Thread 64438619

>no handloading thread
So what has everyone been working on lately?

>>64438693
He wasn't using a hot handload; he was using a sabot round on a gun with a muzzle brake.

>>64438825
You think muzzle brakes cause chamber pressure surge?

>>64438619 (OP)
not much. wanting to test BLC-2 And Win748 powder charges for my use in my M1 (IMR4895 is unobtainable or stupid expensive) and I have no cases prep. If I'm prepping cases might as well do them all. I have 2 3gal full rubbermaid containers of HXP and PPU cases. I am not motivated.

midway gave me the old switcheroo, I ordered what they said were normal .357 bullets but then these things show up. They're undersize, and too long for .357 brass, the bullets jam a good milllimeter into the rifling of my marlin and hit the forcing cone of my speed six. Accuracy seemed very good out of .38 brass though. At 6 cents apiece it's hard to be too mad, though they do drop the capacity of my 20" tube mag from 11 to 10. I wrote a 2 star review warning of the issues but they won't publish it.

Midway still has a different, normal 125gr .357 bullet for the same price, with a high cannelure and non-rolled jacket meplat, get some while the gettin's good.

>>64438619 (OP)
loaded around 80-90rds of 8x56r 200gr soft points with 43.5gr of H4895, 44gr seemed excessive and even though steyr M95 carbines are pretty harsh on recoil they seemed pretty close to the original 1938 stuff I got when I bought it. resizing the .338 speer hot-cor bullets is definitely for a light press, I ended up breaking one of the cast arms on my lee single stage press and ended up upgrading to an RCBS REBEL, even then the slugs have to be heavily lubricated.

Also the RCBS hand primer is fucking ASS
I get at least several primers out of 200 either sideways, mangled, doubled in the primer feeding ram, the lid doesn't hold them flat, the small primer plastic case holder adapter interferes with the priming rod, or the cylinder on the ram goes out of joint.
for being cheap that lee single stage had a great priming system

>>64439951
*not for a light press, I got through maybe 10 before I broke the poor lee with a bullet that wasn't lubed enough

>>64438825
If that was the problem it would have exploded the brake and not the action.

>>64439570
No, the sabot leaving the barrel and getting stuck in the brake is what's causing it, not the brake itself. The military understands this, its why the ammo he was shooting is rated for the Browning M2 only, not for anti-material rifles.

>>64440035
If you don't believe Kentucky Ballistics in his follow-up video, then watch gun jesus explain it; you can skip to 2:22 if you're in a hurry, but I recommend watching it without skipping forward. Every gun dude that covered it is in agreement that the sabot caused a bore obstruction that dangerously increased the pressure in the barrel.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=71OGayW7CnI

>>64440144
Interesting

Got a contender in 50 Alaskan. Turns out it’s actually “50 Alaskan mag” and appears to be a belted magnum cartridge that I’d be willing to bet was based off of 375 H&H mag brass. Currently waiting to hear back from someone who apparently knows a bit about it. Bummed I bought a box of 50 Alaskan ammo that I can’t use now (yet) but honestly I think if I can get confirmation on exactly what it is I can just reload it and while 50 Alaskan magnum appears like it has to be lower powered than 50 Alaskan… since it’s in a contender frame and has about half an inch less cartridge length… it’s still a 50 cal handgun… so it’s a fun project and a win regardless…

>>64440217
Farthest right

>>64440218
The 15 is the barrel length.

>>64440226
guess ill ask you here since the other /hg/ died. how much does your contender weigh and any advice for looking for a used contender? i read that with some magnums the frame can end up stretching. anything else of note i should look out for?

>>64440276
I’ll weight it tomorrow but it’s pretty light compared to my revolvers. This is my first contender so I can’t offer up too much advice. Mainly I’d make sure it feels like it locks closed solidly….

https://bellmtcs.com/maximumcartridgeforcontender Has pretty good info about stretching frames, what causes it and how to avoid it.

Other than that I’d say from personal experience double check the dimensions if it’s an obscure cartridge and the label isn’t 100% exactly what you expect before you special order a 96$ dollar box of ammo…. Honestly though it’s a shame I don’t have a gun yet for this stuff because the actual 50 Alaskan rounds look awesome..

>>64438619 (OP)
I just threw some random brass into my FART. I'll pull the .45s out when it's done and size those.

>>64440144
>sabot leaving the barrel and getting stuck in the brake is what's causing it
That's fucking retarded because by the time the sabot reaches the muzzle the powder is already burned and pressure already peaked. The load bearing threads already sustained higher pressure.
>then watch gun jesus explain it
Ian didn't analyze the gun. Mark Serbu, who I am heavily biased against for that matter, actually did his fucking homework and worked backwards to figure out the pressure required to cause a failure as seen on the KB video, and it required a nuclear hot load. Basically to the point that the round that nearly killed KB would have obliterated any .50 BMG on the market and no matter what projectile was loaded in it.
It was a spiked round because some Bubba loaded it to 190,000 PSI. A sabot getting stuck at the muzzle after a 50k PSI load already burned isn't going to jump to 190k PSI.

>>64442720
>by the time the sabot reaches the muzzle the powder is already burned
Most of it, if all of it had been burned there would be no muzzle flash.
>by the time the sabot reaches the muzzle the pressure already peaked.
No, if that were true, then bore obstructions would be completely safe. Tell you what, why don't you buy a .50, fill 2/3 of the inside of the barrel with mud, and then fire it? Do so 3-5 times and report back your findings.
>Ian didn't analyze the gun. Mark Serbu, who I am heavily biased against for that matter, actually did his fucking homework and worked backwards to figure out the pressure required to cause a failure as seen on the KB video, and it required a nuclear hot load. Basically to the point that the round that nearly killed KB would have obliterated any .50 BMG on the market and no matter what projectile was loaded in it.
Except it wasn't a handload; it was a military surplus SLAP round. Those get fired from Browning M2s no problem. Serbu was just trying to save face.
>the round that nearly killed KB would have obliterated any .50 BMG on the market
Any .50 gun with a muzzle brake, that is.
>It was a spiked round because some Bubba loaded it to 190,000 PSI. A sabot getting stuck at the muzzle after a 50k PSI load already burned isn't going to jump to 190k PSI.
Again, this is Serbu trying to save face, regular .50 BMG ammo is 55k PSI, and all it needs to be to destroy any rifle chambered in it is about 85k PSI. That's very possible with a bore obstruction.

>>64442786
>if all of it had been burned there would be no muzzle flash
You don't understand muzzle flash. It's a combination of sudden expansion of gasses and combustible gasses and remnants of unburned powder reigniting once in contact with the atmosphere. It's would be extremely inefficient to have powder still burning out the muzzle, so the powder is tailored to a cartridge/barrel by making sure that you get a complete burn and then use the pressure still inside to keep applying force to the bullet. Unburnt powder is just a fact of life, and there will be gaseous byproducts that can combust but lack oxygen to do so (powder contains its own oxidizer). Once in contact with the atmosphere, they ignite outside the muzzle.
TL;DR - you can achieve complete powder burn and still see flash
>No, if that were true, then bore obstructions would be completely safe
Bore obstructions are unsafe because they bypass dwell time and can start early unlocking of the bolt, leading to case head failure and damage to the weapon. Banana-peeling the barrel is not as dangerous to the shooter, and doesn't magically cause bolt failure.
>.50, fill 2/3 of the inside of the barrel with mud
Moving goalpost. The failure supposedly happened at the muzzle. Past the muzzle, even. Already backing down?
>it was a military surplus SLAP round
Purchased where? Privately acquiring a SLAP round comes with zero assurances over its origin.
>Any .50 gun with a muzzle brake, that is.
Not really. Shooting off a muzzle brake with a SLAP round will ruin your barrel, but it will not obliterate the receiver. And it's a known danger for spotters because the sabot pieces can be deflected towards people near the shooter. But not for destroying the bolt and receiver.
>Again, this is Serbu trying to save face
It doesn't matter if Serbu is willing to lie to protect his image, because the facts show the breech was already engulfed in flames before a single spark was visible at the muzzle.

>>64438619 (OP)
I just got done loading a whole batch of standard load .500 Magnums with a 400gr JFP bullet doing ~1600fps. Now I'll be doing the opposite this time and aiming to replicate some of the out-of-production Winchester ammo for lighter loads in .454 Casull and .500 Magnum. I've got some .451 240gr JHC and .500 350gr JHP bullets coming, and I'll be aiming for ~1300fps for both as a baseline. Its a hard line to walk between wanting lighter loads that I can shoot a lot of comfortably but also still wanting it to be more powerful than .44 Magnum and feel like you're shooting something. We'll see how it goes.

>>64442991
>and remnants of unburned powder reigniting once in contact with the atmosphere.
So there was more powder to burn. Checkmate.
>Bore obstructions are unsafe
Anon, they affect different guns in different ways because different guns have different points of failure. Ian covered this in the video you clearly didn't watch.
>Moving goalpost. The failure supposedly happened at the muzzle. Past the muzzle, even. Already backing down?
It doesn't matter where it started; what mattered was that there was more pressure inside that barrel and bore than the gun could handle.
>Purchased where?
KB said he purchased the surplus SLAP rounds from a seller at a gun show that he trusted and had bought ammo from before. The person claiming it was an improperly loaded handload was Mark Serbu.
>the facts show the breech was already engulfed in flames before a single spark was visible at the muzzle.
Source: it came to you in a dream. Picrel is the frame before the explosion; wait 60 seconds for me to show the very next frame.

>>64442991
>>64443121
This is the very next frame with the camera he was using.

>>64443077
Nice anon. I haven’t tried any 400 jfp’s yet but I’ve been running 350gn xtp mags up to about 1750, and 1840 running lil gun and h110.

I found a good low power (but Smokey) load is to get an OAL of 1.985 on 19 gns of unique, I use a heavy crimp out of habit.. I get just under 1400 fps with those out of a 10 inch barrel and they’re very low recoil for the caliber..

What are you running for your 454’s?

>>64443133
The .454 is getting the 240gr JHCs. They’re from the Sierra SportsMaster line, which is also what my 400gr JFPs for my .500 Magnum came from. I know a JHC bullet is really old-school but I think paired with a nickel-plated case it’ll make a really sexy bullet, and yes, I have the flavor of autism that likes aesthetically pleasing rounds kek. The 350gr JHPs that the .500 is getting are Hornady XTP-MAGs. I’ve used them before and they always shot good.

>>64439910
>Owns and uses calipers
>Seats to crimp groove instead of OAL without a second thought
Turn your fuckin brain on man

>>64443408
It's a round for lever action and revolvers. If you don't use the cannelure, the bullet moves in the case. This bullet got me looking for cannelure machines again, but they're all 3x what I spent on the bullets.

>>64439910
You don't have to use the cannelure just because it's there. A good crimp alone will sturdy enough for use in an autoloader, even moreso a revolver. 0.356 bullets work for both 9mm (0.355) and .357 Mag, so that may be why it's threshold. Not sure what the cannelure is made for if it's too long for .357. Maybe 350 Legend or it's made for a different type of crimping die?

>>64440327
so something like 357 maximum or 445 super mag with properly cut chambers/fitted barrel and not running Bubba's Nuclear Hot loads and i should be fine

>>64443563
The lee factory crimp die will essentially punch its own cannelure into the jacket, and those can be had for very cheap.

>>64443867
I'm pretty sure they were 9mm bullets made a hair too large. When I said it was for revolvers, that was only a little true, I shoot almost all of my 38 rounds through a lever action. Obviously those like to shove poorly crimped bullets deeper into the case. I may get a 38 fcd like >>64443956 suggests, or just shoot them all with the tiny seating depth and deal with extra sooty cases. My gun does like the bullets, like I said. I'm out of 38 empties anyways, it's time to fuck with suppressed 30 cal.

keep on stackin

>>64443933
Yeah, honestly if you can I’d try to load up GRT which lets you model loads and gives you an idea of pressure, take its accuracy with a grain of salt and check its predictions against real world velocities with known published loads before trusting it for wild stuff. Essentially though the bigger the cartridge is in diameter the less pressure you want to run on it… it pushes backwards against the frame and above a certain point can begin stretching it out.. where that point is may be up for some grey area and debate. Also my contender weights in at 42.1 oz with a 15 inch barrel at a .510 bore… I suspect if you get the smaller bores in the same size the weight will go up unless they’re fluted…

>>64443222
That’s how I feel about those 450 gn swift a frame 50 Alaskan bullets I posted earlier… they’re really really nice. Need to figure out a gun for those after I figure out this contender. Sadly they are definitely a no go in it.


I’ve used a lot of the xtp mags in both 500 and 454. Love em. Also somewhere have a fun email from Hornady who said essentially “above 2000 fps we don’t recommend the 350 gn xtp mag bullets because we cannot guarantee it won’t shed the jacket” I emailed asking when I tried them in 500 bushwacker. They’ve worked fine so far though. Kinda wild to see one blow through a solid 16 inches of railroad tie without expanding… but they can.

>handloading
I'd prefer handholding

Anyone have advice/experience with pissin' hot 6.8 SPC out of the original (NOT SPC II) chambering?
I was mainly interested in pushing 115-120gr stuff as fast as I can, but also maybe dicking around with some 130-140gr stuff, like the old SSA loads, but, again, just out of the original SAAMI chamber instead of SPC II.

>>64443956
They’re also a lot easier to set up than dialing in a roll crimp die…

>>64443121
>So there was more powder to burn
Unburnt powder doesn't factor into the equation. There's always a 1% of powder that's ejected out the muzzle and doesn't contribute to a cartridge's energy. It's just shot out of the muzzle after the burn ends. Once it meets fresh air this unburnt powder can reignite and contribute to flash. But sweep a range floor near the firing line and you'll find a pile of powder that accumulated over time.
>affect different guns in different ways because different guns have different points of failure
And they fail at the weakest point. The breach is typically the part with the greatest safety margin.
>It doesn't matter where it started
It does. You claimed a barrel obstruction past the muzzle with a regular charge can obliterate the RN-50.
Then you demanded the plug to be placed 2/3rds into the length of the barrel which is a clear moving of goalposts.
>from a seller at a gun show
DING DING DING
>that he trusted and had bought ammo from before
Guess what, dickhead. You always get fucked over by people you trust. You didn't do business with the people you didn't trust in the first place. It always be your own niggas that fuck you over.
Plenty of people have received disappointing product from businesses they had bought from before. Nobody's perfect and everyone can slip.
>Source: it came to you in a dream
Watch Kentucky's own recreation of the event. He had a higher frame rate camera.

Finally getting around to organizing my space a bit more. Mostly reloading and firearms books with some other stuff mixed in. Any suggestions for good reloading literature

>>64446991
Binder books are hodgesons 27th powder manual and Lyman’s cast bulletin handbook vol 3
Also Amazon just delivered my project for the night..

>>64443128
That muzzle was flashing before the explosion. Those cartridges were pissin hot

>>64447003
So any advice for using cerrosafe? After two attempts failed I think it’s not cooling fast enough to evenly shrink and unlock. Not sure if it’s because I’m trying to cast a 2 inch ish long .530 chamber… or if I overheated and fucked the cerrosafe already….

>>64440144
>its why the ammo he was shooting is rated for the Browning M2 only, not for anti-material rifles.

Oh that makes sense, except for the original desert storm M82s being specifically marked for firing it

>>64446991
Lee 2nd edition is useful as a collection of a bunch of load data copied from other sources in one volume
Practical Shooting by Brian Enos

>>64438619 (OP)
Always wanted to see these shot out of a full powered rifle. You'd crack mach 3 easy.

There's never been anything comparable to that, tested I mean. .30 caliber wadcutter at that kind of speed. Makes me wonder what it would do in gel or meat, or to a steel plate. No one's ever punched through a steel level III with a flat projectile, but post 3000fps anything becomes possible.

I have started to get my friends into the reloading rabbit hole
>feelsgoodman.jpeg

>>64442786
>the sabot stuck
The PLASTIC sabot
In a firearm
Got stuck.
A firearm, a device that be design squashes the METAL bullet into the bore size.

Bro come on.

>>64438619 (OP)

handloading 9mm.
boollet: FMJ, 124 gr
Powder: 4.6gr Unique
OAL: 1.075"

>why?
Im broke and jobless right now.

Cobbled load from 124gr load from an older Lyman reloading manual (printed in the late 80s). Any anons with a more modern one confirm this is acceptable load? All I can find online is loading info for powders that aren't Unique.

>>64452469
looks good to me, little short oal maybe
https://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/powderlist.aspx?page=/reloaders/powderlist.aspx&type=1&powderid=3&cartridge=23

usually I do up 5 or 10 and shoot them to check gun function and check for pressure signs on the brass, before making more

>>64440144
>>64440035
>>64438825
>>64442786
You know what? Fuck Serbu and his multiple followups. KB himself did his own followup video. He successfully duplicated the exact same failure in both another Serbu and with a Barret, using some of the same batch of ammo. The Barret (which has even more blowout protection than the Serbu) also exploded, and it sent potentially lethal shards of the bolt and receiver directly through the area his face and chest would have been.
Those alleged "SLAP" rounds overpressured the gun so hard the brass peened raised text onto the bolt face. It was not milsurp. It was loose rounds in a bag with Shapie on them. And they would likely have boomed an M2 as well.

>>64452469
Lyman’s 50th. Doesn’t list a fmj, but jhp should be pretty similar, what’s your bullet length?

>>64452469
Pet loads by Ken waters has some close stuff. He updated and reupdated it.

>>64452469
1st update

>>64452469
Updated update

>>64439910
are these the cheap overruns they have right now? i just got a bunch for 6 cents a piece shipped. i think i saw your review. another dude wrote that there are 2 differnet ones the ones you got are for 38 special. the 357 version had the higher cannelure.

>>64455906
ha yeah they did post the review. Early on there were actually three different 125gr bullets all with the same incorrect picture: the ones I posted, the good high cannelure hp ones I bought another 1000 of because damn what a good price, and some fmj they incorrectly listed as plated. I'm getting the feeling they're either understaffed or there's a newbie handling the website product pictures.
In any case, the factory crimp die was a good idea I didn't think of, and in someone else's review they mentioned flipping the bullets over, which was another solution that didn't occur to me. Now I'm curious if my gun will feed them upside down.