How is it possible that there's no parks in these massive areas? How the fuck did gateway arch become a national park but nothing in Idaho or the NE?

Idaho is filled with places that could be national parks, but Idahoans are too busy prepping and being neo-nazis.

do you not understand the concept of public land that isn't national parks?

the west is a dry dusty desert, you can't farm most of it, so it ends up getting sold to the feds at a discount and turned into a money-making "national park"

>>2820123
That's not even remotely true for most of the west coast national parks outside of the South west. Not to mention oil companies would love to grab up Theodore NP and a lot of Alaska's

>>2820124
>Not to mention oil companies would love to grab up Theodore NP and a lot of Alaska's
based
we should let them and use the money to buy up a lot more public land in the east where there's stuff actually worth seeing

>>2820126
Do better.

>>2820127
>national park
>you may only enter 9-5
>if you try to enter before or after those hours you will be shot on sight
>oh also its 40 dollars per car, or 10 dollars for a bicycle or pedestrian
>if you are here a minute after 5pm the gates will close and you will be insta-towed and have to pay 6000 dollars to have your car back
>local food vendors? not allowed on national park land unless we get a 30% cut and the food has to be the worst generic goyslop imaginable
I dunno why people worship the most (literally) gatekept environments possible

>>2820122
Good.

>>2820123
>>2820126
Doubling down on your bait won't help you now.

>>2820128
>>you may only enter 9-5
What the fuck are you on about man? You can enter most national parks 24/7 and the ones that make you pay to enter usually let you in for free if you come before peak hours or after evening peak hours.

>>2820133
This is also how you get to the popular parts of places like MRNP without timed entry reservations. If you're arriving much laster than sunrise you're doing it wrong, anyway.

>>2820133
https://thehill.com/homenews/nexstar_media_wire/5217409-planning-to-visit-these-national-parks-you-may-need-to-make-a-reservation-to-get-in/

If you’re planning to visit the Colorado park between May 23 and mid-October, a reservation will be required to get in during certain hours.

There are two timed-entry reservation options. The standard, required between 9 a.m. and 2 p.m., gives you access to the park and the outlying areas but not Bear Lake Road. If you want to visit Bear Lake Road, you’ll want the second timed-entry reservation. This option is required between 5 a.m. and 6 p.m., with re-entry to Bear Lake Road permitted after 2 p.m.

The first option is needed daily between May 23 and Oct. 13, while the second is in effect from May 23 until Oct. 19. Timed-entry reservations to Rocky Mountain are sold in batches, starting on the first of each month for the following month: reservations that become available on May 1 run from May 23 through June, those up on June 1 are for the month of July, and so on through September.

>>2820133
>just wake up before dawn bro

>>2820146
Yes and? You're moving goalposts. The parks are not gated at 9-5. The majority of the parks never gate you in or out. Plenty of people arrive early to be able to get to places before tourists get in. Not to mention not all parks are timed entry. A huge number of the parks even have an active night scene purely because stargazing in them is incredible. I sat out in Yellowstone and Glacier NP until midnight before deciding to head back out without any issues and plenty of other cars were around still as well.

tl;dr: You're a fucking pussy and clearly have never been outdoors if you think anything in your post was real

>>2820121 (OP)
Idaho has portions of national parks and a giant wilderness area but you can't drive cars into it so it can't be a national park.

>>2820148
there's endless red tape with national parks
they suck
not worth all the timing and permitting and fees
not to mention the rules and the people watching you and the inevitable chinese and pajeet tourists

I can just waltz right into a game land or state forest.

Also using timed entry this year is Arches in Utah. From April 1 through July 6, and then again between Aug. 28 and Oct. 31, those driving into the park between 7 a.m. and 4 p.m. will need a timed-entry ticket.

Those who have permits to camp, be in the backcountry, visit Fiery Furnace (which is closed as of late March 25), or for other special uses do not need a timed-entry ticket, according to Arches officials.

Arches releases timed-entry tickets six months before the date of the reservations. In early March, tickets for August reservations became available. If you’re looking to visit Arches in September, your entry tickets will go on sale on April 1. For October visits, reservations become available on May 1. Limited tickets are made available on the day before their designated entry date, starting at 7 a.m. MDT but park officials warn that “these are expected to sell out quickly.”

>>2820154
You're a pussy and a retard. If you think the timed entry for Arches is a big deal then you are legitimately one of the chinese/pajeet tourists you seem to hate. Anyone that actually wants to get out and hike far into the parks is out early before timed entry would even matter. Especially for a fucking place like Arches where you'll be melting under the sun if you're fucking stupid enough to start your hike in the afternoon or mid-day

>>2820154
>i can't arrive at eleven o'clock with all the other tourists and it's not fair
That's rough, man. My heart goes out to you. Please choose life.

>>2820121 (OP)
NH is just like
>long tradition of private land open to the public
>massive tax benefit for leaving land undeveloped
>right to roam or something
it still mostly works but not as much as it used to. People aren't defensive of their land and you really can just go in most of the woods without contacting a property owner or worrying about lot lines, but they build more and more houses so it's more fragmented and less vast expanses of nature.
Common complaint here is that despite very open gun laws, there's nowhere to actually shoot.

>>2820128
>you may only enter 9-5
Are you always this fucking ignorant?

>>2820154
>there's endless red tape with national parks
>memetake
>pay entrance fee, drive in, hike, fish, picnic
What red tape?

>>2820121 (OP)
North carolina has 5 national parks in it alone, you're map is wrong

>>2820323
The map shows National Parks, not all property managed by the National Park System. The NPS manages other things as well, like memorials and historic sites. The only National Park (partially) in North Carolina is Great Smoky Mountains, which is on the map.

>>2820121 (OP)
we have state parks because there is nothing worth being a national park

>>2820121 (OP)
Map is old, they made delaware water gap a national park. Also it's because we have state parks.

>>2820327
incorrect

>>2820353
Idiot.

>>2820123
The land was always the governments since they got it from france/mexico. Nobody sold anything to the feds, it was federal land that was then designated a park or whatever

>>2820121 (OP)
Because becoming a national park is a political process, and that process and the idea of parks has changed overtime since they started. To become a park some place generally needed a few things
>land with some tourist-draw feature
>either still federal land without development or few enough homesteaders theyre easy to bully out
>an impending threat of development or gatekeeping or destruction of the land
>a national interp campaign to get the public to care about the land
>buy in from local business and political interests
>and then for congress to actually do the thing
Parks didnt happen in the east because the east was already settled and developed and whatever natural features that did draw people, like niagara falls, had already been turned into tourist traps
There are plenty of places out west that had campaigns to become parks but never happened, and theres a long history of many of the parks first being national monuments.

Also because there are just more dramatic and stunning features out in the west. For americans in the late 19th into the 20th century, the forested hills of the east were commonplace and tame, but the huge canyons of the west and giant trees and things like geysers and glaciers and petrified wood were all so new and different

>>2820122
Idaho has a ton of "National Wilderness" area (like the Sawtooth, Bitterroot, Frank Church, Hells Canyon, Owyhee, Gospel-Hump, Big Burn, etc). I think it might actually have the most NWA area of any state.

I'll take National wilderness area over national park any day. Absolutely zero development allowed. No roads. No permanent structures. No motorized or mechanized equipment. Nothing with "wheels" (no bikes even). Even trail crews have to use big old crosscut saws to remove deadfalls because chainsaws are banned. Just about the only things that are allowed are hiking, camping, and hunting.

That's basically the difference between a national wilderness and a national park. You can't build roads or visitor centers, but you can hunt. Otherwise the protections are basically the same. I don't hunt, but I think it's a pretty fuckin based arrangement.

Ironically, Idaho actually cares about preserving wild places and not just making them into friendly, accessible "parks" for Chinese tourists and Californians.

>>2820487
>Ironically, Idaho actually cares about preserving wild places
anon any place marked wilderness was already clearcut logged and mined and all that and only became wilderness after they finished taking the things worth taking from the land
wilderness really just means the government is gonna be as lazy as possible - no signs, shitty roads, unmaintained unusable trails etc.

>>2820503
>memetake

>>2820154
Yeah it really sucks being a low IQ nigger who can’t plan ahead.

>there’s people everywhere
Not in the backcountry

>>2820121 (OP)
state parks populate those lands

>>2820487
There is no such thing as a "national wilderness". There is just federal land that has been designated a widlerness area. That federal land can be anything, forest service, BLM, NPS, even fish and wildlife has some I think. Most national parks have wilderness areas within them, often making up the majority of park land outside the road corridors. Wilderness and national parks are not two separate things. And plenty of parks and forests have exceptions built into their founding documents that allows them to use some speicific machinery in wilderness areas. For example trail crews in Sierra Nevada national parks and forests are allowed to use chainsaws in wilderness

>>2820503
>any place marked wilderness was already clearcut logged
A lot of the designated wilderness out West is places that were too inaccessible and too difficult to log

>>2820503
There are no roads in wilderness by definition, how could they be shitty?

>>2820503
>unmaintained unusable trails
>i've never actually been /out but I pretend I know on the internet
idiot.

Should probably look up the Adirondack park….

>>2820122
lol I recently looked at stats that showed 20% of kids in Idahoan schools were hispanic and there's towns where real estate prices increased by 380% in the last decade due to californians

>>2820596
>pa
>state parks are free
>ny
>state parks (good ones) all cost 10 dollars to enter
reeeee

>>2820596

>>2820611
$10 is a reasonable charge for the better state parks like Letchworth, Watkins Glen, Treman, Chimney Bluffs, etc. and you can get in free if you know when and where to go.

>>2820610
There’s really nowhere left to go, fucking hell

>>2820624
It's also littered with small towns and homes throughout.

>>2820697
I was recently looking at homes in a 9k "city" in North Idaho and a pretty standard family home had a graph with its price history: in the last 10 years it went from 250k to 600k. It was built in 1985 and in 2018 rent was 1.5k. 9k town, not downtown or anything like that. In 2020 the median income in there was 46k, so I wonder if this inflation is all californians. I looked at some pictures from local schools and there were a bunch of blacks and asians.

>>2820121 (OP)
humble yourself and walk through some tallgrass prairie reserves, it's not Yosemite but still wild

>>2820121 (OP)
>no parks!
Retard. That's a map of NATIONAL parks. It does NOT include state parks, county parks, private parks.
Go be a disingenuous faggot somewhere else.

>>2820697
That's by design.

>>2820122
>Idahoans are too busy prepping and being neo-nazis.
Shit, they sound like great people.

>>2820935
The cheapest home in Irwin, Idaho (population 259) is 375k. The most recent data for average income is from 2000 and sits at 31k.

>>2821091
The number of non-whites is increasing fast, people are having to move out of places where their families have lived for generations because they can no longer afford it and meanwhile the government in Boise is discussing the display of LGBT flags.
Let me also remind you that Patriot Front people were arrested without any formal justification in Coeur d'Alene (which is now divided between lakeside property for millionaires and California type urban sprawl full of non-whites further north). Sandpoint also had some tranny event on the park.

Anons really think Idaho in 2025 is like the Montana Uncle Ted moved to back then.

>>2821116
>Anons really think Idaho in 2025 is like the Montana Uncle Ted moved to back then.
So..are there any states are still like Ted’s Montana?

>>2821116
>arrested without any formal justification
lol. and you wonder people think you are all retards.

>>2821813

>>2820146
>just wake up before dawn bro
know how i know you're a faggot who doesn't go outside?

>>2821813
Yeah, there absolutely are. I briefly lived in one.

>>2820548
Have you ever hiked in idaho? They barely maintain any of the trails other than a few that are highly trafficked. The main usage of wild areas in idaho is by boomers on their 50k off road golf carts.The USFS trail maps have not been updated since 2016 and even then I imagine a ton of the trails on those maps were already completely overgrown and unmaintained. I don't mind mostly cause if I know a trail in unmaintained it means I am probably not going to see anyone and it is more of an adventure but hiking through the many many burns of idaho wilderness areas is pretty miserable when they have not been maintained. No shade and 1000s of downed trees everywhere. It was really ambitious of the forest service back in the day to cut so many trails into the wild areas of the country then to only let them all go to shit. It is cool being on some long disused trail you can barely distinguish and coming upon the remains of old trailwork water bars or bridges or stone work.

>>2821813
>Ted’s Montana?
You can still put a cabin in the woods and be a murderous retard in Montana

>>2820503
>no roads
>mined and logged
are you retarded?

>>2821851
anon they used to have logging/skid roads/railroads crisscrossing every single wilderness in the east before it was wilderness, supposedly parts of linville gorge didn't get logged due to the steepness, but for the most part, every single holler and gorge got tree-raped, and they were hooked up to ropes to do it.
There's no DRIVEABLE roads nowadays through most wildernesses, but most trails through a wilderness are just the old logging roads repurposed for foot travel.

>>2821843
USGS maps haven't been updated since 1989 the last time they did the land survey irl. Now they get "digitally updated" which means nothing because they aren't checking if the paths/roads on the map still exist or where they actually go.

>>2821871
>There's no DRIVEABLE roads nowadays through most wildernesses
In the rockies, the mnts are littered with old logging roads. They are closed to cars- but you can atv, sled, ski, bike, hike on them to your hearts content. Its primo out.

>>2821884
I mean, there's old logging roads everywhere in the mountains in the east, but the condition widely varies as to whether you can actually get through them. If they were not maintained at all they just turn into bogs, and, at higher elevation can form fens where the mud is knee deep or more. I've walked through plenty of logging roads where there was absolutely no escaping slogging through mud for hours. Also, some of them are just totally blocked off by deadfall at this point, or trees started growing in them if they weren't really used as paths after the logging days.

The original point though, was not about the roads existing, but that all the trees were stolen prior to designating the land wilderness, and in the east, the land generally burned down a few times over from all the tinder and lack of trees to prevent fire - so it isn't really preserving it, it's more just "we took all the profitable stuff so we are gonna sell it to the government now"

>>2820610
I can’t express the extent to which I loathe the coastal scum converging on the last unspoiled parts of America.

It’s not fair that AIDS didn’t kill them all.

>>2821917
Wait but I though AIDS is just a conspiracy and the virus isn't real cuz it doesn't satisfy Koch's postulates and yadda yadda, so it IS in fact real?

>>2821884
These are not wilderness then. Wilderness, by definition, has no roads of any kind or any motorized use

>>2821892
>all the trees were stolen prior to designating the land wilderness
not out west. a lot of the places that have been designated "wilderness" (as opposed to just regular national forest) were too remote and inaccessible to be logged which is why they just made it wilderness.

>>2821944
some places did have some logging prior to being designated wilderness and you can still find some old logging roads.

>>2820121 (OP)
The obsession with national park designation is weird for most peoples' purposes. Huge state parks, national monuments, national forests, national recreation areas etc aren't really different for outdoors shit. I guess if you want to drive to something beautiful and look at an informational plaque or sign of some sort, then it matters. But I never found myself particularly assblasted about Baxter, Adirondaks, Presidential Range, Pisgah, New Mexico Rockies, Mongollon Rim, Oregon Coast, and most of the AZ-UT lacking NP status.

>>2820128
stupid people just refuse to stop posting here

I was about to move to ND a short while ago because it seemed to be free of the issues that plague most of the country plus good outdoors (not like Montana or Idaho but those are ruined now). Is ND on the way out as well? Anyone from there care to chime in? I keep hearing about a growing hispanic population, in Fargo there's somalis, in Grand Forks I saw a mosque across the street from an elementary school, people like Oleary hyping it...
At this rate all that will be left is some Mars looking badlands in WY.

>>2822016
>those are ruined now
imagine believing this. how fucking retarded you must be.

>>2822010
Missed the point

>>2822022
Buddy I'm not moving to ID or MT to be surrounded by a bunch of dweebs from CA/Portland/Seattle, I want a local community with a small town vibe and not a bunch of transplants with a generic amerimutt culture, and that's not talking about real estate inflation. Many of those who are actually from there are having to move out because they can't afford it anymore.
>inb4 you're an outsider too
The only reason I'm looking into moving is because my own hometown was destroyed by similar outsiders, I never wanted to move out but now there's nothing here for me anymore. All I want is a white place with its own culture that isn't flooded with city rats, spics or niggers. I considered small towns in Europe for a while since ideally I'd be around people with a similar ancestry as mine but Europe is fucked if you care about freedom and the outdoors.

>>2821820
> But after a year and a half of delays, lost evidence and failures of prosecutors to follow court orders, he said he didn’t have a choice.
""""""LOST EVIDENCE""""""""
How gullible must you be to believe this bullshit? For fucks sake that there was even a gay parade in CDA to begin with is testament to how the place has changed, and then the goddamn SPLC and the jew who wrote this piece whine about muh diversity. IF YOU WANT "DIVERSITY" STICK TO FUCKING PORTLAND
https://idahocapitalsun.com/2024/02/12/how-north-idaho-prosecutors-lost-the-case-against-patriot-fronts-white-nationalist-leader/

>>2820611
>10$
>you can just walk in it's suggested
oops.

>>2822016
You want Nebraska it's like ND and montana and idaho but not filled with retards just weirdos

>>2822074
>I want a local community witha small town vibe
Then fuck off and stay where you are loser we're full.

>>2822077
>but not filled with retards just weirdos
Care to elaborate?

>>2822079
Self explanatory.

>>2822016
I’ve looked at SD but that’s getting slowly but surely flooded as well. There are no bastions left

>>2822074
>MT to be surrounded by a bunch
>cucked by his own ignorance
its the 4th largest state. there is barely a million people in it. you're not gonna be surrounded by much of anything.

>>2822084
It depends on who you consider retards and weirdos.

>>2822077
>Nebraska
>outdoors

>>2820121 (OP)
Oak Ridge Prairie Park of Griffith IN is wonderfully underrated, particularly in the seasonal extremes of August and January. The best part of it is like a long private drive through some primordial, ordinary, lowland scene. With the heat or air conditioning maxed in your nearby parked car, it often feels like landing on another world.

>>2822154
I've done entire /out/ vacations to Nebraska. It's great because nobody else is there. Just get a local to tell you where the good spots are. Also from western Nebraska, the Rockies aren't that far for a weekend trip.

>>2820121 (OP)
There’s plenty of conservation areas in those places just not national parks per se but there’s national forests, state parks, other conservation lands, etc.

>>2822190
I live in northern IL, It's about 6:40 AM, and the sun is about 8 degrees above the horizon, but weirdly orange,.the whole sky strange in its domelike mistiness, due to the enormous fires in Canada.

>>2822196
Almost an hour later, the sun about 1000K lower in look than usual. like Tau Ceti, or Asimov's Aurora. Delightful in look, horrifying in implication.

>>2822196
FIB spotted

I saw the Great Plains for the first time over the recent Memorial Day weekend and I have to say, they're one of the most amazing /out/ locations I've ever seen. Seeing them for the first time is up there with seeing Saguaro National Park or taking a fan boat out into the Everglades for the first time.

>>2822228
Oops, meant for >>2822190

>>2820128
>went to state park recently
>they threatened 8-4 or else will be blood
>arrive at 9pm because I'm an idiot that loves setting his tent up in the fucking dark
>the sigils on the wall tell of death that come to those who don't pay in full
>I booked online but fucked up the number of people coming
>I give a thumbs up on the sacred piece of paper to tell them that "loli paid"
>go into the office the next day; it was a complete shitshow thanks to gub'ment making a skeleton crew even more spoopy
>after a couple rounds of talking about friends who will come later that morning, I get $10 back be cause they're bad at math
>mfw I could have camped for free and I'm sure they wouldn't have noticed

>>2820121 (OP)
in idaho there is the frank church - river of no return wilderness that has some of the last untouched (by euros) land in the lower 48
beautiful and like other anons have said most of it is virtually unmaintained and primitive to allow for certain ecosystems to thrive- i would hate to see another nat'l park here besides that thin strip of yellowstone that we have lol
hopefully mr trump doesnt downsize it for cobalt mining rip
there is also craters of the moon in south central idaho which is a big lava field that erupted as recently as like 2k years ago- just a nat'l monument so not as slopped up like a true nat'l park
shove all tourists into yosemite for containment????

>>2822369
>shove all tourists into yosemite for containment
Maybe that worked twenty years ago, but it doesn't work now. If you have anything on the national park list, there will be swarms of tourists there to see it.

>>2822369
I would be more worried about coastal fags, they are there year round unlike tourists

>>2820121 (OP)
>or the NE
there are hundreds of state parks in Vermont, Massachusetts, and New Hampshire, just no national parks

>>2822077
>it's like ND and montana and idaho