From a tactical and weapons stand point, how did the ATF get fucked up so badly by a bunch of Christ cucks cultists? How did it go so wrong?

>>64101002 (OP)
because everyone involved was retarded

>>64101004
Explain.

>>64101002 (OP)
Because police work usually involves not trying to kill everyone, and back in the 90s was before all the tools and tactics for doing that against someone actively shooting back wasn't developed. Once they gave up on that notion, shit went downhill real fast.

>>64101007
>Needing directions from the local mailman who later tips off the cult
>Making an operation that goes as poorly as Operation Showtime did

>>64101014
>actively shooting back
ATF shot first, Branch Davidians defended themselves.

>>64101018
Yes, and?

Unchecked institutional arrogance. The ATF is pretty chill nowadays, but that's only because they got so embarrassed at ruby ridge and Waco that they still haven't really recovered. Good thing too, if they hadn't been outed as incompetent jackboots on live TV and had instead been emboldened; then the gun scene would look very different today. GWOT probably had an effect too, your average ATF employee nowadays is either a GWOT vet or a DMV Shaniqua, while in the 90s is was all insecure small-town cop types who never served but wish they had.

>>64101002 (OP)
TFD
David Koresh did nothing wrong.

>>64101022
So they did nothing wrong and the ATF had no intention of doing things non lethal, they went there intending to murder all those people.

>>64101024
>The ATF is pretty chill nowadays
Tell that to the guy in prison for making videos about the Auto Key Card

>>64101007
Branch Davidians were retarded SDA cultists who could not into proper bunker ventilation. Alphabet agents were retarded jocks looking to justify thier bloated budgets and managed to fuck up in every way possible. Everyone involved should be ashamed of their actions and commit sodoku (I'd say start with Janet Reno and David Koresh, but they're slowly turning into worm shit as I type this.)

>>64101027
Yeah, sure, and that's why they spent 50 days sticking their thumbs up their asses first. I said nothing about them doing anything wrong, I said that door-kicking fucking sucks, especially without pepperball.

>>64101044
The ATF went to murder those goddamn people and did. You're a satantic ZOG cuck if you say otherwise.

>>64101049
Nigger you didn't even read my first post, did you? Go be a nigger somewhere else.

>>64101054
Yes you're making excuses for them basically.

>>64101057
Oh, no, I dared to suggest that the ATF is criminally incompetent, retarded their way into a situation they weren't in a position to resolve, and threw up their hands and flipped the table. How fucking subversive of me.

>>64101065
You dared to imply that had non lethal options existed then they would used them which is preposterous and shows your true intentions here.

>>64101070
Argue with your facts, not your feelings.

>>64101076
I just did.

>>64101038
the sheer amount of explosive gas would have went up in an open area.

Vernon was running a safehouse for human trafficking victims and had clintons victims there in the past.

>>64101002 (OP)
How bad did they fuck up? A bunch of innocent people are dead when all they had to do was arrest the guy when he was in town by himself. They fucked up catastrophically.

>>64101077
Oh, no, it's retarded.

>this thread
>again

>>64101002 (OP)
>>64101018
Shooting and killing cultist retards is based

>>64101027
Based

>>64101049
All cults and cultists deserve their own WACO

>>64101100
I bet you think raping kids is based too.

>>64101115
Koresh sure did.

>>64101115
The cultists at WACO sure did, cults generally think raping kids is a-okay, and I'm not a cultist of any kind
Cults are also big on other forms of child abuse

>>64101124
>>64101117
glownigger claws clacked this out

>>64101127
>Y-you rape kids!!!
No I don't, but cults do
>G-glownigger!!!!!
Seethe you bitch, kill all cultists

Imagine how the vatniks need to dig 30+ years back to found something to make the west look bad. Tell Putin nobody fell for your samefagging thread.

>>64101100
>>64101104
>>64101115
This is extremely antisemitic

>>64101117
>>64101124
>>64101134
There is zero actual evidence Koreah raped any kids. All that shit came out after when the government was desperate to make themselves not look like the monsters they were for burning a bunch of men, women and children alive.

>>64101147
>Imagine how the vatniks need to dig 30+ years back to found something to make the west look bad.
Corner the Dorner?

>>64101147
Shut the fuck up, tourist scum. This is what /k/ used to be like.

>>64101002 (OP)
They treated a serious situation like a photo op and underestimated resistance.

>>64101162
Except no one would have been defending the feds

>>64101155
>All that shit came out after when the government was desperate to make themselves not look like the monsters they were for burning a bunch of men, women and children alive.
Also worth noting that they didn't admit that they used incendiary grenades on the kerosene soaked wooden structures until the grenade casings with intact serial numbers were traced back to the US government.

>>64101155
>Zero evidence
>Except all the statements victims of child abuse and child rape
Bet you solve this cognitive dissonance by claiming it's fed brainwashing or planted memories lmao
You already conveniently claimed there's "zero actual evidence" when such evidence does exist and is not some nefarious fed plot
In any case killing retarded cultists is based and I hope it would happen more often, it's a shame that they don't commit mass suicides more often

>>64101166
Then overreacted because they lost face.
Then destroyed and "lost" a bunch of evidence.

>>64101170
Then sauce it.

>>64101169
Didn't the front door also mysteriously get misplaced during the trial? The one that could have provided evidence on who shot first?

>>64101170
>t. Girl he had a crush on wouldn't easily fuck his degenerate ass because she was based and religious so know he seethes against all ebil "cults"

>>64101176
It disappeared after being logged in and stored in secure federal storage.

>>64101170
>Except all the statements victims of child abuse and child rape
Physical evidence is important when the witness is in the custody of the government that just killed everyone the kid might know.
>>64101176
>Didn't the front door also mysteriously get misplaced during the trial? The one that could have provided evidence on who shot first?
Not who shot first, but the volume of fire directed at the same door they were ordering people to walk through. It was a metal door so the direction the metal was pointing would illustrate who was doing the most shooting. Both sides claimed the other side did most of the shooting. Oddly, it magically disappeared when it was needed as evidence.

>>64101174
https://www.nytimes.com/1993/05/04/us/growing-up-under-koresh-cult-children-tell-of-abuses.html

You could have just googled "Koresh cult child abuse", but then again, you already have your established view that they didn't abuse kids and certainly didn't rape them, and every piece of information that runs contrary to that is handwaved away as feds lying, feds planting evidence or feds brainwashing victims
And even if the feds did all that evil shit, they still killed a bunch of fucked up retard cultists, which is always based

>>64101192
>NYTimes
>paywall
>Allegations come out AFTER siege
You reek of leftism.

>>64101155
>the plan was to kill everyone all along
>which is why they walked in far under-strength, got into a standoff, turned it into a media circus, and then tried to make shit up to deflect from it
Please, explain your logic in detail, because you're on levels of schizophrenia that mere mortals struggle to keep up with.

>>64101180
I just hate child abusers and child rapists, what's so hard to understand? Why do you defend pedos on the internet?

>>64101200
>the plan was to kill everyone all along
I never said that, asshole.
I assume the Feds thought they were going to surrender or only put up token resistance.

>>64101124
Anybody who hurts kids belongs in a WOOD CHIPPER

Funny how many anti gov types end up outed as CHILD PREDATORS isn’t it.

How many militia groups and Russian sympathizers have gotten outed as the worst evil imaginable, child sex offenders…… almost makes you think the government isn’t as “evil” as the people against it.

>>64101002 (OP)
GMS! and shalom
>>64101007
>tell the mail man you are going to go in like cowboys
>get recked

>>64101204
Well, my bad then, you were otherwise indistinguishable from the prior anon.

>>64101201
Because I don't think the evidence supports that they were.
I notice that often people who are so virulently vocal about hating "pedos" end up to be them themselves, trying to divert blame and struggling with their guilty conscience.

>>64101209
>Russian sympathizers
Paid shill, pls go

>>64101192
>And even if the feds did all that evil shit, they still killed a bunch of fucked up retard cultists, which is always based
That sounds... boomery.
As a reminder, the guy who rydered the Oklahoma city building in response to these military attacks on citizens was gen x. And he got the fastest execution that wasn't also called a lynching. The older generation wants to pretend murder is justified blah blah

>>64101199
Kek, I expected as much
There won't be any piece of evidence that will change your worldview, because every piece of evidence that contraficts your worldview is disregarded
You're deep in cognitive dissonance and you solve this dissonance with confirmation bias
By the way, how the fuck do you think that the investigators can get evidence of the crime as it is happening from a fucking insular cult of child fuckers? Do you actually think that the feds have clairvoyance capabilities or something? Are you a fucking moron?

>>64101225
>There won't be any piece of evidence that will change your worldview
Since I'm not clicking on a paywall either, what was the PHYSICAL evidence of kiddy rape?

>>64101024
>The atf is pretty chill nowadays
tell that to brian malinowski who was murdered by the atf inside his house in the middle of the night despite him working in an airport all day, where they could have easily arrested him without any trouble.

>>64101209
>Anybody who hurts kids belongs in a WOOD CHIPPER
Good thing the ATF didn't kill any children during the raid.

>>64101233
I'm not gonna engage in this retarded dance:
>PROOFS??? MORE PROOFS???? YEAH BUT WHAT ABOUT ALL THE EXTRA PROOFS??
Nothing will satisfy you, so you crowing for all kinds of proof against this particular cult is a dishonest discussion tactic

>>64101214
>Because I don't think the evidence supports that they were.
That's just it, you have a view that they didn't rape kids, so all the evidence and victim statements against them must be either fabrications or so weak that they can be disregarded

>>64101248
So you’re blaming the ATF for the cult members setting fire to their own compound, so their child victims couldn’t testify to the abuse they suffered? Not a good look.

>>64101249
>dishonest discussion tactic
A good example of a dishonest discussion tactic is to use the testimony of a terrified child and have no physical evidence to back it up.
>>64101268
>the cult members setting fire to their own compound
Using the incendiary grenades that were traced to the government and not to the cultists?

>>64101268
I'm saying that if your object is to protect the children, realizing the apocalyptic cult's prophecies of a government army coming to wage Satanic war against their dollar store Jesus is the completely wrong approach.

>>64101002 (OP)
>annual ATF sockpuppet Fed thread cope post

>>64101282
>Satanic War Against Dollar Store Jesus
New song title

>>64101294
Jesus built my car
It's a love affair
Mainly Jesus and my hot rod
Yeah, fuck it

>>64101002 (OP)
Ignoring the bunk reasons to be there at all, because no one in the DoJ thought to arrest the guy who routinely goes jogging around the area.

>>64101209
Ukraine is the number 1 exporter of cp in the world.

>>64101540
And Russia is #1 location for so called bulletproof hosts (hosters that don't care that you're peddling CP) and also shared #1 exporter of CP

>>64101275
>good example of a dishonest discussion tactic is to use the testimony of a terrified child
lol, of course you'll just deny, drny, deny because your pet cultists retards just simply coulf not have raped kids

>>64101038
>turning into worm shit

Your are edgy and a moron

>>64101282
>We should coddle insane retards and respect their fantasies!

>>64101540
Any CSM traced back to Ukraine invariably is due to Russian bad actors. But you know this, Sergei. Did you think you could demoralize someone this time?

>>64101287
>everyone who makes fun of my conspiratard fantasies is a fed
The fact of the matter is that the colt members burned their own compound to avoid accountability for their crimes, including crimes against children. Sorry everyone has to see you “muh Waco” guys defending kiddie diddlers.

>>64101002 (OP)
Back to /pol/ Rajesh

>>64101002 (OP)
A bunch of retarded cultists died.
What's the problem?

>>64101268
This has to be b8.

>>64101573
All the evidence says otherwise. Keep licking that boot though.

>>64101592
>I confronted something that doesn't validate my hugbox views?
>Must be b8
You're defending kiddie diddling cultists

>>64101002 (OP)

They weren't expecting the Branch Davidians to actually shoot back and ignored all the advice from the local police who had direct experience dealing with Koresh and his followers.

>>64101249
>extrajudicial killing is cool
I'm so glad you are not American.
>InB4 "I am!"
No. You are not. Even if you live here.

>>64101594
Ah, yes, the CS/smoke grenades fired four hours earlier at a different fucking building. Such compelling evidence.

>>64101597
No. You are just so bad at lying at ignoring actual facts that I refuse to believe that is your objective stance. You are just trolling or bumping the thread.

>>64101024
>ruby ridge

Wasn't that the US Marshals though?

>>64101601
Shame more feds weren't killed. Or horribly disfigured and paralyzed for life.

>>64101602
Yes, extrajudicial killing is very cool when it targets insane cultists

>>64101607
Hilarious how you claim that I ignore "actual facts" when you and other autistic faggots ITT defending these cultists ignore everything that contradicts you

>>64101616
And their children too bruh!!! So based senpai. Makes me want to join the Feds and Army and die for Israel protecting this LGBT multicultural country! And I say all this as a young cool white guy! So please fellow white guys, pay attention to how I feel so you can also see this thought process as normal

>>64101611
Originally. FBI was responsible for the murders.
Never forgive Troy Industries for hiring Lon Horiuchi's partner/defender.

>>64101619
The evidence the Clinton government manufactured to cover their own asses?

>>64101628
>all the evidence says the feds did it
>except the evidence that says otherwise, that's fake

>>64101628
Yes, how convenient, everything that you don't like is manufactured and planted by Clinton crime family, the feds and evil libshits

>>64101623
Defect to Russia and die on drone cam, you massive faggot

>>64101624

No, I mean the initial shootout that triggered the siege was between Randy Weaver's family and a couple of US Marshals who were staking out the place. The FBI was brought in later and Horiuchi had a Nanking moment and blasted a Vicki Weaver. ATF's involvement in the siege was minimal.

>>64101002 (OP)
Turns out when you have one group of people, who are essentially competent with guns, shooting at another group of people who are competent with guns, the group who is in the large compound has the advantage over those who are running around outside without cover or concealment for the most part. That's the reason they decided to just burn the place down. It was either that or make a coordinated breach and get their shit pushed in even further as they enter a funnel of death.

>please hate the thing i hate
i dont really care
>ZOG THIS ZOG THAT
Every single time.

>>64101771
>you have been deceived and lied to
>I don't believe you
>FUCK YOU YOU'RE ONE OF (((THEM)))!!!!!
Never gets old.

>>64101134
You love Jews.

Operationally they completely shit the bed. Their plant was found out. Their operation was exposed before they arrived on target. Their infil was a retarded plan to cram a bunch of fat feds in a stock trailer and hope they didn’t find it suspicious. Then they proceeded to send a team around the back to shoot their dogs which imo created the confusion that kicked the whole thing off in the first place because the retards on white side assumed that the shots were coming from the front. Then they found themselves dealing with dozens of barricaded, well armed, religious zealots that were ready to die for their beliefs. Then they spent the entire siege escalating tensions after their initial assault was repelled. I honestly believe if they had just sent a couple feds to the front door and served a warrant for his arrest Koresh would have gone willingly and the whole thing would have been avoided.

>>64101155
I mean he objectively married an underage girl when he was in like his late twenties.

But yeah all the other stuff was purely accusations.

>>64101170
You don't need a conspiracy to point out people lie to hurt those they don't like anon. Simple accusations and testimonials wouldn't hold up in court especially when CPS had already investigated these claims and could substantiate them.

But hey thank God the government killed all those children that were allegedly abused.

>>64101540
what parts of ukraine anon?
OOF, it's the parts that had the most people who identified as "russian"
russians in ukraine are like a festering cancerous globule in basically every kind of statistical map you can look at, it looks like this smeared ring of shit across it's east when it comes to AIDS infections too.

seems almost like the ukranians weren't moderate enough and they should have actually slaughtered or expelled all of these vermin like russia claims they did.

>>64101557
>not shooting people on sight is "coddling" them

>>64102711
It is when they're cultist scum

>>64101650
The ATF initiated the chain of events by accusing Randy Weaver of not paying a $5 tax. ATF agents wanted to recon the Weaver homestead and asked for Marshall support and the USMS either didn't second guess the ATF logic or rationale. At any rate they sent agents to assist. These agents, along with the ATF, were immediately made by the family dog, which they machine gunned. A friend of the Weaver family, Mr Harris, returned fire and killed a Marshall. The Marshalls then machine gunned Weaver's adolescent son, then fled. It was after this that HRT was dispatched, and they promptly shot Weaver's wife in the head while she was holding a baby. Again, this was all over a (false) allegation of an unpaid tax.

None of the other agencies learned moral lessons from RR or Waco, but they did learn that the ATF will leave you holding the bag. Other fed LE regard the ATF as a liability because of these incidents.

>>64101004
Fpbp

>>64101635
>Yes, how convenient, everything that you don't like is manufactured and planted by Clinton crime family, the feds and evil libshits
https://www.congress.gov/committee-report/104th-congress/house-report/749/1?outputFormat=pdf

No, the feds objectively did a bunch of retarded shit that led to needless deaths. The ATF raid should never have been authorized in the first place. Janet Reno should never have authorized the ending of the siege which resulted in the fire but did because the administration wanted the embarrassment to end. The whole "David Koresh fucked kids" narrative was cooked up by the same feds to cover their asses with sensationalist stories for retards like you to be distracted with. The objective findings? Gross incompetence bordering on malice from the top to the bottom. The fact you think this behavior is acceptable because of the people who died is a direct indicator this country is a failed experiment in self government.

>>64101002 (OP)
A combination of the ATF being stupid, cops not wanting to kill kids, and Branch Davidians being suicidal.

Logically, the ATF should have just waited the siege out, grabbing the cultists as they came out to get food. Initially, this is what they did until some politician took charge and demanded that the ATF act immediately.

So the ATF attacked and the cultists used kids as human shields. The ATF balked and pulled back. Next, the ATF rolled up with an armored vehicle and piped in tear gas and the Branch Davidians didn't have a good response to that.

This is where shit gets confusing because the next thing you know the building catches fire. We're pretty sure it wasn't the cops since tear gas doesn't burn and they were already winning. It was probably Koresh since "Death before Capture" is very cultish but none of the survivors could tell us what happened.

tl;dr ATF was stupid for picking a fight with cultists and the Branch Davidians were crazy people that burned themselves to death rather than surrender.

>>64103526
>On /k/
>Not blaming the ATF for every minute detail of a complex situation

good luck with that

>>64103526
>piped in tear gas
>tear gas doesn't burn
They used grenades that reach over 600°F

>>64103570
Are you saying that tear gas sets people on fire?

>>64103551
>>64103570
see?

>>64103576
No, he's referring to the 4 grenades they borrowed from the NG that used solidified CS and burned it to disperse instead of the aresolized form that ATF carried, and proceeded to shoot at a different fucking building than the one that burned.

>>64103576
I am saying that a metal canister that exceeds 600°F will ignite many things expected to be found in a habitable domicile that is likely to land on.
>Technical literature on the burning temperature of the U.S. or other western CS grenades is sparse. The 1966 Edgewood Study helpfully asserts that U.S. grenades burn at 300 to 800° C, which is truly a wide range of results. The scientists who wrote the study replicated the contents of various CS grenades and did a significant number of test burns, with temperatures in the 500s and 600s as common results. The highest was 793° C and the lowest was 493° C.
-bellingcat
You think that won't ignite laundry, furniture, curtains, carpet?

>>64101002 (OP)
https://gematriaeffect.news/the-jesuit-order-connecting-waco-oklahoma-city-bombing-9-11-2001/
https://gematriaeffect.news/the-waco-siege-on-the-87th-day-of-the-masonic-lodges-age-april-19-1993/
https://gematriaeffect.news/waco-siege-february-28-1993-baylor-bears-going-28-2-for-2021-hoops-season/
https://gematriaeffect.news/6-shot-in-dallas-forth-worth-shooting-april-9-2021-4-days-after-baylor-won-championship-in-waco-tribute/

>>64101004
that's true but really we can expect better from the government even if that's never been the case at any point

>>64103526
>>64103551
>>64103585
At the risk of strawmanning, it sounds like your argument is that Federal law enforcement ahould not be held accountable for their mistakes.
That they shouldn't be held to higher standard than a bunch of crazy, retarded, pedo cultists.

>This many faggots defending the ATF
>In a fucking WACO THREAD, no less

Ukraine war truly killed this board.

Nobody seems to mention that the BATFE and the FBI psychologically tortured the Branch Davidians by blasting defeaning sounds and shining floodlights at the house full of women and children.
Do any of the BATFE defenders have an excuse for this?

>>64103721
https://desuarchive.org/k/thread/50439134/#50439134
lol
lmao

>>64103754
Well, you know, they simply HAD TO reduce their morale. If they hadn't done that they may have put up even more of a fight than to the death.

>>64103754
Unironically a good-faith attempt to resolve the situation peacefully, hamstrung by the operational decision to use escalate to deescalate tactics against a hive of schizos.

>>64103807
So the intention is to rescue the women and children inside, so they torture them mentally.
Which still doesn't get them to come out and makes them want to stay inside even more.

>>64103829
If you trace the timelines of the history, it wasn't, actually. The BATFE had their budget on the congressional chopping block, a prime target, and a famously corrupt Clinton-tier AG (Janet Reno) backing them. The schizo worship of the Branch Davidians is silly, but let's not pretend this wasn't pure authoritarian corruption brutalizing common Americans out of sadism and ego.

>>64103850
Close. Yeah, they wanted a big billy badass bust, so they walked up to a pile of proto-/pol/acks, started with the show of force, and when that went hilariously wrong, doubled down on the mistake until everything blew up.

>>64103576
>he doesn't know
Using burning CS grenades to set buildings on fire to kill anyone holding out inside was a staple police tactic and open secret in the 1950s-1990s era. It was the cultural equivalent of shouting "stop resisting" while beating a hapless retard with a baton. It was part police corruption, part political correctness, part practical breaching techniques instead of room-clearing/hostage-rescue style CQB.

>>64103526
>Logically, the ATF should have just waited the siege out, grabbing the cultists as they came out to get food.

Logically, there shouldn't have been a siege in the first place. The compound was ope n for literally anyone to just walk up to, David kuresh spent a significant amount of time out of it. They wanted the a spectacle, they wanted the dividing to fight back so that they can be made an example of. It's not just that the ATF is incompetent, they were incompetent AND were acting out solely of their own interests and not those of alleged victims.

>>64103576
Anon you act like the police/feds fire bombing people they don't like is something that's never happened.

>>64103877
poor poor David Koresh can't fuck his followers wives and daughters in peace

>>64102383
Lol, you probably fap to muslims.

Anyway, bigotry aside, would a one megawatt pulse laser be lethal against infantry?

>>64103869
That's what they did with Robert Jay Matthews when he refused to come out of his house. They didn't use tear gas, but they tossed flares into the house.

you are all dumb niggers
Waco was completely orchestrated to happen decades in advance

>>64103883
I mean I'm more worried about those same wives and daughters that you claim to care about getting burned alive but I guess that's just me.

a few inoperatives never stops progress

>>64103926
Both Waco and Ruby Ridge were planned as boosts for the AWB.

>>64101004
>because everyone involved was retarded
>>64101024
>Unchecked institutional arrogance. The ATF is pretty chill nowadays, but that's only because they got so embarrassed at ruby ridge and Waco that they still haven't really recovered
>>64101038
>Alphabet agents were retarded jocks looking to justify thier bloated budgets and managed to fuck up in every way possible.
>>64101282
>Satanic war against their dollar store Jesus
>>64102676
>Their infil was a retarded plan to cram a bunch of fat feds in a stock trailer and hope they didn’t find it suspicious. Then they proceeded to send a team around the back to shoot their dogs ... Then they found themselves dealing with dozens of barricaded, well armed, religious zealots
>>64103850
>Yeah, they wanted a big billy badass bust, so they walked up to a pile of proto-/pol/acks, started with the show of force, and when that went hilariously wrong, doubled down on the mistake until everything blew up.
I don't have any special insight on this other than growing up in Texas in the 1990s who remembers an ATF agent showing up to my third-grade classroom with a bunch of guns to show us during a "bring your dad to school day." And "trigger-happy morons" who think they're the ultimate badasses describing these guys sounds pretty accurate to me, just as a vibe. Like the whole thing is just very... that. Like of course these morons would try something like this + religious fundies + they fucked it up. Makes sense. You will either get it or you don't.
https://youtu.be/9erLsEHAZRI

>>64103756
Was that supposed to make a point to the contrary? Because if so you failed spectacularly.

>>64103910
>They didn't use tear gas
From Patty Hearst's pals in the 60's that never liberated the imaginary country of Symbion, to the black man that looked suspiciously like two asian women and who managed to get fired, fired on, and set on fire when they cornered the Dorner, incendiary smoke frenades set structures on fire. And it is a convenient way to avoid a trial. Whenever our government uses incendiary grenades to murder someone, it isn't because it never happened before.

>>64101002 (OP)
the predisposition to raids has heavily undermined policing and it has not been rolled back to any significant degree since this incident. even today completely unfounded calls with no evidence except manufactured urgency are enough for the police to """accidentally""" kill you and your family. it seems absurd that the system isn't fail safe but i guess a few too many people cried about something that i don't know about that the police feel they must be ready all the time to drop into any home without establishing anything first.

>>64104093
I am not denying that they used incendiary devices when they cornered Matthews. I am saying that what set the initial fire for his house was the flares tossed in there.
Or if you're referring to Waco, then tear gas was absolutely used there.

>>64104118
>then tear gas was absolutely used there.
My point is that it's never accidental.

>>64104105
The weird thing is that its only an issue the in the US. In all other countries police are able to asses the level of danger before they go all out.

>tear gas used in war
>war crime
>tear gas used on suspects that are innocent until proven guilty
>how much gas do you need
hmmmm

>>64104153
>>64104141
really is food for thought

>>64101225
The literally had an undercover FED planted in the cult.

>>64101004
EVERYONE. That includes the BD's. Them not negotiating surrender was absolutely retarded.

>>64101623
>die for Israel
Name a single American soldier that fought in Gaza or Palestine. I'll wait.
>the hundreds of thousands of Muslims who died for Palestinians
There is a reason why Palestinians are so hated.

>>64103721
It's less defending the ATF and calling out the Davidians as being absolute retards.

>>64104344
them being retards is one thing, but the pedophilia cult worship was never brought up in court, mainly because the ATF/FBI killed everyone, including the alleged women and children victims who ran from the compound after the feds lit the place up, only to get shot themselves by fed snipers.

>>64104362
They should have surrendered. The feds wouldn't have shot anyone if they had simply surrendered, Koresh knew he was fucked for kiddy diddling and sacrificed his congregation for it. And retards like you hold water for him. Everyone did everything wrong, but the majority of the blame falls solely on Koresh.

>>64104153
It's because if you start using non-lethal gas, then it might escalate the conflict to lethal gas; so nobody runs the risk.

>>64103721
The board is full of redditors and the jannies are on their side. It’s a microcosm of the west being flooded with thirdies by the joos. The /k/alergi plan.

>>64104389
Yes Koresh is the originator of sin here but the government had numerous opportunities to arrest him elsewhere but they were absolutely obsessed with getting the guns at the same time, since, understandably, it's the ATF not the sex criminal cult patrol.

>>64101100
Feds are lower than cultists lmao.

>>64104389
If its true, then take them to court with a warrant, everything you said was propagated by feds who needed to save face and justify their attack. What caused this to happen was someone shooting the other, the question is, who shot first?

>>64101614
cry bitch cry

>>64104485
Bootlicker.

>>64101024
fuck off fedkike

I'm no fan of cultists, but the shit the feds did to them was inhuman. They in no way deserved what happened to them

>>64104427
>who shot first
To wound somebody? The BD's did.
>they shot the dogs!
Irrelevant.

>>64104583
shouldn't you be looking for a job, what with the USAID cuts, I figured people like you wouldn't be doing this kind of thing for free

>>64104614
>muh (x)
This cope will never work. Seethe.

>>64104614
funny how you retards keep talking about USAID ever since you were told to (you never heard of it before that point)
and ever since it was cut, all the people running rings around you in online discussions are still there and haven't magically turned into dust.

it's almost like you're completely fucking delusional and most of the people making fun of you have their own opinions, just like any person does, retarded schizo.

>>64104645
I don't know who you quoted, but good luck with the job hunt government shill, I'm praying for you!

Koresh and hia cult were weird, but not "kill everyone and burn down the compound" weird. The ATF and every other alphabet soup branch involved fucked up and rightfully deserve every bit of criticism.

>>64101078
I've never heard of this theory before, give me a quick rundown on it

>>64101104
Agreed. Let's start with the Mormons, Orthodox Jews, and scientologists.

They saved and protected the hell out of those children.
Also very weird to be there to save the children but then take trophy photos with their corpses.

>>64104657
Yes. Everyone picked the worst possible option. The ATF didn't raid a compound where the BD's prayed on their knees while they were shot and burned alive, they shot federal agents conducting a legal arrest. If the BD's immediately surrendered then we wouldn't have a ATF today.

>>64104697
>dosen't know what evidence is
Dumbass.
>shows cherry picked picture with random debris
Cope, you lost.

>>64104722
Evidence?
So the goal was to save the children, which is why they purposely let the building on fire, to save the children from abuse.
Is this some Uber government logic where like peta we have to kill the dog to save the dog?

>>64104738
It's like where's Waldo, but for dead kids.

>>64104709
>If the BD's immediately surrendered then we wouldn't have a ATF today
thats an interesting statement, maybe that would give the ATF motivation to attack the compound and frame the davidians so that they can justify their existence as unelected enforcers of the second amendment (SHALL)

>>64104738
They even went through the trouble of finding a color camera and taking group photos.
One of these dudes still proudly keeps his ok his desk. Sig hired him, IIRC

>>64104738
>they lit a building on fire
No.
>save the children
Why didn't the Branch Davidians release the children? Could it have been the fact they were all Koresh's children with underaged girls...

>>64104750
Don't forget the currently ongoing Clinton scandals that this was supposed to distract from.
This was supposed to be a nice easy layout for Janet Reno, distract from something, and make the govt look good.

There's a reason why the feds vetoed a snatching grab and peaceful execution of search warrant. Also don't forget the FBI lost the front door in their evidence locker

>>64104750
>they immediately surrender
>ATF response is comical, like using a SWAT team to write a speeding ticket
The BD's did exactly what the FBI/ATF feared they do, they immediately shot at feds and then fortified themselves into a corner.

>>64104753
Yes. Yes they did. Grab the burners and burn them out.
Shit, FBI hrt, formed from the same pool of ATF HSLD and Delta still do the same thing to this day.

You harp about evidence but neither bring up any nor do you even attempt to use logos properly.

>>64104761
Not true mr ATF man.
I'm so upset about my government lying to me for nearly my entire adult life about the m1 Abrams being used on the raid.

I was always told, through several presidencies, but it was simply engineering vehicles.

>>64104772
>they had flamethrowers!
There were bears and eagles too!
You faggots are so mentally ill you rewrite reality in your brains to justify slaughter like McVeigh did.
Protip he died like a bitch.

>>64104750
>I need to preserve my job
>I know, I'll cause the largest shitshow in the history of American policing, create a national scandal, and turn my department into a nationwide pariah!
This logic has and will never make any form of sense
>inb4 exactly! SLOPPY JOB!

>>64104753
"Hey we are getting shot at, lets release the kids in front of us so they will shoot at them instead"
for a fed nigger, you aren't very smart, then again, the government doesn't hire the best people.

>>64104784
well judging by the fact clinton gave them an even bigger budget, it sure seems like it worked out just well for them

>>64104781
>Abrams
That was completely disarmed. It had no ammunition on board. Congratulations you sub-60IQ moron. Go read the AAR's.

>>64104785
>any of this
How the fuck do you breathe without life support.

>>64104799
with my nose, glow nigger

>>64101624
>Never forgive Troy Industries for hiring Lon Horiuchi's partner/defender.

dude no one fucking cares about that besides /k/ and that was only during the "cancel" years where people would find reasons to hate brands they were never interested in.

>>64104782
Why do you argue like a cryptoid from absurdity?
Just the well known consequence of the heavy use of external only rated gas grenades. Just like nowadays.
And multiple recordings on the hostage line of koresh begging to not get burned down.
>>64104784
Literally. Was less bad then most of the other scandals going on at the time.
Give a quick Google on the White water development trust, Ron Brown dying of a gunshot wound in a fucking plane crash, with all of the X-rays disapproving.

It was a shit show of epic measured including an attempt at impeaching and a body count approaching 75+

There is a reason why Arkansas remains a CIA hot bed and it's not just being the nation's leader in cocaine.
>>64104785
Feds never are. All they know is pageantry. Look at how the Fed ITT argues or forma concepts.
They literally haven't updated their playbook since cointelpro in the 1960s.

They should have just grabbed koresh during of his morning runs outside of a compound. But that wouldn't have been a good show for all of the media they invited to the spectacle.

Enjoy just one of the shit shows Clinton had oncovered
https://whatreallyhappened.com/RANCHO/POLITICS/MENA/mena.php

>>64104792
>results dictate intent
your doctor is calling, he wants to know why you haven't refilled your prescription

>>64101024
>in the 90s is was all insecure small-town cop

every town was small in the 90s dude

>>64104821
>being this ESL
Just boot up GPT, it'll make a more convincing argument than you.

>>64104709
>If the BD's immediately surrendered then we wouldn't have a ATF today.
The same ATF that murdered half a family over a few inches of shotgun barrel would not have disappeared over a peaceful but botched raid. More recently, they got caught telling a literal retard to commit federal firearms crimes. The undercover shop they were running was called "squids smoke shop". In a round about way, they were paying people to commit crimes so that they had people to arrest. And that unconstitutional government agency still exists.

>>64104822
ah yes, thanks for reminding me to take my zinc, vitamin C, and iodine, glow nigger. At least you're nice unlike the birl next to you

>>64104795
Lol. They say that. Witnwss testimony says other things.
It only took the feds 30 years to admit m1 Abrams being deployed. How dare I not fall for the further lies.
>>64104799
Insults insults insults without a lick of evidence. Sad!

>>64104832
Don't forget that the cult unloaded on the door at the poor feds knocking on the door.
It's a real shame I couldn't visit such a momentous piece of evidence at the FBI museum.
Once again best available evidence

>>64104795
>That was completely disarmed. It had no ammunition on board. Congratulations you sub-60IQ moron. Go read the AAR's.
My favorite part was having to rewrite the involvement of certain people there because of pesky laws like posse comitatus.

>>64104822
> Taking CIA fake vaccines that are only being used to harvest DNA and track people.

If you fall for 20-year-old TTP, you're NGMI.
https://youtu.be/16taFc4s1sg

>>64104845
>insults
>is the one that started it
Really bitch? Cry more, name one ATF or FBI agent arrested or even tried. Game fucking over.

>>64104845
>Don't forget that the cult unloaded on the door at the poor feds knocking on the door who had just shot and killed several animals to illustrate their peaceful intent
ftfy

>>64104832
>murdered a family
That shot a US Marshall in cold blood. Seethe.

>>64104862
>That shot a US Marshall in cold blood. Seethe.
Returning fire is a more accurate description of events as the shooting had already started before any family member pulled a trigger.

>>64104858
>they shot the heckin dogs!
>anyways I started blasting
Yeah do this to law enforcement and try that defense in court, see you in 50 years.

>>64104871
>shot a dog
Not a human. You don't get to shoot a human over a dog. Seethe.

>>64104858
Yep and that's exactly why the FBI lost the physical evidence that cleared their name.

Instead of being a priority One malinformation cyberthreat to the government 40 years later.

>the government pays fed boys to kill civilians
>the government then pays niggers to sit in a warehouse of computers to shitpost on a korean underwater basket weaving forum refute any claims of said killing of civilians, contrary to actual evidence of said killings

>>64104881
*gunshots going off while on private property*
"Hey go make sure that they aren't just killing our dogs before reacting. Killing our dogs mean that they are peaceful."

>>64104881
Yes yes you do. Clear cut self defense around here. Crazy man with a willingness to use lethal force has no guarantee to just .... Stop.
God bless my neighbor for getting rid of the neighborhood crackhead after killing his dog
>>64104871
I'm extremely impressed by how quickly thread quality went down I didn't realize it was still a priority mail information thing. Needs an effort post here or on Pol.
There is a giant breakdown of every single day including government scandals, media actions and movements, and all the copied search warrants at the time somewhere out there.
I wonder if I can track it down

>>64104897
>shoots uniformed federal agents
Ha, that will show those fucking glowniggers!
>they surround you and shoot some of you
ACK

>>64104901
>yes you do!
>gets capital murder charge
ACK

>>64104891
Kinda spoopy.
I've noticed normal screeching autists don't just ignore stories about other saps they're not read onto.
They just call you schizo for bringing up the CIA via usaid and childhood vaccination program capturing 80% of Pakistan's DNA.

>>64104855

>>64104903
>uuuuunifooooorm means tassssty boooootses
Having a badge doesn't guarantee lawful intent.

>>64104907
Keep telling yourself that.
We get to shoot people to recover property too. Someone up the road got his TV stolen, fetched his deer rifle out of the safe, and shot the guy at like 200 yards. Perfectly legal.

>>64104912
>Having a badge doesn't guarantee lawful intent.

ya cool man how many times has that line worked out for the defendant?

guys we have to kneel down to our government agent overlords like good cucks, or they will kill us oooo

>>64104912
>noooooo a badge means nothing!
>gets capital murder charge
ACK
Hey faggot, try this in front a jury.

>>64104912
And they braved a hail of 50 cal fire just to save the children.
Pic related. Kind of weird to stack your fifties after using them then being on fire

>>64104919
>kneel
>not long march
Lol, lamo.
You faggots always scream about the boot, but don't understand that the boot can be worn.

>>64104919
so we're at the "uhhhh BOOTLICKER!" stage of the argument where you just keep posting until the guy leaves or the thread gets deleted.

>>64104921
>dosen't know what evidence is
Stop.

>>64104921
>Kind of weird to stack your fifties after using them

do you think mexican cartel guys just arrange all their guns and every round of ammo on a table for display?

>>64104912
No, but it guarantees that you're going to get your shit pushed in if you go full retard. That's what your right to lawful redress of grievances is for.

But that's what makes Waco and Ruby Ridge so special and long-lasting. That it was two cases of a catastrophic fed fuckup happening to people who were never going to accept any other motive for the actions of an official than deliberate malice, so they went full retard and got their shit pushed in. And so they remain the enduring nightmare of other people who will never accept any other motive than deliberate malice.

>>64104912
Pretty wild that a hail of gunfire on the brave BATFE agents didn't shatter any car windshields

>>64104914
>We get to shoot people
>>64104915
>ya cool man how many times has that line worked out for the defendant?
Thank you for reminding me the nature of people on the other side of that blue line.

>>64104932
>>64104932
F* up my post order. That's the dude that shot himself in the leg on that famous clip of him climbing a ladder.
This is the initial brave hail of gunfire.

>>64104925
Pretty fucking much. They never have any other rebuttal, which is why have the surprised pikachu face when they get the maximum sentence for their retardation.

>>64104937
>dosen't post the part where they get shot on the roof
Odd.

>>64104934
>Thank you for reminding me the nature of people on the other side of that blue line.

when cops shoot at you you either surrender or die. thats how government works.

>>64104942
Sorry Anon, I have failed you.
Go find the clip of that or the guys at the corner getting shot by the ATF on the other side of the wall. There's a rare clip of some feds inside in a doorway lighting each other up too. Haven't seen it in several years.
Top tier fed agency behavior.

Kinda weird how they started investigating Waco and they had to start losing evidence, but Oklahoma City happened and now they get to classify Waco stuff for national security and fight domestic terrorism.
One hell of a cohencidence

>>64104920
the way I see it, the davidians were not meant to get out of this without major losses or capital punishment. The government wanted them dead and got it one way or another, the law was not going to play by the rules with proper warrants for arrest and actually try to take them to court (they had no basis and no evidence to support any of this >>64104760
).
>>64104932
>>64104937
all this for a couple of machine guns that only had just been outlawed a few years prior?

>>64104947
Anon these people believe that they're the Main Character of reality, they simply do not grok the concept of "Sovereignty" or "Legitimacy".

>>64104966
>reeeeeeeee
Yeah I thought so.
>>64104967
They c

>>64104978
c-c-c-c-c-COMBO BREAKER

glow nigger bros.... I don't feel so good... I gotta report this to my superior and I might lose my job.......

>>64104967
You can read the original arrest warrant here. It reads like most of the usual Clinton think of the scary guns tripe. Notice how they use the same tactics 40 years later. Not inventive, sadly.
http://www.jaedworks.com/shoebox/waco.html

Then Vince Foster killed himself 2 months after Waco with the magic revolver that changed colors and an FBI that took a couple weeks to pressure the wife to claim she'd seen it before.

>>64104967
Just read the warrang yourself lol.

>>64104995
Holy fucking shit.
I killed the thread just by proving the original search warrant.

>>64102705
This is 100% the Truth.

Outrage at CP from "Ukraine" should bolster commitment to holt Russia accountable, nothing else.

The regime in Kyiv is gilded in the golden crest of democratic legitimacy, and is leading the fight against Russian influence, CP, corruption, and other harms in the world.

Amazing coincidence how many child predators are against Kyiv. It should come as no surprise though. Malign actors historically have been the main threat vectors by which Putin threatens our spaces by leveraging anti-social behaviours which come by default in pedophiles.

tl;dr: Fuck ziggers, fuck the militia radical extremist movement.

>>64105186
So uh, guess it's time to overthrow the is government.
They have operated and maintained the largest repositories of c********* written history of the world.
Mike Benz has talked about it a few times CP honey pots have been going on for decades.

They've maintained and operated multiple giant rings for over 10 years. There is just a fair bit of congressional investigations into not springing the alleged trap.

>>64105193
I hate schizos and their gullible retard followers so much

>>64105193
>Mike Benz
You mean (((Kike Benz)))? The brownoid trying to spread doubt in democracy and make everybody into Putin's useful idiots? His claims don't hold any scrutiny when you understand the angles that Russian IO pushes. But lets not bully you too much, after all Russia is "based and trad" and is the solve to your incel conundrum, right Vasily?

>>64105212
schizo board, go back to >>>/pol/

>>64104485
Found the .gov pencil pusher.

>>64104583
>The BD's did.
False and the whole reason the front door so conveniently disappeared from evidence lock up.
Must sting to know that the people you see everyday and on whom your wages depend would kill you in an instant with no remorse or hesitation if they could get away with it.

>>64103604
>>64103694
None of you fed shills going to reply?

>>64101002 (OP)
cops are just circle jerking when they get all Tactikool and point guns at everyone.

They never dream of anyone actually shooting back. If they did they'd "call in sick" or claim a fake "stress" disability, or become Jr HS gym teachers.

Hillary ordered Janet to burn everyone, because otherwise Bubba's admin would be overshadowed by the bad optics of Dave on trial, and all his conservatively dressed, well behaved, nice White baby-mommas with their nice White children, on TV quietly supporting him, week after week, month after month, year after year.

It would be "Little House on the Praire" or "The Waltons" on trial on TV everyday.

>64105173
>[list of items that turned out to be on the property
>"yeah, but it reads like a laundry list so I don't like it"
Pathetic. No you for you.

>>64104784
An identical train of reasoning was very publicly used by the boston PD over a lite brite, you're doing a terrible job making your case.

>>64105186
God damn it. I hope ukraine burns in nuclear hellfire. Maybe then you fucks would shut up. How many years have you been shitting up this board? I hope you get pancreatic cancer and die.

>>64104131
I would agree with that, anon. I misunderstood your initial point.
Yes, the BATFE and the FBI knew what they were doing when they started spraying that shit into the compound.

>>64101616
Your worship of jackbooted thugs sounds pretty cultish to me.

>>64101638
NTA but go fuck yourself, retarded plebbitor niggerfaggot. Not everyone who disagrees with you is a russnigger.

>>64101192
>And even if the feds did all that evil shit, they still killed a bunch of fucked up retard cultists, which is always based

i hate you kikes, are you even human?

>>64104406
Based.

>>64105680
>>64105683
They're like most people where they'll believe whatever their government tells them. Just ignore them.

>>64104485

Your badge doesn't change the fact that you're a pussy, and your wife only married you for betabux.

>>64104881
I value my dog more than I value you and every other jeet on the planet.

>>64104924
Based and Gramscian Rightpilled

>>64105212
Ill even keep it on topic.
Operation innocent images. (1993).
Tsk tsk. Bring some sources and actual evidence.
>>64105284
Of course not.
Then there's the mic audio on the radio net screaming about burners and burning.
If you haven't noticed, all they do is decrease thread quality. They no longer even pretend to think we're equal in humanity.

>>64105427
That's unironically the plan. You don't want that.

>>64102705
>OOF, it's the parts that had the most people who identified as "russian"
Proofs?

>>64104995
>it. Mrs. Bunds also told me that Howell had fathered at least fifteen (15) children from various women and young girls at the compound. Some of the girls who had babies fathered by Howell were as young as 12 years old. She had personally delivered seven(7) of these children.
>According to Ms. Bunds, Howell annuls all marriages of couples who join his cult. He then has exclusive sexual access to the women. He also, accoring to Mrs. Bunds, has regular sexual relations with young girls there. The girls ages are from eleven (11) years old to adulthood.

>>64104678
Came to me during a 5 day long bender of huffing whipets and boofing meth after the last Q drop.
Now put on the dress, and assume the position.

>>64101134
glowniggers get the rope. waco was to silence the innocent and protect clintons corrupt ass.

>>64101260
we know you rape kids officer.

>>64101049
Still won't buy Troy sorry lesbo Hop

>>64105796
I thought the plan was to turn it into New Khazaria. If the land is irradiated that plan falls through.

>>64101002 (OP)
I'm not an American nor I was old enough to remember it.

Why do people in this thread are standing with cultists? I get the idea that the feds fuck up the siege and didn't save enough lifes, but why the fuck should anyone care about some psychos and their sub-80 IQ followers?

Were they, like based, or something? Kaczynski type shit? I don't get it

>>64104583
If someone shoots your dogs do you stop and think "well they're probably not going to shoot me so I should remain passive"

>>64104881
Anon if someone shoots your dog in your backyard and you do absolutely nothing you're a sociopath

>>64104915
Considering he only ever was found guilty of failure to appear in court over the inital weapons charge, and got the government to settle over a civil suit. It absolutely does work in court.

>>64104920
He didn't get a capital murder charge though, in fact I can't think of a single case of someone shooting a uniformed officer in self defense relieving a capital murder charge

>>64106776
the ATF was told that they could simply arrest Koresh going about his normal routine but they decided to take the riskier approach becauwe they wanted to get in the compound at the same time and seize the guns
basically they bungled it all for some guns. of which there are many in the US.

>>64106776
>I get the idea that the feds fuck up the siege and didn't save enough lifes

The issue is none of their actions were done with the intent to save lives

>>64106776
They weren't trying to save lives at all.

>>64106776
>but why the fuck should anyone care about some psychos and their sub-80 IQ followers?
because the vast majority of the people killed by the Feds at Ruby Ridge and Waco had not even been accused of a crime, let alone been charged or convicted of one

>>64106776
You probably won't ever get it, even most Americans don't really get it unless they actually look in to the details of the case and were alive during that time. You really need to view things within the context of the time and particularly in reference to the ruby ridge incident and Oklahoma City bombing. The feds weren't there to save lives or make arrests. They were there to make an example of right wingers fucking off and doing their own thing while the government was becoming increasingly involved in everybody's lives, farther left wing than most of the populace, and increasingly controlling. They needed to justify their current and future actions by finding or creating right wing weirdos they could paint as a justification. In both cases evidence justifying their actions was at a bare minimum nowhere near justification for the severity of the response and was likely outright fabricated to justify their homicidal actions. Ruby ridge was bad but waco was an absolute shit show in comparison, there are very few documentaries that even begin to address how ghoulish their actions actually were. At Waco in specific there is strong circumstances evidence that the ATF opened fire first and literally executed several people who attempted to surrender throughout the siege. There is even stronger evidence that they intentionally destroyed any and all evidence that could confirm/deny this by destroying their videos of the initial conflict, destroying their own written records of agents during the incident, destroying various items of inconvenient physical evidence(ex church doors) and destroying the bodies of the people they were claimed to have executed. There's a long list of things that they lied about or covered up during the incident. Janet Reno also directly lied to the congressional investigation on some points afterwards. Given the claims of the davidians this really paints a certain kind of picture to any reasonable and objective observer.

>>64107150
Most of them didn't die to ATF bullets, tho. If anything, it was their desire to die rather than surrender that led to more deaths when the building caught fire.

>>64107631
Prove it

>>64106776
imagine goofing so hard that cultists start to look good

>>64106776
Imagine there are some schizos saying the feds are evil fascist thugs who like to kill innocent people for sadistic fun, but nobody knows what's true, nobody cares, and it's impossible to settle the debate because it's just a lot of people BSing without any proof.
Now imagine the feds go prove the worst conspiracy theories completely right on national video. It was the COVID of the 1990s. And unlike COVID, jackbooted thugs coming to burn your children alive are a threat which can actually be shot by a random guy, so there was a lot of resonance.

>>64107709
most people try to escape burning buildings. im not sure why, but burning to fucking death, people seem to not like that

>>64106776
Yeah the Branch Davidians were a bunch of wacky cultists but:

>Feds could've nabbed David Koresh and overall handled the situation using less confrontational methods with a lower chance of failure, but they wanted to go in guns blazing because reasons
>Feds fucked everything up and acted like a bunch of retarded jackboots instead of like professional law enforcement
>Feds threw CS grenades which just happened to burn at 600 degrees into buildings they knew to contain flammable material
>Feds used excessive force, bringing in a literal fucking tank, mowing down kids as they fled burning buildings
>Feds took photos of themselves standing over the charred corpses of children, smiling/posing like they just shot a prize buck
>Feds denied wrongdoing, misplaced evidence, covered each others' asses

And this was coming right off Ruby Ridge, whose victims were far more sympathetic than the Branch Davidians.

>>64107821
Woah it's almost like a burning building might jave obstacles that prevent people from escaping it.

Even when ignoring the fact that they thought they were surround by a bunch of thugs who would shoot them and ask questions later in the process

>>64108167
right. i considered that. but my sources say that when your burning, and on fire, you generally are not concerned with....anything else. even if whats outside the burning building is certain death.

have a completely unrelated picture.

>>64107756
First time talking to fed Bois

>>64105919
Kek. Salty CIA nigger confirmed.

>>64107787
Imagine believing the Federal government cares about people after living through COVID.
Lost a 20 year old family business, and like 6 friends to suicide because their business was deemed nonessential for 18 months.

T. Northeast hellscape

>>64103604
The only pyrotechnic CS gas was deployed at 8 in the morning and the building didn't catch fire until noon. You're basically saying the fire burned uncontrolled for 4 hours before anybody saw flames.

>>64108167
People escape from burning buildings all the time and Ruth Riddle was able to escape the building while the fire was burning. The University of Maryland later concluded that the cultists could have left if they so wanted.

More than that, the ATF had an M728 combat engineering vehicle. The thing looks like a tank and there's no reason to believe it couldn't just blow up the compound. No, the only reason anybody stayed was because they weren't rational.

>>64101192
Didn't the feds have a guy on the inside that said they didn't have anything on them besides tenuous weapons charges? If they were fucking the kids wouldn't that have been one of the primary reasons for a warrant/raid? I don't know a whole lot about what went on there but it does come off like there was a bunch of bad PR from that incident so the feds came out later claiming they were molesting the kids so they had to Kill 'em All.

>>64108497
>The only pyrotechnic CS gas was deployed at 8 in the morning and the building didn't catch fire until noon.
That is, of course, from the same source that claimed no incendiary grenades were used at all. And that was the official story until those pesky pictures of grenade casings were found. Then the story morphed into "they were actually used those at a different time on a different structure lol the end". Do you know why they said the grenades were used before the fire instead of after the fire? If they would have claimed after the fire, it would have been impossible for the fire to be started by them.
But the pictures of dead children seemingly kicking the backs of their own heads were also available. CS gas becomes something nastier when it degrades in a fire. The continued use of "non lethal" CS gas during a fire becomes other than non lethal when the cyanocarbon releases the carbon. And from the pics, that temperature was reached.
But nothing ever happened, it was a weather balloon or something.

>>64108637
Source?

>bunch of Christ cucks cultists
>colt members

>>64103883
And yet if Koresh were still alive and came out as a troon today you would be the first in line to defend his polycue lmao

in a sense its the military coming home to roost and test out its toys state side .eg psyops and FLIR + catching fire to everything
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Shed_Light#Sensors

>>64108664
The undercover agent's name was Robert Rodriguez. Koresh let him walk out of the compound even when he knew Rodriguez was working for the BATFE.

>>64108497
FLIR footage suggests otherwise.
Also, David Thibodeau (one of the survivors) said that there was a fireball through one of the hallways which would've started the fire.

Very thinly veiled /pol/ thread that has almost no /k/ related posts in it.

>>64108497
>the ATF had an M728 combat engineering vehicle. The thing looks like a tank and there's no reason to believe it couldn't just blow up the compound.
There were also 10 Bradleys and 2 literal Abrams MBTs https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Activities_of_Federal_Law_Enforcement_Agencies_Toward_the_Branch_Davidians/Section_5#1._Military_equipment_and_personnel_provided

>>64104489
>>64105271
>>64104485

>>64101004
cope

Amateur lmfao

>>64108896
I saw a pic of the Abrams but thought it had to be an edit. Who the fuck brings a Tank to a Domestic Arrest?

...Also, who the hell looks outside, sees a dozen armored fighting vehicles, realizes they have no weapons that could penetrate them, and thinks "Nah, I'd win"

>>64106776
shut the fuck up tranny

>>64109291
Chechens.

>>64106776
>I'm not an American
could have ended your post there, tranny

>>64106776
>I get the idea that the feds fuck up the siege and didn't save enough lifes,
dave went for a jog every day and went into town once a week. they legit did not have any evidence dave was doing anything wrong at all as he let them into the compound multiple times before then to do search warrants and they had an undercover guy who said dave wasn't doing shit. the gayTF could have easily just black bagged dave on his jogs or trips to town but they decided to go be cowboys and try to shoot up the compound because they were in hot water and at risk of losing funding due to shitting up ruby ridge a year or so prior. they came up with this bullshit excuse that dave was raping and beating kids
>not ATF's job by the way
and tried to film the raid and mysteriously "lost" the tape from the raid. they also shot first when dave tried to surrender and then "lost" the door that showed they shot first, but the other door was fine. they also said they didn't shoot out of the helicopter, but there were bullets in the roof from someone shooting down at the compound and then FBI said they didn't use flammable munitions during the final raid but then it turns out they "misplaced" and then found a ton of flammable munitions they were shooting at the compound the whole morning before gassing it.
You can also watch the IR footage of the gas raid and the FBI guys are just straight up shooting everyone trying to escape the gas and they threw some dead guy's body back into the building through the window

>>64108497
>People escape from burning buildings all the time and Ruth Riddle was able to escape the building while the fire was burning. The University of Maryland later concluded that the cultists could have left if they so wanted.
there's literally footage of the FBI shooting people trying to get out and then throwing some guy or his corpse, not sure if he was dead, back into the burning building

>waco thread
>in autosage
every time

>>64109602
You'll appreciate reading the original search warrant here. >>64104995
Literally the same CNN playbook today.

>>64109602
But that doesn't look good for the media that was invited out. How odd.
Really weird how they continuously lose evidence. Pic related.

>>64104973
>they simply do not grok the concept
We do. None of the current systems of government is legitimate .