Im starting to get into soccer as someone who’s been a casual fan my whole life and have been watching prime Messi and Ronaldo tape to form an opinion in the debate

Am I missing something or what. Ronaldo is amazing and extremely exciting player but this lil nigga Messi is crazy I have yet to see anyone close to him. It’s like every time he touches the ball he creates a chance. I understand why the debate became a thing but what are the arguments against Messi?
Also assists should be like hockey where the person who passed to the guy who passed to the goalscorer also gets credited for an assist I feel that often the 2nd to last pass is the most significant.

>>149141554 (OP)
>Im starting to get into soccer
That's what they want. Abandon first world white sports and embrace the third world favela shit. Meanwhile, hockey is flourishing in mother fucking florida??

Messoy = Roids + fifa
TSUUUUUUUUU = hard work and beating the odds

>>149141554 (OP)
>every time he touches the ball he creates a chance
This was true in 2011

>>149141554 (OP)
There's no strong arguments against Messi. Penaldo fans are just retarded, and I don't give a damn at all about this debate

Cristiano was an amazing striker during his prime and is probably the UCL goat, but his lack of success in World Cup really tears him down. If Portugal won a WC with him scoring a goal in final maybe there would be no debate. World Cup is really what forges legends. Pelé, Cruyff, Maradona, Zidane, Ronaldo fenomeno... they made their name thanks to world cup success or huge performances. Cruyff is probably in the top5 discussion, would definitely be slightly higher if he won one with Netherlands.

So anyway, it really depends what competition is the most important for you : Champions League or World Cup, but I think WC is more important for legacy.

>>149141693
kek Ronaldo played for Madrid he's just as guilty of being pushed by Fifa as Riggi is. Things changed when he left the club which is why they gave the Ballon d'or to Modrić to punish him

>>149141849
Right I just said in the post I’m watching games from their prime
>>149141624
I’m just excited for the World Cup since for some reason they chose my little corner of the world to host the final lmao. Still in disbelief they’re gonna play the worlds biggest game in fucking east Rutherford New Jersey

Messi needs the whole system around him to set him up. Just look at his performance when he played for P$G. Completely invisible.

>>149141554 (OP)
both are overated

>>149142015
July 19’th, 2026
MetLife Stadium, East Rutherford,
New Jersey, USA

>>149141624
>hockey is flourishing in mother fucking florida
Not really, even after two championships no one here really cares

>>149141554 (OP)
Its a SVOL thing.
You either get it or you dont, its not objective its a subjective truth wich can be sumarized in a single word:
TSUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

>>149141554 (OP)
It's a matter of preference no matter what arguments are presented. Ronaldo is the better goalscorer, many fans admire his tenacity. He started out as a flashy dribbling-focused winger but became a goalscoring machine later in his career, thriving on his overall skill and athleticism. He reinvented himself a second time when he became more of a pure poacher as his age got to him. Ronaldo has performed in England, in Spain, and in Italy, and he is seen as the key player within the stacked Real Madrid squad that won the CL three times in a row, including many clutch victories (and quite a few offside goals that shouldn't have stood, but we digress). Ronaldo's athletic feats and overall attitude often stood out. He seemed to consciously bend a game to his will. Over and over again. And yeah, some just consider him more charismatic and handsome or whatever
There are reasons for some fans to prefer him over Messi. And there are reasons to consider Messi the better player. This question can never be answered for good, and anyone who tries to pretend this is a clear matter is dumb in my opinion. We're talking about a team sport with many different positions, countless teams, leagues, competitions, tactics, and managers here. And then there's the time axis. There's no way to objectively choose a single man to stand above others

It's Messi but Ronaldo is still a legend and an icon of the sport and it's crazy he almost kept up with Messi at all

>>149143919
Thank you Chat gpt.

>>149144050
Yeah, you're right ... no human could ever defend CR or call this entire debate dumb. You're welcome, Cristiano

the more players on the pitch you have the more redundant the goat debate becomes in a sport

>>149141554 (OP)
>the person who passed to the guy who passed to the goalscorer also gets credited for an assist
extremely fucking gay. assists shouldnt even be a thing. please stick to american sports

>>149141554 (OP)
am here to save you lots of time just listen to your eyes dont fall for the stats and the fake narratives. messi mogs ronaldo its been known for any real football player who actually watch the game

>>149141554 (OP)
Messi is the most naturally gifted football player to have ever existed. Dribbling, passing, finishing, he was the whole finished product. He was pretty much perfect at everything. He shifted the entire game to revolving around him. Barcelona would play through him and the opponents would shift their tactics to shut him down.
Ronaldo was nowhere close to as gifted. In fact, he wasn't even the most talented player in the Sporting Academy growing up. Quaresma was more highly touted prospect. What made Ronaldo great was his absurd dedication to improvement. He'd go through the regular training sessions and then spend an extra five hours training himself. He pivoted from trying to be a more complete player in his younger 20s into simply becoming a goal scorer in his later 20s to keep up with Messi, because that was the only way to keep up in the discussions and he wanted to be the best so absurdly bad. And the numbers speak for themselves. He had this stretch where he'd score like 12-15 goals in the Champions League season after season. Many of them in the knockout stage.
Having said that, he simply wasn't Messi. He was a more exciting story. A more inspirational storyline, but he wasn't as good of a football player. You'll notice how a lot of younger players have Ronaldo as their inspiration and idol growing up, but almost everyone agrees Messi was the best.

both are overrated
because both are shitty leaders

>>149144187
>assists shouldnt even be a thing
Ofc they should be. Tonnes of greats have insane assist stats.

>>149144587
was Messi even the captain at Barca?
no it was always someone else, other than a few years at the end
so how can he be the goat?
he wasnt even the most important player on his own team

>>149144662
Marquinhos was the most important player in PSG's treble, got it.

>>149144762
were talking about the goat
I just cant get over that
Pele was the captain of Santos, Beckenbauer was the captain of Bayern, Cruyff was the captain of Ajax, Maradona was the captain of Napoli

>>149144476
>listen to your eyes dont fall for the stats
so true. in fact, fifa should change the rules so that instead of putting the ball in the net, a goal is given by dribbling past a semi pro lel liga defender. doing a spin beforehand should be a multiplier too

>>149144050
nah, it’s an actual anon
he is obviously autistic but his takes are often quite good

Ronaldo is more clutch, has saved his teams with hattricks out of nowhere multiple times especially in the UCL and for Portugal
Has more goals and will become the first to reach 1k goals
Has more CLs (5 vs effectively 3) and holds CL records for goals and assists, as well as KO round goals and assists
UCL threepeat
Has adapted to 3 top leagues
Until 2022 had the better international career. Messi was seen as a choker and loser in the world stage in 2016 when he choked the final pen in the Copa America final and Ronaldo won the Euro
You can argue all his BdOs are well deserved whereas you can easily argue at least one of Messi's was fraudulent, if not more
Won all of Portugal's international trophies and qualified us for every tournament since he started playing for us

I think Messi is better and has more of a case for GOAT but there's plenty of reasons one could prefer Ronaldo desu. It was more of a debate before the WC but its

>>149141554 (OP)
Maradona is the real GOAT, you bum.

>>149141554 (OP)
When Messi first came on the scene, people were sucking his dick disproportionately. They’d show clips on TV of him just walking around the pitch and pundits would shriek and coom like he could do no wrong. It was insane. And when he finally got the ball, he just walked through people and nobody could touch him, like watching someone cheat at a videogame. I hated it. Luckily, other people hated it too, and they started claiming Cristiano Ronaldo was the real GOAT, because for some reason none of them could remember any other GOAT players like Pele. The football industry encouraged this idea that whoever the GOAT was, it was definitely someone you could watch playing now, because that makes them money when people believe that. It’s bullshit, but that didn’t stop them. I am very insistent that Messi is an overrated midget rigger, but even I concede that nobody would ever have tried to say Ronaldo was the GOAT if people hadn’t been sucking off Messi at the same time.

>>149144545
>naturally gifted
Dr Fuentes pls go

>>149152777
DIEGO is the GOAT you fucking nigger.

>Messi is the most naturally gifted
lmao people act like Pissi doesn't need to train at all
Pissi was super bad at free kick and passing when he was young. Ronaldo was better free kick taker than Pissi back in the day. I don't know why Ronaldo is super dogshit at free kick nowadays tho.

>>149141554 (OP)
stats vs magic
some people just dont understand

>>149141554 (OP)
Both are great players but if you're on /sp/ you will hate them both as their "fanboys" are just mentally ill and spam the board 24/7 with
>le riggitini - n-no you Penaldo
shit.

both of them don't fit in modern soccer anymore since both are lazy faggots that don't defend
its 11 vs 10 whenever they are on the field

for me it's always been obvious messi was the goat. it was simply more aesthetically pleasing to watch him play. ronaldo made lots of useless moves and helped his teams a lot by diving or threatening to dive, messi never did that. just cut through every defense like butter, made the right decisions always, in the right timing, with incredible accuracy and unparalleled agility. it's dumbfounding how great he was at everything except headers, and that's only because of his size.
pic related because the difference is probably the amount of dribbles that ended in a dive by ronaldo

>>149141554 (OP)
Pissi and Penaldo are the "GOAT" in the same way Marvel slop is the best movie or Last of Us is the best video game

>>149152912
this is untrue. Ronaldo has always defended and been in the top 3 for distances covered through his entire career lol.
messi on the other hand is indeed a systembaby who walks around the pitch out of possession to "conserve energy".

>>149152956
there's been tons of great dribblers, djalminha is the best dribblers of all time but no one ever mentions him anywhere, let alone in the conversation for the goat, messi and ronaldo are because they've been at the top for nearly two decades, something unheard of

messi was given hgh from a very early age, which gave him an abnormal strength and acceleration, even back in the day people were puzzled at how such a short guy could shove around defenders much bigger than him, he was also raised in a system he knew perfectly well, along a bunch of players that won everything before he was in the picture, and naturally continued doing it while he was there, and kept winning while he played for his nt. messi has also been glazed since his breakthrough, by the media, the refs and the suits in charge

ronaldo was the opposite of this, he's had to build his lanky gamer body, he's had to adapt to different systems and he's never had the protection of power that be, in fact he's been bullied since forever. and yet, he won, messi might be the best player ever if he wants, but ronaldo is the goat

>>149153219
sorry, wrong picture, i meant to post this one.
im trans btw

>sawker