Seems like people are very divided about this.

Some say they're very good because you can buy it and keep it for years while 125 will feel boring after a month and 300-500 will feel boring after a few months.

Their opponents say that SV650 is even less beginner friendly than a 600 supersport because it has just as much torque, less "smooth" engine and worse handling. Instead they recommend 125 as the first bike.

Others are in between. They consider 650 a bit too risky and recommend 300-500 as the first bike.

You can utterly f* yourself up on a moped, just as well as a superbike.
First bike ought to be a standard with sufficient speed to keep up with local traffic.
Once you master that then indulge yourself.

>>28472885
>You can utterly f* yourself up on a moped, just as well as a superbike.
Yeah, but f* yourself up on a superbike doesn't require wrong way riding or getting smashed by a stupidly fast BMW

>>28472885
>You can utterly f* yourself up on a moped, just as well as a superbike.
Yeah, but f* yourself up on a superbike doesn't require wrong way riding or getting smashed by a speeding BMW

>>28472910
Learner bikes are for learning on. Are you suggesting faster bikes are more safe?

>>28472879 (OP)
If you have a hole in your head get a 300cc shitbike like ninja 300.

If you have self control but are unsure of your personal skill to mechanically handle the bike and its controls, get a 70hp bike.

If you have basic self control and motoric skill you can get any bike you want.

>>28472918
CB250 was pretty much optimal learner in its day. 85 or so mph. A bit large for smaller humans but otherwise pretty much idiot proof.
Aim here and you'll not die while parking.

>>28472955
Pic.

SNIFFA

>>28472879 (OP)
Is it true that if you can get a bird on the back of one of those things, they just cream their knickers because of the vibration?

>>28472955
This segment is dead because Americans want more and more and Europeans want either 125 up to 15 hp or a ~45 hp bike because that's what law encourages them to get and they don't want anything in between

>>28472985
125 12 hp is for teens and 45 hp is for older learners.
Pass the tests and taste freedom.

>>28472879 (OP)
>Some say they're very good because you can buy it and keep it for years
correct

>while 125 will feel boring after a month
incorrect
125 is scooter territory. if you want a scooter, its fine forever. if you want a bike, 125 is a joke.

>and 300-500 will feel boring after a few months
depends on the bike. some are quite fun, some suck ass.
about the only bike in this displacement class i'd actually recommend is the kawa with the 400cc i4, but its NOT a beginner bike, so stay away.

> even less beginner friendly than a 600 supersport
incredibly, unbelievably, unfathomably wrong
a 600cc supersport is NOT a beginner bike by any stretch of the imagination. its incredibly fast and its torque curve makes it extremely treacherous. pic related (top)
in contrast, a 650 like the sv is much friendlier to noobies. again, pic related (bottom)
notice how the power delivery in the 600cc supersport is very non-linear. you apply some throttle, nothing happens, you think "hey, this ain't so bad" and then BOOOM MOTHERFUCKER 110hp, hope you were ready for it fuckboi, lol
the sv650 however, is easy to understand and predict.

my suggestion
>don't buy a fucking bike
seriously tho, don't. they are quite dangerous even if you're not a retard. if you are a retard, well, at least sign up as an organ donor before hand.
if you really, REALLY need a bike, eg because you live in some big city and traffic/parking are impossible, get a scooter. and safety gear. and be very, VERY careful of retards.
and if you decide to ignore my suggestion, definitely avoid a 600cc, definitely avoid a non-scooter at 125cc, and definitely don't buy a turbo busa. i know its tempting, but don't.

>>28472879 (OP)
I'd get something with ~40-50hp for a learner bike, and I'd specifically look to get cheap, used, and cosmetically challenged. My top learner bike recommendation for years has been the ninja 500, but they're starting to get all used up.

>>28473044
>if you really, REALLY need a bike, eg because you live in some big city and traffic/parking are impossible, get a scooter. and safety gear. and be very, VERY careful of retards.
>and if you decide to ignore my suggestion, definitely avoid a 600cc, definitely avoid a non-scooter at 125cc, and definitely don't buy a turbo busa. i know its tempting, but don't.
What would you suggest if I live in the countryside but need to commute (50 km with 45 km being either 90 km/h country road or 140 km/h motorway) into a big city where parking is impossible?

>>28473083
assuming you're really serious about the parking being impossible bit, i'd suggest a 600-650cc sport touring.
you need more than 125cc on the motorway. and you're really going to appreciate having a fairing and windshield at high speeds. stay away from adv bikes as they're fashionable right now and hence overpriced.
so, sport touring it is. picrel is a list of recent(ish) models you can look for used, courtesy of our future AI overlords.

but really, do think about just getting a car. how bad can the parking be?

>>28472879 (OP)
I started on an SV650s and didn't have any problems. It's not that fast

>>28473110
I already have a car. Driving and parking in the city is getting worse by the year. So, it's coming down to either bike or public transit. Thanks for the list. It helps to know specific models and the general range that I should look at.

Luv me V-Strom 650, which is basically a lifted SV650 with fairings and more comfortable bars. Gets me everywhere, across country on the interstate, down gravel forest roads or through Appalachian hillside. I put significantly taller gearing on mine, which ironically made it more fun as I can wring out the gears more, and it reduces touring RPM.

You'll always want more, or different, or better; that's the human condition. Learn to love and take care of what you do have, and you'll be happy.

The truth is retards that are going to neck themselves on a motorcycle do it whether its a 300cc or 1000cc. For them this may be the differences between life and death.

I'm not a retard and rather safety conscious. I practice drills in parking lots when I get rusty, wear full gear, etc. I started on a 600 with +90 horsepower and have never had a problem.

I'd say if you fall into the former category you should just steer clear from motorcycles entirely

>>28472980
Japanese bikes generally don't shake.
>>28473498
I saw a black VStrom on the highway today while I was being almost blown off of the bike by wind and hating my knees. The guy looked so damn comfortable riding it. I might have to buy a 1000, dbt has won me over.

>>28472879 (OP)
A 125 is more dangerous because it has no passing power for highway speeds

You are GOING to dump your first bike a couple times on weird corners/drop it pushing it/misjudge the stability of how you parked it with the kickstand.
Get a used low displacement bike for cheap to learn on then go on to whatever feels appropriate after that.

Look thousands of stupid Americans start on 800lb piece of shit Harleys and the overwhelming majority of them don't die so you "can" do anything. Honestly if you're bargaining with strangers on the internet about what the fastest bike you're "allowed" to start on is then just go get your Turbobusa and fuck off but it probably won't "last" you very long either.

>>28474100
1050 looks so sex.

>>28472879 (OP)
Sv650 is a monster, get a cb300r or rebel 300. Anything but with abs.

>>28474197
Harleys are slow as shit though. They're basically beginner bikes that are hard to lift when you drop them.

>>28474222
They are also tricky to slow down which is great because they also can't turn at any speed.

>>28474237
OPs bike is a f* rocketship in comparison.
It's odd that people with small pps get agressive when you question their penis extension.

>>28474246
Dumb ESL redditor nobiek

>>28474237
>they also can't turn at any speed
As someone who has taken and passed a police riding course, they absolutely can. Most just lack the confidence to even try.

>>28474253
Found one. :)

>>28474258
30deg of lean angle with low CoG is 30deg of lean angle no matter how you slice it. They can be maneuvered well and don't have the steering limitations a supersport does at low speed but when Joe Dipshit gets himself in a corner deep he's just going to grind floorboards to the scene of the accident.

>>28472918
what bike is this?

>>28472879 (OP)
They are perfect if you have the brains to use their extra grunt not to go very fast indeed, but to ride calm at slightly above normal traffic speeds, instead of revving the guts out of a 250. Having a forgiving torque band lets you focus on roadcraft and awareness rather than on fighting the bike.

>>28472879 (OP)
There's no reason you can't drive a fast bike slow.
I bought a 100hp bike about a month after I got my motorcycle endorsement. Took it slow while I learned and had no problems, never felt unsafe. As long as you trust yourself to be responsible and only carefully push the bike as you get more experience, then you should be fine.

>>28474953
Supersports and superbikes have no purpose other than going fast though

>>28474956
I have an example case of 1. I had a 125 trail bike and a 250cc two stroke race bike. Across town the 125 beat the shit out of the most powerful 250 in the world at that time.
Corner speed counts.

It's complicated. The biggest advantage of something like sv650 is that you can do basically everything you may want to do on the road with it, but we'll get to what smaller bikes may not let you do. The disadvantage is that you are not used to the torque and acceleration something like it has. It will likely scare you a bit and this means that you'll test the limits of it less, slowing down your learning process. A less powerful motorcycle gives you more time to reign it in as you're riding it for obvious reasons.
However let's look on the other side of the isle. We're not talking 125 cc because these are completely outclassed, let's talk about something like the Royal Enfield's 350's. They have about 20 HP, they should be not very intimidating and safe... however, you can take one on a highway but the only vehicles slower than you will be trucks, and as opposed to trucks you are not a giant rectangle, so not being able to get to the speed limit during overtaking said trucks may be dangerous - you don't know if the car behind you isn't driving at the speed limit and doesn't see you because he's answering text on his phone.

I'd say that your floor should be a motorcycle that can get to the legal speed limit on the roads you imagine yourself riding. The ceiling should be as low above the floor as possible, just accept you'll grow out of your first bike.

>>28472955
I FUCKING LOVE THE CB250/CB400
great, great bikes even for today's standards.

>>28472879 (OP)
Literally any bike is fine so long as you're not a retard

However you are still vulnerable to deal accidents, people pulling out on you, merging lanes and not seeing you etc.

The bike isn't dangerous. You are (if you ride like an idiot) and so are others (if they don't see you/make mistakes)

>>28475129
What this anon said.

Cb300r, g310r, duke 390 are good options

>>28472879 (OP)
Honestly, I know a lot of anons means well to star with low displacement bikes but I never saw the appeal to trade up with cc as I go. Why go through 1-2 bikes rather to just get the one you want from the beginning? As long you're not whisky throttling and go slow at the beginning you'll be fine.

I started with a litre bike myself, still haven't dropped it years later

>>28476446
>He said he had been teaching course for 10 years and witnessed 3 people finish the course, hop on a 1000cc bike and die within a week. 1 guy died the same day he finished the course; said the kids family came to the last course day with a "surprise" r1 present and the kid died that day.

>>28476454
Tbf it really isn't different from rich American parents gifting their kids a v8 muscle car or performance package bmw back in the 2000s. I knew 2 people who got life altering injuries from that.

>>28476461
it is EXTREMELY different.
cars have seat belts and crash bars and crumple zones and airbags.
and much better ability to break, too. and the discrepancy is many times higher if we're comparing the braking distance with a noobie rider on the bike, as even bikes with abs still require skill to maximize breaking. which doesn't apply to cars.

mind you, that's not to say that its impossible to kill yourself with a car, or that its a good idea to give a fast sports car to a new driver. im just saying its not even close to being as much of a death warrant as giving a noobie rider an r1.

>>28476466
Cars are more dangerous to others though

>>28476466
One of them is a literal potato now that has to been kept alive by his family since they crashed their hard so bad flying of an exit ramp that they might as well be brain dead.

>>28476481
sucks for the others :)

>>28476466
>seat belts and crash bars and crumple zones and airbags
ATGATT.

>>28476590
all the gear in the world isn't enough to make up one 100th of the difference.

>>28476612
You pay your money and take your chance.
Modern safety enhanced cars are difficult to drive because they have so much mandated safety.

>>28476614
>You pay your money and take your chance.
correct. free country and all that.

>Modern safety enhanced cars are difficult to drive because they have so much mandated safety.
more like annoying and boring
but even an older car without all the baggage is 100s of times safer than any bike.
i'll happily do 100 30mph crashes in an elise before i do one on a bike. any bike. with any amount of gear.

>>28476622
Crashes suck, if the bits between the accidents suck then I'd say live a little. What have you got to lose. :)

>>28476633
>What have you got to lose.
life and limb.

>>28476461
Yes but you have to be both rich and stupid to do that, which is much harder to accomplish than the poor and stupid required to crash a clapped out K1 GSX-R1000 at 170mph.

>>28476446
I disagree. SV650 is something that can be used by first time rider and you can still learn on it, so it's not that big of a deal but the reason why people recommended smaller displacement first is just a proven method of getting better at riding. There's a reason you can almost always find used ducati litres for sale with fuck all mileage for instance, rich fag gets bored, thinks he's smart enough to start from high end sports bike and "decides it's not his thing". For every person like you there will be probably 5 who would scare themselves for life if you gave them a litre bike as their first.
Take the simplest thing ever, clutch. I can drive stick, but how many people don't? A person who's completely new to using it will sometimes slip on it and release it too quickly or keep some gas on while shifting. Whichever you'll do your bike will jank you a bit. If you have too much horsepower under you and you don't expect it you may even end up in the situation where one moment you were on the bike, the other you're behind the bike.
Every such mistake you do on a smaller displacement motorcycle will be just much less painful(both literally and figuratively) and you'll feel more confident dealing with it, this confidence will then result in you riding more and learning how to stop making these basic mistakes. You'll still make mistakes because good technique is learned by exercising it's particular elements on purpose, but something like proper shifting, braking etc. is easier to end when you don't have to be that precise.

I think people are focusing too much on power and not really considering the other downsides of a large displacement bike. They're gonna be bigger and heavier and that just makes everything harder, and if you're behind the bike and struggling to survive the whole time you're not gonna be building skills and enjoying yourself the same way you would on a lighter one that's more forgiving and lets you push yourself and the bike. You're also gonna be way more likely to drop the bigger, heavier bike and it's more likely to end up with expensive damage when it happens.

Also, IMO, almost nobody really knows what they want when they get their first bike, and most people end up getting another one pretty quick, so you may as well just accept that the first bike is gonna be a trainer that you're not gonna keep forever, and then figure out what you actually want as you gain some experience instead of jumping right into a bike that sounded cool before you'd ever twisted a throttle and then realizing it's not the right one for you and being stuck with it or having to take a big financial hit to get anything else.

>>28472879 (OP)

>>28477411
>>28477411
>>28477411

>>28474222
>Harleys are slow as shit though
if youre a fat old man and dont throw a trask kit on it maybe