Thread 64000881

https://japannews.yomiuri.co.jp/news-services/reuters/20250716-269840/
>WARTON, England, July 15 (Reuters) – The likelihood of a new country joining the British, Italian and Japanese project to develop a fighter jet is diminishing, said a BAE Systems executive, amid long-held speculation Saudi Arabia could become a fourth partner.

>“To be part of the core program today in the same way as Japan, Italy and the UK, because of the pace we’ve achieved, and where we are today becomes quite challenging now,” Herman Claesen, managing director of BAE’s Future Combat Air System business told reporters on Tuesday.

>“The likelihood is diminishing all the time.”

>The British-Italian-Japanese project, called Global Combat Air Programme, was announced in 2022 before a joint venture was formally launched in June 2025, with the aim of producing a next-generation stealth aircraft by 2035.

>Claesen said it was possible for a new partner to join, but it would be a decision for the three governments, and they would need to consider the potential delays that could come from any change to their existing agreement.

>The advantage of a new partner would be to expand the market for the aircraft, but Claesen said he was confident there would be sufficient demand.

>“There is, I guess, a bit of a queue forming of various nations who want to talk to the three governments,” he said.

What killed the hype?

KF-21 bros can't stop winning

>>64000881 (OP)
Did you even read your own post?
Sage

>>64000881 (OP)
>What killed the hype?
Europoor incompetence

>>64000881 (OP)
>What killed the hype?
Nothing, the 3 countries don't want to give up any workshare. Any 4th country wants a portion of the workshare, making it nonviable unless they're fine just being a funding source, and not an actual working partner.

>>64000971
Why you mad, nigel?

>>64000881 (OP)
shamefuru disfuray

>>64000881 (OP)
Rely on such a shithole like SA is a liability. And a morally harmful to nipponjis

>>64002725
And a situation morally

>>64000881 (OP)
Why invest in vaporware when there already 6th gens flying?

>>64000881 (OP)
>“There is, I guess, a bit of a queue forming of various nations who want to talk to the three governments,” he said.
>What killed the hype?
Nothing and your own post explains it. The hype is there, plenty of nations want to be the fourth partner but the 3 core members aren't likely to allow them, given it would risk delays and setbacks.

>>64000890
you mean the only gook that spams that 4th gen bodykit that will never be stealth?

>>64000992
>>64001200
>>64002716
>>64002737
>>64000881 (OP)
Have you and other brown third worlders even read the article OP posted? It literally says that the chances of joining are because the project is going along smoothly and allowing others to enter now would ruin that, and the bonus of expanding the potential market is not really that appealing as their current projections for market demands are already good.
>>64000890
We're talking about 6th gen fighters, not fourth gen ones.

>>64002737
What makes it 6th gen? The tailless design? Lmao. Meanwhile the GCAP testbed for the new sensors, radars and technologies that actually define the 6th generation is already flying and production for the flying demonstrator have already started. China has already shown they have none of the features that make a plane a 5th gen so why should we believe them that they have a 6th?

Why does the GCAP look like a 5th gen plane?

>>64003746
Why does it looks like it has a smaller RCS than an insect?
Gens are enough of a buzzword advertising meme without morons like you not understanding anything

>>64003746
Because it is fundamentally a large 5th gen plane.

>>64003780
Explain why it is '5th gen' but not '6th gen'

>>64003786
There are no clear defining features for 6th Gen.

Most people take 6th gen to mean 5th gen airframe + adaptive cycle engines + sensor fusion + on board compute capable of operating without datalinks back to a larger computer cluster + drone wingmen integration.

Some people also think 6th gen needs directed energy weapons, but at the moment that's still fantasy.

At the moment most "6th gen" programs are more akin to 5.5th gen and you'll likely see F-35s upgraded to allow similar capability in decades to come.

>>64003746
What if I tell you that this is not the final design but just the BAE placeholder.

>>64003833
Gens are fundamentally a LM marketing scheme
No one ever talked this way until 5th gen, and then retroactively called planes 4.5 without ever considering what a 1/2/3/4 is
As you say, there are no discernable guidelines and we know fuck all about these projects, so all the
>ackchually this is a 5/5.5/6
Obviously don't know what they're talking about, because no one does besides the people currently working on these handful of projects

>>64003833
>fantasy
Is it though?

>>64004491
Fantasy on an airborn fighter-sized platform without dedicating the entire thing to essentially just be a flying laser.


Supposedly, rolls-royce are targeting 1MW per engine in the GCAP fighter for 2MW of total power generation which COULD be used to power an airborne laser, but it would still be a significant technical undertaking to integrate a laser powerful enough to be useful against an incoming missile and still have room left for other systems on the fighter.

>>64004555
Ah my bad i thought you meant energy weapons as general as a fantasy
Won't be surprised if we see it quite "soon" in our lifetime, relatively

>>64003746
Because Europeans haven’t been innovators since 1945. It’s all just a meme that’s going to be worse than the F-47

>>64004605
Japan is European?

>>64004688
Hitler-kun said they were honorary aryans. But hitler was also a crazy methhead so he might be full of shit

>>64004696
What Hitler?
You take that back you fucking... fucking... meanie!

>>64004688
The most advanced Japanese plane is a license built F-16 do yeah, same meme shit. I would argue Japan is even worse than Europe because of Meteor and NSM.

>>64004714
The X-2 is just a licence built F16?
You a truly a fascinating specimen, do go on.

>>64000890
winning?

>>64002737
for the 400th time chinkshill, not a 6th gen, no matter how much you shill for it.

>>64003746
does it?

>>64000890
>>64003084
>>64003095
>>64004983
Saudis will buy KF-21 to replace the aging Tornado fleets regardless of its involvement in GCAP, since the earliest flying prototype will only come out only after 2035 and the earliest delivery of a production model can only happen after 2040, whereas KF-21 has already entered serial production and is scheduled to debut in the air force in 2026.
https://en.yna.co.kr/view/AEN20250626007600320
>The first batch of the KF-21 fighter jets are scheduled to be delivered to the Air Force starting in the second half of 2026, according to the release.

>>64005043
>since the earliest flying prototype will only come out only after 2035
Even if the program were a clusterfuck like the Eurofighter the IOC date would still be around the stated 2035 for the actual GCAP. The demonstrator is set to take flight in 2027.
>Saudis will buy KF-21 to replace the aging Tornado fleets
Did they actually place the order or even a MOU? And how is this relevant to a discussion about a future 6th fighter jets?
Not to mention that Tornadoes are IDS meant to do wild shit like SEAD/DEAD, while currently the KF-21 doesn't even have precision A/G capabilities or any kind of HARM/EW integration. A replacement for the Tornado would simply be buying F-15EXs

>>64005043
>since the earliest flying prototype will only come out only after 2035 and the earliest delivery of a production model can only happen after 2040
You're confusing the GCAP with the FCAS.

>>64005089
>Did they actually place the order or even a MOU?
No, but the UAE did.
https://www.airdatanews.com/uae-approaches-south-korea-over-kf-21-boramae-fighter/
And judging from their previous moves like the procurement of KM-SAM, they will likely follow suit.
>The demonstrator is set to take flight in 2027.
A tech demonstrator isn't for combat though.

>>64005089
>KF-21 doesn't even have precision A/G capabilities or any kind of HARM/EW integration
They are already developing a AARGM equivalent not to mention they already have ECM capabilities as well. Also, dropping guided bombs like KGGB from the current iteration of KF-21 is no problem as well.

>>64005089
Also, KALCM is only a few steps away from completion and it will likely be its main armament against ground/naval targets.

>>64005125
>>64005145
>>64005167
>UAE
No, they didn't sign a MOU for the purchase according to your own source. Hell, it even states they just bought Rafales.
>A tech demonstrator isn't for combat though.
Do you understand how developing an aircraft works? finalize the design as much as you can with software and simulations, then you build a demonstrator/prototype. Test it in the real world and make the necessary corrections then enter LRIP. Then once the production facilities have been fully switched to full rate you have your first batches of deliveries of the end product.
I have no idea what timeline the Saudis have for replacing the Tornadoes, but it still doesn't matter since comparing the GCAP with the KF-21 is like comparing apples to oranges. One will be a 6th gen stealth air superiority fighter, while the KF-21 will most likely not be stealth and it's more set to be a cheaper multirole alternative for countries that cannot afford monetarily or politically to buy western equipment.
If you want to sing the praises of your country first attempt at a frontline fighter jet you should pick realistic comparisons, because even with all the development in the world from how the current production kf21 are they won't really even be close to the F-35 or the F-22 so trying to compare it to the GCAP or other 6th gen programs will just bring you ridicule.
>They are already developing a AARGM equivalent
Which means they don't currently have one, same for the KALCM. What is the point of constantly going "but we might have it in the future!" ?
Dickriding your country since you're patriotic is fine, but at least keep it realistic. Who says Saudis are interested in the unproven version of armaments already available through their usual suppliers? Come back when they have actually placed an order (or you have actually developed the product)

>>64005184
You're arguing with armatard

>>64000881 (OP)
>post meant to put shade on GCAP
>look inside
>project going smoothly, main partners not interested in rocking the boat
Bait used to be believable.

>>64005198
More than bait I just think the brown/yellow third worlder who is paid to post shit like this had a pretty poor reading comprehension.

>>64005204
kek, looking at the first post and the subsequent damage control I think you hit the nail on the head.

>>64004983
Jesus Christ

>>64005184
>No, they didn't sign a MOU for the purchase according to your own source. Hell, it even states they just bought Rafales.
Anon, this happened after they concluded the Rafale deal, and would you seriously put one of your commanders on a jet that's still in a prototype stage to do a test flight for no reason?
https://defence-blog.com/south-korea-offers-uae-key-role-in-kf-21-fighter-program/
>The two sides signed a memorandum of understanding committing their air forces to regular consultations. On Wednesday, the partnership is expected to advance further as the two nations prepare to sign a letter of intent for comprehensive cooperation on South Korea’s next-generation KF-21 Boramae fighter jet.

>The KF-21, which is currently in limited production, is scheduled to enter service with the South Korean Air Force in 2026. As noted by the Air Force, the agreement will grant UAE personnel access to air drills involving the KF-21 and allow them to observe operational units managing the platform.

>Brig. Gen. Azzan Ali Abdulazeez Alsharhan Alnuaimi, head of the UAE’s Air Force Warfare Center, is expected to take part in a test flight aboard a KF-21 prototype during the signing event at Sacheon Air Base, approximately 290 kilometers south of Seoul.
Also worth noting is that when the arabs make purchases of the weapons they usually put them on an embargo which is why most of the times it's not covered by the press. The same happened when they bought a bunch of KGGB and K239 from South Korea.
>Which means they don't currently have one, same for the KALCM.
KALCM is merely a tweak from the cruise missiles they've worked on previously like Hyunmoo-3 or SSM-750K. They even use the same turbojet engine, SSE-750K. All that's left right now really is just testing.

>>64005184
>I have no idea what timeline the Saudis have for replacing the Tornadoes
They literally are planning to do it as soon as they can which is why they invited KAI to do presentations for them. >>64005043
>but it still doesn't matter since comparing the GCAP with the KF-21 is like comparing apples to oranges
Not true, since modern multirole fighters are designed to do both ground attack and interception missions

>>64005184
>One will be a 6th gen stealth air superiority fighter, while the KF-21 will most likely not be stealth and it's more set to be a cheaper multirole alternative for countries that cannot afford monetarily or politically to buy western equipment.
No one has ever said KF-21 is going to be an air superiority aircraft, South Korea already has F-35A for that role and they are already planning a new 6th gen program.

>>64005238
>Anon, this happened after they concluded the Rafale deal, and would you seriously put one of your commanders on a jet that's still in a prototype stage to do a test flight for no reason?
Hey, you said they signed a MOU for the acquisition, your own source says it's not true. We can juggle words as long as you like, but neither the UAE nor the Saudi have ordered any.
>>64005281
And? It's still not relevant to the GCAP. If they ever buy the KF-21 to replace the Tornado it would be competing with the GCAP. What's so hard to understand that the KF-21 can do nothing a 5th gen can do so it's even dumber to compare it to a 6th gen of which they literally have asked to be let into the development? My comment about the apples/oranges was meant in regards of the quality.
>>64005288
Looks like in South Korea the bar for saying "we are developing" is pretty fucking low. It's been like this since the 90s with you, 100 announcements, zero deliveries.
>>64005186
Yeah, now it's clear. Either him or a low level bot

>>64005288
>No one has ever said KF-21 is going to be an air superiority aircraft,
It's never going to be stealth or 5th gem either

>>64005288
>>64005281
>>64005238
Not the other anon, what is your argument here? You're rambling incoherently

>>64000890
The KF-21 Boramae isn't a competitor to the Gcap tho

>>64005312
>MOU
>procurement
What are you even onto? An MoU is nothing more than a piece of paper that has non-binding conditions attached. What you're looking for here is a solid contract not an agreement.
>It's still not relevant to the GCAP
GCAP won't even start flying until mid 2030s and KF-21 will enter service next year.
>If they ever buy the KF-21 to replace the Tornado it would be competing with the GCAP
Not true at all since KF-21 is literally a one on one replacement for it whereas GCAP is more aimed towards the high end market like F-47. Hack, even the base price of KF-21 is still cheaper than the Gripen.
https://bulgarianmilitary.com/2025/06/30/south-koreas-kf-21-boramae-fighter-jet-price-jumps-to-110m/
>South Korea’s KF-21 Boramae jet now costs $110M, up from $70.4M, yet undercuts F-35 and Rafale. Explore its tech, global impact, and export potential.
Also, Saudis like to diversify its source of military equipment so it's hard to think of them investing solely on a single plane.
>Looks like in South Korea the bar for saying "we are developing" is pretty fucking low. It's been like this since the 90s with you, 100 announcements, zero deliveries.
Well, they certainly are delivering more than joint european programs which ended up going nowhere in most cases.

>>64005315
>It's never going to be stealth or 5th gem either
They literally can convert it into an F-117 level RCS with IWB in the future if they're allowed to, but the time and resources it would take wouldn't worth it unless they have an outside investment which KAI is literally working on right now.

>>64005320
GCAP won't happen until 2040. It would fall into a limbo of delays like many of the europoor programs did in the past.

>>64005373
>The KF-21 Boramae isn't a competitor to the Gcap tho
Yeah, but it's the fastest in delivery time at the moment, at least in the west.

>>64005381
>GCAP won't even start flying until mid 2030s
First prototype is set to fly in 2027, stop ignoring what you don't like.
>Not true at all since KF-21 is literally a one on one replacement
Except right now it can do nothing that a tornado can? And please stop posting blurry powerpoints of "future" make a wish upgrades.
>bulgarianmilitary
Lmao, but even still, kinda fucked up a kf-21 costs more than a f-35 when it can't do anything the f-35 can.
>>64005389
>They literally can convert it into an F-117 level RCS with IWB in the future
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha. Yeah no, an IWB won't fix that mess ( >>64004983 )

>>64005394
>GCAP won't happen until 2040. It would fall into a limbo of delays like many of the europoor programs did in the past.
Got it, do you have any evidence to back your claim? Because like it was said earlier, if we apply the slower timeline of the Typhoon to the GCAP we would still see the GCAP operational by 2035. And all the actual factual evidence we have shows the GCAP going extremely smoothly.

>>64005398
Except it costs more than an F-35, has no guarantee of further capability updates and would waste resources for a future 5th gen or 6th gen procurement for a country.
The only way the KF-21 can get sales is by aggressively pushing the price down and selling it to countries that cannot buy western equipment. All of which would've never became GCAP customers in the first place.

>>64002737
Not a 6th gen you bugmutt.

>>64005415
>First prototype is set to fly in 2027
That's a tech demonstrator, literally an F-35 clone you're looking at.
>Except right now it can do nothing that a tornado can? And please stop posting blurry powerpoints of "future" make a wish upgrades.
What are you even talking about? KF-21 is literally designed as a multirole fighter from the start.
>Lmao, but even still, kinda fucked up a kf-21 costs more than a f-35 when it can't do anything the f-35 can.
>say literally cheaper than F-35
>continues to ignore it
What are you smoking?
>Yeah no, an IWB won't fix that mess
Those are just the same off-the-shelf launchers used in Eurofighter. They didn't adopt iwb to save time for the 1st and 2nd block, but there's a space in the fuselage for future upgrades into iwb.

>>64005417
>Got it, do you have any evidence to back your claim?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHIndustries_NH90

>>64005398
>fastest in delivery time
Usually when countries spend billions on jets they orefer quality. And south korea doesn't have even a single track record for building a quality fighter, meanwhile all members of the GCAP do. Any potential customer would prefer to either buy the F-35 or just wait for the GCAP.
The OP article saying that there is a queue forming of various nations that want to enter the program proves this.

>>64005434
>Except it costs more than an F-35
Why are you keep lying?
https://www.flyajetfighter.com/the-f-35-in-switzerland-what-is-the-budget-and-what-are-the-security-implications/
>On June 30, 2021, the Federal Council proposed the purchase of 36 F-35A aircraft at a cost of CHF 6,036 million (≈ €6.48 billion). This budget covers:
>The first aircraft will be manufactured in the United States (eight units from 2027 for training), 24 in Italy (Leonardo) and four assembled in Switzerland by RUAG as part of offset agreements. Annual operating costs are estimated at CHF 9.66 million per aircraft, or CHF 347 million per year for the fleet. Over 30 years, the total purchase and operating costs are estimated at CHF 15.5 billion (≈ €16.6 billion).

>The only way the KF-21 can get sales is by aggressively pushing the price down and selling it to countries that cannot buy western equipment.
Which KF-21 is literally designed to be. Thank god.
>All of which would've never became GCAP customers in the first place.
GCAP and KF-21 doesn't even have the same timeline. One is being delivered to the military next year, the other one is uncertain at this point.

>>64005441
>That's a tech demonstrator
No, the tech demonstrator is this one ( >>64003113 )
>literally an f-35 clone
Except the different wing profile, lack of HS, larger nose cone and yadda yadda.
>What are you even talking about? KF-21 is literally designed as a multirole fighter from the start.
Can the KF-21 now do anything the tornado can? No. Your promises of the far future are just that.
>What are you smoking?
Listen, we already had this discussion in the other thread where you cherrypicked the price of the swiss f-35 procurement to say the kf21 was cheaper, while ignorimg the average price for all other contracts was around 80M, stop embarassing yourself every time.
>launchers
Once again, an IWB won't fix that mess, jesus, look at the Y-22 prototype and compare it to the kf-21. There are so many design choices that increase RCS that the KF-21 will NEVER be a stealth fighter. You can keep crying about it all you want but it won't change reality.

>>64005469
>switzerland
HAHAHAHAHAHA I fucking knew it lmao. Now check the finnish deal you slimy weasel.

>>64005466
>Usually when countries spend billions on jets they offer quality.
Kek, no.
>And south korea doesn't have even a single track record for building a quality fighter, meanwhile all members of the GCAP do.
South Korea has already built FA-50 which itself is a fighter jet on its own and KF-21 has flown for 1300 hours so far which is 70% of the 2000 hour requirement.
https://defence-blog.com/south-koreas-next-gen-jet-marks-progress-in-testing/
>KAI confirmed that the program has already logged more than 1,300 sorties—roughly 70% of Block 1’s planned flight tests. Recent milestones include successful air-to-air missile firings of the Meteor and AIM-2000, even under supersonic conditions and external fuel tank configurations.

>>64005469
>the other one is uncertain at this point
Damn, I really made you angry huh? You're literally ignoring the evidence you yourself posted in the OP.

>>64005490
>https://biz.chosun.com/en/en-industry/2025/06/20/ZTSKECEHZ5DQRFUADTGODGWNHQ/
>FA-50
The same that the poles bought to replace the su-22 but are stuck doing nothing since you haven't integrated a single A/A and A/G armament? Or the 37 FA-50PL block 20 that were supposed to be delivered years ago but are stuck in development hell due to lack of integration of AESA radar etc? Looks like korean deliveries are an hoax as well.

>>64005485
>>64005466
I told you you're arguing with gook armatard. He's a broken record. No matter how many times he gets BTFO he comes back.

>>64005479
>No, the tech demonstrator is this one ( >>64003113 )
https://www.twz.com/air/this-is-how-the-uks-new-stealth-fighter-demonstrator-will-look
>first rendering has been released showing the new fighter demonstrator being built in the United Kingdom as part of the Tempest next-generation air combat program. The crewed flight test vehicle bears a notable resemblance to the Lockheed Martin F-35, apart from its lack of horizontal stabilizers and a number of smaller differences. Planned to take to the air in 2027, the Combat Air Flying Demonstrator will feed into the design of the Tempest, which is being developed as a stealthy fighter for the U.K.’s Royal Air Force, as well as for Italy and Japan, and is expected to be in service by 2035.
It's all so tiresome...
>Except the different wing profile, lack of HS, larger nose cone and yadda yadda.
Like any of that really matter. The one criterion here is whether it can replace its missions, and yes it can.
>Can the KF-21 now do anything the tornado can? No. Your promises of the far future are just that.
Can Tornadoes shoot Meteor?
>Listen, we already had this discussion in the other thread where you cherrypicked the price of the swiss f-35 procurement to say the kf21 was cheaper
Anon, this is the latest price tag for the F-35. Do you remember how cheaper things used to be before the pandemic? Now this is the norm.
>Once again, an IWB won't fix that mess
It's not just about IWB, they'll be replacing all sorts of protuberance on the surface including the IRST.

>>64005506
>The same that the poles bought to replace the su-22 but are stuck doing nothing since you haven't integrated a single A/A and A/G armament?
FA-50PL is what you're talking about. All of FA-50GF that had been ordered previously were delivered on time. And the main reason behind the delay was due to Raytheon failing to deliver the radar on time.

>>64005524
>It's all so tiresome...
Yeah what is tiresome is your lack of knowledge of aviation.
>Like any of that really matter
It's all so tiresome...
>Can Tornadoes shoot Meteor?
Can the KF-21 do SEAD? No.
>inb4 you post another blurry pic of a powerpoint that totally shows it will be able to in 20 quintillion years *if you get any customers*
>Anon, this is the latest price tag for the F-35
No, it's the price tag of a cherry picked contract where the MOD of Switzerland had to apologize for the shitty deal. The average price per unit for current orders is around 110M

>>64005537
No, the FA-50GF are the ones without the armaments stuck doing nothing, the FA-50PL aren't even in existance since none have been delivered.

>>64005524
Leaving aside the price, why would anyone who can choose between the F35 and the KF-21 ever choose the KF-21? You have proved you can't deliver on time, you have proved your products AREN'T proven and the capabilities between the 2 are like comparing a F1 car with a bycicle.

>>64005524
>The one criterion here is whether it can replace its missions, and yes it can.
I mean, it would be pretty embarassing if you were to copy the general design of an previous aircraft and then not be able to do anything the predecessor could.kinda like the KF-21 which tried to copy the F-22 design without realizing that it's not enough.

>>64005441
The tornado is not a multirole, it's a pure striker interceptor with EW package, so comparing it to a multirole doesn't make sense.

>>64002737
Chinks actually think that's 6th gen?

>>64005524
>they'll be replacing all sorts of protuberance on the surface including the IRST.
Weird, you just said you'll get an IWB only if you're allowed to. Lol. I bet 10 years from now you'll still be shilling about an upcoming iwb.

>>64005448
What has an unrelated helicopter anything to do with the GCAP? Do you have any evidence OF THE GCAP program being delayed?

>>64005448
And by the way, that looks like an extremely successful helicopter. Just look at that list of operators, longer than any operators list of any korean military product.

>>64005448
I accept your concession

>>64002764
>The hype is there, plenty of nations want to be the fourth partner but the 3 core members aren't likely to allow them, given it would risk delays and setbacks
Basically this. The 3 core members don't really need the money from a new member, especially since things have been going so smoothly. Saudi Arabia can beg all they want but it's too late to join now. Especially if they want any geo returns.

>>64005680
They could use the money, they're just not willing to give up workshare in exchange for cash.

>>64005718
To me it feels like that a bunch of nations were just waiting to see which between GCAP and FCAS would come first and jump on their wagon. But they got the short end of the srick when FCAS got stuck in limbo and GCAP went so smoothly that they prefer not letting anyone in unless they can actually contribute to the project.

>>64005761
Pretty much, now they have to weigh between waiting on FCAS, being a GCAP customer, or holding out hope the US will sell them something comparable.

In most cases assuming GCAP doesn't hit any major stumbling blocks in development will likely see several countries interested in becoming customers.

>>64005789
It would be funny if Japan decides to go back on their loosening of export rules and cockblocks sales. IiRC at first they were super against Saudi Arabia even being an export customer. (Especially since they now want 50% geo return on all investments)

>>64005801
Currently at least japan's laws block export to any country actively involved in conflict.

>>64005575
>No, the FA-50GF are the ones without the armaments stuck doing nothing
Actually the Poles finally caved and were forced to buy new-old stock 1980s AIM-9Ls even though they operate AIM-9X just to give their FA-50s literally any kind of weapon because the gooks were massive kikes. They refuse to integrate either AIM-9X or AIM-120 unless someone else pays for the integration, so the entire Block 20 program is currently dead in the water because gooks refuse to pay to upgrade their own planes. It's pretty funny how quickly gooks went from touting Poland as this major export success between that and K2PL domestic production being dead in the water. The only time it's still brought up is when Korea delivers a handful of K2s or K9s that were initially slated for ROKMC service, but swiped away to meet delivery requirements. Meanwhile the ROKMC is still operating M48s.

Obvious chink falseflag is obvious.
/thread

Just because it’s a petrostate does that mean oil prices are obligated to give money to every scam operation on the planet just to say that they do? I’m sure they wanted to know in concrete terms what they will be getting out of an investment into the program. Since the program is just a pretend-defense fund to allow governments to do “defense spending” without seriously spending on defense, there’s no reason for the Saudis to give money away to it as they don’t have a requirement to pretend to to defense spending. If the Saudis put in enough to turn it into a real program, then it should be their fucking jet which they control. But even if they wanted to do that the governments which control the actual technology and engineering talent to realize such a jet probably won’t let that happen anyway, so what, exactly, does Saudi get out of it?

>>64007128
LMAO. Well the poles kinda deserve that for not buying european.

>>64005469
>Which KF-21 is literally designed to be. Thank god.
Not really considering it uses american F414 engines. The KF-21 is chockfull of ITAR components, the moment you try to sell it to someone the US doens't like they'll immediately block the sale like they have already did with the Gripen.

>>64004724
>F-15 with a body kit that went nowhere
Crazy

>>64005186
Armatard uses an iPhone. This guy is a Korean American incel who also spams on /int/

>>64007397
>F-15 with a body kit
Objectively wrong
>went nowhere
Objectively wrong, you're in a thread about where it has gone
Why do they make you seethe so much? Are you a chink? A shitskin? A snowcoon perhaps? Or all of the above (French)?

>>64007285
Who did they block the Gripen from? The only recent block I can remember was Argentina and that was entirely due to BAE and Britain telling them to fuck off, hence they went crying to China.

>>64005490
>FA-50
>fighter that can't even integrate modern munitions
>even the FA-50PL is years behind and can't integrate modern munitions despite being a requirement
>Poland had to buy outdated munitions just to arm their useless Korean garbage
Serves Poland right to be fair. They could have just acquired Gripen D/Es and been happy since they have access already to modern AIM-9/120s but they went with the poor mans option and got stung. They should have just kept their rusty ass Su-22s.

>>64007471
literally all other options would've been better. They could've expanded the F-16 fleet, bought gripens, bought typhoons like they originally wanted to, buy the armed variant of the MB346.
They went with the FAil-50 because they were promised deals on the gook tanks than never came since they had to revise the deal and an establishment of a MRO hub for "future european custormers" of the FA-50. I really wonder who in their right mind would want to hop on the gook carousel seeing as they can't deliver on time nor deliver what was promised.

>>64007497
They couldnt expand the F-16 fleet because there was no extra production to get short term deliveries. It was the first option they wanted but it didn't work out.
Same as Eurofighter.
I assume they didn't go with Gripens because Gripens were priced around $100 million per unit.
I didn't see how much they paid for FA50s but it was claimed they were the main choice because the Worst Koreans could churn them out faster than anyone else could but the joke is that they only got 10 of the ones that can't use any existing normal munitions the Poles had, hence the purchase of 80s AIM-9Ls, and have yet to recieve the FA50PLs at all which are the ones that supposedly can use AIM-9X.
May as well just opted for JF-17s at this point since at least they'd have saved money.

>>64007576
>JF-17s
Lol, I wouldn't put it past the poles.

>>64007605
Thats why I said it. Anything is better than a fucking light attack jet thats primarily a fucking trainer. May as well bought a bunch of BAE Hawk 200s. At least they'd fire AIM-9Ls too.

>>64007617
>BAE Hawk 200s
Not with those engine and airframe issues

>>64007617
>Anything is better than a fucking light attack jet thats primarily a fucking trainer
Light attack aircrafts are ok with the role poland needed to fill, and especially now that countries are seeking to make cheaper drone hunter platforms (laser guided LAU32 for example is great against drones)
The problem is that they bought something that existed only in paper without assessing the credibility of KAI, which has none.

>>64007677
Hey, at least they serve as a good lesson to anyone else contemplating Korean arms.

>>64000881 (OP)
Can't those countries just join as students? Pay money to the project, get no geo return, but you're allowed to send your scientists and engineers to learn

>>64007736
May as well hand over the tech to China in advance if you are doing that.

>>64007750
why? the why would they even be interested in letting a third party join? I tought the point of allowing more countries to join was to increase sales, get money and the country that joined got a discount on the jet, local jobs and technological knowhow

>>64007471
>They could have just acquired Gripen D/Es and been happy since they have access already to modern AIM-9/120s but they went with the poor mans option and got stung.
Gripen C/D are discontinued and only available in mechanical radars and the remaining surplus werr already being given away to Ukraine. Gripen E/F are not even integrated with AMRAAM while literally costs as much as a new F-35.

>>64003113
>>64004987
>>64005439
>>64005615
Post US 6th gen. PPT slides don't count btw

>>64007806
We already know the US was flying 6th gen tech demonstrators in 2019/20.

>>64007806
After China shows a single piece of evidence about their doritos being 6th gen. If a tailless design is enough to claim "6th gen" then the germans had them since ww2 with the Horten.
China doesn't have any R&D industries, they can only copy, so if we want to give china the benefit of the doubt, their 6th gen will at most be close to the F-35 in terms of technology (not surprising since Israel got full access to the F-35 source code)

>>64007128
>Poles finally caved and were forced to buy new-old stock 1980s AIM-9Ls even though they operate AIM-9X just to give their FA-50s literally any kind of weapon because the gooks were massive kikes
This isn't even a defense contract you're talking about here. It's a bilateral pact that allowing both countries to transfer their sidewinders in case any side gets into a war.
>They refuse to integrate either AIM-9X or AIM-120 unless someone else pays for the integration, so the entire Block 20 program is currently dead in the water because gooks refuse to pay to upgrade their own planes.
Huh? Last time I checked they're literally flying FA-50PL equipped with Phantomstrike radar.
https://milmag.pl/en/the-first-fa-50pl-will-be-ready-in-2025/
>>According toinformation provided toMILMAG, it has already completed nearly all the required tests as scheduled. The integration of the new AESA radar requires slightly more work, with flight tests planned for 2025. The final step will be integrating the radar with the approved weaponry.This text comes from MILMAG Military Magazine.

>The only time it's still brought up is when Korea delivers a handful of K2s or K9s that were initially slated for ROKMC service, but swiped away to meet delivery requirements. Meanwhile the ROKMC is still operating M48s.
Okay, you're the schizo kraut from the K2PL thread who were conjuring up a conspiracy theory that the fast delivery of K2 was only possible because Rotem was secretly producing unauthorize numbers of K2 in advance. Now it all makes sense now, kek.

>>64007260
>>64007643
>>64007677
You're literally talking to a kraut armatard who's obsessed with the poles living rent free in his head.
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/63932454/#q63940112

>>64007834
>Huh? Last time I checked they're literally flying FA-50PL equipped with Phantomstrike radar.
>shows the same image of FA-50 stuck in production. Can you show me a single FA-50 in Poland that can use AIM-9Xs or that has a AESA radar? You can't, and by the look of things you won't be able to for a long while.

>>64007847
>Huh? Last time I checked they're literally flying FA-50PL equipped with Phantomstrike radar.
>shows the same image of FA-50 stuck in production.
Can you show me a single FA-50 in Poland that can use AIM-9Xs or that has a AESA radar? You can't, and by the look of things you won't be able to for a long while.

>>64007847
>pole obsessed kraut posting facts
vs
>gook armatard that can't even read his own sources

FIGHT ON!

>>64007856
>Can you show me a single FA-50 in Poland that can use AIM-9Xs or that has a AESA radar?
The integration of missiles you mentioned is under discussion with the US right now. I don't know why you're blaming the delays on the US right now since this wasn't even part of the deal in the first place.
https://defence24.pl/przemysl/polsko-amerykanskie-rozmowy-o-uzbrojeniu-do-fa-50-bedzie-produkcja
>Deputy Minister of National Defense Paweł Bejda met with the CEO of RTX (formerly Raytheon) to discuss strategic directions of cooperation. The main goal of the talks was to increase the involvement of Polish industry in the production of key armaments components and the development of modern defense technologies.

>According to the ministry's official website , discussions focused on implementing the production of cable harnesses for the Patriot system in Poland, as well as increasing the participation of Polish industry in the production of Patriot launchers for customers in other countries. The discussions also included expanding cooperation in the development of air defense radars and research and development in the field of radiolocation.

>Another important point of the meeting was the acceleration of missile deliveries for the Polish Air Force's FA-50 aircraft, with the prospect of locating their production in Poland. The integration of FA-50 aircraft with American weapons systems was also discussed. Finally, the parties discussed cooperation in counter-drone solutions.

>This meeting is another in a series of others aimed at encouraging large players in the arms market to invest in our country, which will allow the development of the domestic defense industry and strengthen our security.

>The FA-50PL aircraft will be armed with RTX-made AIM-9X Sidewinder missiles, short-range air-to-air missiles already used on the F-16 and F-35. The FA-50PL program also includes a feasibility study for integrating the medium-range AMRAAM missile.

>>64007859
Your schizo theory has long been debunked, krautard.

>>64007865
>The integration of missiles you mentioned is under discussion with the US right now.
So you can't. Thanks for the clarification and for proving once again that worst korea can neither deliver on time nor deliver what was promised.
>https://youtu.be/r3Nqh896s_Q

>>64007128
>So you can't.
? The US has already approved AMRAAM integration since the beginning of the war.

>>64007865
>https://defence24.pl/przemysl/polsko-amerykanskie-rozmowy-o-uzbrojeniu-do-fa-50-bedzie-produkcja
lmao

>>64007885
>literally points out the one poster who constantly spams pro-kraut narratives all the time out of all comments
>pretends as if he understands polish
Like clockwork.

>>64007896
neither can you apparently

>>64007910
>I'll just keep pretending this random comment is a truth
Have you had enough of larping, Davien?

>>64007460
Colombia, less than 4 months ago. They then offered them to buy F16s instead...

>>64007916
I'm just posting the toughts of your own customers from the article you posted, Kimchi Lee.

>>64007916
>Davien
Davien isn't a German name tho? It's an american name.

>>64007453
>theyre wrong because I said so
You’re brown like all weebs

>>64008239
>theyre wrong because I said so
That's literally your argument

>>64008296
Ok so how is the X-2 doing then? Why doesn’t Japan make indigenous planes? Their most modern and actually flying plane is the F-2, a license built F-16

>>64008239
Why are you quoting your own argument you dumb nigger, the X-2 is caragoricallt not an F-15

>>64008319
>How is thr X-2 doing
Amazingly since the work on it is being used to develop one of the 3 only functional next gen jet programs currently, and the only one outside the US
You are one asshurt little faggot, lmao

>>64007453
He's probably a chink or a gook. Those are usually the ones with an autistic hatred for the japs. They've never been able to get over getting absolutely raped by the japs during WW2, it's some kind of inferiority complex I think.

>>64008319
They joined the GCAP program you stupid bug negroid.

>>64008357
This whole thread was probably a mongoloid that couldn't read the article he posted
Gook and chink spammers are the worst and I suppose they probably false flag as one another

>>64008319
>Ok so how is the X-2 doing then?
It's become the base of the GCAP you absolute buffoon. Still salty Japan civilized your country in WW2?
>Why doesn’t Japan make indigenous planes?
What do you think is the X-2? They made a full on 5th gen fighter jet, then concluded that it would be more economical and it would end up as a better product if they teamed up with other likeminded nations to build an actual 6th gen fighter, unlike anything that's being produced by the rest of asia.

>>64008377
yeah, it's the usual kf-21/fa-50 spammer. You can sometimes find him spamming /int/, furiously lashing out at asian women for marrying white men.

>>64008355
>caragoricallt
>an F-15
POV: the whitest weeb

I’m sorry I’ve hurt your feelings brownoid but the X-2 is literally just a F-15 with a bodykit. It’s not even a 5th gen so how is it used for GCAP.
>the 3 only functional next gen jet programs currently, and the only one outside the US
Which are the other ones? GCAP is British, F-47 American and otherwise only the Chinese have have their J-36/50 or w/e they’re called.
>You are one asshurt little faggot, lmao
>lmao
That’s definitely the vibe that’s going on here
>>64008372
Ok so the X-2 didn’t go nowhere after a decade and now they’ve joined GCAP, contributing nothing since it’s UK lead (and the UK actually makes jet engines and indigenous planes)
>>64008382
>It's become the base of the GCAP you absolute buffoon.
I doubt a F-15 with bodykit is the base for the GCAP. Iirc they even use the EJ200 for the prototype's propulsion, meanwhile Japan doesn’t even have a Meteor analogue.
>What do you think is the X-2? They made a full on 5th gen fighter jet, then concluded that it would be more economical and it would end up as a better product if they teamed up with other likeminded nations to build an actual 6th gen fighter, unlike anything that's being produced by the rest of asia.
Ok so it’s totally a 5th gen without IWB, radar absorbent material, geometrics and electronics and Japan just went with the F-35 because they just did (despite according to weebs the X-2 being better than the F-22 geg)

>>64008430
Go back to /int/ and complain about WMAF relationships some more you seething chinkoid loser lmao

>>64008430
Even AI knows you're full of shit.

I fed the thread into an LLM and your posts constantly get flagged as deliberately misleading/false

>>64008430
>I doubt a F-15 with bodykit is the base for the GCAP
You'd be right since the base of the GCAP is the X-2. (technically the F-X)
>ej200
lolno, it used XF5s.

>Ok so it’s totally a 5th gen without IWB, radar absorbent material, geometrics
Weird considering the "geometrics" as you call them, the fit and finish etc are literally better for stealth in the X-2 prototype than the current KF-22.

>RAM
Do you even know that Japan literally developed RAM for the US?
>https://web.archive.org/web/20100720015305/justice.gov/osg/briefs/2006/0responses/2006-1155.resp.html
>https://web.archive.org/web/20181231031813/uscfc.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/opinions/DAMICH.Zoltek.pdf

>>64008430
Since every time you have a meltdown it goes like this, before running away, can you post a single piece of evidence to your claims?
>>64008691
>filename
LMAO

>>64008461
You realize japs are Asian too?
>>64008510
I’m not enthusiastic and never mentioned Korea tho. Just don’t like browns aka weebs. Also interesting that calling someone brown is racist.
>>64008691
GCAP is British designed, no Japanese input. In fact GCAP was already laid out before Japan joined
>XF5
Never produced vapor ware vs the best engine in its class (and Rolls Royce actually being a leading edge engine producer on par with America's best)

The X-2 simply isn’t a stealth aircraft, notice how it doesn’t look similar to the F-22 or F-22 but more like a F-15 with a bodykit? The KF-21 is also just a F-15/18 with a body kit. Asians can’t innovate
>ram coating developed by Japan
Sure, then why doesn’t any Japanese aircraft use it while the B-2, B-21, F-22, F-35 etc do?
>>64008714
What meltdown? What evidence do you want me to post, the fact that Japan hasn’t made an indigenous airplane since WW2 and the X-2 looking suspiciously like a redesigned F-15? It fits the bill since the only planes Japan builds are license F-15 and F-16. Korea is the same but they actually got assistance from Lockheed to make their F-16 trainer and KF-21. the Taiwanese did the same with the F-CK-1 F-16/18 mashup.

>>64008848
>I’m not enthusiastic and never mentioned Korea tho. Just don’t like browns aka weebs. Also interesting that calling someone brown is racist.
No, it's including your other posts in the thread as well not just THAT post, I also fed it this image and told it that it was you >>64008395

And pic related is what the AI said after feeding it your latest post

>>64008848
>GCAP is British designed, no Japanese input. In fact GCAP was already laid out before Japan joined
You tried larping as a bong already in a past thread where you used the same talking points and got BTFO.
>https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/63026450/#q63037045
>Never produced vapor ware
It's literally the engine the X-2 flew on you 조센징.
>The X-2 simply isn’t a stealth aircraft, notice how it doesn’t look similar to the F-22 or F-22 but more like a F-15 with a bodykit?
It doesn't? Your rage and jealously against your betters (japanese) is blinding you my dear squid game.
>Sure, then why doesn’t any Japanese aircraft use it
Because there in no point in using it on a non stealth aircraft? RAM isn't magic, and RCS tests are conducted at first without RAM to properly evaluate the design choices of the aircraft.

You're the same gook that made this thread, tried to shill on your failed products, got shit on, and now you're having a meltdown trying to seed discord trying to claim to be british.

>>64008848
Also, why are you literally ignoring the factual evidence posted by the US CONGRESS that Japan developed RAM?
>https://web.archive.org/web/20100720015305/justice.gov/osg/briefs/2006/0responses/2006-1155.resp.html
>https://web.archive.org/web/20181231031813/uscfc.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/opinions/DAMICH.Zoltek.pdf

>>64008873
>>64008848
After showing it some of your posts in the archive over the last several years using the same talking points and disinformation, the AI thinks you're a clear propagandist/shill.

>>64008848
>he KF-21 simply isn’t a stealth aircraft
FTFY

>>64008848
>XF5
>Never produced vapor ware
Huh? Do you gook shills even research stuff?

>>64008893
Ask the AI why he's now larping as a bong

>>64008848
>The X-2 simply isn’t a stealth aircraft
Why does it employ stealth design choices, S duct inlets (that the gooks can't produce) and radar blockers for the engine you claim doesn't exist?

>poopy going all out
You will never be Japanese, you will never be white. You’re brown.

>>64008935
The last time you made this claim and I posted my white arm + passport you then just left the thread and let it die despite the fact you had been bumping that thread for like 2 days at that point.

>>64008946
Nigga we literally we what you look like when you posted yourself on discord lol. You’re a brown ogre who plays War Thunder

>>64008963
I don't use discord...

You're just making shit up again because you know you're getting BTFO in this thread.

>>64008935
>you will never be white
>says the gook
Lol. Hey since you don't want to back ANY of your claims and we're on /k/ how about you prove you have a gun? This should be the bare minimum

>>64008997
non american date format

>>64007834
>Huh? Last time I checked they're literally flying FA-50PL equipped with Phantomstrike radar.
Nope

>>64008988
Lil bro you really want me to ask /wtg/ to come here? Also btw Korea is more popular among everyone under 30. I’m not the biggest fan of Asians and even I know parasite.
>>64008997
>.22
>DDMM
Not even trying to hide it anymore.

>>64009011
>Lil bro
I'm almost 40 kid

>>64009025
Grim. How many children do you have?

>>64009011
>22lr
Why aren't you posting a gun you own, 조센징?

>>64009037
They can't own guns in the japanese colony of Worst Korea. If they could they would all immediately kill themselves due to how shit their society is.

Isn't there literally some volunteer internet defense force in Korea sponsored by a hyperracist ROK general to poopoo anything non-Korean?
Like I'm fairly certain I remember reading about them spamming some newspaper or map company with thousands of hate messages a day about calling the Sea of Japan the East Sea.

Looks like he ran away like koreans always do.

>>64009074
Once he starts getting called out by multiple people who actually refute him with proof he quickly falls apart and leaves.

If you're lucky he'll be back when it's on page 8 or 9 and he'll post some shill images and random disinformation while saging the thread and hope no one notices so it looks like HE was actually the last word in the thread and EVERYONE ELSE stopped replying.

>>64009053
Are you calling OP a VANKer?

>>64009117
AI seems to think there are similarities, if nothing else

>>64008430
The US has two projects you dumb fucking cunt, and yes the bong multinational project includes Italy and Japan, who are bringing their experience from the x-2
Which btw is objectively not an F-15
I'm sorry those buck tooth rice munching monkeys raped your inferior yellow buck tooth rice munching monkey ancestors, but you have to let it go
You make yourself seem even more pathetic than you are, and you're already incredibly pathetic

>>64009011
How much of a noguns do you have to mistake that for a 22?

>>64005398
>Yeah, but it's the fastest in delivery time at the moment, at least in the west.
No? They havent even started full production yet. It's just a prototype that South Korea keeps shilling but has no customers, no actual serial production is taking place in SK and it was rushed through development just to show they had something flying so that the arguments of the project price kept ballooning would be mitigated. KAI is having multiple delays in delivering a trainer like we have seen so I can't imagine what will happen when the actual production of the KF-21 will start.
The sheer number of cop outs taken during development that have put the stealth "capabilities" of the KF-21 in a dead end like we see here >>64004983 and will never be realistically fixed. SK doesn't have the capabilities to indipendently produce the RAM necessary to reduce its already huge RCS and I have watched all the available footage on the KF-21 flying, and not in a single picture you can spot a Lunenberg reflector. I hope I don't need to explain to you what this means regarding its RCS.

>>64011436
At this rate KF-21 might reach 5th gen status in the late 2030s or 2040s.

>>64011537
No, it won't ever reach 5th gen for the simple reasons that in order to reach it they would need to remake it from the ground up, too many things are just wrong with it. And seeing how they haven't been able to even integrate basic stuff on their trainers since they don't want to tackle the integration costs I doubt they'll have a different approach with the KF-21. I'm sure the kor shill will reply with some blurry powerpoint pictures, but at the end of the day their own jets speak for themselves.

>>64011558
It has a clear path to IWB integration with Block III in the early 2030s, give them another decade or so for RAM.

It still won't compete with F-22/F-35 fee other purpose built 5th gens, but it would likely be far stealthier than a true 4.5th Gen like an F-15EX/F-16V.

>>64011570
>fee
Or the

>>64011570
>It has a clear path to IWB integration with Block III in the early 2030s
Nope, just like the gookshill already said it's only going to be tackled if a customer requests for it. Not to mention that the KF-21 issues of stealth, like we have already seen and talked, are much more in dept than a IWB. An IWB doesn't make your jet stealth by default, it's just the minimum requirement.
>give them another decade or so for RAM.
RAM isn't something you develop on the spot, they have done zero research on it and from their own propaganda they have zero plans to use it, let alone actually develop it.
>but it would likely be far stealthier than a true 4.5th Gen like an F-15EX/F-16V.
I would be surprised if it's even remotely stealthier than a 4th gen. Look at the SU-57, its design choices are technically better for stealth yet it's calculated RCS is still comparable to a clean superhornet.

>>64000881 (OP)
Did you even read your own article?

>>64011436
>No? They havent even started full production yet.
Anon, I have a bad news...

>>64012229
>mass production
>of a block 1
To me it looks like they are just scrambling to build the barebone versions ordered by the ROK air force to keep KAI afloat.
If they really decided to mass produce the current 6 prototypes they have shown this jet is dead on arrival and won't be exported anywhere.

>>64012391
>To me it looks like they are just scrambling to build the barebone versions ordered by the ROK air force to keep KAI afloat.
Anon...
https://www.defensemirror.com/news/39760/Hanwha__Korea_Aerospace_Sign__1_65B_in_KF_21_Contracts_for_Engines__20_New_Jets
>South Korea has approved a major step in its KF‑21 Boramae fighter jet program with fresh contracts worth a combined 2.22 trillion won (nearly $1.65 billion) awarded to Hanwha Aerospace and Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) by the Defense Acquisition Program Administration (DAPA).Hanwha Aerospace signed a follow-up deal worth 623.2 billion won ($459 million) to supply over 80 F414 engines for the first mass production batch of KF‑21 fighters. This follows a previous contract worth 556.2 billion won ($410 million) signed last year, bringing the total value of the engine deal to 1.1794 trillion won ($860 million). Deliveries will continue through December 2028.The agreement includes full logistics support, including spare parts, maintenance manuals, and on-site technical services. The F414 engines are built using heat-resistant, lightweight materials designed to perform in extreme combat environments.In support of the engine program, Hanwha recently completed a 16,529-square-meter smart factory, funded by a 40 billion won ($29 million) investment, to produce F414 engines and develop future propulsion technologies.Korea Aerospace Industries (KAI) also signed a new contract with DAPA valued at 2.39 trillion won ($1.76 billion) to deliver an additional 20 KF‑21 jets. This builds on a previous 1.96 trillion won ($1.44 billion) agreement signed in June 2024 for the first batch of 20 aircraft, completing the 40-jet order.

>>64012461
Yes, they're building 40 Block 1 jets that don't have true multi-role capability, they're saving that for Block 2 which is going to be ~2029-2033 if you're lucky.

No one wants an air to air only platform that costs more than most other multi-role 4th gens.

>>64012476
>don't have true multi-role capability
That depends on what kind of ability you prioritize. The first block will still be able to launch AIM-2000 and Meteor, and that alone is still a strong multiplier. Also, it will be able drop guided weapons like KGGB or JDAM. The upgrade in block 2 is merely a software update that allows you to do ECM using the MFR like Captor-E, so there's not much a change in hardware. And by the time the delivery of the 1st block is finished, block 2 would already be ready.

>>64012476
Also, reminder that development of block 2 will happen between 2026 and 2028, not 2029.

>>64012461
So you literally reaffirm my talking point. Thanks. Now can you please reply to >>64008997 ?
Yesterday you ran away with your short tail between your legs.
>The first block will still be able to launch AIM-2000 and Meteor, and that alone is still a strong multiplier
no, it's literally the bare minimum
>Also, it will be able drop guided weapons like KGGB or JDAM
not the version you're currently building.
>And by the time the delivery of the 1st block is finished, block 2 would already be ready
So why would anyone want to buy the block 1? It just goes to prove they've been bought by worst korea to throw them a lifeline.
Other similar project by the time they were into LRIP/IOC had already multiple customers. Meanwhile even your own partner, Indonesia is rethinking their financial involvement.

>>64012547
Yes, which means it'll actually enter service between 2029-2033.

>>64009074
I've seen that guy get absolutely humiliated multiple times now and yet he keeps coming back. Maybe the gook has a humiliation fetish, it's probably ingrained from all the raping and subjugation the japs did to them.

>>64012629
he now created another thread shitting on the thyphoon

>Yesterday you ran away with your short tail between your legs.
Not the same anon though.
>no, it's literally the bare minimum
How is being able to launch one of the most powerful BVRAAM in the world is a bare minimum? BVR capability is all about modern air combat. Dogfight is a relic of a bygone era as proved in indian-paki war.
>not the version you're currently building.
? You can literally drop kggb from F-4 or F-5 because it uses a separate PDA from the computer used in jets.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-DFYKeucR4
>So why would anyone want to buy the block 1? It just goes to prove they've been bought by worst korea to throw them a lifeline.
>let's just ignore both F-16 and Rafale has a huge backlog while KF-21 has a superior RCS due to it's S-duct design
It's not an F-35 replacement that you think of but it clearly isn't a slop that you think of.
>Meanwhile even your own partner, Indonesia is rethinking their financial involvement
Indonesia was caught trying to steal its technology, so it's de facto out of the contributor status. Buy anyways it resumed paying for the program again after a few negotiations.
https://biz.chosun.com/en/en-industry/2025/07/04/KVKX2CEIIFDKTN2DFFEG5XSWGY/
>>64012591
>Yes, which means it'll actually enter service between 2029-2033.
Why would you take that long for a mere software update?

>>64012665
>Why would you take that long for a mere software update?
You're under the false delusion that it's a software only upgrade. It's already been confirmed to be a hardware and software upgrade, so no you can't just flash the Block 1's with a software update and turn them into Block 2's.

>>64012676
>You're under the false delusion that it's a software only upgrade.
It quite literally is though.
>It's already been confirmed to be a hardware and software upgrade
Huh? Care to share the source you're citing? Or are you just coping about the fact that block 1 isn't really that different from block 2 other than additional armament that comes along.

>>64012665
>Not the same anon though.
Oh yeah I'm sure. Was he another one of your VANK coworkers?
>How is being able to launch one of the most powerful BVRAAM in the world is a bare minimum? BVR capability is all about modern air combat. Dogfight is a relic of a bygone era as proved in indian-paki war.
nice to see you keep up the same exact disinfo tactics. Nobody talked about BFM, the argument is that the current KF-21 in production has only some A/A capabilities, which is literally the reason nobody has ordered any even this late in the program.
>let's just ignore both F-16 and Rafale has a huge backlog while KF-21 has a superior RCS due to it's S-duct design
Anon, do you know the meaning of the words you're using? You literally just admitted my point.
I hate AI with passion, but the images posted by that anon earlier about you are pretty spot on.
You can only post out of context articles that either prove nothing or go against your own talking points, when you're made aware of that you move the goalpost or simply ignore it and try to gaslight us with more baseless claims. I don't know how you are taught in south korea, but in the rest of the world people aren't so easily fooled by such a low effort shilling.

>>64012729
>Oh yeah I'm sure. Was he another one of your VANK coworkers?
Does pic related show up in your dreams recently?
>KF-21 in production has only some A/A capabilities
Already debunked by the existence of KGGB and other guided bombing methods. But I'd say it's lacking more in the variety of its armament.
>Anon, do you know the meaning of the words you're using? You literally just admitted my point.
How?
>I hate AI with passion, but the images posted by that anon earlier about you are pretty spot on.
?
>You can only post out of context articles that either prove nothing or go against your own talking points, when you're made aware of that you move the goalpost or simply ignore it and try to gaslight us with more baseless claims. I don't know how you are taught in south korea, but in the rest of the world people aren't so easily fooled by such a low effort shilling.
I've been telling you the truth all along though? At what point did my word made thou upset precisely? Is it because KF-21 will be one of the best selling fighters in its class?

>>64012769
>Does pic related show up in your dreams recently?
I'm not really into playing with wojack dolls, so not really. But you seem to have a really deeply rooted inferiority complex against anything that is not korean, why?
>I've been telling you the truth all along though?
>source? It was revealed to me in a dream
many such cases.
>Is it because KF-21 will be one of the best selling fighters in its class?
Like I already told you before, this kind of chest puffing is usually more impressive after you manage to get even a single export customer.

>>64012799
>no source
>no pic
>just trust me bro
A moment ago you didn't even know kggb can be released from any kind of platforms and now you think you know better about the plane than me? Great job doing your cope maxxing lol.

>>64012799
He's probably a mod from r/aznidentity

>>64012842
>kggb can be released from any kind of platforms
so do you have any video or picture of it being released by a KF-21?

>>64012842
>https://www.twz.com/40113/meet-south-koreas-new-kf-21-hawk-indigenous-fighter
Hmmm. That's weird.

>>64012718
Considering they're budgeting for 80 Block 2's, but aren't budgeting anyhting for Block 1 upgrades should tell you everything you need to know.

Even if it IS just a software upgrade, it would cost money in the budget to upgrade the Block 1s, and no money is being planned for allocation.

>>64012872
>>64012877
>>64012799
Anons, you'll make him run away again

>>64012533
>The first block will still be able to launch AIM-2000 and Meteor
>The FA-50s to Poland being delivered with 0 weapon capability was such a travesty that Korea delivering a fighter jet that actually has missiles is seen as a major accomplishment

>>64012906
kek

>>64012906
The bigger worry is; The only FA-50S that Korea was able to deliver to Poland were literally GF models "Gap Filler" that the Korean Air Force had and decided to give Poland since KAI can't deliver airframes fast enough.
Does this mean that for all their loud cries of superiority most of their equipment is in that state of not having any integration? Officially the ROKAF has 60 of these FA-50 and they are all without any A/A or A/G capabilities.
This doesn't really spark much confidence in their capabilities in case of a war.

>>64012955
>Officially the ROKAF has 60 of these FA-50 and they are all without any A/A or A/G capabilities.
The issue with Poland was that they only had an inventory of AIM-9X and didn't operate the 9L or 9M. Korea has these missiles, but they are from 1977 and 1983 respectively and have been out of production in the US since 2001 and various FMS countries since around 2005. Korea is basically relying on whatever inventory they have left and all western inventories have been getting sent to Ukraine for the last 2 years. It's honestly shocking that Poland got their hands on any, but they got stuck with the older 9L with basically no resistance for flares or IRCM. As for AIM-9X integration that was supposed to happen in the Block 10 version, but that was 3 years ago when they started producing them and they still haven't integrated it. Poland was actually offered this hypothetical Block 10 version with 9X compatibility which is why they were comfortable buying them at the time, but Korea rug pulled them for the n-tillionth time.

>>64013365
I mean, being stuck with AIM-9L or AIM-9M isn't amazing either.

Like yeah at least they've got stocks, but you're still stuck using a 40+ year old missiles

>>64012886
Oops

>>64004983
Jeez

Bump

>>64005603
>The tornado is not a multirole, it only does three separate things

Uh, okay

>>64020372
The things he refers to are from 3 different variants of the tonka. The Tornado isn't a multirole aircraft in the sense that it's normally used. You can argue that it can be used as such but it's not that accurate imho.