Thread 64230616

Is that white phosphorous? This is from Gaza; an attack on a tent city from December

Feel like I'm in 2022 again with this shit ass thread OP

>>64230616 (OP)
>Is that white phosphorous
yeah

>>64230616 (OP)
Its not WP as you usually airburst WP. To me that looks like a secondary from them hitting something that shouldnt be in a tent city.

It's condensed judaism, aka "Juden Phosphorous"

>>64230650
what could it be that would blow up into all those flare things that fly everywhere and ignite all the tents?

>What munition is this?
The based kind.

>>64230672
Any other kind of munition.
WP puts out a massive amount of smoke, far more than shown.

>>64230672
Rocket fuel.

>>64230650
>>64230672
it is WP, simple as. it's also not a war crime because Israel never agreed to ban it, like how the US can use cluster bombs.

>>64230679
That's somebody's son...

>>64230686
rocket fuel would not make those weird flares, I know this from Ukraine war clips

>>64230682
what other munition specifically?

>>64230648
I don't think Israel has that level of base.
Yet.

>>64230701
they never banned it. they CAN use it.

I wish both sides would get shake & bake'd.

>>64230672
>>64230697
>>64230700
You are all retarded. Tell me which this looks like more.

>>64230712
it's only a matter of time until Israel chimps out and nukes Iran.

>>64230697
>it is WP, simple as
this nigga lmaooo

>>64230706
>>64230697
they shouldn't.
We are going to reconvene the Geneva conventions so no one can do this kind of shit and try to weasel their way into arguing it's okay because acksually it's not technically illegal.
And killing human shields should be a war crime too, I don't care if it makes it harder to kill that guy you really wanna kill, wait until he's not surrounded by 50 unaware children.

>>64230717
it does look like that though

>>64230726
>it does look like that though
Looks like what? A magnesium based incendiary shell? Or are you saying it resembles WP more?

>>64230717
So which of these 2 examples does it more closely resemble to the video OP posted?

>>64230735
The result is the same, with persistent flares starting fires everywhere.
It looks like an incendiary bomb, not a Hamas stockpile exploding is what I'm saying. A Hamas stockpile of huge incendiary bombs in a tent city? Why wouldn't they keep that in the tunnels?
All you hear is people screaming

Some illuminating composition that isn't WP. Russians had those go off when they stockpiled ammo close to the front at the beginning of the Ukraine war.

>>64230753
>It looks like an incendiary bomb
It looks nothing like an incendiary bomb. Those are airburst for maximum coverage.
What it looks like is the bomb scattering broken fuel grains from rocket motors.

>>64230753
>The result is the same
No, and the point you are trying to make is retarded.
>It looks like an incendiary bomb
Can you show me a video of them using an incendiary bomb in a way that clearly shows the name of the shell/bomb so we can compare?

>>64230700
>I know this from Ukraine war clips
You haven't been watching malfunctions. Rockets and missiles that land on target aren't carrying fuel anymore.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IwqmezeSuQ
Speaking of, does anyone know why there's rocket fuel in the middle of a tent city? Sounds like a fire hazard to me.

>>64230700
>I know this from Ukraine war clips
Somehow even a more strange thing to lie about lol

>>64230726
>it does look like that though
Looks like exploding munitions that have fuel in them.

So why is it ok to set all those people on fire? Like 30-50 Israelis died from their rockets from 2000-2023, there's no urgent rush here to save lives.
They could wait until the daytime when everyone's not asleep at least, to let the civilians get out of the way.
The side doing the actual killing logically bears at least half the responsibility for every human shield death, and the world agrees judging by all the hate Israel's been getting for their human shield overkill

>>64230897
>The side doing the actual killing logically bears at least half the responsibility for every human shield death
Fuck off, you amoral nigger. The fault for human shields, child soldiers, occupied religious structures or any other "mutual" warcrime lies entirely with the instigator.

>>64230897
Answer my fucking question which dose this look like more white phosphorus or munitions being blown up?
>So why is it ok to set all those people on fire?
Idk ask the guys who put the bombs there?

>>64230906
>>64230923
yea I heard this board was filled with jidf shills and it's apparently very true, this might as well be reddit

>>64230930
Brother going on /k/ and lying about munition stuff is just lame regardless of any political shit

>>64230930
>wa wa wa muh jidf
Tell your other cousins to be less retarded than the last one. You're on the board that knows shit about how war works, and you're crying that in this instance, the team you like was in the wrong. An infantry raid on a "totally just a refugee camp bro" is going to be a disaster for everyone involved, because they're going to get shot at, they're going to shoot back, and then they're going to call in gunships, because the one thing about war crimes that midwids and dune coons refuse to learn is that UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES are you obligated to give the enemy free kills to avoid committing one. Vid rel is more of an honest-to-God war crime than the shit you posted.

>>64230950
forgot about this "trend"

>>64230616 (OP)
Looks like a single .45 acp ball round

>>64230726
>killing human shields
No fuck that, USING human shields should get you declared as "Hostis Humani Generis" and all of your "human rights" should be null and void.

>>64230937
>>64230989
I'm talking about human shields in general now, I believe you it wasn't white phosphorous.
Anyone who thinks its just fine to kill 50 unknowing civilians in the middle of the night because the enemy (who may be insane) was using them as "human shields" is a fucking psycho. International law is not always up to date with international morality, but it will be updated.
If it was correct, maybe Israel wouldn't be so hated internationally right now because it wouldn't have done all those thousands of family-annihilation strikes

>>64230950
>ur muslim
no, and you are definitely jewish, no one else defends this shit anymore

>>64230964
more chutzpah

>>64230998
You are wrong about everything. The blame SOLELY lies on the people using human shields. All the deaths in this war lie completely at the feet of Hamas and the Palestinians.

>>64231009
then why is everybody so mad at Israel for killing so many human shields?

>>64230998
>I believe you it wasn't white phosphorous
Then I will say I do not like isreal anon
>>64230998
>more chutzpah
Idek what that is

>>64231011
They aren't. All the "international outrage" is completely performative.

>>64231011
Because "everybody" isn't familiar with how war works. You walked into one of the few corners of the earth left with a substantial population of people who have had their own well-being rely on their ability to know and abide these rules, and you're mad that you found them. That kinda says it all.

>>64231011
>everybody
Damn if EVERYBODY agrees then something will for sure be done right?

>>64231015
>>64231025
>>64231031
multiple white people have self-immolated over it; people feel much more strongly about it than you seem to yet realize. Probably because the video evidence is very compelling and there's like 700GB of it (below). People everywhere vehemently despise Israel's approach to human shields

https://drive.proton.me/urls/P9ZFG94DT4#pQOAuw22o7ct

>>64231043
Look anon I do not like or agree with isreal at all, but you are being a retard in this argument.

>>64231043
>muh feelings
Okay, and that makes them correct how?

>>64231043
>mentally ill people set themselves on fire
And what did that do? Nothing. Where are the Muslim nations? Are they mobilizing their military? Are they taking Palestinian refugees? Are they blockading Israel? No, they're not. It's purely theater.

>>64230616 (OP)
Very little smoke generation for WP + the pieces extinguish too fast, could be burning rocket fuel or pieces of burning HE. It's hard to estimate from the video, but it seems like it's not a huge explosion, more show than bang judging from how close the video is shot and the cameraman is unaffected. Ammo dump struck with a smaller munition could make sense
>>64230717
afaik, this is not WP, it's a Russian magnesium/zirconium submunition incendiary, basically small pellets of burning metal.

>>64231048
human shields justification lets Israel kill like 60 sleeping people at once with a 2 ton bomb for a 'suspected militant' and be like "hey not my fault!!."
No, because you wouldn't want them doing that to your family based on some AI startup giving your cousin an arbitrary militant score. Most people don't want to risk their lives to try and overthrow their government for a foreign government either, they just want to live. You don't sign up to be a human shield nor do you even realize 90% of the time.

>>64231053
because they will certainly become international law after all this. Israel is already a guaranteed pariah state because it wasn't law yet, because nobody thought anyone would try and use this like a loophole to explain away killing an insane ratio of civilians.

>>64231056
because the Israel lobby is still in power until the next elections. Global public opinion has changed thoughever

>>64231100
>Russian magnesium/zirconium submunition incendiary
Yes i put the name in the webm file

>>64231103
>kill like 60 sleeping people at once with a 2 ton bomb
A single instance of this happening?

>>64230950
>Vid rel is more of an honest-to-God war crime
elaborate? cant' see shit behind all those pixels

>>64231103
>okay, so it's not a warcrime, but it MIGHT in the future
Thank you for the concession.
>>64231114
Rodent glued to the RPG warhead. Animal cruelty is a war crime.

>>64231043
>multiple white people have self-immolated over it
And your kind cheered on their deaths despite their sympathy for you.

>>64231124
didn't notice that, thanks

>>64231103
>Israel lobby
>dosen't even spend in the top 20 donors
Really powerful that lobby.

>>64231128
That's actually the funniest part, EVERY SINGLE Western protest group would be slaughtered in a heartbeat by Hamas if they could.

>>64231103
>>64231114 (me)
>because they will certainly become international law after all
Okay, fuck it, let me explain to you in detail why you are stupid and this won't happen. Let's take your example, a 30:1 ratio of hostages to combatants, and make that the ceiling. If you have more than 30 hostages per soldier, it becomes punishable to bomb the target, you have to send in infantry. Immedeately, some shitskin will go
>hmm, so if I take 31 hostages, then they have to walk into the killzone!
Creating numeric values to human shields ENCOURAGES the use of human shields, leading to greater overall instances of warcrimes, both from the direct usage, and from all the militaries all over the world that are going to say "that's fucking stupid, I'm going going in there, call an airstrike. Go ahead, send my ass to jail, it beats being dead."

This is, again, the part of military law that retards like you actively refuse to understand. Laws that do not provide one side immunity when responding to the other team's crimes create MORE crimes, because it INCENTIVIZES the commission of warcrimes for tactical and operational advantage.

>>64230950
Eternal flight...

>>64230897
>Be civilian
>See there is missiles in your tent city
>Know that Israelis will destroy the munitions if they are seen
>Do nothing to distance yourself from the retards quite literally placing bombs in a civilian camp
>Jews bomb the weapons cache
>Wtf??? How did this happen???
They're not human shields if they willingly let people bring weapons into their camp, they are at best useful idiots for Hamas and at worst likely actively supporting them hiding weapons there.
>But muh pai children!
I truly do not care. Maybe if those same children weren't cheering on the massacre of civilians when it was them doing the killing I'd feel a tiny twinge of guilt, but EVERY SINGLE Pali rat I've ever had the displeasure of interacting with had the FUCKING NERVE to openly brag about every single mudslime attack on civilians, openly declared that America was their enemy and they want to destroy it while simultaneously living entirely on government gibs, and the picosecond that Muslims get slapped back for their transgressions immediately change course into quite literally crying on social media about how poor innocent Palestinians are oppressed and being genocided, (genocided despite their population and obesity rate increasing over time)
Fuck them and fuck their nonstop bullshit. As far as I'm concerned Israel should bulldoze the entire Gaza Strip into the ocean, civilians and buildings alike.

>>64230950
Forgot I saved this webm actually

>>64231261
>>See there is missiles in your tent city
How do you know they knew? They probably didn't. Otherwise they would have moved further away. I don't think they love pain and death as much as you believe. They'd have no reason to doubt Israel would strike like this by that point.

The rest of your post is just "the children deserve it anyway!"

>>64231290
>The rest of your post is just "the children deserve it anyway!"
Oh my mistake if it came across like that, what I meant to say was "They all deserve it anyway, Total Mudnigger Death, Mohammed was a pedophile warmongerer and if there is a hell he is burning in it for all eternity."
There, does that sum it up better?

>>64231290
NTA, but there probably weren't any casualties anyway. Ask yourself this: Why were they filming nothing in the middle of the night? IDF likely did some roof knocking style announcement, so that everyone could GTFO before they blew the cache.

>>64231290
>they love pain and death
Their entire ideology is the torture and murder of all Jews. Hamas gives zero shits about it's own people and even less of a shit about others.

>>64231347
Sounds paranoid and racist, assuming you’re talking about their civilians as I am. Most people are not political and just want to live their lives

>>64230650
This. The point of WP is that it burns very hot for a long time. The smaller bits here are fizzling out in midair.
This looks to be burning explosive, not WP. So Israel hit a weapons stash.

>>64231369
>Sounds paranoid and racist
you're on 4chan, it's racist here. now gtfo, reddit fag.

>>64230781
The Palestinians are allowed a space program! It's a literal war criem to deny them!

>>64231369
>Most people are not political
Muslims are.

>>64230726
>human shields
There is no evidence of this .

>>64230989
Might as well abolish the Geneva conventions and round up every Jew on the planet into ovens and get it over with.

>>64231261
>They're not human shields if they willingly let people bring weapons into their camp
There is no evidence of this happening

>>64231261
>As far as I'm concerned Israel should bulldoze the entire Gaza Strip into the ocean, civilians and buildings alike.
This is the best case for the Holocaust I came across

>>64232251
>>64232256
Yeah, I'm sure all that rocket fuel was just in the sand, it's an environmental hazard.
Failing to remove civilians from your depot: it's not just stupid, it's a crime.

>>64230616 (OP)
its a regular tritonal bomb
the burning chunks you see flying in all directions is APCP solid rocket fuel ignited after being hit by the tritonal bomb. since the APCP rocket fuel is designed to burn much slower inside of the rocket while powering it you dont see it blow up when hit but burn as chunks of it fly everywhere

Mate, OP, that is classically a munition going off after being precision striked.

White Phosphorous is a heavy smoke, persistant, long lasting chemical
It won't look like the mamganese from a firework burning off in tendrils

>>64230616 (OP)
it's just a secondary

>>64230726
the only one responsible for the deaths of human shields are the ones that used them
which is both sad and funny considering in the case of gaza, it's their own people.

>>64232346
>>64230672
>>64230700
You can see a webm of the same thing happening right over here >>64230604, but I'm sure it was some kind of jewish trick to have rockets planted in that civilian camp, there's no chance the honorable pigestalians would try to hide weapons among civilians!

>>64232370
Hamas / Hezbollah are the pawns of the Ayatollah and Iranian Revolutionary Guard, for use in their proxy war with Israel.
People who think they are supporting Palestinians by supporting Hamas are fucking retarded, because the only liberation they offer is liberation from living.

Also before anyone says anything, the Israelis (or rather, Netanyahu and his clique) basically consented to Hamas becoming established in Gaza, pretty much because they are a convenient excuse to continue their policy of running the worlds largest ghetto.

>>64232460
>Also before anyone says anything, the Israelis (or rather, Netanyahu and his clique) basically consented to Hamas becoming established in Gaza, pretty much because they are a convenient excuse to continue their policy of running the worlds largest ghetto.
This shit is retarded. What would they have done to stop Hamas? Invade?

>>64232370
The reason human shields work is because the aggressor is usually not so crazy where it's literally their military doctrine to kill their own POWs / hostages just to deny them to the enemy (Hannibal directive).
You can only go with "we'll show them human shields wont deter us, then they'll stop!" so long before you have to acknowledge that killing this many civilians is not changing their policy of using human shields and all it's doing is making you forever look like murderous criminals to the world. The success of this tactic (Hannibal Directive, wantonly killing human shields) is dependent on the enemy actually caring about their own civilians.
Hitler didn't give a fuck all those people who died horribly in Dresden; as far as he was concerned, they were going down the the ship. But the aggressor (Israel) is obligated to care for all civilians as well as the allies should have cared for the German civilians, because state terrorism (Dahiya doctrine) is immoral and is no better than regular terrorism. It can be done but not for 2 years straight come on, at some point you have to realize it's not working and you're only making yourselves look like psychopaths

>>64232492
>What would they have done to stop Hamas? Invade?
Gee billy, I wonder why we're having this thread right now?

>>64232507
>the aggressor
>(Israel)

>>64232515
in the OP webm and the overwhelming majority of engagements (out of tens of thousands since Oct 7), Israel has been the aggressor

>>64232514
The Israeli people would support such an invasion? Even now, despite Oct 8 a not insignificant portion of the population is opposed to war.

Additionally, you complain of Israeli "aggression" and yet complain that Israel did nothing to stop Hamas taking over Gaza. This is contradictory.

>>64232521
In the OP webm an Israeli missile or bomb takes out what seems to be enemy weapons hidden among civilians. As those weapons are specifically intended to be used, indiscriminately, on the Israeli state and its people, the strike in the Webm is thus an act of self-defense.

>>64232528
>[Country A]'s warplane drops a bomb in the middle of the night and sets dozens of refugee tents belonging to [Country B] on fire.
[Country A] is the aggressor in this scenario, there is no spin

>>64232528
>an act of self-defense.
Israel cannot claim self defense. Their very existence is an act of war.

>>64232507
What a fucking mountain of cope.
>muh hannibal directive
Taking human shields is a crime, and the only correct response to it is to render it completely ineffective in influencing your decision-making. Formally acknowledging that this sucks and it's not your fault the enemy did a warcrime is moral and laudable.
>muh they're not stopping
Irrelevant. Showing them that it only works will only encourage them to do it more.
>muh state terrorism
>muh optics
>muh feelings
Go be a woman somewhere else.

>>64232549
>Country B hides bombs and weapons among civilians, hoping their presence will dissuade any attacks on their stockpile
>Country A uses a precision weapon to strike the cache, setting of secondary explosions
>these secondary explosions do more harm to the civilians than the initial strike
In this scenario, Country A is beyond ethical. They have mitigated harm to the highest degree possible. This as Country A has a right and a duty to defend itself and Country B is wholly at fault for hiding munitions and weapons among its own civilians.

>>64230717
Do you have the clip from azovstal?

>>64230726
>We are going to reconvene the Geneva conventions so no one can do this kind of shit and try to weasel their way into arguing it's okay because acksually it's not technically illegal.

Who's we?
And how is reconvening a convention going to effect a hypothetical nation that isn't party to it?

>>64232552
>Their very existence is an act of war.
And you're losing the war, Mustafa.

>>64232560
OP is someone, or a group of people, who does this 24/7.

>>64232549
>>[Country A]'s warplane drops a bomb in the middle of the night and sets dozens of refugee tents belonging to [Country B] on fire.
And what, pray tell, was the bomb aimed at?

>>64230616 (OP)
UN is passing several edicts against the war in Gaza so the Jews are trying to get in as much as they can before the sanctions hit.

>>64232589
>save us UN

>>64232562
I strongly disagree. It's always unethical to kill unknowing women and children. Why couldn't they wait til day and warn them? In the clip all you hear is people screaming in terror

>>64232611
>B... but its at night
It makes literally no difference.
>people were SCARED!
Get mad at Hamas, they hid weapons among civilians knowing full well that Israel is likely going to strike it.

>>64230697
WP isn't banned by any international convention.
It is regulated under Certain Conventional Weapons, like all other incendiaries.
Israel is party to Certain Conventional Weapons and if this is in fact WP, they'd be violating it here

All that said, this doesn't look like WP. It looks like fuel secondaries

>>64232623
Also, you can still use WP for to either obscure or illuminate. We (the US) used it in Fallujah, a lot.

>>64230616 (OP)
You know, I wanna say its white phosphorus but white phosphorus mostly airbursts, above, in the air. And has a lot more white smoke. That's more like munitions exploding with the stuff flying out and falling being parts of the munitions hit.

This is white phosphorus in Fallujah in 2004. This is usually what it looks like

>>64232631
OP knows this. He's a literal shill.

>>64232611
>It's always unethical to kill unknowing women and children.
I agree and laws of armed conflict agree, but because that doesn't change that in a war you need to destroy targets of military necessity, it places the blood for the killings on the hands of the people who put the targets with women and children, not the people who destroyed the targets.

If Hamas was a state military they'd all be up for war crimes against their own people.

>>64232628
You can still use it as an incendiary too just while following certain rules.
I'm not sure how those rules are parsed when it comes to illumination and obscuration

>>64232654
I used to work with a former FISTER and I once asked him. That was his answer. To illuminate or obscure. You're not allowed to use it offensively. If you're using it to "obscure" and it just so happens the position you're "obscuring" is the enemy firing-line, then its all good :)
>This is why JAG officers get attached to Brigade HQ's.

>>64232619
ok I'll be mad at Hamas but I'll be equally mad at Israel for actually pulling the trigger. How likely were the rockets to actually hurt an Israeli civilian anytime soon? I've read the rockets only killed 30-50 Israelis from 2000-2023

>>64232654
>I'm not sure how those rules are parsed when it comes to illumination and obscuration
Basically "don't shoot it at people"
>pop WP grenades between you and the enemy: no problem
>drop WP shells on an enemy trench to "illuminate" it: hey hol up a minute

>>64232549
>invincible ignorance

>>64232644
The blame should be officially shared between aggressor and human-shield-holder. It's retarded to just let the aggressor get away with killing 100 unknowing innocent civilians just because the enemy was allegedly hiding behind them (no proof needed).
Equal blame. If the world felt otherwise there wouldn't be nearly so much outrage about it coming from people that you'd otherwise consider reasonable.

>>64232661
>your honor, I may have been trying to kill him, but did you consider that I missed because I have no training and used a high-point?

>>64232661
>well, despite their best efforts, Hamas is really bad at killing Israeli civilians even though they are trying their hardest
>so Israel is not allowed to interdict Hamas attempts at killing Israeli civilians
Hamas chose to start this war. Hamas choses to use its own people as shields. Hamas choses to hide weapons among refugees. Whatever results falls squarely on their shoulders. Simple as. End of.

>>64230950
That field ratnik was a Wagner contractor and massacred children at Bucha, he earned that drone flight.

>>64232665
>the aggressor
The mask slips off every time you try to put it on.

>>64232665
No, I will not reward hostage takers by placing them on moral equivalence with the people they are knowingly and deliberately placing in a position of "do something awful or let me kill you and yours". Get fucked you absolute failure of a man.

>>64232678
>by placing them on moral equivalence with the people they are knowingly and deliberately placing in a position of "do something awful or let me kill you and yours".
This.

>>64230897
Because this is a two century old semitic blood feud

Hamas and gaza exist because israel went around burning orchards and evicting people from their homes to colonize "OUR rightful land"
The arabs have the EXACT same attitude towards the jews. Given the chance, they will treat jews like cattle.

The arabs are only losing because they are fucking retarded and the jews are of average intelligence.

>>64232658
>>64232662
This may be internal policy or an example of military legal broscience (brolaw) akin to the old .50 bmg "shooting at their belt buckles thing because Certain Conventional Weapons is quite clear on the matter as seen here.
Or I suppose it could be a way to skirt around the "no air delivered incendiary weapons in civilian areas" thing but this naturally wouldn't apply to grenades

>>64232688
>forests
>not allowed to burn
>unless they ARE the military objective
Ents on suicide watch.

>>64232668
So it's apparently so urgent and there's such a rush to destroy it in time that they can't wait until daylight and for people to evacuate before destroying it? They could just watch it with a drone and bomb it if they see Hamas try to transport the launcher away, if they're paranoid it will be evacuated away with the civilians. They have absolute control.

>>64232251
>trying this
Don't cry when the Jews go full Samson Option on your ass, remember that as you die from some turbo-Ebola or radiation sickness.

>>64232678
>>64232676
There is definitely a moral equivalence because this: >>64232247 is bullshit condemning them all as a monolith of insane murderous terrorists. Civilian lives should be protected no matter whos. That's the reason we have international law. Random kids and old ladies (and even most men) didn't vote to go do a crazy slaughter of Israelis

>>64232716
>real life isn't like the movies!
Yes.

>>64232723
So why is there a stockpile of rocket fuel in the middle of a refugee camp?

>>64232690
Yeah, I don't really get the last part.
It reads like "no burning the forest unless you're burning the forest for any reason a military might burn the forest"

>>64232507
>aggressor
>Israel
Wut

>>64232723
>Civilian lives should be protected no matter whos
Yes. However, collateral damage is a part of conflict. If your opponent goes to great lengths to maximize the collateral damage their OWN CIVILIANS suffer so that people like you cry about it on the internet, then the fault is theirs not the side shooting back.

>>64232728
Its to guard against ecological terrorism. So like burning down the forest the Bomalians rely on for hunter-gathering because the bomalians are being irritating.

>>64232549
>country B puts weapons into refugee camp
>country A destroys them
>somehow is country A fault that country B put weapons in the camp
What kind of third world logic is this?

>>64232742
Dudes a literal shill who maintains one of these threads on /k/ at all times 24/7.

>>64232611
>it's unethical
Correct, which is why Hamas needs to be stopped. If those weapons weren't there no bombs would be dropped.

>>64232665
>aggressor
Who started the war?

>>64232661
>I've read the rockets only killed 30-50 Israelis from 2000-2023
Shelters and iron dome. It doesn't stop being attempted murder or an act of war because you can mostly mitigate it.
>two century old semitic blood feud
Fourteen. Most westerners cannot and will not ever understand this. This has been going on for twice as long as the English-French conflict.

>>64232725
If the civilians are aware of the danger, sure they could be targets, but the thing is they always say they're not and that they had no idea.
From their point of view, they are just getting bombed randomly in their tents. And kids have no idea what’s going on anyway

>>64232759
Civilians were not and are not targets. Proofs? They didn't all die.
>but they didnt know!
And?

>>64232759
So why is there a stockpile of rocket fuel in the middle of a refugee camp?

>>64232740
I was thinking that but couldn't that be considered a military objective unless you're already committing higher order war crimes.
Does it exist to be a tack on charge?

>>64232758
>fourteen
Yeah, Judea/Israel didn't have Muslims until the Palestinian Arabs killed them or drove them out. The entire "Middle East" was solidly Christian until the Arabs flooded out and through horrific acts that shocked even the standards at the time (go read about Jihad it's utterly sickening what they did) tortured Christians and Jews into conversion, or slaughtered them wholesale.

>>64232759
>they didn't know
>hey what is mahmud doing with those weapons crates?
>SHUT UP ITS NOTHING
The truth is that the Palestinian civilians can't do anything about it, if they try to flee or inform the Israelis Hamas will kill them and their families. An Israeli bomb might kill you, but Hamas WILL kill you.

>>64232763
Because Hamas put it there? You don't seem to understand. Yes Hamas did a bad thing by putting supplies there. I just don't think it's justified to kill vast amounts of human shields with no concern for their safety. It should be harder to do that for all sides under international law. Killing them doesn't actually even discourage Hamas from continuing to use more human shields.
All this rationalization of it basically acts under the assumption that the human shields are willing and complicit. But they rarely are.

>>64232784
Isreal is not targeting civilians. They are doing the best the can under the operational restraints created by Hamas.
>but civilians!
If the choice is between your own civilians and the other sides it's an easy choice. Especially when you're mitigating as best you can.

>>64232784
>think
Yeah you don't. Leaving those supplies just encourages MORE death, both Palestinian and Israeli. Look up Israeli bombing policy, they often use leaflets and loudspeakers to warn civilians away, and if Israel is committing genocide then why do this? Why only drop one bomb? Why not just carpet bomb the camp?

>>64232799
>>64232795
Oh, are you guys jews?

>>64232784
There actually are rules for that. If Israel had dropped a 2000 pound bomb on the site, that WOULD have been a warcrime, because even in a situation where civilian casualties are inevitable, they are still under onus to keep things to a minimum. Instead, they hit it with something small enough that the secondaries are more impactful than the incoming weapon itself. Now if you want to take that angle, you can probably find actual, verifiable instances of Israel doing something wrong by not doing their part. Instead you're crying that it's not fair for the civvies that Hamas keeps getting punished for breaking the rules.

>>64232807
No, just IQ over 40.

>>64232807
Nope. I just find thus whole "hide weapons among civilians and then cry about it when they die" to be quite repulsive. Knowing they cant win the war and knowing the jews will not stop, Hamas has decided to maximize civvie casualties to create as much political pressure as possible.

>>64232835
You don't even seem to consider the civilian's perspective, just Hamas and Israel.

>>64232842
Hamas is actively committing crimes against civilians that result in their deaths. That is abhorrent and needs to be stopped. Simple as.

>>64232842
Nigger, you're the one bending over backwards to try and come up with why it's Israel's fault Hamas is doing warcrimes against their own civvies. Yeah, they don't want to get bombed, I wouldn't either, and if Hamas would STOP PUTTING THEM IN THE FUCKING LINE OF FIRE, they wouldn't.

>>64230648
no it's not, retard

>>64231112
>>64232812

There are thousands of instances of extended families wiped out while sleeping as collateral damage over someone with suspected Hamas association living in the house

Here’s a big list of investigations; the victims all have the same last name in the vast majority of them:

https://airwars.org/civilian-casualties/page/39/?country=palestinian-territories&belligerent=israeli-military&post_type=civ&start_date=2023-10-07

>>64232847
Stopped by killing said civilians, using a technique that evidently doesn't work after 2 years of trying

>>64232861
If Israel STOPPED FIRING ON THEM they wouldn't be burning alive in their tents

>>64232885
>just reward the bad behavior, they're not stopping anyway
Never have children.

>>64232893
It clearly doesn’t even remotely work at all though. Hamas doesn’t care at all if you kill 50 children to kill a soldier, it’s in fact a win for them since it makes so many people who didn’t care before so angry at Israel. It’s not been a good strategy for Israel’s reputation at all

>>64232908
>I see through the optics game
>it still works on me though
So are you getting paid, or are you actually a woman? I'll tell you what the civilians in Gaza should be doing, they should be beating every Hamas nigger they see to death in self-defense. Normalizing hostage-taking is not an acceptable outcome and every subhuman that engages in it deserves to die in agony.

>>64232842
>moving the goalpost again

>>64232522
>The Israeli people would support such an invasion?
I specifically mentioned Netanyahu. Maybe I shouldn't have put it in parenthesis in case of pedantic autists like yourself. I'm not that oblivious to the fact that the Israeli people aren't necessarily thrilled about it, but Netanyahu and his clique run things. People bitch about shit the US Gov't does even though Americans don't 100% support, they bitch about shit Russia's Gov't does even though they don't 100% support it (and flee the fucking country). People can bitch about Israel and the stupid shit their Gov't does.
>complain that Israel did nothing to stop Hamas taking over Gaza.
I know they stopped dealing with the PLO as much around the same time that Hamas was beginning to sprout up, even though the PLO had mellowed out a lot (which is part of why Hamas sprang up)

>>64232795
>Isreal is not targeting civilians

>>64230717
9M22C Incendiary Grad rockets use magnesium cups filled with a thermite-like mixture to start fires. That's what your clip shows. Not white phosphorus.

>>64233064
>but Netanyahu and his clique run things.
Netanyahu is riding the tiger and can't get off. The only reason why Netanyahu's government hasn't collapsed from the increasingly angry and disillusioned majority of Israeli society demanding a stop to their sons coming home in body bags, a comprehensive inquiry to the 10/7 attacks and why the hostages weren't the first priority in all of this is because the moderates (ie. those more angry at/afraid of Hamas than the government but not in the "YEAH BULLDOZE 'EM" camp) want Hamas defeated first. Netanyahu has a personal motivation to drag things out as long as possible and on the other hand if he stops short of TPD and annexing as much Palestinian territory as he can get away with then his right-wing coalition will happily feed him to the wolves.

When the fighting finally stops in Israel there is going to be a very ugly political reckoning.

>>64233123
>When the fighting finally stops in Israel there is going to be a very ugly political reckoning.
That's pretty much what I've been expecting. It took a good 4 or 5 years after 9/11 for the "wait, what the fuck are we doing" to settle in and get around the zeitgeist. They'll have a big crash-out and a lot of political shit going on heading into the 30s.

>>64232716
Good b8

>>64232611
It's impressive the mental gymnastics thirdies will go to in order to avoid accountability for themselves or their peers.
Let's do a simple thought experiment.

How would you react if the US had a stockpile of munitions detonate which was in the middle of a crowded marketplace during the occupation of Iraq? Would you be blaming the ones who destroyed the weapons of the western imperialists hell bent on erasing the Iraqui way of life, or would you be screaming and crying on every single platform that would listen to your drivel that the evil western imperialists had the gall to stockpile munitions in a civilian area where they knew for a fact there would be mass collateral damage if they were attacked and that they were deliberately using that crowded market as a shield?

>>64230726
>killing human shields should be a war crime too
Agreed, Israel is so quick to talk about Hamas using human shields. Yet they are so fond of shooting at the shields anyways just to get the guys behind them. Jewish tricks.

>>64230989
Why not both? Taking human shields is bad, shooting them is worse. Either a lack of aim or a presence of malice is to blame.

>>64232721
Hopefully upon themselves, turn the entire area into an open air pyre. Remember, Samson died with the Philistines too.

>>64233282
>taking hostages is bad
>that's why you should encourage them to take more
Silence, dune coon.

>>64230989
i agree, that line of kibbutzim between the gaza border and IDF military installations should be recognised as a warcrime

>>64233064
>I know they stopped dealing with the PLO as much around the same time that Hamas was beginning to sprout up, even though the PLO had mellowed out a lot (which is part of why Hamas sprang up)
The Israelis deliberately supported Hamas in its initial internal power struggle with PLO, specifically because PLO had been trying to move away from violent resistance, and into institutionalist/structuralist measures (ex. petitioning the UN for membership, attempting to enter various int'l orgs). Which the Israelis were weak at combatting.

>>64233106
I'm responding 3 hours later just to call you a worthless retard because I put the fucking name on the webm

>>64230989
>"Hostis Humani Generis" and all of your "human rights" should be null and void.
Considering Israel have been using those for decades, they have indeed lost both.

>>64232879
Yeah it is.

>>64233401
This is an absurd claim to make, because Israel only supported Hamas in the mid 80s when they were a non-violent charity organization. Israel support to Hamas ended abruptly as soon as Hamas carried out its first violent attack.

>>64232258
>kill all jews!!!
>WTF? why jews want to kill us all?!?!?! KILL ALL JEWS!!!!!!!!!!!

>>64233456
Tying someone on the hood is what you do when there's nowhere else you can/want to put inside in army vehicle. If I cared enough about your shitty post I would post the photo of an injured US soldier being evacuated on the hood of a Humvee.

>>64230616 (OP)
White phosphorus is used for one of two things, producing a lot of smoke for concealment or setting a large radius of shit on fire.
In either case, the best way to deploy it is through an airbusrst, which is not happening in your video.
Notice how the burning fragments don't produce that much smoke (nowhere near enough for concealment) and how they visibly dim even while still in the air (unlike white phosphorus which burns for a while)
This looks more like a weapons cache being hit

WP is usually airburst and there's not enough thick white smoke off the blast and trailing the sparks besides. Prolly some secondary material off something it hit.

>>64230616 (OP)
Looks like those thermite rounds for the Grad.

>>64232721
This kind of shit is what makes me wish for a final solution more, not less.

>>64231261
>bulldoze the entire Gaza Strip into the ocean, civilians and buildings alike
I, too, Heimi Goldenstein from Jewrusalem Oblast, also am such a moderate as yourself.

>>64231290
>How do you know they knew?
And no palestanian space scientist knew anything at all about humass looting billions of dollars in aid to Gaza ... for the last two decades ... to build a network of underground bunkers and tunnels and stock them up with billions of dollars of Iranian weapons in preparation for Oct 7. It all "just happened WTF" without anybody having any clue whatsoever and appeared someday out of nowhere.

Allah does, indeed, work in Very Mysterious Ways.

>>64231304
You left out the part where mudhommad liked to feltch pig anus after his cult followers pulled a train on a sow's ass. So I've heard. Everyone is talking about it.

>>64230616 (OP)
That's a secondary. Looks like solid fuel propellant cooking off. IDF scored themselves rocket.

>>64232460
kek hamas ruined irans plans
so no they're not a pawn
and hamas was elected and remains the more popular than the PA in the palestinian territories

>>64232507
traditionally the advisory never gave a single shit about the its enemy's civilian population well being
which is why protections were put in place with international law
they weren't put in place for death cults to abuse

also killing civilians per se isn't a war crime
targeting is

>>64230717
That guy with the solar panels in his back yard sweating bullets.

>>64230726
>And killing human shields should be a war crime too, I don't care if it makes it harder to kill that guy you really wanna kill, wait until he's not surrounded by 50 unaware children.
Oh but those 50 children have been told by their non rationalist non liberal mentors there is nothing more glorious than to die for the cause, what do?
The problem with you anon is you are scientist, you think rules, good will and science magically fix reality, you somehow ignore your own scientific data about tit for tat game theory shows you need to punch back as good as you get, only then the other ape figures out no one gives a crap about its crocodile tears. Even Pinker bothered to use research rather than dopamine induced thoughts.

>>64230980
There's a reason why it won two world wars brother.

>>64234022
zigger zerg waves won world war 2

>>64233476
ok, if you like outing yourself as a moron, do as you please

>>64233198
>its impressive the mental gymnastics I do to paint you as the strawman I want you to be
Why do you fags assume I'm automatically defending Hamas if I'm criticizing Israel for carelessly murdering unaware human shields? No, Hamas did something very bad by putting munitions there, Israel did something equally bad by killing the surrounding civilians with zero regard for their safety or care to separate them from the target, when it could easily be done with no consequences. As if Israel doesn't have absolute control of the "battlefield" from the sky and is in the slightest bit more danger if they wait for daylight and let these people evacuate before striking.

Every "Deus Vult" and Christian crusader type, including the standing Secretary of War, should be asking themselves why literal Islamists are the only ones doing the work of protecting Christian holy sites and the Christians native to the Holy Land from zionist genocide.

Then they should ask themselves why Christian nations are upholding this genocide of their own Christian brothers in the Holy Land. The answer to this question: Bribery, blackmail, and blasphemous lies.

Lord God bring us a day when the Christians of the West wake up and come to our aid. When they remember that is both possible and necessary to fight a war for the sake of what is righteous and good.

>>64234102
Did you just stop shilling up the meg thread to start shilling here?

>>64233982
>Oh but those 50 children have been told by their non rationalist non liberal mentors there is nothing more glorious than to die for the cause, what do?
Kids don't want to die horribly no matter what they're told. All these arguments just amount to "you don't understand bro they're literally LOTR orcs and they really WANT to die just to make us look bad, aren't these kids evil??"

>tit for tat game theory shows you need to punch back as good as you get, only then the other ape figures out no one gives a crap about its crocodile tears.
Except you've been doing it for 2 years, still constantly killing huge numbers of unaware human shields and getting more and more global condemnation for it daily. They don't "figure it out" no matter how merciless you are because they want you to recklessly kill their civilians and become the bad guy (exactly what's happening and it's insane all the people I see ITT who are in denial about this, just covering their eyes and ears and pretending all outrage comes from 2 paid shills)

>>64234102
>>64234125
Its not going to work.

>>64234125
>noooo! You're not allowed to defend yourself because the other guy is hiding behind civilians
Wrong.

>>64234132
It already has, you just have too much hubris to admit it. It’s a shame you didn’t take it more seriously before it got to this point. Opinions have changed + hardened in reaction to all this killing, and anti-AIPAC is now a mainstream political position

>>64234147
and yet, the war continues and will continue until Hamas is destroyed.
>you
I'm not Israeli. I am a /k/ommando and your shill script of "you cant defend yourself if the other guy creates collateral" will never ever work here.

>>64231290
>How do you know they knew?
They attacked it and the resulting secondary explosion(s) are exactly the sort you'd get from bombing rockets or other kinds of munition that involves explosives and rocket fuel.
The alternative is, what, they just guessed and it turned out lucky?
>They probably didn't.
Why not?
Intelligence gathering isn't rocket science, you have people in observation posts making note of which known militants go where and interact with whom, you've got collaborators snitching for money, some kind of preferential treatment or because they have a bone to pick with Hamas, you've got prisoners they can interrogate and there's always the Achilles heel of all modern organizations, OSINT.

>Otherwise they would have moved further away.
>They'd have no reason to doubt Israel would strike like this by that point.
Ah, now THAT is an intelligent question, Israel demonstrably attacks weapon caches and assassination targets even when they're in places such an attack would cause a lot of collateral, so why do these weapon caches end up in the middle of a dense civilian population?
You're right that Hamas aren't retarded enough to think it would stop Israel from attacking, which means the decision to place these caches there was made with the understanding that when they're discovered it will lead to a lot of civilian casualties.
So why do they constantly put those caches there?
It's not for concealment because Israel finds them.
It's not to deter Israel from attacking there because, as you said, by now they'd know this would happen.

That leaves one option, Hamas is placing their assets in such a way that attacking them would maximize their own civilian population's casualties.
And how does maximizing their own civilian casualties serve them? just check the news.
Hamas itself hasn't been able to do shit to stand in Israel's way, the only roadblock it encounters is international pressure.
In short, the more dead palis, the more likely Hamas is to survive

>>64234155
An effort should be made to protect the collateral while still destroying the target. Acting like the urgency to destroy it is so great that they have to be killed immediately without warning is utter horse shit. This war is 95% a series of airstrike assassinations against targets who have zero air defense or any idea it's coming. Basically they have to live in fear of randomly exploding at any moment because someone around them might be hiding something. Sounds exactly like the air of terror and fear that terrorism is specifically used to cultivate.

Currently, minimal effort is made in the area of civilian safety and it's almost like the IDF considers more collateral damage a good thing because there's less people to have to deal with later. Like 'kill as many as we can get away with because we can just blame it on them and get away with it no matter how disproportionate'. The number of whole families wiped out certainly reflects this.

>>64234191
Yes. War is scary.

>>64231369
>surely Hamas and palis can't be this retarded, the dindu
From their own words:
https://avalon.law.yale.edu/21st_century/hamas.asp

>"Ye are the best nation that hath been raised up unto mankind: ye command that which is just, and ye forbid that which is unjust, and ye believe in Allah. And if they who have received the scriptures had believed, it had surely been the better for them: there are believers among them, but the greater part of them are transgressors. They shall not hurt you, unless with a slight hurt; and if they fight against you, they shall turn their backs to you, and they shall not be helped. They are smitten with vileness wheresoever they are found; unless they obtain security by entering into a treaty with Allah, and a treaty with men; and they draw on themselves indignation from Allah, and they are afflicted with poverty. This they suffer, because they disbelieved the signs of Allah, and slew the prophets unjustly; this, because they were rebellious, and transgressed." (Al-Imran - verses 109-111).

>Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" (The Martyr, Imam Hassan al-Banna, of blessed memory).

What part of palis being genocidal an racists isn't clear? It's because they can't afford the Hugo Boss uniforms?

>>64234147
>Opinions have changed + hardened in reaction to all this killing, and anti-AIPAC is now a mainstream political position
Go read contemporary history, since its inception in 1946 Israel has survived everything from sanctions and embargoes to full scale invasion and UN being run by a former nazi:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Waldheim
Now I guess you think I am a glowie or some jew, I am not, I am some random office guy who likes cheese and bacon burgers but after taking my time to read about world history and listen to both sides and then some reality checks concluded palis fucked it up and are in the same situation Nazi Germany in 1945, with the downside of millions of retards excusing their bad choices.

>>64234191
>An effort should be made to protect the collateral while still destroying the target.
>Currently, minimal effort is made in the area of civilian safety and it's almost like the IDF considers more collateral damage a good thing
When the target is a building they give evacuation notices a solid hour beforehand in the form of personal phone calls and charges that shake the building without damaging it.
When the IDF wants to assassinate a person (or people) in an apartment they fire rockets into that apartment, as can be seen by photos where a building is intact save for the target apartment.
The IDF also regularly issues evacuation notices on a per-neighborhood basis a good while before going in.

What else can they do? any situation that would neuter the IDF and prevent them from attacking an area will be taken advantage of by Hamas, just like >>64231206 said.
Frankly, whenever I hear someone use this argument and ask them "what SHOULD they do than?" they belong to one of two groups
1. The people who didn't think about it and are often not too concerned with coming up with an alternative, because the "It's not their job" and "the experts should just know how to make it so". (In this case the "experts" are soldiers but this line of thinking is depressingly common in all walks of life, ESPECIALLY politics)
2. People who argue in bad faith that there IS nothing Israel can do that isn't a war crime, aside from just taking it. (replace Israel with Ukraine and you get the exact same bad-faith argument coming from ziggers)

>>64234235
The history of the Palistinians is a history of them fucking up. The "Nakba" only resulted because they tried to nakba the Jews and (ironically) lost so severely they got nakba'd themselves. Had they not tried to wipe the Jews out in 1948, they would control most of modern day Israel. Alas, they fucked around.

>>64234199
Yes, believing every Palestinian including their kids is a Hamas radical-Islam zealot who you condemn to death is extremely racist and dehumanizing. Individual people have their own thoughts and minds and don't just follow the Hamas charter in their heads like a mindless drone.
Anywhere on earth, the overwhelming majority of people just want to live and aren't willing to get killed for politics. And you're trying to convince me that even the kids there are itching to die because of how bad it'll make Israel look? give me a break.
The narcissism to think that their entire existence revolves around fantasies of killing and torturing you is literally crazy

>>64234235
Israel has never come remotely close to being in as bad a position as it is now internationally. Arab states unsurprisingly sanctioning them for colonizing their area means nothing

>massive amounts of combusting matter thrown up from the ground
Probably rocket propellant or HE being struck by a small bomb and being thrown outwards.
Take note that a lot of the material is burning in the air which means that it didn't explode in the initial explosion so it's not from the exploding munition itself.

Guess it's an ammo dump hit by an air dropped bomb or something.

>>64230726
Franc tireurs have no protections under the Geneva conventions. Parties that never ratified them also have no protections, nor obligations to obey them. Parties that commit forbidden acts like hiding military infrastructure under protected places or using human shields lose protections. Parties that repeatedly and constantly violate those accords themselves forfeit those protections. Guess which ones apply to Hamas (hint it's all of them).

>>64234242
>everyone wants to genocide me!!!! Stop thinking about genociding me!! You want to do it AGAIN, like the Germans did, don't you? Well I'll genocide you FIRST then you'll see hahaha...
Like a damaged survivor of child abuse who beats his own kids later in life. Nobody deserves to get genocided, nobody. Threatening genocide does not justify genocide of those who made the threat.

>>64233689
Never heard that part but the rest od what the other anon said is in the Koran

>>64234274
They also apply to Israel though, they build tons of their military and air defense facilities in the city and under hospitals. That one hospital hit by Iran missiles had a huge IDF headquarters under it.
Combined with the insane ratio of tangible civilian deaths, I'd say Israel is even worse than Hamas in terms of war crimes. Just because Hamas is all bark and no bite for 2 years while Israel is actually killing insane numbers of civilians

>>64234278
>start a war with the explicit intention of genociding someone
>they beat you in that war and ensure that you can never again threaten them with genocide!
>waaaaaa!
Kick rocks.

>>64234297
>That one hospital hit by Iran missiles had a huge IDF headquarters under it.
seems like projection tbqh

>>64234297
Is this fucking satire or something?

>>64234102
>the West aiding muslims
They do, to the tune of millions of $ in welfare & benefits every single day paid to useless immigrants.

>>64234247
>Israel has never come remotely close to being in as bad a position as it is now
I dont know about that but what I do know is that Hamas, Hezbollah and Iran have suffered a generational defeat and are in an utter shambles.

>>64233508
Do not go full retard, mutt child.

>>64230718
Hate everyone involved in this whole conflict but hate Israel the most.
Their behavior that created and perpetuates the whole Israel/Palestine conflict really just disgusts the shit out of me.

>>64234297
>they build tons of their military and air defense facilities in the city
Israel has military bases in cities, sure (like IDF HQ being dead smack in the middle of Tel Aviv) but those are actual military BASES.
That is, it's a closed compound where everyone inside is a soldier and everyone outside isn't, it's close to civilian population but there's a very clear separation between one and another and there's no ambiguity about whether military or civilian infrastructure has been hit.
Hamas, on the other hand, is EMBEDDED in this civilian infrastructure.
They dress as civilians (except for appearing on television and in parades), they operate from civilian infrastructure that has absolutely no business pulling double-duty as a base for an armed anything (Hospitals, houses of worship, schools) and they build their actual dedicated installations (the tunnels) beneath population centers and connecting to and from the aforementioned civilian infrastructure, meaning there is no way to attack it without attacking these places.
And you might be tempted to argue "It's by necessity and not choice", but whenever the IDF issues evacuation orders saying they're about to bomb/attack/enter an area, Hamas bends over backwards for people NOT to do that, including threatening them with violence or death.
Meaning, Hamas goes out of its way to preserve the situation in which they're mixed with the population.
As I said, It is within Hamas' interest to cause as many Palestinian casualties as possible, because that generates sympathy, which generates international pressure on Israel, which improves the chances of Hamas staying in control of Gaza after the war.

>That one hospital hit by Iran missiles had a huge IDF headquarters under it.
Now THAT'S cope

>>64234308
what? You just can't believe it? In all those videos of missile barrages during the Iran war you could constantly see air defense launchers shooting their missiles from the middle of the city, because they were placed there so they'd be surrounded by human shields

https://x.com/shaunking/status/1933962304082547195

Here's a video of the IDF unquestionably organizing and meeting inside a hospital. Seen a bunch of IDF soldiers posting pics of them hiding inside schools too, during the Iran war.
Accounting for the actual dozens of times I've seen "every accusation a confession" be proven true with Israel, there is not even the slightest reason to doubt that they would use human shields around IDF facilities. In fact they would justify it by saying that their enemies do it first, if the proof became utterly undeniable (like the proof of genocide has been). But for now they just deny it.

Using human shields by either side is despicable, and wantonly killing them like it's your chance to get as many of possible since you can still blame it all on Hamas is just as despicable.

>>64234380
This looks like a pretty bog standard military hospital

>>64234380
>air defense launchers shooting their missiles from the middle of the city, because they were placed there so they'd be surrounded by human shields
Or maybe because they were there to protect those civilian targets...

>>64234278
What the fuck are you babbling about you drooling retard, the Palestinians with the support of 8 different Muslim countries invaded Israel-Palestine with the expressed objective of killing every Jew there. The nakaba just had the Palestinians get kicked out, not completely wiped out.

>>64234380
>see air defense launchers shooting their missiles from the middle of the city, because they were placed there so they'd be surrounded by human shields
Iron Dome is in cities because its designed to protect cities. Nevertheless, its now permissible to attack targets despite the high risk of collateral damage? You've spent the last 21 hours making the exact opposite argument.
>Here's a video of the IDF unquestionably organizing and meeting inside a hospital
So, if a hospital is staffed by soldiers - a military hospital, if you will - its then permissible to hit that hospital?

>le both sides posting this hard
Yes I'm sure you're totally bipartisan, Mr. Organic Poster who is definitely not a thirdie having a meltdown across multiple threads.

>>64234380
That's a military hospital you fucking retard.

>>64234410
>>64234422
they literally have 800 miles of space between Iran and Israel in which to intercept Iran's missiles. In fact 95% of them were shot down by US bases, ships and allies in Iraq and the rest of the middle east long before they got near Israel; the Iron Dome is shit and surrounded by insane propaganda to protect Israel's propaganda of invincibility and the US military industrial complex.
The launchers don't need to be inside the city to intercept the incoming ballistic missiles. They are just there to make them slightly less likely to be struck and so Israel can accuse Iran of targeting civilians

>>64234441
>The launchers don't need to be inside the city to intercept the incoming ballistic missiles.
>They are just there to make them slightly less likely to be struck and so Israel can accuse Iran of targeting civilians
You've just conceded your entire 21 hour argument. If it is wrong for Isreal to do it, it is wrong for Hamas to do it. By your own admission. A self-inflicted TKO.

>>64234422
>is it permissible
No. Under the Geneva Conventions (which Hamas dosen't give a fuck about) medical facilities and medical personnel, even if military are not to be deliberately targeted. HOWEVER, if an enemy is using said hospital for offensive conduct (shooting from, observation, weapons storage) then that building loses it's protection. Same with medics, if they choose to use their service weapon then you can engage them as normal infantry.

>>64234454
Its a hypothetical. He complains that Isreal strike Gaza hospitals which Israel says has HQ's under them, yet argues it was permissible for Iran to strike an Israeli hospital because soldiers were present in it. These are contradictory positions.

>>64234441
>Trying to make hot takes about iron dome placement
>Doesn't even know the difference between mid course interception of missiles vs launch/terminal phase interception
Not gonna read any of the rest of your shit because you obviously have no fucking clue what you're talking about lmao

>>64234036
No it was Colt 1911.

>>64234380
>air defense launchers being placed in population centers is a war crime
I can't help but wonder if you believe yourself or if you're being retarded on purpose because outrage is more effective than thought out arguments.
No, AA in population centers isn't a war crime, AA placement is determined by the needed coverage, there's no choice there.
Plus I'd bet both my kidneys those interceptors were launched from clear military installations.
>Here's a video of the IDF unquestionably organizing and meeting inside a hospital.
Nigger what you're showing here is a military hospital set up in a car park (you can even see the parking spaces)
When countries (any country) expect a mass casualty incident they set up these things and more often than not the military's involved because they have the manpower, knowledge and infrastructure to throw up an ad-hoc field hospital
Mass casualty incidents such as, oh, I don't know, a ballistic missile barrage, kind of like
>during the Iran war.
yeah
>>64234441
>they literally have 800 miles of space between Iran and Israel in which to intercept Iran's missiles. In fact 95% of them were shot down by US bases, ships and allies in Iraq and the rest of the middle east long before they got near Israel;
You're imagining interception as launching a parabolic missile to meet another parabolic projectile half-way, that's not how it works.
Interceptors don't have range because they use on their fuel on very sharp maneuvers to hit a missile which can and will change its course either on purpose (to combat AA) or just because rocketry is hard.
And that's not even taking into account radar only goes so far and without it you can't know precisely where the incoming missile is and where it's (probably) going to land, which you HAVE to know to get an interceptor to explode next to it.
>the Iron Dome is shit
The iron dome isn't what intercepts ballistic missiles, it intercepts short range missiles.

>>64234449
you are a retarded direction-brain literally incapable of separating Hamas from Gazan civilians. I am not arguing for Hamas, fuck Hamas, they are awful and the reason for all of this and they provide ZERO leadership in this crisis, only an excuse for Israel to keep killing. And there is undeniable proof that they've been funded and bolstered by Israel for years. I can't in good faith blame the Gazan civilians for what Hamas says or does when Israel has so blatantly tampered with their government and ensured it ended up a specific way.

I argue for the civilians and against Israel's bad faith argument that they've got no choice but to kill 83% civvies (leaked from IDF) in this incredibly bloody and careless way.

>>64234441
Do you not know what short range air defence is?

>>64234483
>I argue for the civilians
and yet >>64234297
Is it okay to strike civilian targets that contain military instillations or not?

>So many civilians have died!
Get mad at Hamas. They use them as shields so they get hurt.

>>64234468
Doesn't matter, shilling is about pumping a narrative.
To you mixing "striking hospital - BAD" and "striking hospital - GOOD", but the message he's trying to get across is "Jews - BAD"
You don't need to beat anyone in an argument, just outlast their patience and then you're free to pump your dumbass agenda

>>64234483
>I argue for the civilians and against Israel's bad faith argument that they've got no choice but to kill 83% civvies (leaked from IDF) in this incredibly bloody and careless way.
I can't wait to hear your idea for what Israel SHOULD do in that case.
Go on, surprise me, how should Israel conduct the war so that it's neither a war criminal and Hamas doesn't get a checkmate where Israel literally can't respond?

>>64234468
I never said it was permissible, I said Israel was again proven a hypocrite for the 1 millionth time

>>64234509
holy fuck always with the identity politics, no I dont think "Jews - BAD" you fucking retard

>>64234501
>Get mad at Hamas.
sure but I'll also be mad at Israel and so will everyone else except its zionist defenders, you think they should be blameless

>>64234538
Israel should try to assassinate Palantir-designated "potential Hamas associates" (given a numeric score) when they are not surrounded by their entire extended family who is 70% women and children. Instead, it's literally a policy to wait til 1AM to kill the whole sleeping clan at once. See any of the thousands of incidents at:
https://airwars.org/civilian-casualties/page/39/?country=palestinian-territories&belligerent=israeli-military&post_type=civ&start_date=2023-10-07

In incidents like the OP, they should wait til daytime and warn the people to evacuate from around the site before striking it, They're not gonna just sneak away xx tons of heavy launchers in 30 minutes without Israel noticing.

>and Hamas doesn't get a checkmate where Israel literally can't respond?
why so black and white? Of course they can respond, it just makes it slightly harder when you can't say "human shields don't matter b/c it's only their fault". They are being killed almost without retaliation like fish in a barrel

How about this: You have to warn human shields before you kill them, or it's a war crime.

Killing unaware human shields without giving them a chance to escape is wrong.
If that means your target might escape due to the warning, then you should think of a better time / place to kill him, or do it in such a way where you can keep him trapped in the same place while the human shields evacuate, or just kill them all and eat the war crime.

People will understand if it's to assassinate someone important, like a named enemy commander. For lesser militants, like these ones given a 'Hamas score' by AI and designated a potential junior member, they should not be allowed to eat the war crime and pretend it's not a crime over and over, killing whole families like they've done thousands of times now

>>64230616 (OP)
Weirdly explosive tents they got out there.

>>64234677
>>64234796
And what if there ARE no opportunities like this?
Let's say some kind of foreign military decided to assassinate you, they've got two options.
Either march someone over there to put a bullet in you personally or fire some explosive projectile remotely to kill you.
Let's also assume your countrymen are hostile to this armed force, meaning that if they march some infantry over to you through the street, your neighbors would be happy to throw heavy shit on them or outright shoot at them if they have the means.
If you live in a city, the path to your house involves going through a street that has a LOT of vantage points for your neighbors to do that, a street is basically a killing zone.
Plus there's a good chance the ensuing commotion would alert you to what's happening, which would allow you to escape or prepare for a last "fuck you".

So personally getting there is a poor choice for an army that doesn't treat its soldiers like cannon fodder, meaning plan B is to launch some missile at you.
Chances are you live in a city so I want you to really think about it.
When was the last time you were far enough from other people that if you were to get drone'd there would be no collateral? (human collateral specifically, ignoring property)
The vast majority of your life, without even intending it, you are in a position where you can't be droned without other people being hurt.
You're either at an apartment which you share with family/roommates, at work around other people, at school around a LOT of other people, on the road around many other people or on the way to any of the former.
The only times you might be alone enough is if you drive very late at night or go hiking or on vacation.
If you knew this enemy was waiting for you to do that to drone you, you could easily stay around other people forever without making much of a change in your life.

I don't think YOU think fighting a war waiting for those rare slip-ups is feasible

>>64235184
If the target is really that important to hit, go ahead. Obviously, countries like the USA and Israel can get away with lots of war crimes before anyone really challenges them. Nobody's gonna be mad if the target was known and important.
If it's some suspected low level paper pusher in his home w/ family, is it really that urgent to kill him at all anyway? He will surely just get replaced by someone else on the same day. You know where he lives and can just wait to kill him when he is not surrounded by 50 civilians, if you have to. Israel has quadcopter drones watching everywhere.
I honestly think assassinations are just an ugly, terroristic strategy in general. I've never seen any country use them as extensively as Israel.

Blame for human shield deaths (which should always be a war crime) should be split equally between the both parties. They would no longer be considered protected after having been warned for a certain time. There needs to be a penalty to dissuade this behavior, because it's inhumane to civilians and I would never want it being used against me with the justification that it's legal

>>64235378
No matter how many times you try to just bluntly repeat yourself like some kind of autistic loser that literally cannot comprehend that others don't share your mindset you are not going to get anything but scorn from people who are already used to your bad-faith nonstop verbal flatulence, why don't you go cry to Hamas if you are this insistent on saving the poor widdle Palestinians from the evil Jew? Or better yet why don't you go cry your crocodile tears over on normie social media and fucking stay there? They love this kind of tactless blunt sophistry, you'll fit right in.

>>64235544
cope, seethe and dilate, ZOG troon. I don't care what morally bankrupt genocidal subhumans think

>>64235588
Oh I guess you're done even pretending now, what a surprise that you were never arguing in good faith anyways. How shocking, it's almost like everyone in this thread knew this from the very first post you made.

>>64235378
What's "that important"? do the grunts doing the shooting and the ambushing count?
What you're offering is, in practice, for the IDF to not attack ANYONE but top command and only when they make the mistake of standing alone somewhere in the gaza strip, one of the most densely populated regions in the world.
And even with that you're not proposing this as something which wouldn't be a "war crime", you're bringing this up as a "war crime Israel and the USA could get away with"
So what you're saying is that so long as Hamas militants and command keep themselves surrounded by civvies and operate out of hospitals, It's impossible to do anything against them without it being a war crime.

There is no rule of law which (save for surrendering) allows one side to place its forces in such a way that they can participate in combat from it and the opposing side cannot fight back against them.
And no, the guilt isn't shared between the person using a human shield and the person killing both.
If you were in a situation where some crazed gunman grabs a human shield by the throat with one hand and shoots into a crowd of people with the other, and you had the option to shoot him by also killing the hostage, that wouldn't make you a murderer

>>64235588
>Le both sides poster outs xerself as a seething /pol/troon
Sad! But, many such cases.

>>64235588
Aaaaand meltie

>>64235596
>>64235773
I'm not arguing in bad faith at all, I barely cared about any of this shit 2 years ago and neither did the vast majority of those outraged now. Then I saw dozens of horrific incidents on video and all these people like you denying, insulting and pearl clutching in defense of it.
Zionists bring hate upon themselves by enabling and defending war crimes while unironically believing that any hate or pushback resulting from it just comes out of thin air, from jealousy or bigotry. As if the anger about all the the war crimes is just an act to excuse stirring up senseless hate against them. No, stop being so fucking narcissistic, it's not all about you. It's about what Israel is doing.

People don't like seeing that shit from their allies and especially don't like being told to STFU for questioning why our taxes pay for it.

>>64235782
>be /pol/estine
>slaughter entire Jewish villages in the 1800’s & early 1900s, before anything resembling occupation - wikipedia.org/wiki/1834_looting_of_Safed, wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tel_Hai, wikipedia.org/wiki/1920_Nebi_Musa_riots, wikipedia.org/wiki/1929_Hebron_massacre
>start 100% of the wars between Israel & Palestine, always targeting civilians
>never make a peace offer, rejected deals or proposals in 1919, ’20, ’22, ’37, ’38, ’47, ’67, ’78, ’94, ’95, 2000, ’01, ’05, ’08, ’09, ’14
>try to overthrow Jordan (Black September)
>start Lebanese Civil War, massacre thousands of Christians
>betray Kuwait & support Saddam's invasion
>turn down Camp David
>respond to 9/11 by dancing in the streets https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqZBy09vCVk
>refuse to field uniformed combatants
>refuse to stop using hospitals, mosques, schools, & maternity wards to launch strikes & store munitions
>refuse to abide by any ceasefires
>use little children as suicide bombers - wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_of_child_suicide_bombers_by_Palestinian_militant_groups
>waste tens of billions in foreign aid enriching corrupt leadership & luxury car dealerships
>commit heinous act of murder & rape on American, French, British, Italian, Thai, Nepalese, Philippine citizens not involved in the conflict
>parade naked women’s corpses around on your vehicles, tortured & beheaded foreign captives, desecrate corpses while streaming it worldwide
>immediately turn around & beg the world for help when the bombs start falling
>insist that you’re allowed to rape a man’s wife & murder his children if you run home to hide behind your family
Religion of peace by the way, and if you start asking questions like: 'Why are so many members of a particular ethnoreligious group of 2 billion with 50 countries under their control obsessed with waging holy jihad against a tiny country the size of New Jersey?' you're the colonialist genocider.

>>64235782
Ah yes, the concerned American taxpayer line. Yes, truly I have been convinced now that you are trying to deflect to American politics. I thought this was about Israel?
Orange man bad? Orange man good? Orange man... Anything at all to change the subject? Clearly these evil /k/ posters don't care about Palestinian civilians, I know, I'll try to make it about their tax dollars!

You know what? I fully support my taxes going to Israel if it means that they will be used to cull the hordes of inbred bloodthirsty dogs at the source. However I must admit that I'd rather have them go to giving Budanov the means to obliterate Russian shill farms. What do you think of that, shill-kun? Gonna call me a kike? That's usually what's next on your script when someone won't submit to your feeble attempt at browbeating.

>>64235782
>I barely cared about any of this shit 2 years ago
Me too, then Hamas thought it would be a good idea to broadcast the butchering of civilians, rape of women, and parading corpses tied to the hoods of their vehicles on the internet then dare to cry the second they get crushed for their quite literally barbaric ways.
Go fuck yourself you inbred dog.

>>64235588
>

>>64235806
Nah Palestinians were being terrorized and massacred over 80+ years for trying defend their land and sovereignty from an invading colony made mostly of Europeans. There were many Jews and Christians who lived there in relative peace for thousands of years.

There is an unending cold war between Israel and the Muslim states (led by Iran) where they are trying to topple each other's governments and instill their own puppet ones; Israel has succeeded in doing this with most neighbors. Then we see Bibi openly admit that Israel is funding and bolstering Hamas to prevent peace.
Given those circumstances, I just can't blame the Palestinian people for what's happening to them. They are trapped, terrorized, blockaded, occupied and thoroughly manipulated by the most Hollywood tier intelligence agency. They would react differently if not forced into such a desperate, oppressed defensive position.
Herzl was just as interested in Argentina as Palestine for the site of Israel but picked the latter because it would probably attract more diaspora.

>>64235823
What I think is that you're beyond help and you should get shunned and cancelled for voicing your demented supremacist opinions openly. I'm sure you're certain I want to gas you, but I am against genocide

>>64235896
fuck Hamas
I'm not muslim btw

>>64235983
>I'm not muslim btw
So are you a puccian or a street shitter? Don't tell me- you're a "concerned American citizen"! ahahahaha ok faggot and I'm the second coming of Mohammed

>>64235983
When was the country of Palestine founded and by whom? What were its borders, capital, and major cities? What was its currency, official language, and primary religion? Who were its leaders prior to Arafat? Since there is no official country of Palestine today, what caused its demise and when did that occur? Why did Palestinians never try to become an independent country until after 1967? Why did the original PLO charter in 1964 say the West Bank belongs to Jordan and Gaza belongs to Egypt?
Finally, explain the following quotation by a senior member of the PLO:
>"The Palestinian people do not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian people' to oppose Zionism." - Senior PLO official Zuheir Mohsen, interviewed by James Dorsey, Trouw, March 31, 1977
>muh stolen land
The land expert representing the Jewish Agency before the Shaw Commission of 1929 claimed that 90% of lands bought up to that time came from absentee landlords. During the 1930s the proportion fell to 80%. In the last decade of the mandate they were about 73%." (Abraham Granovsky, Land Policy in Palestine, (New York: Bloch Publishing Company) 1940, pp. 3, 17ff.)
You don't get to start a war just because someone bought your old apartment and you want it back (after ethnically cleansing them from their homes throughout the Middle East, no less). If you gamble on killing everyone and lose, you don't get to then insist on conditions for peace almost a century later, launch terrorist attacks on civilians then run home to hide behind your wife and kids.

>>64235983
I, achmed burger of texas caliphate, agree with my brozzer. For far too long has the yiddish shaitan had their throats upon the necks of the most innocent virile warriors of palistine.

>>64230897
>30-50 Israelis died from their rockets from 2000-2023
>Attempted mass murder is acceptable if the one trying to do it is incompetent
really makes u think

>>64236008
>>64236025
Your hubris is absolutely insane. Is it supposed to be a rare thing for a white American man (yes me) to be mad about his govt providing weapons and funding to a genocide? Because from all the news I see, like half of the protestors you see anywhere are whites like Greta Thunberg or Aaron Bushnell

>>64236022
they were the native people living on the land for like 40 generations. Arabs mixed with them starting during the Muslim conquest, but it's still the same population. If Israel was established and had absorbed them as citizens when it annexed their lands, everything would be fine. But instead it ethnic cleansed them and chased the vast majority out. Now it is trying to expel them altogether in Gaza

>>64236132
>Is it supposed to be a rare thing for a white American man (yes me)
post guns.

>>64236129
>black and white again
the urgency to blow targets up right away ASAP even if it means killing 50 civilians is not warranted when their capacity to commit said mass murder is basically 0%. Just warn them first

>>64236132
Yes habibi, like I said, I, achmed burger from the texas caliphate, agree with you. We must defend our christian arab brozzers in the palestinian state.

>>64236132
If that's true, explain the Zuheir Mohsen quote. Explain why the original PLO charter in 1964 stated the West Bank belongs to Jordan and Gaza belongs to Egypt? Why didn't they try to establish an independent state before 1967?
So what percentage of the Israeli population is Arab, and how did they get there? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_citizens_of_Israel
Now tell us what happened to all the Jews who were living in the Middle East?
Decline of Jewish population:
Afghanistan 1948: 5,000 2019: 1
Iran 1948: 100,000 2016: ~9,800
Iraq 1948: 150,000 2017: 10
Tunisia 1948: 105,000 2017: 1,700
Algeria 1948: 140,000 2017: ~50
Libya 1948: 38,000 2019: 0
Lebanon 1948: 24,000 2017: 100
Egypt 1948: 75,000 2017: 20
Syria 1948: 30,000 2017: 100
Morocco 1948: 265,000 2017: 2,000
Bahrain 1948: 1,500 2018: ~35
Yemen 1948: 64,000 2017: 50
Oman 1948: 5,000 2019: 0
Pakistan 1948: 2,000 2017: 745 Families https://x.com/stats_feed/status/1712437145716019707

>>64236132
>Palestinian Christians
>conveniently leaving out Palestinian Arabs which make up 99% of the population (Muslim)
>image from THAT site
Done.