>dropping nuclear weapons on civilians (even though we already killed 1 million Japanese civilians via conventional firebombing, but nobody cares about them lol) is... LE BAD!!!

Okay /k/, let's dance to the critics tune for a bit. What are some ways the Little Boy and Fat Man bombs could have been employed that did not result in massive loss of civilian life, but would still have been psychologically effective enough to intimidate Japan into surrendering?

Drop it on a purely military target? Drop it in the mouth of Tokyo Bay? Announce our intention to destroy a city, name the target, and give the local authorities a 72 hour window to evacuate inhabitants (and if they choose not to, it's on them)?

I realize that we're looking back with 80 years of hindsight and that at the time, using Little Boy to destroy a city seemed to be the best (and only) option, but let's assume Truman got a bit of cold feet about it (maybe he personally attends the Trinity test and experiences the terrifying the power of the bomb firsthand or something) and started looking for less-lethal alternatives.

>>64085015 (OP)
>bombs are le bad
Bombs are le based

>>64085015 (OP)
Demand immediate surrender. Then drop one in Tokyo bay.

Then do it again the next day. And the next day.

>>64085015 (OP)
>What are some ways the Little Boy and Fat Man bombs could have been employed that did not result in massive loss of civilian life, but would still have been psychologically effective enough to intimidate Japan into surrendering?
Japan was already petitioning surrender and trying to use Moscow as a neutral intermediary with the USA months before the bombs were even dropped. Their sticking point was that they wanted a guarantee that the Japanese Emperor wouldn't be subjected to a war crimes trial and executed, but Roosevelt and Truman both demanded an "unconditional surrender" that prolonged the war for no good reason over objections from the British.

Instead of sparing a city from fire bombings they could have spared a naval base or something, say Kure thats right by Hiroshima. Drop the bomb there instead, therell be less loss of human life and you get to demonstrate the bomb against concrete bunkers and whatever vessels were still there.

>>64085087
That is not 100% true. Japan wanted not just the safety of the Emperor, but wanted the emperor to be in power with limited rule.

Ultimately, no. They wanted unconditional surrender and conquest. There is no way to do this but to unconditionally wipe out as much life as possible. Striking mere military targets when conquering a nation is ineffective. It just turns the non-military targets into guerilla fighters.

>>64085015 (OP)

They could have dropped it on Kure as >>64085106 suggested

>>64085038

That they are

>>64086213
>There is no way to do this but to unconditionally wipe out as much life as possible
Except the rationale for not only nuking Japan but firebombing Germany was to destroy military-industrial infrastructure, and civilian casualties were unavoidable as "precision" bombing wasn't a thing back then.
>Striking mere military targets when conquering a nation is ineffective. It just turns the non-military targets into guerilla fighters.
There were still tens of millions Japs ready, willing, and able to banzai charge GIs with fucking bamboo spears in the event America invaded and pillaged the home islands like the Imperial court was afraid of, and yet the occupation of Japan was NOT plagued by insurgency. You know where partisan warfare was a huge problem? In Eastern Europe where the German occupying forces set out to unconditionally wipe out as much life as possible.

>>64085015 (OP)
>Drop it on a purely military target?
bingo

>>64085087
afaik there were no peace offers made by japan that explicitly agreed to a complete surrender with the only condition being immunity for the emperor. from what i understand leaders in japan were still hoping to hold onto at least some of their mainland conquests in china and manchuria and believed they could play the ussr and america off each other in negotiations, so their peace feelers to america were invitations to open negotiations for a settlement with final terms largely left undefined.

>>64089426
with the German cities bombed by the Brits it was the other way around: destruction of industry was side effect of burning down the entire city. They didnt have the accuracy to hit or even means to target just the industry in the darkness.

>>64085015 (OP)
>American desperate to justify mass-murder
Hmm

>>64089571
Let's not talk about the events that led up to the "finding out" phase.

>>64085015 (OP)
We saved Japan from being carved up like Korea was.
>Stalin: let us have Hokkaido
>Truman: lol fuck off
And that was that. Simply preventing a second Korean war would have been a net gain of millions of civilian lives and a protracted war that might have seen Japan become part of the USSR.
So nuclear weapons saved lives in Japan.

>>64085015 (OP)
Nuke Tokyo and Kyoto. Fuck the critics.

>>64089426
>There were still tens of millions Japs ready, willing, and able to banzai charge GIs with fucking bamboo spears in the event America invaded and pillaged the home islands
Doubt it. So they were utterly fanatical that they would commit mass suicide in spear charges, but then went "oh nvm" as soon as they could do so? Fanatics don't abandon their beliefs so easily.
>but they were obeying the emperor! They thought he was god!
The emperor who got couped and had several assassinations against him? Some "god"

>>64089684
My point is that you create fanatics when you put people's backs against the wall, like when you make your stated mission murdering as much of the civilian populace as you can. When you wage a war with the objective of *limited* destruction of your enemy, even if there is collateral damage along the way, you can go a long way towards stopping insurgencies before they form.

>>64089694
>When you wage a war with the objective of *limited* destruction of your enemy,
I don't think limited destruction was on the menu in the case of Japan. We would have gone full tilt until they capitated.

>>64085015 (OP)
I hope the Japanese one day have revenge on you mutts and nuke Tulsa or some shit. Your ZOG nigger country deserves it.

>>64089733
First of all, the japs lack the stones. Second, if they ever do grow the stones please hit Austin or Houston first. They're both equally awful in unique ways

>>64085087
Japan, like all Asian nations are soulless backstabbing faggots that you should never trust ever, at all, for any reason. You would be a fool to allow any concessions in their surrender and that is their own fault for essentially being a shitty ex girlfriend when it comes to morality and literally everything else. In my opinion we should have refused all peace offers and erased them from history with and endless stream of hellfire.

>>64089817
Good morning, fellow moderate.

>>64089426
>There were still tens of millions Japs ready, willing, and able to banzai charge GIs with fucking bamboo spears in the event America invaded and pillaged the home islands
This is a Zigger-tier talking point that only proves how out of touch with reality the ruling military junta of Japan actually was. The idea that 5' nothing high school girls and grannies would charge American tanks and GIs with sticks and fight to the death is completely absurd and should be dismissed as something only a completely retarded milfag would deem plausible. Remember that these are the same retards who thought that sending their best pilots to commit sudoku was a winning strategy. And for the record, the German leaders had the same desperate idea when they were on the brink of defeat as well. All it did was give Eisenhower an excuse to imprison thousands of German civilians in concentration camps:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werwolf
>>64089566
Their reasoning was that they didn't want to surrender everything and have the war be a complete waste of blood and treasure. Remember that they were heavily into the whole ancestor worship thing, and probably thought the war dead would curse them if they gave up all their gains. Japan was allowed to keep Okinawa anyway since it was long considered strategically important by the Americans.
>>64089568
The official bombing strategy was to target marshalling yards to cripple German logistics. These were shunting yards for freight locomotives that were often found near civilian populated areas, so it was a euphemistic method for terrorizing and killing civilians while still being legally sound under the rules of war on paper.

Test it out at sea but within sight of Tokyo. Announce the next target in advance (radio, leaflet drop etc). Hopefully they would give up after the first test.

But remember, there was very nearly a militarist coup when the emperor was considering surrender. Things could have gone very differently even with the nukes.

>>64090150
The US could have dropped five more nukes, and it wouldn't have changed anything since the Japanese ruling class of aristocrats and military careerists were oppressive psychopaths who didn't give a fuck about the lives of commoners. The only thing that forced them to surrender was the USSR declaring war, since they figured it was better to go ahead and surrender to the Americans than fight a war on two fronts and be forced to surrender to both the Americans and the commies. Even then, they only surrendered once it was implied that Hirohito would be let off the hook and Tojo would be the fall guy for the whole thing.

>>64090202
The nukes weren't for the Japanese, they were for Stalin.
Before the end, Japan would have been carved up into several administrations with Hokkaido and Northern Japan going to the USSR which would have created a split japan like Korea.
Then, Stalin would have armed his communist guerilla forces and told them to reunify, and we'd have another Korean war.
Truman told Stalin to fuck off, and the Japanese surrendered to America instead.

>>64089733
>nuke major American city
>Americans all celebrate and thank you instead

>>64089733
This is a zero-sum situation for Japan. If they nuke California, we'll sing their praises forever. If they don't nuke California, then we'll retaliate by forcing them to annex California.

>>64085038

FPBP

>>64085015 (OP)

Drop it on top of Mt. Fuji (literally as sacred as Mt. Sinai in Japanese mythology) just to fuck with them.

>>64085015 (OP)
a demonstration in view of japan would have been devastating itself as it would have polluted a major food source from fishery
if they didn't surrender after that they may have dropped something like 15 nukes

>>64093261
>a demonstration in view of japan would have been devastating itself as it would have polluted a major food source from fishery
No it wouldn't have. We've detonated hundreds of nuclear bombs in the ocean and that has never happened.

>Japan is already suing for peace on the single condition the emperor remains head of state
>US want unconditional surrender because they need to sell total victory back home
>drop the bomb on a city full of civilians
>Japs don't know what hit them, need time to think about it
>US don't give them that time, drop another one a couple days later (muh shock and awe)
>Japs give up
>US still allow the emperor to remain head of state, so their demand for unconditional surrender was basically unnecessary
>therefore the bombs were unnecessary
>therefore the civilians were killed unnecessarily
>unnecessarily killing civilians is not only a war crime but a crime against basic natural law everywhere on the planet
>burgers act surprised if they get criticized for it

I mean realistically, they could have achieved unconditional surrender by just dropping the bomb at sea in viewing distance of the Tokyo harbor, with a message á la "the next one will hit the palace". IF the Japs still didn't surrender, then any further casualties would be on the hands of Japan. And the show of force against the Soviet Union would have worked just as well with that method.

And imho that's the whole controversy: The US could have prevented civilian life, thus they were obligated to do so (even by the standards of the time). But they didn't.

>>64093257
There's a problem with that: it's a volcano. Not an extinct one either.

>>64085079
It's a bit misleading. Japan still hoped to be able to keep lands at this point. They wanted to be able to negotiate and the safety of the emperor was just an element. I also believe that american weren't sure about what they would do with the emperor either.
Critics on Hiroshima an Nagasaki are completely anachronistic either way. It was justified for almost anyone you would ask back then.

>>64093417
We'll call it a science experiment.

>>64093314
>We've detonated hundreds of nuclear bombs in the ocean and that has never happened.
never did it in front of an audience and told them to fuck off though? can you read or do you just like farting from your mouth? fuck dude, why do you make me do this?

>>64093387
>rape and pillage your way across the world in a war of aggression
>cry when the same principle is applied to you
We should have dropped more.

>>64093387
If you've done any research you should have learnt that dropping a demo nuke was considered and then decided against.
The Japanese military leadership had been fanatically brave in the face of threats for decades, so US experts thought there was a real chance they would push Japan into fighting to the last woman and child. They also had a tight grip on media and public information, so if they wanted to keep a demo nuke secret form the populace then they could have. They were ALSO aware of younger officers agitating for a coup to prevent any potential surrenders.

The nuking of a city was explicitly to prevent the military from covering anything up and to force the civilian side of Japan to recognise reality and take control of decision-making from the military.
And even then Hiroshima didn't get the ball rolling fast enough: Jap military was still wanting to argue the details of a surrender with US until Nagasaki.

>>64093512
>The Japanese military leadership had been fanatically brave

The Japanese gave up fighting the Soviets after Khalkhin Gol and begged the Soviets not to rejoin the war in 1945.

Japanese military officers threatened to overthrow Hirohito and replace him with his brothers if he didn't give in to their demands.

>>64089733
>Your ZOG nigger country deserves it.

Japan literally served as a shabbos goy for Jews like Jacob Schiff

>>64089566
Japan held solid control over western Indonesia (Java, Sumatra) and Vietnam, but were already collapsing in China in Spring 1945

Japanese soldiers fled from east Guangxi in the second Guangxi campaign as well as Fuzhou and Wenzhou, before the atomic bombs, and after Japan was defeated in the battle of West Hunan and battle of west Henan.

Hirohito himself ordered withdrawal to prevent collapse as Japanese had no more ammunition, fuel or food to hold those territories.

>>64089426
>There were still tens of millions Japs ready, willing, and able to banzai charge GIs

Ordinary Japanese commoners in the Tokyo firebombing said they wanted the war to end immediately.

Japanese soldiers in the southern Philippines said their morale totally broke down under attack by Moro Muslims and the soldiers were desperately trying to surrender to Americans as Moros were massacring them.

>>64093462
>rape and pillage your way across the world in a war of aggression
>cry when the same principle is applied to you
The 7-year-old Japanese schoolchildren were raping and pillaging their way across the world?
In what world are children liable for the sins of their parents?

>>64093512
>dropping a demo nuke was considered and then decided against
Why?
>US experts thought there was a real chance they would push Japan into fighting to the last woman and child
"Well there's a chance a warning shot will not calm him down, so let's just fill him with bullets right away even if we could still do so if our warning shot really doesn't work."
>The nuking of a city was explicitly to prevent the military from covering anything up
How could a demo nuke at sea in viewing distance of the whole of Tokyo be covered up?
I don't get how burgers can get so defensive about shit that happened 80 years ago. All you have to do is say "yeah, that wasn't ideal", maybe put down a wreath at the Hiroshima Peace Center, and the entire issue would be over in an instant.

>>64093544
>We consider any soldier who surrenders when he can still physically fight to be literally a criminal and the punishment for this crime is death
>Oh sorry we changed our mind 10 minutes ago when we started losing no no stop I said we believe in surrender now!!!
Nobody outside of Japan actually knew that Japan was really going to surrender. They had been saying and acting as if they weren't going to surrender under any circumstances for years. Then in 6 months some Japanese leaders changed their mind were willing to consider it.
Except we still don't even know if Japan was really going to surrender because they didn't have a unanimous decision and they did have a history of coups by pro-war groups of officers.

>>64093595
But you're not bound by what your enemy claims or says or puts into legislature. You're bound by the Hague Convention, nothing more, nothing less.
Hiroshima and Nagasaki were war crimes, and burgers can't admit they made a mistake because they're insecure mutts like their orange leader.

>>64093608
>Hiroshima and Nagasaki were war crimes
In what way?

>>64093594
Jesus that's a lot of projection.
Maybe you should take your own advice: don't be so upset about something that happened 80 years ago, then maybe put down a wreath at Nanjing, Changzhou, Manilla, Singapore and Harbin (to name a few places)

>>64093578
>The 7-year-old Japanese schoolchildren were raping and pillaging their way across the world?
>In what world are children liable for the sins of their parents?
Their parents were responsible for their deaths

>>64093460
You said it would pollute their fisheries. You were wrong. Take the L.

>>64093608
We didn't ratify those conventions. The USA reserves the right to nuke the gook.

>>64093734
NTA and I think the nukes are based but the US had absolutely ratified the Hague Conventions.

>>64093618
The unnecessary killing of civilians.

>>64093637
So if your orange retard starts to sperg out for good and, say, actually starts an illegal war of aggression against Greenland, Norwegian troops would be justified in bombing day care centers in Wyoming?

>>64093751
No point in arguing with burgers.
They think droning wedding parties in Afghanistan is le based, but God forbid one of the operators develops PTSD later. Then prepare for lots of flagwaving and hollywood dramas about muh poor veterans, why do they hate us so, can't get the images out of my head, muh noble sacrifice oorah blah blah blah

>>64093751
Certain parts of it, we didn't ratify the prohibition on the use of nuclear weapons.

>>64093767
First, there's a difference between specifically targeting a daycare and targeting an entire city with military significance.
Second, Greenland is Denmark, not Norway.
Third, collateral damage happens in every war. I wish kids didn't get killed it will always happen to an extent.
Fourth, why are you so concerned about Japanese kids but not all the Chinese, Filipino, Malaysian etc. kids who got tortured and murdered?

>>64093781
>nuclear weapons
>1899 and 1907
What are you talking about? Show me the relevant sections.

>>64093779
How many generations of goat fuckers can we take out with a couple of 2000 pound bombs?

>>64093314
>We've detonated hundreds of nuclear bombs in the ocean and that has never happened.

Isn't Bikini Atoll still uninhabitable because all of the fish and soil still have detectable levels of radiation?

drop it on top of some japanese military garrison in china or korea away from civilians.

>>64093751
The Hague convention has nothing to do with nuclear weapons. The USA didn't even sign all of the Hague convention statutes.

>>64093632
Based

>>64093807
The US ratified the 1907 Hague Convention IV which concerns collective punishment. That was the point being contended originally by the other anon.

>>64093578
>Won't somebody please think of tge poor ant hill!

>>64093819
Yeah in 1994, which was about 50 years after we microwaved the Japanese

>>64093826
Wrong again. It was ratified in November 27 1909.

>>64093836
Oh well, nuclear weapons aren't collective punishment, and the bombings of Nagasaki and Hiroshima, the fire bombing of Tokyo, and even the carpet bombing of Best Korea never materialized as war crimes.

>>64093763
How do you judge that? Both cities fell well within what one would designate as valid targets

>>64093841
Yeah I don't disagree. I'm just saying what the status of the Hague Conventions we'd.

>>64093846
It's a stupid argument because you know the japs would have nuked a major American city if they could have, not in retaliation, but out of spite, like everything they do.

>>64093767
just like how kikes are starving and killing children in retribution for 10/7

>>64093767

No, but they would be justified bombing day care centers in New York City (because they're brown children)

>>64093888
>Hamas refuses to surrender despite the Gazan population suffering from starvation, their Iranian and Hezbollah allies having long since abandoned them, and all of the regional Arab powers calling on them to just take the fucking L and lay down their arms
>all in a war they started
>surely this is Israel's fault

>>64093785
>there's a difference between specifically targeting a daycare and targeting an entire city with military significance.
"Well you see, that city of 200,000 people had a recruitment office somewhere, so we were justified in flattening it."
>why are you so concerned about Japanese kids but not all the Chinese, Filipino, Malaysian etc. kids who got tortured and murdered?
Because
1. two wrongs don't make a right
2. Japanese schoolchildren weren't the ones doing the murdering in China, nor did they "contribute to the war effort"

>>64093791
The funny thing about arrogance is that it will always come to a deserved end eventually.
I'm gonna lean back and enjoy your screeching once China starts bombing the shadow of your empire in like 20-30 years. Don't come crying to the UN about muh civilians then.

>>64093842
A entire city doesn't become a valid military target just because there's a recruitment office somewhere.
"Well the bomb killed 500 civilians, but it also hit one soldier" is exactly the kind of disproportionality the Hague Convention prohibits.
Inb4
>but it wasn't just a recruitment office, they had an entire arms factory
In which case you could have just sent conventional bombers to exactly this part of the city. If less destructive means of taking out a valid military target are available (which they were), you MUST use those means.

>>64093888
>just like how kikes are starving and killing children in retribution for 10/7
... which, too, is a war crime. Once again our Hebrews and their pet dogs across the pond have different rules to play by for some reason.

>>64093959
Look at all these intellectually dishonest disingenuous straw men, surely this is a conversation worth having

>>64093257
iirc there were actually plans considered to deface Mt. Fuji but the Americans for the most part decided to preserve a lot of the ancient Japanese landmarks.
>>64093387
Basically this but nuke apologists will still cling to 80-year-old propaganda about how jap kindergarteners and grannies armed with sticks and stones would have inflicted 6 million casualties if the Americans tried an amphibious invasion of Japan.
>>64093430
>Critics on Hiroshima an Nagasaki are completely anachronistic either way. It was justified for almost anyone you would ask back then.
No it absolutely wasn't lmao you can look up what MacArthur, Eisenhower, Nimitz, etc. thought about the atomic bombings of Japan. Pretty much all the high-ranking American military leaders thought they were unnecessary since everyone on both sides knew Japan was going to lose the war long before the bombs were dropped.

how come we only ever talk about what america does? other countries drop bombs too.

>>64093987
Dude, the Japanese killed entire cities of people with guns and bayonets for no reason at all, and you're mad that a strategic bombing was slightly disproportionate.

>>64093959
>here's my retarded argument
>there were Japanese school children

>>64094070
Because no one drops as many bombs as Burgerstan.

If you think you're the world police, people are gonna hold you to a different standard.

>>64094092
Yes. And?

>>64094155
Since you are so focused on a lesser crime and dismiss worse ones, it seems like your agenda is more about America-bashing than upholding morality and norms of conduct in warfare

>>64094070
They want to vilify the hegemon because despite being weak and therefore full of virtue the only thing these weak nations do is sin and commit evil so dark that we should wipe them off the face of the earth old testament style. It's the commie tactic of accusing the good guy of what you are yourself doing. America has single handedly saved the world from itself.

>>64094174
You've hit the nail on the head

>>64093987
>A entire city doesn't become a valid military target just because there's a recruitment office somewhere
But its not a recruitment office you are hitting.
In Hiroshima's case you are hitting the Army HQ in charge of defending southern Japan, and the 20 000 soldiers garrisoned there. This is in direct support of a 500k strong invasion that you plan to land in a few months time.
In Nagasaki's case you are hitting one of the major transport&logistics hub, along with its shipping& repair industry. Again in direct support of the planned invasion and Operation Starvation.

>>64090122
read what happenned in okinawa. A significant part of the civilian population commited mass suicide rather than surrender.

>>64094378
>A significant part of the civilian population commited mass suicide rather than surrender.
They were forced to do it by the men in many cases. It was mostly just a mass murder by Japanese men of their own women and children. https://www.asahi.com/sp/ajw/articles/15686095

>>64094174
So you agree what the US did constitutes a war crime.
Glad we can agree on that at least.

>>64094292
>in direct support of the planned invasion
the one you don't wanna launch because you might get hurt? Why support it then?

>>64094378
>we had to nuke them to save them from committing sudoku
>but we also had to nuke them because they would have fought to the death and inflicted 6 million casualties on American GIs
What kind of logic is this?

>>64094429
Japanese logic

>>64094040
>everyone on both sides knew Japan was going to lose the war

Japan was losing after Americans mined all of Japan's ports with magnetic mines and Japanese were entering the start of collective mass starvation.

Is that a war crime too retard?

>Americans for the most part decided to preserve a lot of the ancient Japanese landmarks

Japan mass destroyed tens of thousands of their own temples, castles and shrines in the Meiji restoration.

90% of Japanese landmarks were already erased by Japanese themselves.

The firebombings and atomic bombs destroyed most of the rest like the original sensoji temple.

>>64094378
> A significant part of the civilian population commited mass suicide rather

There were nearly 2 milllion Japanese civilians in the Soviet occupation zone in.South Sakhalin, Kuril islands, Manchukuo and North Korea.

The Soviets killed starved and mass raped nearly every single Japanese civilian in those regions.

Only a few thousand Japanese commited suicide.

The vast majority of the Japanese girls and women who got raped by Soviets just kept silent about the rapes out of shame. They didn't kill themselves.

>>64094628
>Japan mass destroyed tens of thousands of their own temples, castles and shrines in the Meiji restoration.
Source?

>>64094628
>is intentionally starving civilians a war crime

>>64094429
I guess you can attribute it to what they learned in the pacific theater? Nips were a bit too fanatical in their fighting and were committing suicide due to failure because of their whole honor code thing. Guess the USA, at the time, saw them as a nation that rather fight to the death or commit suicide than surrender.
You can also look at the current war in Russia and Ukraine and see that Russians rather commit suicide than get captured because they'll bring shame to the motherland. Society can really do some damage to the psyche

>>64094702
>Nips were a bit too fanatical in their fighting and were committing suicide due to failure because of their whole honor code thing. Guess the USA, at the time, saw them as a nation that rather fight to the death or commit suicide than surrender.
Ok but my point is that women do not behave like that at all ever in the history of warfare lol
>You can also look at the current war in Russia and Ukraine and see that Russians rather commit suicide than get captured because they'll bring shame to the motherland.
And look at what Ukrainian women did when the war broke out. Women don't care about nebulous concepts like honor or national pride. They're pragmatic and only ever looking out for number one.

>>64094754
All this is based in what? What you've seen because of the internet? Internet didn't exist during ww2 so no one really really knows what they were truly like. Most of the exposure you'll get to nips during that time is war propaganda and, if you're lucky, nip-american friends if they weren't put into internment camps

>>64094788
Bro are you really trying to argue that 5' tall 90 lbs Japanese women armed with pointy sticks would have banzai charged American troops? I know Japan is a weird country but let's be real here.

>>64094673
https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/16634206/

https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/16634206/#q16634301

>>64094702
>Nips were a bit too fanatical in their fighting

Japanese soldiers surrendered to Chinese at the battle of Changsha (1943) and Changde in 1943.

There are video and pictures from western journalists.

Japan's military GHQ denied that any Japanese soldiers surrendered.

Japanese propaganda≠ reality

Japanese soldiers in the southern Philippines were attacking each other and stealing each other's supplies as their morale completely collapsed under attack from Moro Muslims and trying to surrender to Americans. The officers threatened to murder the Japanese conscripts who were trying to surrender.

>>64094702
>because of their whole honor code thing

Japan mass exported Japanese teenage girls (karayuki-san) as prostitutes to China and western colonies before world War II. Their main clients were Chinese coolies and western soldiers stationed in colonies.

Japan's honour code was "do whatever the emperor tells you to do".

It's NOT an honour code like Middle Eastern Yezidi type codes (protect your women's vaginas from outsiders)

Oh God it's the hapacel spammer.

>>64094910
Hapas defend Japanese cuckoldry like weeb incels such as yourself.

Many hapas have Japanese mothers themselves dumbass.

>>64094910

>Japanese men (Asian males) get insulted for prostitution of Japanese girls to foreign men

>first reaction of a white incel cuck is to start defending Nip men

>accuses poster of being a hapa

>hapas literally defends Japanese male incels and attacks anyone promoting white male-Japanese female marriage

>>64094947
I don't care what your malfunction is, you're a known spammer, r*ddit user, and ban evading retard. Drink bleach.

>>64094971
Hapas are well known defenders of Japanese incels.

Hapas are against Japanese women marrying white men (the majority of Japanese American and Canadian women are married to white men at a right outstripping every other Asian)

They say Japanese women should only marry Asian men

Hapas aren't a pro-China defence group, they ban anyone insulting Japanese women by posting facts like karayuki san

The fact that your first instinct was to accuse me of being hapa for posting facts on Japanese girls getting fucked by foreign men tells us why you cucks are controlled by Jews

Funny how I didn't say a single thing about white women, and the first instinct of the incel weeb with his collection of JAV porn is to accuse me of being anti-white for insulting Japanese (Asians), and of posting blacked cuck porn.

>>64094998
Just spam your 50 prewritten posts full of /his/ archive links already so you can get banned like you have probably hundreds of times over the years between /k/ and /his/. Very well adjusted, not mentally ill at all behavior, by the way.

God damn did I hit a nerve or what? My only post i the thread was >>64094910 as soon as I saw the /his/ archive link and I stopped reading kek. Looks like my spammer radar is dead on.

>>64095016
>black man on white woman interracial porn

What does this have to do with Japanese prostitutes in China?

Again cuck, you defend Japan harder than your own people which is why Mirpuri Pakis and Jews rape and own your people like cattle.

>>64095016
>>64095066
Japan also protected Jews while they raped white Dutch women in the Dutch east Indies and raped Spanish women, Italian women and German women in the Manila massacre in 1945

Jewish bankers like Jacob Schiff funded Japan against Russia in 1904-1905.

Your entire posts are projection.

Do I need to start posting archive links to your hundreds of spergouts, spammer-kun?

>>64094904
>Japan mass exported Japanese teenage girls (karayuki-san) as prostitutes to China and western colonies before world War II.
This isn't really a Japanese thing so much as it is an Oriental thing i.e. cultures influenced by China and Confucianism which treats women as disposable.

>>64095249
Wrong retard.

In Confucian China, people locked women in their house and did gender segregation in public.

Women were not allowed to wear revealing clothing in public.

Women and male strangers did nor bathe together. A man could kill his wide for talking to a stranger.

Widows wee expected to remain chaste and not remarry. Divorce was heavily stigmatized.

Adulterous women were drowned to death.

Temporary marriage was totally taboo for Chinese women.

Chinese commoners lived in patrilineal clans with strict gender segregation.

In Japan, Japanese commoners did not gender segregate. They did not live in patrilineal clans or have surnames before the Meiji restoration.

Japanese commoners women bathed with male strangers and could commit adultery without their husbands killing them

Japanese commoner women could become single mothers with no stigma since none of them cared about paternal lineage

Japanese girls practiced temporary marriages in port cities with foreigners (marriages that expire after an agreed amount of time) and could have multiple children before permanently marrying a Japanese man.

Japanese women could wear short sleeved dresses in public and flirt with male strangers.

Japanese commoner men didn't kill their wives for adultery.

Because Japanese commoners did not practice Confucianism, only samurai and nobles did.

In Japan, it was legal for Samurai to rape or fuck a Japanese commoners wife without punishment. If the commoner even hit or cursed the samurai he would be executed.

In China, all extramarital intercourse with married women was illegal. If a noble tried to fuck someone else's wife he would be charged in court.

>>64095112
Show me a single "spergout" with blacked porn or anything to do with hapas.

I don't actually think you're Tenda, God knows we'd be lucky if there were only one mentally ill chinese supremacist spamming this site. You ARE inarguably mentally ill and obsessed with cuckoldry, so instead I'll just link some of your spam over on /his/. You're the only faggot I've ever seen who so obsessively links your own archive posts, so it makes it really easy to find your hundreds upon hundreds of posts about how everyone was getting cucked by the chinese.

https://desuarchive.org/his/search/text/https%3A%2F%2Fdesuarchive.org%2Fhis%2Fthread%2F8101383/
https://desuarchive.org/k/search/text/https%3A%2F%2Fdesuarchive.org%2Fhis%2Fthread%2F13220256%2F/
https://desuarchive.org/his/search/text/https%3A%2F%2Fdesuarchive.org%2Fhis%2Fthread%2F13220256/

I found one that was just you linking your own posts 200 times but lost it kek. In the meantime, I wonder how many of the 1100 mentions of "Karayuki-san" on /his/ since 2020 are you. I bet it's close to half or even more. They certainly have your posting style where you spam dozens of posts with archive links to your previous spamfests.
https://desuarchive.org/his/search/text/Karayuki-san/start/2020-01-01/

https://desuarchive.org/his/search/text/https%3A%2F%2Fdesuarchive.org%2Fhis%2Fthread%2F9505389/
Is there a name for this mental illness?

>>64095703
>hapas

>chinese supremacist

Japanese women are the biggest producers of hapa school shooters.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryuichi_Tsukamoto#:~:text=Ryuichi%20Tsukamoto%20was%20born%20on,to%20his%20underage%20mother's%20pregnancy.

>Ryuichi Tsukamoto (born June 16, 1950) is the alias of a Japanese serial killer who, as a teenager, killed three women in three separate prefectures between 1966 and 1967.[1] Dubbed by investigators "Metropolitan Designated Case No. 106", Tsukamoto was convicted and sentenced to life imprisonment in 1972, but is believed to have been paroled in the late 1980s.[2][3]

>Early life
>Ryuichi Tsukamoto was born on June 16, 1950, in Shiogama, the son of a black American soldier, A. Johnson, who had been stationed at a nearby military base, and a 16-year-old Japanese girl.[1] It is said that Tsukamoto had trouble breathing when he was born, possibly due to complications relating to his underage mother's pregnancy.[4]

>About a week after his birth, the Korean War broke out, resulting in his father being dispatched to Korea, where he was later killed in combat.[2] At the age of 4, his mother married an American soldier in Fukuoka, with whom she later returned to the US, leaving her illegitimate son in the care of her grandparents in Sendai.[2] According to author Shigeru Azuchi, he was then living under his mother's surname, which, according to Azuchi, is "a common Japanese surname starting with an S."[5]

>In 1955, a pair of American soldiers offered Tsukamoto's grandmother to adopt him. She initially agreed to the proposal, but later turned the offer down when the couple demanded 50,000 yen from her.[4] Three years later, the grandmother passed away, and Tsukamoto was taken in by his uncle, an employee of the Japanese National Railways who had a wife and children.[4]

>Despite his mixed-race heritage, Tsukamoto was never bullied by his peers, who feared him due to his remarkable physical strength.[4]

>>64095703
>>64095930
What does hapas, a site including half Japanese born to Japanese whores, have to do with "Chinese supremacists"?

Hapas doesn't allow anyone to talk about Japanese women being whores.

I can't tell if he's mad because "hapa" is an insult to his racial purity, or because it hit too close to home, but regardless of that, I invite any anon to read the archive links I provided, and know that's just scratching the surface. This mentally ill noguns r*ddit spammer has made thousands, maybe tens of thousands of posts, all about the same subject.

Japanese women have the biggest interracial marriage rate in the US and Canada.

I remeber a pro-Japan weeb spamming charts of interracial marriage among Asians in the US to defend Japan and attack China on a thread.

Except the incel didn't read, the chart said Japanese women outstrip ever other Asian in interracial marriage.

>>64096121

No surprise, there's not that many Japanese men to go around

>>64095989

huh

>>64085015 (OP)
in isolation dropping bombs on cities is bad
some people cant get past that. the idea that war was already a fact and the decisions were made in that context is apparently too much nuance for some.

>>64085015 (OP)
they could have dropped them on Dresden
that's the key complaint with the bombs. that they weren't used on white people. you know it's true

>>64094275
It's suspicious that after quality post like this the thread somehow gets derailed by off topic nonsense.

The problem is generally speaking most people assume the bombs were being dropped by people with the same peacetime mindset we find ourselves in now. Objectively, every single civilian death is a sad thing in a time of peace. But 1945 was not FDR and Churchill and the world sitting around with normal emotions, it was 6-9 years of warfare, total warfare. Let's round down and say WWII's total deaths is 50 million. Let's round up and say Hiroshima and Nagasaki combined was 250,000 people including radiation induced deaths years later. They account for one half of one percent of the total casualties of WWII in its entirety.

At the level war was being conducted on, the individual ceased being an individual. Without even going into "no one cares about Dresden/London/etc." stuff, I don't think people fully grasp how massive the scope of casualties were. The planned invasion would have killed more, and I blame hollywood for whitewashing the amount of post-Normandy civilian deaths that occurred in Europe. Wherever any army on either side moved, civilians suffered.

Do you know some of the other plans we had for Europe? The Morgenthau plan was estimated to kill upwards of 25 million people. Operation Vegetarian, which involved anthrax laced food for cattle and other fun stuff had a risk of potentially wiping out the majority of Eurasia if it went out of control.

I guess the point I want to make is not that Japan has no grounds to be upset over civilian deaths in WWII, but that they somehow feel they are uniquely victimized moreso than others because their homeland enjoyed the fruits of conquest but never the downsides until Mr Doolittle popped in to say hello. 1914-1945 was genuinely a period of such destructive and total death and chaos I hope we never experience anything like it again.

>>64085015 (OP)
Anyone who argues that dropping Fat Man and Little Boy were not the right decisions is a faggot.

>>64085087
Threadly reminder that the cowardly Soviets waited until Nagasaki to invade Japanese held Manchuria

>>64086213
They were both valid military targets, any way you look at them.
If anything it was more merciful compared to dropping them on Tokyo.

>>64089426
>Eastern Europe where the German occupying forces set out to unconditionally wipe out as much life as possible.
Hyperbole is not your friend, anon.

>>64089684
>several assassinations against him?
That he survived.

>>64093417
Problem?

>>64093578
A jewish one.
>Exodus 34:7 Deuteronomy 5:9

>>64089733
how will Japan nuking an irrelevant city in a shithole flyover state serve as revenge?

>>64101447
It was the day that their non-aggression pact expired with the Japanese. The bombs were timed to coincide as well.

>>64093608
They were valid targets. Keep seething, turdie.

>>64093594
>All you have to do is say "yeah, that wasn't ideal"
Just like the position the Japs still take about their nunerous war crimes?

>>64093901
What Hamas? I thought the Israelis continually claimed they had complete military victory? But also they somehow need to keep shooting and withholding aid and asking for gibs, while defying two international courts.

>>64094040
If the US had invaded the homee islands serious casualties on both sides would have certainly occurred and a lot of US reprisal killings could have been expected.

>>64094152
And now that we don't want to be world police the world bitches too.

>>64094397
Winners don't commit war crimes.
Sucks to suck.

>>64100931
>because their homeland enjoyed the fruits of conquest

Japanese women were prostituted (karayuki-san) to Chinese men and westerners during this time period.

Average Japanese was poor and foreign men could buy Japanese teenage girls as a temporary wife.

Japanese commoners never enjoyed the fruits of anything during this time.

>>64101447
Japanese military forces in Manchuria were not affected by Nagasaki or Hiroshima.

They were defeated on their own, because Japanese soldiers were inferior to the Soviet army.

>>64101481
Japanese were going to die of mass starvation by the tens of millions if the war continued to 1946 due to their ports being magnetically mined.

They did not have the ability to resist a land invasion or inflict serious casualties.

>>64101534
>They did not have the ability to resist a land invasion or inflict serious casualties.

idk Okinawa seemed like a pretty bloody shitshow to me

>>64101490
It completely defeats the "No! The Japanese would never have surrendered without da bomb!" narrative too.
MILLIONS of Japanese surrendered in Manchuria. A lot of those surrendering got shot too so it was even higher. They surrendered probably more than any other nation in WW2.

Japan is already starting to change their gay constitution and chinkland will get their comeuppance within the next 50 years. 1 nuke warhead for every 10000 chinks, while Japanese BMD intercept every one of theirs.
After that we can discuss about settling the score for Hiroshima and Nagasaki

>>64102079
>chinkland will get their comeuppance

Japan never developed any of their own nuclear technology or missile technology, the US gave Japan its entire nuclear program (atoms for peace) and ballistic rocket program for satellite launches during the Cold War, and Japanese "nuclear physicists" have been comically incompetent and stupid and caused multiple deadly disasters like in 1981 and twice in 1999.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Japanese_nuclear_incidents

Japanese "nuclear physicists" claimed wearing white underwear and long sleeves would protect from nuclear weapons after Hiroshima was bombed, and were unaware that plutonium existed so they assumed the US rab out of uranium and claimed the next uranium bomb was months away from being ready after Nagasaki

Nagasaki's bomb was plutonium, not uranium and the next plutonium bomb was being prepped immediately after for nuking Japan again if they didn't surrender.

>Japanese BMD intercept every one

Chinese nuclear physicists like Chien-shiung Wu (Wu Jianxiong) worked on the original Manhattan project and helped invent the atomic bomb that was dropped on Japan. She separated uranium 235 from 238.

Chinese scientist Qian Xuesen directly worked on the US's ballistic missile program and helped build the US's first ballistic missiles. His cousin Qian Xueju (Tsien Haue-chu) worked on the US jet fighter progarn.

Chins developed its own nuclear bombs and ballistic missiles, Japan had it given all to them and had multiple accidents and meltdowns

Japanese scientists never invented any of their own weapons, they copied British and French bolt action rifles, Britain and Richard Voght helped Japan design aircraft.

Chinese engineer Wong Tsu (Wang Zhu) helped design Boeing model C during World War I in 1916, among the first military aircraft used by the US navy.

Chinese general Liu Qingen designed a semi automatic rifle during World War I.

Britain had to help Japan build its aircraft in the Sempill mission.

>>64102079
>>64102223
Japan doesn't have enough fissile material for enough nukes to attack all of China, even if they were competent and managed to make nukes.

Japan doesn't have enough missiles or silos to blanket all of China with nukes.

Since Japan is smaller than China, Chinese missile silos (both fixed and mobile) can blanket the entire Japan with tens of thousands of concentrated missile launches from all over China's land

Just 10% of China's missiles need to work and/or get past Japanese missile defence to destroy all of Japan.

ALL of Japan's missiles would need to work and get past China's missile defence to destroy just one Chinese province, and the rest of China would survive intact.

>>64101865
The Japanese also stationed 1 million Japanese civilians in Manchukuo, entite Japanese families went so half of them were Japanese girls and women. Those were ordinary civilians, not even military nurses.

2.7 million Japanese (civilians and soldiers) fell into Soviet hands in Manchuria alone, not including Japanese in North Korea, South Sakhalin and Kuril islands.

The Soviet army mass raped every single Japanese girl in their occupied areas, in Manchukuo, North Korea, South Sakhalin, Kuril islands. The number of Japanese girls and women who were raped was hundreds of thousands.

The Soviets massacred and raped Japanese for months in Manchuria and North Korea from August 1945-February 1946.

Over 300,000 Japanese civilians died under Soviet occupation in Manchuria, from massacres, starvation and cold. Entire Japanese families died.

Chinese civilians and Soviet troops both raped Japanese girls and starved Japanese men.

Soviets took hundreds of thousands of Japanese soldiers to gulag work camps in Siberia where many died.

Every single Japanese woman and girl that returned to Japan from Manchukuo had been gang raped multiple times.

10,000 Japanese girls and women (zanryu fujin) remained behind in China and married Chinese men, had children with them and moved back to Japan later in the 1970s with their children.

Japanese suffering in World War II is massively downplayed

Hundreds of thousands of Japanese civilians experienced mass rape because their retarded government placed Japanese girls in a war zone, while weebs falsely boast that Japanese "got off lightly".

>>64101865
>>64102245
https://desuarchive.org/his/thread/17775343/#q17775346

347,000 to 376,000 Japanese were killed by Soviets in August storm

Soviet Union took control of 2.7 million Japanese in Manchukuo and North Korea during their August storm operation.

Japan had settled over 1 million Japanese civilian settler colonists in Manchukuo with their families, including wives and daughters.

Soviet troops set up rape quarters in barracks where hundreds of thousands of Japanese settlers girls, women and military nurses were gang raped for months until the Soviet army withdrew.

Japanese men were deported to Siberia as slave labour in gulags when the Soviet army withdrew.

The Soviets also invaded South Sakhalin and Kurile islands (Karafuto) where Yamato Japanese settler colonists also lived.

>>64102261
>Soviet troops set up rape quarters in barracks where hundreds of thousands of Japanese settlers girls, women and military nurses were gang raped for months until the Soviet army withdrew.

>>64101865

Germans actually have the highest

Uhhh chinkjitasissies? What is our response to this >>64105852? Do we have any /his/ posts about rape we can spam? How could the racially impure Flips style on us so hard?

>>64106660
https://www.philstar.com/headlines/2023/01/29/2240996/lessons-takeaways-mamasapano-incident/

>>64098855
What nuance is there to nuking two cities full of civilians? In times of war, combatants must make every reasonable attempt to minimize civilian casualties. It's a war crime when civilians are the targets and not merely collateral damage. Killing 100,000 civilians with a single weapon is an act of genocide. We all recognize these rules of war outside of the context of WWII, but the Truman Administration and US State Department created ex post facto justifications for why the nukes were necessary by claiming Japan was uniquely evil and fanatical like they were Zerg from Starcraft or something.
>>64101481
This is a perfect example of the false dichotomy that was presented to the American public after the fact.

>>64106660
He
A. Replied with it
B. Is doing exactly that in the main thread lmao

>>64107048
I hope the hapa my neighbors will now have to raise turns out a bit less retarded than you

>>64107057
Can we get him to meltdown in more than one thread at once? Let me try.

>>64106882
Comrade-Raceführer Xi has a tiny penis and couldn't rape a quadriplegic child you worthless chinkcel r*dditfugee.

>>64107048
>What nuance is there to nuking two cities full of civilians?

Both cities were full of military installations and industrial facilities being used in direct support of the war effort.

>Killing 100,000 civilians with a single weapon is an act of genocide.

Please cite a passage from the Genocide Convention in support of your conclusion. I want the quote and a page/paragraph number.

>>64107151
thread moved to pol we shall see in a few minutes...

>>64107274
>Both cities were full of military installations
Only 150 Japanese soldiers died at Nagasaki. Fewer than 10% of the Hiroshima casualties were soldiers.
>Please cite a passage from the Genocide Convention in support of your conclusion.
Article 2 of the Convention defines genocide as:
"... any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;"

Americans will say the Bosnian Serbs killing 8k fighting age muslim men in 1995 was a "genocide," but killing 200,000 Japanese civilians (primarily women, children, and elderly) was a justified act of war.

>>64107277
And of course he has a memeflag so that nobody can see he's in Canada, or some other western country equally embarrassing for a Chinese racial supremacist. Why do these fags never actually live in the countries they shill for, but instead in geopolitical rivals that happen to also have much higher standards of living? I have more respect for that retard that moved from Texas to the russia because he bought the whole based and tradpilled line, only to get sent to the front and drones; at least he put his money where his mouth was and took a drop in quality of life to live according to his values (his values were just shit lol).

>>64107319
>Article 2 of the Convention defines genocide as:
>"... any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
None of that applies. We were not trying to exterminate a national, ethnical, racial or religious group. We were trying to stop a war, and it worked. Thanks to that, hundreds of thousands of civilians died, not millions.

>>64107705
>We were not trying to exterminate a national, ethnical, racial or religious group.
Yes we were lol "We will keep massacring civilians until you agree to unconditional surrender," is a genocidal strategy.
>We were trying to stop a war, and it worked.
It wasn't necessary to stopping the war. None of the highest-ranking American military leaders thought the atomic bombs were essential to winning the war.
>Thanks to that, hundreds of thousands of civilians died, not millions.
False dichotomy based on nothing but a "just-so story."

>>64107895
Dullard. America dropped leaflets a month before telling the Japanese to leave the cities. Hell Nagasaki was able to save hundreds of children for feeding this warning, why did nobody else heed the warning before the bomb was dropped?

>>64108575
So if Russia or China dropped leaflets on your city saying they will totally super seriously destroy it, that would give them carte blanche to do whatever they want, and it would actually be your fault for getting nuked? Get real dude.

>>64100931
Around mid-1945, the number of direct and indirect deaths resulting from the ongoing Pacific War was something like 10,000 per day on average NOT including combat fatalities, mostly in the form of POWs and civilians in Japanese occupied territories, a concept that seems to be lost on 99.9% of armchair analysts. So if you could envision the bombs expediting Japanese surrender by only 25 days, they would have saved as many lives as they destroyed. The prospect of a planned invasion doesn't even need to be invoked for the bombing to sound justified.