Creation is the proof that there is a Creator, this Creator can be perceived as nature, the universe or life itself. You love the word 'nature' but hate the word 'God', why is that? I think some atheists just hate the concept of religion as an institution but they are okay with the concept of the Creator if it's defined as nature or life itself which is how the Bible defines God.

>>508575279 (OP)
>Creation is the proof that there is a Creator
thats assuming existence is a creation

>>508575422
fpbp, checked, /thread

>>508575422
How do you define what is a creation? Can a nonalive object (fork, plastic etc) be considered a creation?

>>508575279 (OP)

the Great "I AM WHO I AM" the name. As stated in the bible.

Historical Timing — “In the Fullness of Time” (Gal. 4:4)
"But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son..."

Everything was divinely aligned:

Roman Empire: Crucifixion, a Roman method, fulfilled Psalm 22—prophesied before it even existed.
Pax Romana: Peace and roads enabled Gospel travel.
Greek Language: A common tongue (Koine Greek) helped spread the message.

Prophetic Precision
Jesus fulfilled 300+ prophecies:

Psalm 22: “They pierced my hands and feet.”

Isaiah 53: A servant suffers for sins.

Zechariah 12:10: “They will look on Me whom they have pierced.”
If He died by stoning (Jewish method), these wouldn’t be fulfilled—it had to be Rome, and it had to be the cross.


Jewish Calendar Alignment
Jesus died during Passover, becoming the true Passover Lamb (1 Cor. 5:7).
At His death, the Temple veil tore (Matt. 27:51)—access to God was opened.

Free Will + Divine Control
Judas betrayed Him. Pilate caved. Leaders schemed.
Yet Acts 2:23 says: “This man was handed over...by God’s deliberate plan.”
Even evil choices fulfilled a perfect design.

Symbolic Geography
Jesus died outside the city (Heb. 13:12), like sin offerings.
Golgotha, the “Place of the Skull,” echoes death and sacrifice.
Some believe His blood reached the hidden Mercy Seat below.

Every Detail Mattered
A different day—no Passover.
No betrayal—no arrest.
No Romans—no cross.
Yet every thread was perfectly woven. History held its breath.

>>508575279 (OP)
Believing in a god defined as nature or life does not imply that the god created the entire universe.

>>508575279 (OP)
They're starting project bluebeam, whatever you do, do not board the ships, frens.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uY_xgaPRYxA

>>508575779
it does when you consider the universe as part of nature, or do you have a limited definition of nature which is something that is only confined to our planet?

>>508575279 (OP)
>the Bible
When you read any religious texts, from any religion, no thoughts or ideas stand out as coming from anything but human. Everything reflects the society and technology of the time and place it was written. There are no thoughts that are beyond human, nothing insane that you would expect from a being that creates universes. Imagine if you went back 100,000 years and wrote the people of that era a book, it would have insane shit that they couldn't even comprehend in it, things they've never seen, ideas they've never thought of. No religious text is like this, it's all retarded shit like, don't work on sunday, don't commit adultery. These are not the thoughts of a god, they are the thoughts of a guy who wanted a day off and whose wife was fucking around.

>>508575279 (OP)
>Creation is the proof that there is a Creator,
Neat presupposition. To bad you can't demonstrate past it
>>508575279 (OP)
>Bible defines God.
As a victim of causality. It's why his plan changed so much lol

>>508575279 (OP)
Actually, the universe is proof that there is not a creator. Disprove this.

>>508575422
Every position, boiled down to it's fundamental argument, assumes X about existence.

Serious religious people say X is a self-generating conscious entity.

The average religious midwit thinks X is whatever their preferences about the religion they picked.

Atheist posit that X is self-evident, therefore questioning it is not smart. What is self-evident about X? Good luck getting that answer from an atheist.

>The average atheist midwit thinks X is their preferences.

Gnostics say X is a vengeful entity, in a quest to make humans a mockery.

>>508575422
Yes Christianity really cant cope with that thought. This astro turfed religion shit being posted constantly to keep us from doing anything is getting old.
Herbs in all fields frens dont let the jidf win

>>508576285
This

>>508575955
Nature generally refers to living organisms like animals and plants. But if you also include landscapes and any other non-living thing in the universe that wasn't made by humans, the argument does not change. The universe could have existed forever or come into existence spontaneously, thus not needing a creator.

Some people worship God. Others worship the Truth. Both are idiotic.

>>508575279 (OP)
Magical jews aren't real. Grow the fuck up you big brown baby.

>>508576470
>Atheist posit that X is self-evident, therefore questioning it is not smart. What is self-evident about X? Good luck getting that answer from an atheist.
>>The average atheist midwit thinks X is their preferences
Atheism is just the disbelief or lack of belief in God or gods

>>508575279 (OP)
who created the creator though?

>>508576285
You will never be a woman.

>>508576685
Irrelevant.

>>508575279 (OP)
This guy is actually pretty based i remember seeing a few of his videos

>>508576285
This. And also, if Rabbi Yeshua ben Yosef was actually a god, why didn't he speak directly what he wanted instead of talking ONLY to jews through allegories only jews would understand?

Why did he avoid non-jews at all costs?

Why did he avoid interacting with literate Greeks and Romans, who were everywhere in the Levant in that time period, who could have written down his precise words?

Why didn't he write any books himself?

It's because he was a mortal jewish rabbi who died, if he even existed at all.

>>508576630
That's a nice preference. Hope that solipsism doesn't self-imolate eventually

>>508576520
it could also be microbes, fire, light, dust, gas particles or components or life/creation/living things etc. which exist outside of our planet.

>>508575779
>Believing in a god defined as nature or life
It’s also incompatible with biblical god

The Bible describes god A LOT and he is a sapient talking entity that interacts with the matters of humans, and performs miracles extremely often

>>508576767
Why?

>>508576824
>That's a nice preference.
It's the definition

>>508575279 (OP)
The egotistical type of atheists all believe (either consciously or subconsciously) they have free will, but soience will never be able to rationalize the existence of free will.

Why is there something rather than nothing?

>>508575279 (OP)
>the Creator is defined as nature or life itself which is how the Bible defines God.
This is a common moving the goalpost technique by theists - attempting to redefine the concept of God as "the universe" or "logic" or "nature" or something. Basically, you're definition of God becomes so vague or remote that it's trivial.

>>508575279 (OP)
If you define God as the forces of the universe and nature, I guess I'm not an athiest. What is the point of doing that though?

>>508576895
God is the life which gives life/ability to breathe/pump blood/move/laugh/cry/hunger etc. to a material object. no life = no God

Acts 17:22 So Paul, standing in the midst of the Areopagus, said: “Men of Athens, I perceive that in every way you are very religious.
Acts 17:23 For as I passed along and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription, ‘To the unknown god.’ What therefore you worship as unknown, this I proclaim to you.
Acts 17:24 The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man,
Acts 17:25 nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything.
Acts 17:26 And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place,
Acts 17:27 that they should seek God, and perhaps feel their way toward him and find him. Yet he is actually not far from each one of us,
Acts 17:28 for “‘In him we live and move and have our being’; as even some of your own poets have said, “‘For we are indeed his offspring.’
Acts 17:29 Being then God's offspring, we ought not to think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by the art and imagination of man.
Acts 17:30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent,
Acts 17:31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead.”

>>508577159
It's less delusional than being an atheist and in a really important way.

>>508576928
I don't see how true free will exists when when causality exists. All of our choices have a reason and every choice made or not made has consequences. Consequences are what bind our choices. Even though it's not true freedom, this gives us the ability to make more informed choices

>>508576285
Imagine if God bothered to put accurate STEM trivia in the Bible, so that nobody could ever explain it with a goat herder making it up.
God works in mysterious ways...

>>508577115
God is everything/all in all, that's how the Bible defines God.

>>508576767
aren't you concerned that you are worshiping the creator instead of the more powerful creator of the creator?

>>508577227
We already have names for these though. Nature and universe.

>>508577382
What you call it is less important than the realization it exists.

>>508577305
That is not how the Bible defines God. The God in the Bible has specific characteristics that distinguish it from simply "everything."

Im not a Christian but I find wisdom in the Bible
"By your fruits you will know them"
The fruits of atheism? Culture rot, immigration, homosex, lack of morals, and obesity
Disgusting spiritual system!

>>508575279 (OP)
>it's defined as nature or life itself which is how the Bible defines God.

this is not a claim of any mainstream christian denomination

>>508577472
>What you call it is less important
You call it the same thing lol
>>508577472
>the realization it exists.
Yeah, as the universe and nature lol

>>508577360
Not in the least. My philosophy is to be as unconcerned as possible. It helps me to relax, and that is my first goal.

The only relevant question: How can I achieve greater relaxation?

Answer: By not asking questions.

>>508575279 (OP)
Atheism evolves into Islam, we have already seen it in every atheist nation. Weak spirituality will cave easily to aggressive spirituality.

>>508577472
Also just realizing it exists is not the end of the battle. Living as if you know it exists is an entirely different problem, and one I still struggle with.

>>508577526
>Culture rot, immigration, homosex, lack of morals, and obesity
All these things aren't exclusive to atheist

>>508577526
Blaming atheists for cultural decline is like blaming bald people for the current trends in hairstyles.

>>508577602
My perspective means I literally don't care to argue about semantics. It's completely irrelevant.

>>508577612
Hahahahaha retard alert

>>508577697
>My perspective means I literally don't care to argue about semantics
But that's what you're doing. Arguing for your preferred semantics
>>508577697
>It's completely irrelevant.
Not to you, clearly

>>508575422
abiogenesis niggers are omega fucking retards tbqhwy familia

>>508577488
nature of God =! who God is in the world

God is also defined as love. God is everything that is good or anything that gives life, or anything that is the opposite of evil and sin, and Jesus is the visible image of God or love personified.

>>508575279 (OP)
How long did the creator wait before creating the world?

>>508577809
I'm not arguing for semantics at all retard. That's what you are doing. My point was the exact opposite -- semantics are irrelevant as long as the meaning behind your beliefs are the same. Dumb dumb dumb.

>>508577841
>God is also defined as love
And evil.

>>508575279 (OP)
pantheism is just atheism with poetic fruity language as window dressing.
it doesn't solve any of atheism's problems.
>no basis for logic
>no grounding for morality
>moral anti-realism
>inability to justify the uniformity of nature
>no human dignity
>if thoughts are just chemical reaction, reasoning loses credibility
>no ultimate meaning
>epistemological inconsistencies
>self-refutation
>no reason to pursue truth as it doesn't aid in darwinian fitness

The only logical conclusion to atheism is absolute nihilism. The words I am typing are symbols used to represent imaginary concepts. Thought is illusory.

>You can choose your own meaning in life
That's cope against your death anxiety.
Living a good life? There is no such thing because there is no meaning. It's cope. It's all meaningless. You are a meat processor.

Art is coping.

You browsing this website is coping.

>>508577227
Explain more. Obviously the laws of reality got us here. Saying mud was made by rain mixing with dirt vs god making mud seems pretty different idea. I dont think anyone thinks the mud is just a random alignment of atoms.

>>508577907
1John 1:5 This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
1John 1:6 If we say we have fellowship with him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth.
1John 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin.
1John 1:8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1John 1:10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

>>508577896
>I'm not arguing for semantics at all retard
Incorrect.

>>508577896
>semantics are irrelevant as long as the meaning behind your beliefs are the same
See? Arguing for your preferred semantics

>>508577987
>7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.

>>508575279 (OP)
>I'll keep evolving
Not if you don't have any kids. In this the paryers are superior to you since they are far more likely to have kids and thus will keep evolving while you go extinct.

>>508576904
Are definitions prescriptive or descriptive?

>>508577949
My first reply in this thread was talking about egotistical atheists who believe in free will. I would argue this is delusional. What you label """God""" in your head, as long as you are mindful of the implications, is not important.
>>508578018
I didn't even read this reply retard.

>>508578168
Definitions can be either prescriptive or descriptive, depending on their purpose

>>508578183
>I didn't even read this reply
You did.

>>508575279 (OP)
> Circular reasoning circular reasoning circular reasoning
> Why is everyone stupid but me

Kys christgolem

>>508578129
darkness is the absence of light. God just gives us over to what we prefer, some people enjoy dwelling in light while in darkness that's why some people will go to Heaven while others will go to hell because God is a just/fair God.

>>508578314
You're right I did, after I already replied calling you a retard.

>>508578129

>>508578346
>You're not wrong
Thanks :^)

>>508577947
if religious cucks can choose their own meaning in life, why couldn't atheists?

>>508578384
>You're right I did
Kek. I know. You goons are easy

>>508578346
while others enjoy dwelling in darkness*

the people who will be sent to hell have preference for evil/darkness and they hated anything that is good.

>>508578460
(You)

>>508578392
This doesn't prove me wrong :^)

>>508578402
you're wrong but the bible verse that quoted is correct through my interpretation of it.

>>508578483
Have a nice day :^)

>>508578346
>a man commits violent, brutal murder but believes in Jesus at the end of his life so he goes to heaven
>infant dies before baptism so doesn't go to heaven
>We're supposed to believe that God is fair and just

>>508575683
You tell us how you determine what around you is a creation and what around you is not a creation or natural

>You have free will and everything is good
>nooooooo don't eat the apple nooo you can't just eat the fucking apple!!! That's it, all living things are cursed forever, I don't care if only 2 people ate my favourite apple, fuck everybody, even this lion over there, he must get cancer.

why did He sperg so much?

>>508577668
They're very jewish, atheists just make good golems because they only ever attack Christianity (specifically White-positive Christianity and Christian Identity)
Name me one atheist who isn't a niggerlover

>>508578548
>you're wrong
Nope. Otherwise God isn't omnipotent and omniscient

>>508578608
>atheists just
Disbelieve or lack belief in God or gods. That's it.

>>508578558
redemption and forgiveness are good things. believing that humanity is soulless through the rejection of an afterlife is narcissistic and selfish.

>>508575279 (OP)
Onions Ratcliff

>>508578559
if i can sense something using any of my senses then it's a creation.

>>508576895
I do not believe in the god of the jews