Shousetsuka ni Narou (lit. "Let's Become a Novelist")-edition

A general for readers and authors involved or interested in the growing phenomenon of 'web novels', serialized English fiction posted to websites such as:
>Royalroad, Webnovel, Scribblehub, Wattpad, Archive of Our Own, Spacebattles, HFY, various personal author websites, and more

>Why read web novels?
Not for prose or tight editing or deep themes, frankly. As a whole, web novels are infamous for content sprawl and pacing issues. If you enjoy having millions of words to sink your teeth into to get to know the world and characters, though, you may be interested. Keeping up with other readers on a weekly basis to discuss the story's events unfolding is another perk, in the same way discussing an ongoing TV show might be.

>Why write web novels?
Ease of access & potential for Patreon earnings. Many successful authors gain an audience on their website of choice and funnel their readers into a Patreon. See https://graphtreon.com/top-patreon-creators/writing for an idea of what some are earning.
Also, once an author has earned a fanbase, transitioning into an Amazon self-publishing career is several orders of magnitude easier than starting 'dry'.

Previous: >>24474794

>>24492191 (OP)
First. I just broke this thread's hymen. She will always remember me as the special one. Enjoy your sloppy seconds, losers.

I'm not a fan of any of these guys but they've produced some resources on story structure I've found potentially useful for web/serial fiction:
>Dan Harmon's Story Circle
https://channel101.fandom.com/wiki/Story_Structure_101:_Super_Basic_Shit
this is basically babby's first Hero's Journey but it's an okay starting point which articulates things you might already be aware of but hadn't thought about consciously

>Dan Wells' Seven Point Story Structure
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzfRuHa21NIzQFrQ6FAq8Pj2IA_SXiwrN&si=CeqGZhCye9SIKhFg
nothing revolutionary but the discussion about lining up the climaxes and pinch points in concurrent plots is worth checking out

>Dax Murray's Layering Method
https://blog.daxmurray.com/serial-storytelling
web novels/serial fiction can get away with a lot but I think this layering can help reduce meandering and maintain momentum/relevance

Perfect narrative won't save shit characters/dialogue/etc but how are you approaching story structure? I think it's a helpful tool at certain points of the writing process as long as you don't become a slave to it.

The first volume of my story is now fully available on Royal Road---60,000 words!
https://www.royalroad.com/fiction/119783/fff-class-unlucky-antagonist-villains-origin-story

I fucking hate system novels. Especially when it breaks the fourth wall and the system has a personality. I hate how 99% of litrpgs add it for the sake of adding it and it adds no value and only annoys the reader with page long stat sheets every chapter. I hate how every amateur author thinks they are a comedian and add r*ddit tier snarky quips all over the place. System apocalypses are oversaturated and boring. Dungeoncore is gigashit (Tenebroum is good tho). Most kingdom builders are likewise shit (except for release that witch). Behead those who write "I got reincarnated into my favorite heckin game/novel", regression, tower climber, I'm the heckin villian otome gurl and other gook shit. I hate everyone and everything. I just want a non-isekai/portal/regression/system apocalypse/other bullshit fantasy novel that I can read for 10 trillion chapters, simple as.

What grinds your gears? Let me hear it.

>>24492346
go off king but it is pretty funny you named like 99% of serials
>a non-isekai/portal/regression/system apocalypse/other bullshit fantasy novel
try reading "This Used to be About Dungeons" and "Thresholder" by Alexander Wales

>>24492346
>>24492264
In my story, the "System" is a human-made, designed to optimize the use of magic.

>>24492346
Likely popularized by Tensura, but at least its system has this subtle ironic personality, which brings something to the table.

>>24492346
monster MC either turns human or integrates into human society and lives a completely human life with a human personality
weak to strong. I like weak little jobbers. struggle and characterization through weakness is cool. being the strongest and most badass ever is lame
I like gamelit but hate litrpg. there is whimsy in the silly imagination of exploring a videogane like space. there is no whimsy in optimizing stat sheets and number crunching for chapters on end
I want to like dungeoncore stories because I like the aspect of homeliness in an alien ecosystem, but they get bogged down in boring ass segments of "I did chores," and "I spent this whole chapter exploring the magic system". tenebraum is pretty good, agree
wuxia/xanxia. don't know why, I just hate it
exposition dumps. especially in dialogue. you could've world built the most fascinating and refrshingly unique setting ever conceived but I do not give a shit, you have to actually write and give context for me to attach to and speculate on, not just jam essay after essay of made up cat facts in my face
you seem to hate everything webslop, which I'm sorta with you for but I actually like a lot of the genres. what I stand with on isn't a hate for all slop, but a hate for derivate and joyless slop. it's so damn obvious when something isn't derivative in an appreciative way
it is kinda funny for you to be into webnovels but hate every single genre and trend common to them. like someone that likes vtumours but hates anime girl high pitched voices

>>24492393
>monster MC either turns human or integrates into human society
i really like this when the MC stays weird though, the interactions are great

>>24492346
If I wanted to read normie-slop I would re-read WoT or a shounen.

>>24492382
I can see logical reasons for it to exist. Like what you mention or perhaps it was a creation of the gods to balance the races or something. The real issue I have is that people often make it into some TTRPG thing that shits out numbers and witty blue boxes. I do not think I have ever read a novel where I gave a shit about the stats or that it played any interesting role in the story. I know it can be done and that a story could do it in a way that's appealing but it doesn't happen and so I dislike most of the genre by default.

>>24492393
It is quite ironic that I read them but hate most of them. What I enjoy about web novels is they are less pretentious and sometimes don't take themselves too seriously. You can spitball goofy ass stories with unique concepts that just wouldn't work in published novels. A lot of the sub-genres I'm calling out are ones that have had some good stories but today have essentially become factories of stale derivatives of those novels but lack any soul. There's a billion novels trying to be the next Primal Hunter. Just fucking write stuff because you want it to exist. Make something with some passion. I have more respect for slice of life fantasies with good world building over murderhobo systemapocalypse guy with generic name saves earth by swinging a sword.

>>24492410
>that it played any interesting role in the story
This is one of my system windows, and as you can see, I've added little details that are not only necessary for my story but also interesting to speculate about.

>>24492191 (OP)
>See https://graphtreon
I recognise Studio Foglio, but other than that, are any of these fellas NOT actually writing isekai / system / cultivation / dungeon / meta stuff / YKWIM,
and actually writing trad serial SFF?

>>24492470
Alexander Wales, ErraticErrata, Wildbow, Hungry to name a few off the top of my head.
Unless you mean "trad fantasy" in some much stricter manner than I assumed

Imagine being the voice actor forced to read all of this out loud.

>>24492473
Yeah I don't really get system-heavy novels. I tried DOTF as my one foray into it and it was okay I guess, like C-tier, not a total waste of time but there's so many better stories out there
It's a dopamine addiction or smth

>>24492196
You alone are the hymen-destroyer one.

Now you have given me the idea of the hymen restoration hero and I alone shall enjoy this concept's beautiful first.

>>24492191 (OP)
>Royalroad, Webnovel, Scribblehub, Wattpad, Archive of Our Own, Spacebattles, HFY, various personal author websites, and more
can i get a rundown of the audiences expectations on these various sites and are they all troughs for slop for pigs or do any want more than the same thing they liked once again forever?

>>24492488
>do any want more than the same thing they liked once again forever?
even published sff audiences barely want this, what makes you think online slop sites will
that said if you write something truly outstanding, you will find an audience. lots of pseuds have this idea that just because their work is new and different that they deserve writers when in reality the writing is neither comfort food OR fine dining. gross + exotic is a terrible combination

>>24492492
>deserve writers
deserve readers

>>24492472
perhaps a good way to define this is, how different are their works from e.g. JRR Tolkien and Terry Brooks?

>>24492492
>if you write something truly outstanding, you will find an audience
a belief in magic.
if you put work in front of people that dont even want to try it may as well be unreleased no matter what its quality.

>>24492497
Very. All web fiction is much more indulgent and less mature than those (actually, Wales is pretty mature, but his works are still heavily based on nerd culture).
The closest web novels will get to trad pub is Sanderson-esque stories, and a quality tier below that desu
If you want good prose, trad-paced stories, meant for mature audiences, clearly you need to stay in the trad space. Those kinds of books take loads of effort to write and require professional dev edits and line edits. Web authors don't have that
If they did, why would they go through that much work to then post it online? Clearly they should go through an agent + tradpub at that point.

>>24492502
If it's truly outstanding sheer word of mouth will do the job. Like with Weir
I'm not saying "better than web sloppa". I'm saying
>truly outstanding
Like better than 99% of popular published works

>>24492488
>RR
The readers mostly want progression fantasy/litrpg but there are novels that do okay there outside of those genres.
>Webnovel
The readers want to spend $1200 to read Shadow Slave and horny 14 year old harem fantasy written by someone who has never spoken to a woman irl
>Scribblehub
Royalroad with smut for ESL's.
>Wattpad
The readers here want romantasy with werewolves and vampires
>AO3
Smut and fanfics. I don't know what the creatures that go there and read sonic x Harry Potter x asoiaf fanfics want because I don't use the site.
>HFY
Redditors aren't human in my eyes. They should only expect lead at high speeds from me. You will have to ask them yourself.

In general I think readers mostly want sloppa. I enjoy some sloppa myself at times but i get tired of the same GMO corn feed in my trough at times.

>>24492506
theres no word of mouth if no one reads it in the first place, you cannot get around causality with your magical beliefs

>>24492503
>why would they go through that much work to then post it online? Clearly they should go through an agent + tradpub
because tradpub will force woke edits?

>>24492512
Some people will read it, anon. Even the most obscure works on RoyalRoad and other sites get a few views. And if it's so incredible that they read the whole thing then gush to their friends on discord, reddit, in real life about it, then it catches fire and builds an audience over time.
It has literally happened before eg Weir. Stop saying it's impossible when it happens.

>>24492509
thank you

>>24492513
Only if the author in question is writing some truly unhinged shit, and they would just not pick that author up then

>>24492503
dealing with publishers is its own whole thing
I don't think quality of writing is inherently disconnected from web novels anymore than trabpublished work being inherently literary

>>24492527
>I don't think quality of writing is inherently disconnected from web novels anymore than trabpublished work being inherently literary
Hmm, maybe so, but I've yet to see something on the web I could put up quality-wise to stuff like Game of Thrones or LOTR or whatever.
Can you?
If not, take your guess why. I took mine.

>>24492534
for web novels I mostly read slop and don't really hang out in online literary spheres where people would be trying to write online litfic
a lot of tradpubbed genrefic is just as slop as web pub, because they're primarily entertainment products. there is less incentive to make an entertainment product with web novels because anyone can be doing it for any individualized reason, rather than conforming to the creative and financial responsibilities of working with a publisher
are most web novels slop? yeah, sure. is this an absolute? no, of course not

>>24492534
>yet to see something on the web I could put up quality-wise to stuff like Game of Thrones or LOTR
try reading "Primordial Dual Cultivator Dragon With System" chapter 2

>>24492549
>are most web novels slop? yeah, sure. is this an absolute? no, of course not
Well yes, but you're arguing a different topic than me
Previous anon asked whether any works help up to stuff like LOTR/Terry Brooks, and I said no, works of that quality go to Trad Pub bc of needs for dev edits and line edits
Can you name some works of similar quality to top-tier trad pub? I cannot, regardless that I really enjoy certain slop

Why is /wng/ full of people talking about how they're burnt out of slop and don't like slop and wish they could read "real fantasy books without all that slop nonsense" instead
Go to /sffg/ or /wg/
Any brothers who actually belong here with me? What's the last slop you read and enjoyed? I'm reading "Player Manager", a pretty unique litrpg where someone in the real world gets a system focused on scouting/managing football(soccer) players. Surprisingly enjoyable

>>24492601
Last sloppa I read was Sky Pride. I've seen people recommend Player Manager a lot but I saw it stubbed and didn't bother pirating it because I'm not too into sports anyways. I'm not doubting that it's interesting but how does the author make a story of it? Is there like other managers he's competiting with to get his players or something? I'm having a hard time envisioning it.

>>24492601
criticism of what you're discontent with isn't the worst thing
it is vapid to just go "I don't like it" without offering any insight into why or what you'd do better or whatever
last thing I read was Necroepilogos though I'd hate to consider it slop. it's actually pretty good
before that I was reading Arkendrithyst which is number crunchy as fuck. I don't think I've power skimmed any story as hard as I did that. it had a weird double think in the narrative where the protagonist hates litRPG systems and thinks magic should have more whimsy, so he creates magic using rhymes and through thorough visualization and understanding, but simultaneously the prose is constantly concerned with detailing every little possible nuance and interpretation of the magic system and running number calculations on stats. I ended up dropping it after like 300 chapters because the protagonist turns into a dragon and for whatever reason that crossed a line for me

rec and "what are you reading" posts are nice. there's such a sea of slop to wade through on one's own and it'd be cool to know what anons are reading and what they appreciate

Anon from last thread who was asking about inserting stat pages into my otherwise non-litrpg fantasy. I've put a few partially filled out placeholders into my existing draft and I'm enjoying the effect it has so far. They've let me cut a couple of clunky exposition paragraphs I wasn't able to figure out how to do in a way that satisfied me. I know it's pure tell instead of show, but I think I can be okay with that.
Now I'm planning to add some more stat stuff into the story. A good bit of the first few chapters follow a character exploring a dungeon and I like the idea of adding a count for her health and mana alongside the descriptions of her exhaustion to give some tangible emphasis.

>>24492615
>Necroepilogos
You've read Katalepsis then I assume?
I agree, Hungry is an incredible author, although it's still sloppa-ish. Very indulgent in the style of most web novels. Katalepsis was at least, haven't read her new one
>>24492611
>I've seen people recommend Player Manager a lot but I saw it stubbed and didn't bother pirating it because I'm not too into sports anyways. I'm not doubting that it's interesting but how does the author make a story of it? Is there like other managers he's competiting with to get his players or something? I'm having a hard time envisioning it.
I'm only about a book in, but right now it's just exploring the consequences of having "cheat abilities" in the real world, which is always fun. He's setting himself up for a career as a player scout/manager since he can read everyone's stats and identify talent no else can (and knows what position to put everyone in to maximize their ability)
IDK it's just kinda interesting. The novelty is part of the appeal

>>24492631
I read Katalepsis for a bit but something about it put me off. it was awhile ago so it's hard to recall exactly what it was but I think it was something about the prose and finding the character drama trite
Necroepilogos has neither of those issues. it's actually the first time in awhile I've quite enjoyed the prose of a webnovel, rereading lines just to savor the brain feel of them (even if the descriptions get a bit dense with techno-jargon babble at times)
the chapters are hitting the point of the slop reveal where it becomes clear what the author is trying to do for wider appeal. there's some girlboss mary sue type stylings and it recontextualizes some of the set up in a way that makes you roll your eyes. overall it's quite inspired though. the setting is something I adore since I'm a total sucker for the eschatological themes

>>24492631
I'll give Player Manager a shot simply because I want to see how the author does it.

>>24492601
A Practical Guide to Sorcery - though it's too well written to actually call slop.
Cyberpunk Gamer - the author seems to lack a basic understanding on the use of commas which irritates me, and the story is an unashamed self-insert OP MC and I'm okay with that because I enjoy the game / world setting and cyberpunk stories are rare, especially fun ones.

>did what someone here said and put a note in asking readers to leave reviews
>already jumped from 15000 to 13000 in a day

>>24492473
Do you nikkas really write and read stuff like this?

>>24493256
Bro you're a writer, you should be able to communicate what the fuck you're trying to say clearly.

>>24493280
reads fine on my machine

>>24493273
most of the anons here don't read the crunchy litrpg stuff, no
>>24493280
what do you mean, what anon said is perfectly clear
you probably aren't an author. he's saying his Overall Ranking (determined by ratings) jumped b/c of an author note asking for anons to engage with his work. Most readers are ghosts and lurkers. It's why YouTubers tell their audience to like and subscribe; it genuinely boosts engagement by a lot.

>>24493303
ESL retard. 'Jumped' implies that the number went up, and your sentence reads like there's a typo. WHAT 'jumped' is not specified and totally unclear. Views? Followers? If it's views, you're implying that your readers had premonitions you put an author's note on your latest chapter and are boycotting you in retaliation?

"""Writers""" like you are why I'm cruising up the rankings despite sucking. My competition is pathetic.

>>24493316
>he's saying his Overall Ranking (determined by ratings) jumped b/c of an author note asking for anons to engage with his work.
That legit did not occur to me. That's great but damn it would not have been hard to mention ranking at least somewhere in his post, or clarify in his followup. That is a strong signal that his writing and communication skills in general suck.

>>24493317
You're the one with a lack of comprehension. The use of jumped is fine. You could argue anon should have said 'jumped from rank...' but that is clearly implied if you have more than 80 iq.

>>24493323
>That is a strong signal that his writing and communication skills in general suck.
Disagree. Was perfectly clear. Vibe check: do you write and post writing or not

>>24493317
is this a bit

>>24493317
>"""Writers""" like you are why I'm cruising up the rankings despite sucking. My competition is pathetic.
Fuck man, the /wg/ troll really did invade /wng/
Was fun while it lasted I guess

>>24493340
don't you try to turn me into a boogey man
that dude is just retarded

I maintain that the first post was unclear, and the second post replying with snark after the lack of clarity was pointed out puts the fault for the miscommunication on the 'jack poster.

I acknowledge that my posts were caustic, but I maintain that I'm in the right. I will not comment on this further. Good night.

>>24493360
haha you got caught acting like a dumb ass

In your opinion, what do you think of magic and what it could be within a novel?

>>24493366
it's magic, it can be whatever you want
further, you're the writer and anything you write can have whatever narrative function you assign
to be less subjective, I watched Excalibur and I was struck by how magical the nagic felt in that movie. made me yearn for stories where magic feels mystical and unknown and magnificent

>>24493316
You sure? Cuz I've seen a lot of people here and in /sffg/ recommending dungeon crawler Carl and it had pages with a bunch of shit about items and such too

>>24493366
It's magic, it can be what ever you want it to be.

>>24493385
That becomes less common as the books progress and it was never a 'hard' litrpg to start with.

>>24493385
individuals do be saying whatever they want
dungeon crawler carl is absolute garbage. I read some of it out of nostalgia because the premise reminded me of a storyline from a pulp fantasy series my dad liked. carl is straight ass and a prime example of the post-creativity derivative slop that many resent

>>24492346
>What grinds your gears? Let me hear it.
whenever someone has a cute girl on the cover and the story is not about said cute girl. Fuck off. I'll kill you personally. "oh no i don't want to put an ugly guy on my AIslop cover" yet you want to write about one? Are you homosexual? Can't ask the robot to draw you badass self insert dude holding two katanas and smoking a blunt? fuck you.

>>24493394
As is usual the series popularity and the author's bank balance don't care about your opinion.

>>24493401
this culture that cock sucks anything with success as if aligning with soulless practices champions that success for oneself is so vile
story sucks ass. I didn't say shit about the money or popularity. the writing. is. ass

>>24493406
There's an easy solution to that, write something better... oh, wait, you can't.

>>24493385
DCC is great and it's not anything like the stat dump in the image. Sure there's lootbox openings and achievements and shit, but they're cordoned off from the rest of the story and handled as a sort of "dopamine time!" which I find kind of endearing stylistically
>carl is straight ass and a prime example of the post-creativity derivative slop that many resent
Strongly disagree, DCC is one of the only litrpgs I've read that has real characters and genuine emotional growth / human drama. It's the exact opposite of derivative.
There's a reason it's the only one to get tradpubbed. Literally the ONLY

>>24493411
brorther what the FUCK are you talking about?
what relation does the quality of MY writing have to do THAT story? I could be james joyce and it wouldn't mean fuck all the fact that dungeon crawler carl is a bad story written poorly
if you like it, all the power to you. babbling these weird attacks as if that'll make another person's story gain merit makes you seem like a alzheimers patient having a totally seperate conversation

>>24493401
not sure what point you're making with this statement. either defend why you like DCC like I did or just shut up, money =/= good
>>24493406
>the writing. is. ass
the writing is nothing special but it's serviceable prose wise. The story and character growth I consider extremely solid

>>24493406
I dunno, I just read chapter 1 and the prose was decent. Not just okay, but decent. I've seen worse setup and sentence structure in published books.

I probably won't bother reading the books since they're not free online but it looks alright.

>>24493423
>dungeon crawler carl is a bad story written poorly
why

>>24493412
I'll admit that I didn't read it very long. I read to the point where he enters the second floor and readily dropped it
if it develops an emotional heart past that point and that the first arc isn't enough to judge then I aplogize and admit my ignorance

>>24493435
I also dropped it my first go-through. I tried again the second time via audio book because so many people raved about it. The voice acting by Jeff Hayes is genuinely the best I've experienced and elevates the series. Plus, it really does just get better as it goes. It's one of three litrpgs I can think of that reads like an actual story rather than grueling number crunch bs.
using the argument "popularity = good" is cringe but there really is a reason DCC broke out of the bubble

>>24492191 (OP)
How does this compare to The Odyssey?

>>24493476
mogs desu

>>24493478
How so?
In what way?

>>24493280
BAAAAHHHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAA
HOLY ESL OUTING

>>24493480
brevity of wit, clarity of soul, and a depiction not just of the common humanity of the Greek peoples from is extracted universality, but a transcendent universality that is shared not just of all the human race living today, but all of human lives to have ever lived. maybe even of all humans to ever live henceforth
it may just well end up human kind's last great work

>>24493394
>the premise reminded me of a storyline from a pulp fantasy series my dad liked.
Are you talking about Heroes Die?

>>24493559
nah. the Myth series. there's a book where they get trapped in a devil's gameshow
>The novels are set in a future dystopia Earth where a parallel world called Overworld reminiscent of the worlds featured in post-Tolkien secondary world fantasy has been discovered. The corporations that run Earth send actors into Overworld in order to provide the masses of an overcrowded world with virtual-reality entertainment.
damn, that's a pretty apt guess

>>24492346
As long as isekai harem Fantasy is the only thing these slopgoblins are willing to read, that is what will be written.

>>24492513
You can self publish if you're up for it

>>24492534
It is clear what the webnovel audience wants, and it's not effortposting. The cattle wants their slop, and they want lots of it. This filters out all the sophisticated authors and leaves indian LLM prompters, who are the majority of the market.

>>24493721
speak for yourself
I want only top shelf slop. free graze slop. farm to table slop. 24 carat slop. 1 of mintage pristine vintage slop. marquise nouveau slop. crystalline aligned slop. direct select dominant RNA slop. critical failure free kevlar slop

>>24493721
"Name your favorite web serials" deadass needs to be a filter question in this thread because you don't read them, you're a trolling tourist

I finished my first serialized web novel. Really was a novellette or novella - ended up at about 22k words across 9 chapters. It should probably have been 6-7 chapters, but eh.

It's a parody of harem anime where the MC is a medical eunuch and the girls just steamroll his rejection. I think it turned out OK but I dragged it out too long.

Anyways just wanted to share. I'm going to try writing "on market" for the next one, a lich who gets time jumped forward and decides to enforce undead-run utopia on a largely-now-magicless fantasy world.

>>24493810
>I'm going to try writing "on market" for the next one
ewwwwww
congrats on your writing. good luck and keep it up. your next stories elevator pitch is fun, hope it comes together

>>24493810

>>24493787
Worm and Practical Guide to Evil are the "right" answers, though. Would need to be ongoing to get new answers - and then people would just post their own work.

Can't have shit in Detroit.

>>24493823
>shitposters who try to halt any post by demanding you post your favorite web novel
>reply by posting your web novel's page
kinda based

>>24493823
>the "right" answers
the right answers would actually be the sloppiest like HWFWM DOTF PH etc
really shows you aren't a poser, and are down here rolling in the mud. worm and APGTE are normie shit

>>24492534
Look at comics and Manga. They have similar monetary/readership incentives, with similar results.

You can't put out frequent short updates to interminable stories without sacrificing writing quality along the way.

>>24492251
I prefer kishotenketsu
>ki
Introduction
>sho
Development
>ten
Twist
>ketsu
Conclusion

Perfecting the technique is hard. In theory, everything can follow it.
>book follows macro kishotenketsu
>each chapter has their own micro kishonketsu
>chapter itself can be a collection of kishonketsu

>>24493849
>2 million word meandering progression slop
>normie shit
Jesus christ anon, unironically touch grass

>>24493862
oh cool. I've known for awhile that asia has a twist centric storytelling sensibility but never knew the name
thanks anon. nice post

>>24493869
he's right. worm is basic bitch shit as far as web novels go and would be liable to fail a theoretical gatekeep

>>24493869
Okay anon, you name the "normie" web serials
If you can't, you're actually a little bitch for replying to me

I know you're accusing me of making a bogeyman out of you but there really does seem to be a change since you showed up.

dumb posts often seen accompanied by finger quotes

>>24493938
I'm just sad you ruined my thread desu

>>24493928
There aren't any. It's not normie shit.

Alternatively, erotica named "Owned by the Boss" or "The Alpha's Mate" or whatever

litrpg, power fantasies and harem novels are everywhere, it's getting old. I want to see more novels where we got brotherhood and nothing else but struggle against resonable amounts of opposition, fists full of magic and some good comedy. Just good vibes with the bros. Like low to mid level DnD/Pathfinder sessions.

>>24493935
I've made a couple dumb silly posts but the aggressive fight starting isn't me

>>24493945
When you use an adjective in a niche space you're using it in a relative sense
normie web serials means web serials normies might read. not that normies actually read serials. isn't this obvious?
idk man I'm actually depressed you ruined my comfy thread so im just leaving tonight. bye troll anon

>>24493949
im pretty sure this troll boogeyman of yours who keeps using finger quotes, misinterpreting basic statements, and talking past people in one sided strawman arguments is one of your regulars

>>24493946
any trend that stays stagnant long enough will get stale and web serials have been an incestual circle of self informing derivarion for awhile
that sentiment is going to be getting more and more common, which means there's opportunity for people who want to share their more original stories
I kinda hate DnD session inspired writing. you can always tell. character's always have this star-of-the-show quality like they all think they're the A list actorin an ensemble cast
have you reas ogre's pendant? I enjoyed it as a short little sword and sorcery romp

>>24493962
Yeah, the A-list thing is over used. I rather have something more natural. And for the Ogre's Pendant? I'm gonna go give it a read.

>>24493946
All male parties rarely happen anymore because any work with them is accused of being gay or secretly gay and then you get actual gays coming along and demanding that the work be more gay
Try to go to any male-dominated work and see how long it takes for someone to call it a sausagefest and complain that there aren't enough female characters, the concept of brotherhhood has been made a joke

>>24492473
People enjoy reading this? Or do they just skim over it?

>>24492503
>Clearly they should go through an agent + tradpub at that point.
You act like they will publish anyone. You have to pass various shit tests to get published traditionally, including a political litmus test, a gender test, a race test, a jewish blood test, and a marketability test. And if you were born the wrong race, the wrong gender, and dont put your pronouns in your twitter with more than 10,000 followers, you're not getting published.

>>24494051
If you want to be taken seriously don't make your points like a 13 year old drama queen. Speak like an adult and articulate yourself reasonably. This isn't /pol/

>>24494031
>the concept of brotherhhood has been made a joke
No, more like people suck at writing and have only been exposed to all male gay casts so they don't know how to write actual hetero brotherhood. It's a problem of being raised surrounded by propaganda and not reading the classics and thinking that the classics are the twisted nonsense that gets memed (frodo and sam, Achilles and Petroclus, etc).

Still, actual brotherhood stories aren't really fantasy. They happen in real life. If I'm reading fantasy, I want to read about some five foot tall 100 pounds soaking wet little girl using martial arts to throw cars around and summon dragons to fight with her and shit like that.

I honestly think the /wg/ regulars migrated to /wng/ because the only crap posted there is AI shitposts, beginners submitting unedited pseud nonsense, and other useless crabbing. They saw a higher quality thread and migrated out of boredom. The slop posters are and have been the only genuine writers since the beginning. And now we're the de-facto /wg/. Which means the trolls and retards have invaded
So it goes. The lifecycle of a thread. At least we lasted a few weeks

>>24494080
>hello fellow web novel fans
>/our/ genre is repetitive slop and we should try to be more like traditional books, amiright?

>>24492251
For me its the Fichtean Curve.

Whats all this then?

>>24492346
>I hate how 99% of litrpgs add it for the sake of adding it and it adds no value and only annoys the reader with page long stat sheets every chapter.
It feels like they mostly add in a system so they can throw "level up!" messages when the MC does something cool but then they feel almost forced to include a worthless uninformative character sheet every few chapters just so the readers won't feel they're pulling the level ups out of their ass.

Some stories really misuse the levelups. I feel like most would be better if they just ignored that shit except when the MC is actually upgrading/evolving a skill to a new one that does something more/better, or otherwise getting some actual new ability instead of being 5% better at swording.

>>24493366
it shouldn't do whatever you want, it should have as much autism and potential munchinkry as possible
i wanna skip past the fight scenes so i can read more about the main character's retarded minmaxing strat to break the game

>weebshit
Honestly fucking kill yourselves

>>24492601
>Any brothers who actually belong here with me? What's the last slop you read and enjoyed?
I'm reading Worth the Candle right now. It's got an interesting variation on the generic "reincarnated into a game" plot because it's based on a tabletop game the main character was DMing for instead of a vidya and as a result a lot of things work really differently. A lot of interacting with antagonists, cities, etc that HE originally wrote for his players and seeing how the game has twisted them around. There's also a lot of psychological reflective stuff and flashbacks to the guy's shitty emo life from beforehand and him working through all his baggage.

Previously I read the first book or two of Chrysalis which is fun straightforward levelupslop where the main character is a giant ant getting cool new mutations and evolutions by eating lots of dungeon monsters and occasional humans and fighting to protect his ant colony in a hostile world. Probably will go back to it later but I also wanna read Lord of the Mysteries.

My top 5 atm :

Pale Lights
The Time of the Apocalypse
Dungeon Crawler Carl (on patreon)
The Wandering Inn
Zenith of Sorcery


Any recomendations from fellow anons?

>>24493862
I'm a fan of kishotenketsu in practice too but haven't really found many good simple resources for studying it that don't add a lot of the blogger's/podcaster's/literal who's own interpretations and end up
presenting some bastardised version of it. Did you have any you wanted to share?

>>24494163
I like this too. It definitely works well with serial/web fiction

>>24494765
> The Time of the Apocalypse
No idea what that one is, a misspell? The rest are all fairly standard & popular, so maybe try one of:

A Practical Guide to Sorcery
Metaworld Chronicles
Mother of Learning
Path of Ascension
System Universe

>>24494875
Time of Apocalypse is Mother of Learning but better.
It stars by stealing the plot from MoL wholesale but it becomes its own thing by midway of volume 1.

>>24494875
Oh yeah right , it's "Years" , not "Time" . My bad.

>>24494058
Ok. How about this? The New Yorker has published zero white men born after 1985. But good luck getting published traditionally.

>>24494879
>>24494882
Ah, that one. I agree, Years of Apocalypse has the potential to top MoL. I also forgot one other recommendation: Reborn: Apocalypse

>>24493406
Why would someone make something food when rubbish is more profitable.

Out of curiosity, which web novel has the best prose?

>>24494949
Pale Lights

>>24492488
Thanks for asking that for me.
>>24492509
>Royalroad with smut for ESL's.
Wait they allow smut?

>The readers here want romantasy with werewolves and vampires
So Wattpad is where I'd put my OC Donut Steal Constantine x Doctor Who sloppa?

The Wandering Inn fucking sucks

>artist I hired to draw my cover keeps trying to slide into his comic/anime blend artstyle rather than just drawing normal
I think I overestimated his art skills. I should have just used AI. Or better yet, just dedicated 8 hours to learning GIMP and draw it myself.

Between this and RR ads I'm NEVER going to financially recover from this.

>>24494949
ErraticErrata is pretty solid like >>24494964 said but if I had to pick one it would be Hungry, who writes Katalepsis and Necroepilogos

>>24495445
>t. Zevara

>>24494863
>Did you have any you wanted to share?
Not really I don't really get it myself.

>presenting some bastardised version of it
I get what you mean, so many to equate to Western structures.
But it kinda misses the point. This storytelling originated from a poem structure.
So you could tell a story with just four sentences.
I particularly hate pic related, because it seems to only care about screen time, and not understanding its poetism.

>>24495489
solid contender

>>24495546
Firgit to mention few nitpicks with pic.
It's not "Japanese" exclusive; the same structure as prevalent in Chinese, Korean, and Vietnamese.
So it is East Asian.
And I would argue kishoketsu is not "four-acts", but four parts.

>>24495472
>fell for the girlboss propaganda
girl... you weren't actually supposed to get that grift...

>>24495472
Sloppa is pretty shit but wrangling artists is an entire second job because they're all horrifically mentally unwell and determined to make it your problem.

>Obsidian for story/chapter outlines, misc notes, dialogue snippets, worldbuilding, character profiles, zeroth draft
>Scrivener for first draft onwards, editing, etc
Share your slop creation setup

>>24495590
I do everything in Scrivener
Scrivener really does seem like a must-have for serials, since they get so big and need so much organization

>>24495590
shit everything into gdocs and figure it out

>>24492346
>>24495565
>>24495546
it grinds my gears when people attribute a plot structure to japan when it is chinese, with every other nation having learned to do so from the chinese, and all the more when the east has the audacity to influence the west.

>>24495595
> I do everything in Scrivener
Same, it does everything I need. I just wish it had multi-monitor support.

>>24495590
I write directly into the submission box each week. the way god intended

>>24495590
KWrite for notes and everything in a giant librewriter doc, which I then break up into separate files for chapters.

I do have a vertical oriented screen for writing, it's amazing.

I'll have to check out Obsidian and Scrivener.

>>24495750
You fucking psycho

>>24495750
Do you also publish as soon as you finish?

>>24495783
No, no, he's got a point

>>24492191 (OP)
I struggle to be devoted to a single story.
What's wrong with me?

>>24495996
you're a slutty girl with lots of needs

Which platform won't shut me down over depictions of drug use?

Rate the potential of my outline:
>MC is a loner with foresight
>MC's father is a cruel lord
>Island has a slave revolt
>Incompetent Viceroy sails to the island to reprimand its lord
>MC becomes the Viceroy's mistress
>Viceroy helps the Lord to put out the revolt
>Viceroy convinces MC to kill her father
>Viceroy installs MC's cousin as the new lord
>MC leaves with the Viceroy

>>24496072
I can't comment on its potential in any other format/genre but I don't think many web novel readers will be interested in this

>>24496072
doesn't interest me personally and is so outside my sphere of potential interest that it leaves me helpless to evaluate it

>>24496072
nobody wants to read some sad chick be a slut for a dumb bureaucrat

>>24496126
women totally might lol
doesn't belong on rr and such though

>>24495590
You're paying a lot of money but producing nothing

>>24496202
woah that's so wise
you should like, write a self help book or start a podcast

>>24496129
maybe if the viceroy was a competent chad
as it stands, the story isn't appealing to anyone

>>24496072
I don't see any redeeming qualities whatsoever
no moral, no theme, no internal catharsis, nothing

>>24495600
>gdocs
your slop is getting scraped as we speak and being used to train AI

>>24496214
I self insert as the loser viceroy
>>24496072
I think it could use some work shopping. have you considered making the MC have short tendons in her legs so she has to wear high heels all the time but also she hyperhidrosis localized to her feet so those heels have to be open aired peep toes?
It'd really help your story's mass appeal

>>24496217
Catharsis is her siding with an outsider and murdering her dad

>>24496214
Viceroy is the king's nephew, who is a war veteran whose over ambition caused series of military disasters.
And the uncle believes he would cause more trouble, he would stay in capital, which is why he sent him to fuck-no-where to act as viceroy.
But the viceroy believes this is an honor.
So you are supposed to feel bad for him.

>>24496219
done been
I despaired about it when I realized the AI takeover meant all my work was fed to an AI but I'm passed that point

>>24495590
gdocs

>>24496219
my future slop is but a drop in the ocean and unlikely to alter AI's output

besides I already have ~200,000 words published which I'm sure AI has scraped

>>24495996
I used to have that problem until I fully plotted one out, the shortest one, and started writing with the goal of FINISHING it. I still have the other ideas and loose plots, but it's a lot easier to focus on one for months and months when I know there's a definitive end point I'm aiming towards, and I know the path to get there.

>>24496072
>>24496083
>>24496126
What if the viceroy was a dragon? A HOT dragon? Like literally change nothing else, but that the royal family is dragons.

>>24496268
only if he has a big fat knot that the MC gets plugged with

>>24495595
>>24495741
I love Scrivener too but it gets a bit clunky if I use it for ALL my planning and notes as well as writing. Obsidian is much lighter weight

>>24495600
>>24495750
I'll pray for your sanity

>>24495783
>KWrite
Obsidian at its most basic level is just a markdown editor with links like having your own wiki and folder organisation so it shouldn't feel too different to your current setup. Most of the other bells and whistles aren't necessary but the native Canvas plugin is great if you like to think spatially.

>>24496202
One is free and the other can be pirated; neither are essential.
I've been enjoying this new general so I wanted to share useful tools with other sloppers

>>24496277
it was a fun topic slopfriend

>>24496268
>What if the viceroy was a dragon? A HOT dragon? Like literally change nothing else, but that the royal family is dragons.
Is this a Vice Principals-reference, by any chance?
I just finished watching it, and it has a teacher who writes a novel about a guy who fucks dragons.

>>24496284
No, but everyone thinks dragons are cool, dragons as royalty lording over humans is objectively cool, and women love non-human romantic partners, so a dragon coming over and telling a seething young woman to kill her father and become his mistress is just the kind of thing they'd click follow on. It doesn't even have to be explicit.

But like someone else said it probably does need a broader conflict, themes, etc. Right now it's pretty dry, just something that happens without any apparent deeper meaning.

>>24496072
>>24496232
Daughter-perpetrated patricide is ABSOLUTELY disgusting and, assuming you're a male, you should be ashamed of yourself for even imagining this.

>>24496288
I despise dragons and think they're corny
if the cast of main character's features a dragon I WILL drop the story
>>24496284
I'm following your story to masturbate to toxic power dynamics NOT fawn over dumb idiot scalies

>>24496291
This is the fantasy of most women albeit

>>24496298
>I despise dragons and think they're corny
Okay. The world needs all types, even objectively wrong ones.

>>24496219
Who cares?

man... I hope the viceroy's impregnation scene is hot...

Tried to read the first couple of the top 10 web novels on various web novel signs and they were abysmal. Absolutely awful. Yet they had millions of readers. That's why I've figured I'd give writing fantasy slop a try. I know the text is likely pretty trashy but I'm looking for any feedback that can help. Thank you very much

>>24496288
I just can't take the dragon idea seriously.

>But like someone else said it probably does need a broader conflict, themes, etc. Right now it's pretty dry, just something that happens without any apparent deeper meaning.
Of course.

>>24496334
>people are making money from this garbage?
>I can do it too!
>writes a bland, uninspired passage
>isn't even fun
is this the /wng/ equivalent of someone coming in saying they want to draw but drawing seems hard so they decided to write instead, followed by the worst prose you've seen in your life?

>want to write
>keep getting occupied by reading other stuff
How do I fix this?

>>24496348
being a good writer takes equal parts writing and reading
just tell yourself that you're maintaining your literary diet and doing prose/narrative studies

>>24496334
Bro not everyone has a 4k monitor. Try to keep it to 1920 width, or better yet, 1080. Word wrap is not your enemy.

-passive voice in the second sentence, first line a bit too wordy
-unbothered by colors; one does not trudge through mushrooms although I get what you were going for, needs rewording
-Up ahead- superfluous, drop the 'up'
-surfacing on the surface- bless your heart
-how is there room to sprint on a small boat
-unsheaved -> unsheathed; listen to your spellcheck
-had began ->had begun or just drop the perfect tense and use begun by itself
You have a few other spelling mistakes from then on.

Is English your second language, or do you just not read much? You're anonymous, friend, what you answer doesn't matter.

>Tried to read the first couple of the top 10 web novels on various web novel signs and they were abysmal. Absolutely awful. Yet they had millions of readers. That's why I've figured I'd give writing fantasy slop a try.
That motivates me to keep at it too, but what didn't you like about particular stories you read? Like what was wrong with #1 on RoyalRoad, Mother of Learning?

>publish chapter where big things happen
>use it as an excuse to beg people to read my story, beg for reviews, beg to be dicked down by readerchads and their fat cocks
>reactions are exactly the same as any other chapter
time to delete the story and then drink drain cleaner

>>24496339
It wasn't really a serious suggestion. Unless...?

>>24496348
Personally I wake up early, take a shower, grab an energy drink, and then spend the next hour or two writing with the goal of hitting 1000 words minimum. It's the very first real thing I do every day, without fail, unless I'm traveling. So it's part of my daily routine, and because it's my first caffeine of the day, I get a dopamine blast while I'm doing it, which my brain associates with writing, so now my late night caffeine cravings are mentally associated with writing and I fall asleep envisioning scenes to write in the morning. Additionally, the rest of the day I have no guilt because I know I got my writing done first. Even if it's not 1000 words of story, I count if I write out 1000 words of notes, outline, whatever.

Later in the day, when I'm tired, I'll read web novels and light novels and general scifi whatever.

I highly recommend getting a routine established and manipulating your brain's dopamine to make it stick.

>>24496362
the cocks will cum as they are ready
be a love maker. circle their nips, nibble on their ears, suck their necks. edge them. draw it out
your desperation is a turn off. if you act like a pump and dump that's what you'll be treated like

>>24496362
Link the chapter. And give it time. That begging will pay off for a long time as new readers get to that point and read your plea, even if it's months later and you've written dozens more chapters since.

ABB: Always Be Begging!

>>24496348
If it's stuff related to what you're writing it's not a problem.
Bad writing is about 20% lack of talent, 20% lack of practice and 60% not reading enough.

>>24496375
even it's not directly related to writing, there is skill and inowledge transfer from all reading to writing

>>24496359
Appreciate this so much. Technically I am ESL but my English is better than my native tongue. I read all the time but mostly old Russian literature translated to English. I know this sounds unfathomably painful but could I give you my discord and we can chat some more there?

As for your question, I read a couple of the top 10 of sites like royal road around a year ago so I have no clue what mother of learning is. The few things I remember is that so many stories had a stupid amount of Korean over the top revenge tropes of dumbass wizard/mage/whatever the fuck kids being unreasonably evil towards the mc. Also the prose was utter horse shit. Especially one where a man went to walk into his daily job and building. I tried to read LORM and I don't know if it's rhe orose or me but reading it is skin to trying to decipher smoke signals from a miasma of fog.

>>24496334
>Cold glow
>It's [swamp's] waters were not naked
What the fuck?
Generally, I love figurativeness, but this passage is immediately weird.
It's also full of unnecessary repetition.
The first two sentences mention a swamp; you could switch one for a wetland.
Same with the boat.

>>24496376
Agreed overall but when cooking up sloppa you gotta remain focused.

Is there a market for Star Trek/Mass Effect style space opera sloppa? Not too self fellating about the science type stuff

>>24496379
Not that anon.
>mostly old Russian literature
Just a weird idea, but personally, if you want to writea fantasy story and are already familiar with old Russian literature.
I reckon something inspired by the Muscovite War of Succession would make for interesting story
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muscovite_War_of_Succession
It's this generational war, very similar to the war of the roses

>>24496396
I've seen a couple on RR but it's not my thing so I didn't pay much attention

>>24496397
That's looks great, thank you so much. I didn't expect people her eto be so helpful.

>>24496379
>I know this sounds unfathomably painful but could I give you my discord and we can chat some more there?
Nope, glowies are probably after me and I'm 4chan only.
https://www.royalroad.com/fictions/rising-stars
Try checking out some of the stories from here. I'm following Pinnacle Warrior and it's pretty decent.
My advice in general would be to write simple sentences. VERY simple sentences. Subject, verb, object. A lot of readers aren't that intelligent and are worse than poorly educated, so they can't handle complex sentences with lots of clauses. Description is fine, but you can tone that down as well. "A boat drifted gently under the cold glow of the moon. Flotsam and colorful mushrooms cluttered the swamp's surface." Stuff like that.

>>24496334
If you don't understand the appeal of something, how are you going to make something that appeals to that audience?

>>24496407
Rising Stars isn't the best list to look through if you're trying to get a feel for what people are reading. It only allows new stories and only for ~30 days which means there's a LOT of trash on there. Even top 7 of RS isn't necessarily doing that well
Check out the Popular This Week page

>>24496407
Understandable, will do and thanks again.

>>24496413
Yeah but they're also general stories that are a little newer and for a new writer, you'll want to catch peoples' attention with your first few chapters like those guys did.

Like the Dungeon Diver story on Popular this Week has nearly 900 chapters. Not really helpful for someone just getting started although it does have a decent first few chapters in terms of writing.

is the author of The Crow and The Rabbit in the house?

>>24496396
Sure there's a market, I've seen plenty on KU doing well, but it's not a genre webnovels tend to cover.

>>24495590
I have notebooks.

i've tried maybe two-dozen different webnovels and they were all terrible. i think the one i stuck w/ longest was HWFWM (...3 books??) but it was never that strong and still falls off a cliff.

>>24496485
>HWFWM
god I hated this one. soulless

>>24496359
I just read the first few paragraphs and besides the wake up from pain cliche to kick off the story, the prose is weird. For example 'Predictably, Kirielle grew visibly agitated after only a few moments of this pretend disinterest'. This is as fluid as dried cement.

>>24496498
Wow, three adverbs in one sentence. I think it would be difficult to do something like that intentionally.

Question. I just finished war and peace and to use that as an example the dialogue usually has a person saying something eg

>'You can't like tomatoes that much nikolai.'

(Followed immedietly with the response)

>'Oh yes I can!'

None of that 'she said calmly' or 'he replied'. Can I just have dialogue where it's a person speaking and the next line is the other person speaking or do I have to be a total sperg and imititate web novels and go

>'no' said Natasha loudly

>'what do you mean no?' said Andrei as he sucker punched her dog

>'Ow' shrieked Natasha as she began tap dancing

>>24496520
You can absolutely do that, as long as it's clear who is speaking when. If it's dialogue between two people, you can just alternate lines back and forth and people will follow.

When there's like a half dozen people standing around talking, it's harder to keep track without obvious verbal tics (the japanese method) or just putting ," said Jimmy

>>24496520
the great russian novelists all use dialogue tags. read more attentively
bad writers in general are infamous for over reliance on dialogue tags, both using using them poorly and too often
no, you don't have to. any prosaic styling is neither mandatory nor barred
writing is great because you can do anything if you can do it well

>>24496541
Thanks

Should I wake up every day and aim for 1000 words (sort of like a short story but in the same universe. Kind of like an epic). Next morning edit and write another 1000 to continue said story from another perspective or from the where it left off?

>>24496563
if that's what you want to do?
strange question
daily 1k words is perfectly attainable goal

>>24495472
Update on the cover art, the artist came back and fixed every single problem I had with it, and made a ton of progress today. Might have it finalized by the weekend and I can submit an epub to amazon on monday.

>>24496577
we're so back

What are the necessary things that comprise a web novel. What separates it from eg an adventure story? Do I have to have Isekai or RPG elements?

>>24496606
It just has to be posted on the web

>>24496606
Pretty much what >>24496610 said, but it's also common for web novels to last a long while, releasing frequently.
But, if you're asking "Do readers like isekai or RPG elements?" the answer is yes on Royal Road.

>>24496563
God, I wish I could write 1000 words a day.
Technically, I can do it, but I would hate it, and spend 10 days rewriting it.

>>24496697
In my experience, re-writing is pointless. The 80% solution really is best with webnovels. If tradpub ever wants it, they'll give you a real editor to help you with rewriting for market.

Like my current story is written like shit. The bonus content I'm writing now after the fact is WAY more entertaining to read. But fuck if I'm going back to rewrite the original story. I'll just leave it up and move on to the next story, which will be even better than what I'm writing now.

And the end goal isn't writing the great 4chan novel anyway. It's getting $17k/month on patreon for shitting out two short chapters a week of slop. I won't get there by endlessly rewriting: I'll only get there by moving forward, one chapter at a time. Besides which, even if you demand a certain level of quality of yourself, you still need to finish that first draft so you can rewrite it.

>>24496219
so? they've already torrented all the shit on libgen including the complete works of plenty of better authors than anyone in this thread (no offense)

>>24496072
>>24496232
if the catharsis of helping politically assassinate her father is supposed to be the point there should be a longer arc in your outline of working "within the system" and and struggling with the father's bullshit before the viceroy thing. you've gotta build up before you can pay off
maybe that was supposed to happen during the slave revolt before the viceroy eventually comes to fix shit, but the outline doesn't elaborate or make it clear

>>24496362
>beg people to read my story,
what's the point, only people who are already reading will see your begging
if you aren't popular from the first week you are doomed to obscurity

What do large published fantasy authors do all day? Some of these retards take a decade to release a 400 page follow up book in their series. Are they just lazy? Are they spending all day jerking off over prose? Do they think they're Tolkien and so they're spending a decade worldbuilding?

One autistic amateur author can output as much in a month as they do in a decade and I'll unironically enjoy it more. Embarrassing. Pathetic.

>>24496898
depends on the author. some like brandon sanderson or lately adrian tchaikovsky (he's more SF though) are very prolific and write a shitload.
some spend a lot more time revising and rewriting and revising and throwing shit out again trying to get everything perfect. which can be nice if you wanna appreciate the craft but if you just wanna zone out and read entertaining slop it's of course a much slower way to produce writing

others just suffer from typical artist brain diseases and spend all day jerking off or curled up in a ball suffering from crippling depression and write 100 words a day. these ones are usually either geniuses or dogshit

>>24496897
>if you aren't popular from the first week you are doomed to obscurity
Not true: consistency goes a LONG way. Readers are willing to give you a chance and follow the story if you're ON TIME with your chapters as scheduled. My story is meandering poorly paced depressing muck, and people keep finding it and following it.

>>24496898
If you had a hit, and then you got a $4k royalty check every month with no further effort on your part, would you be particularly motivated to keep writing? Most people wouldn't. Why put effort into something and neglect other things if the money is effectively the same anyway?

>>24496362
I don't even read author notes. I don't give a fuck what the faggot is rambling about, I'm just there for my slop. Imagine going to movies and every 15 minutes the director comes to stand next to you, saying like "please, would you consider rating this movie on your way out, maybe write a review, please, please my man, it would mean so much to me, maybe leave a small donation too? Even a dollar is fine! I think you owe me that if you're having a good time". Holy hell how disgusting and annoying, get off my face! I hate every gay bitch who actually listens to these cretins because it only encourages more begging

>>24496396
Yeah , r/HFY is full of these and i have read a few on RR (HFY has better quality , i don't know why)

Just some points of encuragement :

1) A lot of famous classics were serialized. Serialization is not an issue (ex: Count of Monte Cristo , Foundation , etc)
2) Writing quality is not a big issue. (I don't read Asimov because I like his prose)
3) Don't underestimate the RR readership. Good stories rise to the top with good concistency.
4) The pipeline for eventual Amazon sales is to first get decent readership in RR and then ORGANICALY shill on reddit (progressionfantasy , litrpg , etc)

I had an interesting idea for an isekai story told from the perspective of the natives of the isekai world. It's about nobles and peasants living in a medieval fantasy world, but suddenly powerful wizards and superheroes and space marines from Earth appear out of nowhere. Obviously this completely disrupts the balace of power and makes everything worse, and violence and scheming ensues.

>>24497320
Imhate to break it to you but
a) it's been done before
b) thats mr Dinniman's new standalone book, "Operation Bounce House"

>>24497332
Damn, I thought I actually had an original idea. This description is almost exactly what I was picturing.

>>24496302
also women, five seconds after a fight:

>>24496452
link?
this is quite interesting

>>24497336
don't sweat novelty too much. nothing new under the sun etc etc
worry about execution

>>24497214
i have never asked for money. I just want to know people enjoy what I write.

>>24497372
If they did, they'll say it willingly, if they don't, they didn't.

>>24497378
historically, in service marketing, the ratio of good reviews to bad is about 1:4, even for successful businesses where bad service is much less common than good
people (myself included) just don't take the time to give feedback to a good product or service, we only end up saying anything when we're dissastified

caveat: I'm not up to date with the latest research so this might have changed in recent years as the Internet marketplace STRONGLY incentivises customers to leave good reviews for the common good, so this might have changed in recent years

but I doubt leopards change their spots that much
for example, the ratio of Follows and Bookmarks to Reviews I have on FFN is pretty much on the historical level
>BUT DID HE SAY THANK YOU?!?!

>>24496362
Your supposed to use author's notes to talk about random ass shit you like while maybe giving a bit of insight to your creative process and behind-the-scenes factoids.
You're being the wrong kind of faggot

>>24497390
>Your supposed to use author's notes to talk about random ass shit you like while maybe giving a bit of insight to your creative process and behind-the-scenes factoids
I too think Mikey Wray is so kewl

>>24497390
Would using it to directly ask readers questions to boost engagement be seen as cheap/intrusive? Or even beta reading style questions like "do you find character A likeable/trustworthy?" or "did you see this twist/reveal coming?" or "was this segment frustrating/tedious?" Etc

>>24497378
people are far more likely to express negative opinions compared to positive ones.

>>24497359
Just scroll through the Amazon best sellers for Military Sci-Fi. You have literally stuff like the Wayfarers series of Old Man's War and more pulp series like Backyard Starship, Omega Force, and Spinward Fringe.

>>24497390
I think i have asked for ratings/reviews 10 times in 70 chapters. I don't usually do this because I hate begging but people here said I should. I don't know what I'm supposed to do.

>>24496891
That's why there is a prologue about father's action causing more suffering to her.

>>24497456
Consider why you're writing this. If it's a story that you simply must get out into the world for whatever compelling personal/artistic reason, then cool.
Nobody's saying you need to write to market but from what you've described, it will likely have minimal appeal in the web novel scene

>>24497439
use a female pen name
nothing wrong about leaving a "comments and reviews are always welcome <3"
thank people that leave nice reviews
give feedback and build a parasocial relationship

>>24497471
don't forget the "you a real one [praying hands emoji][fire emoji]"

>>24497460
I'm writing it to explore the world.
Initially, it was just romantasy, with no slave revolt or patricide. Just two people traveling and meeting people.

>>24497502
this sounds way more interesting to me
fictional travelogues can be great. great backdrop for romance. if you can write episodic stories this sounds likesonrthing I'd love to read
makes me think of spice and wolf
why the drastic chamge from your original vision? did a friend tell you that you need more stakes and drama to make the readers basedjack?

>>24497387
Web fiction is not a hotel in Teneriffa. People are not financially invested in it, expect nothing, and are generally reluctant to hurt the author's assumed fragile feelings. They'll sooner stay quiet, if they have nothing good to say, and simply move on. That silence is a message of its own. Something really has to ruffle feathers before they put in the effort to start ranting.

If your story has the slightest potential, you're more likely to get good and encouraging reviews by eternally content-starved normalfags who think they can "help" and thereby get slop closer to their tastes.

>notice a pfp giving reviews across different stories I read
>think this guy must be deslerate and review swapping like crazy
>check their account
>110 reviews 0 fictions
holy fucking based
I kneel

>>24492191 (OP)
Said it before

If I had long nipple hairs I would braid them.

honorable seniors
would you give my xianxia novel a chance?

https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/this-middling-young-master-will-comprehend-dao-and-plunder-legacies.1237343/

>>24497609
...people still use spacebattles?

>>24497609
cultivation stories are so boring

>>24497618
>royalroad
ai and progression slop
>webnovel
horny 14 yr old esl's and shadow slave
>scribblehub
horny 14 yr old esl's and non esl's
>A03
smut
>wattpad
esl smut
>HFY
redditors

where else am i reading or posting?

The 18 year old born of his parents being one degree of familial separation predictably crashed out and promptly dragged out with his hanger-on's by his babysitter on the fact that despite given the very best of the clan resources and being born more auspiciously with the Extreme Yang High Quality Talent spirit roots he only mastered the sect's basic Crucible Breath and Strikes, never winning any Inner Disciple Acceptance Tournament with a low turnout every Spirit Beast Hunt, and spamming talismans every fight in the 3 years he spent at Melting Crucible Sect.

>>24497509
I have a habit of cascading things.
It's still going to be that, it's just this island this is sort of a prologue to continental travel.

>>24497623
bro it's slop; put your ego away
you're not better than the average royal retard or fanfic schlicker

Fuck there is no greater feeling than cracking the context of the story you want to tell. Been trying to get the story formula -- the who, what, where, why -- of my series for about 3 years now (whilst working on my other main story that's two books in already).

Just finally figuring out how to fucking start the whole thing and have it hold the story premise is amazing, man.

>>24496898
Whilst the whole day is there. The writing spark for the day can go in as little as two hours. Trying to write when not fresh and gearing up for the day can be a real detriment to the work. That, and authors like Tolkien weren't all-in with their writing. Dude was a professor, husband, father, devoted Catholic, etc.

George RR Martin is just a lazy cunt though.

>>24497625
zoomer babble really is its own dialect
I wonder if it'll inform english as a whole going forward. zoomer prose is going to be so fucked up

>>24497621
there are interesting slop out there if you give it a go
Beware of Chicken I hear is pretty nice but I haven't pirated it yet
This Young Master is not Cannon Fodder is quintessential slop
Ave Xia Rem Y is the most closest to the good mainstream slop there is
Cultivation Nerd is the very best slop of all the slop I have read and is my gold standard for the slop I read
but not all cultivation stories are slop my fren
Reverend Insanity is proof of that
>>24497630
no there has to be a line drawn, if not for the demarcation of sub communities within the community then for the sake of knowing where to look as to not waste time

>>24497387
I'm willing to give reviews and ratings to early works I find. I found a couple stories recently before they had ten chapters, and I was among the first reviews and ratings for them.

But am I going to read Mother of Learning and think to myself, hmm, I should spend my limited time rating this and reviewing it? Fuck no. So there's an aspect of how much impact my view will have, too. Why be the millionth guy to review Dr. Pepper when I could be the third guy to review some new energy drink that just came out?

I would rate and review peoples' works they post here, if I thought it was really good. But I'm not going to be the shitstain who gives a one or two star review, either. I'd rather just give feedback here, or in a comment on a burner account.

I don't know what the point of this post is anymore. I guess I'm just saying it's complicated.

>>24497646
there is no camaraderie for the successful
buy a book from a starving artist, pirate from a millionaire

>>24497618
it's pretty damn popular for its niches. some of those stories have literal thousands of pages of responses

>>24492191 (OP)
What´s the opinion on Beware Of Chicken here?

>>24496334
unironically go hit up a video that tells you the difference between showing and telling
sanderson that redditor already outdid you with
"Szeth-son-son-Vallano, Truthless of Shinovar, wore white on the day he was to kill a king"

>>24497666
I liked it. It's not peak or anything though. Better than most slop

>>24497666
interesting premise but it lost steam

>>24497636
That's not zoomer babble though
It's English attempts to copy translated Chinese

>>24497666
It starts out as a pretty good and amusing parody of the genre, but eventually the joke does tend to wear thin. I enjoyed it while I read it but once I took a break to read something else never had the urge to go back.

>>24497694
over-localisation is bad but "foreignisation" is a flawed approach too.
there's no reason why a xianxia/wuxia written in English can't have prose like Zelazny or Le Guin. forcing oneself to write like an early 2000s internet fan translation for the sake of emulating an incidental quasi-style is a disservice to the genre.

>>24497733
>prose like Zelazny or Le Guin
part of the appeal of web slop is how quick and easy it is to read. which isn't to say the awful translated cultivation style is what I want either, since I can't read that stuff. i don't want what would be considered good prose by lit tards though

>>24497750
this might not be what you're saying but Zelazny and Le Guin aren't pretentious highbrow litfic either. they're SFF writers with very beautiful prose that's still engaging. I suppose a better example would have been someone like Robert E. Howard (author of Conan the Barbarian) who wrote a lot of fun, pulpy stuff — maybe a little purple by 2025 standards but still very readable. I'm a big fan of his fight scenes.

>>24492473
Reminds me of "He Who Fights with Monsters" type shit. I can still hear the "Transcendent damage" and "spirit vault" and "it has no effect" repeated verbatim over and over.

>>24497609
The technical quality of the writing just isn't good enough for me to read. You have a lot of problems with run-on sentences, broken sentences, punctuation, perspective, and formatting. It's a broken word soup. Even if technical quality doesn't matter as much as people think, especially for slop, the writing still has to be easy to follow. You might benefit from using AI purely for technical critique.

>>24497378
>If they did, they'll say it willingly
Not true. I enjoy plenty of stuff but even if it's the best shit ever I never comment/review/like&subscribe or otherwise engage in any kind of interaction. I just wanna quietly read my shit and leave without ever speaking to another human being.

>>24497594
>have chest hair about 2-3 inches long all over
>never braided it
is this the secret to get into Rising Stars?

>>24492191 (OP)
How time jumps?
I'm thinking of having 1 year time jump between every chapter

>>24498070
>How time jumps?
at most 1

>>24497932
I hate to tell you, anon, but you alone cannot represent the entirety of the human race.

>>24497999
No, that's armpit hair, chest hair is for when you want to sell you KU, dummy.

worm fucking sucks, why is it always recommended

>>24498196
because most people don't think it sucks
i bet some of the stuff you consider peak we would call trash

>>24498121
Nah, time jumps work as long as they help the narrative flow cleanly. Long time skips of several years where characters just sit and do nothing while the situation changes suck.

>>24498070
It'll come down to the execution. My instinct is that it's a bad idea. I probably couldn't pull that off.

>>24498196

>>24498196
worm's fine

someone feed a chapter of Worm into an AI and see what it says

>>24498202
I barely started with web novels. I've been recommended Worm, The Wandering Inn, A Practical Guide To Evil, Mother Of Learning and Lord Of The Mysteries.

I dropped Wandering Inn after the first book because it was terrible and it's a stupidly long series.

I enjoyed Worm's world building. The powers and their origin were very creative, and I found some characters interesting. Unfortunately the pacing was a mess, the prose dull, the protagonist extremely unlikeable, and there were too many cop out moments. The comically edgy tone didn't help.

I've yet to read the other 3.

>>24498301
nabokov if he had a low vocabulary and linguistic competence

>>24498301
Dungeon Diver: Stealing a Monster's Power is pretty standard for litrpg web novels in my opinion. It's hard to recommend things that are stubbed, but Dungeon Diver is totally available on Royal Road. The writing is mid but it shows you kind of how the "system" and progression aspects work in the narrative.

Of stubbed web novels that aren't too hard to pirate, Azarinth Healer and Beneath the Dragon Eye Moons.

I had a micro-aneurysm followed by vertigo minutes ago when I was looking too hard into revising phrases on my screen. Don't fucking redo your draft more than three times or you may die.

would you still read worm if it was a worm

>>24498367
stop reminding me that there'll never be anything that captures the magic of act 1 kumo

note to self
events are not story

Is there a WN in which the MC has an ACTUAL harem? I mean, the MC has romantic interest in all of the girls, not it’s not a mono-romance with gag characters on the side?

>>24498403
a tragedy in two lines

>>24498411
mostly the authors who churn out that litrpg harem stuff dump it straight on KU rather than royalroad etc.
there is lots of smutslop on scribblehub though

>>24497390
I did creative insights and behind the scenes in my AN for a long while but stopped doing them because there was a thread floating around at the time discussing them and it was a general consenus they take away the magic.

>>24497618
I started using it more often. It recently got a overhaul with the creative fiction forum so it has slightly more visibility for newer fics.

>hit 200+ pages, 5000 views, and 150 follows in the same day
Is this ratio ass?

>>24498301
Those really are terrible first recommendations for an introduction to webnovels. They are all stupidly long series, some are the authors first novel (and it shows) or suffer from (machine) translation problems.

Is this a good advertising for Royal Road?

>>24498560
that's pretty insane for one day. were you boosted by review swaps?

>>24498411
On Astral Tides - maybe the best WN with an anime-style harem (both as a joke and written seriously) with actual fleshed out characters and relationships between the MC and all the girls.

>>24498582
No haha I've been posting for months, I just achieved these milestones all on the same day

>>24498573
So what's good then

>>24498573
>They are all stupidly long series
Isn't this a major appeal of serials? I can only come up with a few shorter ones and they're not that well known
Worm, The Wandering Inn, Mother of Learning, and APGTE are all adjacent enough to regular SFF that they get talked about and recommended in normal fantasy book spaces as the gateway drug. I'm struggling to imagine what would make for a better introduction.

>>24498609
Like...Super Powereds, maybe? I thought that was ass though. Obviously HWFWM, PH, and DOTF are out, all are long and much sloppier. DCC isn't really a serial, it found most of its success as an audiobook and then trad pubbed novel. Unsong? That's not really popular and is kinda weird. Perfect Run? I didn't like it desu, but it's short-ish and complete ig. Obviously none of the cultivation slop stories, most are translated.
I'm drawing a real blank. I have no clue what would be an introductory serial if not Worm

>>24498609
I admit I may be being overly harsh but both Worm and Wandering Inn are especially rough works at the start and even fans say it takes a while for the series to become 'good' - but that wait can be a few 100k words or more to reach. A Practical Guide To Evil I guess isn't a bad choice, the writing is more than decent from the get-go.

>>24498623
ok anon but all serials are bad and have issues like that. this is a slop space. what are the good introductory serials if not those?

>>24498637
Reverend Insanity

>>24498623
Worm was what got me into web fiction and I found it perfectly readable from the geto go as someone who had previously read whatever was popular that year in epic fantasy, like Sanderson Abercrombie Brent Weeks Pierce Brown etc

>>24498640
A troll response right? that's translated, which even a lot of slop enjoyers can't handle

>>24498643
I've recommended Worm to friends before. Most have dropped it for various reasons - too slow, badly written, simply didn't like it - but those who did like it *really* liked it. No story will appeal to everyone.

>>24498637
> what are the good introductory serials if not those?
I'd first ask what kind of books they like and then give recommendations based on their response.

how is super supportive so popular? the pacing is fucking glacial
>stop liking things I don't like
there are many web novels I don't enjoy but can totally see why they're popular with other people. super supportive isn't one of them

>>24498675
Honestly at this point I just want you to name any short, well written serial for any genre that would make for a good introduction into this space

>>24498694
I haven't read it yet but I've seen so many people rave about it, and it blew up like crazy so there's gotta be something there
It's specifically marketed as slow burn slice of life though, so I can see how the pacing would be glacial when web serials are already considered slow

>>24498694
having criticism isn't the same as acting like a belligerent retard
I think I read like 30 chapters of this years ago and dropped it
I can appreciate a glacial pace if the prose is good and the story offers something to engage with, be it effective characterization, setting up cool intrigues and set pieces, convincing character relationships or whatever. super supportive was setting stuff up but I found the prose too stale to find any charm in it

>>24498699
The Perfect Run
Dead Tired

>>24498699
if you've already read the entry point stories and weren't impressed then you're going to need to offer more insight if you want a recommendation
kinda just seems like you're being dismissive and combative desu senpai

>>24492191 (OP)
I'm so worried about writing garbage, I never write anything.

>>24498729
I bounced off the perfect run personally but I did mention it as being in contention. For some reason I can't get into any of Void Herald's stuff, something feels off about the writing (maybe because he's ESL? but some ESL authors I can read just fine)
Dead Tired is an interesting suggestion for sure, lol. I don't read RavensDaggers stuff but from cultural osmosis I always thought Dead Tired was received pretty meh, and RavensDagger in general. Definitely doesn't come to mind as a premier rec for someone just starting out
I do intend on giving Perfect Run another try since I see it mentioned a lot though. Maybe through audiobook this time, that tends to mask prose issues for me
>>24498732
Anon I'm the one who gave those intro recs and the other anon said "those fucking suck as intro recs" so I wanted to know what his were

>>24498735
a writer who writes garbage is a better writer than one who writes nothing at all

>>24498694
> how is super supportive so popular?
Right there with you anon. I've read plenty of long series, hell I'm almost up to date with TWI so I know about slow webnovel pacing. But that series takes it several levels too far.

>>24498699
>well-written
It's web novels man. NONE of them are "well-written." Not even genuine masterpieces of literature like Mushoku Tensei or Honzuki no Gekokujou. And I'm being sincere when I call them masterpieces. They are, but they're not "well-written" by standard measures.

If you want "well-written," you go read a classic. Web novels are their own thing.

>>24498749
You're responding to the wrong person, my fellow slop friends. I'm trying to pin down the poser who called APGTE, Worm, TWI, and MoL as being 'way too long and horrible entry points into (((our))) genre'

>>24498741
Well I wouldn't recommend Perfect Run to those that don't like gamelit or timeloops, but it's a short, snappy (and complete) story. Dead Tired is like the authors other works, just very easy to read. Their other series are better but the requirement was for short.

>>24498759
>but the requirement was for short.
Only because that anon said long serials were bad as an intro into the genre (lol). I'm sorry, are you him or just someone who jumped into the convo?

>>24498753
He doesn't have an answer because he's playing the game of holding up an impossible, undefined standard and refusing to define it so that he can claim nothing meets the standard. It's mid-high level trolling, but at the end of the day it's just trolling.

I wish more people would just shill their works here or post samples for critique.

>>24498694
how is the pace glacial? I thought webnovel slop was supposed to be nonstop battles every chapter?

>>24498749
one of the main principles of good writing is intercoherence which is a high ask when you're writing millions of words of the same story for years on end
web novels can (and do) have individual aspects of a well written work but they'll come and go because the story and its author are both constantly in flux
a serial and a novel aren't directly comparable by the same measures because a serial is a living thing while the novel is definite. a novel is planned, drafted, rewritten again and again, edited, and only after it is determined to be exactly what the author wants to be is it considered finished. a serial is written on a deadline and you just have to figure that shit out as you go

>>24498769
there are different sorts of slop. you're thinking of the litrpg grindfest slop which is headed by titles like HWFWM, PH, and DOTF
very different from stuff like wandering inn and super supportive, which can go for entire book lengths with nothing much happening

>>24498765
I've been waiting to talk about an anon's story but they haven't posted anything about it. without a post to reply to I'd just be mumbling into the void hoping they see it
authors: talk about your shit

>>24498776
>authors: talk about your shit
i would but linking myself to 4chan doesn't seem wise

>>24498784
I get why you'd be skeptical but we're mostly past the point culturally where anyone cares about the anonymous hacker known only as 4chan

How many anons here are actually writing a webnovel? Who is already posting? Who is still wallowing in worldbuilding and brainstorming?

>>24498771
right, right, makes sense, thanks

>>24498804
I'm a retard who is in brain storming
I've got a few ideas I sorta like but I feel that if I don't have a unity of theme and premise that appeal to me then the story will inevitably slip out of my hands. either by me not wanting to write it and falling behind schedule, or the story becoming a frayed mess that doesn't resemble the original promise at all
trying to think of something or roll around my current ideas to find an angle that hooks me

>>24498795
no, we aren't
I'm NTA but I keep my 4ch activities secret from everyone I know because they all think 4chan is only for Nazis
and my liberal friends would cut me dead if they knew, and that is virtually all of my fandom such as it is

>>24498804
I write, post, and have been for years now

>>24498821
I've known quite a few normie 4chan users. I had a coworker with a /b/ tattoo. met a couple /lit/tards at a book release
a lot of internet culture in general is downstream from imageboards and 4ch. it's definitely less stigmatized than a decade ago
if you're specifically in some yuppie/collegiate spheres then I could see it being a problem
a shame. anonymous imageboards are a nice place to appreciate community because the central focus is a shared interest. too many times I've gotten into a writing community and had people wanting to get up in my life and become super intimate

>>24498842
yeah I'm here mainly for /tg/ and /k/, because normie hobbyist boards tend to be more closely modded than I like
but no, I know my friends and 4chan is just totally verboten
sure I might find 2 or 3 fellow channers but I'd lose a hundred

>>24498804
Mine has been on hiatus for over a year and a half...

>>24498804
>actually writing
me
trying to make the jump from fanfiction
will promote here in a couple of months I guess

>>24498776
>>24498804
there have been 4 or 5 stories linked in these threads that I've seen, maybe more that I missed.


>>24498784
I've been on this site since the late 2000s, I can be traced back here and to a number of other bad places in a variety of ways if people care enough.

>>24498742
Are you saying person who wrote My Immortal is better than me?

>>24498998
My Immortal is blatantly parody and is talked about even this many years later, so unironically yes, since that takes a certain skill. if maybe not traditional writing skill. but something adjacent

>>24498998
My Immortal is an important cultural relic of a bygone era

>>24498804
>>24498784
I completed and serialized a short story last month, and before that serialized a longer 3 volume work(axed on 3rd volume) for like 3-4 years straight. I used to post it on /wg/ time to time but usually people never read it. Right now I'm working on an outline I'm treating as a skeleton first draft.

>>24498776
just do it. Say "I've been reading [story] which was linked here and think the girls need bigger tits"

>>24498776
If it's the pirate eldritch cultist one, I'm here but haven't made much headway into it.

>>24498998
yes
don't take that too badly; I think My Immortal is beyond my own capability even
it was the perfect parody in that it was ludicrous and yet not so ridiculous that it was a valid question whether it was in earnest or a prank
that's a balance quite difficult to achieve

if you think it's easy, well, try writing and posting a parody of Royalroad slop that is so fucked-up it sends everyone wondering if it's real or a prank

>>24499094
it's much harder to make something like My Immortal now. we're so far into post-irony culture you'd be seen through immediately

>>24498283
AI praises everything. Every fucking thing.

>>24499095
it's different, not more difficult
My Immortal was difficult for its time also

and no, all genres can be parodied. even comedies and porn can be lampooned. what makes My Immortal brilliant is not that it was ironic; "Gilesbie" protested that she was in absolute earnest throughout. rather, it was perfectly written to be just good enough to appear unironic. that's difficult for any parody of any genre.
Spaceballs was ironic; The Room wasn't. now try doing both at once.

>>24499118
it's not that culture would necessitate it being ironic but that the culture would cause people to perceive it as ironic

>>24499147
yes. and that's where the difficulty is. to discern precisely where the line is drawn in today's culture, and edge it.
so long as serious works and parodies exist side by side, there will always be a line.
the "post-ironic" culture as you call it has simply moved the line.

>>24499101
i showed the AI a picture of my penis and it said there wasn't no detectable penis

I don't know if I'll have physical copies of my book ready in time for the convention next month... I'm gonna try and get everything finalized (manuscript and epub) tomorrow as fast as I can, do one last editing pass, and call it good enough for a first edition.

It would really suck to have to hand out business cards trying to sell epubs rather than have a stack of books on hand to sell.

>>24498587
NTA, I looked for that wn on royal road just now and it said deleted. Any other places that sory is on?

>>24499364
Google is your friend

If you have ai sloppa art as cover art I'm sorry but I'm just not gonna read it.

>>24499503
that's ok everybody else will

>>24499503
The process of commissioning art is extremely tiring on top of costing money. And frankly, AI is good enough. Cover doesn't really matter for a book as anything but marketing.

I could have easily wrangled an AI into making my cover art instead. It wouldn't change anything about the text inside.

Anyway in five years all covers will be AI generated and nobody will be able to tell the difference, and in six years nobody will care.

>>24499675
Yes, you're right. Nobody will care. Those same people who don't care will go on to read AI slop stories over anything written by (You).

>>24498735
He who fights, can lose. He who doesn't fight, has already lost

Also writing tons of garbage is the first step towards shitting out something decent

>>24498749
Comparison is with tradpub fantasy , not with the classics. And a lot of webnovels WIPE THE FLOOR with modern fantasy

>>24499364
It seems that it got removed from RR because of snowflakes - it has no-fade-to-black sex scenes and one of the girls is the common anime trope of being hundreds of years old but looks underage. Scribblehub is its home now but if you have KU that's the best way to read it since the published books now have an editor and proper formatting.

My Immortal should be OP for the next bread

>>24499503
based
>>24499675
i will use proper art and I will care when see AI art.

>>24500142
Done

>>24500369
>>24500369
>>24500369

>>24499675
It took me two minutes to find multiple people on fiverr working in physical mediums whose work is cover-worthy for under $150.

>>24500373
its over

>>24500477
/lit/ has one board specific rule and it's that fanfiction is banned, and you guys made the OP with a famous fanfiction title
no shit

I'm pretty sure I've seen Light Novel and other weeb generals banned too so we really should stick, at least for the OPs, to English web novels. don't use ao3 or shit either, that's mostly a FF site

Reverend Insanity should be OP for the next bread

>>24500492
I'm not against it I just know for a fact I've seen LN threads booted off of /lit/ before. Translated chinkshit might get the same treatment

I didn't personally enjoy it but something Dungeon Crawler Carl would probably be the safest option