>outsourcing is bad!
i own a small accounting firm.

market rate on a first year staff is $60k salary and another $30k in fringe benefits. staff never stick around because they want a 10% raise every year and a promotion every 2 years -- with WFH days, and in spite of being clueless and making mistakes and lying about studying for the CPA exam.

meanwhile i can contract a CPA/ACCA indian through an outsourcing firm for $20k all-in, who will happily accept a 3% raise and no promotion. as a bonus, his work is generally higher quality and requires fewer review notes.

so tell me, why is this a bad thing?

>>507232913 (OP)
skill issue, on your end

>>507232913 (OP)
>so tell me, why is this a bad thing?
Because you are putting temporary profit before your countrymen and country as a whole. Accounting literally creates no wealth so you are basically parasiting without providing anything in return for the country

>>507233043
i made $386k last year.
>>507233245
this country has never once made my life easier. and i disagree with your assessment of my work.

>>507232913 (OP)
>small accounting firm
Because you are a small little shit "firm", probably working out of your basement that pumps out bookkeeping and personal tax returns for 80 year olds.
With you, there is essentially no engagements of value that would result in juniors learning and progressing their own careers. You truly are retarded to think your "firm" offers anything of value to young accountants, the only applicants to your "firm" are bottom of the barrel.

>>507233597
see >>507233569. i did 3 years in B4 tax before going to a small firm and eventually starting my own firm. small firm is better unless you want to be a slave to a corporation making $150k max.

>>507232913 (OP)
>I can't make money without betraying my country
Be poor then.

>>507232913 (OP)
you’re probably autistic and incapable of empathy so who cares really

>>507233569
>i made $386k last year.
>this country has never once made my life easier.
kek use capital letters and proper punctuation nerd, you're out of your element here

>>507232913 (OP)
Outsourcing is bad.
>I want to benefit from all of the upsides of the security and opportunity market access here provides
>but I want to fuck over Americans and hire Pajeets instead


Then go to India and start your business there, I’m sure they have more pajeets than you could ever dream of.

>his work is generally higher quality and requires fewer review notes
Who do you think you’re fooling. For what it’s worth, if I engaged a CPA to do my taxes and then I found out I was being reviewed by an Indian in India, I would drop them immediately.

How much do you work by the way? It sounds like you run your business like a plantation you fucking leach.

>>507233569
> this country has never once made my life easier.

Then go run your business in israel or India. Nobody cares jew

>>507234249
this isn't a client communication. i don't need to capitalize anything.

>>507233917
Any fucking idiot CPA can grind out $400k in their little shitty firm if you accept every shitty engagement that comes through your door. An $800k book at 50% margin is nothing unusual even up here in my shithole country.
I'm saying the work you do is garbage content, grinding bookkeeping and compilations - none of which is interesting to juniors who want to progress their careers. You have no brand name, you have no connections, you are a small fry little shit. No junior with potential would ever chain themselves to your shitty little garbage firm.

>>507234361
Why don't you invest in your employees?

>>507234321
i review their work. you might want to read your preparer's form 7216. they probably already outsource to india.

>>507232913 (OP)
just say you want slaves that work for nothing, it's ok. schlomo

>>507234536
my orphan w2 rate is $500. my business is like 70% business returns/bookkeeping and 30% orphan w2.

>>507232913 (OP)
Your neighbors will become poor, rob you, and piss in your cereal.

>his work is generally higher quality and requires fewer review notes
Off the rails. You're either Indian yourself or you've never worked with them

>>507234609
not slaves, just hard workers.

>>507234769
No junior wants to grind that shit work, so you get shit applicants.

>before going to a small firm and eventually starting my own firm
Code for you got bounced out because no one liked you and/or you committed a grievous sin like sexually harassing someone and your old firm swept it under the rug to maintain their reputation. If you were worth a shit, you'd have gotten partnership at your old firm and you'd be clearing $1M+ right now but instead you work in your basement and blame juniors.

>>507235087
anon partnership at B4 these days takes 15 years assuming you aren't given non equity partner or permanent director cope prizes. small firm partnership is useless as private equity buyouts become more common and dilute equity partnership. you sound clueless.

>>507235337
>small firm partnership is useless
Hahaha bitter grapes, you definitely got bounced and now you're all "I'll show them!"
Yea it totally sucks being bought out, it total sucks getting that multi-million $ check, grind out a few years at 90% of what you used to make, and then retire into the sunset.
Who benefits from equity buyouts again? Gasp, could it be the partners? No waaayyyyy, good thing you dodged that bullet.

>>507236434
>Who benefits from equity buyouts again? Gasp, could it be the partners? No waaayyyyy, good thing you dodged that bullet.
you might want to ask your senior to re-explain how partnership structures work. if your piece of the pie shrinks because you gave a piece of the pie to a PE firm, you aren't coming out ahead.

>>507236434
>>507237139
also in the more egregious cases where PE obtains majority ownership, partners are converted from K1 to W2 employees which is very bad for a number of reasons.

It's not that outsourcing is bad, it's that we have become so reliant on it that we can't do things ourselves anymore.

>>507232913 (OP)
>meanwhile i can contract a CPA/ACCA indian through an outsourcing firm for $20k all-in, who will happily accept a 3% raise and no promotion. as a bonus, his work is generally higher quality and requires fewer review notes.
Oh bullshit. I worked big 4 and our Indian outsourcing sucked ass. The interns and first years were better. I had the same experience with internal audit which had an India team also

>>507232913 (OP)
>why is this a bad thing?
if people find out you'll lose business

>>507232913 (OP)
Are you public or private? First year staff start at $65k because they don't get a raise until they complete the CPA exam. That's why kids flock to private because they get way higher wages without doing a completely useless masters + slave-tier hours for an extremely hard exam. I have never met an accounting "firm" employee without a CPA who is breaking 75k, which in some cities is barely above livable. To even break 70 they want you there for at least 4 years with 0 life for literally half the year.

>Indians have less review notes
Fucking lol. Let me guess, you take the same clients in the same industry and the Indian s/o with "SALY". Or are you actually doing recalcs that require some level of complexity, which a first year has to be trained for? First years get thrown in the water and told to swim, literally figuring out everything on their own while the partners fuck off and staff is drowning. Be a better accountant and trains your first years. This is why public is a joke.

>>507232913 (OP)
Employees should be getting a share of the company’s profits, not your exploitative wages.

>>507232913 (OP)
are you looking around? the cost of living, rent, car ownership is 10x higher in a shit hole like india. of course their will be cheaper labor in a 3rd world hellhole.

by using foreign labor you are playing a part of the AI cultivation (if it can be done cheaper by any means necessary it will be done)

accountant jobs are mostly going automated anyway you'll be out of a job in 10 years. save up for early retirement

>>507238278
Parasites like him are easily dealt with; just simplify and fully digitalise the tax system, make tax records public and replace bureaucracy with e governance. All the parasites will lose their hosts overnight and drop like flies without any useful skills.

>>507239874
>public or private
public tax, obviously.
> accountant jobs are mostly going automated anyway you'll be out of a job in 10 years. save up for early retirement
you couldn't be more wrong. kek. you're really going to trust an "AI"'s calculation of your tax liability? what if you are overpaying? you're not going to pay someone to check it? also how is an "AI" going to turn a shoebox of receipts into a schedule A? how about for a schedule C? what if your "business" bank accounts are mixed use like most small business dipshits do?

>>507240730
>just simplify and fully digitalise the tax system
big boy tax preparers (intuit) lobby congress to prevent this. trump plans on killing IRS direct file.
> and replace bureaucracy with e governance.
complex tax laws are a feature not a bug. it all exists to put a massive burden on w2 wagies and allow for """"loopholes"""" (as the layman would call them) for people with stakes in small and large businesses.

>>507240289
>accountant jobs are mostly going automated anyway you'll be out of a job in 10 years. save up for early retirement
This is the alternative scenario. If the government won’t simplify taxation and fully implement transparency and e governance, the status quo will continue with the difference that OP and other parasites will be replaced by automation.

>>507237139
>if your piece of the pie shrinks because you gave a piece of the pie to a PE firm, you aren't coming out ahead.
Are you a fucking idiot? Why would anyone sell their practice if the seller didn't come out ahead? Is PE forcing the partners to sell at gunpoint? Are they partners selling their practices for $1?
I will lay it out for you - Selling to PE is so that the owners (i.e. partners) crystalize the gain on the value of their practice upfront, rather than going through a sale process immediately prior to their retirement, which can result in all sorts of complications, e.g. general risk mitigation, potential forced retirement due to illness, credit risk on buyout, finding an appropriate successor (not the partner's problem any more, it's PE's burden now). And on top of that PE is paying around a 25% premium over going market rates versus a traditional type sale, or at least that was the premium a few years ago.
Then there is earnout component and non-compete clauses to ensure the partners stick around for x number of years and keep the practice functioning. Yes the partners earn less for the years subsequent to sale to service PE's cut, but they get millions of cash upfront when the PE buyout occurs. Partners can dump those millions in a fucking GIC and basically come out equal versus the cut PE takes if you go year-by-year.
You dumb shit, how would you even know, you weren't a partner at a firm, you're a basement sweatshop loser. If you were worth a shit, you'd be a partner at your old firm, or you would have teamed up with one of your former colleagues but oh no, no one likes you and/or everyone knows you are incompetent. I lean towards you being incompetent because you don't even understand the simple reason why partners sell to PE. Fucking dolt, you should be ashamed.

>>507241072
TCJA "bonus depreciation" is being brought back. how is an "AI" going to ensure your assets, based on your input as a layman, are eligible for bonus depreciation? if you're wrong you get assraped with penalties and fees. if you're right you get a massive reduction in your tax bill. do you know how to answer this question and be 100% right, considering bonus depreciation is a red flag for an audit?

>>507232913 (OP)
Because it's bad for the counrty, shlomo.
It's good for you.

>>507233569
Disagree all you like but the results of your faggotry can be seen across the country.

Give a base salary +commission. That's basically the only way for a small business that requires skilled professionals to grow and stay competetive. Then when you're ready to retire you could likely sell your business to one of your long term employees. That's how I bought my hardscaping business and that's how I'm continuing to run it. Laborers make an hourly rate comparable to the rest of the industry and my foremen get a base salary I can afford plus 15% commission on all contracts they land. I maintain the buisness and pocket 5% plus the full commission on all jobs I work as the foreman on. I clear about $250k/yr and my foremen clear between $170k and $200k/yr. If a foreman can't scout work or run a job they make basically nothing and they either quit or I fire them.

>>507241338
partnership is a totem pole. new partners at at the bottom. senior partners and retired partners (who collect a $300k/year retirement until they die) are at the very top. senior partners have more shares in the partnership. they sell out the partnership to a PE firm in exchange for cash. they don't care about future cash flows (receiving a smaller share of the pie) and the demands a PE majority owner will put on junior partners and non-partners (treating them like wagies or actually converting them from k1 partner to w2 wagies) because they secured their retirement and will be dead within 20 years.

similar things are occurring in private practice dental and physician groups.

>>507240996
I‘m not just talking about income taxation but about every single tax and every single regulation. Total transparency would remove a plethora of parasites by eliminating their superior knowledge of the system. I doubt that it would happen in America, your shithole is too unequal for that. But there are more than 150 other countries on Earth, and if only one them adapts such massively efficient system of public governance, you’ll simply either have to adapt or fall even further behind as a primitive shithole.

>>507232913 (OP)
no. the time for talk is over. you belong in a death camp.

>>507233569
no you didn't.

Why do people go on /pol/ and tell lies?

>>507241363
>but what if premise A of my shitty system leads to X?
You’re history. China or some other Asian high tech country won’t give a single fuck about the mud huts you call system of public governance.

If I knew my accountant was sending my SSN and payroll information to shitindia I would come to your office and rape you.

>>507232913 (OP)
what do people do in accounting?

>>507241987
im a CPA with a decade of experience and my firm offers a mix of personal income tax and business income tax services. >>507234769 i could have made this much (at the cost of working 80 hours a week for 4 months) running a w2 mill.

not everyone on /pol/ is a retarded failure. next time you get your taxes done, assuming you dont go to some H&R Block bullshit, ask your accountant how much his business grosses a year. you will be surprised.

>>507242175
go read the form 7216 you signed. he's probably already sending it to india.

>>507233569
>i made $386k last year
Let me guess, you need more.

>>507242503
5 more years and i plan on taking a pay cut, winding it down to stuff i can do fully remote, and retiring to another country.

>>507242287
Take the blame when the fraud all comes crashing down

>>507232913 (OP)
you also own a small personality

>>507232913 (OP)
You're sucking up money from the immediate local economy and sending it outside the economy which leads to the problems you're bitching about what with the local normies asking for fair compensation.

The reality is because of assholes like you what they are asking for IS fair compensation because of what that kind of abuse has done to operational standards. Surely you aren't so fucking retarded you can't see that?

>>507241702
>partnership is a totem pole.
Big4 yes in the context you are implying, normal small firms not necessarily, in fact unlikely. Small partnerships are valued based on gross billings and realized margin, not seniority nor years of service.
The "retirement" you stated in small firms is simply the retired partner selling their practice to an internal successor, rather than to some rando on the street, again based on gross billings/margin, NOT seniority.
All that has nothing to do with your orginal retarded assertion that "partners do not come out ahead when selling", of course they do you moron.
Again, you were never a partner, you have never signed a partnership agreement, you have never held equity in a partnership. Quit talking out your ass and go churn some w2s with rajeesh.

>>507232913 (OP)
>his work is generally higher quality
Your story was believable up to this point, but you just couldn't help yourself.

>>507232913 (OP)
>i can contract a CPA/ACCA indian
With a fake cert.
>for 20k
You get what you pay for.

When he fucks up and you owe millions, don't bitch and cry about it, fucking moron.

>>507242107
glad to see that some of the chink spies in canada are finally being kicked out and sent home to shitholes like germany

>>507243728
He's a washout who couldn't hack it in a real firm, a loser who even accountants don't like, so now he churns garbage work in his basement for minorities who are washing their cash.

>>507232913 (OP)
>>507242795
good thread. its nice to have a reasonable OP who knows what he's talking about and isnt just making another gay larp. you are a fag btw, enjoy the smell of curry, retard, your business will fail catastrophically under the weight of indians and you will forever wonder where you went wrong

>>507232913 (OP)
>so tell me, why is this a bad thing?

So then do it. What is stopping you?

>>507232913 (OP)
>as a bonus, his work is generally higher quality
this is massive cope lol.

as other have said, by outsourcing you are sending USD outside of the US economy which is a net negative for this country. if you cant afford to pay good people what they demand you need to charge more for services so you can. and if you cant do that then your business shouldnt exist in the US since its clearly not a viable economic model.

>>507232913 (OP)
>so tell me, why is this a bad thing?
It isn't, you know how the economy works
The problem is, the vast majority of people, even in advanced, industrialized countries, are basically 16th century French peasants with a HS diploma or a GED and think "the economy" is a like a giant pie that will eventually run out if they don't get a slice

>>507243916
you're lucky OP is so disgusting otherwise i'd have point out that you are a brown college dropout

>>507243366
my assertion was junior partners do not come out ahead when selling to private equity firms. some of these $500 w2s i can crank out in 30 minutes. that's $1000 an hour less a negligible overhead. how many hours do you plan on working per week when you maybe make partner (and pay the $300k buy in) 18 years from now? maybe 65 hours a week? kek.

>>507232913 (OP)
>i can contract a CPA/ACCA indian through an outsourcing firm for $20k all-in, who will happily accept a 3% raise and no promotion. as a bonus, his work is generally higher quality and requires fewer review notes.
>
>so tell me, why is this a bad thing?
You can do this today. In a few years the same Indian is going to want a 20% increase each year, which is going to be 50% for you because it is outsourced. When that happens you will find you don't have the staff to bring it back in house.

>>507233569
You made that much, yet this is where you still choose to spend your time?

>>507233043
This

>>507244126
Holy shit
XD
>by outsourcing you are sending USD outside of the US economy which is a net negative for this country
>>507244161
>the vast majority of people, even in advanced, industrialized countries, are basically 16th century French peasants with a HS diploma or a GED and think "the economy" is a like a giant pie that will eventually run out if they don't get a slice
Buddy
I can't even
It was literally the post before mine
Holy shit
>

>>507234937
You want slaves that aren't called slaves, gotcha

>>507244126
ive had the same guy for the past 3 tax seasons. he has 10 years experience doing US tax returns and he costs $20k a year.

And what will you do when a jeet fucks up a customers taxes and sues you into oblivion?

>>507244354
yes. tax/acccounting has always been a chud profession. not sure where /pol/ got the "only jews do it" thing from.

>>507234937
>No bro! These aren't slaves, they're indentured servants!

>>507244685
i review their work, the guy i've been using most recently has >>507244586 a lot of experience, and i have a $1M E&O inusrance policy.

>>507244713
Is Accounting a good field? I might go for a BS Accounting degree from WGU (my company has tuition reimbursement, so I would be getting a free BS degree), then go for 4/4 on the CPA exams while working full time...I'm currently in medical manufacturing as a technician working nights...so plenty of time after work to study. Also for CPA review, is Ninja CPA any good?

>>507244925
It only takes once to ruin a business. Hope it works out for you :)

>>507245313
>It only takes once to ruin a business.
no it doesn't. that's not true in accounting, it's not true in the legal profession, it's not true in private practice dentistry/medicine. it's not true in any business, really.
>>507245246
yes it's a good profession still, at least in small firm tax. i got my CPA like 7 years ago and used becker. a friend's son told me good things about ninja, apparently its much cheaper.

>>507232913 (OP)
>lying about studying for the CPA exam
Why would they lie about this? Is studying for the CPA really that big of a pain?

>>507233569
>i made $386k last year.
>he costs $20k a year.
>wont pay US employee $90k
here's the real problem. you aren't providing enough value to earn $386k and your business doesn't have high enough margins to sustain your economic model. you have too much competition and the market doesn't pay enough for your services, this is why you cant hire US employees. you could make $200k and pay 2 US employees generously.

I own an 8 figure firm, mainly because I know how to build and scale a sales organization. CPA firms are laughable in this department; we completely dominated a niche in under 6 months through a combination of inbound and outbound marketing and started with a good closing orientated sales team.

We do everything from low level bookkeeping for $500/mo to cost seg to R&D credits, crypto audits, forensic engagements and apportionment studies.

Everyone equating compensation with quality is wrong. Paying a 1st or 3rd year $80k vs a Saaar $9/hr gets you all roughly the same quality of work. Most people are unteachable / won't care and are only there for a paycheck.

Like most things in the world, its the middle managers making $150k-$200k that perform the final reviews that make or break the business. From an execution standpoint they are by far the most important. Stack them with a handful of visionaries who really understand the tax code and will take risks/have a good sales game and its gg.

The amount of cope in this thread is laughable. We will all eventually get replaced with Indians, it was inevitable the second high speed internet became available. The one tool you have to your advantage is literally infinite knowledge at your figure. If you can't build a $1MM business with GPT 4.5 at your disposable you are either dumber than the Indians you claim to be superior to or are just plain lazy. Clocks ticking either way. There will be no office jobs in the United States 10 years from now.

>>507232913 (OP)
Honestly, you should be hanged. You don't get to live off the fat of a first world country while exploiting shithole third world labor for your own gain. You take, but you don't give back. You are like a nigger.

>>507244713
Why would somebody as valuable as yourself spend your more valuable time here?

>>507246375
>There will be no office jobs in the United States 10 years from now
How is this even a realistic scenario? Do you really think the people in this country will just be okay with having no livelihood?

Outsourcers need to be deported to the third world so they can live with their pets. If you don't want to contribute to a developed world society, then you should be excluded from it. NO FREE LUNCH.

>>507234937
>not slaves, just hard workers.
(You) either pay most people a livable wage that gives them at least a dignified middle class life for their time period or society ceases to exist as most people stop giving a fuck about anything except being gangbangers with other gangbangers that give at least one iota of a fuck about each other as they build their empires out of respect.
Your ass is grass and (You) don't even know it yet. When this economy inevitably resets nobody worth a fuck will trust (You).

>>507246683
Think about it this way. You start a company there in the USA. Sole proprietor. You then hire on, say 20 people. And these people are from varying other countries. Maybe 4 of them are Americans to do business there and choreograph with the other workers. So 5/20 Americans, vs 15/20 non Americans. Are you still an American company?

>>507244483
>employee lives in india
>gets paid
>spend money in indian economy
vs
>employee lives in USA
>gets paid
>spend money in USA economy
theres literally no way the jeet getting paid is supporting the US economy. you cannot argue this. its taking money out of US and sending it to India, its not returning to US as spending. you can spew all the retarded word vomit you want but its simple and undeniable.
>inb4: google subscriptions, microsoft excel, etc.

>>507232913 (OP)
>so tell me, why is this a bad thing?
For you it's not bad because you are reducing overhead. For us it's bad because well paying jobs are being shipped overseas, which increases competition for the jobs that are still in America, which also enables employers to get away with paying low wages...in other words, a race to the bottom. Point is...the answer to your question depends on who you ask. In that past, I would state that you should support your countrymen; however, after witnessing how the general public is really like, I say just do your thing...America is no longer a country but an economic zone where every man is an island.

>>507246683
where was your tv made? your cellphone? what about most of the components in your car? you have been benefiting from third world labor for your entire life.

>>507246375
So. If the anons here on 4chan /pol/ were as successful as you claim to be. They'd still end up spending their time here as you do now, as they do now?

>>507247203
Of course not. These companies/employers are parasites. They benefit from first world infrastructure, legal systems and institutions but the negative externalities of their hiring practices is directly destroying the golden goose. They are like fishermen who overfish until there is nothing left.

>>507247520
he's going to confirm exactly what i told you: tax/accounting is a chud profession. it's no different than STEM. in fact, my bachelors degree was in applied math.

>>507247520
I don't really understand the notion that successful people don't/can't post on 4chan...4chan is the embodiment of free speech...there really aren't that many options left on the internet for free speech without having to worry about getting cancelled.

>>507247483
Nigger, you want to send every single job to the third world. There is s point where we are just going to hang you.

>>507232913 (OP)
I only hire white men for my electrical company, they work hard and they shower everyday as far as I can tell. I would close my doors and live on the street before I hired a stinking shitskin.
You absolute faggot.

>>507247758
You are the company you keep. Surely someone as capable as yourself must understand that, right?

>>507246843
I don't have a good answer for you. I can only share my personal experience - top 10% of performers make 90% of a company work. Everyone else is useless fat. It is the same way on the sales side which has massive turnover. Perhaps its the way its always been and Fortune 500 companies can simply cope with useless eaters. World is moving faster than ever and it will only continue to accelerate.

Like the guy in this thread asking questions about bonus depreciation; all of that shit will eventually be phased out by AI (Corvee Tax Planning is already OK at this; in 5 years it will definitely be able to do a full cost seg)

>>507247483
and it needs to stop. eternal third-world slave labor can't keep the world going forever

Short termism is ruining everything. Sending all labor and institutional knowledge out of the country will inevitable kill that country.

>>507247886
I only use White plumbers and electricians. This idea that Mexicans are keeping trades afloat is comical.

>>507247930
>Like the guy in this thread asking questions about bonus depreciation; all of that shit will eventually be phased out by AI (Corvee Tax Planning is already OK at this; in 5 years it will definitely be able to do a full cost seg)

i really doubt that. i had a salesfag demo Blue J for me. it looked nice but the cracks in its foundation were visible, and this is just dead simple research -- not applying the code to transactions. contrary to what the hook nosed charlatans want you to believe, advancing LLMs to the "final frontier" of learning isn't just a matter of throwing more computing resources at it.

Also, btw OP. You're already completely convinced in what you think is the right thing to do. Do you think a capable and intelligent person would come here to 4chan /pol/ to get clarity on their business decisions? What is the point of asking the anons here for their opinion? Are you looking for /pol/ to convince you? You already believe it to be the right thing to do. Why are you not already doing it?

>>507232913 (OP)
train me from the ground up and let me work from home (since im in a remote area) and ill work for 40k a year. i don't even need the benefits.

>>507248393
Perhaps my salesmenship is on display and you are correct. Those AI generated presentations have made debt a legit viable product to sell to non profits though. Even brain dead idiots are bringing in good commission.

>>507247520
Yeah I guess? I can do whatever I want whenever I want and started with nothing. Its pretty great man. This place is still the epic-center of lulz since i can has cheezburger

Smells like jeet in here

>>507249140
You might be on to it

>>507249140
It's 100% a jeet. I don't know of ANY American who fully supports outsourcing. I even know CEOs who say "I wish we could do it here but if we don't then our competitors will put us under". Everyone knows it's fucked and the government should do something about it, but the finance asshats like OP are the ones that are all in on it. It only benefits the top .01%.

>>507249544
Namely the shilling for jeets.
>jeets do accountant work
The fuck they do. They typically just rely on the basic bitch software to do most of the lifting, and then straight up bullshit the rest. I know, because I deal with poojeets constantly doing basic arithmetic fuck ups. The smart jeets would just fucking move to America and get the actual big boy American salary. Outsourcing to india just gets you a fucking nightmare more than anything else.

>20k for a poojeet
Bullshit anyone is working that cheap for CPA work, there's no fucking way they'd do advanced shit for $9. OP is out his ass stupid if he thinks that remotely viable. Moreover, starting CPA is like 75k, so idk where OP gets it beyond BSing.

Other dude, theres no fucking way a poojeet is doing any remotely good work for $9, much less the same quality as an actual American. You want fucking visionaries for you MUH MIDDLE MANAGEMENT SAAR, but then you want to go with poojeets who have no fucking vision, and cant get a woman even if its fucking arranged. Fucking $9, you'll get a poojeet who just does data entry into his software, who doesn't know shit from shineola about American tax laws. And then the poojeet will bring in more of his shithead friends who know nothing, and your vision becomes shit stained real damn quick.

It all reeks of jeet shilling, SAAR TRUE ARYAN VISIONAIRY SAAR PLEASE AM LETTING ME DO YOUR TAXES SAAR VERY EASY YES.

Watch the jeets dance to this one

>>507251207
You misunderstood what I said.

There is effectively no difference between a 2nd year associate at $70k and a $9/hr SAAAR in terms of work quality. The only time there is if you get a legit sharp and ambitious worker which are naturally only going to be 1/10 people.

The middle managers are the make or break on the execution side of the business. They are the jobs I would never outsource. They make $150-200k on base. They are the final review for all the middling associates and India's work. They are hungry have families to feed etc. In an ironic way they are even bigger slaves to their corpo jobs than the $9/hr jeets.

Visionaries are rare and when you find one you gaslight them into thinking they are not. If they self actualize they will leave your company immediately to start their own. They are never jeets.

Glad to clarify

>>507251207
anon, you do realize that everyone is outsourcing, right? i worked in b4 tax (EY) for a bit. this was 2015-2018 and "staff level" work was routinely sent to the india team. today something like 1/4 of EY's 400k employees are in india. they generally make 1/5 of what US employees make.

>>507251130
India is very strong super power. They have the largest population of any size. This is meaning that they have the most intelligent people on the planet. There is a top 10% of USA. And there is a top 10% of India. India has 5x the population size of USA. So that means they have a 5:1 ratio of talented people in the top 10% in comparison to the top 10% of USA. So its no wonder that useless American dogs get outcompeted. And India with their massive population advantage. Have clearly surpassed all western nations in being a desireable place to place to live. India has the most capable people on the planet. That is why India is the main super power of the world and everyone is moving there.

>>507252469
See nah that sounds like bullshit. Sounds just like this >>507252525

>>507232913 (OP)
>his work is generally higher quality and requires fewer review notes.
PFFFFT AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAA hey guys check this shit out
>Everyone: ROFLMAO

Whatever you say jew/indian. Roflmao "higher" "quality" indians, PICK ONE AND ONLY ONE. :))

You jews are so stupid you don't even know how to lie.

>>507232913 (OP)
why don't we outsource your job too?
>you can't just do that
why?

>>507252934
Its his company. He (presumably) doesn't make money on his own labor but rather through the retained earnings he has reinvested into the company. When he first started out he likely was making money off his own labor. Marxists are retarded as fuck and an intro course to Balance Sheets would likely leave them all disenfranchised.

>>507252861
https://www.ey.com/en_in
https://www.ey.com/en_gl/careers/global-delivery-services

>>507247930
>I can only share my personal experience - top 10% of performers make 90% of a company work
That was true 10 years ago and just as true 40 years ago. It’ll be true in 10 years also. You aren’t the first to point this out and you aren’t insightful.

>>507253626

Why didn't you respond to this one OP?

>>507248561

>>507254159
The entire premise of the thread is OP has no incentive to hire domestically for entry level jobs as opposed to offshore.

This is becoming especially true as AI use expands into territories beyond just chatbots. Entry level employees almost by definition cannot be top 10% of performers since they do not have the experience or acumen except in very rare cases which they are extra ordinarily bright.

Therefore OP correctly states there is very little reason to hire entry-level jobs domestically except on the off chance of getting a diamond in the rough.

All arguments to the contrary ITT have been nonsensical autistic screeching. In my original post in this thread I merely took this to its logical conclusion - no office jobs will exist in the US in 10 years.

>>507254803
i'm not asking for people to provide clarity or approve of my decisions. i'm asking why people think my decisions are "bad" when the benefits vastly outweigh the downsides.

>>507255016
Where then will the money come from that is purchasing the services being provided?

>>507232913 (OP)

Because your taking jobs away from Americans that deserve it and your letting brown people who arent as talented as white Americans work.

Its not a winning strategy.

>>507255139
>>507254803 (You) #
i'm not asking for people to provide clarity or approve of my decisions

>i'm asking why people think my decisions are "bad"

Do you contradict yourself like this in your day to day too?

>>507252469
>i worked in b4 tax (EY) for a bit. this was 2015-2018 and "staff level" work was routinely sent to the india team.
I was at KPMG during the same time frame and our India teams sucked. They could tick and tie but if something deviated even slightly they had zero critical thinking to figure it out. Even for the easiest stuff.

>>507232913 (OP)

Indians aren't loyal to the U.S. at all. They treat working here as if they deserve it they dont. They are guests in America quite frankly.

>>507252525
The top 10% of India brings them up to a human IQ level
>india superpower saaarrr
>believe me saarrrr
Post shit stained hand

>>507255016
Great job not addressing anything I said

>>507255628
Atleast you understand it

>>507255256

Every company that puts DEI first and Americans last is not a good company period. They will underpay you and kick to you to the curb. Its not how America was built and it shouldnt operate that way. Get rid of all DEI.

GO AHEAD OP. HIRE YOUR INDIANS. YOU'RE GOING TO DO VERY WELL LMFAO

>>507233569
I hear Israel is going to need some accounting to rebuild. Perhaps you head over there

>>507255223
The same place the money to purchase goods manufactured outside of the United States comes from. The economy will adapt as it always has since we started putting food in the ground instead of tracking down boars. I imagine for a period there will be a upper-middle class of Indian AI-Wranglers who are professionals. Note this is already normal in software development, its simply making its way into other industries.

>>507255483
IDK how long your career is/was in accounting but that very same sentence could be applied to 90% of year 3 Associates domestic hires

>>507256171
>The same place the money to purchase goods manufactured outside of the United States comes from

Where does that come from?

>>507255706
Let me make it retarded for you
>I say 10% of the work force is responsible for 90% of the quality work
>You say I haven't said anything interesting
>I reconcile the point of me bringing up this statistic is that there will eventually be a bottle neck, no reason to hire domestic US employees because entry level hires are almost never top 10% performers. Its the entire point of the original post.
I guess I failed to address anything you said because you said nothing of substance. I tried my best to bring the point full circle to OP but seems like it fell flat. Oh well.

>>507256692
Why hasn't work always been offshored then? What changed?

>>507256448
That could devolve into a monetary policy disucssion (petrodollar, nature of fiat currencies etc) or a macroeconomic discussion (displacement of large amounts of the work force) or even a birthrate conversation. If you're ultimately asking "what will happen when there are no jobs" you can dive into all the 4chan schizoid theories you like - UBI, social credit system, you will eat the bugs etc. I don't particularly care to talk about that as it derails the OP which focuses on the immediate short term (now, 5-10 year future economic impact of mass offshoring of entry "white collar" jobs). Feel free to start your own thread and Ill post in it.

>>507257364
Work was outsourced for the majority of human history via slavery and serfdom. There was a period which it was not and this period was extremely prosperous for the average person and for the first time class mobility became available for a very large cohort of the population not just the particularly sharp. Technology is simply returning us to status quo.

>>507244299
>my assertion was junior partners do not come out ahead when selling to private equity firms.
You have horrendous reading comprehension, you're truly retarded. A "junior" partner in a small firm who has a $2m book who sells to PE will receive the same sale proceeds as a 70 year-old partner with a $2m book at a small firm. Valuation in small partnerships is based on revenues, you stupid dense fuck, not seniority.
In other words, a kiddo partner with five years under his belt, but a rainmaker will receive the exact same sale proceeds as the geezer partners. This is not true in big4, but it is true for small partnerships. Different valuation metrics.
Meaning if you weren't such a poor performer and weren't bounced out of your small firm, you could have been invited to the partnership, maxed out your capacity within a few years of schmoozing, then received a couple million from a PE buyout.
But no, you're stuck in your smelly basement grinding shit work with a garbage practice that you'd be lucky to sell for a couple hundred k at absolute best, if you could even find a buyer for your garbage.
Ohhh but you didn't want a multi-million payday after all ohhh noooooo. I don't care, you're fucking retarded and stubborn, I'm sure you're going to fuck something up so badly you'll be sued into oblivion and get your CPA stripped. Maybe rajeesh your sole employee will have a spare bunk for you.

Can the Indians in this thread, the OP and others, tell me how this mathematical law doesn't apply to Indians?

As any population grows, their mean becomes more accurate. Indians have the MOST people on the planet. They have the largest number, so their mean is the most accurate as to what they are.

Indians tell us they are such capable people. And in a country the size of India. Then it must mean they have the most amount of nominal capable people on the planet. AND ONE WOULD ASSUME

A nation full of capable and intelligent people, MUST mean that it is a capable nation.

Is India a capable nation? I don't think so. I think India is an incapable nation. And because the amount of people that exist within it, actually shows the true MEAN of the people that come from it. Indians claim they are the smartest most capable people on the planet. But their country is still filled with trash? These people are so capable that their entire country is still a pig sty? America and the West are so incapable of raising smart people that THEY NEED people from a land that is not capable itself?

>>507258253
You're not doing a great job of convincing people of your truth.

>>507258770
you're conflating overall business valuation and interest in the partnership. a junior partner has a smaller interest (proportional share in the partnership) than a senior partner. the proceeds from the book of business revert to the partnership and are distributed to the partners along the lines of the share in the partnership.

>>507232913 (OP)
>they want a 10% raise every year and a promotion every 2 years
Doesn't feel unreasonable you jew

>i made $386k last year.
well see there's your problem

>>507260090
>Meaning if you weren't such a poor performer and weren't bounced out of your small firm, you could have been invited to the partnership, maxed out your capacity within a few years of schmoozing, then received a couple million from a PE buyout.
Goddamnit, read this again:
"Meaning if you weren't such a poor performer and weren't bounced out of your small firm, you could have been invited to the partnership, maxed out your capacity within a few years of schmoozing, then received a couple million from a PE buyout."
How many times do I have to say this: For small partnerships (i.e. suB T50), valuation is based on each partner's revenues. Each partner has equal "units" as you say.
You are so dense I am sure you are a pajeet.

>>507260248
And yet he still spends his time here, with you. What is more believable kek

>>507232913 (OP)
nothing personal, but I hope AI removes the need for your services altogether

>>507260371
>For small partnerships (i.e. suB T50), valuation is based on each partner's revenues. Each partner has equal "units" as you say.

let me make sure i understand this. you are claiming that a firm founder would admit someone to the firm with a share equal to his own? in what possible scenario would this occur?

>>507261010
Let me make sure I understand this. You think the quality of work you get from outsourcing to Indians will be the same quality of work you get from people in the USA?

OP is right
Why would a business hire developers in the United States or UK when a bloke from Mumbai does the same job for 1/4 of the salary?
Don't be a retarded commie. Companies aren't charities.

>>507260090
>hires indians
>refuses to live with them there
20+ posts and decades of experience BTFO'ed with two lines. You are fooling no one youngling

>>507232913 (OP)
Accountants ruin companies. They count beans and know nothing about any particular industry or what it takes to make a product. They read an excel sheet and say d
>durrr why this cost so much.
>new idea: lets hire jeets because it's cheap

>>507261010
Why should anyone hire your firm and not one from india? I'm pretty sure they are more hardworking that you are.

>>507232913 (OP)
You're paying them basically 5 times the average annual salary. Of course their happy to jump through hoops, have no benefits and accept 3% raises. It'd be like paying the American 300k and ANYONE would jump at that opportunity. No benefits needed and accept 3% because it would be massive yearly raises

>>507261773
non-citizen indians can't get an EFIN number. it's federal law.

>>507258253
>Work was outsourced for the majority of human history via slavery and serfdom

Sorry I thought slavery was abolished in the USA. Is that not the case anymore? Slavery actually is still what is to be upheld?

>>507262193
>what is nepotism
You aren't being serious are you?

>>507262321
how is federal law nepotism?

>>507232913 (OP)
Ask manufacturing, short sigthed tard.
In the beginning it is cheap, but once the talent is gone and the world competes for the talent abroad, sufficient quality is more expensive than at home. There no longer is anyone home though, you took the short term win and fucked yourself in the long run.
Less taxable income means higher taxes for those with income.
Smarter everyday did a video about it quite recently.

>>507262668
>not putting two and two together but when it's convenient
I didnt mention any law being nepotism and you did know what I meant. Nice try tho, doesn't work here.

what an insecure poser
lmao

>>507262321
I'm in for 30k if need be I'll do it I need a reliable accountant too :/ I've tried to do it on my own and it always ends in me forgetting to do it and I'm getting the bills in and not paying my contractors lol

>>50723291
I'd ask where these fickle faggots demanding 10% raises every year are going to acquire those, and if they don't, whether you're offering them another chance to do their old jobs? I'm assuming you aren't embellishing either.
Anyway, when your competition is no longer able to outsource, then you're on a level playing field for worker pay.

>>507263711
why?

>>507247872
Its not as black and white. In cases where there is labour shortage outsourcing should be welcomed (better to move the factory to thirld world, then import third worlders to work in factory). But countries should place restrictions on for the cases its negatively influences local population.