Why did the military choose P320 over slightly better but more expensive Glock, and why they didn't even consider M9A3?

>>64098285 (OP)
snig bribed/offered a better price than glonk, and the spaghetti shooter didn't meet their retarded requirements

>>64098285 (OP)
>Require modularity and a well placed manual safety
>Glock: no, but we'll staple this abortion of an afterthought to the side
>Beretta: what about a 92 in a different color with some ergonomic changes?
Sig was the only company that even tried to listen to what the army wanted

Which comittee member has has a SIG factory in his home state?

>>64098302
>abortion of an afterthought
it's funny because that's exactly what the entire firing mechanism of the 320 is lmfao

Why do they have a fetish for slide mounted safeties? Just put it on the frame where it belongs.

>>64098302
the modularity thing was dumb

>>64098285 (OP)
Bad comparison. Should be 92 vs 75 vs 226.

>>64098285 (OP)
Odd, I would think the military with all its schools and experience would just dedign their own and contract out to manufacture it and show everyone how its done.

>>64098363
Kek. That would result in even more horribly niggered up garbage

>>64098323
If you want to respond to a contract by telling the giant organization funding it that their requirements are "dumb" and provide a product that ignores them then you can totally do that. Pissing yourself and shrieking about how it's unfair your product wasn't picked afterwards is the behaviour of a retarded child

>>64098285 (OP)
The same way people chose F104 over locally produced aircraft.

>>64098363
Sounds like an Experts tm problem.
The army can't economize given that it's centrally planned desu.

>>64098285 (OP)
G17 is the best military choice.
The 320 is junk. The 92 was horrible. The G17 is a good issue sidearm. People just have an issue with finding the next best thing instead of sticking with what works.

>>64098363
Military is far to retarded to do that. They would draw a blaster from star wars storm troopers so that really shoot gud

>>64098285 (OP)
Glock wasn't remotely giving a good price and while it performed well in tests regarding adverse conditions and mechanical accuracy, it didn't score as well as the 320 in categories like "battle readiness" (whatever that is), but more importantly ease of use and ergonomics. Basically, it wasn't just cheaper, the testers concurred with most people that glocks are just less fun to shoot.
The real travesty is that the Smith wasnt even allowed to really compete

They should just buy psa daggers. For real. We tax payers would come out on top.

>>64098382
Why assume that we want X product? The modulatory thing is something the military doesn't even use. From what I understand, you either get a full size or compact with a medium grip. No swapping slides or grip modules allowed.

I don't see why they need modulatory in a pistol.

>>64098382
The best part is that Glock DID sue because they DID think modular requirement was dumb and they didn't like that the DoD cut it short when they were comparing the finances. The judge told them, in a much more legal way "It's their contest, they can pick whatever winner they want". Glock then said they would no longer pursue US military contracts

>>64098401
It's kinda stupid they didn't give s&w a chance for fucks sake their pistol is literally called "military &police"

>>64098412
Wat? For reels?

>>64098419
Yes, they were salty bitches about it.

>>64098363
they used to before mcnamara shuttered the ordnance department following the m16 jackassery

>>64098382
Huh? I did stuff all the time and I'm a real man.

>>64098302
>military in charge of recognizing what they actually need
These people don't know or use guns and Sig Saar shouldn't be anywhere near making firearms anymore.

>>64098363
>Gentlemen, I would like to present to you the result of our highly successful and, might I add, only seventy million dollars over budget, XM22 Advanced Combat Pistol program.
>america_the_beautiful.mp3
>Featuring-
>Select fire capability!
>The barrel length for sufficient armor-piercing velocity
>Magazine and ammunition standardization with our new M7 rifle!
>The most advanced optics in existence!
>So in summary, Gentlemen, what you have before you is-
>A pistol that can't be holstered...
>A self defense weapon that is ineffective within 50 meters...
>A quasi-battle rifle that can't be shouldered and shot accurately...
>But can punch right through Ratnik armor at 900m.
>"Fantastic!"
>"Congratulations... General Smith!
>"General?"
>"Hell of a job!"
>"General?"
>Let's build it!
>"...They're building it!!?"

>>64098302
The modularity thing was grips panels. Both the glonk and the beret had those. The beret was also the only one with a manual safety from the start. Also it functions as a dococker AND .mil agencies wouldn't have had to retrain all their armorers + retrain all their troops.

tl;dr Army should have just bought the beret, but since Snig bribed people we have this wonderful mess instead.

>>64098285 (OP)
>M9A3
Nah, the APXA1 fits all the criterias.
>modular
>FCU is the serialized part like in the p320
>extremely reliable
>various grip sizes
>optic ready
>suppressor ready
>manual safety available
>drop safe
>sneeze safe

>>64098285 (OP)
having one in hand the slide safety/decocker is genius but why didn't they make both sides symmetrical?

>>64098532
Extra chromosome level "operators" have made pistols retarded. A pistol is for fast engagements at close range when a rifle is not an option or in hand. Optics, lights all fucking silly. Its a bag of dicks at a sausage party.
Military needs especially, plane jane basic bitch iron sight pistol. Its a backup at best. A point shoot tool if everything has gone wrong. Even capacity is a meme as there are little to no actual modern situations that I recall that capacity was an issue. In the civilian world even less.
As a side on pistol lights in a dark situation...thanks for the target.

>>64098502
glock cope, all these years later

>>64098285 (OP)
What to make of this development? Are COA's going to be up in value now? I doubt the US mil is going to be snatching them all up, but something is afoot.

>>64098560
post a single handgun you own.

>>64098567
No. Stop being a teenage faggot

>>64098560
Decent quality b8

>>64098511
There is absolutely no evidence of any bribery. Honestly, they were the lowest bidder and the lowest bidder literally always wins

>>64098576
Its not bait. Its simple facts. Optics and lights do not provide what one thinks they do.
The fact you cannot counter the point is enough.

>>64098596
Anon I already said the b8 was good, you don't need to try and engage me

>>64098567
I agree with that guy

>>64098602
Post an example of the fastest shooter in the world hitting small moving targets...
(He used iron sights)
Post examples of the fastest in the world to draw and fire accurately
(They use iron)
As far as lights, if you are in the dark with a light and the position of the target is unknown you have presented the best target in the world.
Sorry you got all your training from youtube fags. I got mine from the government. We used night and thermal in the dark. But do go on blasting a light in your dark living room in your undies so jamazquis and trevon can unload into you while you piss yourself.

>>64098610
okay reel it in buddy it's starting to get silly now.

>>64098560
>point shoot tool
Yes
>capacity a meme
I see it as a "better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it" especially since modern semi auto handguns easily carry 10+1 or more.
>light
HD situations. Rather not shoot a shadowy figure in the house without positive ID.

>>64098610
>noguns fails to understand how lights work IRL
Classic

>>64098610
How many lights do you see on my gun there

>>64098616
There you are standing square to the target shining a light exposing yourself in a non athletic position like you are shit standing squatting backwards thumbs pointed forward with all your pretend high speed gear...
Fucking faggots are priceless.

>>64098618
If you cannot positively identify who is in your home without a flashlight you are too retarded to own firearms.
Have you no security setups and procedures at all in your home? Have you done zero training?
Yelling hey you is literally better than exposing yourself with a light.

>>64098624
I know you think you are going to blind your target momentarily but you won't. Thats not how emergency situations work.

>>64098631
Sure anon. Just work on assumptions thst everyone will follow procedures 100% of the time. See how the court likes that. See how reality likes that.

Ow wow people are seriously engaging with such blatant shitposting

>>64098638
Usually it’s this gay guy with a .380 that is screeching about how red dots are ugly and bad

>>64098504
This guy is correct. Military procurement has gone from
>What's a realistic use case 95% of the time
To
>What's the most outlier conditions you can imagine, we're talking one in a million here and assume everything the bugs and ziggers say is 100% true
Which, when it comes to things like aviation and missiles, sure, good plan, it's why the US is thirty-forty years ahead of everyone else on the planet. But for small arms? Especially sidearms? Completely off the rails and out of touch with reality.

>>64098637
You mean like having soft lit areas that backlight anyone moving through the home and dark areas where people are armed?
I prefer to take my training advice from officers like heath who transitioned from hand held light to mounted as SOP and watched the rise in officers shot as now thugs can just aim at the light instead of guessing if center of mass is to the left, right or below a target.
Not to mention is you are using a weapon mounted light to id who is in your home you are pointing a weapon at loved ones in an intense situation.
Seriously you fucking clowns are retarded.
Capacity, again, no. Just no.
The difference between 15 shots and 8 shots and a magazine change in a "have it and not need it situation" is frankly a joke. What the fuck are you doing mag dumping blindly while running away?
That doesn't work well for law enforcement. It doesn't work well in HD.
Im not saying anything different than the professionals say. Im just saying something different than the shills say.

>>64098717
What’s your draw and fire time? Your best splits on a target?

>>64098740
I dont train with a timer. I train with live ammo for trigger and aim and we use simunition in live houses.
Everything you have done training is irrelevant until you face being hit back when shots are fired.

>>64098302
0.01 rupees have been deposited to your Sig Sauer™ Account

>its only ok when beretta or glock do underhanded shit to get contracts

>>64098560
How is that related to anything in the thread?

>>64098787
How does having requirements extra unused, not needed and counterproductive features for a military pistol trials relate to a thread about why the military chose x pistol and not why?
This is hard for you because you are stupid.

>>64098819
And we are going to pretend that optics and laser mount are useless for the army?
Stop baiting.

>>64098745
lol

Are you going to say that holding your flashlight at arms length away from you is a viable combat strategy since people shoot at the light?

>>64098763
To be fair "We do underhanded shit to get contracts and churn out cheap garbage" should be Sigger motto at this point

>>64098302
Beretta submitted the APX which is as modular as the 320, the m9a3 was a suggestion prior to the military considering the pistol trials to simply upgrade the m9 contract that they rejected for whatever reason

>>64098302
The M9A3 was offered before the M17 trials as an engineering change order to the existing contract. M9A3s were per-unit cheaper than the existing M9 order. Beretta said it would save the U.S. military hundreds of millions of dollars. But nope. General Miller and other kikes wanted to work for Sig Sauer after they got out.

>>64098407
>Army says they want modularity
>Army judges the contest
>Glock brings something they didn't want
>loses
>Glock and You: But we didn't think they want/need one of their requirements!
Are you stupid?

>>64098936
glocks were more reliable and accurate in the 12500 rounds fired in the trial

>>64098285 (OP)
DoD wanted striker fire, so they told Beretta to kick rocks. Sig offered their pistols for far less per unit cost than Glock and also could manufacture ammo for them saving more money. Basically, the DoD cheaped out and decided to pick something not battle proven so they deserve their shitty pistols.

>>64099027
This.

>>64098285 (OP)
I've always wanted a berretta. Opinionated pros and cons? I need to shoot one.

>>64098302
If the military said build this. I would build it and then make a better one. I wouldn't necessarily give them the better one. Mil contracts. So easy to get.

>>64098532
Are the APX line pretty good. I keep flip flopping on getting one of the compacts for conceal carry since I love my 92x and the APX seems pretty affordable

>>64098285 (OP)
lobbying

>>64099106
the APX carry has nothing to do with the full size APX. The full size ones are tanks of reliability, the carry one I think had some issues at first

>>64099091
It's my main pistol. I absolutely love it. Full steel, gorgeous, shoots awesome. No tilting motion during recoil so it's kinda flat shooting.

It's kinda big so if you have manlet hands, you might have issues. But you can solve that with extras (thin grips, extended mag releases, stuff like that).
Orig 92FS are pretty basic, i'd stay clear of them. The modern m9a1 and upwards are great tho.

Only legit issue is, mounting a red dot is a bitch and a half. The factory option sits kinda high. You might wish to look into a langdon tactical slide cut.

>>64098596
I didn't get the Brigadier is my gun going to break

>>64098560
Hahaha why would you say smth so controversial yet so true

>>64098504
>But can punch right through Ratnik armor at 900m.
The worst part is that it can't, not even at 10 meters.

>>64099209
No because the locking block has been improved and you aren’t shooting 9mm NATO without regular recoil/hammer spring replacements for 25-50k rounds. There is also the issue where an unknown amount of 9mm proof level loads (55k PSI) infected the U.S. military ammo supply which caused slides to snap in half. Thanks Winchester/Olins. All 92FS/M9 - the S stands for safety where they installed an enlarged hammer pin that will catch the rear half of the slide when it snaps.

>>64098383
Those worked fine for their original purpose (fast point defense fighther) but buyers like the West German air force used them for ground attack.

I did have the good fortune to watch several 104s simulate simultaneous ground attack during REFORGER but they were not really suited to that mission.

>>64098412
>Glock then said they would no longer pursue US military contracts

No need. They can sell plenty elsewhere.

>>64098845
Clearly you never trained with a pistol and off hand light. There are umpteen different ways to hold the flashlight including wrist over wrist. And every one of them places the light off center from your center of mass.
Given the modern-day adoption of plate forward square shooting even by those without a plate or a clue WHY the position was created, if you have a light on your pistol the odds are very high shooting directly at it will not only be a hit, but a high chest hit.
With the off hand light if you aim at the light the chances of a miss or non fatal hit are very high.
I feel like you have strong opinions and weak experiences.

>>64099328
How does this make you feel? Competition shooters training SOF, them using optics and lights on their guns while you bitch and moan on anonymous forums?

>>64099363
Ben's slower than a pre teen girl with a single action to put a round on the target from the holster. How does that make you feel?

>>64099412

>>64099474
Thats slow as shit. His sidearm is sticking way the fuck out on his belt. He is square to a target that will be shooting back. His accessory/magazine sidearm is sticking way out. He is in an unathletic and heel heavy position.
It takes .3 seconds for some people to draw and fire from the hip at the top levels.
Ben is not a combat shooter. He is a larp shooter. And it shows. If you want to copy him be my guest. One less retard in the way when shit goes south.
Ben would be hit before he fired the first shot
How well does a light and optic hold up to saltwater submission? How well does a 19x conceal up against your dick with an optics and light on it?
Me thinks you dont know shit all.

>>64099494

>>64099494
what the fuck is a combat shooter?

>>64099412
can you post a gun that you own

>>64099549
it's people who cannot perform unless it's COMBAT where they have slower times and group sizes versus fake shooters like competitive shooters but in COMBAT they will see red and outshoot competitive shooters because their technique is about COMBAT and not putting rounds on target faster

>>64098633
no retard I'm blasting the light at them to ID my target so I can clearly see the whites of the niggers eyes before I magdump him center mass

my light is to ID targets, it's attached to the end of my gun, if I'm pointing it at you it's because I decided to kill you. The light isn't going to "momentarily stun them" the 5.56x45 FMJ's I zip through them from the top of my stairs into my tile floor is going to permanently stun them into the afterlife

>>64099328
>bad guy shoots at my chest
>hits me square in the armor plate
>shoot him in the fucking T-zone since he cannot see anything but the SUN and I can see every pore on his sweating face

I hope he had m995 in his his rifle or a fucking deer gun otherwise I'm still standing up and he's dead.

>>64098302
>Require modularity
Why?
Who even gets to use the modularity of those under the contract?
I have a sneaking suspicion the millions of grunts carrying the thing will never even maintain it much.

>>64099594
You do not ID a target in sd/HD with the lightweight on your weapon you absolute retard. You will be pointing a loaded weapon at family members or innocent bystanders retard. Fuck you. You are a god damn moron. Enjoy prison and losing your children to social services.
>>64099608
You won't be shooting back at shit. You will be taking shots to the neck, arms face or high chest. Even with a miss your dipshit ass will be diving for cover before you even see the target. Thats what the light does. Let's them see you first.
Fucking absolute retards

>>64099594
To id the target with a pistol mounted light you have to point your weapon at it. You claim both if you point it its because you have already decided to kill it simultaneously you say the light is to id the target.
You are very stupid.
Its okay
You have a light on your weapon so you won't last long in the dark

>>64099091
M9s are my favorite pistols to shoot right up with a CZ SP01. Easy to shoot, reliable, decent aftermarket options without too many choices or subpar parts, optic mounting options aren't as good as most other pistols, Langdon cut slides are the best, but a Dlah Designs plate with suppressor height irons is a lot cheaper and works just as well. Factory mounts are too big, but the do work. Easy to suppress too. I've never known amy one who hated their M9. Service issued M9s were shit because the armorers never serviced properly.
If you have small hands get a 92x, you can swap out the straight grip panels with the traditional profile grip panels. I like the feel if the straight grips personally, but the traditional grips look better.

>>64098684
But I like red dots? Unless there’s a different fag with a .380.

>>64098363
You have no idea how fucking dumb people in the military are. It scares me that we give them loaded weapons but I guess we have to.

>>64098285 (OP)
Where was HK?

I feel like they could have just entered an old USP, only with a standard rail and won.

>>64098302
>>64098363
Does sig really pay people to post here? Put that money into making guns that don't suck.

>>64099786
If we picked the usp we would have won in the middle east.

>>64099786
>i like how the USP looks so it would have won

>>64099849
>i like how the USP looks so it would have won

>>64099849
Wouldn't be the first time, that's why they picked the beretta.

>>64099849
It's a brick that went through an autistic amount of torture testing and has a three decades long pedigree of just werking, babybrain.

>>64099786
>worse DA/SA trigger than the 92 by a long shot
>not modular or even accepts different backstraps
>not optic capable
>not made in the US
>paddle release

>>64099927
The USP did not, it's trials are less than what the M9 went through. The MK23 is the one that was tested to oblivion and they are not the same pistol.

>>64099936
>not modular or even accepts different backstraps
Babby hands.
>paddle release
It's better and everyone who disagrees is wrong.

>>64099936
>not modular
5 rupees deposited, saar!

>>64099936
>>64099944
paddle release is mid and you only stan it because its something only HK does. liking HK is not counter-culture or contrarian, its pure feels > reals, something that is becoming incredibly mainstream in this post-fact work.

>>64099786
Aren't they big as fuck?

>>64099972
It's a military pistol. People used to carry C96's.

>>64098610
>Sorry you got all your training from youtube fags.
>I got mine from the government.
Absolute peak hasserved humor, well done.

So why was "modularity" required? Who is swapping components out so much that it is a necessity?

>>64099966
>stan
Kill yourself.
>its something only HK does
I'm not an hk fanboy but nice try.
>the rest of your post
Sounds like you have a canned response. I don't give a shit about culture or counterculture. If it was popular you wouldn't say shit.

>>64098610
Can you link an incident where a bunch of future doctors mag dumped a house because they saw a light on inside? Or whatever the fuck you are talking about? It's gotta be pretty serious. Why do cops and military still have lights on their weapons don't they know it will get them kilt?

>>64100042
Why isn't it also a requirement for their rifles? Nobody even uses their sidearms but ever m4 has the same grip.

>>64100033
explain?

>>64100051
Cops and military work in groups. With other equipment. They don't just use pistol lights. Parachute flares, night vision and infrared, ir chem light, own the night.
You are alone. In your undies. With a fucking spotlight over your vital zone like a fucking retard. Huge fucking difference.
I can tell you from personal experience in my unit not only did we not use lights, we did everything in our power to eliminate all light at night.
Stop listening to people teaching you shooting stances, equipment choices and other shit that is based completely on situations that do not translate to your own.

>>64100102
Whatever we paid you was too much.

>>64100086
Government training is fucking awful in nearly every aspect and almost always outdone within the private sector. This includes firearms, which involved gems like "wait until you hear the reset before shooting again" and "never fuck with your rear sight." To present government weapons training as something to be proud of is, for those who have actually served, funny.

>>64100102
anon have you ever had an x300 shined directly at you? there is no "spotlight over your vital zone" there is a blinding starburst.

>>64100106
Im guessing you didn't pay taxes when I was in. Probably get more back than you pay in now. Couple little welfare checks some other guy pumped into your brown living situation partner.

>>64100102
Anon has never used a light at night. Not just a WML, but a light period. Chances of this being a shitposter are skyrocketing.

>>64100125
First you have to turn it on and aquire the target. Is it one or two? Its not a movie kid. You die in the end.

>>64100127
>when I was in
you are correct, I have paid taxes with the same frequency as you have been in the military
>never

>>64100127
>Im guessing you didn't pay taxes when I was in
Well you're wrong and the rest of this post is some weird gay fantasy which is what I expect from people like you. Just reinforcing my point.

>>64100125
NTA, but unless you've already spotted the person first, and your first light usage is to light him up, you absolutely ARE putting a spotlight over your chest.
In which case, how much is the light even helping you?

>It helps me identify the target!
You're already pointing your gun at the target though.

>No, it helps me see who the target is!
If you have any doubt in your mind as to who the target is, why are you pointing a gun at them?

>>64100156
>what is throw
post gun, now.

>>64100138
>temporarily flash 1000 lumen light
>all people within eyesight have lost their natural night-vision capabilities for ten seconds and need to either use their own lights or nightvision

>>64100160
Then you're not blinding the target tho

>>64100111
The first thing we did was zero our weapons. That requires manipulation of both the front and rear irons. Then again when issued an optic. Never heard the reset thing you said either. We spent countless hours shooting. Dry firing. Assembling and disassembling. Cleaning. Inspection. Confirming zero. Thousands and thousands of rounds. Familiarity with our issued firearms was paramount. It was complete muscle memory. You get tired of shooting. Im not sure where you get your information, or if you were in some non combat unit but our training was top notch. It was literally our job.

>>64100163
gun. now.

>>64100170
You first.
That's fair, right?

>>64098586
>$230 a unit goy (and total force retraining and new armories)
Beretta was going to give them the m9a3 for less than the per unit cost of the original m9 from the 80's, the price difference would have been nominal at most in direct cost and not have cost a multiple of the program in retraining and infrastructure. As the best case, if sig hadn't out the gate started killing servicemen. Rejecting new Berettas out of hand then not even doing half the trial before picking the hipoint of sigs is why everyone for years called this shit out as bribery.

>>64100166
>Never heard the reset thing you said either.
Yes, I'm sure you didn't lol.

>>64100163
Have you ever looked at a light in the dark or as you as unexperienced with lights as you are guns?

the big issue with nu/k/ is that you can never be sure if the fuddlore you're seeing spewed is being said ironically anymore

>>64100183
The only person who's vision and tactical advantage is compromised by a light is yours in this situation until you have acquired the target first you fucking retard. No, a light on your gun is not going to blind a guy lurking in your hallway while you are standing in your bedroom. It is however going to fucking light you up like a Christmas tree. Kill your night adapted eyes, and let him know where the tard is.

>>64100214
You have no lights, or guns.

>>64100214
>your vision, on the opposite end of the light, is what's getting destroyed
>not the intruder that only has to partially have the bezel pointed at his direction to lose is
u 'avin a laugh m8 or have you actually just never tried out wmls at night?

>>64100220
Feel free to post your polymer 9mm with Amazon red dot and flashlight. Or if you are short you probably went 10mm. No, 9mm. You love the coolaid

>>64100229
You pointing a light at a doorway in your room will not effect someone not in the room or doorway. You are stupid. Thats why this is hard for you.
Eyes need time to adapt to dark, and to light. You have just snapped on a very bright light in a room you can only be sure you are in.
Sell your guns. You are literally too stupid to have them.

>>64100230
Meds now pls thx.

>>64100237
>has never heard of light discipline or clearing methods
>feels knowledgeable enough to talk about it anyways
classic

>>64100138
>First you have to turn it on
All the bodycam I've seen the police already have the light on. Why in the fuck would they only do it after they find out where the idiot is?

>>64100156
>why are you pointing a gun at them?
It's not that big a deal.

Dunno why you guys are bothering at best he's just a (you) grabber and at worst he's a schizo living in his own fairyland of delusion

So why did they need to be modular?

>>64100238
>pristine condition
>take pics of its one and only range trip

>>64100170
I already took the pic, so I might as well post it anyway.
M9A3 with a WML.

WMLs are gay and so are you.

>>64100246
>>when I point my gun at someone I intend to kill them
>>I use my pistol light to positively identify my target
>>The intruder will be blind because i have my one billion lumen pistol light on them
>>have you never heard of light discipline
Lol.

>>64098363
But if they did that then how would the brass get their kickbacks?

>>64100279
anon...

>>64098302
And now they get to enjoy the worst sidearm in existence when they already had a good one that wasn’t known for killing the carrier

>2025
>people still don't understand WMLs
Disappointing but not exactly surprising these days

>>64100260
Huh?

>>64099328
presumably what this moron thinks, or some variation thereof.

Why did they need to be modular?

>>64100289
I GOT IT FOR THE IR MODE, OKAY?!

>>64100305
>my retinas are scorched from a miniature sun pointed right at me
>let me being out my own piece, somehow still accurately aim, and get some shots off without being dropped like the deer in the headlights I am
lel
lmao even

>>64100300
different gun
caught in 4k lmao

>>64100329
I think you might unironically be photosensitive

>>64100305
you suck ass shooting one handed stop pretending you are dick tracy

>>64100340
>anon said, smugly staring at 1000lumens until he no longer had functioning sight, declaring victory

>>64100345
im not trying to troll or be a dick
i think you are legitimately photosensitive

>>64100279
Where is the (you)?

>>64100340
This is the mental midget equivalent of saying someone is a hemophiliac because they bled when they got shot.

>>64100333
That's a bold strat famalama, but I commend you for taking it.

>>64100340
>>64100352
not him but my regular flashlight is 600L and if I flash it in my eyes it hurts like a motherfucker. a lot of wmls are way higher than that. you disingenuous nigger.
>>64100342
??? this guy just went on a tirade about how offhand lights>wmls, I draw the situation he describes and somehow I'M the retard shooting one-handed?

>>64100358
He's just Built Different(tm)

>>64100358
>>64100376
i mean maybe im the weird one, but i can shine my 1000 lumen surefire rifle light at myself in the mirror
its annoying and makes me squint a ton, but its not going to slow me down much in a life or death situation

>>64100352
>On full natural night visions
>600-1000 lumen light shines into your eyes
>This hurts and disorients
>Anon: "Have you considered the chance you're photosensitive?"

>>64100390
> i can shine my 1000 lumen surefire rifle light at myself in the mirror
Oh Jesus, how many times have you done this up now?

>>64100305
Wrist on wrist off hand light tends to force the weaver stance leaving the body bladed and the light lines up with the outside edge of the body, not center mass. You seem to have a tenuous grasp on what goes on in shootings.

Why did they need modular?

>>64100363
different ejection port cut
nice try and better luck next time

>>64098532
Bersa. TPR. 9.

>>64100401
couple of times
not for more than a few seconds
its really no big deal

>>64100404
Oh yeah you're actually right lol, first pic was when I had the first edition GI model before they came out with the updated, more period correct version I swapped it out for.

>>64100414
>couple of dozen times*

Why they need modular?

>>64100418
sure bro

Why need modular?

>>64100435
Not your bro, pal.

>>64100456
next time show your luger, not the $400 turk clone

>>64099091
I would say go with the Italian made line because I just got a 92gts and the staking for the extractor pin are atrocious. Apparently that's a common theme for those

Why modular?

Modular?

>>64100460
>show your luger
You're not the boss of me.
>$400 turk clone
$500*, super special period correct version.

>>64100305
Joggers tend to shoot low and left so that is actually increasing your likelyhood of getting blasted.

>>64100527
>$500
check out gun zone deals . com next time
they've got it for $412, no sales tax, and like $15 shipping
I was thinking of getting one, because it has no mim parts, unlile previous versions

>>64100394
He can see in the dark but also is unphased by lights.

>>64100544
>they've got it for $412
The 9mm version yeah, but that'd be pretty gay. Proper .45 is still at $480. Still an absolute steal.

>>64100557
https://gunzonedeals.com/product/tisas-1911a1-us-army-45acp-5-wwii-army-7rd

What kind of luger do you have?
I've got a really nice 1916 DWM i got from Simpsons ltd like 7 years ago

>>64100563
>https://gunzonedeals.com/product/tisas-1911a1-us-army-45acp-5-wwii-army-7rd
Oh it's one of those gay "add to cart" things lol. I got mine right when they came out, but for $500 I'm still not going to complain for what I got.
>What kind of luger do you have?
1939 byf I got for $800 from a Dallas gun store back in 2011.

>>64100572
pretty sick price, assuming its all good under the hood
I paid like $2k for mine
It's nicer than yours, but you got the much better deal imho

>>64100581
The late 30s productions definitely have lesser spit and shine, but the waffen stamps partially make that up for me. Shoots great, as lugers do, but I'm a C96 man to the core.

>>64100292
SF already fielded Glocks. Hell even normal combat units fielded them. Just buy an Glock. Still have a Glock 19, sold offy p365, thinking of just getting a 43x. It's just so simple and good.

>>64098402
Who would win?
>entire US Military
vs
>hordes of civilians wielding uncountable numbers of daggers and psa ar15s

>>64098285 (OP)

>>64099972
4 U

>>64100594
>beer
>shitting pills
>cheap poloroid
>worcester sauce
>pile of empty almart bags
>luger and broomhandle
that's one of the most /k/ pics I've seen in a while lol

So why did the gun need to be "modular" for the contract?

Am I going crazy or is the modular thing its own fucking psyop itself that no one will acknowledge? It keeps being brought up when people ask why Sig won the contract.
What the fuck is it that was so important?

>>64098532
I had one of these, this abortion made the snig blowing peoples balls off acceptable. This gun is worse than a even a taurus, the only thing it does "well" is be drop safe.

>>64101216
The newer version is better.
I also got it for $220 after taxes, with a rebate
At that price, it's hard to complain about.

>>64101227
So 220 I can't argue with, its safe and goes bang at a good price, but to me it's worse than many of it's contemporaries and it feels like some last second beretta bargain bin special.

>>64098285 (OP)
>>64098294
SAMEFAG
A
M
E
F
A
G
Why does the Anti-Sig schizo(s) keep making so many threads?
And when will he(she) quit?

>>64098285 (OP)
Is there really a need for sidearms in the military outside of symbolism?

>>64098302
what the army wanted was fucking stupid. i think the other companies were just surprised that they actually cared about that retarded shit

>>64098302
Only modularity you could ever need for a modern military side arm is an optic cut, threaded barrel and accessory rail. Other than that? *dismissive jerking off motion*

>>64098285 (OP)
The tests showed glock was better, but P320 was vastly cheaper than both the glock or 92 (kwab).

>>64101351
Basically for non-combatants and guards on base just so they have SOMETHING other than their limp dick and a flashlight.

>>64100418
Fellow Mauser 1912 enjoyer. Mine needs a replacement recoil spring, cannot feed the first round in a fully loaded mag for shit.

>>64098285 (OP)
Is it normal to see all of the machining lines on the top of a basic 92FS slide, like it's a low polygon model?

>>64098285 (OP)
Sexy ass handgun my goodness, everytime I bring it out to show friends they always compliment it and are surprised its not just another Glock

>>64099786
Not made in US so automatically disqualified. Also HK contracts are notoriously expensive and they are sue happy in European gun contract contests

>>64101388
I fucked up, it’s a Mauser 1914, I always think of it as Mauser 1912/14 and it fucks me up. I swear I’m not retarded.

>>64101362
Cheaper in many ways it seems.

I'm gonna trust the green beret guy I did pistol training with who was a glockfag and said you can pay him a million dollars a minute and he'd never buy an m9. I hated them too. 320s have a lot of quality issues too. Like the safety doesn't work

>>64100611
You can always spot Glock’s marketing team because they can’t help but shit on the P365.

>>64101336

>>64101450
This. I don't get it, the 365 is higher cap and easier to conceal. who in their right might would want a fatter, lower cap carry piece?

glockers are gay but siggers are somehow even gayer and more retarded

anyway carry that fuddy five it's all ya need sonny

>>64100166
I was in seal team Six and we used lights on our guns, killed alot of terrorists by blinding them with our lights actually

>>64101216
nah, you never owned one considering both the toblerone and the A1 version are extremely reliable. People who own them have only positive things to say about it.

>>64101848
I have shot an APX all of once and I didn't like it at all
The PDP, or hell, Glocks feel more comfortable

>>64102027
that's a valid argument because comfort is subjective. I was talking about its reliability.

>>64100166
You were never in the military lmfao

>>64102260
You are a pedophile

>>64098285 (OP)
Go and read the RFP, note what the mandatory requirements were.

https://sam.gov/opp/4d021209938939195ef9b9d7b02ef4d6/view

>>64101336
We are many we are one

>>64098285 (OP)
Seems they didn't consult the graphs

>>64098302
They were all modular dummy. Just that the p320 was $180 a pop, they army swept the reliability issues under the rug. It jams on fucking ball ammo. And when they fixed it it started jamming more on hollowpoints after. What a fucking clown show

>>64098586
No but there were several US military employees that worked for sig soon after, and I'm not just talking about Scott Miller. You have Bobby Cox too

>>64100102
Military and police situations don't apply to.civilian. You minimized light to avoid being arty'd you dumb fuck. Fuck load of help your guns would be then. Good thing civilians don't have to worry about that at all. Fuck off meal team 6

>>64100156
You don't need to hold a gun in front of your chest. I can detect a target but that doesn't mean I can see him well enough to shoot him. It's called positive ID, just knowing there's a person in front isn't enough

>>64104488
You going to hold it out to the fucking side and flag the 2 year old having a nightmare gangster style instead?

>>64099412
Post your times before you talk shit about others. You won't, goodbye

>>64098597
Kino pic, really makes me want a P08

>>64099697
Fuck off jackals, if my gun is out then my life is in danger. If my life is in danger I WILL point my fucking gun ay anything that moves. The only purpose in a wml is to know whether to shoot or take the gun off target when that happens

>>64104500
But of course my melanated friend. If my guns out its for good reason. Anything goes cocksucker

>>64104512
He won't even post a gun lmao

>>64104512
The only time that matters is the time from unaware contact/incident to time the first shot is fired. Ben has yet to post one of those. So he is irrelevant.

>>64101434
He should try brand new berettas and make his judgment. Can't judge a gun when it's a clapped out army issue

>>64104544
>>I have no problem pointing a gun at my own children, family ect in an stressful situation
Seems like you are the brown here

>>64104559
You've yet to post yours so you are also irrelevant.

>>64098382
>their requirements are "dumb" and provide a product that ignores them
that's how the Gewehr 43 came about

>>64104567
How do I know they are friends or family? Not until the wml comes on. I don't need to worry about pointing guns at them if they are friendly. Because I am not brown enough to shoot them despite it. Your concern of such indicates you know you would, my swarthy Sambo shithead

>>64104568
Constantly. 7 Ben will immediately start whining about how its irrelevant because fast draw doesn't win stages. And that is why Ben is irrelevant in sd/hd and mil/police conversations.

>>64104580
Only a tard ids things with his weapon pointed at them. And you are a tard. Buy a flashlight. Backlight your entrance and stairs. Grow the fuck up dipshit.

>>64104601
.7

>>64104580
>>never point a loaded gun at anything you dont intend to shoot but also I point my pistol at my family during a break in because I'm to niggerish to prepare for such an eventuality in any way to keep them safe so I'll just shoot one instead and then get assraped in prison because I'm a manlet.
Good luck with that anon

>>64104601
I mean it doesn’t, taking the extra time to get a good grip on the gun does. Bob Vogel (PBUH) would take extra time getting a good grip.

I did a .8 from concealment like two weeks ago

>>64104626
.8 from concealment is good. I only train iwb.
It makes all the difference in the world in a real life situation.

>>64104626
You dont win by hitting more in a fight. You win by hitting first, hitting hardest and in the right spot.

>>64104613
>>64104623
post guns

Even for /k/ there is a shocking amount of posts in this thread that are clearly people who have never touched a gun in their lives acting like they're pros.

>>64098302
I'll add another (you). The "modularity" in question was literally just the ability to change out the backstraps. Retards keep thinking it meant an FCU and exchangeable grips. The army is not that forward thinking, they are a bunch of backwards idiots themselves

>>64104692
buddy there's a lot of posters in here who clearly haven't used fucking LIGHTS since they don't even know what throw is, let along guns

>>64104641
Yeah but you’re talking about fights and Ben is talking about shooting stages where there’s a dozen targets

Drawing as fast as you can and completely bobbling the grip and throwing the gun on that floor isn’t going to win a fight.

>>64101703
I'd prefer a pistol that didn't have a striker unit that disintegrates itself after a couple hundred rounds

>>64104744
Exactly. Bens sport experience is not transferable to real life situations. Yet he sure does try to equate the stress of competition to being shot at.

>>64104823
Ben’s field is all about moving and shooting, shooting fast. Maybe you can learn something from it.

>>64098565
Probably tons of LEO snatching them up after ditching the P320. Possibly some mil contracts, who knows on that front. Stuff happens in the background before we know about it and you can kinda see it happening beforehand, like Glock discontinuing the G17 MOS in favor of the G47 being it's replacement signals they are moving in a more modular direction

>>64104704
>>I point my firearm at innocent people and children while in stressful situations then try to claim I'm actually not hoping there are no law enforcement officers here who know that my billshit is legalize for i can do it because I say I'm not actually doing it.

>>64104834
Even a broken clock is right a couple times a day. Bens correct on target focus not front post. Stance, draw, gear, pretty much everything else ben is out of his element when it comes to real world situations.

>>64101848
I post my own gun, then tell me I've never owned one

Is this nigger telling me a flashlight attached to your pistol is a bad idea?
"Here lemme just find this lightswitch real quick before I shoot your home invading ass with my 9 in my own bedroom"
No you wanna be blind as a duck because some dude said you might accidentally shoot you own dog or something.

>>64104847
>I'll just not see what I'm potentially about to shoot and just shoot
Retard, post guns now.

>>64098285 (OP)
M9A3
>The only offering with the correct barrel length for 9x19.
Obviously it was too effective.

>>64104935
nta, but a timestamp has always been the minimum of evidence to be believed on /k/

>>64104500
what was this anons alternative. just shoot his own child and find out later it was his child, after he finally turns a light on?

>>64099412
Oh ok you’re just a seething troon, got it.

>>64099494
Imagine being this desperate for attention kek

>>64107777
In Nogunz Land, lights only shine a narrow neam necessitating you to always need to point your muzzle directly at what you need to see AND guns go off as soon as they detect a living target in front of them. Things like trigger discipline, control and light throw do not exist, so WMLs are useless there.

>>64100045
lol the Hk simp is absolutely seething

>>64098285 (OP)
The spaghetti gat looks best so pick that one.

>>64107813
Muzzle discipline trumps trigger discipline. Responsible adults look for the flaws in systems and find reasonable alternatives. Pointing a gun light at a family member is not something a good person is willing to do. Setting up lighting in hallways, stairways and outside of doors to backlight anyone traveling is. Handheld lights, motion lights, and interior/exterior monitor systems that go directly to your phone have all made sitting around in the dark and snapping on a light like a pistol light like a low IQ poor obsolete. Same for flood lights, night vision cameras, and many, many other systems. When pistol lights were first adopted we understood the issues but they were an advancement. Now technology is cheap and available that has made pistol lighs not only obsolete, but have rendered them more dangerous than benefit in home defense.
If you are going around teaching new gun owners they need a light on their pistol instead of teaching them how to put them at an advantage over an intruder at every step you are very, very wrong.

>>64109130
Post your guns anon, this is getting tiresome.

>>64109146
No. Post a valid opinion that isn't a parroted response.

>>64109146
Its just stupid to use a pistol light in home defense.
>>I'll blind them
You will be flagging loved ones potentially
>>I'll search with the flood
Then they aren't "blinded" no that they would be to begin with, and you are exposed to be shot
>>you just dont understand how lights work
No YOU don't understand that lights on pistols in home defense is fucking retarded. They are better for a home invasion. Makes me think you are a nigger. Post brown hands.

>>64098285 (OP)
>Glock better
tourist...

>>64109428
it is when compared to P320

holy fuck this guy is still going on a day later
just say you got burned by an olight or something

>>64098285 (OP)
Because it's a better gun?

>>64109490
very brave of you to parrot all the memes you saw on discord.

>>64098285 (OP)
Sig bribed better than Glock or Beretta.

>>64109411
>>64109378
Why are you here when you don't own guns?

>every person lives with someone else
>every person has the means to directly alter the lighting and switching of their domicile so that every single room is optimized for on-approach light operation from your bedroom
>you should just hope for the best and stay put and/or shoot blindly into the dark rather than risk muzzle flagging someone you don't want to
you noguns faggots can tongue my anus

>>64109685
Civilian self defense is avoid contact, break contact. But But, no fuck you just turn on a fucking light switch. But I'm in bed. Fuck you buy a flashlight. But muh two hands, muh quicker acquisition.
Its a felony to point a firearm at a non threat as a civilian. Full stop.
Advocating for a weapon light in home self defense is beyond stupid and shows a lack of maturity and education that is very telling.

>>64109832
don't read, words from a noguns mean nothing.

>>64109411
>wmls expose you to being shot by revealing your position
>they are better for a home intruder
????

>>64109832
Full stop I’m killing anything that’s not me in my domicile

I don’t have a WML for identification, I have a WML so I can see what’s left

>>64109832
>Civilian self defense is avoid contact, break contact.
I'm not hiding away in my own home you flaming fucking faggot.

>>64098586
>>64098302
>There is absolutely no evidence of any bribery
How much is Sig paying you to do damage control lmao

>>64110068
>posts no proof of bribery

no patrick, feels are not proof.

neither are vibes.

>>64109832
lmao you type like a redditor

>>64109832
You are an actual woman, I hope you know that.

>>64107810
Imagine falling for it this bad lmao

VP9 would have been the kino choice

>>64098414
Has the M&P ever managed to get a contract for the M part of that name?

>>64109685
using a separate flashlight held away from center mass makes you less likely to get shot tho
>bbbbut i cant shoot my glock one handed!
glock problems buy a better pistol lol

>>64109832
>Advocating for a weapon light in home self defense is beyond stupid
lmoa who has gotten charged for using a weapon light to id a threat in their home?

>>64098302
What the army wanted was stupid

if everyone is so angry at sig for not being drop safe why is everyone ok with 1911s and 2011s?

>>64110983
Outside the US. Frankly, I don't know why murica doesn't give it a shot except name brand power