Saint-Saens edition
https://youtu.be/KHt4PFKiQE0
This thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.
>How do I get into classical?This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:
https://pastebin.com/NBEp2VFh (embed)
Previous:
>>126648409
>>126671995>The live version is even better.This one? goddamn this is a sick cover
>>126672023No, that one is kinda boring. Talking about the contemporary-ish one with the studio recording but with Berlin instead.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvfxurfQQig
>>126672034I see. I do generally prefer the sonority of the BPO over the VPO. I'll give it a listen next time I'm in the mood for the 5th, thanks!
>norman lebrecht really rates leinsdorf's mahler 3
>hurwitz/classicstoday totally pans it
Which of these two mahler fanboys should I trust?
>>126672123https://www.musicweb-international.com/Mahler/Mahler3.htm
>>126672123Listen to them and figure out which one you like by A/B comparing them to a reference version, while looking at the score?
>>126672123Leinsdorf is pretty well-liked around these parts. I haven't heard that recording in a long time, but I remember it being pretty good. Not one I'd revisit because I think all of those early recordings have been topped, especially with that kind of straightforward style of performance to the piece. Like right now, I'm listening to Jansons' recording of the 3rd -- I'd rather listen to this than Leinsdorf's again.
>>126672136I'll just stick with Kubelik then.
hurwitz
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I WILL NOT BE SEATED NEXT TO THIS EMISSARY OF SATAN
>>126672175That's undoubtedly one of the great ones, yeah. I do prefer listening to Mahler cycles/recordings with a bit more color and flair and personalization these days, but for a straightforward reading, you can't top Kubelik's.
>times you actually agreed with hrwtz
For me it's Schubert 9 by NDR/Wand
now playing
start of J.S. Bach: Goldberg Variations, BWV 988 (Arr. Sitkovetsky for String Trio)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QaU718WHYU&list=OLAK5uy_m8HPzcRzfYtEkmmg6-u6mLMCsBXb-1T6w&index=1
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_m8HPzcRzfYtEkmmg6-u6mLMCsBXb-1T6w
>This is now my new reference for Bach’s Goldberg Variations on anything other than keyboard. ---- Dominy Clements
>>126672211Man, I'll never get what you Wand-enthusiasts see in his recordings. His Bruckner, his Schubert, and I think Hurwitz considers his Beethoven 9 a reference recording too.
I wish I liked Scriabin more, his conceptions strike me as interesting. His later Sonatas don't sound so good sometimes which could just be a bad speaker issue
>>126672276Yeah I don't really listen to his later sonatas anymore. His shorter piano stuff though, like the etudes, preludes, poemes, mazurkas, etc., never get old.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSqQ-B1EmpU
Nothing dissonant or wildly chaotic about that.
>>126672270I'm not a Wand enthusiast. That NDR Schubert 9 (live) is the only Wand recording I like. Must be a fluke because I think his Berlin Schubert 9 is indeed rather boring
>>126672302No wait, I forget I also like his Bruckner 8 from Lubeck Cathedral. Must be a live recording thing
>>126672194Emissary of Satan is a little harsh no?
>>126672276>>126672286Listen to Fantasy in b minor, the second theme is beautiful
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hz1P2lSWO-o
Also 4th sonata, coda of 2nd movement is glorious.
>>126672276>>126672344Also listen & watch with these videos, you'll recognize subjects faster and better:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-6mUlg6_Qc
>>126672011 (OP)Saint-Saëns 3rd symphony is a mic drop on classical music. like "here, let me distill all of the elements that make a symphony great, add an organ and get you in & out in 40 minutes."
I hate using the term "perfect" but man, it's perfect.
>>126672011 (OP)His best work is Danse Macabre and there's nothing wrong with that
>>126672687Tru
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74dWyDw6Bxk
Now playing Blacked Fantasy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrX5wML26tA&ab_channel=COSTNER1121
Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53P6nMzgGw8
>>126672828>Creepy vampiric figure who spent time in jail for molesting a 14 year old boy Talking about the sisterposter btw pic unrelated
>>126673140Edarem is a legend.
Now ristening
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUDMXaU4jm0&ab_channel=zmov1
>>126673153If you say his name in a mirror 13 times he appears
Was he the single greatest melodist that ever lived?
I'm currently learning all his sonatas, and the thing that amazes me the most about them, is that despite Mozart's habit of construcing his works from stock classical figurations and cliches, they are all tied together by one long, unbroken melody which could be sung by the human voice. Beethoven's sonatas, while commanding a much larger scope as far as form and harmony are concerned, do not have this quality of having an unbroken melody tying it all together, and non-sequiturs are not rare. It has been said that Mozart composed for one instrument, the human voice, and I can really hear why. Glenn Gould famously claimed him to be the easiest of the great composers to imitate, but I have yet to hear one of these convincing imitations. If anything, command of melody might the single most elusive part of composing.
>>126673255>Was he the single greatest melodist that ever lived?All his melodies
Duh duh duh deh deh deh duh duh duh deh deh deh duh duh duh deh duh deh duh deh duh diddle diddle diddle duh DAH DAH DAH Dih dih dih dela duh di di di etc and so on
>>126672123def not Hurwitz
best Mahler 3
/Classical/ pleb here. Are there any other pieces some you could recommend me like the Lohengrin Prelude? It might be the most beautiful piece of music I've ever heard bar nothing, even other stuff by Wagner (which usually is ruined for me by the singing). The high note at about 7:23 makes me see the platonic form of beaty it self every time I hear it. Fuck me it's so good.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxqyUW2txQw
>>126673434Parsifal and Tristan preludes
>ruined by singingI'll forever believe that people who hate operatic singing have simply been exposed to too many bad, wobbly singers
>>126673434I love the Lohengrin prelude too, but my favorite is definitely the Tristand und Isolde prelude. One of the most earth-shattering, transcendental pieces of music ever constructed. Like you, I cannot stomach contemporary opera singing, but Wagner's preludes and overtures are sublime.
>>126674285Wagner was more suited to writing symphonies instead of operas but his ego got the better of him.
>>126673434for me it's Rienzi Overture, any other piece like it?
>ruined by singingi disagree, but i have to be in a very specific mood to listen to a full opera, i do like them though.
>>126674463that's what we have Bruckner for
>>126674930Bruckner has nothing in common with Wagner.
>>126674950fuck off, contrarian.
>>126674974There's nothing contrarian about that statement. It's a widely held view. The composer that Bruckner is closest to in style is Schubert.
>>126674981bait should at least try to be believable.
>>126673434Listen to the Lohengrin choral sections:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJqYzXQIT4Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kt1pT9EAbPw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkE0Q6Cjkcw
>>126674463Wagner showed no propensity for symphonic form and when he wasn't inspired by dramatic subjects his musical inspiration was surprisingly impoverished. The entire structure and sound of his music depends on it being operatic. For example, Wagner didn't believe extreme and unexpected dissonances had any places in symphonies. So already you would be missing one of his essential trademarks. Tchaikovsky was retarded and didn't understand the difference between symphonic opera and the symphony.
>>126675016not a big fan of operas. women's music I say.
>>126674981It's one thing to say that Schubert was more important than Wagner on Bruckner's symphonic style, it's another thing altogether to claim that Bruckner had nothing in common with Wagner. That's just retarded. Yeah, Bruckner decided to start composing symphonies after hearing Tristan und Isolde.. just cause unrelated incidents.
>he doesn't like opera singing
>>126675046The greatest works of Handel, Gluck, Mozart, Cherubini, Méhul, Weber, Rossini, Wagner, Verdi, Strauss, and so many other composers are operas. If you don't like opera you don't like classical music.
>>126673454It's the talking parts that suck.
>try to listen to opera>overture: oh this is great!>first movement with great singing: wow I'm really loving it this time>next movement with characters talk-singing: ugh, turn it off already
>>126675302Really, you can't stand hearing this?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hdvw-ljjTI8
>>126675387Yeah, that's roughly where I switch to listening to something else. At least I've gotten to the point where I can listen through highlights releases with just the best parts, but of course not every opera has releases like that.
>>126675410Personally I find that singing quite pleasing to the ear. Maybe try following the words? That might get you used to it and explain to you why they sound like they do.
>>126675435Right, that's the thing, I never follow the libretto/plot. I'd imagine if I did then these scenes would be information-with-singing rather than unintelligible talking to my ears. Oh well. Someday.
now playing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RP_3cQNMVPU
>>126675507It's a pretty egregious sin to have never followed the libretto of an opera before. It is a form of theatre and is meant to be enjoyed as such. Maybe give Bergman's Magic Flute a try? It's all very modernised and calculated to have the greatest cinematic effect, so it's easier to appreciate for someone who otherwise is uninterested in traditional theatre.
best recording of Bach's complete keyboard works (preferably on Piano)? asking for both solo keyboard and consertos.
>>126676002idk about "collected in one set" recordings
as for one performer for all of the works, then I guess Zhu Xiao-Mei would be my top pick followed by Angela Hewitt.
>>126676002>>126676037gotta love this quote on the back
Like I always say, there's something about Bach's Art of Fugue which makes it sound like it contains all of the secrets of the universe, and to grasp the deepest mysteries, all you have to do is listen and understand.
>>126672011 (OP)Which composer wrote most beautifully for the clarinet? Off the top of my head I can think of Mozart, Spohr, Weber, Wagner, Brahms and Strauss.
>>126676002You're gonna have to pick and mix
>>126676311okay, which ones are my favorites for each piece?
>>126673255In terms of melody:
Chopin > Schubert > Tchaikovsky > Rachmaninoff > Mozart > rest of the composers
>>126676320How the fuck should I know
>>126676334where do i fit in that ranking?
>>126676334Quite possibly the most pleb taste I have ever seen in my life. One of the easiest tests to see if someone is a pleb is asking them this question: Is Schubert a superior melodist to Beethoven? If they say yes, they have no idea what they're talking about and never got past a childish appreciation of the artform.
The debate over the superiority of composers embodying Classical Restraint, such as Haydn and Mozart, versus the degenerate romantic composers like Tchaikovsky, reveals a tragic decline in musical taste. Haydn and Mozart are not merely composers, they are the epitome of musical perfection, crafting works with precision and elegance that elevate the listener to sublime beauty. In stark contrast, Tchaikovsky's compositions often resemble a cacophony of emotional turmoil, marked by self-indulgence and a desperate plea for attention that lacks the sophistication of their Classical predecessors.
It is lamentable that many find solace in Tchaikovsky's overwrought sentiments, as his incessant emotional manipulation distracts from the fundamental principles of musicality that Haydn and Mozart exemplified. The latter's music champions clarity, balance, and rationality-qualities conspicuously absent in Tchaikovsky's self-serving emotional excess.
Ultimately, the elevation of Classical Restraint over the emotional histrionics of Tchaikovsky is not merely a matter of taste but an indictment of modern musical appreciation. Haydn and Mozart represent the pinnacle of artistic achievement, while Tchaikovsky serves as a cautionary tale of what occurs when music devolves into mere emotional spectacle. One can only hope future generations will recognize the profound superiority of the Classical masters and reject the insipid allure of the degenerate.
Strauss operas
Salome - Nilsson/Vienna/Solti (Decca)
Elektra - Borkh/Dresden/Böhm (DG)
Rosenkavalier - Vienna/Erich Kleiber (Decca)
Ariadne - Della Casa/Berlin/Erede (HMV)
Frau ohne Schatten - Vienna/Böhm (Decca)
Ägyptische Helena - Jones/Detroit/Dorati (Decca)
Arabella - Della Casa/Vienna/Solti (Decca)
Daphne - Güden/Vienna/Böhm (DG)
Capriccio - Bayern Radio/Böhm (DG)
There's a distinct kind of beauty in music that buds from clarity, balance, and a sense of proportion. When every note feels considered, every phrase is shaped with care. This, of course, is classical restraint. Classical restraint is not about limitation; no, it's about refinement. Classical restraint uses structure as an expressive force. With classical restraint, tension builds not through outbursts, but through subtle harmony, momentum, and the most delicate shifts imaginable. You hear classical restraint in the poised symmetry of a Mozart sonata, where every voice breathes with classical restraint, without ever overflowing. Classical restraint is not cold, nor is it dull. Classical restraint is emotion, distilled, filtered, clarified, and decanted into eternal form. Truly, nothing expresses more than classical restraint.
>>126676478Neat. Not one Sinopoli?
The idea of "Classical Restraint" often reflects a focus on the material, emphasizing a base existence devoid of spiritual depth. This viewpoint prioritizes technical precision over emotional authenticity and spirituality, relegating the art of music to the status of mere mathematical computations. In this framework, the intricate and nuanced qualities that imbue music with its capacity to evoke transcendent experiences are diminished, as the focus shifts toward a rigid adherence to structural and formalistic elements.
Music sounds best in 4/4. It's the most danceable beat, and you get cool phase shift effects when the official time signature is something different. There's no reason to listen in other time signatures. Save the counting for performance where it's actually useful.
3/4 is equivalent to 6/8 for listening purposes.
3 / gcd(3,4) = 3, so you get 2 bonus variations if you listen to it in 4/4. Look at how the timing lines up:
1 2 3 1 2 3 1 2 3 1 2 3
1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4
Each measure of 4/4 cycles through one of three different variations of 3/4.
Harpsichord is the greatest instrument ever created
>>126676552He can have Friedenstag lol
>>126676575Harpsichord sounds like two skeletons fucking on a roof.
>>126676663During a thunderstorm.
>>126676575If I wanted to feel like I was playing Runescape, I'd just play Runescape.
don't sleep on the Bruckner 5 from this set
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTKViROLpbw&list=OLAK5uy_kr5uf3IVAouJC5B2ATqXixMby2v4hPq8o&index=21
One of my favorites
i love Mozart's Requiem, what else should i listen to?
>>126677187Mass in c minor
>>126676359beethoven just likes repeating tiny motifs over and over
>>126677368yeah, it's called thematic development. Get yourself tested for mental retardation the next time you see a doctor.
>>126677395dude it's just sounds repeating and stufg
is Vivaldi worth getting into?
>>126671995>He has a live recording of the 6th that is my personal GOAT, but it hasn't been issued by a label. Let me know if you want it, and I'll upload it. His other recordings range from good to just OK, but those two are the standouts.Please do post!
>>126677395that's not what thematic development means
Any composer who wrote sub-50 minute symphonies after Beethoven is not worth listening to
Who is the absolute most conservative conductor? I do not mean politically, nor do I mean HIP. I mean like, the guy's an old fuck who got taught by a late romantic composer/musician and he vows to not in any way alter his style of performance from what his teacher taught him, well into his late years of life. Bonus points if the guy lived to the stereo era and has at least one recording in stereo. Mainly just curious to have something as close as possible to an authentic romantic recording in high quality that isn't a 78RPM with more noise than my wife during her period.
As said, I would rather not have any HIP because the accuracy of that is dodgy at the least
best Medtner pianist and best recordings?
i bet you guys never heard this hidden gem
https://youtu.be/-eAGt2RVAXI?si=Nia89fwofQJe4oSr
>>126672276>I wish I liked Scriabin more, his conceptions strike me as interestingHe is very interesting. A remarkable, and frankly bizarre, mixture of extremely progressive chromatic harmonies and relatively "out-of-date" forms. It's surprisingly easy to follow along with the score, as he writes in ternary or some kind of sonata form... more traditional in the early works, more idiosyncratic and modified in the later ones. Almost every phrase he sculpts is 4 or 8 bars long, with plenty of periods and sequences that mimic tonic-dominant relationships, even when they're not there anymore. It's kind of forced, but it works beautifully most of the time.
>His later Sonatas don't sound so good sometimes which could just be a bad speaker issueThe textures really are ethereal and layered, and perhaps cheap speakers might flatten everything to a blur of upper-mid mush. But I still doubt it's just a 'bad speaker issue'. It's more likely that you're hearing subpar performances. Scriabin is a notoriously difficult composer to get right, and many fail miserably, especially with the late works. Try recordings by Sofronitsky, Richter, or Szidon. Ashkenazy and Horowitz aren't bad either.
>>126677533I dunno, maybe Karl Bohm? He was personal friends with Richard Strauss.
The first piano Sonata of Beethoven
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9oIdtq9E2ZU&ab_channel=OndaCC
g.g.: So you do feel, in effect, that the critic represents a morally endangered species?
...
G.G.: [pause] Yes
g.g.: .... But now that you've stated your position so frankly, I do have to make mention of the fact that you yourself have by-lined critical dispatches from time to time. I even recall a piece on Petula Clark which you contributed some years back to these columns and which --
G.G.: – and which contained more aesthetic judgment per square page than I would presume to render nowadays. But it was essentially a moral critique, you know. It was a piece in which I used Miss Clark, so to speak, in order to comment on a social milieu.
g.g.: So you feel that you can successfully distinguish between an aesthetic critique of the individual – which you reject out of hand – and a setting down of moral imperatives for society as a whole.
G.G.: I think I can. Mind you, there are obviously areas in which overlaps are inevitable. Let's say, for example, that I had been privileged to reside in a town in which all the houses were painted battleship grey.
g.g.: Why battleship grey?
G.G.: It's my favourite colour.
g.g.: It's a rather negative colour, isn't it?
G.G.: That's why it's my favourite. Now then, let's suppose for the sake of argument that without warning one individual elected to paint his house fire-engine red --
g.g.: – thereby challenging the symmetry of the town planning.
G.G.: Yes, it would probably do that too, but you're approaching the question from an aesthetic point of view. The real consequence of his action would be to foreshadow an outbreak of manic activity in the town and almost inevitably – since other houses would be painted in similarly garish hues – to encourage a climate of competition and, as a corollary, of violence.
g.g.: I gather, then, that red in your colour lexicon represents aggressive behaviour.
g
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G.G.: I should have thought there'd be general agreement on that. But as I said, there would be an aesthetic/moral overlap at this point. The man who painted the first house may have done so purely from an aesthetic preference, and it would, to use an old-fashioned word, be "sinful" if I were to take him to account in respect of his taste. Such an accounting would conceivably inhibit all subsequent judgments on his part. But if I were able to persuade him that his particular aesthetic indulgence represented a moral danger to the community as a whole, and providing I could muster a vocabulary appropriate to the task – which would not be, obviously, a vocabulary of aesthetic standards – then that would, I think, be my responsibility.
g.g.: You do realize, of course, that you're beginning to talk like a character out of Orwell?
G.G.: Oh, the Orwellian world holds no particular terrors for me.
g.g.: And you also realize that you're defining and defending a type of censorship that contradicts the whole post-Renaissance tradition of Western thought?
G.G.: Certainly. It's the post-renaissance tradition that has brought the Western world to the brink of destruction. You know, this odd attachment to freedom of movement, freedom of speech, and so on is a peculiarly Occidental phenomenon. It's all part of the Occidental notion that one can successfully separate word and deed.
g.g.: The sticks-and-stones syndrome, you mean?
G.G.: Precisely. There's some evidence for the fact that – well, as a matter of fact, McLuhan talks about just that in the Gutenberg Galaxy – that preliterate peoples or minimally literate peoples are much less willing to permit that distinction.
g.g.: I suppose there's also the biblical injunction that to will evil is to accomplish evil.
G.G.: Exactly. It's only cultures that, by accident or good management, bypassed the Renaissance which see art for the menace it really is.
g.g.: May I assume the U.S.S.R. would qualify?
G.G.: Absolutely. The Soviets are a bit rough-hewn as to method, I'll admit, but their concerns are absolutely justified.
g.g.: What about your own concerns? Have any of your activities violated these personal strictures and, in your terms, "menaced" society?
G.G.: Yes.
g.g.: Want to talk about it?
G.G.: Not particularly.
>>126676359Go on. Elaborate.
What the hell! Black Wagnerians exist:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ujQlMdGYoz8
>>126678020Those are Wagnerians that left Numenor before the flood but were still loyal to the King and later Sauron
I like Gould. I like Richter. I like Arrau. I hate Wang. I hate Uchida. I hate Grimaud. Simple as.
>>126677626>"out-of-date" formsNo such thing as "out-of-date" form. Literal pop brainrot
>>126678143Nothing wrong with pop, kid
>>126678136>I like Gould.>I hate Uchida.>I hate Grimaud.Why?
>>126678020So The Ring ends in an immolation or a Holocaust if you will?
>>126678170depends what you mean by pop, if you mean top 40 slop then yes, there is a lot wrong with it.
>>126677626I stick to Lettberg
My music is a mixture of classical and jazz that I call Clazz
>>126678209lettberg was minimally acceptable when it was the only complete collection around, but now with Pic Related, the Ashkenazy collections and the Alexeev piano works, there is no need to listen to her subpar performances.
>>126678238It's called Third Stream and has existed since at least the 1950s.
>>126678265>pic relatedforgot image
Schumann
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIck1Klf9vs
>>126678238wow no one has ever done that, truly ground breaking.
>>126678276It's called Clazz
>>126677569medtner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbagb2VVogw&list=PLQvPaHUvfv1ZD14Opz9o8oiIvdnJOMnS4&index=19
only got time to listen to 90 haydn symphonies; which 16 do i drop?
>Quite possibly the most pleb taste I have ever seen in my life. One of the easiest tests to see if someone is a pleb is asking them this question: Is Schubert a superior melodist to Beethoven? If they say yes, they have no idea what they're talking about and never got past a childish appreciation of the artform.
Say her name, /classical/. Say it.
s-l400
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<<<Start doing this
>>126672023I meant to say, but forgot what the fuck is this? Upside down woman slicing off a baby's lower leg, while a short haired shirtless man with glasses points to the fleshy part of this thumb while doing the Jesus symbol
>>126678604what? spin around in space?
fw
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xx8ooc-s7OQ
>>126678143Yeah, I figured someone would miss the quotation marks. It's almost like I put them there for a reason.
>>126678209Lettberg is mediocre and uninspired, a very stale modern recording (I'm repeating myself here).
>>126679065She's the benchmark for Scriabin
>>126677884>refuses to elaborate
>>126679224He actually does go on that's just where I cut it off
>>126678552she looks jewish
>>126679065right, but most importantly she lacks the spirituality of Sofronitsky or Richter.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ti4W9ycDuWI
Oh, Man! Pay mind!
What says the deep midnight?
"I slept, I slept.
From deepest dream I now arise.
The world has depth.
It's deeper than the day devised.
Deep is its Woe.
Want—deeper still than all its strife!
Woe says: Be gone!
But Want asks for as endless life!
For deep, deep, endless life!"
>>126679450>François-Xavier Rothhmm
>>126679999What about him?
>>126680027I haven't heard any of his conducting. Just an interesting choice.
let's try Pollini's WTC, never seen anyone here mention it
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNDy_CngesU&list=OLAK5uy_k3eMNvM7RrFpVV0r3zpJ3fjOMJfKwkMXA&index=1
>I've been waiting for several decades to hear Pollini play the WTC, which he began to include on programs in the 1970s but has never played in my hometown of Boston. The thing about this WTC is that it is unlike any other you've ever heard, including Gould, Gulda, Richter, Schepkin, Schiff, Hewitt, Fellner, Ashkenazy, Aldwell, Barenboim, Tureck, and Fischer. There is a remarkable purity about it - a humility and directness borne of wisdom and utterly free of egoic adornment - that distinguishes it from other renderings.
hmm intriguing
>>126680146You should have started with the last one-I'm so sick of hearing that wretched prelude in C
>>126680171lmao when I was copying the link, I was thinking that exact thing;
>are people gonna be sick of me posting this opening piece?lol my bad, here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMBlI-rh8YY&list=OLAK5uy_k3eMNvM7RrFpVV0r3zpJ3fjOMJfKwkMXA&index=47
>Despite all the criticisms that can be invoked (noises, breathings, nasal sniffs from time to time, captured on the tracks of this DG twofer) this recording of Maurizio Pollini featuring his version of the Well-Tempered Clavier Book I stands as a landmark in the recorded catalogue of all times. I have no doubt that from now on generations of pianists and audiences alike will take it as a reference version for this Everest in the keyboard repertory.O_O high praise
>>126680146Another modern piano recording with oversaturated sound. How do they fuck up so badly?
>>126680793I like it :(
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P65tgfkhgQY&list=OLAK5uy_k3eMNvM7RrFpVV0r3zpJ3fjOMJfKwkMXA&index=7
>>126678172nta, but when listening to something like Mozart's third sonata in Bb major, you can tell that Gould is having way more fun, especially in the third movement, which is supposed to be fun. Uchida, while always solid, just feels so restrained and timid by comparison, almost as if she reveres the music too much; she plays every single note as if she is walking on holy ground. Mozart, or at the very least his sonatas, should for the most part be fun and vivid, and Gould almost always delivers on this front. Gould's Mozart is vastly underrated for this reason; people really need to stop playing his works as if they are performing at nursing homes. Mozart's own playing was allegedly lively and detached, two words which describe Gould to a tee. Gould's irreverent, almost anti-authoritarian temperament likely mirrors Mozart's personality.
>>126678136and wonder at the profound and ethereal beauty of something other...when we are reminded that there is far more to life than bills and diapers and dishes and laundry....that there is something other that lifts up the soul and speaks to that place in your heart that you forgot was there - that place in your heart that you buried in the mundanities of life, where you used to romp as a child, dreaming of fairies and unicorns and rainbows and magicians thundering and wizards striking and elves in courtly dances....
It is a place that we sent to sleep for a while and got busy slowly dying.
...but there are moments when we are reminded of beauty. Hearing Helene Grimaud play Brahms is one of the moments where words fail and you are buried in the colors of magic and rainbows and storms and lightening - and your breath is taken away for just a moment and everything is right again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dYoJ2OWfFc&list=OLAK5uy_nmcwPbaAKESno7K2MooNGo2_xRPUqSdio&index=12
>>126680915whoops, first line got truncated:
>There are a few moments in our otherwise dreary walk through this vale of tears when we lift our our eyes and wonder at the profound...
Suk's Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kb2rbRuhJxs&list=OLAK5uy_mNZJd_Mkzfw-hkKuat_QQi_2uDB-weUr8&index=21
>>126673454>>126674285>>126674571>>126675016Thanks mates! Sorry for the late reply but I'll check these out!
>>126680146If anyone is curious, this ended up being fantastic. Definitely one of my new favorites, a recording I will return to often. Shame he only has a recording of Book I. RIP
![zizektomaz-gregoric-2[1]](/thumb/mu/1749671036249218.jpg)
great substack article by Slavoj Zizek about his favorite music
https://slavoj.substack.com/p/my-favourite-classics
>Let me begin with the standard stupid question: if I were allowed to take only one piece of music to an island, what would it be? For decades, my answer has been the same: Arnold Schoenberg's Gurrelieder. What makes Gurrelieder really unique is the mirroring between its musical line and the history of music itself: the shift from the late-romantic Wagnerian heavy pathos to atonal Sprechgesang is rendered in the very progress of the piece.
>Otherwise, my tastes are classical, and definitely ‘eurocentric,’ with a preference for chamber music... seriously? How to bring this together with my total dedication to Gurrelieder which demands around six-hundred musicians for a proper performance? Schoenberg’s preferences for chamber music are well-known: in a nice swipe at American vulgarity, he said that everything in music can be told with a maximum of five or six instruments – we only need orchestras so that Americans get it… How, then, to account for Gurrelieder, which demands soloists, a full orchestra and three choruses? In the notes to his recording, Simon Rattle proposed a wonderful formula: Gurrelieder is a chamber-music piece for orchestra and chorus – this, effectively, is how one should approach it.
>So here we go with Bach: while I cannot follow any of his Passions without yawning, I find his solo violin and cello sonatas irresistible. Take the second movement (fugue) of Bach's three sonatas for solo violin, in which the entire polyphonic structure is condensed in one instrumental line, so that, although we "effectively" hear only one violin line, in our imagination we automatically supplement it with other unheard implicit melodic lines, and seem to hear the multitude of melodic lines in their interaction...
is the opening and continues from there
>>126675113>ywn have a qt3.14 opera singing gfhttps://youtu.be/lP9V7_fevgQ?si=kp3IWrX8vLaOU46i
>>126680837I like pollini.
But don't you hear the awful quality of the sound recording? There's almost constant distortion
>>126681622>Imagine, along these lines, – my private dream - a Parsifal taking place in a modern megalopolis, with Klingsor as an impotent pimp running a whorehouse; he uses Kundry to seduce members of the “Grail” circle, a rival drug gang. “Grail” is run by the wounded Amfortas whose father Titurel is in a constant delirium induced by too many drugs; Amfortas is under a terrible pressure from the members of his gang to “perform the ritual,” i.e., deliver the daily portion of drugs to them. He was “wounded” (infected by AIDS) through Kundry, his penis bitten while Kundry was giving him fellatio. Parsifal is a young inexperienced son of a single homeless mother who does not get the point of drugs; he “feels the pain” and rejects Kundry’s advances while she is performing fellatio on him. When Parsifal takes over the “Grail” gang, he establishes a new rule for his community: free distribution of drugs…lol
now playing
start of Mendelssohn: Symphony No. 3 In A Minor, Op. 56, MWV N 18 - "Scottish"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xrY9I0jrJs&list=OLAK5uy_lR7UGiLbF_MeKJGMJKDBoGYyXAjha0X_k&index=22
start of Mendelssohn: Symphony No. 4 In A Major, Op. 90, MWV N 16 - "Italian"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCbRxmCAV1g&list=OLAK5uy_lR7UGiLbF_MeKJGMJKDBoGYyXAjha0X_k&index=26
start of Mendelssohn: Symphony No. 5 in D minor, Op. 107, MWV N15 - "Reformation"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Kcy5m4L3e0&list=OLAK5uy_lR7UGiLbF_MeKJGMJKDBoGYyXAjha0X_k&index=5
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lR7UGiLbF_MeKJGMJKDBoGYyXAjha0X_k
>>126681622>I prefer Sibelius's fourth symphony to all of MahlerAbsolutely fucking based beyond belief.
>>126677533Pierre Monteux is probably the most obvious choice, since he lived well into the stereo era and made a plethora of recordings. He refused to adapt to the modern orchestral seating standards and always used the OG setting with split violins, and we can go through his interpretations and see quite a bit of consistency throughout the decades. Of course, things like orchestral habits changed (less portamento, more vibrato, etc), but those were outside of his control.
Some obvious choice recordings:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C4XeZZ3Rnxk&list=OLAK5uy_ma9HPF0eK4QIZBiV24PXjXVBPM79YUsek&index=2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MS-zFhMQbyo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7T1_K8Yk2zY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FK1WTjJWbKM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBN3rECRQGQ
Another good choice is Bruno Walter, but you have to be picky since his conducting style changed quite rapidly after his heart attack in the late 50s. Anything before 1957 tends to still have his original style.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYKHE_xUqHM&list=OLAK5uy_ncyy0-ck79w8o89sTI0TM-3O0_6hmdxPE&index=4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9GdEBwj9k0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7lx7QWLYNw&list=OLAK5uy_m5w5-QfqDaimte5Odf_1HEUXxlvhqT0kg&index=2 (hands down, the best recording of the first act of Die Walkure)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhn6NQIYiJw&list=OLAK5uy_nM0_oWqz4_GMm70XH7HzXCaJ1JDRtMLBg&index=2
But if you want the most extreme exponents of the romantic style, you'll probably need to look at a conductor like Mengelberg, who did not live to make stereo recordings but whose live recordings are fairly free of shellac noise. I have performed quite a bit of remasters for his recordings myself, to streamline them further.
Further reading: https://www.morethanthenotes.com/the-project
>>126682083It sounds fine to me. I always assume however it sounds is a fully intentional stylistic choice, so I enjoy it for what it is.
cover
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>>126677485https://litter.catbox.moe/9k03m4.7z
It's in decent stereo sound, though the acoustic sounds a touch weird and the sound is very up close. It's an incredible performance.
>>126682244wtf I hate Zizek now!?
>>126682268Having every last dying bronchital breath of pollini sound just as loud as notes struck on the piano was an artistic choice? Interesting...
>>126681622This article settles it: opera is indeed the peak of classical music.
>>126682354Man I don't even hate Zizek like I'm sure some here do, and he makes some interesting observations, but if this kind of theorycel analysis convinces you of that then you could probably be convinced of anything so long as the speaker possessed sufficient verbal facility.
Chopin is like Mozart if Mozart knew how to make interesting music and Debussy is like Chopin if Chopin knew how to make truly beautiful music
>>126682373I love Zizek
>... the time has come to declare Bach the greatest modernizer of European music, the key agent in inscribing music into the Newtonian scientific-formalized universe. Prior to Bach’s time, music was perceived within the Renaissance horizon of harmonia mundi: its harmonies were conceived as part of the global harmony of the universe, expressed in the harmony of celestial spheres, of (Pythagorean) mathematics, of society as a social organism, of the human body―all these levels harmoniously reflected in each other. Around Bach’s time, a totally different paradigm started to emerge: that of a “well-tempered” scale, in which musical sounds are to be arranged following an order not grounded in any higher cosmic harmony, but which has an (ultimately arbitrary) rational structure. (True, Bach was obsessed with the Pythagorean mysticism of numbers and their secret meanings, but the status of this obsession is exactly the same as that of Newton’s obscurantist Gnostic fantasies which comprise more than two thirds of his written work: a reaction to the true breakthrough, an inability to assume all its consequences.) This was Bach’s true fidelity (in the Badiouian sense): to draw all the consequences from this de-cosmologization of music. All the talk about Bach’s deep spirituality, about how his oeuvre is dedicated to God, should not deceive us here: in his musical practice, he was a radical materialist (in the modern formalized-mathematized sense), exploring the immanent possibilities of the new musical formalism. It is the “Italian” re-assertion of emotional melody (pursued also by his composer-son who, in taking this line, committed a kind of parricide and was for a short while even more popular than his father) which marked the expressive-idealist reaction to Bach’s materialist breakthrough.
>>126682373>listen to anon instead
>>126681622You need to imagine him sniffing after every other word and speaking in a curious halting manner to get the full Zizek effect. In fact he probably goes on for several pages before finally concluding that he hates Schoenberg and considers him a pervese fascist
Milstein's Bach just clicked :)
https://litter.catbox.moe/ezydpinzsip572cw.flac
Where do you guys rank his set? It's now in my top five, along with Ehnes, Perlman, Julia Fischer, and Tetzlaff (all subject to change).
>>126682444>Where do you guys rank his set#1
>>126682388Yeah I've seen some talk or another where he does this spiel about Bach. I think the most interesting thing about Zizek's comments is the weird tension between the three points of a) being a critical theorist who predominantly likes common practice music, b) his outward repudiation of the kitsch and pomposity of the 19th century from which Adorno and co. liberated us, and c) analysis that uses musical qualities to elaborate on extramusical socio-cultural phenomena in a way which is, ironically, very 19th century. Ultimately it's just Scruton for communists.
>>126682453Well, when ideology is latent within everything, every act of expression, every piece of structure, every relation between persons, every physical action, hell even every previous interpretation, then anything and everything can be analyzed and interpreted and re-interpreted, especially in the post-metaphysical milieu of 20th century continental philosophy (though Zizek's 'serious' philosophy books do concern ontological questions) where to analyze is all that's really left, thus critical theory.
Medtner
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0O6hFiEgHY
>>126682385Debussy is the most interesting
Chopin is the most beautiful
Mozart is the greatest
There is nothing else to be said of those 3
>>126682531I'm not disputing that it's a self-justifying system. But since I'm neither in agreement with it nor some kind of dogmatic opponent, the most interesting thing to me personally about his comments on music is what I suppose Nietzsche called what is involuntary about philosophy. If his eros were called upon by Nono or Boulez then this article would look very different. Even Schoenberg himself wasn't what Adorno wished him to be.
retarded pleb here, how do i write a fugue properly? I know the basic rules of it but after writing my subject and answer I get really lost. is there a good tutorial for retards out there? If someone feels like helping me I can post my email or something.
>>126680915thirsty boomer
>>126679206Lol, no.
>>126679317Of course, that can go under 'uninspired'.
>>126680094his Bruckner 9 is great
what do you guys listen to music on? please tell me most of you have decent quality loudspeakers
>>126683870chinese headphoones
>>126676041>recorded in germany by chink>is in frenchgay af
how to chat up a classical music girl?
>>126683870cheap speakers i bougth 10+ years ago (only one is still functioning)
>>126672011 (OP)Pederast edition
eugh
md5: 98392699a689eca2057e98c73c5bbabe
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>>126678136>I like Gouldstopped reading
>>126679304She couldn't look more scandinavian if she were three times as fat, had a head kerchief, and was actively milking a cow in a meadow
>>126684525globalism NOW
>>126683843oh for real? I'll give it a peep later tonight then.
Just so we're clear:
Symphonies, Rêverie, Sonatas & Vers La Flamme: Ashkenazy
Piano Concerto: Postnikova+Rozhdestvensky
Op 54: Lokalenkov+Golovschin
Op 60: Argerich+Abbado
Symphonic Allegro: Moscow Philharmonic+Golovschin
2 Piano Fantaisie: Ponti+Leonardi
Scherzo & Andante for string orchestra: Hamburg Strings+Preyss-Bato
Everything else piano solo: Dmitri Alexeev
>>126684681Sweetie you forgot the Lettberg again. It's time to get back to the disciplinary chamber.
>>126684681My issue with the anon who has asked for recommendations for 70% of the standard classical music repertoire has yet to let us know how he's felt about any of the recordings.
Scriabin on Scriabin piano
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1cHBBJa9Es
Isserlis' Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IC1mWcl3B4Q&list=OLAK5uy_kciACZR_57T5reDdw86G1AULnZiFlTGqs&index=1
>>126684760Those are tourists who come, ask to be spoonfed, and then leave
>>126684833Is it time I start doing what the sisterposter did and start solely replying with the Farthoven 5th, forcing newbies to find their own way?
>>126684842>replying with the Farthoven 5thThat's a time honoured tradition and not the exclusive patrimony of some schizoid shitposter. Also yes.
>>126684842Haydnposting was better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIvWjI4PrJw
Henry Neighaus :DDDD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyyeXGI2NqQ
>>126684881I remember still the first time I heard Haydn's surprise symphoy, in G Major, no. 94.
It was 73, Bernstein was in the podium with the trusthy Vienna Phil. I'd never heard Haydn before, and found myself thoroughly entertained. I'd heard Haydn was a fun-loving fellow, and it certainly showed in his music. I distinctly remember bopping my head to the tune of the first movement. But nothing could prepare me for the absolute show of wit that was about to come in movement number 2, when happened the eponymous suprise.
A sudden blast! A loud, fortissimo chord, and just after a lenghty pianissimo section! I burst out laughing. "Oh Haydn" I remember thinking, barely managing to think straight at all between my chuckles and wheezing. "What a prankster! What a jokester!"
The audience attemped to calm me down, some even asking how I'd not known about the famous suprise by then, popular as it was. Were they not happy one had been lucky enough to live to that point and still feel the pure, unadulterated Haydn genius? Were they jealous? I did not know then, and do not care now.
I tried to calm myself, but kept chuckling all throughout the variations in the next movement. At the edge of my seat, I waited for the repeat of the blast, this time hoping to control myself. Imagine my surprise then, during the repeat of the first section, when the surprise surprised me further by not showing up at all! At that point I feared for my life, such was the lack of oxygen from my guffawling fit.
They only managed to removed me from the facility putting an end to my disruption after I'd already soaked the floor in urine.
confession: I don't enjoy listening to Beethoven's piano sonatas anymore
>>126684993you burned your beethoven receptors
a diet of mozart should do the trick
>>126685016Nah, he needs to go further back. Immerse himself in renaissance vocal music for about a year
speaking of Beethoven's piano sonatas, anyone try Jonathan Biss's cycle? Came across it now when randomly searching for a new one to try
start of Piano Sonata No. 5 in C Minor, Op. 10 No. 1 "Little Pathetique"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVN1Hq243DQ&list=OLAK5uy_m8WnQVcDiZde73ZynldLtdMzRcvu-SGwQ&index=2
start of Piano Sonata No. 11 in B-Flat Major, Op. 22
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mh3SylPp_68&list=OLAK5uy_m8WnQVcDiZde73ZynldLtdMzRcvu-SGwQ&index=5
start of Piano Sonata No. 12 in A-Flat Major, Op. 26 "Funeral March"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZ94LS1fNAU&list=OLAK5uy_m8WnQVcDiZde73ZynldLtdMzRcvu-SGwQ&index=9
start of Piano Sonata No. 26 in E-Flat Major, Op. 81a "Les adieux"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDCP61FPTBE&list=OLAK5uy_m8WnQVcDiZde73ZynldLtdMzRcvu-SGwQ&index=12
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_m8WnQVcDiZde73ZynldLtdMzRcvu-SGwQ
Please remember to appreciate Brahms' late organ works, which are some of the best pieces he ever wrote.
>On May 21, 1896, Brahms' lifelong friend and champion, Clara Schumann, passed away in Frankfurt am Main. Brahms, who considered Clara to be the "greatest wealth" in his life, was so devastated that he bungled his travel arrangements and missed the funeral in Bonn. Upon his return to Ischl, where he spent his summers, Brahms' friends noticed an unsettling change in his appearance. Physicians at first told the composer that he had jaundice, though they secretly believed he was suffering from liver cancer, the disease that had killed his father. When Brahms left Ischl to "take the cure" at Karlsbad, it is possible, though unlikely, that he was unaware of the seriousness of his condition; he rarely admitted to having an illness, even if he knew it was the truth.
>In was in this atmosphere that Brahms composed the Eleven Chorale Preludes, his first music for the organ since 1857. It is possible that some of the settings may have originated before 1896; most of Brahms' work on the set, however, took place during that year. Brahms may have known, if only subconsciously, that he might not live to see another summer; this may have influenced his decision to set, twice each, the chorales "Herzlich tut ich verlangen nach einem sel'gen End" (I sincerely wish for a happy end) and "O Welt, ich muss dich lassen" (O world, I must leave you"). Indeed, the second of the two "O Welt" settings contains the last notes the composer ever wrote.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0FhT39zqlQ
Busoni also arranged a few of them for the piano.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F8OlbwMo0rg&list=OLAK5uy_nFtJYaBWNw_s7Q5i_VT6TMkpxtpinnwHY&index=11
>>126685072>Please remember to appreciate Brahms' late organ works>implying I've ever forgotten
>>126685055Also, kinda odd comment which I'm sure many will disagree with: I like these cycle that are ordered not chronologically but along some other program. It's a bit of a turn off going through a Beethoven piano sonata cycle 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and so on -- dividing the set into 9 vols., with this first one being 5, 11, 12, 26, and the rest similarly divided? I like that. You get a good mix of performances of all of Beethoven's periods right off the bat, and you don't get encouraged to skip the first, I don't know, 15 or so.
>>126685072Yeah I don't even care for the organ and I love those pieces.
Hewitt's Bach :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqZ4_vZhO9s&list=OLAK5uy_mV2fKy2RwJhFxR0AoPf50U7lmDs6T78ug&index=83
Schubert
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFlrTGdqdEs
I;;m just bout to gonna PISS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6YyIOlLWcU
I gone done did piss
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0KQSF2V7vh0
Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIokzBQEnTQ
disgust
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>>126685492>Bach on a post-1747 pianoforte
https://youtu.be/EYLbQRkJRlo?si=T1Hv4AtjqTSmH9Nm
>>126686069That's not Mozart, that's a Playmobil
Is there anything else like Rachmaninoff's, Chopin's, and (kinda) Scriabin's Etudes and Preludes?
>>126686069buy an ad, faggot.
![Brahms_piano_AV2397[1]](/thumb/mu/1749703640027818.jpg)
now playing
start of Brahms: Eight Klavierstücke, Op. 76
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rbtM6MOB8w&list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I&index=2
start of Brahms: Two Rhapsodies, Op. 79
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrFSteGVVts&list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I&index=10
start of Brahms: Seven Fantasien, Op. 116
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVHKa-DWwBk&list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I&index=12
start of Brahms: Three Intermezzi, Op. 117
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbByazT67Ts&list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I&index=19
start of Brahms: Six Klavierstücke, Op. 118
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XZFdHRZsvI&list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I&index=22
start of Brahms: Four Klavierstücke, Op. 119
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3TR4fzGnFk&list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I&index=27
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_llgl22WDGsAnx7Ivu78dD4JtcAk5W4F-I
One can never have too many recordings of Brahms' late piano music, and I like that this set includes Ops. 76 and 79.
>>126686745Yes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YR2_cHXapJo
>>126686745>>126686908Wait, sorry, I posted the wrong one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmkiFTW1E2I
That's probably more your taste. Eventually the first one I posted will grow on you and then you can sink into his preludes and then metopy and the masques.
>>126686745Poulenc's Improvisations:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4WI6B8rY4o
Faure is the GOAT
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svtiDFfjYXI
His nocturnes and barcarolle might be an easier pill to swallow at first.
damn, back in my Bach bubble where nothiing else sounds good. Oh I'll listen to the WTC, what next, oh the Art of Fugue, nice, what next, oh the French and then English Suites? dope, then the Partitas? How about the WTC again, okay bed time, fall asleep to the Mass in B minor, repeat tomorrow
>>126686978Much appreciated.
Rostropovich/LPO Tchaikovsky cycle finally got added to YouTube Music, hell yes, been wanting to listen to this set for a long time. Anyone heard it? It any good? I used to think there was no way Rostropo could be a good conductor but his Shostakovich set really impressed me, so I'm looking forward to see how he does here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2s9jyVgRH8&list=OLAK5uy_kMEixP5emqmdqK0-QM7Z6F2tSGdvSpCew&index=14
>>126686745>RachmaninoffIunno, Schumann's more generic works I guess
>Chopinhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNcgAJLHf7A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6tf_BhhvaA
>Scriabinhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeZVsmQOpCo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nVM0Bt4er8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJlxl8Dpbp0
>>126686990>>>/lgbt/>>>/blogspot/>>>/tryhard/
>>126687057>RostropovichGrade A++ cellist, "ok" conductor
>>126687226Well, this 1st is off to a good start, give it a peep
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKEYGT5a-Y4&list=OLAK5uy_kMEixP5emqmdqK0-QM7Z6F2tSGdvSpCew&index=1
>>126687267terminally usanistani
mahler
md5: f5befaf7eeb4db122ae7515b026b254b
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Mahler symphonies tier list
S: 9th, 6th
A: 8th, 5th
B: 3rd, 7th, Das Lied
(this is the masterpiece line)
C: 4th, 10th
D: 1st, 2nd
7 of the top 10 works of the 20th century, 10-11 of the top 20. Astounding!
>>126687611>D: 1st,>B: 3rdwhy don't yo just go listen to some Wagner then if you hate CHOONS and loooooove pointlessly drawn out drivel with singing
>>126687622and you are not a child of God
>>126687635The melodies in the 1st are incredible and instantly memorable, but that's mostly all it has going for it, plus the weak, directionless, mishmash fourth movement takes it down some notches and it lacks the emotional depth of the other works.
>>126687635also if you don't like the 5th movement of the 3rd ("BIMM BAMM"), you might not even be human
Bach is okay, pretty overrated
>>126687666I just prefer his instrumental symphonies, particularly 1, 6, and 9, and feel 2 and 3 are awkward and disproportioned. Unbalanced. A bit messy. Particularly 3. Too protracted for its own good
Mahler is okay, pretty overrated
>>126676478I'm gonna go through all of these, thanks for the recs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czPYstk87Dw&list=OLAK5uy_nZCK1XyiiTXhk8mbl4JuWN9BoW_8S8LUU&index=1
>>126687729>and feel 2 and 3 are awkward and disproportioned. Unbalanced. A bit messy. Particularly 3. Too protracted for its own goodI totally respect that and understand where you're coming from.
Were Mahler's 3 hour long symphonies for massive orchestras a way of compensating?
yes2
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>>126676478>Elektra - Borkh/Dresden/Böhm (DG)
>>126687756he's ob-obviously l-l-leaning!
>>126687756who was he indebted to, and why
>>126676478>Salome - Nilsson/Vienna/Solti (Decca)I'd say Wiener Philharmoniker, Herbert von Karajan
If I were a composer today, I would make an orchestral suite of the top hundred or so best operas, and then I would conduct them. Now that would be a worthwhile contemporary classical music project.
>>126687778>that would be...worthwhilehow
>>126687786...because operas contain some of their composers' best orchestral compositions, and so those who are not fans of opera can enjoy them, duh, I figured that'd be self-explanatory!
Wait a second, this whole time I've been seeing Jed Distler on classicstoday listen Hewitt's Bach Well-Tempered Clavier as one of his reference recordings, he was talking about her 1998 recording, and not her 2008 release, the one I've been listening to this whole time!?!? what the fuck. well time to rectify that right now, forgive another Bach post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDDcpgSYdn0&list=OLAK5uy_lKhQS1LR5MRfGddW5F3VCa1dLr6PxAjf0&index=89
Okay, so red dress cover is the 1998 one and the white dress cover (
>>126685141) is 2008. I also just read the previous one was recorded over a period of 2 years, whereas the newer was only 9 days? Interesting.
>>126687898Yeah already the Prelude in C Major is sounding much better on this one. I'd been posting the 2008 white dress recording this whole time and no one ever said anything? Not one greentext,
>not listening to her superior 1998 recording insteadreply? Jerks... Just kidding. Check it out if you haven't heard it before either. Good night.
>>126687793>those who are not fans of operaFuck 'em.
now playing
Sibelius: Tapiola, Op. 112
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uxKcHdl5yho&list=OLAK5uy_lIyeQi32WxtqljX2CvYTTrFnT9Wd6yUM4&index=8
start of Sibelius: Symphony No. 2 in D Major, Op. 43
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aR4CfRctTEE&list=OLAK5uy_lIyeQi32WxtqljX2CvYTTrFnT9Wd6yUM4&index=9
start of Sibelius: Symphony No. 7 in C Major, Op. 105
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=di5et2iVXXg&list=OLAK5uy_lIyeQi32WxtqljX2CvYTTrFnT9Wd6yUM4&index=12
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_lIyeQi32WxtqljX2CvYTTrFnT9Wd6yUM4
This is supposedly Colin Davis' finest Sibelius cycle (compared to his other two[?]), and one of the finest ever, so I've got high hopes, should be good.
>>126687611This grossly undersells the Resurrection Symphony.
>>126676478Now do the same for Wagner.
>inb4 copy and paste hurwitz list
Classical music is the best type of music and only smart people with high IQs listen to it. I'm very smart and I love classical music because it has complex patterns and I can see them easily, normies are stupid and they don't understand because they're not smart enough, I love classical music im v
>>126689375kill yourself.
>>126689375This but unironically.
>>126689375>im vYou are dominant?
Are there any genuine inside-NK recordings by North Korean orchestras that ever got bootlegged (Not orchestras from there performing outside of it)? Kinda curious what they'd sound like.
>>126689357Die Feen – Ötvös
Das Liebesverbot – Sawallisch
Rienzi – Downes
Holländer – Karajan
Tannhäuser – Barenboim
Lohengrin – Bichkov
Der Ring – Levine
Tristan und Isolde – Barenboim
Meistersinger– Sawallisch
Parsifal – Kubelík
>>126690174>t. hiss or live fag
>>126690190I do tend to like good singing, yes
>>126690200good thing there are stereo studio recordings with good singing
>>126690204Yet for some reason you didn't list a single one. Curious.
>>126690214I listed 10, actually.
>>126690134>Der Ring – Levine
>>126690281prettiest sung Ring
>>126690295There's some good singing, but Behrens and Goldberg are complete trash and ruin any good singing that accompanies them. Morris being the best Wotan since London can't save that cycle. Not to mention the tempi are far too slow, well over an hour over the premiere, which Wagner already considered too slow. Simply too unidiomatic.
>>126690347Wagner was known for lots of extreme rubato when he conducted, so I'm fine with big contrasts between slow and fast in performance. I think Levine is fast when he needs to be, save for some very specific moments (like the entrance of the giants, unfortunately). He is usually slower in orchestra-only sections (which Wagner was at least known for doing with the ending of Parsifal) but I feel he really makes the story flow in a snappy fashion in scenes of character interaction to compensate.
Also I'm surprised you don't like Goldberg and Behrens. I love their voices.
>>126690295Objectively speaking the singers are much worse than in the 50s and 60s. What do you mean by 'prettiest'?
>>126690716>Wagner was known for lots of extreme rubato when he conductedThat doesn't justify just doing any tempo you want. Levine's too slow and that's a fact.
>>126690754well other than my example where else do you think he is too slow?
>>126690716>Wagner was known for lots of extreme rubato when he conducted, so I'm fine with big contrasts between slow and fast in performance.And he still thought Richter's premiere at 14:30 was too slow. There are some 208 remarks on the rehearsals of the Ring premier where Wagner felt that Richter's tempi were too slow: "nicht schleppend" is a common remark.
>Also I'm surprised you don't like Goldberg and Behrens. I love their voices.Too much vibrato and generally poor declamation.
>>126689357Holländer - New Philharmonia/Klemperer (EMI)
Lohengrin - NDR/Schuchter (EMI)
Ring des Nibelungen - Bayreuth/Böhm (Philips)
Tristan - Flagstad/Philharmonia/Furtwängler (EMI)
Parsifal - Bayreuth/Knappertsbusch (1962, Philips)
I don't have faves for Tannhäuser or Meistersinger at the moment.
>>126691143As a matter of fact, my fav Meistersinger is pic rel, but it's only excerpts
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RGA4cnNW00
I am generally suspicious of performers that try to do an entire artist's work or a body of works. Like any pianist that does ALL of Beethoven's sonatas rarely does half of them well. Even Schnabel thought that the act of recording all of Beethoven's sonatas was hubris. And they broke that set up into years upon years. These days artists will just perform and record everything within. A few sittings. No time for reflection. Just another set of pieces. That Lettberg Scriabin set is even worse. It's the height of arrogance to think you could satisfactorily perform every piano piece by a composer as complicated as Scriabin.
>>126691738I am genuinely concerned of your asperger's consequences for this general.
That said, Gilels has a wonderful set of Beethoven sonatas and I dare you to find me a a significantly better performance of any given sonata (I don't care about nitpicked taste-related nothings). Arrau and Goode are also quite good. Nothing more can be said about the topic.
Ignore everyone else, the answer is always Lettberg
>>126691770>Gilels, Arrau, GoodeMid
Handel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IVhkfJPyc4
Why did he call it “Beethoven’s 5th Symphony”?
>>126690742Gilels is good but he's the best only at like sonata 16 and the two tiny ones no one cares for
>>126691778hylics like Lettberg should not be playing Scriabin.
>>126691905why the fuck do you think?
>>126684842>>126684833I swear some people here have such a shitty attitude heaven forfend they lift a finger to help their fellow man and not be useless spiteful sacks of shit. And they can’t just discuss music they claim to love with the curious oh no they have to prove themselves worthy.
>>126691905He probably called it symphony in c minor
>>126692614What did you do?
>>126691738On the contrary, I don't listen to recordings by performers who haven't done an entire cycle. Standalone Mahler 5? Pass. Standalone Beethoven's Piano Sonata no. 26? Pass.
Etude no 5 of Scriabin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtbalqzkvYI&ab_channel=MariaLettberg-Topic
>>126692678Nah, I've made some exceptions there. Ya know the one I really hate though? Recordings of selections from Bach's WTC. Now THAT I will NEVER listen to. An entire book or bust!
Best Scriabin interpreter?
>>126692633I bought a Bach bust.
>>126692759Ignore everyone else, the answer is always Lettberg
>>126692759Scriabin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bstDVo92Io&list=RD6bstDVo92Io
>>126688408I know I get overly excited when I come across a new great recording, but this seriously might be some of the best performed Sibelius I've ever heard. The third movement of the 2nd almost made me cry. Highly recommended.
>>126692697Honestly I don't think you even need to play the whole piece, there should be mashups
>>126692763Big Busty Bach
>>126692785>add new recording from young pianist just titled Bach>it's made up of single movements from a bunch of different works, eg one prelude, one movement from a partita, one movement from an english suite, one movement from the italian concertointo the trash it goes
>>126692805You misunerstand me, I think even the preludes could be broken up but then again I'm not really thinking of conventional performances
>>126692831No, I understood you, I just wanted to continue talking about what I wanted :^)
Plus your reply seemed like you were joshin' anyway
>>126687692Bach's harmonic slop soup deserves to be called out more often. He's not even the best baroque composer
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