses in hopes some things slip by.

>>63972893
So what?
Bombing civilians has never won anyone any wars.

Terror bombing never won a war.

The meme of the moment seems to be interceptor drones, you just slam into the shasneeds at high speed.
Like these: https://www.harmattan.ai/systems/gobi
but basically every drone company is making some.

>>63972806 (OP)
all thanks to comrades orange dismantling of the sanctions regime and stopping military support.

>>63972895
>>63972896
But you can't deny it draws attention and Ukraine can't just shrug their shoulders and not care about it, especially as it is intensifying, drains resources and could potentially make more important sites vulnerable for attacks. I am all in for TZD but you can't outright dismiss an issue like this, especially as it will probably be more common in the future and at even bigger scale.

>>63972867
Russian attacks on valuable targets, even their wunderwaffe Hazel basically did fuckall damage. I'm kinda surprised how ineffective Russia has been withbit's standoff arsenal. If Ukraine had that much crap to throw at Russia, there would be no russian oil industry anymore.

>>63972806 (OP)
Ukies have been using technicals in this role for some time now, amongst other things

>>63972906
https://kyivindependent.com/trump-extends-bidens-sanctions-executive-order-against-russia/
https://www.kyivpost.com/post/55461
You'll never be a real superpower Ivan.

>>63972912
It is an issue, but once again it's russia sacrificing long-term gains for short-term gains. It looks impressive and loud but achieves 0 useful goals, which is typically russian, come to think of it.

>>63972886
>the only countermeasure is see is doing drone spam on your own
unironically, this is probably the best cause of action when dealing with dollar store cruise missiles; just use your own. you can utilize cheap methods to mitigate them, but doing the same thing back forces opfor into the same position.

Hey, today is the 1234th day of the 3 days special military operation

>>63972924
>Russia sacrificing long-term gains

How? The drone spam is like 50 million dollars if every drone costs 50k and they send a thousand out at a time. It's not that big of a cost since they can't seem to push the frontline anyway so this is keeping Ukraine on their toes. They've also started targeting recruitment offices too now together with their propaganda targeting Ukrainian men, according to the Ukrainian media itself. https://www.pravda.com.ua/columns/2025/07/8/7520747/index.amp

>>63972888
This. They've increased their production but it's not as dramatic as the graph makes it seem. Also it would be consistent with a demoralization effort as noted by >>63972947. However, it's still an increase from 100 a day to 200+.

>>63972947
>every drone costs 50k
The drone doesn't miraculously pop into existence at the factory and teleport to the target. They need thousands of vehicles, loads of manpower and so on to move them around. It'll be more expensive and cost manpower. However you are right, some faggots keep acting like everything Russia does is just the final nail in the coffin and they'll collapse from it.

>>63972893
Then why didn't they do it previously? Is your argument that Russians are literally so retarded they took 3 years to figure that one out?

>>63972806 (OP)
>cost-effectively counter these annoying shits
Attack Moscow. Fire bombs are cheap.

>>63972888
>Somehow you think this means they'll be launching 1000 soon.
It's like a math thing. You wouldn't understand.

>>63972806 (OP)
All those drones being launched and basically nothing being achieved. Impressive.

>>63972806 (OP)
Best solution which Ukraine is ramping up is drone interceptors.

Also, these chimpouts play a big part in Trump changing his tune on Ukraine, so they may be a strategic failure in time.

>>63973023
>they deplete resources used to stop them
>they hit what they're purposefully aimed at within their effective range deep into enemy territory

that's strategic warfare (and in this instance, on the cheap)

>>63972843
>>63972822
They're called Skynex now

>>63973046
russian strategic smekalka, very smart and thoughtful!

>>63973025
if they become ineffective due to kinetic kill drones/hunter-killer drones, russia can mass produce the jet engine variant since their buddies in china will no doubt supply them.

for ukraine, they need to get countries to send them their own versions in massive numbers.

>>63973051
>russia can mass produce
they can't even mass produce current sneeds kek
>their buddies in china
le mao

>>63972806 (OP)
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AZP_S-60

1000+ of these guns, with AA crews working on shifts.

>>63973063
>Working on shifts
Just strap computers and radar to them >>63973048

>>63973057
if they're sending 100s of them a day, that's mass production, anon.

the common thought now is that many of the components of these versions are from china.

>>63973067
These things are not cheap. Also takes time to build.

>>63972856
>the idea is to demolralize the west in stopping shipments.
They keep trying this tactic and it keeps backfiring. The horrors broadcast on European tv pretty much ensure continuing weapons shipments.

i have been saying it since the war started
ukraine needs to do insane amounts of sabotage to russia
i am talking fire bombings, spiking water supplies, poisoning food. take out fuel stations.
they need to make life miserable for everyone

>>63973106
First, that would take away from western support and legitimize Russia's cause.
Second, Russians as a species are used to living and dying like animals, you can't defeat them by making their life miserable.

>>63972994
>Is your argument that Russians are literally so retarded they took 3 years to figure that one out?
Yes.
>They need thousands of vehicles, loads of manpower and so on to move them around. It'll be more expensive and cost manpower.
I doubt it is that much. It is substantial, yet but somehow I would argue it is somehow better than sending hundreds of thousands of men into the meatgrinder for single digit square kilometers and having to pay their relatives millions and millions. Not saying it is a good option but a better one than they've been doing.

>>63973133
>western support
basically zero
if they want the horrors to end they can just leave
or they can all die
we can and should build slaughterbots

>>63973048
>90 mil for a fucking flak gun with a radar to shoot down hobby RC planes

MIC is such a scam

>>63972895
>Bombing civilians has never won anyone any wars
It ended the War with Japan 100%.

>>63973048
>REVOLVER OERLIKON

>>63972867
>>63972856
>terror bombing is when you destroy infrastructure with minimum civilian casualties
>Meanwhile America's bombing campaigns cause millions of deaths
Russia's strategic strike campaigns against infrastructure which usually result in single digit casualties with hundreds of targets being hit.
https://www.bundle.app/en/breakingNews/7c3eeb04-15f3-40a6-a5b1-11c4e1073add?l=1
>Ukraine says Russia launched 550 drones, missiles Russia launched 539 drones and 11 missiles, the air force said, adding that air defence units had downed 268 drones and two missiles.
>14 injured
Russia's strikes against AFU targets result in dozens, even hundreds of casualties with lone missile attacks
>https://kyivindependent.com/russia-strikes-training-ground-during-formation-resulting-in-mass-casualties-ukraines-military-says/
>100 dead
>https://kyivindependent.com/sumy-governor-organized-military-award-ceremony-on-day-of-russian-mass-attack-official-claims/
>30 dead
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_2024_Poltava_strike
>70 dead

>>63973157
>mention WW2
>huh, let's look up how many civilians the USSR killed
Oh dear...

>>63972806 (OP)
Nothing. You just endure and try to outspam enemy with more drones.
Fucking lol from unaware retards with lasers and gepards and other shitty gimmicks.

>>63973157
all those nations combined and they still can't beat Uncle Stalin's high score

>>63973181
Russia is not the USSR. Russians wee underrepresented in Soviet politics. The same criminal regime which dropped nukes on innocent civilians instead of military targets still holds power in America.
>>63973208
>a churka and his Jewish clique massacred russians and central Asians
Thanks for playing

>>63973219
>innocent civilians
hiroshima and nagasaki were industrial hubs

>>63973157
Hello, Rajneesh,
As your FSB handler, I would like to remind you that recycling the same content within a 24 hour window (>>63973120) will result in your payment being docked for the day.
I have forwarded an e-learning course to your e-mail address so you can revisit your training.
Repeated incidents will result in the termination of your employment.

Best regards,

Taтьянa Cepгéeвнa Чepнoвa
Senior Human Resources Supervisor

>>63973230
Hiroshima and Nagasaki had little to no military installations
>some of those civilians worked I'm factories
Okay? There's an alternative universe where Americans aren't bloodthirsty psychopaths and chose to nuke the Japanese navy instead of random cities

>>63973241
>

>Random cities

>>63973241
>

>>63973048
Now that's what I call a fucking technical

>>63973157
Neither Israel nor USA is best friend of Ukraine. Now redo your shit with just an EU flag.

>>63973250
>>63973254
>multiple seething responses

Yep it's a Paki.

>>63973254
Oh it's you again

>>63973219
>Russia is not the USSR.
Oh great, when are they leaving the permanent seat of the UNSC?

>>63973245
>Hiroshima and Nagasaki had little to no military installations

>Hiroshima was described as "an important army depot and port of embarkation in the middle of an urban industrial area[...]"

>Hiroshima was a city of industrial and military significance. A number of military units were located nearby, the most important of which was the headquarters of Field Marshal Shunroku Hata's Second General Army, which commanded the defense of all of southern Japan,[113] and was located in Hiroshima Castle. Hata's command consisted of some 400,000 men, most of whom were on Kyushu where an Allied invasion was correctly anticipated.[114] Also present in Hiroshima were the headquarters of the 59th Army, the 5th Division and the 224th Division, a recently formed mobile unit.[115] The city was defended by five batteries of 70 mm and 80 mm (2.8 and 3.1 inch) anti-aircraft guns of the 3rd Anti-Aircraft Division, including units from the 121st and 122nd Anti-Aircraft Regiments and the 22nd and 45th Separate Anti-Aircraft Battalions. In total, an estimated 40,000 Japanese military personnel were stationed in the city.[116]

Hiroshima was a supply and logistics base for the Japanese military.[117] The city was a communications center, a key port for shipping, and an assembly area for troops.[78] It supported a large war industry, manufacturing parts for planes and boats, for bombs, rifles, and handguns.[118]

>The city of Nagasaki had been one of the largest seaports in southern Japan, and was of great wartime importance because of its wide-ranging industrial activity, including the production of ordnance, ships, military equipment, and other war materials. The four largest companies in the city were Mitsubishi Shipyards, Electrical Shipyards, Arms Plant, and Steel and Arms Works, which employed about 90 percent of the city's labor force, and accounted for 90 percent of the city's industry.

>>63973273
>>63973278
>
>>63973292
Translation: Hiroshima had one guy operating a radio. Nagasaki had a port

>>63972867
like childrens hospital in kyiv?

>>63972856
yeah terror bombing is always a failure and never works as intended. Americans even concluded that when post 1945 they discovered germany was producing most ammo and gear in 45 while fighting hopelessly outmatched on two fronts. Nipps were sitting on a fuel starved island after getting nooked twice and still ready to commit national sudoku. Its only their emperor interfering and putting an end to the madness and even then some hardcore IJA imperialists wanted to overthrow him and push on with the war

and todays monkes chimp outs are nothing compared to those bombings that turned entire cities into piles of rubble

all monke, as the sunk cost fallacy gambler he is, is achieving is strengthening ukranian resolve of breaking him. ukraine is going to be the death of him and his dreams of resurrecting failed and dead empires

>>63973219
>Russians wee underrepresented in Soviet politics
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>We're shit at it which means we're not doing it
No it just means you're shit at it.

>>63973319
>forced perspective
Oh look lying turdie

>>63973241
BLOODY BENCHOD BASTARD BICH. Okay I see u tomorrow and rape u. bye bye!

>>63973343
AIIIEEE shut up Rudra

>>63972896
>So what?
>Bombing civilians has never won anyone any wars.
How do you explain the Kosovo war then?

>>63973319
That's like 50 guys
Meanwhile in Moscow

>>63972896
Hiroshima and Nagasaki beg to differ

>>63973343
That's probably a troll.

>>63973349
That one's legit.

>>63973219
>Russia is not the USSR
Correct, Russia without Baltics, Poland, Czechoslovakia, Ukraine, is inept shithole that can't produce or innovate shit. Hence you have Pidors in delusions of being a superpower (because places like Baltics were only strain on them), and now they have reality check.

>>63973157
95% of those death were not inflicted by us forces

>>63973367
He knows. He's been told. He's trolling because Russia hasn't had a single significant win this year.

>>63973372
What about the great sumy offensiev?

>>63972806 (OP)
It achieves nothing of military significance and is a waste of time and resources, plus it helps the PR campaign becaus it demonstrates how both evil and retarded Russia is. So honestly just letting it happen would be best. Defending against swarms like this is never cost or resource effective. Best bet is to let it drag on for a bit, then start doing the same right back at Russia. Spam Moscow with drone swarms yourself.

>>63973385
You fucking retard those drones have 90kg warhead that will fuck your shit up.

Will this work?

>>63972897
I don't get why they don't make the interceptors a bit more rugged, lets say with an X shaped blade in the front that also covers the propellers so that they can be reused.

Imagine pic related but with props.

>>63973048
>90 mil
Five of those is more than it costs Russia to build 5000 drones.

>>63973407
And 5 of those will take down 10,000 drones each over the course of the war. Your point?

>>63973407
Yes but they can protect multiple buildings and industrial facilities worth hundreds of millions.

>>63973367
>>63973372
>95% of those death were inflicted by us forces
Ftfy

>>63973435
Too bad there's not a single building in ukraine that fits that criteria except for Maybe old Soviet nuclear plants, but Russia doesn't target those anyway

>>63972897
>>63973406
Why not just put a long stick with a shape charge at the end?

>>63972806 (OP)
Cope nets around apartment buildings. Just order those anti-suicide nets they use in the Foxconn buildings and turn them around.

>>63973593
Adding explosives guarantees your own drone dies as well + explosives are expensive and dangerous.

>>63973435
If the method of attack costs less than the method of defense and you aren't overwhelmingly more wealthy than the attacker then you loose. Doesn't matter if defending is a better option than not defending, of fucking course it's better to try and shoot down drones instead of letting them pummel your factories that's why defending fucking sucks, you've only got bad options on the table.

>>63973254
That picture needs updating
Not the Russian side obviously, because Russia is a shithole, but the English side is badly out of date

>>63973415
Really fucking doubt that. With the limited range of gun systems and drones attacking the target from all directions a single turret will catch only a handful per mass attack. And then you factor in the cost of ammunition and there's no way you aren't spending massively more resources defending than the enemy does attacking.

I say, instead of buying expensive german gun turrets, use the money to build/buy more long range drones to hit oil refineries.

>>63973643
Just need a long enough stick.

>>63973051
A jet engine is so much different than a plastic propeller battery powered thing it's a different class of weapon entirely. If your solution is to change weapon classes then the previous weapon class has been effectively countered.

>>63973526
>My Lai massacre by US personnel
>347 killed
>Hue Massacres by NVA personnel during Tet Offensive
>6000+ killed

Yeah nah fuck off you brown cunt.

>>63973671
Much cheaper turrets and ammunition should be able to counter the cheap mass drones. Why have these not been developed? I don't believe anyo drone gun systems are obsolete or incapable just that the western countries making them are stuck in the traditional big unit, high cost, slow development, low innovation process that dominated war industries since the first man o war.

>>63973719
*anti drone gun systems

>>63973711
>executing POWs is the same as murdering women and children
lol

>>63973154
The rest of the Pacific War probably contributed at least a little.

>>63973157
>destroy infrastructure with minimum civilian casualties
yeah

>>63973245
>chose to nuke the Japanese navy
There wasn't much of it left by August 1945.

>>63973719
>Why have these not been developed?
?

>>63973728
>Schoolteachers and their students are POWs
Yeah nah fuck off brown thirdie. You will always stink of shit.

>>63973728
>Pham Van Tuong, a part-time janitor for the Huế government information office who made it on the Vietcong list of "reactionaries" for working there, was hiding with his family as it hunted for him. When he was found with his 3-year-old daughter, 5-year-old son and two nephews, the Vietcong immediately gunned them all down, leaving their bodies on the street for the rest of the family to see.
You will ALWAYS stink of shit.

it's worth pointing out that russia usually sends a handful of cruise and ballistic missiles with each of these waves, which turns it into a complex attack. they also plan the routes of the drones and cruise missiles based on ground radar emissions they detect via satellite, so ukraine needs to keep their radars sam radars off and then turn them back on when early warning gives them the go.

i suspect russia will throw in anti-radiation variants of these drones with the waves, if they already aren't.

>>63973145
Build one that works for less and submit design to Natick. You won't, because it's more gratifying to act superior while in bitch mode than to do anything else.

>>63973671
Ammunition is dirt cheap, even expensive proximity fragmentation rounds are gonna be like 30-60 bucks a pop. Even these cheap shit ass drones are a couple grand, and you only need one, two shots max to pop it out of the sky. One single turret could probably take two or three dozen shasneeds out of the sky on it's own easy. Potentially more. Add that up over multiple years and it's going to make it's cost back and then some.

>>63973757
What is the name of this system

>>63973837
>>63973048
>30-60 bucks a pop
For the Oerlikon, 35mm AHEAD Airburst costs about $500-$1000 per round. They fire 20-40 of these per burst against a drone.
A Shahed costs about 20k-50k.
I'd say the fragmentation ammo costs so much because it comes from a small 200 yearold ammo workshop in Europe with one guy running it. If you want it 30-60 a pop, Europe must 5x their effort to establish an actual military industrial infrastructure.

>>63973880
M-LIDS

>>63973887
>$500-$1000 per round
Have you tried not being a third world country?

>>63973887
So at worst, with the current economy of scale, they're equivalent cost and at best they're half cost or better. In exchange for stopping drones from degrading strategic capabilities, damaging infrastructure and just straight up plain saving innocent lives.

Seems like a decent price if you ask me.

>>63973219
>Russians wee underrepresented
>we
Found pussian

>>63972867
>That's well understood but they still need to be countered
Perhaps not.
Perhaps waiting until Russia's economy implodes might be best.

>>63973241
Bodied that curry FREAK

>>63972822
>>63972843
also picrel
APKWS
reusable interceptor drones

>>63972806 (OP)
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?
You make peace

>>63973955
anon, no one cares about diplomacy nowadays because everyone has to get exactly what they want and no one can consneed anything.

>>63973955
>You make peace
>With zigerian
How did it go in 2022?

>>63972806 (OP)
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?
Spam /pol/ with Ukrainian victories to demoralise ziggers

>>63973981
Perfectly well in 2022, judging by Arakhamiya’s confession rofl

>>63973343
>bro really posted a /uhg/ falseflag
It’s a hand of a 50 yo Scot poster from britpol general. Archive has it, goreleaf caught a melty after the Scot himself showed up

>>63973908
Seems a lot closer to the rheinmetal supergun. Also the love fire showed it using 30mm cannon to take down dji drones that were nicely just hanging in the sky in one spot. I still wonder if there isn't a smaller cheaper solution that could be put out there specifically for the small stuff

>>63973154
If the US wasn't on the brink of invading the home island they're wouldn't have surrendered and even then they only barely decided to

>>63974002
>Archive has it
are this archive in the room with us right now?

>>63972947
Because that 50 million dollars isn't demonstrably doing anything. It's like if russia bought a private jet once a week just to kamikaze it into a city block.

>>63973728
When those POWs are women and children, yes.

>>63974012
>are this archive
Of course it is slick brosenko right next to Schatzi

>>63973534
Every single factory, electric utility, and apartment building full of people fits that criteria anon.
>>63973660
You calculate expenditure against what is being defended, not against what you are using to defend it (if you can do it cheaply, that's a bonus). A single bullet is pretty cheap, but a soldier is more expensive than a bulletproof vest, so we still use bulletproof vests even if they are more expensive than the bullets the enemy is firing, etc.

>>63973593
It smashes into the enemy drone at 145 mph, you don't really need explosive to damage it and a purely kinetic payload makes everything cheaper and easier to handle.

>>63974007
When 30x113mm shells are out of your price range, I don't think nationhood is for you.

>>63972806 (OP)
tulsi doing her part
plawse and dankiu

>>63973405
Jesus, Russia is entering another shitty era of their history. God must hate Russians.

>>63974051
> You calculate expenditure against what is being defended, not against what you are using to defend it
Good job now you lose either way
1. It hits target, huge economical loss
2. It’s intercepted, small economical loss
So either you lose quickly or slowly but there is no alternative. You always lose

>>63973832
Bitch this costs more than a 5th gen stealth multirole fighter, while having an engagement range of 4 KMs

And yeah I am starting to think about re-learning math and shit now

>>63972806 (OP)
it is cheaper to fire missiles in return
but aim at their missile production facilities
unfortunately it is hard to develop this capability no less build it while under enemy attack without using slave labor in tunnels

>>63974724
Small economic losses are inevitable in warfare.

>>63972806 (OP)
new footage of skynex in action.

>>63974724
this is thirdie calculus.

>>63972806 (OP)

Russia kills like 120 people a month with this shit while Ukraine is killing like 30000 of their soldiers. It's not hard to see how this is going to end.

my prescription: a fixed wing jet drone. it flies from enemy drone to enemy drone and shoots them down with a gun / flak canon type of thing. optical / IR targeting, image recognition lock. footage to command center to confirm. otherwise autonomous flight.

>>63972806 (OP)
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?
You can tell that Russian strikes became much more concentrated in June and July 2025, with fewer but much taller spikes on the histogram corresponding to fewer but much larger drone/missile waves. I think this corresponds to ukraine's AD working, but that doesn't quite explain why russia continues to do smaller waves.
>I would think spreading the population out to not live in commie blocks
then ukraine can't do shit anymore and russia wins. cities exist because high population density is critical for productivity, also for quality of life
>and building command centers/factories underground or spread them out
underground command centers are feasible. underground factories? lmao

>>63975269
Guns, ammunition, and firing systems are very heavy, aiming is difficult, and debris from destroyed Shaheds may hit pursuing aircraft. I think it would be better to just use larger and more expensive drones (or manned aircraft, or tethered balloons) to carry a bunch of small, cheap interceptors. The interceptors would essentially serve as cheap air to air missiles in this case. They may already be doing this.

>>63975261
>Russia kills like 120 people a month with this shit
that's because the targets are facilities, not people.
>while Ukraine is killing like 30000 of their soldiers
that'd be >1.08 million *dead* which even ukraine doesn't claim

>>63972806 (OP)
>Russia is now drone+missile spamming every 2-3rd day now
Tonight is actually completely quiet, they're saving up I guess, or thinking about how to deal with the massive interception rate from last night.
>700+ drones used on three cities
>20 drones actually hit something

>>63972873
>Orange Fuckface has imposed snaction and tarif fraud ob t3h monke ...?
$300m in weapons from presidential authority.
Better than nothing.

>>63974639
My question is more along the lines of how many of those things can you purchase, field and supply versus how many targets can they protect. A super cheap option with cheaper ammo could be fielded down to the level of every individual vehicle and several on every base.

>>63975318
it needs to be a big drone. shahed sized at least. they're pretty big. those can take an .50cal at very least. i doubt the debris issue. it's a targeting and maneuvering issue. a computer controlled system could observe from the side, on decision roll in, shoot accurately and maneuver out very fast.

>>63972806 (OP)
>how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?
Nuke Moscow, nuke Pidorsburg.
>but nukes are expensive
Still the most cost-effective way in the long run.

>>63973333
>that poster
Anon, warn me next time, I almost spat my coffee.
(also checked & witnessed)

>>63973955
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?

DEW SHORAD systems like the Army has been field testing. This article is from 2023, but I'm too lazy to go find an updated status report on the program. https://www.defensenews.com/land/2023/04/13/army-short-range-air-defense-laser-prototypes-take-down-drones-at-yuma/

>>63975376
Assuming 90 kg payload, here is some napkin math:

Fixed HMG - 30 KG
600 rounds - 60 kg

16x interceptor drones - 80 kg weight
Drone drop mechanism - 10 kg weight

I think loading interceptor drones will yield a much higher amount of stowed kills. Like in this scenario, assuming 100 rounds to shoot down a shahed, and a 75% hit rate for interceptors, the interceptor-armed drone fighter will be able to destroy twice as many Shaheds as the gun-armed drone fighter.

>>63975319
>that's because the targets are facilities, not people.
krokodil dreams
or are you going to hit us with
>yeah their targeting is shit and constantly hits commie blocs, but that doesn't mean they intentionally hit them
In reality the number is low because the citizenry of Ukraine have become efficient at taking shelter when warning systems prompt the too, and drones take quite a while before they arrive besides.

>that'd be >1.08 million *dead* which even ukraine doesn't claim
In terms of 'unrecoverable losses' it about matches. That said, strictly confirming 30,000 KIA per month is the current goal that you'll hear from various groups these days. Magyar's Birds is quite transparent about those terms, progress towards it, and their contributions.

>>63975239
AHEAD ammunition is so cool.

>>63975358
Homie, that IS the super cheap option.

>>63973887
>A Shahed costs about 20k-50k.
why do you lie?

>>63975319
>that'd be >1.08 million *dead* which even ukraine doesn't claim
It was in fact claimed by Pavel Gubarev, one of the leaders of the russian incursion into Ukraine during 2014-2015.

>>63973154
Well anon the fucking nuke was a game changer

>>63973157
>leaving out Chechnya

>>63973887
I’m so bored of Le economics professor reddit man describing war in dollars and cents
>UHM AKTUALLY IF YOU STOP A TARGET FROM BEING DESTROYED OR CIVILIANS BEING KILLED WITH SOMETHING EXPENSIVE THATS ACTUALLY A BAD THING

>>63973526
You do realize US troops also stopped the soldiers from attacking civilians further in the massacre right?

>>63972856
It will work, unless another nation puts troops on the ground and changes the equation.

Its simple math.

>>63976199
Hasn’t so far

>>63976232
I didn't say it would be quick, i said it would work.

Sanctions failed, arming Ukraine has prevented their collapse but is not enough for them to push Russia out. Ukraine is a smaller nation in every aspect than Russia. If Russia wants to grind them down, they can. They appear to be just fine with doing so.

>>63976287
It won’t work

>>63973887
>For the Oerlikon, 35mm AHEAD Airburst costs about $500-$1000 per round.
Have those numbers ever been confirmed or properly sourced? Last I checked they were sourced from a literal unrelated RPG rulebook.

>>63976310
The Gepard ammo is $600 per round according to
>The contract with Rheinmetall was signed a few days prior for 300,000 rounds, at a total cost of €168 million (U.S. $181 million).

>>63976328
>According to a Rheinmetall news release, other nations declined to contribute from their existing stocks of ammunition, “citing either political considerations or constitutional restrictions.” Rheinmetall typically produces its munitions for medium-range artillery in Switzerland. The long-neutral nation has not sent any weapons to Ukraine, but has earmarked about 1.5 billion Swiss francs ($1.7 billion) for humanitarian and development aid to Kyiv over the next five years.
>Local reports indicate the Swiss government is considering whether to allow third-party operators of locally made weapons to send them to Ukraine, under stringent export guidelines.
>The company is providing two types of ammunition to Ukraine as part of the aforementioned commitment, including a subcaliber APDS-T munition containing heavy metal penetrators, intended for engaging hardened targets. The second type is a conventional high-explosive incendiary designed for air defense and for attacking aircraft and guided missiles.
Those numbers aren't for AHEAD rounds, they're for 35mm APDS and HEI that were remachined from IFV rounds to be compatible with AAA guns, so the price isn't even indicative of normal cost for those rounds either.

Meanwhile apparently AHEAD is manufactured in Switzerland? And they don't want to export it to the Urkraine or something? Is this entire saga about the cost per round of AHEAD actually just mountain germans/jews titanically price gouging by fostering artificial scarcity? If they really were $1000 per round then there's no way the Middle Eastern users could have afforded the system. I am deeply curious about all this.

>>63976433
>Those numbers aren't for AHEAD rounds,
My bad for not specifying my intention, I posted that as a reference for the cost of current ammo. AHEAD is newer, more complex and heavier.

>AHEAD actually just mountain germans/jews titanically price gouging by fostering artificial
Hard to tell, artillery shells are ~100 times heavier but only 5-10 times more expensive including fuze and propellant charge, the other difference is production numbers, the production of 155 shells is actually higher (?). Price per kg is meaningless when a small shell needs of a production line and it can take as many process and time to make than a larger shell, the cost of materials is tiny (except for explosives).

>>63975300
>underground factories?
The big ones like Rhinemetal are underground I believe.
You can do a lot with say, an underground carpark too.

Otherwise, you simply distribute your production in many small workshops.
People are building FPVs at their kitchen table in hundreds of small communities and they get collected in basements.
Some of the small operations for things like nets and candles can be done in random basements too.

>>63975319
Rubio said over 100k dead in 2025, that was at a press conference this week.
That's at least half of the claimed amount.

>>63976194
>You do realize US troops
A handful of helicopter crew did and they were punished for it.

>>63976433
>Meanwhile apparently AHEAD is manufactured in Switzerland
RM opened a factory in Spain after that came up.
Not sure if it's online yet.

>>63973048
If this proliferates (if the war lasts that long, I'm bet it will), Russia will eventually have to replace piston Geran since AAA will be economically effective.

IDK if Geran-3's 600kph is going to be enough either. Its not a low drag shape, its another kite. For the replacement they need something like 90kg warhead, 900kph cruise, high speed turbojet, air or gas generator (or rocket) catapult boost launch at over 300kph. Thirstier so more weight - maybe 500kg. Likely to need to fly lower, maybe have to terrain checking LIDAR. Probably look like a miniature Kh-101 but with a fixed blade wing. Everything gets faster, awesome, evolution in progress.

>remove pussia from swift and ban all trade with EU and limit gas purchases
>cant even have direct international flights in or out and borders basically have been closed
>3 years later and its economy hasnt collapsed
how do they do it bros? im guessing after 70 years of communism will make any country pretty resilient but damn

>>63976822
- they kept sanction proofing their economy after 2014
- third worlders love fossil at a discount
- EU trade with all of the former USSR countries ramped up by a factor of 10
- China helps keep them afloat because destabilizing and draining Europe while weakening Russia is a win-win for them

Make no mistake, though, they're in deep shit.
You can only suck your banking sector dry for so long.

>>63976847
Austria is also getting royally fucked by this. Their largest bank RBI, a conglomerate of smaller raiffeisen aka "Raika" banks has a substantial investment in Russia with AO Raiffeisenbank. It's one the of the big four in Russia and so far n one knows how much money is parked in there and how fucked the company is once Putin steals the subsidiary or the Russian state collapses.
AO Raiffeisenbank can still use Swift for limited transfers but selling it failed so far. One attempt was to swap AO Raiffeisenbank with some Sttabag stonks, but US laywers flew to Vienna, gave everyone an enema, refused to elaborate and went back to the US. It was really funny to see all the big money guys on Austria cope and seethe about that.
It will also be even more funny when suddenly several big and small companies in Austria go bust once Russia collapses, because there are a lot of crooked things going on like selling machine parts to Uralgavonozod for tonks or Strabag building roads, I mean mega yachts for Oligarchs lol.

>>63976199
>>63976287
but it doesn't work tho.
>sanctions failed
now i know you're retarded.
>ukraine is smaller
>b-BUT UKRAINE IS SMALLER THO
the line of midwits everywhere.
>they appear to be just fine with doing so
that's not what they're doing, thougheverbeit, they're currently losing the economic and attritional war.

>>63976822
Russia has the largest borders in the entire world, perfect for 1st, 2nd and 3rd party smuggling

>>63976822
they had a warchest of foreign currency they inject into the market to prevent collapse.
basically they're making their own economy look like it's not completely unwanted and their currency look like it's retaining it's value by dumping a ridiculous amount of saved up gold and foreign reserves into the economy.
this contingency is about to stop working though, they're through most of it at this point, and they're already trying to stretch it out by playing a game of musical chairs with debt between the banks, the military complex and gas companies.

>>63976847
>>63976822
Oh and also picrel.

>>63972806 (OP)
>So how the fuck do you cost-effectively counter these annoying shits?

ok considering that apparently russia hasnt run out of washing machines since 2022 you can only do one thing

vibrate the air vibrations are the arch nemesis of washing machines especially the flying ones

>>63972856
>Those attacks mostly hit civilian targets of questionable value and the idea is to demolralize the west in stopping shipments.


can you tell us then why ukrainians have placed air defences on random cities like lutsk and fastiv?
clearly they arent there to protect civilians lets stop with this bs cope

>>63973357
And Dresden is the very opposite. And since Russia isn't nuking Ukraine, we shall defer to Dresden.

>>63976822
Short answer: China, India, and lots of debt.
Longer answer: Since 2014 they de-dollarised and de-Europeanised. The main hit to their oil/gas revenues by the EU is in the form of gas since Europe bought all of Russia's gas, and most of Russia's gas is in the European Arctic. For interest, Russia has the world's largest proven gas reserves.
They are now effectively bankrolled by Indian Rupees and Chinese Yuan for their exports. Turkey too - the Turkish dimension to all of this warrants a doctoral thesis paper desu. Sanctions have had some effect but a lot passes through ex-USSR countries in the Caucusus and Central Asia before it reaches Russia. China too sells them European dual-use goods that end up in Russian weapons attacking Ukraine.
The domestic economy is also living off of credit. The government has burnt most of their sovereign wealth fund to recapitalise banks to encourage them to lend more to the civilian sector (but also heavily to the defence sector). See this guy's graph which is from Craig Kennedy's Navigating Russia report >>63976847
If US and Euro sanctions are to really make sense, then these 3rd party countries also need to be hit with some punishment for passing on goods to Russia. The Senate Big Beautiful Sanctions Bill might do the job.

>>63972896
That picture is so true it hurts

>>63977012
Going nuclear on third countries isn't going to do it tough. There's always a way around sanctions if you want to avoid them.
And they are already doing what you want them to do, breaking their economy. Everything they sanctions bust they pay a steep premium for.
There's a case in belgium with a guy selling them chips at a cool 500% markup. I can't imagine the turks and chinks being any kinder to the russians.
Plus the russians have lost their old ex-USSR export market. Mostly to Europe for high end stuff and China for all the rest. If you go hard on them for sanctions bust you are also giving russia a chance to get back into those markets.
Taking as much of russias export market is crucial because it further limits their chance to recover from their post war recession.
Geo-strategically is also brilliant, those countries are also concerned by russian aggression and now they are cozing up to the west, china and turkey. That's a big problem for the russians. No point in upsetting them now by slamming down hard on them.

>>63972856
>civilian targets of questionable value

I love it when a country's military resigns from its main purpose

>>63976979
She didn't do any magic tricks. Just turned the ruble printer on and increased CAR. The central bank is not really independent of the government in Russia.
The only reason that the ruble has any value at all is because they have so much in reserve ~$400 billion in equivalent USD - precisely because if there ever is a run on the ruble they have sufficient buoyancy to choose an exchange rate of their liking. Having high central bank reserves is a good thing for a dodgy currency of questionable value, but it's bad to be a dodgy currency in the first place.

>>63976989
>it's cope to protect civilians
What causes you to think like this? Is it impossible in your pea brain that Russia is both evil and stupid enough to conduct terror bombing on, as you said, "random cities like Lutsk"?

>>63972822
that's not cost effective
>>63972806 (OP)
the most cost effective solution would be striking russia back in kind as a form of deterrence but unfortunately that's not possible

Putin knows he can bomb Ukrainian cities with impunity because Ukraine will not be allowed to so much as crack a window in Moscow by its allies.

>>63974741
>Bitch this costs more than a 5th gen stealth multirole fighter, while having an engagement range of 4 KMs
How much does the operating hour of each system cost?

>>63977064
you do not place random AA on random cities
period
especially when you cry that you dont have missiles
obviously they were protecting military targets

>>63977130
>saaaaaar don't put your aa in cities saaaaaar russia should be able to freely terrorize civilians saaaaaar I drink cow piss saaaaar

>>63977133
thats stupid and you know it

why they dont have random aa on every random city then?

its not like they are close to the frontlines or whatever so please cut the crap

>>63975239
Stupid question, why is the camera for aiming set so close to the turret it loses vision temporarily due to the muzzle flash? Couldnt you easily offset it by a fuckload because you could just have the offset calibrated in the electronics?
>>63975300
Yeah that is interesting. You'd expect to see much more missile strikes since according to all the sources I've seen (from both sides) the russians should be manufacturing a good deal of missiles yearly. And on top of that the Korean supply.

>>63974051
You run out of money.
Your country has thousands and thousabds of expensive targets. The enemy has thousands upon thousands of munitions to hit all these various targets.
You cannot protect them if the defense systems cost a ton of money.

>>63977143
You stop what you can with what you have, extending the time you have to develop cheaper solutions, while trying also to inflict strategic losses on the enemy. We are already seeing the transition, from using AA missiles to systems like Skynex that can down a Shahed with a couple of bullets and interceptor drones.
What's your suggestion, not to even use air defence since it's too expensive?

>>63977143
>enemy has thousands upon thousands of munitions to hit all these various targets
Source?

>>63977140
>terror bombing civilians to demoralise a war-weary population doesn't exist
>no yuo r stupid
Christ Jesus you're a complete retard.

>>63975755
>AA turret that costs more than an F35
>cheap
...

>>63977162
My suggestion is to hang all fucking germans for selling overpriced crap.

>>63977168
i will ask you again
why there isnt aa on every city since russia is terror bombing
and sort of happen russia is targeting those specific cities which sort of happen to have AA?

either russia is so lucky that every city they pick has an air defence
or someone is using civilians to hide their military

>>63977171
It's not like Ukraine is paying for it.

>>63977165
That's exactly why long range attack drones have been so revoluionary.
Even a shithole like Russia can produce large volume strikes.

Imagine what a drone manufacturing superpower like China could do with drones.

Low cost effective air defence is a matter of survival in the upcoming war in the pacific.

>>63977181
>Low cost effective air defence is a matter of survival in the upcoming war in the pacific.

the only thing that can deal with a swarm of it is lasers
literally nothing else
unless they make their SPY radars a DEW

>>63977177
Holy mother of ESL, Rajesh your post is barely comprehensible.
>why there isnt aa on every city since russia is terror bombing
>either russia is so lucky that every city they pick has an air defence
These two statements are contradictory. Is there AA in every city they target or not?

>>63972887
This has always been obvious to anybody with an IQ over 20.
Unfortunately, our government homunculi seem to be even more retarded than that.

>>63977180
And? If it cost what a cannon with a targeting system should, ie. MAX 5 mil, then europe could actually afford enough of them to guarantee protection.

It's ridiculous that this thing costs the same as 10 main battle tanks.

>>63977183
I think automated interceptor quadcopters seem pretty promising

They just need to make them reusable kinetic kill vehicles and the drone menace is as good as dealth with.

>>63977184
>mom if i say esl and try to change his questions as contradictory while they were clear as fuck will it work to win?
>so long you are stupid to argue with statements you cant provide the answer for yes my son!

you

>>63977187
It's not a matter of money, but production capacity.
Also you're looking at the cost of the entire battery, including the radar (which is the most expensive bit), the control station, and 4 guns + ammo. The cannon itself is not particularly expensive for such a high-tech AA piece, given you can basically defend an entire block with just one gun.

>>63975239
Aren't these munitions pretty fucking expensive compared to their targets, though? I activated some mild autism and calculated what might be about 16k USD being lobbed at Shahed nr.3 in the video, with the drone itself costing between 20 and 50k. Granted, the money is less, but it's still quite substantial given that the ukies don't have so much production capabilities or war chest to burn.
Wouldn't some cheaper solutions also work? Like maybe improving good old shilkas? Right now, ukies mostly intercept drones by using a large amount of technicals with AA guns shooting normal ammo in large quantities.

>>63977064
>The only reason that the ruble has any value at all is because they have so much in reserve ~$400 billion in equivalent USD
more than 2/3 of that is frozen in Europe
the real reason the ruble is keeping it's value is that russian trade has collapsed. India, Turkey and China don't trade with them in rubles buy in their own currency for hydro carbons. Russia only trades in rubles with thirdworld shitholes like Venezuela and Cuba.
this allows them to fix the value of their currency because the volume is so low.
they can then go "look how stronk ruble is, sanctions don't work. pls lift sanctions". But the minute that sanctions are lifted the ruble would crash as every russian would want to get dollars, euros, GB pounds, Swiss francs, yen anything really for their rubles
>>63977143
>Ukriane runs out of money
>the EU gives them an couple hundred billion more in loans, debt assurances and gibs

>>63977195
So do Russians always happen to hit AA-defended cities or not? It's legitimately unclear.
I would reply to your point if I could understand what you're attempting to say.

>>63977204
you are asking the questions i asked you?

you tell me since you obviously have more data and info
does russia hit blindly and is so lucky so far that every village and city has air defence
or
ukraine is flat out lying as always?

>>63977201
>but it's still quite substantial given that the ukies don't have so much production capabilities or war chest to burn.
Those are produced in Italy (iirc), and paid for by German and EU money. The Ukrainians get them for free.

>>63977187
you have to understand
90% of Rheinmetall's employees are autistic german furries and fursuits aren't cheap

>>63977207
>does russia hit blindly and is so lucky so far that every village and city has air defence
??? Do you mean unlucky?
They tend to hit every major city, all of which are covered by air defence. Sometimes they hit or shell smaller cities too, which are not as protected.

>>63977209
Ok fair point, but they won't get unlimited gibs. Even though Germany probably doesn't even feel such costs given its xboxhueg economy.

>>63977215
>but they won't get unlimited gibs
Ukraine gibs now count towards you NATO spending target so the gibs will flow

>>63977213
the only major city they constantly hit is kiev
second occassionally is odessa once or twice per month (per data)
the rest of the smaller cities are neither close to them or to the front lines most of them infact are south west and nortwest of kiev

there is absolutely no reason other than to protect a factory or any other military target to have a random lone launcher in such areas
if you are still arguing that its typical then its better to stop it here

>>63977219
>the gibs will flow
>The gibs are life.
>He who controls the gibs controls the war.

Ok I concede, you got a point. Given all that,n ow I am pretty certain the ukies must get more of these systems.
And shilkas. And other guns. Some AMRAAMs too, given that they launch them from the ground as last line of defense.

>>63977201
the question is
how much those first and second gen shaheds WITHOUT warheads costs..
if they cost LESS than the munition which is probable then again they have a huge problem

>>63977226
gibs-hulud the great gibs worms
but I agree that we should do what we can to arm the Ukrainians to the teeth
-it kills russians
-it's cheaper than doing it ourselves
-allows for improvements to be made by battle testing it
-boosts our arms industry
-it kills russians

>>63977203
I deducted the $300 billion which is frozen. They have $400 billion leftover after that, and most of that is gold which has surged in value this year thanks to Trump fucking with the dollar and compromising the value of dollar-denominated assets. They would nominally have about $700 billion if nothing were frozen, which was about $600 billion in 2022 at the start of the war.

I don't think sanctions will ever get lifted desu. Europe is not only rearming itself militarily but it's also broadening its energy supply and building NPPs and the like. The US might lift some sanctions, but US-Russia trade was quite minimal to begin with.
The positive Russian current account really relies on oil and gas exports and not much else. There's hardly anything that they make, either in goods or services, that's valuable.
On another note, Russian military exports have collapsed - even India sells more to ex-USSR countries like Armenia now than Russia in the 2020s. Modern Russian equipment is barely able to keep up with outdated Western-donated equipment in Ukraine. Even barely used Russian AA in the Ukraine war has been proven to be ineffective versus American-made fighter jets in Iran. There's a big question on the quality of a lot of higher-spec expensive Russian kit that was sold previously.

>>63977224
These are the areas attacked during yesterday's attack. Pretty much all over the country.
>there is absolutely no reason other than to protect a factory or any other military target to have a random lone launcher in such areas
They have launchers all around because Russia is bombing them. I feel like I'm arguing with a retard.

>>63977219
>Ukraine gibs now count towards you NATO spending target so the gibs will flow
So Trump's shenanigans brought NATO and Russia a step closer to a direct confrontation?

>>63977142
It's a big muzzle flash.

>>63977209
Ask me how I know you own a kippah.

>>63977244
>They have launchers all around
ok lets pretend you are right
we assume they have 8 so long israel actually gave theirs too
if not then 6
thats 24 launchers
zhytomir khmnel rivne ternopil lviv all together have 151 cities
and they ONLY have 6 radars which is safe to assume at least 3 of them are near the frontlines from north to south.....
so yes numbers do not add up even if you place the 2 systems of israel this will fall short of having RANDOM LAUNCHERS ALL OVER THE PLACE JUST BECAUSE
get over your self and stop pretending that both parties arent using civilians to hide their military

>>63977243
>I deducted the $300 billion which is frozen
my bad
sanctions might get lifted tough or at least in part since the way they where voted in by the EU requires them to be renewed and Slovenia and Hungary will try to fuck with that
but even then the disconnect from russian hydrocarbons isn't going away. It's also not there jet simply due to how big of a part russian hydrocarbons was in Europe's energy mix.
russia really needs sanctions to go away not so it can export more hydrocarbons (although that certainly wouldn't hurt them) but the 1001 ways that the sanctions are bleeding them.
Tooling wears out? we you need to get the replacements from Germany, that will be a 400% markup for the sanctions busting. Or you can buy chinese they'll only mark it up 250% but it's also chinese quality and you'll have to replace the rest of it as well since it's all made to "chinese international standards".

>>63977248
trumps shenanigans are always effective, just not always in the ways he thinks they will be

>>63977238
In addition to all that, it also kills Russians.
As an europoor, this is the best way to spend taxes - transform money directly into trad and not gay blowjobs drone interruptions.
We had fucking peace on the entire continent until these retards decided to revive the USSR.

>>63977266
Anon they have more than one missile defence system.

>>63977268
they aint gonna touch those 300 billions
they arent stupid
not because russia will retaliate or something
but because this will completely nuke the eu banking system overnight

you see the premise is that BIS provides trust that the national funds are untouchable
if those retards decided to do this BIS will no longer be able to provide guarantees
and this will literally trigger countries from taking their money OUT of eu banks
and if one those countries is china (they have 2.3 trillions on eu banks) then i dont want to even think what will happen

>>63977256
Ask me how I know your skin is brown.

>>63977279
The post you replied to, and the post he replied to, didn't say anything about spending frozen Russian money.

In fact no post ITT did.

>>63977277
patriot is the cheapest one

i highly doubt they are using sampt in random areas given how expensive as fuck those aster costs...

but its all speculation since ukraine constaly says that they intercept 95% of them all day 24/7
(which makes me think why israel even gave their away with such effective rate that they have..................)

>>63973273
>>63973278
>>63973319
You both are pathetic.

>>63973757
One got delivered to Ukraine recently, IIRC.

>>63977289
>(which makes me think why israel even gave their away with such effective rate that they have..................)
You really need to pass whatever third-world language you speak natively through a proper translation software or an AI. Reading this shit is painful.

The Russians bomb all over the country. That's why you see a variety of AA systems all over the country. It's really not that hard to understand.

>>63977304
nah its not you completely get what i mean you simply dont want to accept that ukraine is lying constantly
>The Russians bomb all over the country

really?
even chat gpt gives a summary of a total of 27 cities from january till now

and im removing those
Kyiv, Chernihiv, Zhytomyr, Khmelnytskyi, Ternopil, Sumy, Odesa, Poltava, Dnipropetrovsk, Mykolaiv, Kharkiv, Cherkasy
Kostiantynivka and Kryvyi Rih because they are all in the frontline....

so yes according to ukraine the number STILL DONT ADD UP

>>63977324
>Kyiv, Odessa
>Frontline

>>63977324
NTA. Please read this wikipedia article before posting again.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motivated_reasoning

>>63977324
>>63977244
Please indicate the frontline on this map.
I hate thirdies so much it's unreal.

>>63977337
>60km from the frontlines isnt frontlines guys we are totally safe
>>63977354
oh look how he tries to be relevant again
chatgpt used ukranian sources for the hits
i provided all the cities
and yet you still fall back on the original argument
UKRAINE SIMPLY doesnt have the air defence to be able to cover all of ukraine and having it in certain areas which russia hits A LOT its because there is military presence

your argument of hitting civilians is pure bs because then russia could have very well hit all of the other gazzilion cities and villages ukraine has without air defence
yes?
yes.............................

>>63973887
>For the Oerlikon, 35mm AHEAD Airburst costs about $500-$1000 per round. They fire 20-40 of these per burst against a drone.
kek
bs

the price per round is correct
but you absolutely DO NOT need 20-40 per burst
it's more like 4-10
recently published data (last week) talked about ~5000€ per downed Drone

but also only 2 Skyshield units in Ukraine
and it was never meant for comprehensive coverage, only critical infrastructure

>>63977365
>your argument of hitting civilians is pure bs because then russia could have very well hit all of the other gazzilion cities and villages ukraine has without air defence
Yeah Russia would never strike random civilians in random cities.

>>63977372
and where was this anon again?

name the city please
NAME IT

>>63976287
>Russia is fighting entire NATO
>Ukraine is a smaller nation in every aspect than Russia. If Russia wants to grind them down, they can.

pick one you retard.

Russia is a fucking Dot compared to the west, economically and militarily. if the west really wanted to, they could shut down russia in a month by applying massive secondary sanctions to anyone who buys russian Oil, and also ramping up weapons imports 3 fold to Ukraine.

Regarding Russias recent drone spam, if you havent been paying attention by now, theres always a new thing, then a new counter to that thing. its being going on for years like this now.

>>63977394
>Russia is a fucking Dot compared to the west, economically and militarily. if the west really wanted to, they could shut down russia in a month by applying massive secondary sanctions to anyone who buys russian Oil, and also ramping up weapons imports 3 fold to Ukraine.

isnt this the whole premise of that new bill they voted on the senate?
a 500% tarrif for anyone that buys russian gas and oil?
how is this gonna fucking work in favor of usa again?

>>63977381
NTA but pic rel was Kherson

>>63977399
India and China have enormous trade surplusses with the United States. Taxing that = profit. To divest from Russian hydrocarbons they can buy American oil/gas instead. Which is also profit.
What's not to like?

>>63977399
yes that is the point in the new bill.

>how is this gonna fucking work in favor of usa again?

russia wont get any money = war ends in months. Russia is a tiny economy to Russia and China, they would be stupid to support them in favor of the western markets.. its like 30times smaller in trade..

>>63977381
Village Pravdyne
Please explain to me which ammo factory is in that village

>>63977423
where is this anon? give us a nice big red dot on the map for us the stupid people to know

>>63976804
To be frank, RM, and any other arms manufacturers, should repatriate the tooling and IP, then divest themselves of anything else they own in Switzerland immediately. The notion of basing arms manufacturing in a country who is guaranteed to refuse sales in any and all circumstances where you would actually need the arms on the basis of neutrality is absolutely absurd. Establishing a dependent relationship with proprietary ammunition carries only negative value, with literally no upside at all, if you can't restock in war.

This is amongst the most fundamentally unethical pieces of arms dealing I've heard of, and that's really saying something. It's low for arms dealing and it's low for Swiss neutrality shenanigans. No one is ever going to want to buy anything that has Switzerland in the supply chain ever again after this, and rightly so.

>>63973526
>My Lai: crocodile tears
>Bucha: never happened also your russophobic
I genuinely pray for TZD, god bless putin for speedrunning ziglet demographic suicide.

>>63977381
>The toddler was staying with his great-grandmother in the village of Pravdyne, in Kherson, according to Oleksandr Prokudin, a senior military official.
>Pravdyne (Ukrainian: Пpaвдинe, previously known as Tsarevodar) is a village (selo) of Ukraine in the Bilozerka settlement hromada, Kherson Raion, Kherson Oblast. In 2001, it had a population of 1,621.
You're subhuman.

>>63977442
the only subhuman here is you

the house wasnt destroyed which means whatever was NEAR it when the drone hit it exploded and the shockwave basicly did the damage
but you arent ready to talk about this

>>63977447
Yeah the drone heroically destroyed ten HIMARS trucks and killed 50 NATO generals in the highly defended military HQ of bumfuck nowhere.
Please neck yourself.

>>63977459
so it was at the frontlines quite literally
and you are trying to pass it as what? like ukranians do not hide shit in civilian areas?

>>63977465
>russia attacks civilian areas in a full scale war
>russia terror bombs civilian areas
>y duh ukes have military stuff in civilian area?
Gee man I fucking wonder.

>>63977468
>i dont want to say the words
>i dont want to say that ukraine uses civilians
>i want to pretend that the frontlines are peaceful and whoever lives there isnt being left out by the military

ah yeah

>>63977476
>its ukraines fault we invaded those cities!!!
This is why all russians deserve to die btw

>>63977481
>lets try to gaslight

so you gonna answer as to why ukraine uses civilians or not?

>>63977483
Because the military hardware needs to be there to stop the invading russian army from occupying their homes and dropping drones and bombs on them.

>>63977489
ah so hiding military targets on a civilian area is a warcrime or not?

>>63977490
Not if they're their to protect the civilians from an imperialistic invading army of subhuman rapists, no. In fact, that's what a military is used for.

>>63977490
Ukraine does not use civilians. The hardware is there to protect them. From the likes of your "people".

>>63977490
You've provided zero evidence for this in the case being talked about or in the general case. Russia murdered that toddler with their indiscriminate terror bombing. They didn't target a military asset near him, because 1: There wasn't one and 2: They don't, as a rule, actually target things; their attacks with standoff weapons are basically indiscriminate.

>>63977494

>no

and there you have it he couldnt force or gaslight his way out and now he is trying to justify literal warcrimes
>>63977496
you remember the recent attack in kiev where that building was burning for 2 days and had massive secondary explosion and it was literally 40 meters from a hospital?
what was ukraine building there?
or you gonna claim the secondary explosions were fat kids or something?
>>63977500
what evidence? i dont have to bring any evidence i kept asking and asking till the point he couldnt get out of the loop because he ran out of excuses to give

>>63977500
To be fair you are right, it makes no sense for any equipment to even be there, given that there are civvies next to it, and the position on the map. Basically Pajeet is trying to project "muh warcrimez".

>>63977510
>you remember the recent attack in kiev where that building was burning for 2 days and had massive secondary explosion
I am sure you will now provide a link?

>>63977510
Why the fuck would there not be military assets in a place that is being invaded. Of course there is going to be anti air and shit in a place that is being terror bombed by subhuman invaders. Were the anti air emplacements in London during the blitz a warcrime too?

>>63977465
>village of 1000 souls, 30km+ behind a stalled frontline
No I'm sure Russia sent a drone to drop grenades on it because it was a strategic military target, we do not do terror bombing saaaarrrr

The strategic bombing, if you want to call it that, which Russia is conducting on Ukraine pales into insignificance compared to what the Allies were inflicting on Germany in just 1944.
>Through 1944, the Allies were dropping on average 3,000 tons a day of bombs on Germany.
https://www.worldhistory.org/article/2430/allied-bombing-of-germany/

A Shahed/Geran carries up to 90kg of explosives. A few hundred of those is only a few dozen tonnes metric. Nowhere close to the combined power of the RAF and friends eighty years ago.

>>63977519
give me few mins
>>63977534
yes ofc we all know ukraine has enough air defence to cover all of ukraine
get over with this bs excuse
>>63977537
>LETS DROP A BOMB ON THAT RANDOM HOUSE IN THAT RANDOM VILLAGE GUYS

yea

>>63977568
Why are you so desperate to believe that Russia isn't bombing civilians? Reply without motivated reasoning.

>>63977577
here is the thing
if you said this in 2022 i would have agreed with you 100%
but now they simply do not have the ammunition to do a fucking genocide

>>63977519
https://x.com/squatsons/status/1931327903159255400

>>63977568
>yes ofc we all know ukraine has enough air defence to cover all of ukraine
so is their military hardware there or not then? Is Russia bombing civilian targets because the hardware is there or are they just terror bombing civilians like apes which would justify the presence of that hardware if it was there? Which is it?

>>63977585
obviously there is
there has always being
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZlD67Q9Sa4

>>63977510
>what evidence? i dont have to bring any evidence i kept asking and asking till the point he couldnt get out of the loop because he ran out of excuses to give
So you're saying you want him to prove that there wasn't military equipment with the toddler that the Russians killed? Hasn't he already provided photographic evidence of the location, including the dead toddler, but absent any military equipment? Isn't that exactly what proof that your claims are lies would look like? Meanwhile you've provided zero evidence of anything, just an unending stream of unsupported accusations about Ukrainians being responsible for war crimes committed by Russians against small children.

I hope the blood money the Russians pay you to shill for their war crimes is worth it. Die in a fire.

>>63972880
Hello Air Defense Cuckold

>>63977568
They drop bombs on random people in Kherson all the time.

>>63977593
nigga their house is intact cut the bs if a drone had hit it it wouldnt have some structural damage here and there
ok?
ok..

>>63977584
>https://x.com/squatsons/status/1931327903159255400
>a zigger channel showing the secondary explosion as "interesting"
>red pale flame instead of white propellant flames that would be military
>fucking methane tank blows up from the heat in the factory that uses methane
Jesus fucking christ you people.
Did you even check what it produces before eating the shit straight out of the propaganda channels? This is a metal factory. It produces machines and cast elements.
It literally uses gas. It should not ever under any circumstance have live military equipment, for the fucking obvious reason that it's the worst place to store any.

>>63977584
>>>63977577
>here is the thing
>if you said this in 2022 i would have agreed with you 100%
>but now they simply do not have the ammunition to do a fucking genocide
>>>63977519 (You)
>https://x.com/squatsons/status/1931327903159255400

Did he fucking delete his brown propaganda posts and ran?

if so funny when everyone in russia from the president to TV people to military commanders to random wifes all explicitly say in their internal media how they are going to kill all hohols, how they are happy when hohol civilians die, they literally celebrate when they hit things like child hospitals and see pictures of children and moms outside, the president specifically celebrates the units that tortured and killed civilians and gives them medals after it was known what they did...

but then you have some shithole dweller or some shithole sympathizer come out of the woodwork to some western media and try to claim how "naaah maan russians wouldn't do that". even funnier how neither russians nor the shitskins like indians have ever given a single fuck about civilians, or even have such a concept. it's all about exploiting western moral values they don't have to waste your time. if you actually believe them and don't protect your civilians like they're military object, they'll just exploit this as a weakness and kill them. they want you to fall for it. this shitskin shill never actually gave a fuck.

>>63977661
It's possibly also for internal propaganda purposes to spur recruitment. 2025 recruitment is lower than Q4 2024. If people think the war is just about to be won then there will be a rush of kontractnik sign-ups who want the payout bonus + medals without any fighting.

>>63977279
>completely nuke the eu banking system overnight
it wouldn't tough.
For a start this wouldn't be a random seizure of funds. These are the funds of a country that started an external war of aggression against and other country. Both signatory parties of the UN charter that bans wars of aggression and both recognized nations under said charter.
Any country that isn't thinking about violating the UN charter so flagrantly hasn't a thing to worry about. For those that might be considering it, would the EU even care about your war? I means if Brazil takes a bit of disputed land from Peru. Would the Eu take their funds? ofc they wouldn't.
Even the Chinese could argue that since Taiwan isn't a nation and pretty much all of Europe agrees to the one china policy the EU couldn't base any seizure of it's funds on the same reasoning.
Even if all the countries that might want to start a war or feel uncomfortable about having their money in Europe where to pull out. It's not enough to crash the market in and of it's self. And besides what alternative do they have? Put all their money in the US? Yea that will work out great for China if it invades Taiwan.

>>63977660
God I hate browns.

>>63977279
>and if one those countries is china (they have 2.3 trillions on eu banks) then i dont want to even think what will happen
The Deutsche Bank will invade Greece, chop its population up and sell them for spares. The Bundestag will have somebody come up with an excel file that demonstrated that it needs to be done.

>>63977711
Why is December so high and January so low?

>>63977825
>Deutsche Bank excel file
More believable
t. ex-DB shitter

>>63977238
>Qualifications?
>Killing Russians, murder, arson, and killing Russians
>You said killing Russians twice
>I like killing Russians

>>63976822
>3 years later and its economy hasnt collapsed
It did, you're just not seeing it because it's on morphine of fucked up policies and usage of reserves saved up for 2 decades for shit.

>>63976954
The biggest fuck up of sanctions is that everyone is okay with stuff getting sold to russia via intermediaries, and I don't mean iPhones, but military parts. E.g. that case with Safran and Thales parts that are contracted out by a Kazakhstan company, but end up in russia.

>>63977825
>Deutsche Bank will invade Greece
Those Germans attack at a steep bank angle, watch the skies, Greecebros.

>>63977051
>There's always a way around sanctions
Only if you let them. Start imposing secondary sanctions and the intermediaries will do everything in their power to avoid shipping to russia.

>>63977064
>The only reason that the ruble has any value at all is because they've stopped any real trading vs EUR and USD
fixed that for you

>>63977140
>why they dont have random aa on every random city then?
My brown friend, there is not enough AA to cover everything, Ukraine isn't Luxembourg.
One of the reasons why russians target different cities is specifically because they're trying to target regions which are less protected.

>>63977187
>It's ridiculous that this thing costs the same as 10 main battle tanks.
My brown friend, how do you think that turret costs? Just checking how much of a retard are you

>>63977203
>this allows them to fix the value of their currency because the volume is so low.
Only partially. When it comes to buying stuff from abroad the currency rate magically becomes different.You can see this in russian whining about buying stuff from AliExpress, as in "this costs $10 on AliExpress, which by the currency rate should be 800 RUB, but when I buy it it's actually 1200 RUB, what the fuck" and all that.

>>63977243
>They have $400 billion leftover after that
They do not. Most of those "$400 billion" are bullshit. The liquid assets are about $35-50 billion. https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2025/07/04/russia-sells-off-more-foreign-currency-from-wealth-fund-to-bridge-budget-gap-a89689
The rest are things like gold, which is partially okay for storage, but not for financing shit, and, which is even more important, debts and shares of russian "national champion" state corporations, which had to be bailed out post-2014. So a ton of that "money" is virtual.

>>63978214
The sovereign wealth fund and central bank reserves aren't the same thing anon.

>>63977244
>there is absolutely no reason other than to protect a
My retarded friend, you shoot down the missiles and drones when you can, because you can't be sure where exactly it's targeting, unless it's a ballistic missile. I know of examples how russians routinely try to bomb specific sites, which don't have anything strategic or military, but they do it like regularly, like more than 50 attacks there already. Probably shitty intel or something like that. However, you still shoot down the missiles and drones, because guess what - you can't be sure the missile and drone won't turn before that target and go somewhere else.

>>63977372
Fucking grim.
I have that same chinese blanket in red.

>>63977279
>because russia will retaliate
With what? They'll declare war against Ukraine?!

>this will completely nuke the eu banking system overnight
And where will the turdies keep their money? In russia or china? Bitch please, that banking sector is popular because it works.

>>63977465
>at the frontlines
It's nowhere close to the russian or ukrainian forces, you brown subhuman

>russians wouldn't just target civilians
>meanwhile there are public "human safaris" on ukie civilians every day, with russians publishing videos for other russians to salivate over and do fundraising for more human safaris
Brown and disingenuous people (those are usually the same) belong on a cross

>>63978147
A determined sanction buster finds a way.
What the russians are doing now is paying for convince.
Yes, the middleman is ripping them of but they don't have to set up a complete sanction busting ring. When you close down the middle man with secondaries they just have to get more hands on and creative.
front upon front company, forged documents, smuggling ect. the whole nine yards.
How active would the US, Japan and Korea be in checking russian cargo ships sailing from South America to Vladivostok to see if the labels match the contents? What if it's a Chinese ship?
it's all about imposing friction in the targeted economy. As long as they keep buying western en smuggling it you are imposing friction and can control it to a certain extent. The moment you push them to switch to Chinese the Chinese now control how much they want to price gouge them for.
>>63978194
true, the moment the ruble gets exposed to the market it's value will crater.
but as long as that exposure isn't to large and isn't "official" the russian central bank can keep insisting that x rubles are worth y whatever currency. As soon as the government gets wind that the plebs are aware of the true exchange rate they will try to crack down on the plebs finding out.

>>63978391
>A determined sanction buster finds a way.
My brown friend, you impose secondary sanctions and suddenly the intermediaries have to think about losing all their possible wealth just because they've done one transaction. You push that onto banks and such and suddenly the world's banking system and vendors themselves will fuck up any of those transactions.

>>63978391
>A determined sanction buster finds a way.
bruh, like literally just stop with the hypocrisy, it's obvious when sanctions are broken, it's just that nobody cares
when for decades some asiatic pidorstan bought X amount of Y product, but then suddenly wants to buy 1000X the amount of products you don't need to be clarvoyant to understand that it's actually being shipped of to russia instead
look up how thales stuff is being sold to russia via a kazakhstan intermediary, that's not even civilian stuff, that's military hardware and it obviously goes into russia, but people prefer to look the other way

>>63975442
'irrecoverable losses' term has always about KIA+MIA, its highly unlikely russia has reached that number

>>63978429
>>63978445
>just make it a crime
doesn't stop the drug trade.
what it would do is impose more friction and force the russians to be more active in their sanctions busting.
You can't just go trough one intermediary any more and you can't ask foreigners to do it for you because they don't want to.
Now you need put in a few extra paper companies in between. Launder your hydrocarbon money so you can use it to buy directly in the west and funnel it into your system.
So you buy the equipment from Thales with a front in South America. It "sells" it's goods on to a buyer in Africa. They hide the goods amongst other goods belonging to jet an other front dealing non sanctioned goods. These then get shipped to Cambodia where they get picked up by a russian ship. Russian ship sails to Vladivostok where the contraband and the legitimate goods get separated and then put on a train to western russia.
we know it works because the drug trade is moving tons of drugs every day.
Even the secondary sanctions aren't perfect.
How are you going to punish a merchant that deal exclusively in sino-russian trade? Are you going to start sanctioning china for not arresting him? what if he just moves his trade via a front company and the Chinese bust that one, "oh we got the sanctions buster my su focked the former duck farmer who owns gwailo be dumb inc. and was responsible for 90 of sanctions busting according to the Chinese authorities.
You increase friction and make it more tempting to just start buying chinese and the west need never know what's going across the sino-russian border. And if you do found out the chinks will just pretend they didn't know like they do with fentanyl.
Did asking and now trying to force China stop the fentanyl epidemic?

>>63977201
>>63977209
They should have a firing setting for slow easy targets like these where they shoot only 1-3 shots per burst with observation in between.

>>63977203
>>Ukriane runs out of money
>>the EU gives them an couple hundred billion more in loans, debt assurances and gibs
You really think we've got a plenty?
There's never enough of anything, shit gets through, people die, this is attritional war, efficiency is everything.

>>63978620
an attritional war that russia is already losing and has no chance of winning.

>>63976822
I'm afraid the West has been lying to you about no longer giving money to Russia.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdxk454kxz8o

>>63977567
Dropping dumb bombs from 8km altitude is a little bit different from guided bombs.
I don't think a 100x effect per tonnage is an exaggeration.

>>63972806 (OP)
I think you don't understand what's going on here, when at war with subhumans you will know they will do their utmost to target your population, so you will have to endure them attacking civilians, is it horrible? Yes indeed, but that becomes irrelevant when 3+- deaths per attack only ensure you keep highly motivated to kill the invader.
This was never about civilian casualties or stretching resources but killing russians, as I have pointed before they are not invincible by any margin after checking historical precedents.

>>63977661
It's crazy that people don't know this.
Look up any case in recent history of a thirdie military occupying an enemy city etc.
Count yourself lucky if the only thing they do is slaughter your sons and rape your daughters.

>>63978644
Oh, good thing, sanctions will escalate until that graph is corrected.

>>63978651
Explain. There's no evidence that Ukraine's industrial capacity has been knocked out or taken more than a minor, and very recoverable, grazing.

>>63978623
Of course there are no winners here but do you not realize just how much china and the norks produce?

>>63978674
I don't know what sort of industrial effect the Russians have managed to cause.
I don't know what fucking intelligence Russia uses that causes them to target random fucking villages outside Kherson.

Dumb bombs from 8km can hit a city, a precision drone can hit a building.

>>63972822
Horrifyingly expensive ammo, and it needs a lot of it.
>>63972856
2(two) in ukraine at the moment, not really mobile, more isn't coming any time soon, ammo is also not cheap.
Works as advertised though, which is good.
>>63972856
Sent to middle east.

>>63972856
>Ukraine decentralized it's power grid and the repair crews got pretty good in keeping everything going.
Ukraine got into informal deal with russia - "we don't touch your refineries(remember when was the last time one was hit? quite a long time ago), you don't touch our power grid".
No decentralization can counter ability to target even "end user" district transformers/substations with multiple munitions multiple times a month - but there simply was not a single attack on electrical infrastructure in months.

>>63977084
>Ukraine will not be allowed to so much as crack a window in Moscow by its allies.
May 3rd 2023, btw, and there have been other drone strikes on Moscow since (I have especially fond memories of the vid where a drone struck a skyscraper said to house one of the KGB's troll farms).

>>63978550
>219k initial invasion force
>300k mobilization
>???k DNR/LNR mobilization
>200k prisoner-slave soldiers (estimated from rapid and unusual pop. drop recorded during Wagner-period, 266k from 443k at the last count, October 2023, certainly more in sum now)
>30k-40k monthly "volunteers", remarked by Medvedev in early-2024. Presumably less-so early 2022-late 2023, but still some thousands/tens of thousands per month.

We also know the RU MoD is violently resistant to termination of contracts at their agreed upon time, so many are stuck in perpetual service til death/they go "missing".

~1 million over >3.5 years isn't unthinkable, and actually aligns quite well with the numbers and stagnation along the front.

>>63978693
Well that's the point. The Ruskies don't know which buildings are important out of the millions available.
And even if they did manage to hit an important building, the volume of explosives delivered is small enough that Ukraine can rebuild.

If they want to increase the payload of those drones then that necessarily increases the cost, reduces the speed of delivery, so much so that the drone ends up mimicking the cost of a missile. Which is what Russia has a limited inventory of and lacks the capability to produce them at the volumes required to actually knock out Ukrainian industry and keep it smouldering in rubble.

Therefore these cheap and cheerful long-range drones are the only weapon they have at volume to attempt to take out Ukraine's war economy. And there's no evidence so far that Ukraine's hurting badly from it.

I want to see this action

>>63978763
>>30k-40k monthly "volunteers"
They are mostly actual volunteers though.
Except for conscripts who are often pressured into signing contract by the end of theirs mandatory service or suspected criminals who get a persuasive offer from police to sign a contract for a case beings dropped(cops even get bonuses for that) there's a plenty of loosers who see it as an opportunity to improve theirs financial position.

>>63978644
Aren't those existing contracts that the Euro states are just letting run out?

Generalizing a bit here but it feels like people are misunderstanding how exactly the dynamics of modern warfare work. The point of interceptors of different types and EW isn't to consistently get 80%+ interceptions for the duration of a lengthy ass war. What you want is just enough interceptions so that you have the time to destroy the launch points and preferrably manufacturing plants to as large of a degree as possible. If the US / China Taiwan shenanigans happened a while from now we would be seeing the US launching shit like Tomahawks directly at depots and manufacturing facilities. The primary benefit that having a fuckton of AD provides you is that it limits the movements of enemy fighters and bombers and in the initial stages of a war as long as you can mostly negate the initial volleys that presumably will be the largest of the war the followup strikes will inevitably be smaller just due to the physical limitations of launch capacity. The war in Ukrine has skewed the expectations and understanding of people to a direction that just doesn't match with the best uses of modern technology in large part due to the fact that Russia is dogshit when it comes to waging war.

>>63977224
>they only hit Kyiv
Lviv and Odesa too you dumbass

>>63978796
I think increasing the size of the drone until 200kg payload would increase the unit price price maybe 30%
I guess they've decided that achieving the saturating effect is more inportant.

>>63978620
ofc there is no endless plenty but Europe has deep pockets and bleeding out russia is seen as desirable if not necessary by many.

>>63978836
If both countries survive the opening volleys then either it gets resolved diplomatically or it continues with attrition.
This is where it's extremely important to have a high production of munitions and a high production of AA to counter the enemy's munitions so they don't destroy your capability of producing weapons.

>>63977084
More like serf lives do not matter, instead they target production facilities, strategic assets, high ranking vatniggers, there is a reason why in the span of the last 2 years Russia has only managed to get around of 0.5 extra territory from Ukraine despite throwing everything they got short of nukes, in fact, when they tried to test it they failed and then their strategic bomber fleet got wrecked.

>>63978841
How do you work that out? Doubling the payload for only a 30% increase in cost? Maybe in a few years anon.
UAVs that can carry hundreds of kg of bombs are very expensive right now. And not cheaper than long-range missiles.

>>63978570
>doesn't stop the drug trade.
Because:
a) drug trade is low key protected by spooks;
b) is asininely profitable compared to components involved and the amounts worked on;
c) people involved don't have other markets to work on;

Thus if you say to let's say TI that they chips better not appear in russian drones and banks better not facilitate those operations to be paid for then it instantly grinds to a halt, because TI doesn't want to lose their other markets, nor do banks want to lose the other markets. These considerations aren't a thing with drug trade, because there is no other markets involved.

>>63977084
>the most cost effective solution would be striking russia back in kind as a form of deterrence but unfortunately that's not possible

At this point I think it´s only U.S that still gives a fuck if Ukraine starts terrorbombing Moscow and St. Petersburg.
There is no nation supporting Ukraine that would put up with this on themselves. Doesn´t matter who it is, everyone else would have responded in kind by smashing drones into packed football stadiums in Moscow at this point. Tit for tat, eye for an eye, what goes around comes around etc. In the end that will have to be the response, either that or Trump decides to use tomahawks to destroy the plants building the drones. It wouldn´t even be interfering with the war as such, since the drones serve no other purpose than terrorbombing civilians. They aren´t used on the frontline and they are to slow to be used on actual military sites with proper air defence.

>>63978836

manufacturing plants are underground, launch points are mobile, NOW WHAT?

>>63978985
You have the increase the motor which is probably 50% increase in motor cost
But basically all the sensors and electronics stay the same.
The frame becomes bigger but on the other hand it doesn't really change the price if you go from laminating a 5 m^2 shape to laminating a 7 m^2 shape mostly the number of parts is important.

>>63978995
what you are saying is that every gun store should be held liable when a gun they sold got used by the cartels
they should have just made sure not to sell to a straw purchaser
I mean just look at them.
trying to buy their first gun, must be a criminal.
from out of town, must be criminal.
looking to buy several guns at once, that's right a criminal.
buying a gun without ammo or to much ammo, extra criminal

gl and hf trying to enforce that

>>63976810
>they need something like 90kg warhead, 900kph cruise, high speed turbojet, air or gas generator (or rocket) catapult boost launch at over 300kph. Thirstier so more weight - maybe 500kg. Likely to need to fly lower, maybe have to terrain checking LIDAR. Probably look like a miniature Kh-101 but with a fixed blade wing.
Do you think that could be built for under $100k, assuming Russia and still getting mostly Chinese parts.

>>63976989
>can you tell us then why ukrainians have placed air defences on random cities like lutsk and fastiv?
Because your country bombs them.

>>63977195
>so long you are stupid to argue with statements you cant provide the answer for yes my son!
NTAYRT but that's atrocious grammar and frankly incomprehensible ESL.

>>63977201
>Aren't these munitions pretty fucking expensive compared to their targets, though?
No.
They're not spitwads but they're way cheaper than Gerans.

>>63977224
>the only major city they constantly hit is kiev
>second occassionally is odessa once or twice per month (per data)
Blatant zigger lies.
Odessa gets hit most nights.

>>63978613
>They should have a firing setting for slow easy targets
They do.
They're using 5-round bursts.

>>63980627
5 is too many.

>>63980529
They'll have to do something once yeeting 100 Geran gets 100 Geran shot down. The small low-hour turbojets are very simple, four compressors one turbine simple bearings rolled sheetmetal combustor. The LIDAR should eventually be a single PCB with a lump on it. $100k is a bit of an ask tbqh