Is Morrowind dialog /lit/?

>not OpenMW
wince

>>24583825 (OP)

Ok I am convinced, I will stop trying to publish novels and break into the video game narrative and dialogue genre, where do I start?

I think I know where they went, fattie

>>24583825 (OP)
In sincerity, I think so. MW had a real literary quality imo. Oblivion and Skyrim did not.
>>24583925
OpenMW is worse other than lua script enabling

>>24583951
write a visual novel. best form of storytelling anyway. music. visual. writing.

>>24584162
I think video games could be used to do this, but most of the time, the quality falls short. Morrowind was very good at doing this. People also hold up disco elysium as an example, but I didn't like it. The literary notes need to be paired with game play that is actually fun.
Visual novels are cool, but the interactivity of games is a cool avenue for story telling.

>>24583951
play disco elysium to see a successful (and good) iteration of this. the game is based on a novel written by the lead writer that was released like 13 years ago, failed miserably and barely sold, author almost drinks himself to death and then re-adapts his novel into a game and it turned out great.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Kurvitz

>>24584177
Lol that's funny your mind went there too. It became the default literature game. The only problem is it isn't fun to play

>>24583951
>>24584177
also check out Pathologic. highly /lit/ game

>>24584170
I think active video games can have a lot of potential for storytelling too, but the player freedom makes it difficult to have situations play out in ways that are niche/to be explored, or put the player in a specific mindset. There is also a spectrum to interactivity, for example, if you look up "garage, bad dream adventure", point and click and atmospheric, its basically a visual novel in my mind. Theres also visual novels with gameplay mechanics mixed into intermissions, undertale and deltarune (NOT a fan of these games but make a good mechanical example) is what open world is to RPGS for a visual novel. Maybe someone who finds the gameplay loop more engaging would disagree but its just interactive filler. Honestly though once again, I do not appreciate the aesthetic or story of it, delta-rune with character dialogue and interaction midfight is like immersing a player into a story moment while being actively engaged, though i think to control the narrative better you would use these moments more to engage choices.

I have been wanting to make a "visual" novel myself with gameplay elements during key moments.

hell yes it is finding that dude was rad af they tried to recreate the magic in skyrim with that underground area filled with mushrooms but it just didn't have the magic

>>24583825 (OP)
What dialogue? 95% of NPCs in this game can only be asked about the same fucking generic rumors and locations. It's one of my biggest gripes with Morrowind. You don't have the logistical and budgetary burden of voice acting and you've made this autistic hyperlinked dialogue system and you don't do anything with it. Literally every NPC should have had his own personality and unique things to say, even if only a couple of lines.

>>24584205
That could be cool and I get what you mean. It's not usually my thing; something like this
>>24584189
Looks cool and the tone seems surreal, to my tastes, but i know if its mostly dialogue with visual elements, personally I'm more likely to watch someone play it on YouTube or something if I wanna know the story.
> but the player freedom makes it difficult to have situations play out in ways that are niche/to be explored, or put the player in a specific mindset.
So, this is where vidya as a creative medium interests me the most. For what you're saying, a visual novel works best because you can control the linearity, or gated linearity, without having to water down the depth to account for player freedom and fun as much.

What interests me with vidya, is best exemplified by morrowind, or even kenshi (its concepts, not necessarily its execution). Worldbuilding.

A non linear adventure, in a very defined world, sort of turns the world itself into "the story." In kenshi, there isn't a story. Mechanics are fun, if simple.
But there is a world, and even though the game could be deeper, that alone feels like a story. Uncovering books, meeting characters who remember the past or are involved in the present, contradictory histories, different norms in different provinces. It all feels very literary to me and I think can be used to explore themes, to great effect.
The Holy Nation is a racist, misogynist fascist theocracy, but exploration from the player, you learn why they became that way and it adds interesting thematic complexity.
Similar to how in MW, there's no good guys really, just learning about the factions and pressures of this world. Just my opinion on games as art.

>>24584155
Being able to have multiple data folders is a game changer.

>>24584239
yeah, i agree with you retarding morrowind and kenshi. im a big fan of those games as well and consider them to be quite literary, but Disco Elysium and Pathologic in particular balance gameplay and writing quite perfectly. Disco Elysium is able to completely focus on its writing thanks to its game design, which is structured like a CRPG, while removing common gameplay elements like combat, and just making the gameplay a bunch of skill based dice rolls. Pathologic is a strange, surreal, world that oozes classic russian and ukrainian /lit/ as well as similarities to Camus' "The Plague" where the gameplay is a kind of stressful and obtuse struggle and weaves together with the story, themes, plot and aesthetics of fatalistic struggle. i would love a game like Morrowind again today, but we probably will never see that again, outside of things like Tamriel Rebuilt.

>>24584293
>Pathologic is a strange, surreal, world that oozes classic russian and ukrainian /lit/ as well as similarities to Camus' "The Plague" where the gameplay is a kind of stressful and obtuse struggle and weaves together with the story, themes, plot and aesthetics of fatalistic struggle.
I did get this sense a bit playing Disco. Like some of the eeriness I felt playing it accentuated the theme. In that sense, it worked nicely. Just not my type of game typically.
> i would love a game like Morrowind again today, but we probably will never see that again, outside of things like Tamriel Rebuilt.
If we build it, they will come

>>24584223
in morrowind u get the world story from reading books and other texts u find not so much from talking to ppl

>>24584343
yeah morrowind is very much a 'worldbuild-y" game where characters with lots of depth like vivec is only interacted with like once or twice in game, and doesn't actually talk with you that much, so much of their characterization comes from secondary sources.

>>24584239
I think the best games that allow the freedom to build your own story just rely really heavily on world building and exceptional characters to interact with, I guess my mind doesnt go there because I think its difficult to imagine really good characters. If someone is truly extraordinary or interesting, that character would compete heavily with the player in agency. I don't know, perhaps my mind doesnt think about it as quite as viable because im not very creative.

>>24584377
I doubt that's the case. We may just enjoy different things. I would struggle to create something like Pathology because my retard ADHD brain can't focus on a plot long enough to care about or finish it. Worldbuilding works because I don't have to do that, but if your brain works differently, it may be harder for you whereas a plot is easier or more enjoyable. That doesn't make you less creative, don't put yourself down. Or do, lol I'm not telling you what to do

>>24584390
I doubt anyone would take advice from a self-diagnosed retard.

>>24584390
Do you have examples of this sort of construction besides stuff like morrowind, elysium, new vegas? I play a lotta vidya, read some. Theres a lot of stories with exceptional worlds, what are some more of your favorites that provide a lot of player agency?

>>24584423
Those are the best ones I can think of too. I don't play many obscure games. If you find any that are similar, it'd be news to me.
I mentioned Kenshi, it's not super deep but the worldbuilding that does exist is pretty good.

Oblivion was such a massive letdown after this game.

The Dwemer were such a missed opportunity. No one should have been able to fight them. They should have eclipsed all other Magicka users by way of discovering the Tone of Magic/Aetherius itself. That level of modern-ish understanding should have been insurmountable.

>>24584803
I am still butthurt about this

>>24584803
>>24584826
>>24584831
You do realize these games are inconsistently made and the writers are never on the same page

>>24584834
My favorite is how Yokuda sunk.
>and so, he swung his sword super hard and the land blew up into the sea, so epic

>>24583825 (OP)
No, it's extremely terse and "workmanlike" prose. Every character interrupts their sentence for another sentence.

>>24584826
it's obv a reference to a dark ages scenario where the high civilization is overrun by hordes and technology is lost

Did anyone ever compile the complete story of The Lusty Argonian Maid? How much even is there?

>>24584997
google will solve your damning conundrum

>>24584834
sure, but its a "stars aligning" sort of thing and with Morrowind it did where you had Kirkbride being an insane schizophrenic re-writing TES from a generic DnD game to the mish-mash of influences that are apparent with morrowind, to being tard wrangled by Ken Rolston and had plenty of dudes to shoot the shit with like Kurt Kuhlmann. I think Ken Rolston even said he owed much of the visual and narrative aesthetic to Kirkbride