Holst edition
https://youtu.be/VA5CImEv7UI

This thread is for the discussion of music in the Western (European) classical tradition, as well as classical instrument-playing.

>How do I get into classical?
This link has resources including audio courses, textbooks and selections of recordings to help you start to understand and appreciate classical music:
https://rentry.org/classicalgen

Previous: >>127106525

CLASSICAL IS ANIME

>>127140971
If you said that to me in real life, I would put my hand up and walk away, is how ridiculous it is. I've listened to Faure's Nocturnes several times and there's not one piece I can sing by memory. Hell, I'm not sure if I'd even recognize most of the pieces outside of their context.

>>127140981
Berlioz
https://youtu.be/Smu_sWq3LS8

How do you pronounce Faure? I've been saying it in a way that sounds dangerously close to Fuhrer but surely that can't be right.

>>127140986
Chopin's form is so poor.
>>127141005
Foh-ray.

>>127141022
It's a Nocturnes cycle, who cares about form? It's a nebulous, amorphous genre.

>>127141048
Musical form always matters no matter the genre because it's how you create drama in an abstract medium.

Hello, friends.

>>127141073
Nocturnes are supposed to be picturesque and/or emotional snapshots, not dramatic narratives.

>>127141078
Hello!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HAGF715e1s&list=OLAK5uy_k5YYS7DsrOXdvWQlsbYO9pQ_9INk5XAuY&index=13

>>127140981
>>127140996

Bruh, white folks be wildin
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P01EqXn7mik

>>127141104
Drama doesn't necessarily mean Beethoven 5. It just means a sense of progression. Moreover, nocturnes aren't 'supposed' to be anything except an evocation of the night and as you accurately, don't have hard formal parameters. Nothing says they have to be static miniatures.

>>127141185
*accurately stated

>>127141185
>>127141196
All I'm saying is improving on the 'form' of Chopin's Nocturnes is meaningless, because all that matters is the emotional power, melodies, and atmosphere, in which every area Chopin's rank at the highest level.

>>127141184
Ice in the blood

>>127141223
And that's wrong, because superior form will always elevate the effects (like 'atmosphere' or 'emotion') of a work no matter the genre.

>>127141247
Well, there's a reason there's only like five recordings of Faure's Nocturnes whereas there's hundreds of Chopin's.

>>127141297
Yeah, people love salonslop.

>>127141022
>Foh-ray.
Not Few-ray? thanks.

>>127141307
:O -> >:(

This is where I put my hand up and walk away. Oh sorry, I think I heard someone call my name, excuse me... phew.

The second, third, and fourth movements of Beethoven's 5th Symphony are always better when I listen to it than I remember.

>>127142039
Why are you listening to Epstein’s favorite composer?

Beethoven

https://youtu.be/ZdApYYSUfS8

>>127142210
ngl I've thought about that post (>>127106732) when starting the three Beethoven symphonies I've listened to since.

>>127142219
?

Which Beethoven symphony was best?

>>127142245
anyone who doesn't think it's the 9th is a retarded contrarian

9 > 3 > 6 > 7 > 8 > 5 > 4 > 2 > 1

imo

>>127142234
Beethoven

https://youtu.be/WIjiKZR0BSs

>>127140971
>Fauré's nocturnes are leagues above Chopin's.
Fuck no.
>>127141022
>Chopin's form is so poor.
Midwit take
>>127141048
Why are you replying to an obvious pseud take

>>127142296
Stop being a nonce.

>>127142296
ToT

>>127142309
Gotta discuss somethin' around here.

>>127142309
No, Chopin is in fact an inspired miniaturist with mediocre form.

>>127142317
?

>>127142309
>>127142324
Although in hindsight my real mistake was by 'form' I thought they meant something like 'structure' but looks back, they just meant outright 'composition,' ie Chopin was a poor composer, so maybe it wasn't worth the time.

>>127142331
Absolute delusion.

>>127142337
No, I meant form, as in the internal relationships and structure of the music. Chopin was not terrible but was definitely a very limited composer.

>>127142345
As I said.

>>127142340
thank you chopincel

>>127142348
The internal relationships of the music material is obviously not the same thing as composition as a whole. I did not deny for example his melodic inspiration.

>>127142337
The guy has no idea what he's talking about and lacks basic understanding of the form. It's same as people dismissing Mozart because he's too accessible, yet failing to grasp the structure and harmony underneath.
>>127142349
Thank you musiclet

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XY5lLMimVc

>>127142363
Are you the same guy who got humiliated by sisterposter over this exact issue

>>127142371
The sisterposter didn't get Chopin because they were an autist with no heart.

>>127142382
Being easily subject to emotional manipulation isn't having a heart. Brahms made emotional works that were excellently structured in a way that Chopin could never dream of.

>>127142382
God there's little more I hate than the cliché that good craftsmanship = emotionless.

>>127142392
Chopin's romantic form is more varstalie and less monotonic than Brahms', and I love Brahms as much as Chopin. Chopin's form is simply superior.

>>127142407
so true chopincel

>>127142407
Objectively wrong, chopin's form is aimless

>>127142382
>past tense

>>127142448
They're in ADX Florence for spying for China.

Why do so little symphonists write scherzos as lovely as Brahms'?

>>127142466
Brahms' scherzos are more like lyrical intermezzos besides the 4th. It's true that they're a distinct aspect of his style, a little underdiscussed maybe.

Sister Sisters
https://youtu.be/qgD53idHgmE

>>127142418
Repeating it won't make it true. Chopin's "form" cannot be deduced to just one single entity, he deals with it in more ways than most composers. It is never aimless, and he knows how and when to create drama. And often, he does so in calculation with the piano's timbre to maximize the effect. You're no less embarrassing than people who look down upon Mozart for being "too formulaic" while failing to grasp the harmonic relationships in his works, from which the form emerges.

>>127142485
My, what a big mouth Hewitt has!

can't we just agree if you reach the top tier of acclaim and popularity in classical music, you're almost certainly a great composer

Chopin isn't bad, Tchaikovsky isn't bad, Liszt isn't bad

>>127142500
Chopin's attempts to create drama are generally superficial. Every time someone tries to do this 'noooo you don't understaaand he's just like Mozart' I try one or two pieces and discover the same thing: a pretty melodic idea put through an incoherent structure of modulations climaxing in virtuoso pianistic effects. His nocturnes are not really the worst because they're generally short enough to be evocative miniatures, but he basically never develops his ideas in a way that would deepen the effects he's straining for.
>>127142523
nah

>>127142562
>, but he basically never develops his ideas in a way that would deepen the effects he's straining for.
that's what his piano sonatas and ballades are for.

>>127142562
>a pretty melodic idea put through an incoherent structure of modulations climaxing in virtuoso pianistic effects.
He does most thing in accordance to the sonata form, as far as his sonatas go, and Ballades are even more dramatic because of the form he employs. The development he uses can usually be observed in other sonatas, his sense of drama is actually very good. "Incoherent structure of modulations" is an incoherent statement as it doesn't serve your argument. You heard something foolish from someone, and you don't know how to justify it, so you are backpedalling with this nonsense.
https://mtosmt.org/issues/mto.15.21.4/mto.15.21.4.aziz.html

>>127142562
better than a single melodic line played 9000 fucking times like a midi loop

>>127142596
Yeah his ballades are much worse than his nocturnes for that reason. The nocturnes are pretty miniatures with some nice effects; there's some inspiration to build on.
>>127142601
Pretty sure his nocturnes are not generally in sonata form and I was talking about those, not his sonatas. And yeah, his key changes are sort of random and not very structurally convincing, which is a better justification for thinking Chopin is bad than invoking the authority of Mozart.

>>127142636
>Pretty sure his nocturnes are not generally in sonata form
If you don't even know that, then there is nothing to discuss. Nocturnes are usually in tenary form with two contrasting themes. If you're criticizing tenary forms then you are criticizing all Scherzos ever written. Good luck with that.
>his key changes are sort of random
Such as? Name one.
>invoking the authority of Mozart.
What authority are you even talking about? I compared you to a subset of classical fans who don't really try listening to music and judge the surface level, and you, at the same time, regurgitate idiotic ideas. Chopin is no less important than Mozart, I still don't understand what are you trying to say.

All I know is if a rockist put a gun to my head and said I have one chance to play him some classical he'll enjoy or else I'm gonna join the composers I hold so dearly, I'd bet my life on Chopin.

>>127142680
I'm not enough of chopincel to be 100% sure that all his nocturnes follow the same form and therefore I conceded that maybe there was a specific piece you were referring to that prompted your pivot towards the sonatas and ballades. As usual you take as an opportunity to be a faggot and assume bad faith. I see why sisterposter thought you were Indian. Enjoy your salonslop.
>>127142701
Is this supposed to be convincing? Most people are imbeciles about music.

>>127142749
>Is this supposed to be convincing? Most people are imbeciles about music.
Natural resonance with humanity is not an insignificant quality.

>>127142765
The default human condition is abject and their musical needs are trivial.

>>127142769
calvinist? reported to the nearest diocese

>>127142772
I mean this in a purely materialist sense.

>>127142778
nihilist? reported to the nearest aristotelian

mozart's chamber music is like the prussian monarchy's equivalent of a sonic weapon that causes you to shit your pants

>>127142749
>that all his nocturnes follow the same form
And yet you feel the need to criticize the form. Total NPC trash.
>that prompted your pivot towards the sonatas and ballades.
Because that's where development happens, not in tenary forms you illiterate.
>I see why sisterposter thought you were Indian
Thank you jeet.
Also
>not a single example
Thanks for further proving my point. Enjoy shitwaters from dheli

>>127142769
No, but seriously, what otherwise then? To judge artists by the criteria of a tiny, intellectually haughty elite? And by whose standards are they the elite? Again, all I meant was universal appeal is not an inconsiderable point of merit.

Chopin is simply more beautiful and pleasing to the ear and no amount of post hoc musicological babble and boggy "Gesamtkunstwerk" hollering will change that

>>127142850
based. disliking Chopin is like disliking Keats or Wordsworth: silly.

>>127142809
You brought up sonata form all on your own. I just said Chopin's changes are bad because you invited a response on his means of creating drama. These don't affect his more harmonically static nocturnes as much as his ballades and sonatas for obvious reasons, which I also stated previously. Also if you need me to give you an example of Chopin's unprepared modulations, I'm not sure you actually like him.
>>127142810
not about credentials. if you know you know

>>127142850
Even Wagner loved some Chopin, while dismissing other works as salon music. To say that Chopin has no sense of drama and development is objectively wrong on all musicological or auditory levels
>>127142870
Because you mentioned development, illiterate jeet.
>you invited a response on his means of creating drama.
Wasn't me, jeet.
>These don't affect his more harmonically static nocturnes
So now they are harmonically static? I thought they were too chromatic, illiterate jeet?
>Also if you need me to give you an example of Chopin's unprepared modulations
I need you to give me an example because you have none and you're proving my point. Romantic music being more chromatic is no news to anyone. Still waiting.

>>127142887
My posts said drama, and development specifically only came up later because I made the mistake of assuming good faith and noting that Chopin uses unprepared key changes to achieve this. Moreover, harmonically static doesn't mean diatonic. You are remarkably stupid.
>objectively wrong on all musicological or auditory levels
yes yes chopin is top quality saar most popular on reddit
>I need you to give me an example
just listened to the beginning of op. 23 ballade and there's an unprepared change right when the second theme is introduced. calling your bluff here only to make it clear that this is more about your desire to score little gotchas than it is about music, since the statement that Chopin uses such changes should be completely uncontroversial to anyone who supposedly likes him.

>>127143000
>and noting that Chopin uses unprepared key changes to achieve this.
This is objectively wrong. Chopin very rarely uses unprepared modulations, he always prepares modulations though pivot chords, dim 7th pivots and chromatic voice leading. Unprepared modulations are so rare you won't find me one (hint: it's in Scherzos) and they are quickly justified harmonically. Why are you babbling illiterate nonsense, jeet?
>You are remarkably stupid.
Imagine saying this after all the diarrhea you just spewed out.
>yes yes chopin is top quality saar
Thanks jeetie
>just listened to the beginning of op. 23 ballade and there's an unprepared change right when the second theme is introduced.
You should give me the bars, jeet.
Transition is from bars 36-67. At bars 62-67 chromatic shift happens towards B flat major, via an augmented triad in Bar 62 (G flat – B flat – D), settling on the dominant chord in Bar 64. This is not an unprepared modulation.

>enharmonic and dominant modulations are now unprepared
what has /classical/ become

>Wignat sister
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jd63y1xbkUc

>>127143074
man right up until very late you could just slide back into g minor and the tonal instability between Eb and Bb is clearly intentional, persisting for quite a bit longer even after the theme comes in at measure 68. it's not the worst example but it's obviously not a conventionally prepared key change and i'd respect you more if you argued that his aesthetic goals are different from the classical style of clearly articulated formal units.

If it’s not Baroque, it’s slop.

>>127142245
anyone who thinks it's the 9th is a retarded normalfaggot

3 > 8 > 7 > 9 > 4 > 6 > 2 > 1 > 5

>>127142523
(those three are, in fact, bad)

>>127143197
>man right up until very late you could just slide back into g minor
How is that even relevant? And how does that make it unprepared? You are making false claims then trying to get your way out of the embarrassing situation.
It's like you've decided that something which is false is true, and then you work backwards trying to justify it. Starting from "Chopin is bad" as your conclusion and then inventing reasons to support it
>tonal instability between Eb and Bb is clearly intentional,
Another non sequitur. The tonal instability is there right from the first few bars of music.
> it's not the worst example
No, it's not an example at all. You failed.
>i'd respect you more
I don't care about your respect faggot. You are making false claims to justify your schizophrenia and horrid taste in music. Leave my /classical/.

>>127143211
So apparently, according to /mu/, normalfaggotry is when you like the least accessible and most adventurous work by the composer

>>127143211
Gigabased, except bring 5th above 4th
>>127143234
3rd is simply the best, sorry

>>127143244
All the third has going for it is it's length, something that the ninth utilized far better

>>127141242
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAVwX84z88A

>>127143234
>>127143244
Oh and also, Beethoven himself claimed 8th is his best work. 3rd and 8th are the best Beet symphonies
9th is emotionally dishonest.

>>127143234
subtlety is the most required characteristic of great art by far. if it's enjoyed by most people, it clearly isn't subtle.

>>127143245
>All the third has going for it is it's length
... And the best funeral march? And the best climax in the 1st movement? And the best melodies? And the best fugue? Shall I go on?

Don't ask me to explain it, but this was made for the blacks

>>127143211
>>127143234
Listening to ANY Beethoven is normie-core.

>>127143248
He said the 8th was better than the 7th
>9th is emotionally dishonest.
Objectively isn't

>>127143250
>subtlety is the most required characteristic of great art by far.
By what objective metric do you base this on?

>>127143226
the ballade is actually not very tonally unstable most of the time, which is why it stands out that he delays the cadence that confirms Eb. and the chromatic sliding is relevant because it would not generally be considered adequate preparation of the change in the classical style. don't know what to tell you except that this is usually cited as part of Chopin's appeal.

>>127143251
>... And the best funeral march?
7
>And the best climax in the 1st movement?
9
>And the best melodies?
6
>And the best fugue?
Hammerklavier Sonata, String Quartet 14 and Grosse Fuge

>>127143261
>objective metric
>music

>>127143270
wait so we're including non-symphonic works and you still think the best melodies are from the 6th symphony?

>>127143270
Beethoven is NORMIE-core

now rank all 41 Mozart symphonies

Beethoven? You may as well listen to mumble-rap.

>>127143264
>the ballade is actually not very tonally unstable most of the time
Dude, it is tonally unstable right from the beginning of the piece and does not arrive to the tonal center before bar 7, what the hell are you talking about.
>it would not generally be considered adequate preparation of the change in the classical style.
Romantic harmony does not weaken the cohesion of form. Instead, it deepens them, as his modulations and voice leading are carefully crafted to serve the expressive and structural goals. The underlying formal architecture remains intact, it is simply enriched by a more fluid harmonic language. You are free to criticize that and stick to strict classical harmony, but you can't barge in with this utter drivel which you regurgitate from your fellow jeet sistershitter. If you don't like Chopin (and by extension, Fauré) then fine, just keep your dunning kruger in check.
>>127143257
Are ya sure? I thought he said 8th was his best overall.
>>127143270
Yawn. 7th is more contrapuntally rich, it's not necessarily better.
And 3rd is much better melodically than 6th, unless you are some fairy faggot.

>>127143272
You made an absolute statement as if it were fact, which implies a level of objectivity to your statement

>>127143331
>And 3rd is much better melodically than 6th,
Opinion disgarded immediatly

Chad Eroica vs virgin Pastorale

>>127143357
>Too much of a coward to directly reply to his post
geg

>>127143316
Gross Fuge was the first mumble rap song

>>127143370
Beethoven was going to write a great fugue, but then he got high…

>>127143331
man you waste so many words on trying to sound like a big boy.
>seven measures of introduction
yeah, i was talking about the whole piece, which is generally not characterised by tonal instability, relatively speaking. Have you listened to it
>simply enriched by a more fluid harmonic language
So you ultimately acknowledge that Chopin does do exactly what I said he does, but you think it's a good thing. I'm not against breaking the rules of classical harmony. Chopin just does it badly.

Beethoven

https://youtu.be/38gEALwJMzo

>>127143610
We get it… you are on Epstein’s ‘list’.

>>127143610
This sounds surprisingly good for Beethoven.

>>127143610
Is that a finger or a slit in her pants?

>>127143671
We are very fortunate to have Schuricht's stereo 9th.

>>127142477
>It's true that they're a distinct aspect of his style, a little underdiscussed maybe.
He was a scherzo specialist before he went to the Schumanns, it's something he put a lot of interest into.

I can't help but mourn the fact that the fourth didn't, as you say, get a more typically Brahmsian approach to the scherzo, but maybe that's just my fault for never being able to disassociate it from Wakeman's 'Cans and Brahms'.

>>127143428
>man you waste so many words on trying to sound like a big boy
But enough about yourself. LOL.
You couldn't even show me one unprepared modulation
>yeah, i was talking about the whole piece, which is generally not characterised by tonal instability
It is certainly more chromatic and unstable than Mozart, but much less unstable than Scriabin. There's obviously that medium in early romantic music.
>So you ultimately acknowledge that Chopin does do exactly what I said he does
No.
>Chopin just does it badly.
According to... What? You just proved yourself to be illiterate jeet who can't elaborate on his reasoning, and you're telling me you're a better judge of music. kek

There are indeed differences between romantic and classical harmonies, neither is superior to the other. You can objectively assess the form and compare it within the same style, but you cannot objectively compare two different styles, like apples and oranges. But who am I talking to, dogmatic, dichotomous idiot who doesn't understand where the line between reality and personal preferences are drawn.

Chopin does everything almost perfectly, including the harmony and form, and pushes early romanticism to its absolute peak just with the piano alone. If you can't at least respect that, not sure what you're doing here, sistershitter was bullied out for similar reasons >>>/mu/

>>127143727
chromatically sliding to an ambiguous new tonality is absolutely an unprepared modulation by classical standards and your irrelevant grandstanding won't change that, chopincel

>>127143740
>by classical standards
I accept your concession. Didn't think all your logical fallacies and ignorance were in a bigger bubble of a non sequitur argument.
Filtered by romanticism. Your taste down the drain into rivers of dheli

>>127143771
those are the only standards that matter, chopincel. what other possible comparative context could there even be for an unprepared key change besides classical harmony? I've even stated I'm not against breaking the rules as such but only that Chopin makes a pig's ear of it in long forms.

>>127143811
>those are the only standards that matter,
The jeet fallacy strikes again
>what other possible comparative context could there even be for an unprepared key change besides classical harmony?
Wagner, Liszt, Schumann, Franck, Brahms, Fauré, early Scriabin.
>'m not against breaking the rules as such
So you still have not even developed a proper argument for your claim, interesting.
>only that Chopin makes a pig's ear of it in long forms.
Thus spake Jeetustra

>>127143832
God your ESL is painful to read
>Wagner
Don't make me laugh. If I said that Wagner used unprepared modulations or doesn't resolve/stabilise his harmony in some work or another you wouldn't object because everyone understands that these things happened within the context and continuity of classical harmony and are furthermore not inherently bad. Wagner and whole identity of the progressive school could not have existed without that comparative context. You're shamelessly pretending to be retarded as though you don't understand that, when I talk about a composer born before the end of the classical period itself, references to changes in harmonic language naturally imply comparison to classical harmony.

Rachel Barton Pine's Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=waSSaZFiMEc&list=OLAK5uy_mp25r6Pk8JmVs1txdDn8qadKa-9Yerlhg&index=11

>Best-selling violinist Rachel Barton Pine's relationship with the music of Bach runs deep. She first heard and fell in love with Bach's music in her hometown St. Paul's Church in Chicago, which had a stained glass window of the composer in the sanctuary. That church is where Rachel first played Bach's music, at the age of four, and where she returned to record Bach's Six Sonatas and Partitas in its beautiful yet clear acoustic. Rachel says, I'm so pleased to have recorded the Six Sonatas and Partitas in my favorite sound space for these works, the place that I consider to truly be my emotional home for playing them.

>Rachel Barton Pine really may be the most charismatic, the most virtuosic, and the most compelling American violinist of her generation. --All Music Guide

!

can't one of you nerds who knows this stuff track down the anime pedophile's IP and kill him?

>>127143926
Never been blown away by her but I appreciate that she recorded Joachim's concerto.

>>127143998
Seems extreme. Please no advocating for violence. Peace in our time (and general!).

>>127144003
>Joachim
the Beethoven cadenza guy?

can any of you epic 4chan nerds be my personal kiwi farms army and kill all the people annoying me in /classical/

>>127144009
Yes. It's worth a listen.
https://youtu.be/85sQq7bBdro

>As a Bach pianist, Maria Tipo’s tempo fluctuations, tapered phrases, bottomless palette of tone colors, voluminous pedal effects, and restless pursuit of inner voices (real, implied, and imaginary) will send purists begging for mercy. Even in hyphenated Bach (Busoni’s Chaconne and the mighty St. Anne’s Prelude and Fugue, or Myra Hess’ “Jesu, Joy of Man’s Desiring”), Tipo makes dyed-in-the-wool Romantic Bach players like Edwin Fischer or Samuel Feinberg sound like Helmut Walcha.

kek based

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvBkhUDy7Po&list=OLAK5uy_kgIDgCo9-Y3Ge_qzbkY8rpRQ42556UyYU&index=36

>>127144004
I'll advocate for violence in very, very few circumstances, but unashamed pedophiles being in my presence is DEFINITELY one of them

I'm not even sure what to call the genre. ChatGPT refers to these artists as neo-classical, while Apple Music classifies some of it as classical crossover and the rest as classical.
>Hania Rani, Olafur Arnalds, Federico Albanese, Dirk Maassen, Meredi, etc...

It's not exactly what I would consider classical in the traditional sense, but I can't seem to nail genre since it seems to be emerging. It feels like a combination of multiple genres, but I don't really know much beyond that. I've been listening to stuff like this for the past 4 years and I'd really like some help on finding more music like this or some recommendations, thanks.

>>127144019
neat, ty. I see Tetzlaff/Dausgaard also have a recording, yet another formidable pairing.

>>127144010
calling pedophiles "annoying" is the understatement of the millennium.

>>127144044
Classical crossover is usually what that kind of thing is called in my experience. But it's not really classical, no. Tends to have a different audience.

damn I am really picky with my Mahler 2's these days. Been trying to listen to recordings which I either ranked around good/solid or were of upper acclaim, but about halfway through the first movement, they just aren't doing it.

>>127143892
>God your ESL is painful to read
You can stop replying any time.
>Don't make me laugh. If I said that Wagner used unprepared modulations
He doesn't. He uses chromaticism. You are so retarded it's beyond belief.
>within the context and continuity of classical harmony and are furthermore not inherently bad
Romantic music is the continuity of classical harmony, correct.
You still haven't defined what makes something "inherently bad" because you're illiterate jeet.
>could not have existed without that comparative context.
Non sequitur.
>You're shamelessly pretending to be retarded as though you don't understand that
Dude, you can't fucking defend your argument. At this point I'm assuming you're trolling.
>when I talk about a composer born before the end of the classical period itself, references to changes in harmonic language naturally imply comparison to classical harmony.
Your argument is logically fallacious. When the composer was born is utterly irrelevant. If Chopin was born in Baroque period and wrote the music that he did, he still would be a composer of the romantic style, comparable not to Bach but Liszt, Wagner and so on.

You should stop addressing everything else but the non-existence of an argument from your behalf.

>>127144039
Is this the Bach Keyboard Partitas recording I've been searching for my whole life? To rank next to Koroliov's? Maybe. Still have to try Perahia's too.

>>127144010
There are /classical/ threads on kiwi farms? kek

>>127144065
>But it's not really classical, no. Tends to have a different audience.
Yea I am not surprised. It's significantly more minimalist and has lots of electronic influence. I originally found these artists because I loved IDM (listen to this stuff primarily now).

>>127144078
that's all very cute fanfiction, chopincel, but the world continues to use the phrase 'unprepared modulations' to describe composers as late as Wagner, Scriabin and even Debussy. your fixation on 'disproving' an uncontroversial musical statement not even particularly relevant to my original point about Chopin isn't doing much to disprove that you're an ESL who can't parse simple text.

>>127144076
what do you think of Mehta?

>>127144160
Stellar if you want a fast, fierce, gutsy performance. These days I generally opt for the sensitive and poetic approach, but when I want that, there's none better. Been a while though.

>>127144133
>but the world continues to use the phrase 'unprepared modulations' to describe composers as late as Wagner, Scriabin and even Debussy.
The world in question: a random jeet
>'disproving' an uncontroversial musical statement
Uncontroversial statement is that Chopin was indeed excellent at large scale forms as evidenced by the last 2 sonatas, cello sonata and the quasi-sonata one movemnet ballades. What (You) are saying is not only controversial, but regurgitated, highly misleading, misinformation.
>my original point about Chopin
For which your sole argument was invalid and all this time you couldn't even bring up 1 (one) example to justify your edgy claim, contrarian for the sake of contrarianism.

>>127144202
you're being racist so you lost

>>127144202
if you want to talk about music without the implied framework of classical harmony and you can pretend not to understand what an unprepared change is, go check out /jazz/. in the meantime, what you're saying is ironically pretty insulting to those composers like Wagner and Bruckner, who consciously pushed the existing boundaries of musical culture with their roving, ambiguous harmony (and were much better than Chopin).

>>127144211
Jeets can't help themselves but project their jeetness and all they are left with is being called a jeet and destroyed in an argument.
Can't wait for another off-topic argument not relating to Chopin nor his mastery of form.

>>127144244
>if you want to talk about music without the implied framework of classical harmony
You can reasonably compare classical harmony to romantic harmony, but defintely not in that context, of course the dunning kruger effect is quite strong, so you have push the false dichotomy as your last hope.
>and were much better than Chopin
"I AM LE SMART AND CHOPIN LE BAD BECAUSE... BECAUSE HE IS OK??"
Wagner didn't even use the sonata form in his major compositions so the comparison is useless. That said, Chopin is better!

>Chopin is better than Wagner
Based and Choppilled
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlzB9o3_nzw

>>127144296
of course someone with a small enough brain to prefer chopin to wagner would use zoomerspeak

>>127144316
Thank you illiterate jeet
>>127144296
Thanks brother

>>127144273
Wagner's accomplishments mean basically nothing without the implied context, you idiot. Treating his music like its innovations weren't specifically developed in the context of classical harmony is a hundred times more stupid and insulting than saying Chopin has shitty form because it denatures him.

>>127144342
>Wagner's accomplishments mean basically nothing
Another idiotic drivel. Honestly it's so obvious you're trolling you deserve to get slapped with a ban.
>like its innovations weren't specifically developed in the context of classical harmony
Almost everything post Corelli is in the context of the tonal language, dingus.
>Chopin has shitty form
Another clown chimpout, you lost that argument anon.

>>127144397
>Almost everything post Corelli is in the context of the tonal language,
so you agree that when I say 'unprepared key change' about a composer barely removed from the classical period, the implied comparative is classical tonality. glad that's cleared up!

>>127144427
>unprepared key change
Not by any literary source.
>the implied comparative is classical tonality.
Classical tonality itself isn't one single entity like you think it is. It has gradually evolved into romantic, late romantic, and then post romantic harmony.
>barely removed from the classical period,
Kek this cope again
"NOOO CHOPIN WAS BORN TOO EARLY TO USE SUCH RICH CHROMATIC HARMONIES NOOOO"

>>127144454
so true, rockist chopincel

>>127144465
Thank you illiterate jeet

are you guys still arguing? time to call it and move on imo

>>127144479
We haven't been arguing the moment I refuted his sole argument regarding the modulation here >>127143074
But he couldn't gracefully accept the defeat so here we are.

>>127144471
the dumbest part is you still think my problem with chopin is that he did unprepared changes and was too spooky and chromatic or something. Mendelssohn did them too! It's so fundamentally irrelevant that only the most pedantic ESL rockist could possibly get hung up on it.

>>127144507
>my problem with chopin is that he did unprepared changes
???
That's all you could bring up? All this time I've been asking you to be reasonable but you obviously lack both knowledge and willingness to admit the truth. You have zero self awareness.
>rockist
Sistershitter babble

>>127144525
go back to /metal/, rockist chopincel

>>127144527
>still not a single argument, not even an attempt
As I said.
>/metal/
Is this where yoh hang out? Not surprising, smelly jeet.

>>127144539
it's pigs before swine, rockist chopincel

>>127144551
I accept your defeat, smelly metal jeet

>one uses "Xsister"
>the other uses "Xcel"
is there ANYONE here who doesn't talk like a kid?

>>127144565
it's cute how you try to flip the script when you're obviously the same /metal/ tourist who's been shitting up the general for months now.

>>127144581
It's quite embarrassing to post this drivel after losing an argument, smelly jeet.

>>127144590
Next thread how about you do the Bach atheism routine instead? At least it's off-topic enough to be ignorable.

>>127144595
How about you either man up or stop stinking up this general, jeet? You haven't said anything relevant in the past 3 hours

>>127144612
Man up? Is that what you did when you pretended that knowing the rules of classical harmony is an absurd hidden condition in the classical general?

>>127144661
Incoherent babble. As usual, jeet.

>>127144674
yes, music isn't your strong suit, maybe go back to >>>/metal/ instead?

>>127144685
But enough about yourself, plebbit might be more your speed.

>>127144719
No no, I can't go yet when we haven't go to the part where you start talking about intelligence decline and its relationship to classical music.

>>127144733
We'll never get there with you I'm afraid jeet

At times like these I think of the Master of Music and Poetry in whose name this general was consecrated. Wagner would not have allowed his discord kittens to grow so unruly. With his integral and organic conception of the artwork he would, while paying the respect due to those composers out of whose genius was formed these pristine instruments of musical understanding, recognize these matters as beneath the dignity of the true artist for whom they are but tools of his unified expression. Come, let us embrace one another as sisters and retreat to the seraglio to repose in profound meditation upon the works of the Master.

https://youtu.be/yF0pwSC7qWg

>>127144733
That's a low blow, anon, though they might have a point with it

>>127144793
It's not even a personal attack, just something he conspicuously starts repetitious arguments about every few threads, which is shameless enough that I can't imagine it being particularly insulting.

I am in a world, where I am taking a stroll in a beautiful park built by the divine, suddenly my legs feel tired and request to stop. Cordially I went on ahead to sit under the shade of a chestnut tree. My fatigue washes away from me as I slip into my imaginative daydreaming, I can hear the melancholic chirping of the sparrows and the water flowing from the creeks, feel the gust of a chilly wind approaching my face, smell the rejuvenating fragrance of the good earth. But then I realize I was just listening to the start of Lohengrin. I a poor soul, venerate the gods for creating such beauty and allowing an inferior soul like me to experience it!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BG53S27HI5k

Barbara Hendricks <3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUgIIwwjJKU&list=OLAK5uy_kRM7pM9I1JvvdDWvW0td60oWBqXWlXp30&index=2

>>127145024
what's his favourite composer

>>127145037
Haydn

If your composition needs more than four instruments in order to convey its ideas, it's a bad composition.

>>127145158
You're dumb as hell and don't know anything about music

>>127145158
You're highly intelligent and are wise in the ways of music.

>>127145158
Nah. Piano concerto is easily the greatest genre of music.

now playing

start of Liszt: Harmonies poétiques et religieuses
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZrUv0T4UO4&list=OLAK5uy_k37owtUA30G8-EI7_YEWBMHdss7qJVxrM&index=2

start of Liszt: Sonata in B Minor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rf39ig7zdyo&list=OLAK5uy_k37owtUA30G8-EI7_YEWBMHdss7qJVxrM&index=11

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_k37owtUA30G8-EI7_YEWBMHdss7qJVxrM

>>127145037
Chopin or film music

>>127145535
I swear there are so many parts to this piano cycle that are so quiet I can't hear a damn thing.

>>127145995
>he thinks he can pair greatest composers with film music

Your life isn't complete until you've listened to the entirety of Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D Minor (BWV 565) played on the organ. That stuff is euphoric and blissful. Those chords, man...

Handel’s famous oratorio, “Judas Maccabaeus,” has been “Aryanized” by substituting a new text with a German hero, according to the Prague Nazi newspaper Der Neue Tag. The work has received the new title “The General.”

The Nazi paper said the original text was “an oriental extravaganza” characterized by “overheated voluptuousness,” while Handel’s music “is a musical speech which rises into the pure air of Nordic-German spirituality.” “Handel’s music,” the paper said, “is now freed of a contradiction which the 18th century lack of racial insight could not grasp.”

>>127145535
What a horrible cover. For that reason alone I refuse to listen

>>127146313
It's so generic and dull many consider it's written by Bach's student. It's not confirmed to be a Bach piece. Passacaglia and Fugue in C minor is what deserves that sort of reputation.

>>127146611
you know how the French are

>>127138953
You go through Piano Phases-is that Reich?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNVzDGnkbDI&list=RDwNVzDGnkbDI&start_radio=1&ab_channel=TheIntegralSerialist

Even before the Nazis came to power, Handel’s music had been politically appropriated by German musicologists. At the 1922 Handel festival in Halle, musicologist Alfred Heuß made a speech arguing that Germany might have won the First World War if only they had understood Handel’s music: ‘England, which was in possession of Handel’s Messiah, conquered Germany, which was in possession of Bach’s St. Matthew Passion.’ From 1933 the Nazis attempted to rewrite certain historical facts. Early biographies, for example, had stated that Handel had become an English citizen, whereas new biographies claimed that this was untrue. Rather than having been influenced by English music, it was claimed that Handel had himself influenced English musical style, as two of his pupils wrote ‘Rule, Britannia,’ and ‘God Save the King.’

... in 1935, keynote speaker and Nazi visionary Alfred Rosenberg asserted that Handel’s greatest success, Judas Maccabaeus, was only a celebration of military victory, and discussed how difficult it must have been for Handel to set a text that corresponded “so little to the nature of his being.” Handel experts advised that German performers move away from ‘overly Judaized German translations’ of the oratorios.

...
In 1941 the Reichstelle für Musikbearbeitung (National Office for Music Production) began to rework the oratorios, and the texts for Israel in Egypt, Joshua and Samson were revised into Der Opfersieg bei Walstatt (Victory at the Battlefield), Die Ostlandfeier (Eastern Celebration) and the Wieland Oratorio, respectively. The NS-Kulturgemeinde (League for German Culture) ordered that Judas Maccabaeus be changed into Held und Friedenswerk (Hero and Labour of Peace), an ode to Hitler. The main changes in these works was the recasting of Jewish Biblical characters into anonymous heroes, and changing the setting of the works into historical events that would glorify the German military. Other versions of the oratorios emerged, including one by Hermann Stepheni, Der Feldherr (The General), in which the characters Joshua, Jesse and Lysias were anonymous, and Biblical references were changed, e.g. ‘Israel’ was changed to ‘Fatherland.’ In another version, Wilhelmus von Nassauen (which premiered on the day the Germans occupied the Rhineland in 1936), the setting was adjusted to depict the liberation of the Netherlands from Spanish domination. The character of Judas became William of Orange, and the song ‘Rejoice, O Judah’ became ‘Rejoice, Holland.’

I'm hyped

Is Ligeti a one hit wonder(Musica Ricercata)?

>>127147754
A Guided Tour of The Mines of Moria

Is Orff a one hit wonder(Carmina Burana)?

>>127147754
Gandalf?

>>127148148
of course

Strauss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z5LDHcAfNWE&list=OLAK5uy_l3xSQYBc9QIWPB7DmdIiM8RUV-WoETLfw&index=5

>>127140975 (OP)
Hey guys. Please help me with the names of these classical songs:
https://litter.catbox.moe/mjvqq6rc6e35ajbf.mp3
>0:00
>3:32
>5:58

Bruckner

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsVvHE6KMlE&list=OLAK5uy_lrAQTE2WDzoxzc1jmP6d7jFbrR5CkHiJQ

>>127149160
Who are the performers? Very little information online.

>>127149378
are you blind?

>>127149455
Yeah, and who are they?

>>127149299
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJGDKlu39xg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3aL7aozgPU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZ3B5URkiCQ

>>127149732
Thanks bud.

Schumann

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuRFRHO2n3o&list=OLAK5uy_meDKWhPogtDTqbcVmFiQP0bcrbRBr6X-0&index=4

>>127149624
I mean the BRSO is obviously well-known and Rogner is known to people into a certain kind of recording (I know him from his choral and Bruckner stuff). But yes, the oboist is a JAG -- just another guy.

>>127149160
>>127149331
>>127150531
Eterna had the classiest cover art

>I tell you, what a piece! If the whole of German art were to disappear, it could be recognised and reconstructed from this one work. It almost makes everything else seem worthless and superfluous.
- Gustav Mahler on Die Meistersinger von Nürnberg

>>127151275
Bach's successor

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9qtmkhPvn8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5u-pvE7j0s

Françaix

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JFb-btJVMs&list=OLAK5uy_mjthGO3W8H14KPO5mFgU2dU-aQtFk0M2Y&index=10

>>127140975 (OP)

Just stumbled upon this gem https://www.wienersymphoniker.at/en/new-colours:

> Wiener Symphoniker X K-Pop
> This season, the Wiener Symphoniker will once again be happy to stimulate curiosity when they travel acoustically to South Korea and fuse the colourful and dazzling world of K-pop with the European orchestral tradition.

Are there any recordings of previous attempts, /classical/?

Ozzy and Black Sabbath owed their careers to Holst.

Chopin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kMEWYy1kWXM&list=OLAK5uy_my48ySxL1WUSOSpNJgqsVFEqDEIRj7FE0

>>127151608
I know I shouldn't get angry at some silly text but...

Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNtQPL-n_OM

Hello friends
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5vmtuYEnQI

Best Brahms symphony? I keep hearing conflicting opinions from people on this topic when this question is asked. I relisten probably the most to 4, but that's mainly because I don't have to specifically seek out a recording that observes the repeat as the repeat is caked into the score instead of having a sign which makes it a lot less of a hassle to find good recording

>>127155540
Me when Dave Hurwitz is speaking

>>127155540
>>127155615
kek nice vid.
Praise our Lord and Saviour Emissary of Satan

Franck's D minor Symphony has some great tunes

best recording of Fauré's Nocturnes or complete solo Piano works?

do you niggas listen to classical music only?

>>127156374
Are you implying popular music genres are worth my time?
HAHAHA. >>>/mu/

>>127156374
Once you go /classical/. there is no going back

>>127155571
It's the 4th. The 4th is one of classical music's 10/10s. The 3rd is probably a 9.5 tho.

>>127155987
Eric La Sage.

>complete solo Piano works?
Lucas Debargue has a decent set.

>>127156374
Once you go /classical/, there is no going back

>>127145037
>>127145024
Bach, who he insists was an atheist.

Bach
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8xTneajT8Q

>>127156645
>who he insists was an atheist
Just being a realist.

>>127156693
Go shit in your hat.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkO5lBTDBM0

>>127156732
Why does it make you seethe? What are you going to do if we find irrefutable evidenence that he was?

>>127156771
You might as well ask me what I would do if I teleported to Mars…

Holst
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UfpgT9FMAk

>>127143926
This set has shot up to one of my favorites already. Like many here, my first exposures to Bach's solo violin masterpieces were through the lens of Grimiuax and Hahn. Undoubtedly great performers, but even then I felt their interpretations were a bit too dry, severe, and, hell, masculine. These days I vastly prefer a sensitive, warm, feminine touch. Gimme Julia Fischer's Bach. Gimme James Ehnes' Bach. And now, gimme Rachel Barton Pine's Bach.

Highly recommended.

>>127156831
> a bit too dry, severe, and, hell, masculine
?

>>127156803
>>127156822
lol

>>127156868
Compare

Grimiaux
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UupI9Q9bKjM&list=OLAK5uy_lv9Sf7If-6BXPfEQvzA1vqTVo_DCqxOcE&index=26

Pine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUysOCzzVIU&list=OLAK5uy_mp25r6Pk8JmVs1txdDn8qadKa-9Yerlhg&index=22

That said, back when I used to listen to Grimiaux's set, I was still fresh to the pieces, whereas now I'm decently familiar with them, so perhaps I'm due for a revisit.

>>127156901
Who is the Andrew Tait approved performer of the violin the Sonatas and Partitas? Hahn?

>>127156868
>>127156901
Grimiaux's sounds like the impenetrable, rigid voice of the Father. A harsh, thundering command. Pine's sounds like the nurturing, warm embrace of the Mother. Total acceptance and reassurance, attuned to the heart.

Which of course isn't to say Grumiaux's approach is wrong or bad, if you prefer your Bach that way all the power to ya. It's just not what my ears like at this stage in my life.

>>127156931
Really?

oh look, the presumably stoned shitposting-anon who responds with the first lazy joke that pops into their immature mind to every other post and most likely doesn't even listen to classical themselves is back.

>>127156901
>>127156942
Who is the Andrew Tait approved performer of the Sonatas and Partitas? Hahn?

>>127156943
based, get 'em!

>>127156948
Don't reply to my posts ever again.

Ever time I try to finally embark on listening to Gould's WTC, I listen to thirty seconds and then I go, "y'know, let's just listen to Richter's instead." Someday... in the meantime,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eXO8JiMweUc&list=OLAK5uy_lh3gJ0CxtLK6o11AJ49JORIG7CASSuRuM&index=22

>>127156803
No, it's perfectly plausible that Bach was an atheist.

>>127156901
>>127156942
>>127156943

Stop gooning and learn to appreciate the formal structure pf the music. The performer is irrelevant.

>>127156998
here's your (You)

>>127156987
I am not, old sport ; )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jVh5cZ_ZvM

>>127156987
I am afraid not, old sport ; )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jVh5cZ_ZvM [Remove]

gonna go through Maria Grinberg's Beethoven Piano Sonatas set if anyone wants to join in on the experience starting from the beginning

No. 1, Op. 2 No. 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fc38Y0KEx8A&list=OLAK5uy_l_lXndb_UzWQcLdU9UElg6z3JiDqKXR-E&index=2

No. 2, Op. 2 No. 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PVF7i9gEK-g&list=OLAK5uy_l_lXndb_UzWQcLdU9UElg6z3JiDqKXR-E&index=6

No. 3, Op. 2 No. 3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9iBVLAm3dU&list=OLAK5uy_l_lXndb_UzWQcLdU9UElg6z3JiDqKXR-E&index=9

>>127157072
First time listening to classical music? Beethoven is normie-core,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcEA6XZHBlo

>>127157072
Wow Maria Gringoldberg is going to play all 92 Beethoven sonatas?

>>127157085
Karajan was the greatest conductor of the 20th century.

>>127156374
No I listen to all kinds of music. Not literally ALL kinds but you know what I mean

>>127157072
>>127157095
Listen, kid, we get it. You are fresh off the boat from outer >>/mu/ and are desperate to impress us with your ‘categorical’ knowledge of recordings. You are not the first 13-year-old to discover Beethoven from watching Hollywood movies, a phase we have all been through. Let me just cut to the chase: listening to Beethoven in /classical/ is a faux pas that exposes you for a pseud.

Interesting there are virtually no complete Beethoven piano sonata cycles recorded by women. I guess Beethoven's music does come across as intrinsically brimming with the tragic masculine spirit.

>>127157182
annie fischer though...

>>127157181
It took me a long time to realise he wasn't actually a dog

>post some good classical or I'll blow me feckin brains out!

>>127157291
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_1N6_O254g

>>127157256
Grinberg and Fischer and that's it.

>>127157256
>>127157571
And I'm especially talking about recorded in the past few decades. You can find a bajillion recordings of Chopin, Mozart, Liszt, Schumann, Brahms, Shostakovich, Bach, and so on by women, but no complete Beethoven cycles. At least there's a good amount of the late piano sonatas, and I imagine there's probably a good amount of some of the named sonatas scattered throughout recitals and mixed program recordings, but yeah. You search up 'complete Beethoven piano sonatas' and it's all men. Nothing wrong with those recordings, some variety would be nice is all.

what recordings of Bruckner 5 don't play the staccato introductions so quietly that I can't fucking hear them?

speaking of Beethoven, now playing

start of Beethoven: Symphony No. 6 in F Major, Op. 68 "Pastoral"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL3hWlETyFM&list=OLAK5uy_mUzoNsrpCzUNVm6559OeuFv1_Oo6FZKas&index=26

Beethoven: Egmont, Op. 84: Overture
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kL1ZsCzC6a4&list=OLAK5uy_mUzoNsrpCzUNVm6559OeuFv1_Oo6FZKas&index=31

start of Beethoven: Symphony No. 7 in A Major, Op. 92
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZd_B4k1tkE&list=OLAK5uy_mUzoNsrpCzUNVm6559OeuFv1_Oo6FZKas&index=32

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=OLAK5uy_mUzoNsrpCzUNVm6559OeuFv1_Oo6FZKas

I was not a fan whatsoever of this set the last time I tried it despite my usual love for Chailly's performances because it's too HIP-adjacent for my tastes. However, I know it's highly acclaimed and lot of people here love it, and since I've recently come around on really enjoying the 21st century Blomstedt/Gewandhaus cycle, I figured I'd give this one another try.

>>127157687
Barenboim's?

>>127156374
i like King Crimson

>>127156374
At home, yes. When I'm out, I like listening to the music I used to enjoy pre-classical, ie rock/pop. Better for daydreaming and spacing out while traveling and walking or riding the bus.

>>127157704
too quiet in the last movement, though the others are perfect
Klemperer is the opposite; his first movement has it too quiet, while his last one is almost too loud.
can't find a satisfactory one in all of them

>>127157736
hmm, Harnoncourt's?

>>127157687
>>127157736
I'm gonna listen to Blomstedt's right now, if it ends up being good and loud enough I'll let you know. I always avoided it because I've heard it's pretty poor, the weakest performance in this cycle.

>>127157668
Don’t forget Scriabin.

>>127157823
tru, and Prokofiev! Tons and tons of complete cycles of their sonatas by women.

time for a proper traversal of Kondrashin's Shostakovich cycle? yes indeed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hGUPYjhThQ&list=OLAK5uy_lQBR3FCd6tOV1MbF-z22d23DrqYr3bvq0&index=5

>I remember going to a concert in the Royal Festival Hall very many years ago, where a touring Russian orchestra – one of the best – was performing. The only thing I remember about the concert, aside from some staggering playing, was that all of the string instruments seemed to be of the same make, certainly being all of the same uniform dark brown colour. I don’t quite know why, but this somehow seemed to sum up the wide differences between the worlds of Russia and the west. There are so many things that we think we know about that other country, but don’t really understand. The Kondrashin recordings are essential Shostakovich listening for this reason if for no other. They spring from the genuine source, and express not only the voice of one great composer, but the voices of an entire population who, for better or worse, became part of something simultaneously vastly inspiring and uniquely terrifying. ---- Dominy Clements

Why is Brahms 2 generally not as commonly praised as his other symphonies? The first movement is one of my favorite sonata-allegro movements Brahms ever wrote

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DTDA7oMeqIg

>>127158025
The 3rd and 4th and some of his other works just set such a high bar. I agree though, I love the 2nd and its first movement, and one point if its favor I'll give it over the other symphonies is, for me, it's the easiest to listen to and enjoy, the most emotional accommodating. By that I mean the 1st, 3rd, and 4th I generally have to be in a specific mood for me to want to listen to them, whereas the 2nd I can listen to at any time in any mood and no matter what, it satisfies and uplifts my spirit, providing comfort when I need comfort, relaxation when I am tired, and excitement when I am in need of stirring.

>>127158025
2 is easily my fav brahms symphony. no idea if it's unpopular, and if so, why

Paganini

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh-xEqRrhjo&list=OLAK5uy_kk4fMTyBcZNt-mbZ3tjGqa2HMmUUQzFDE&index=23

>>127158025
It's probably my second favourite after the 4th. I think it just has less of a public and easily communicated identity compared to the other three besides being Brahms' 'pastoral' symphony, although I don't think it's actually *unpopular* in terms of performances so much as it is that it's harder to make an eye-catching critical-biographical point with it. Same reason a lot of Haydn's symphonies without nicknames don't get remarked upon as much. Easier fodder for writers and journalists.

Brahms is dry

Bach is atheist

>>127158480
Absolutely harebrained

>>127158344
Juicy post

>>127157736
I found the answer by the way. It's Sinopoli.

>>127158502

>>127158635
oh and Wand with the BPO is pretty good in this regard too.

Bach

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVNJ17aWzdU&list=OLAK5uy_k7ukn-TIO-PTlStVuB_u43vL1jGs5u8VQ&index=6

>>127157377
Bro hat einfach Star Wars Soundtrack geschrieben

favorite Dvorak 4-9?

>>127159579
i always thought of old western movies.

As much as I love Chopin I think Wagner's achievements are greater. True, Chopin presages the most advanced harmonies of Wagner, but he just didn't get there. And yes, Wagner could never compose great music in sonata form, but then again there's no way Chopin could have composed anything like the gargantuan size and unity of a mature Wagner opera. Everything compared, Wagner comes out a slightly more significant composer.

>>127161149
I disagree. Wagner can be godly and epic, but Chopin defined the spirit of man in music. Admittedly, I'm not a huge Opera guy myself so there's that also. Anyway, why compare the two?

Symphony No.17 "For Metal Orchestra" - Alan Hovhaness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YcOBHrgoB4&list=RD8YcOBHrgoB4&start_radio=1&ab_channel=SergioC%C3%A1novas

>>127161149
>>127161228
Salon slop

>>127161561
Thank you illiterate sister

>>127161228
>Chopin defined the spirit of man in music
Wouldn't that be more Beethoven?

>>127161617
Sorry I couldn't read your post because I'm illiterate-I assume you were agreeing with me though

>>127161632
Beethoven defined the flesh of man in music.

Who the hell defined the penis of man in music then?

>>127161843
Scriabin

>>127161228
>Chopin defined the spirit of man in music
damn the spirit of man sure sounds gay

>>127161971
I'm sure Scriabin is only responsible for melanin

>>127159828
1 - 8 can go either way between Kerstez and Rowicki. Best 9 is definitely Muti.

>>127157694
They're really good, and I often listen to them because their audio quality, although I often find his tempo too fast for Beethoven. I think Karajan got it perfectly

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>>127162019
>>127162019
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