What has he done to deserve this?

>done to deserve
That's not a thing anymore. You have to born rich just like him.

>>508071726 (OP)
>Tesla Model Y was the best selling car worldwide in 2024
>SpaceX is the only profitable space start up
>Paypal is replacing visa and Mastercard all over the place
Lmao even. “Deserve”. Sounds like you need him to repeat one of your gay little mantras “black people are good”, “trannies are real women”. Is that who “deserves” billions of dollars

he did a deal with the devil, hes never actually made money, it all comes from government grants

>>508071726 (OP)
a lot of ketamine

>>508071726 (OP)
Gay sex and jewish black magic

>>508071726 (OP)
He was born with rich parents

>>508072102
yeh, paypal is awesome. the rest of his shit is gay though, space x being the least gay of the lot.

>>508071726 (OP)

>>508072102
/thread
OP a confirmed faggot.

>>508071726 (OP)
He opened a company, others with money evaluated its worth and bought into it at an agreed value.

He's actually not that rich the same way your 1st Edition Charizard isn't actually worth 250k.

>>508072102
nobody is buying teslas after he got involved with trump
starship will be his spruce goose and it relies on gov contracts which he put in jeopardy by pissing off trump
He has nothing to do with paypal

>>508071726 (OP)

https://youtube.com/watch?v=lwp7mFFW9L4

https://youtube.com/watch?v=y5uV6qLYqMQ

>>508071726 (OP)
Its not his money. when he made "the deal" he signed over all of his assets to the club. they tell him what to do and how to spend that money. he is a minion, a puppet.

>>508072308
https://youtube.com/watch?v=y5uV6qLYqMQ

>>508071726 (OP)
He gives me fast internet even thought I live innawoods.

>>508071726 (OP)
took risks

https://youtube.com/watch?v=gQEy82pzc_A

>>508072102
Ok but his salary running those corporations is measured in the 10's of millions.
Where do the *billions* come from?
It comes from the stock he has. At the company's founding he was *gifted* a bunch of stock, which inevitably became way more valuable. So in other words, he's getting rich because he "got in first", basically getting an inside deal.

This is why I think this sort of thing shouldn't be allowed. You shouldn't go public with some inside baseball person having 40% of the stock and making a bunch of free money on the accruement. The choice to invest in these startups should be open for public bidding, rather than a select few angel investors. There needs to be a new mechanism to bet on pre-public corporations so that these inside-baseball people stop becoming mega-ultra billionaires just because they got in first.

Also there needs to be something done about speculation. Why are people able to make mega-giga fortunes just buying and selling highs and lows? It's retarded, money is supposed to be in exchange for labor, or value, it's not supposed to be a game run by algorithms. Speculation needs to be shut down and suppressed, since it's a form of addiction and gambling.

If money was truly in exchange for value, then there would be no billionaires. There would be wealthy people, but that kind of insane over-the-top wealth is a result of gaming the system.

What happened to Elon musk’s chin?

why is it like this

>>508071726 (OP)
He's a "self-made man" just like me (family money + govment connections)

>>508071726 (OP)
Making people happy with EV hopes.

All he has to do is modify a Stephen E. Jones overunity circuit to battery submodule size and you have forever batteries that require maybe a fraction of the lithium, if they don't run straight off capacitors. Non-nuclear.

>>508073061
>connections

>>508073183
> All he has to do is modify a Stephen E. Jones overunity circuit to battery submodule size and you have forever batteries that require maybe a fraction of the lithium
nigga he can’t even modify his ketamine intake let alone build a perpetual motion machine

>>508071726 (OP)
>deserve
the sooner you forget about this pointless and archaic concept, the more things you will get
it's a meaningless idea created to cripple you

>>508071726 (OP)
Nothing. He benefitted from apartheid.

>>508072749
The example.
You all land on an island. You happen to stumble on the island's only water source, you're the first person there. You claim it as your territory. Everyone else comes along later, and now has to pony up to you, the water guy, if they want to drink anything.
Your status as the richest person on the island doesn't come from any value you created, it comes from getting there first. All the others were perfectly capable of exploiting the water source, they just didn't know about it.

An innovator like Musk should be able to own patents, and making millions on the patents. You should be able to patent a lot of things, and the patent system should be WAY stronger for individuals. There also needs to be some type of separate patent-court, since doing things through regular court is ridiculously expensive and slow, and basically renders a patent for an individual inventor unfeasable.

There should also be a huge reward for founding a corporation. I need to think about it more. Perhaps a bit of early-advantage stock is warranted. I'm just objecting to this thing where these guys get in early and then get mega-rich as a result. It feels like the rest of the market didn't have an equal opportunity, which they had.

>>508071726 (OP)
>What has he done to deserve this?
be better than you. not hard is it, lazy seething fag.

envy is a jewish emotion.

>>508073647
dumb analogy, one dude on an island with no laws will be hung by the thirsty newcomers

why do poors always think up illogical fanfic when they try to cry about the rich

>>508071726 (OP)
Nothing. He is a secret society puppet.

>>508072319
>and it relies on gov contracts
Falcon 9 depended infinitely more on govt contracts than starship ever did and falcon 9 barely depended on govt contracts outside of the period right after its initial development. Starship is almost exclusively funded through starlink revenue. This shit isn't a secret. I will give you credit for knowing they're contracts and not subsidies like most kikes like to try to claim.

>>508071726 (OP)
he shoots rockets up your butt
he puts robots in every home and business
he puts chips in your brains
you have no idea what potential musk's businesses have, do you?
he will literally own the planet if his arc is allowed to progress as planned
A.I., mRNA, he's everywhere

>>508072248
lol you fell for the gaming psyop?
musk started ridiculing himself fake-gaming to distract attention away from the H1B debate he was losing
noone's debating H1B anymore
you are so easy to rule and abuse

>>508071726 (OP)
Raised a stunning and brave trans son/daughter

>>508073952
When retards hear government contract they just assume the government is funding the thing in full.

>>508072276
coming from a boy fantasizing about removing his own genitals i.e. trashfood
based of elon to call his son dead
that's what trannies are: dead by their own choice, walking rotting corpses that need buried ASAP

>>508072399
based

>>508072319
>any day now musk will crash and his businesses will die
>wake up and musk owns your body, your brain, your memories and your dreams

>>508073209
and?
we took drugs at every dumbass startup I've ever been into

>>508071726 (OP)
You only get that kind of money by exploiting people, loopholes and selling your soul to Satan.

>>508071726 (OP)
> Net worth
What a piece of shit benchmark. It goes up and down depending on valuations.
> Tesla
Debatable. Tesla might not even exist by this time next year.
> twitter
Was a disaster that is slowly recovering.
Actual success stories:
> Space-.X
> PayPal
> Solar City
> Boring Company

>>508073778
Because the island analogy works for 2 reasons:
1) We live in a society so nobody will kill the "innovator" or "founder"
2) Rich people have opportunities to be innovators much more than poor people

>>508071726 (OP)
Fraud

>>508071726 (OP)
He was born into wealth, got bought out by PayPal niggas - so he was known as part of the PayPal mafia (a group of successful people), which gave him some clout to network and buy businesses.
He then bought businesses from people and rewrote history so that people looking in at the surface would think he is an awesome ideas man who could never be a retard.
Arguably he has business skills but he is a retard. He also has a cult who invests in anything he does because he says snippets that make them go crazy.

>>508072102
>model y
Nearly half of Tesla's revenue comes from selling carbon offsets. Literal green-scam money, courtesy of big government. They'd be unprofitable without this credit scheme + other subsidies on the vehicles (tax rebates for customers, etc.).
>spacex
Private company. You don't know exactly what their revenue or costs are.
>PayPal will replace Visa
2 more weeks. PayPal does literally 1/10th the transactions per year, in total dollar value.

>>508071726 (OP)
sucked the government tit

>>508073647
>I need to think about it more
So I've thought about it.

Yeah, so the guy who founded the corporation can either hold all the stock himself, or he can sell it to the pre-market investors that I described. The company is not public yet, but its getting money dumped into it by individual investors using this new system I'm describing.

In this system, I feel like, the individual investors would send their money to the startup. They would get to chat with the owner online, perhaps. They would have a "representative" of some sort overseeing this investment of theirs.

This way, instead of a few big investors deciding the fate of these startups, the entire public market has the ability to fund them. That would elminite this inside-baseball where these big investors get private pitches.

One issue is that startups often don't want to publicly disclose their business strategy or their innovations, for fear of copycats. That's why I think the patent system should be WAY better, so they can come out with it without fear. That way, they aren't reliant on the trust of a few big donors who can keep their mouths shut. They can pitch it openly.

>>508072102
>Tesla
Stole the company
>Paypal
Did nothing but toss money around when they needed it, got told to fuck off once they didn't

>>508074356
1. we dont live in a society "island" like the retard claimed
2. there are no "newcomers" everyone comes from somewhere and is subject to the same chance to be born into a wealthy family as musk

guess what, every parent has every right to give their children the fruits of their own labor so fuck off, you dont have the right to tell anyone they cant give their children advantages over anyone else, communist idiot

>>508072430
>me circa 5 years old

>>508074890
>can sell it to the pre-market investors that I described
Not sell it, because it's not public yet.
But they can....promise to buy it. Kind of like, lending money, but sort of the opposite. It's a promisory note, that they are investing in teh corporation, and the corporation owes you this amount of stock when they go public.

It's sort of like, aftermarket trading. You aren't trading stocks, you're trading the promise to buy a stock.

>>508074942
You know this doesn't work because of nepotism right?

This is how great countries fall, talented people are gatekept, and this is very real criticism of your "muh commie" bullshit.

Its how kikes stay in power and why we have stories like those of Scipio Africanus or Julius Caesar. Just like how the housing market rn is fucked because people misused cheap loans just because they could. They got to the well first, maybe because they had a better starting point thanks to their parents, but that doesn't make it right.

So unless your conceding your position and embracing a middle position, Ill just see you as a kike. There is no way your on 4ch and spouting your nonsense. Prideful bastard.

>>508072102
>>Paypal is replacing visa and Mastercard all over the place
not even close to true
why lie - now I'm doubting your other claims

>>508074333
>Tesla might not even exist by this time next year.
Do you retards ever think before you type?

>>508075122
there is literally nothing wrong with nepotism that BREAKS NO LAWS

dont like it, commie up your laws to gatekeep power into the hands of stupid people not educated by their parents or simply DEI hires that makes you feel better about muh humanity et al bullshit that makes you feel warm and fuzzy that you kept better people than you from oppressing you, worthless tool.

>>508075214
it's because the poor and stupid (very often the same thing) can only ever get by on lies instead of facing the truth of their own disposition; like a woman or nigger they point fingers at everyone but themselves.

>>508072102
>paypal
He had nothing to do with paypal. He sold out when the merger thing happened anyway he has no stake in paypal.

>>508075394
I would expect even a middle schooler to have a better comprehension of the politics of wealth.

>>508075498
Not an argument commie nigger.

>>508075270
There is a lot wrong. Especially when you have competition that is not held back by such stupidities. You must be a jew or indian, or the standard mcfatty bootlicker.

You gatekeep talent with nepotism. It's how Russians went to space first, and how America can't control the world stage anymore. Thanks 20iq kike.

>>508075394
Why do you use this as an example when we are clearly talking about gatekeeping talent and the housing market? As if rich people work 80 hours a week lmao. Did you ever see a kike doing manual labour?

>>508075568
stfu faggot, what are you doing in thailand.

>>508074247
Good point

You can't be poor in America anymore. Once upon a time you could rent a shitbox garage apartment for less than $500 and work at a diner washing dishes and actually sort of survive by yourself, a roommate and you were on your way. Now, you are going to die in a ditch if you don't have thousands of dollars on hand to rent a place and make 3x rent- in a tens of dollars an hour world. I honestly feel bad for people. Any tiny misstep and you are going to be outside living like an animal. Nothing to do with Elon. Just pointing out that even in a place like Savannah GA where there is what exactly to do for any type living, a room in a simple rundown house is almost $300 a week. Tents. The new poor housing in America. Fuck. You aren't going to make it. You literally are not going to make it people. What happened to America.

>>508071726 (OP)
Sucked Ari Emmanuel's penis

>>508071726 (OP)
nuerolink, space x, star link, you know.....shit that people love and actually improves their lives.

He was able to sell the dream of a better tomorrow to the people, which unironcally is worth it for a government. He painted EVs, underground tunnels, and most importantly, a Mars colony.

Was it bullshit? Yeah, absolutely. Was it nice to hope? Yeah. It gave the American people hope for a greater tomorrow. I think Musk is an autistic, legitimately, but he was a vehicle for the future. Bezos, Gates, and the other rich fags kept quiet and the people were bored. It's the same reason Jobs was so important, despite relatively doing little innovation wise.

>>508071726 (OP)
he buys low and shills his bags. i wish more of you faggots would do the same instead of selling after $100 profit

>>508075498
Tell us about the online payment portal, car company, or spaceship/global communications companies you created and why you believe yours didn't become the ones used by people and governments all over the world?
>>508075639
>gatekeep talent
Tell us about your talent and who is holding you back?
>the housing market
Who is preventing you from learning how to build houses?
What precisely have you attempted to do to better yourself or your situation?

>>508076059
I know lots of people using starlink. Are you one of those who thinks space is fake because rockets can't work in a vacuum without air to "push off of"?

>>508071726 (OP)
He does work for the Pentagon.

>>508076167
Is that the extent towards which you can think? Only in black and white?

While you look at group A that is advancing thanks to nepotism, and group B that maybe had their chances ruined, you never see C that didn't even come to exist because the situation didn't allow them to. Just like how boomers pull up the ladder with them, forcing you to succeed through nepotism and bootlicking.

But you are just trolling at this point.

>>508071726 (OP)
what have you done? at all, anything?

>>508071837
What is his father's net worth?

>>508076601
$2 million less than mine lol. I'm a complete leach and loser at 31 years old though.

>>508072749
>owning the company that you found is being gifted something
wow

>>508072102
Elon didn't start any of those companies.

>>508071726 (OP)
A long series of many, many correct bets on what companies to stake his entire fortune on and who to hire to manage them

>>508071726 (OP)
Corporate fraud
Lots of corporate fraud

>>508075639
go have some kids (we both know you're a fag and cant) and then talk to me about not wanting to pass on your wealth to the people you created and cared for their entire lives

worthless communist niggerfag, you lack the ability to even conceptualize the desire to create better people. you're too busy sucking nigger dicks and just want more of that nigger cum to gulp down, don't you

>>508073778
>dumb analogy, one dude on an island with no laws will be hung by the thirsty newcomers
Yeah, rent-seeking doesn't exist because you wouldn't stand for it.

>>508077016
Nigger go pass on your wealth but passing on talent is entirely different. Since when did I even state that passing wealth was the problem, we are talking opportunities here.

Why do you think purely in black or white? Are you seriously retarded? Its either capitalism or communism with you. 'muh commie muh commie'

Why do 80iq retards even frequent this board?

>>508076962
+ plus playing an unethical game the best. He grifts and takes from governments.

Basically the best at taking advantage of the current system.

>>508071837
if he is born rich, he has good deeds from a past life

>>508077281
Yep, just like Calnivists, the richer you are the higher the odds God likes you and you will enter paradise.

We Christians and Indians can get along well.

>>508076306
Work on your reading comprehension, mutt. He set the bar so high so people would try to get that.

I guarantee if he made the modest goal of world wide internet through satellites, he wouldn't be a billionaire. It's cool on paper, but not really exciting. Being a biproduct of the MARS COLONY project though gets him free money from investors and the government.

>>508076389
So you believe it's people born in the 1940s somehow holding you back from starting a successful business or learning how to build homes?
Tell us about some of the times you tried to do any of those things and someone in their 70s stepped in to hold you back.
>>508077177
>takes from governments
Why do you suppose that his spaceship and telecommunications company is getting all those contracts and yours did not? How many government contracts did your company bid on?

>>508077074
something has to be built before anyone goes seeking to rent it. guess who funded it? the smartest person on the island. guess who built it and will probably rent it? you and this other lukewarm IQ. >>508077090

>>508077090
Your entire argument stems from wanting to deny the wealthy the ability to control their wealth. If you earned it then you can flex it however you want. For some it's getting laws changed in their favor and for others it's passing it on to their kids who will do that anyways.

You can't follow a string argument because you're a moron that does not see cause and effect. Go be a gay communist somewhere else, eternal loser.

>>508077359
So the reason your spaceship company isn't the one that is now worth 350 billion is that you only started with the goal of global communications?

>>508077395
>guess who funded it? the smartest person on the island.
Your right.

>changing laws in your favor
Actually, they proved themselves worthy by earning all that money through hard labor, them changing laws is just strongest rule.

I misunderstood you initially. Your definition of fairness is just different. And when shit hits the fan you have the money to move abroad anyway. Family above all.

>>508077621
>earning all that money through hard labor
What do you do for work?

>>508077517
How do you respond to this?

You all land on an island. You happen to stumble on the island's only water source, you're the first person there. You claim it as your territory. Everyone else comes along later, and now has to pony up to you, the water guy, if they want to drink anything.
Your status as the richest person on the island doesn't come from any value you created, it comes from getting there first. All the others were perfectly capable of exploiting the water source, they just didn't know about it.

Guys like Musk of course are paid $10's of millions for their role as CEO. They are paid millions for their patents.
But the *billions* doesn't come from any of that. It comes from stock. They get in early at these companies, and the stock price goes to the moon, catapulting their net worth to an unreasonable degree. But not everyone had the same opportunities to get in early.

>>508077712
Daytrading.

>>508077735
>You happen to stumble on
Why do you suppose Elon just happened to trip over his online payment portal company, car company, and spaceship/telecom company before you found it?
>>508077735
>They get in early at these companies,
In 2010 literally anybody was free to get a fucking job, save 17$ and buy a share of Tesla that is now worth 322.
What do you do for work? How much do you save and invest every pay period?

>>508077802
>My dad works at Nintendo.
So you're unemployed and unemployable, have never attempted to better yourself or your situation, but it's people in their 70s and Elon Musk's fault that you're not a homehowner who is financially secure?

>>508078189
>Why do you suppose Elon just happened to trip over his online payment portal company, car company, and spaceship/telecom company before you found it?
No I think he is among the rich tech crowd, so he has the inside baseball on all this. He knows what's up and coming, and where to place his chips, and is involved with government as well.
But these inside closed-door meetings he gets with startups are not open to everyone. He is getting exclusive access to the ground-floor of these companies. When something goes from 0 to 100, you make a lot more money than when it goes from 100 to 200. By getting in early, he magnifies his wealth by manifolds.
>In 2010 literally anybody was free to get a fucking job, save 17$ and buy a share of Tesla that is now worth 322.
Plenty of people did anon. But again, I want you to think about this.
Money is exchanging value for labor, or value for value. That's the purpose of money. When you arbitrarily make money on stock bets, or "owning something" that goes up in price, you are hacking the system in a way. That's how people can make billions of dollars on the stock market, and not having created one IOTA of value for society at large. They didn't invent anything, they just clicked their screen at the right time.

I think you should examine this with a more critical eye, rather than reflexively defending the system.

>>508071726 (OP)
Aristocracy is a measure of merit through generations. That being said he hasn't really done anything

>>508071726 (OP)
>deserve
I hate this word so much.

>>508071726 (OP)
Those are lizard eyes.

>>508075394
It becomes my problem when he uses the money to buy media platforms and government subsidies.

>>508071726 (OP)
he is headline worldwide news every other week for 6+ years for some retarded bullshit. that alone is worth at least 200 billion.

>>508071726 (OP)
He created the battery and the mars rockets and found a way to glue 4g phone antennas to the balloons in the atmosphere

>>508072351
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Giving_Pledge

So as a CEO, Elon might typically be paid $10 million or so. That's about the market price of a good CEO, a Fortune 500 CEO makes like $25 million.
That itself is GARGANTUAN, that is saying a CEO is basically 1000 times more productive in his labor than an average professional.

But bllions? BILLIONS?
Like, Elon could spend $10 million every year of his life, and he wouldn't run out of money for 50,000 years. That's longer than all of human civilization, that's like when homo sapiens left Africa.

Are we asserting that Elon's drug addicted ass is millions of times more productive than the average person? He obviously isn't.
This wealth of his comes from the stock market. There's some fuckery going on with the way the market works that allows these vast fortunes disconnected from any real-world value creation.
Sure Elon has created lots of value....but not THAT much value.

If you look at the situation with a fine lens, I think the answer is these closed-door meetings that startups do with these investors, which gets them ground-floor opportunities. That's really the issue.
If the general public, or investors at large, had an equal opportunity to invest in these startups, things would be way more balanced.
That's why I think this new system I described would be more fair: >>508072749

>>508071726 (OP)
Sold the shitlibs the delusions they wanted, it was they who gave him their money.

>>508071726 (OP)
be born rich

>>508078426
So what precisely held you back from buying Tesla IPO at 17$?
>"owning something" that goes up in price, you are hacking the system
So if my business is worth more today than when I started it, it's because I "hacked the system", and not because I'm growing and selling my product to more people who want it?
>Money is exchanging value for labor,
Citation needed.
>>508078937
What sort of business do you own and what sort of "government subsidies" do you believe yours is being denied?
>>508079228
>productive in his labor
What do you do for work and what do you produce?
>real-world value creation.
How much value do you create and how much do you feel you're being shorted out of the deal as far as what you contribute vs. what you consume?
>closed-door meetings that startups do with these investors
Why do you suppose start up ventures aren't bringing you to the table when they need a few hundred million in investment capital?

>>508071726 (OP)
same thing Mike Rowe, Kid Rock and Donald Trump did - be born rich

>>508071726 (OP)
Every single time people blamed politicians rather than themselves, they were unknowingly arguing for a return to feudalism.

>>508072102
profits are unpaid wages though. He managed to exploit all those workers. Good for him I guess?

>>508079803
>So what precisely held you back from buying Tesla IPO at 17$?
When Elon owned most of the stock already because he got in at the ground floor? That's the issue I'm talking about.
>if my business is worth more today than when I started it, it's because I "hacked the system"
No but refer back here: >>508077735
In these cases the wealth isn't coming from your labor, or your innovation....it's coming from "getting there first". You got in first, in these closed-door meetings, so you get billions. But I'm saying, the value of "getting in first" not proportionate the payout. Sure, I guess there is a value in scouting out opportune companies. But why is the payout, such an absurd ludicrous amount? Also, why isn't the general public able to bid on this stuff, why is it this secretive cabal of investors doing behind-the-doors shenanigans?
>>Money is exchanging value for labor,
>Citation needed.
Based on this response of yours I"m starting to think you have a low intelligence. Money arose as a proxy for barter, it's really a seamless version of barter with an intermediary called money. But since when did money turn into this game, where you can accrue vast fortunes completely disconnected from value-creation? Capitalism is about engineering a system that maximizes value creation for society, all the theory is based on that. And yet, stock traders who create nothing for society, often get paid more than people researching medical technologies, or scientific breakthroughs. Just think about all the great minds that are currently devising new ways to siphon money off the market, instead of pushing through new medical technologies or researching new engineering breakthroughs. We are wasting those brains.
This entire stock market system is basically a gambling house, engineered specifically so certain interested parties can game the system.

>Shieeet shortie, how did this offbrand nigga get to be running the Barksdale titty joint?

he is a front. he is barely in charge of anything. he is nothing but the public face for media consumption.
all the bought and paid for e-celebs lick his balls to get their dimes on "podcast"s. shit most of his threads here are posted by bots as well.

>>508072749
youre a genius!

>>508076601
It’s not publicly available, but it’s definitely $30mil+. Poorly written news pieces put it around $5mil, but I’m familiar with Elon’s story and know that the stuff he was doing when he first came to the US are impossible without social connections and being from that class of people.

t. wicked smawt working class fag that has ran in “elite” circles

>>508080707
No, I'm a scientist, so I think about things in these logical terms and try to understand how it works.

>>508080514
>When Elon owned most of the stock already
Yes. What prevented you from getting a job and buying 17$ shares that are worth 330 today?
>it's coming from "getting there first"
At what price point did you buy Tesla? Why do you suppose you're not getting invitations when people are looking for private investment of hundreds of millions of dollars?
>>508080514
>where you can accrue vast fortunes completely disconnected from value-creation?
What sort of value do you create and why do you suppose you're not getting invites from startups who are trying to get hundreds of millions in capital investment?
>stock traders who create nothing for society
SO if investors don't bring anything to the table, why do you suppose you're not getting the invites when someone is trying to build financing for a new business?
>This entire stock market system is basically a gambling house
So you don't understand what stock even is. Got it. Tell us what you do for work, comrade.

>>508077329
>the richer you are the higher the odds God likes you and you will enter paradise.
SHALOM MY ANTI-CHRIST RABBI!
>claims to be christian
>say shit that directly contradicts the direct words of Lord Jesus

"it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God"

>>508072749
Yes, it’s literally all just banker games. This wealth isn’t real wealth, but it does translate to real money and power in our system.
The question is also
>how did these companies make money?
Elon claims he didn’t take government handouts but look at the subsidies around EVs/boring company. I guarantee DoD is bank rolling space X and starlink as well. Look at Jack Dorcy and twatter, it was a intel op bankrolled by the feds and they even threatened JD to play along.
So it’s even deeper than what you’re saying.

>>508081095
>SO if investors don't bring anything to the table, why do you suppose you're not getting the invites when someone is trying to build financing for a new business?
Part of it is, the way the rules are set up. There is no public marketplace to bet on pre-public companies the way there is on public companies. So these big investors get their closed-door meetings, which gives them a huge unfair advantage over everyone else. It's the "island" analogy I postulated here: >>508077735
I think there should be a seperate exchange where anyone can buy into these startups, before they go public. They would pay in, and instead of buying stocks, they'd exchange promissory notes for the "promise to buy stocks" when it eventually goes public. There would also be some type of structure, such that these thousands of investors have a "representatives" standing in for them to represent their collective will.

This way, everyone gets the same buy-in potential. This would also prevent a small cabal from deciding which technologies live or die. There's still opportunity for investing in these, but pricing of the initial stock would be way more competitive, so the first-finder advantage would be greatly moderated, although still present.

Another reason they are doing this, is because they're scared of divuging their business strategy and innovations to the public at large, so they hold closed-door meetings. To fix this, we need to overhaul the patent system. It should be WAY easier to patent, but in particular WAY WAY easier to defend a patent. It shouldn't cost you money either. It should be a separate system from the courts too.

He was an early money man withTesla. He decided to work there when it gained traction. He had to sue to be called a co-founder.

SpaceX is as fakenghey as space is. Basically a CGI company.

>>508081731
>"promise to buy stocks"
actually it should be reversed. The "promise to deliver stocks" when the company goes public, to the person who bought in

>>508072749
>This is why I think this sort of thing shouldn't be allowed
What shouldn't be allowed? Starting a company that you own, and that's the first to do something important?
What, it should be taken away from you if it's a success?

>>508073647
>You happen to stumble on the island's only water source
Your analogy is flawed because innovation doesn't work that way. No one stumbled on a rocket that can land ass-first.
>There should also be a huge reward for founding a corporation
The reward is owning what you create.

>>508073647
>Musk
>innovator
He didn't innovate shit. He hired people with his money and they did all the job while he got all the credit

>>508082269
I think you should, if you're seeking investor money, be forced to put your company on the pre-public exchange, which I've described. That should be like, mandatory. And I reconsidered my position. I do think the founder of the company should own all the stock initially, and can sell it (or rather, exchange promissory notes for) the company on the pre-public exchange, or on the public exchange.

But the money that is paid to the founder of the company should indeed be representative of the value he created
1) Whatever ideas he himself created, should be patentable, and those patents worth money
2) Whatever leadership he exerted over the company, he should be paid an executive salary for that, of course.
3) The "first mover advantage" of founding a company that nobody thought of before. Although, this would be greatly moderated, if he was forced to put himself on the pre-public exchange when he was seeking investor capital.

So he should be paid, directly in commensurate to the value he created. Value for labor, value for value.

>>508081288
Post up the links from SAM.gov to all the contracts those companies got and tell us why you believe that they got the contracts instead of your company?
>There is no public marketplace to bet on pre-public companies the way there is on public companies.
So why do you suppose you're not getting a seat at the table when people are looking for hundreds of millions of dollars to invest in their new business?
>It's the "island" analogy
No, that's retarded. This isn't an island, and it's not just an accident of happenstance that someone else just stumbled along and tripped over a spaceship company or a modern automated car factory that just existed out on an island somewhere.
And if you didn't jump on Tesla IPO at 17$ why would you have us believe you would have bought in at 10 before they even had any actual assets or sales?
>I think there should be a seperate exchange where anyone can buy into these startups,
So you believe that anybody who starts a business should be forced to sell some percentage of equity in a public marketplace somewhere?
What do you do for work and how much do you invest each month? What sort of things do you look for in startups that you invest in?
Why do you suppose you're not being invited when people who are trying to start this sort of new venture are trying to raise hundreds of millions of dollars of capital?

>>508082349
>Your analogy is flawed because innovation doesn't work that way. No one stumbled on a rocket that can land ass-first.
Yeah of course, when you invent something, you can patent it, and that patent has value. There is value in creating a new idea. But I"m saying, the value that these guys are getting access to, is way way above whatever the value of that patent would be. There's some fuckery going on here that's vastly inflating the first-mover advantage here.

>>508082673
>I didn't buy Tesla at 17, but if it were on a pre-public exchange a few years before that I would have bought it for 10 before it had any assets or sales!
>Value for labor, value for value.
What sort of labor do you do and what value have you created? You've ignored this questions several times now.
Also tell us what your role will be once we abolish private property.

>>508082767
>Someone starts a new company
>Company winds up being enormously successful.
>Why are these people who started that company so rich? This isn't fair, I deserve free shit!

>>508083103
>Why are these people who started that company so rich?
But that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying, the amount of money the early investors (including the founder) are getting is not in proportion. It's billions, hundreds of billions. NOBODY on earth has created that much value with their own hands.
If you examine the reason, it's because they are getting monopolistic access to the ground-floor. If that was opened up, then everyone would have the same ground-floor access, and therefore the advantage of being the first to discover a startup would be moderated. It would be more reasonable, streamlined, like the free market does. Rather than being this way out-of-whack thing, where the initial investor gets $100's of billions just because he discovered the startup and got a closed-door meeting. And let's face it, probably did some dealing to keep other people out of the deal.

>>508077281
The exact opposite is true.

>>508083338
>some dealing to keep other people out of the deal.
So you believe that the reason you aren't being invited to invest hundreds of millions of dollars into startups is because some hidden cabal is conspiring to keep you personally out of it?
If you didn't buy Tesla at 17 a share at the IPO why would you expect us to believe you'd have bought in at 10 before they had their first sale or built a single factory?
What exactly do you do for work and what value have you created in your life?

>>508083858
>because some hidden cabal is conspiring to keep you personally out of it?
no dude, because the mechanism doesn't exist. The laws around "going public" are pretty strict, so companies have to wait until they reach a certain size and maturity. But there should be a mechanism to invest in pre-public companies, that should be on a different exchange. It should have an entirely different set of rules and system surrounding it too. But the effect of it, would be moderating the ground-floor advantage.
It would also ensure that certain companies or technologies can't be squashed because a few billionaires didn't like you. That shit has happened far too many times. They pick and choose the winners.

>>508084035
>there should be a mechanism to invest in pre-public companies,
There is. It's called "having money to invest". One of my friends who is a lawyer gets brought into that sort of thing all the time.
>the ground-floor advantage.
Again, you ask us to believe you didn't buy into Tesla at 17 at the IPO but you would have bought in at 10 before they had any factories built or made a single sale?
>technologies can't be squashed because a few billionaires didn't like you.
What new technology are you sitting on that billionaires are preventing you from funding to create?
If some anon were trying to fund some new company and called you up, how much money would you be able to invest in it today?
Why haven't you told us what you do for work yet?

>>508082767
>when you invent something, you can patent it, and that patent has value
What you're proposing essentially is that new ideas can be presented to a government committee who will then develop it, and reward the inventor with a small fee. So in your system this is how the Falcon 9 rocket would have been developed, by the state rocketry board after elon and various people give them enough ideas to go on with.
I'm just not sure that anything would get done that way.

>>508085406
I think what that anon is getting at is that someone should just give him stocks of startups.

>>508071726 (OP)
he should be building molten salt reactors.

>>508086262
He should be building Nuclear Salt Water Rockets and using them for every stage including the booster
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_salt-water_rocket
>a continuous nuclear detonation

>>508086156
Oh that's a clever economic system, let's see how that works out

>>508072430
yep. only choice in a turd world country like canada.

>>508072276
raping elons son who thinks she is somehow female can't hurt him, this is a fact.

>>508071726 (OP)
I'll put it this way:
A junkie is a junkie, no matter if they're rich or poor.
A pedophile is a pedophile, regardless of their status and position.

>>508084035
>there should be a mechanism to invest in pre-public companies, that should be on a different exchange.
>It should have an entirely different set of rules and system surrounding it too
I think this already exists. Pre-IPO investment is available but there are rules to prevent retards from losing their life savings. At least in Australia, you can be accredited as a "sophisticated investor", either by having around $1 million available to invest, or getting a certificate from an account that you know what you're doing and accept the risks. This then gives you access to startup fundraising rounds and all sorts of stuff but it's up to you to do your own research

>>508086914
Certificate from an accountant*

>>508071726 (OP)
Pumped a stock illegally in an era where most trading is done with machines and 40% passive investors.

Does anyone actually believe tesla sold more model ys than toyota corolla? I dont. I'm sure on paper they were technically sold to someone somewhere but it isnt organic customers.

>>508071726 (OP)
>networth
muttoloid bullshit metric. 90% of it is bubbled up and doesnt exist.

>>508071726 (OP)
His gaming skills alone justify this

>>508087633
Yeah a part of me thinks it's bullshit when the guy is apparently worth 400+ bil but somehow struggled to get a loan for 13 bil

>>508071726 (OP)
Mandate of heaven

>>508087715
kinda, he cant sell Tesla stocks or anything since if he does it just crashes

>>508071726 (OP)
He played the game perfectly, got into the S&P 500 with just barely the amount of profit, and has every metric that AI investors look for and keeps stealth printing more shares.
All the stuff he is doing was illegal in the 30s-70s. As soon as we got rid of common sense financial laws we start seeing billionaires pop up again, once these laws come back after the inevitable market collapse we will see less billionaires.

>>508082955
In reality there are three groups:
>people who don't want to be told what to do
>people who want to be told what to do
>people who want to tell people what to do
Group 2 is by far the majority, which is great for group 3 but terrible for group 1.

>>508073647
He didn't innovate anything.