i dont understand how would society and civilization and scientific or artistic progress function or even happen if everyone is a egoist individualist who act entirely according to their own will and interests, unconstrained by social norms or external authorities

>>509413136 (OP)
The warlords that would come to capitalize on such a system would inevitably produce an autocracy given enough time. The impulse of the strong to dominate the weak will never be subverted, despite the many attempts of organized religion to do so (i.e. Christianity). That world would either be a nightmare or a paradise depending on your capacity for violence / luck.

>>509413136 (OP)
the social norm is to be an egoist individualist, thats how the economy works

>>509413136 (OP)
that's because you cant control yourself and assume others suffer from the same disease.

>>509413372
why do I need to assume anything
I live in this world surrounded by humans and I see how 99% of them tend to behave
how about you?

>>509413364
but even that warlord would need to somehow gather his army of supposed total egoists
I mean how

>>509413368
maybe thats the only case where it can and does happen
in an imaginary concept of economy i dont know

>>509413136 (OP)
>keep calm

>>509414143
>but even that warlord would need to somehow gather his army of supposed total egoists
Even egoists are still motivated by fear. Perhaps especially since the preservation of their own lives is their top priority always.

Sorry i simply enjoy opening new buisinesses to please and pleasure young egoists
The debt means nothing conpared to my sense of a fulfilment

>>509413136 (OP)
Someone reading stirner doesnt instantly turn them into a sociopath you retard

>>509414573
Why couldnt an egoist be motivated by love for his community exactly?

>>509413136 (OP)
You are asking if society without social norms is possible. Idk but our society does have social norms, and I do not see them going anywhere anytime soon

>>509413136 (OP)
That's the thing, it already does. What I'm asking for is refinement and taste.

>>509413136 (OP)
Society wouldn't progress at all. Egoism is often only self-centeredness and conceit. Rampant individuality like we see today is a civilization killer. All change and progress first comes from a single man who understands that he must make things better for posterity. Only those who disregard their own happiness and work unceasingly towards bettering their world will enter the halls of legend.

>>509416867
>Rampant individuality like we see today is a civilization killer.
Boomer retard

>>509413136 (OP)
Obviously. Thats why I dont tell people about it. Its for greater beings like me. You lesser-thans should follow servile philosophies like stoicism.

>>509413136 (OP)
Because contributing to society helps improve your life. You can be altruistic with a bade in selfishness. It's objectively true treating those around you improves society as a whole.

If you don't agree you are brown or a jew

I dont think many people could parse jewish media from objective reality without stirner, stirners the best teacher on how to parse subjective opinions, he's a genius writer too very fun to read

>>509416299
He wouldn't, but warlords enact discipline through fear not "love for community." You think the warlords raging across Africa right now are inspiring their soldiers with appeals to civic virtue?

>>509416299
>>509419396
Sorry, I misread your post, but an egoist could only be motivated by love for his community insofar as he saw said community as an extension of himself which is relative to how much it bends to his will.

>>509419533
why?

>>509417778
you sound like a little bitch pussy
go pay bills faggot

>>509419533
>he saw said community as an extension of himself
and when does this ever happen
today we see the 5% of the Stirners total individualism and its already world-ending tier of shitshow

i dont understand was Stirner :
1. trolling
2. was actually stupid
3. or actually believed that people are all genuinely good that will not bring the end of the world with their rampant selfishness and individualism

>>509413364
>(i.e. Christianity)
Slaves be obedient to your masters much? Not that I subscribe to this thinking but I'm just saying

there used to be a time when all the selfish egoists were just able to kill each other whenever they felt like it

>>509416867
>bettering our world
what did he mean by this?

>>509413136 (OP)
it can't. that's why we have wagies and normalfags

>>509420973
Stirner's conception of the egoist isn't accurate to humanity. He sees the perfect egoist as having no need for external validation but that's all egoists crave in real life.
>>509421238
"Turn the other cheek" is still a radical concept.

>>509413136 (OP)
The egoist seeks to be better then other people in society, so other people in society are needed for the egoist, this rat race creates a society

>>509417664
judenschutze

>>509413364
I get more power the more I help people. You are just too retarded to see it.

>>509413136 (OP)
Look into the union of egoists. It may be unrealistic, but Stirner covered most of the potential holes in his philosophy.

>>509424205
More importantly, Was he a jew

>>509421569
If you are alluding to to tikkun olam I'm sorry to disappoint. All that matters is the purity of blood and security of soil. Love for your race and a joy in the responsibility of the fight are prerequisites for this purpose. All individual suffering vanishes when faced with collective failure. What everyone needs to understand is that we all share the same fate as our race.

>>509413136 (OP)
>if everyone is a egoist individualist
Every motivation is essentially egoist.
Pure altruism doesn't exist.

>>509423077
He's pretty spicy but this is 4chan, I dont care

>>509423593
>I get more power the more I help people. You are just too retarded to see it.
This vatian jesuit knows his stuff.

>>509424521
>Was he a jew
worse, a germoid barbarian, like the rest of their psycho philosophers

>>509424682
>Pure altruism doesn't exist.
well of course your barbarian mind cant comprehend that
afterall you are satanic protestant destroyers of Europe and white people

>>509424875
That has nothing to do with barbarianism. It's just a fact. Every motivation is essentially egoist. You can't name a motivation for an action that I can't deduce to egoist motives.

>>509424875
jew

>>509424875
The argument that "pure altruism" exists or not it's itself a spook. Just a phrase, where is the reality of it? Maybe we can belittle all movement to unconscious desire that is intellectualized as pure altruism but is just a tendency towards the utility in tribalism. Maybe there is a divine nature that guides this. Maybe both, but the reality to you is all that can really matter from your perspective. A properly realized egoist(someone without spooks) may behave in a semi-collectivist way of that allows for his will to be expressed authentically and the collectivism is between equally realized egoists.

>>509425029
>>509425510
you westoids really scare me
trully soulles and golemized
is it genetics? capitalism? sexual liberation? broken families? what

>>509425841
Scared by reality? Seems to be a you problem.

>>509426239
yeah, your reality
I witness a lot of pure altruism in my Serbian orthodox trad town

>>509426491
>altruism in my Serbian orthodox trad town
That all do what they do in hope it gets them into heaven, yes?

>>509426670
no, the feeling of community and belonging and we are taught to be compassionate

maybe being attacked by foreign invaders all the time is what molded us into that
you wouldnt understand since you are one of the invaders and destroyers, hylics

>>509425841
I'm just using this philosophy of a sock puppet since it's the topic of the thread. Not necessarily reflective of my actual beliefs. That said what Stirner has to say about spooks is THE redpilling process. Anyone who is living for abstract ghost stories of the mind is not living authentically. Do not take this as a rejection of spirituality. On the contrary I don't think a person can really begin to have a proper relationship with the divine until they understand what they really are. Most people are very unrealized, operating on lies and lies to themselves, can you say I'm wrong?

>>509426961
>the feeling of community and belonging and we are taught to be compassionate
So you do it for a good feeling. If you won't do it, your community would expel you. And that would cause a bad feeling. Feeling of being alone, rejected, unaccepted.
It's an egoist motive.
Every religion on this planet is based on the same principle. Do good, get reward, from your community, from your Gods.

>>509413136 (OP)
A society filled of egoist individualist already existed through Africa and it doesn't function. They achieved nothing through thousand of years. Being a egoist individualist is just being a turbo nigger.

>>509427509
you are mentally retarded like your psychotic destructive dark philosophers
cant believe you never witnessed pure altruism
grim

>>509427359
>everything is a spook
wow, so redpilling man

some of those "lies" are unfalsifiable e.g. not able to be proven that they are lies so why even call them like that? because it sounds cool to call divine a lie that we invented to feel better? wheres the proof that its not the divine talking through us for example?

Reputation Eventually a selfish egoist who takes advantage of too many other people for his own individual interests will have ruined his reputation and then no one will want to have anything to do with him.
This is true even in a society filled entirely with selfish egoist individualists without a warlord or religion or anything else imposing any kind of morality or limits on individual behavior.
Without any kind of Kantian ethics or golden rule or anything like that, just like the purely sociopathic optimum for a selfish egoist individual would be to take advantage of other people just up to the point where any more would start to decrease the amount of people willing to cooperate with you that you can take advantage of for your own personal gain.
In the real world, unfortunately, selfish egoists can take advantage of a LOT of people before they start getting limited by a bad reputation. If you scam someone, you might not be able to scam that same person again, but there are plenty of other people who don't have the same reputational information about you that you can potentially scam.

>>509428010
How is what I said destructive? We are a social animal. That's what made us what we are. This construct exists so that social relationship between individuals works. It's our nature. How's that a bad thing? Obviously it allowed us to conquer the whole planet and beyond.

>>509413372
Self-control is a learned trait that originates from external control. The same way a dog, once trained to behave properly, no longer needs a leash to govern its behavior.

Damn this thread is hella spooky

>>509428196
This is where divide and conquer tactics become useful. If you can convince Person B that scamming Person A is good for Person B, and vice versa, then you can go on scamming both indefinitely.

>>509428196
>Kantian ethics or golden rule or anything like that
Even Kantian ethics have an egoist essence. It's just logically deductible. On average, everyone wants to survive in some kind of safety. However this is achieved. So it's only logical to agree to a maxim to grant everyone the same right to safety and integrity.

>>509428264
Donating anonymously to charity with no recognition or reward.
Risking your life to save a stranger (for example, rescuing someone from a burning building).
Volunteering time to help people in need without any compensation or acknowledgment.
Donating an organ to a stranger with no expectation of thanks or benefit.
Helping someone in distress (like giving food to a hungry person) when you know you’ll never see them again.

You are mentally retarded , soulless and cold like your barbarian philosophers.
There is a reason civilization started down here in the south and not up there in your shitty north.

thats why you invade, conquer and loot material wealth while we spiritually thrive and you hate us for it

>>509429087
>Donating anonymously to charity with no recognition or reward.
German is a language of striking clarity and in German we have a word for this that speaks more honestly to the nature of empathy than its English counterpart ever could: It's "Mitleid". It means "compassion" or "pity". But the literal translation is "with-suffering", you suffer with someone. A shared experience of pain or hardship seeing someone else in such a situation. Therefore if you help someone, you can attempt to ease your own suffering, relieving discomfort, guilt, or distress at seeing someone suffer.
It's an egoist motive. And the ability to feel "Mitleid" with someone allows us to function in a social society.

>>509427509
All human relationships and interactions are transactional in some way, otherwise they wouldn't happen. Both parties believe they are getting something out of it, or will get something out of it in the future.
However, that doesn't mean that the "reward" an individual receives is always something that is directly good for them as an individual. Sometimes people do things for other people that comes at their own personal expense because they care about the other person. Their reward is just the knowledge that they did something good or beneficial for the other person.
All fully functional human beings who aren't mentally/emotionally deficient in some way will have a sense of empathy and an innate understanding of basically the golden rule. I know that it would be wrong for me to murder/rape/steal from other people, because I know that I really wouldn't want other people to murder/rape/steal from me.
People do still murder/rape/steal from other people knowing that it is wrong, but they come up with some sort of justification or rationalization why it wasn't wrong for them to do it. Even something like saying "I am just inherently bad person" is a form of rationalization because it is an attempt to remove their own agency and culpability and responsibility for choosing to commit an act that they knew was wrong.

>>509428010
I'm not speaking on any of that. I feel like you didn't read my post at all. I'm just discussing this philosophy because I find it intriguing. You are the one who keeps jumping to conclusions and assuming. You do know you can entertain an idea without embodying it, right?

>>509416867
I see a lot of great examples of selfless behavior in this thread but I want to remind you guys that spending your time fighting kikes online, and also fighting their shit-colored golems too, is selfless behavior also done on behalf of your people, many of whom don't appreciate what you do and also are inconceivable of understanding the value of what you do. Every white guy here is really badass, some of the first people to fight an opponent that most people are too dumb to even see.

>>509429087
You could easily argue that all those things are results of unconscious drives, and even so Stirner's philosophy comments on all of that. "Pure altruism" could be the will of the egoist. You keep doing this whole soulless schtick, but this whole conversation seems to be you being autistic about words. This could be a soulful nature, I don't think you really get what stirner is trying to point at. Whether something is "soulless" or not is a mental construct. Reality is reality. Truth is truth. These concepts we throw in the wall to try to describe it become reality itself to you if you allow them to.

>>509430345
>Their reward is just the knowledge that they did something good or beneficial for the other person.
It's an reward, nonetheless >>509429817
>"I am just inherently bad person"
Which often stems from experiences at younger ages where they experienced neglect from their surroundings and one way to cope with that was convincing themself that they are a "bad person" who must do bad things. It's a way to cope with the own pain suffered at another time earlier in their history. Principally it's the same mechanism working here, just turned the other way around.