How the fuck do you stop capitalism from becoming a plutocracy?
Communisim and Socialisim are too authoritarian.
Anons, what changes to the American ecenomic/social system would have to happen to completely eliminate the class divide while still allowing for individual freedoms?
should America take the regulation pill?
The individual gets a large amount of freedom, but businesses are heavily regulated?
Surely you can come up with an economic system better than what we currently have, right anon?
billionaire bootlickers, don't even bother replying to the thread.

>>508147539 (OP)
"retire" elites when they reach a certain level of wealth and power. Liquidate their companies and their families and their advisors.

>>508147539 (OP)
banish jews from your country.

tyrannicide

>>508147539 (OP)
It's corporatism, anon.
How to stop it is very tricky, because you need to make people care to demand change.

>>508147539 (OP)
Change is impossible and there has never been any change except in technology. Most social systems you think about are just aesthetics, for instance you think of feudalism as being european agrarian, and of communism as being russian, and so on

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secessio_plebis
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gracchi_brothers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julius_Caesar
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustus

>>508147539 (OP)
its a complex mess but its also very simple

so basically

you have to have regulation free market is a myth (free market is comunisum it does not work)

"lets have a free market"
"11 minutes later MultiCorpIncorperated Owns litterly everything"
"but wont people come- ACK

no they wont it just goes to shit

so obviosly you need regultation

now we have a new shit game

so the first shit game is makeing things that are good and in the interest of people

the seccond shit game is the regulatory game
dont want to over or under regulate

how do we do this we need balance somehow

so how do we get balance

enter the third shit game the legal system
im not even going to type here but whatever

Now were in the future so say hello to the most shit game of all

people are going to need trillions of dollers of capital to create civilisation defineing projects


all you have to do is solve like 40 of this stupid fucking games and you win

the problem is and its a huge fucking problem nobody playing the games is allowed to know they are playing a game

and if anybody wins the fucking game it ruins the system (like happend to us)

>>508147693
>elites
retarded inbred nepo babies arent elite
total destruction of the "political class"
total destruction of the corpo/techno jewish empire
total deatruction of the federal reserve
total destruction of kike controlled media
TOTAL DESTRUCTION
ITS TIME FOR A HARD RESET

>>508147863
Corporatism is just a feature of capitalism because with free market capitalism you enable the corporations and billionaires to control government to the point of directing it into inefficiency to the point that there's a "populist" revolt against it and the public sector meant to compete with and keep the private sector in check is dissolved into the private sector.

>>508148163
regulation and rampant profitirng dont matter

people are to fucking retarded to decide whats best

and to fucking good at breaking rules

so the regulation and the rampant profiteering try to just keep eachother in balance

stop the worst of both sides while we get some luke warm slop middleground

abstract this over like 50 layer's and you have society

and its a steaming pile of shit because to many people have won games and their is no balance no direction nothing its a mess

>>508148429
>total destruction
>vague entities controlled by billionaires
Fuck off, retard. You're like a monkey who can't drive a car, has no working knowledge of any of it's parts and can only think to destroy it.

>>508148484
ohh and the people that won games have ludacrous ammounts of power and zero idea what to do with it except keep playing the game that never matterd because nobody was supposed to win

so they just keep playing this game that isnt supposed to have a winner to the detriment of litterly everybody

>>508148636
ohhh great GDP IS UPPP

people are stareving in the fucking streets you have missed the mark by such a distance it is truely impressive.

>>508148429
>ITS TIME FOR A HARD RESET
Change is impossible, you can destroy yourself (KYS) and will just live again

>>508148812
>people are stareving in the fucking streets y
This isnt happening anywhere but Gaza. No one in the first world is starving and almost no one in the third world is except bombed shitholes under siege

>>508147693
>liquidate elite assets
Where does all the money and resources go? If a company disbands what happens to the workers? also what level of wealth would you draw the line at?
>>508147781
>da jooossss
Newsflash, jews aren't the only greedy people anon.
>>508147783
>tryannicide
Ah yes murder. Anon I'm asking about economic systems, killing people is not that. In rare cases the killing comes before a new ecenomic system in the form of assassinations and revolutions, but it's not an actual system.
>>508147863
what do you think then? hm?
>>508148045
what a doomer take.
you really don't think humans will EVER be able to escape the little diagram you posted of rulers and the ruled over?
>>508148122
>random roman wikipedia links
Secessio plebis is based, but do you think that any Roman Systems have any merit or possibility of being implemented in the modern day?
>>508148163
also doompilled, but I can sort of get what you are saying past the ESL grammar. Still not really a solution, just stating how fucked things are.

>>508147539 (OP)
Stop trying.

>>508149013
Never! WAGMI

>>508148812
speak to any market analyst dont tell them about the games right and this verbateum response apears

"no we need to grow gdp to help people"
>but growing gdp is hurting people
"maybe in the short term"
>but thats axiomatically a poor propersition like how can you base it on this because the abstract of this is it will always people because it will always be the short term

its just a dude stuck in the game he has no idea hes playing

>>508148429
Elites covers all of that.

>>508148937
>you really don't think humans will EVER be able to escape the little diagram you posted of rulers and the ruled over?
It is possible and people have lived out of it, but it isnt one of the isms people shill about. Its just a society without bosses and employees. This means you live communally with an extended family that ha no more than 250 members (Dunbar's number), and you cant have greater organizations above them like international court of justice or the police.

>>508148937
you have to fix all of the games

each one could take a lifetime to fix "properly" but i could hard bash them in 40 minutes 1 at a time may a few weeks for the more complicated ones

it would still be shit but it would "fix" the worst of it

you need somebody who knows whats good for society at large and how to acheave it and i dont even know where you would find this kind of person

im not even sure its fucking possible

>>508147539 (OP)
Let AI handle it.

>>508148937
>Where does all the money and resources go?
They're either recycled or removed from the system. The employees will work for someone else. I would draw the line at 500 million. To be fair, the companies could be given to the employees, the liquid assets could go with the elite. They and their families can live on an exclusive island with the rest of the elites and live in luxury. They just can't have control of the world. On the surface, this is a kind end for someone who worked all their lives to dominate everyone around them. In reality, they'd eat each other. Elites have the worst traits of all of humanity. They're vicious and endlessly competitive. Secluding them where they could only compete against each other would drive them mad. Elites of all kinds are exactly like jews: avaricious, greedy, arrogant and evil to the core. There are no exceptions. It would be kinder to kill them, but not a one that made it deserves a moment of kindness. They deserve torture and death. None of them got to where they are by being honest, kind, fair or moral. They're the worst people on earth. A retarded nigger who rapes a baby to death is at least ignorant of how evil he really is. Elites do what they do with full permission of their consciences.

>>508147539 (OP)
First of all desmutt your head and read about communism.
Capitalism is the surplus of labor and only humans can create it.

Usaism says that your work, your family, your faith belong to the rich, you may masturbate before your death.

USSR said nobody should have access to the surplus of another men.

Modern Chinese says the companies should work for the benefit of the state, the state should work for the benefit of the employer yes you hear it right, mass transportation, affordable housing, healtcare, food, benefits the employer bc he doesn't need to pay his workers for those, coincidentally is like early USA

Now you can discuss
And now I'm going to get drunk

>>508147539 (OP)
>>508147863
>>508148439
>plutocracy
We live in a Bankocracy anon.
Central banks run planet Earth (all governments, which are, yes, corporatist)
Corporations are totally dependent—after 2008—on infinite supplies of debt note fiat currency from private central banks to keep from imploding and continue the giga-expansion of the black box casino of the Financialized debt-based global economy.

>>508147539 (OP)
Strict constitutional repuplic under an immutable rule of law backed by ai.

>>508149226
btw hard fixing the games like

purgeing and resetting regulatory practise and all of its spiderwebs

setting up dedicated legal framworks and compensory logistics and oversights

aswell as recodeing capitalistic models and tendancies to do with funding

ect

you dont actually "fix them" because thats hard you put people in place that will play the game really well and get rid of people on the other side

but we need trillions in capital because thats the age were in so we cant just commie it up and regulate the mega corps back into meadium conglomerates

not to mention they would litterly try and kill you somebody would

and at somepoint in the future you would have to take a fucking axe to the regulatory institutions but every time you do this you need a strong legal system because people will try to monopolise basic human needs to extort the population because thats just what you do

the fact that were working towards a "growth" mindset instead of haveing a utopian style society just means we fucked up super bad somewhere

like everything has gone pants on head retarded

the legal system supoosedly protecting us is actively persicuting us

the corps supposedly creating better societys is actively extorting us

the regulatory bodys supoosedly keeping the businesses in check are actively regulating against us

us being the person "THE PERSON" the idealised individual that represents both society and the average man/woman


theres no good reason we dont have homes for litterly everybody good food water ect

that should have been solved years ago and we should be capitalistically argueing about things like transport power ect

>>508149973
were in a race to the bottom for no good reason

whats annoying is theres 10million people that would argue with me untill they are blue in the face for why we cant all just get a free fucking house for being a citizen

and there wrong im sorry they just are theres no good reason for it at all

how we impliment it should be the debate not if it should happen it should have happend its a disgrace it hasnt

>>508149142
>This means you live communally with an extended family that ha no more than 250 members
Okay now we are getting somewhere.
I could get behind this. Though the rub comes from the societal logistics with how large the current population on earth is
so theoretically with this small society structure you have to figure out a way to keep these individual communes, tribes and communities from glomming together and becoming larger and then subsequently conquesting their smaller neighbors. It's so hard to maintain small societies because any larger and more immoral society will just smash them.
Maybe make a unilaterally agreed constitution between however many tribes are apart of this theoretical country, that agrees to stay apart unless they are attacked, in which case they will come together and defend eachother. Another question is if trade would be allowed between the 250 person tribes? would money be allowed or would it be purely bartering? Maybe if someone wants to travel/live somewhere else they find another person from a separate tribe that also wants to move and they swap.
figuring out how to enforce any rules with such small amounts of people is difficult.

>>508150333
its bullshit we just have bad leaders

to lead is a burden

we have a bunch of fukups its supposed to be easier to work than to lead its not and were not being led anywhere good

look man if i just want to dig holes and have a good life i can do that

i dont have to worry about the trillion fucking issues with digging holes were to dig them why we are digging them what it will look like in 10 50 100 years how it will change society on those timeframes ect

also how to keep my diggers happy how the holes will benefit us what harms they could cause

whatever

a leader is supposed to be worried about shit like this but in todays world its just some fucking lazy retard makeing more money than you

>>508150265
But who is going to build the homes you ask

its a travesty that for hundreds in some cases thousands of years we have had extreemly profitable houseing companies and such poor management of population's that we did not reach some sory of equilibrium years ago and figured out some way for free homes to be made for additional population while retaining a viable houseing market

your first house should be free at a certain age maybe that age is 25 i dont know but there should have been enough money in the system to reach this

whats the point of building houses

SO PEOPLE HAVE HOMES

we just ignore that fundamental principal in a multi trillion doller industry like whats the fucking point man

you would have to plan citys better and societys better for this to work

but thats good not bad

>>508149973
REDDIT SPACING
Go back

>>508151426
you dont know what reddit spaceing is and im unbelivably based admit it

if you were given a house at 21 or whatever your legal age is you would feel alot better about paying taxes and you know it.

and the first house you bought with a mortguage ect would still act the exact same way there would just be a baseline for the market

and if we could somehow convince or regulate the companies to not absorb that cost into seccondary homes

the profit margins would be lower but the work more fufilling the reasult more competative ect ect

you would need to scale quality product

>>508148429
Hard reset would be a disaster. Do you think the new framers would start with the premise of empowering the most competent people, but with checks and balances to ensure they don’t become ossified rent-seekers?

No. The framing philosophy would be a Niggcentric revenge system. That is the zeitgeist so that is what would be the driving force.

It would reject competency and replace it with a victim hierarchy led by a group of connected cultural elite priests.

Soviet 2.0. Good luck with that system.

>>508150333
>Though the rub comes from the societal logistics
Its not stable, hence it doesnt happen and only exists as history.
Best you can do is to have a family company where the actual family works and doesnt hire helpers and try to not pay taxes.

>>508151675
and in 100 year's we would expect that basline to go up aswell as the high end

this is how you improve societys

instead i dont even know what the fuck we are doing we are litterly relying on great men to just fix hundreds of years of compounded fuckups

>>508147539 (OP)
You can't.
Any system, be it capitalism, communism, etc. ultimately ends up the same on large scale due to the Lemming Rule and the two main constants that follow it:
>1. The more variables are included in the system, the more likely it is for corrupt elements to emerge.
>2. The amount of effort and organization needed to remove a corrupt element grows exponentially as the variables increase, and is always way greater than it is for the corrupt element to sustain itself.

For capitalism, a simple example would be the price and customer relation.
Imagine you live in a tiny settlement of 20 people. Mr. Smith, your neighbour, has a cow and sells milk.
One day, Smith gets greedy and decides to ramp up the price of milk by 33% for no reason. From the free market perspective, the customers should tell him to fuck off and stop buying his goods. Still, Smith can afford to lose a quarter of his buyers after the hike and still turn out a profit. That's 5 people from the settlement. You, your wife, your child start a boycott, and you then convince a couple of your friends to join, too. Smith loses his profits and rolls the price back. For now, the checks and balances worked.
Now, instead of a tiny settlement of 20 we have a village of 200 and Smith owns a small cow farm. That's already 50 potential people you'd have to convince to join you.
A town of 2000? 500. Etc.
Now add to it NPCs who can't be reasoned with and rabid consoomers who'd buy extra milk *just* to spite your efforts, and the situation gets even worse.

You should get the idea by now. Democracy and so on works the same.

>>508151942
this is true but now imagine mr smith owns a cow farm

after 50 years of owning the cow farm he is expected to give everybody 1 glass of milk a week for free

people will pay mr smith a little more for milk for 50 years

if he decides to ramp up the price he can ect ect

but he still has this baseline commitment he must come good on at the deadline

failing to do so is constituted as gross mismanagement and he has to payback with interest the money

when he pays it back we make a new cow farm remove mr smiths subsidy entirely and subsidise the new cow farm with the same restraint

>>508152234
now if mr smith wants to compete he has to use his years of understanding to outcompete the new cow farmer

and if he had poor business practise the people would be reluctant to even buy his milk

if he creates a vastly superior product he will survive

>>508147539 (OP)
Capitalism always had an end point, and we're there.

>>508152407
clearly its a poorly thought out idea but thats the general premise

mr smith should be creating an amazing farm and people should be helping him

he should be focused on the future of his farm and the future of his town ect ect

giving away free milk is obviously very comunist but that should be his goal he should want everybody to have his milk the best milk *again we get obvious problems here like market capture ect*

but its not that complicated

>>508152673
the problem we have is we just fund the seccond cow farm and mr smith breaks the owners leggs
then the new owner signs a backroom pricefixing agreement with mr smith

now outwardly they are competeing but nobodys getting any milk the price is going up and the quality is going down

>>508152817
kek if you didnt notice im talking about tax and its gross mismanagement

>>508147539 (OP)
Fascism
>"BUT I DON'T LIKE THAT!"
Stop being a minority right this instant.

>>508147539 (OP)
>How the fuck do you stop capitalism from becoming a plutocracy?
It is solvable, but you can't expect the ruling class to diminish their own power willingly.
>Have an active educated populace that keeps out bad actors
There needs to be government media, and it needs to be partisan.
Each party in government gets funding based on their votes to run their own media.
Ideally voting tests as well.
>Welfare, if jobs are more optional they have to pander to workers more.
>Heavily punish monopolistic activities and any rich person who gets too cocky.
4. Any corporation will be transparent.
>names, addresses, work history, if you're seeking to be CEO or executive anyone should be easily able to find out all about you.
>salaries, bonuses, everything upfront
5. Bicameral legislature, 1 side elected officials, 1 side lottery random citizens

This would fix 99% of the problems.

>>508147539 (OP)
>How the fuck do you stop capitalism from becoming a plutocracy?
Distributism

>>508147539 (OP)
Plutocracy also dominates democracy. You can't ban the rich from giving their opinion in a democracy. Who owns and prints the news and entertainment? Where do people get their opinions? Money is power. If you can convince someone to buy your product you can convince them to vote for your guy. The "choice" is not entirely free.

Enforcing anti-monopoly laws splits up moneyed power and allows challengers to arise. It's still plutocracy but the disruption limits the total power attainable by the richest. Heavily taxing rent-income, dividendends and capital gains of the top 1% would also be beneficial.

The rich always have most of the power, all systems are eventually plutocracy. The best you can do is allow disruption of who the rich are and make sure it's those providing value to society (innovating) rather than collecting rents (banking, etc).