/WoDg/&/CofDg/ - World of Darkness and Chronicles of Darkness General - /tg/ (#95973439) [Archived: 684 hours ago]

Anonymous
6/28/2025, 10:51:24 PM No.95973439
A_Vampire_being_repelled_by_a_Crucifix
A_Vampire_being_repelled_by_a_Crucifix
md5: cad514b06db4105dd5f578b4c47fcf6e🔍
Humanity Fuck Yeah Edition

>Previous Thread
>>95957404
>Pastebin
https://pastebin.com/WiCHizn0
>Mediafire
https://mediafire.com/folder/s9esc6u7ke8k5/CofD
>Mega I
https://mega.nz/folder/ePQ1BKhJ#RCosRCh59Ki2Mpb1M9H3Uw
>Mega II (also containing fanmade games)
https://mega.nz/folder/ZbQ2zLJA#DOT-3df6rS2lLet4_RmqJQ
>WoD5 Mega
https://mega.nz/folder/7rQQ1LbQ#16_AiXVGo0P3_rVOJuoZyA
>STV content folders
https://pastebin.com/9i9zhydQ
>General Creation Kit
https://mega.nz/#F!FWJgBTbb!f7d5rARWHYzuI8-8aI-Bxw
>Ideas: BJ Zanzibar's WoD
http://167.99.155.149/
>Anders Mage Page
http://mage.gearsonline.net/anders/
>White Wolf Wiki:
https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Main_Page

>Thread Question
Have you ever used True Faith in your games?
Replies: >>95973641 >>95974538 >>95974675 >>95975670 >>95977074 >>95979204
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:29:58 PM No.95973585
True Faith in WoD
True Faith in WoD
md5: ce39823016dcb4282474e1d6c6fa0ab6🔍
Yep, both for my character and for the NPCs when I am STing.
Replies: >>95975670
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:37:34 PM No.95973606
What's the difference between Wod spirits and COD spirits
Replies: >>95973649
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:37:44 PM No.95973608
Choose three groups to banish forever, but the World of Darkness will be redesigned to cater to the taste of the remaining two groups.
>Metaplot-obsessed lore police
>White room CharOp autists
>Melodramatic theater kid LARPers
>Secondaries who have only played Bloodlines
>Porn-brained fetishists
Replies: >>95973642 >>95973656 >>95973657 >>95973673 >>95973797 >>95973927 >>95973946 >>95974531 >>95975316 >>95975834 >>95977400
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:47:09 PM No.95973636
>>95972063
>Why not go alone?
Because I have suspicions that the main antagonist mage may have infiltrated the office, and mind controlled the other agents. Need a mage to sniff out the other mage bullshit.

>Are they cool with this?
I don't know, probably not.

>Did the GM let them roll?
I don't know, probably not.
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:49:06 PM No.95973641
>>95973439 (OP)
Mummies get it by default, so yes.
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:49:13 PM No.95973642
>>95973608
You will get the same answer as always. Keep Metaplot autists and LARPers. Kill the rest.
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:50:26 PM No.95973649
>>95973606
spirit ranks are better defined in CoD and spirits are more like mages in how they control a hyper-specific aspect of reality.
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:53:34 PM No.95973656
>>95973608
LARPers are cancer, they need to die
everyone else I'm fine with. Autists are more of a boon because they're willing to get into the nitty-gritty of the system, metaplotters know all the obscure setting detail, bloodlines secondaries are barely even noticable, and gooners make amazing fanart.
Replies: >>95973943 >>95991914
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:54:23 PM No.95973657
>>95973608
What is a white room CharOp autist?
Replies: >>95973673 >>95973693
Anonymous
6/28/2025, 11:56:33 PM No.95973673
>>95973608
You already asked this, I'd really like to get rid of everyone and keep the bloodlines secondaries. At gunpoint I'd keep the gooners because they'd stick to their own circle-jerk ERP tables and be filtered out of everyone else. There's already a shitload of fetish bait in the actual core so it wouldn't change much.

>>95973657
The sort of people who never play but theorycraft 40 dice to hit werewolf builds and scream bloody murder if you say you won't allow their path of conjuration tremere that summons suitcase nukes and does nothing else.
Replies: >>95973689
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:00:40 AM No.95973689
>>95973673
>The sort of people who never play but theorycraft 40 dice to hit werewolf builds and scream bloody murder if you say you won't allow their path of conjuration tremere that summons suitcase nukes and does nothing else.
Thank you! In that case I would ideally get rid of them, the lore police, and the fetishists. Theater types and people new to RPGs can be fun (IMHO).
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:01:34 AM No.95973693
>>95973657
"White room" in this context means when someone talks about things in a perfect vacuum, without considering any external factors.
"CharOp" in this context means character optimisation, as in the process of making a character as mathematically powerful as possible.
So a white room CharOp autist is someone who has a habit of designing characters to mathematically excel at specific situations without considering important aspects like their personality or their personal connections or how they would function in an actual game, as they often don't actually play the game and just enjoy pushing the system to its limits.
Replies: >>95973711
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:06:58 AM No.95973711
>>95973693
I appreciate both your patience with my ignorance and your thorough answer.
Replies: >>95991978
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:23:41 AM No.95973796
Any advice for chronicle crafting? I'm planning to run a game, first time as an ST and player, I want to modify Rites of Passage and set it in the Everglades using W20 rules. Of course this will take some work as certain elements just won't translate. Also just first time ST advice would be appreciated.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:24:03 AM No.95973797
>>95973608
Delete the secondaries first. Whenever they get their way, the setting is warped into the image of Bloodlines and its very specific interpretation of the World of Darkness.
Delete the white room autists second. We've seen what happens when they get their way with Mage the Awakening 2e, mechanical superiority creates obnoxious smugness.
Delete the fetishists third. They're not all that harmful but they can be single-minded and turn games into a slog with their devotion to smuttiness and perversion.

Elaborate, wild lore and emotional theatre kid roleplaying form the foundation on which WoD's appeal is built, so I'd keep those two for sure.
Replies: >>95974116
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:41:06 AM No.95973899
Bloodlines' fun campy atmosphere is better than the mopey shit that White Wolf wanted VtM to be.
Replies: >>95992003
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:45:59 AM No.95973927
>>95973608
For the love of god can people stop posting this thread-spam? This bullshit is filler.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:48:26 AM No.95973943
>>95973656
I have found the problem.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:48:31 AM No.95973946
>>95973608
Fuck off with your catty faggotry.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:19:34 AM No.95974116
>>95973797
Oh yeah speaking of Mage the Awakening 2e I've promised my players to run it sooner or later. How many of the rules am I going to have to change to make it fun experience for everyone? (Including me here too)
Replies: >>95974239 >>95974258
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:20:01 AM No.95974118
Imagine thinking that Bloodlines is the sole "fun campy" thing about VtM.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:32:55 AM No.95974186
1664398547285424
1664398547285424
md5: e5cb857a2eb4164ffef4f291ff398b63🔍
Fellow Tremere, what are your favorite rituals?
Replies: >>95974248 >>95974675 >>95974697 >>95978729
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:42:01 AM No.95974239
>>95974116
There is no possible way to answer that question, no one here has any idea about your table. The game works fine for the most part as written though.
Replies: >>95974354
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:44:46 AM No.95974248
>>95974186
Sculpting the perfect servant. The servant get 3 dots Minimum in all attributes out the gate, at the low price of a max humanity of 6(which is higher than most vamps will ever reach honestly). If this is DA, you can even make it work an gargoyles by building a birthing creature for the ritual.
Replies: >>95974304
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:46:15 AM No.95974258
>>95974116
System mastery is everything. Read the book, back to front, then read it again, and again. Commit the laborious process of making a spell to memory. Playing MtAw2e without having a proper grasp of the system is going to cause the game to slow to a crawl as soon as you try to do anything complicated.
Replies: >>95974354
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:57:21 AM No.95974304
>>95974248
>The caster rips the baby in half so that its blood drips across the belly of the woman.
Bruh.
Replies: >>95974384
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:04:05 AM No.95974354
>>95974258
That is solid advice. The system slowing was one of the my concerns at that certainly will help. But I was wondering if there was anything I could do to make it more digestible for a first game.

>>95974239
I was asking with the assumption that the rules as written will be to difficult for newcomers to Mage. If it helps we've got one guy who's a bit crazy and hotheaded, a joker but who's also serious, a guy much smarter than me, a rp heavy planner, and a nice down to earth everyman type.

The thing is they can all certainly learn the rules eventually but this game has so many complexities that trying to go full on from the start seems like it's not going to work out, and some of the systems (Time especially but there's lots) seem like they are ways for a story to breakdown more than anything.

Since I haven't actually done any games with everything running it could by my impressions are wrong but right now it seems like I'll need to curtail things from going off the rails from the beginning.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:07:45 AM No.95974384
>>95974304
What part of "Blood Magic" do you not understand? Were you expecting sunshine and rainbows?
Replies: >>95974705
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:34:57 AM No.95974531
>>95973608
>Remove Porn-brained fetishists
>All of the Vampire, Werewolf and Changling books vanish into dust
Replies: >>95981940
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:36:12 AM No.95974538
>>95973439 (OP)
Used the power of Christ to kill a werewolf mid transformation with a silver cross
Replies: >>95974574
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:42:29 AM No.95974574
>>95974538
that's not how that works though? Shorthand TF doesn't hurt werewolves, just prevents them using rage. Inquisitor style in-depth TF only gives you the power to 1 vs 1 a werewolf.
Replies: >>95977089
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:58:25 AM No.95974675
>>95973439 (OP)
Was a memorable session, walking into a church in search of a weird cult, only to recognize the reverend and many of his parishioners seemed to shine, and my vampire was suddenly hesitant to so much as shake their hands lest he burst into flames.
Oh, and then there was the little old woman who prayed to the Archangel Michael, and none of us dared to kill her despite her being a walking Masquerade breach. My vampire managed to power through her holy aura and tie her up, then nearly died when she made an escape attempt during the daytime.

>>95974186
Top 3 I've used have been: Illuminate the Trail of Prey, Principal Focus of Vitae Infusion, Donning the Mask of Shadows
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 3:01:10 AM No.95974697
>>95974186
Lvl 1:
Blood contract
Impressive visage

Lvl 2:
Principal focus of vitae infusion
Donning the Mask of Shadows

Lvl 3:
Bind the familiar
Approach the Veil :^)
Eyes of the past
(obligatory Inherited Affinity for thee, not for me)

Lvl 4:
Splinter servant

Lvl 5:
Enchant talisman
Escape to a true friend
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 3:02:11 AM No.95974705
>>95974384
Expect sunshine, witch.
Replies: >>95992078
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 3:03:47 AM No.95974716
file
file
md5: 841f6e8e1d6557df763391acee5ae574🔍
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 4:01:03 AM No.95975014
-City Gangrel
-Kiasyd
-Lasombra
-Tremere
-Ventrue
This is the ideal coterie composition. You may not like it, but this is what peak performance looks like.
Replies: >>95975067 >>95975361 >>95975616 >>95977097 >>95978897
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 4:16:06 AM No.95975067
>>95975014
Why?
Replies: >>95975090
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 4:19:07 AM No.95975090
dream
dream
md5: a63aebbebca705be0aca75242e74eb91🔍
>>95975067
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:01:04 AM No.95975316
>>95973608
I'll get rid of everyone except
>Melodramatic theater kid LARPers
>Porn-brained fetishists
We're going back to basics, everyone
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:07:35 AM No.95975361
>>95975014
>Ventrue
>Toreador
>Tzimisce
>Nosferatu
>Brujah
>Lasombra
>Gargoyle (possible controlled by ST)
Now we're talking
Replies: >>95975387 >>95975404 >>95976147 >>95993532
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:10:58 AM No.95975387
>>95975361
No thanks dramafag
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:14:00 AM No.95975404
>>95975361
>Tzimisce
>Nosferatu
>Gargoyle
Fucking freak legion.
Replies: >>95976163
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:53:21 AM No.95975616
>>95975014
Besides the Kiasyd and the inter sect bullshit, I see where you are comming from.
Replies: >>95975649
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:01:01 AM No.95975649
>>95975616
There are Tremere in the Sabbat. Who do you think made those Blood Brothers?
Replies: >>95975683 >>95977903
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:06:09 AM No.95975670
>>95973439 (OP)
>>95973585
>when you have immense true faith but all you do is use it to transubstantiate water into wine when it touches your lips as you live as a miserable hobo
Replies: >>95975687
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:10:13 AM No.95975683
>>95975649
Adulthood is accepting the Camarilla is the best sect.
Replies: >>95975950
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:10:58 AM No.95975687
>>95975670
at least your blood will taste repulsive
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:14:29 AM No.95975697
1751006865077105m
1751006865077105m
md5: 113219b01ddce8bd29f6b352a32c4741🔍
>Send in the monkeys
Replies: >>95975783
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:39:11 AM No.95975783
31
31
md5: 49edd08237d996e9b8969c3de01a4948🔍
>>95975697
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:55:36 AM No.95975834
>>95973608
WoD's metaplot is usually so awful you can't even include it in your games without breaking the theme or setting. The people that push it constantly need to be banished.
Replies: >>95976645
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:03:10 AM No.95975875
1720537331644977
1720537331644977
md5: dfdaca2f9a3c06bfbe20b69a4d5e6c5e🔍
Chronicles of Fagness
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:21:23 AM No.95975950
>>95975683
And childhood is whatever you're doing.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:14:49 AM No.95976147
>>95975361
Based Gothic-Romance melodrama enjoyer
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:19:52 AM No.95976163
>>95975404
>NOOoOOOooOo!!! Vampires have to be pale sexy Interview with the Twilight Carmilla hot. You can't have ugly/monstrous vampires
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:29:22 AM No.95976548
IMG_1665
IMG_1665
md5: 9b825c541f4b6ee12c124add4f4d2b7d🔍
Wraith is peak whiny and depressing goth. It just turns out most people are fucking posers.
Replies: >>95976609 >>95976991 >>95977400 >>95979220
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:43:32 AM No.95976609
>>95976548
Wraith is in my opinion the most gothicpunk splat. Even moreso than Vampire.
It's such a gloomkino game. Shame people are too weak to handle the Shadow mechanics.
Replies: >>95977278
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:50:17 AM No.95976645
>>95975834
The meta plot can be simplified as 'The End is Near'. That's all you really need. Centuries old tensions and grudges are coming to a head and it's going to be bad for everyone when it all boils over. Your character can be in denial of that, ignorant to it, preparing for it, fighting against it, or contributing to it, but the vibe is there all the same.
Replies: >>95976699
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:12:06 AM No.95976699
>>95976645
That's not what metaplot means. The end being nigh is a theme, and/or a setting fixture. Metaplot is the details, specifically the details that were updated frequently to give the setting a sense of "being alive." Things like The Week of Nightmares is metaplot, Gehenna being nigh is too vague to really constitute.

When that Anon is complaining about metaplot and the people who push it, he means things like "The Gangrel Justicar threw a fit and declared his clan was leaving the Camarilla, and somehow most Gangrel actually followed him" as well as the kind of player who would be upset if you told them you weren't having that happen in your game because you dislike it.
Replies: >>95994030
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 12:35:24 PM No.95976991
Doomslayers!
Doomslayers!
md5: 190d051db8b5832bff53b1f413fe1c96🔍
>>95976548
People don't see the things behind the gloom of Wraith. It is pretty fucking fun to play when you have ST that know what he is doing.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:08:09 PM No.95977074
>>95973439 (OP)
My ST allowed me to have it. Even used it to wreck a Garou spirit or two.
He then hit me with a choirester and I had to fall back on my charisma anyway
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:13:56 PM No.95977089
>>95974574
Vampire TF lets you inflict aggravated damage on touch per success
Replies: >>95978401
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:17:05 PM No.95977097
>>95975014
Tzimisce and/or Assamite are a more reliable vitae bank than Tremere, and also come with their own sorceries, while everything else the Tremere can do, the Venture can do better.
Past that, a Cappodician can essentially skull-munch his way to godhood, which makes up for the battle and esoteric potential of the rest.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:57:01 PM No.95977220
I'm reading "Lore of the Bloodlines" and Nagaraja has this merit
>Wolverine’s Palate (3pt. Merit)
>Though many do not know this, the dreaded wolverine is one of only a few creatures in the world that can eat their prey entirely, whether larger or smaller. The Nagaraja with this Merit has the ability to eat bone just as easily as flesh, sapping even more spiritual essence from her victim and converting it to blood points. With one bite, she can cut through flesh and bone and swallow it all at once with no ill effect. This also means she may gain up to 5 additional blood points from a body by consuming the bone
Fuck scribd btw
Unless I'm missing something this doesn't have any drawbacks, no sharper teeth that others could notice and such?
Replies: >>95977227 >>95977295
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 1:58:54 PM No.95977227
>>95977220
It's a merit, they usually don't have one.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:12:20 PM No.95977278
>>95976609
It sounds like a really cool mechanic until the person who plays your shadow does it in the dumbest lolsorandom way. "Kill yourself kill yourself kill that guy kill that guy" is not compelling at all.
Replies: >>95992241
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:15:14 PM No.95977295
>>95977220
Apart from the inherent drawback that eating a person might have on your morality score, nope.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:31:42 PM No.95977365
suck
suck
md5: 20d2eaddf108155758d61e1af54f955a🔍
God, I regret pirating Wyrmtide.
The fuck is this? These are the "famous" Garou of today? What the fuck W5? No wonder Garou Nation shattered with these fucks.
Get of Fenris areright, these fuckers can't accomplish shit.
Replies: >>95977414 >>95977440 >>95977445
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:40:01 PM No.95977400
I like True Faith, whether as the nonsensical greater force or as the actual faith-questioning kind.
I'm lucky enough not to have players wanting to play it too often. Both can be taxing, though obviously for very different reasons.

>>95973608
I've played with every and each of those, and none can't be made to have fun with.
In the end, what matters is how willing everyone around the table is willing to compromise and allow others to have their fun.
That said, porn-fetichists probably hate me for how dry I make the games.

>>95976548
I love the game to death (pun may or may not be intended; open the box to know) but I can't run it as anything but Core book, one shot only.
It's not a note you can sustain for long before it takes its toll in one way or another.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:42:04 PM No.95977414
>>95977365
I'm 90% sure at this point Paradox is a Pentex subsidiary with the goal of turning people against the goals of the Garou.
Replies: >>95977891
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:49:32 PM No.95977440
>>95977365
Idk, famous people are nowadays pretty much SoMe junkies. It seems pretty real that they would be this in your face about saving the Earth. The shit that Werewolf is supposed to be about?

the fact that she's a Red Talon is actually what bewilders me. I mean... how is she even using a phone?
Replies: >>95978011 >>95981940 >>95981960
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 2:50:48 PM No.95977445
>>95977365
Can't judge the whole book on that snippet, but I've been wondering for a while about what seems to me a current (minor, but noticeable) trend of refusing allegory (which personally I like), but at the same time of being unable to take the alternate reality of a fictional world as its own thing. We end up with fiction that all too often seems like a dry re-enactment of the real world, with skin-deep presentation flavor on top.
Replies: >>95977591
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 3:33:16 PM No.95977591
>>95977445
because pissans on the internet enjoy interpreting a work of fiction in the most bad faith way possible cuz they think it makes them look smart, usually that the story is racist. many writers are terrified by the notion that what they write could be considered racist so they write their allegories so on the nose as to be re-enactments
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 4:42:27 PM No.95977891
>>95977414
When do we get some banes?
Replies: >>95981466
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 4:45:21 PM No.95977903
>>95975649
Canonically the Sabbat Tremere all died suddenly by magic because the some writer decided they didn't want them to be a thing anymore. They're still a thing in my version of the setting though since Tremere are loyal to the clan alone and see both sects as means to their ends.
Replies: >>95994216 >>95994295
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:04:59 PM No.95978011
Wolf's Kin
Wolf's Kin
md5: b130f371e55302a1ea5efd545798fc0b🔍
>>95977440
If this was previous editions, Pentex would have already killed her and her entire network through those posts alone.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:15:01 PM No.95978061
Squick aside, wouldn't the rational move for Garou be to fuck wolves constantly since it's a lot faster and cheaper to produce an adult wolf than an adult human?
Replies: >>95978170 >>95978465 >>95979531
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 5:33:36 PM No.95978170
>>95978061
Alright first off
>Garou
>rational
Second
There's not that many wolves left, especially in the USA. That would lead to worse inbreeding than the Silver Fangs lickidy split. Also, those wolves and kinfolk (wolves) probably also "belong" to a Clan or Clans and they probably wouldn't take kindly to you walking up and trying to turn them into breeding cattle right in front of their cereal.
Replies: >>95978429 >>95981940
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:15:15 PM No.95978401
>>95977089
Not on werewolves. That's what it does to Vampires.
Replies: >>95978593
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:18:08 PM No.95978413
1429597436546
1429597436546
md5: 3069d6547694a646e140c2c033021427🔍
Do Vampires get tired? The curse of day making them sleep is exactly that, but if there was no sun, or maybe a particularly wealthy and well connected Ventrue just decided he was going to outfly the sun so the party don't stop, could they get by entirely on Blood? Or would they eventually need to take a little nappy cause their legs are sore and their brain is heavy?
Replies: >>95978609 >>95978838 >>95981421
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:21:53 PM No.95978429
>>95978170
>That would lead to worse inbreeding than the Silver Fangs lickidy split
So... Nothing that the purebreed-focused tribes weren't already dealing with?
Joking aside, this wouldn't really be an issue. You only need 150 individuals and careful management for mated parings to prevent inbreeding. There are Thousand of wolves across the world.
But that would also be retarded compared to just fucking Spirits. Spirits and garou mate to produce full garou every time. Literally just summon some spirits of fertility and go wild to cure all the garou nation's population issues(and introduce New issues like food, housing, limited caerns, limited parents/teachers, etc).
Replies: >>95978495
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:28:09 PM No.95978465
>>95978061
The Children of gaia have a rite that lets them turn anyone into a full kinfolk. Anyone. The rite also explicitly works better the younger the person is, so they could just swing by every school and orphanage in the US/First World to turn the next generation into on big glob of kinfolk. If they feel like being even more rational, they'd bargain the rite with other fera to let them boost their own kin numbers(Not the ananasi though, those fuckers could outnumber humanity if they wanted).
Replies: >>95978563
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:34:16 PM No.95978495
>>95978429
Across the entire world, yes. How many are concentrated in a specific area? How close is the breeding going to be watched? How are you going to convince the Garou already hanging out with their 40-80 wolves to let you have a nice shag? What if you live in Bongland or Europe in general that isn't Turkey or Siberian Russia? Wolf populations are extremely concentrated to specific geographic areas.
Replies: >>95978516
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:37:57 PM No.95978516
>>95978495
Anon, if you read the entire post you'd know that the first two lines were a segway to my actual point.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:45:37 PM No.95978555
Hi, the person running W20 here. Any cool ideas for creating a Garou Sept in or near Philadelphia?
(I'm doing something with the ghost of George Washington, long story)
Replies: >>95978692
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:47:07 PM No.95978563
>>95978465
Going into schools and doing questionable things with kids does seem in-character for them.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:54:52 PM No.95978593
Screenshot_20250629_105341_Chrome
Screenshot_20250629_105341_Chrome
md5: ab5d7a39b7d92a0edac7918c08a9daf3🔍
>>95978401
It does it to all supernatural creatures, vampires are usually specified because they're the most common target.
Replies: >>95978620 >>95978737
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 6:58:08 PM No.95978609
>>95978413
There are rituals that allow you to turn your haven/vicinity immune to sunlight. However, I've yet to see a mention of implication that that allows you to just stay up all day.
So my take is:
>RAW
You got a sleep sometime or you get cranky and take maluses
>ST purview
You can probably pull a few all-dayers by burning vitae. You're undead after all.
Replies: >>95978661
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:00:14 PM No.95978620
Screenshot_20250629_105956_Drive
Screenshot_20250629_105956_Drive
md5: 50fcc21452fb6102213423ea3bad4a9b🔍
>>95978593
Wrong screenshot
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:06:06 PM No.95978661
>>95978609
Yeah I can't quite find anything that says so one way or the other. Being able to get around the Daysleep in any way feels wrong, but also just having to still sleep like a mortal feels thematically incorrect too. What about places like Norway where it's night for months at a time?
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:11:50 PM No.95978692
City Fathers
City Fathers
md5: 87d4ae1b47de28b152c7e5a397e8c18d🔍
>>95978555
Will it involve a City Father too? It sound like it fits the bill.
Replies: >>95978802
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:20:08 PM No.95978729
>>95974186
The one where I prove you're a Baali and make your ass meet the sun
Replies: >>95981760
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:21:46 PM No.95978737
>>95978593
Aren't people with True Faith themselves supernaturals? Can they repel each other?
Replies: >>95978752
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:22:19 PM No.95978740
Anyone know where the fuck "sungold", the sun version of Moonsilver used to make super-klaives, is detailed in? The fucking wiki doesn't provide a source. It's not in "Rage across the Heavens" or "Umbra"
Replies: >>95981002 >>95981176
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:24:19 PM No.95978752
>>95978737
According to mage: Yes, but only if they're of apposing faiths. Modern nights V20 also agrees, it only affects supernatural violently opposed to your faith(so vamps, spectres and black spirals are toast, but normal wraiths and werewolves might be unaffected).
Dark ages is the weird one out.
Replies: >>95978841
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:35:21 PM No.95978802
>>95978692
No, I already used that one in Vancouver, I was looking for something more local
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:42:25 PM No.95978838
>>95978413
Physically? No, the undead never tire. Daysleep is mystical, not physical. Even the biggest fatass in life could run ten miles without tiring if they get embraced.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:42:40 PM No.95978841
>>95978752
Hear me out:
Zealot the Prejudice.
A splat all about individuals who possess true faith and the war between them, the rest of the supernatural world and each other, with different religions deploying all sorts of miracles against each other, so certain are they of their righteousness.
Replies: >>95978908 >>95979062 >>95979130
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:54:24 PM No.95978897
>>95975014
>Ventrue
Natural face, rich, broadly useful disciplines, has easier access to the upper echelons of vampire politics via nepotism.
>Brujah
Two combat disciplines, one of which is celerity. Not inherently ugly, can easily be the muscle while doing other things.
>Tremere
Mandatory mystic weirdo, has the deepest bag of bullshit they can pull from as the game develops.
>Nosferatu
Thematic clan curse, sneaky as hell, can spy on anyone and everyone.

This is the ideal four man VtM coterie. Covers all your bases, none are one trick ponies, no convoluted backstories to justify their presence because all are Cam 7. If you have a fifth, throw in any of the other three cam clans depending on what you need more of.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 7:57:06 PM No.95978908
>>95978841
That'd just be an extension on DA Inquisitor
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:28:18 PM No.95979062
>>95978841
Sounds like Mage the Ascension
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:42:43 PM No.95979130
>>95978841
That’s exactly what Celestial Choristers were doing before they realized they were all “singing” the same song.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:54:34 PM No.95979185
i... am an atheist...
and my bible?
*holds up a copy of The God Delusion and blinds all vamps in the vicinity with my True Faith in Science*
Replies: >>95979195 >>95979206 >>95979216 >>95979612
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:57:20 PM No.95979195
>>95979185
Anon, True Faith in science would mean you aren't an athiest. You would worship Science as your thiesm.
Not worshipping a deity in your religion is Adeism, not atheism. Atheism is not having a belief system, period.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:59:23 PM No.95979204
>>95973439 (OP)
>TQ

I'm actually not the biggest fan of out of the box True Faith. It's a cop-out way of giving people holy powers without confirming the existence of God (or any deity for that matter), and without making it just another form of magic. Don't get me wrong, for its intended use Being confronted by some jesus freak who can make you flee at the sign of the cross when you've spent the entire game laughing at the movie weaknesses it does just fine. But beyond that it falls flat.

Which to be fair it's not like I have an immediate solution myself. How you approach real world religions and how real they are in-setting is an inherent issue with urban fantasy. God left, God is here but is vagueposting, actually there's a divine godhead and everyone is right and wrong at the same time; it's a messy thing to be sure. I wish I had a solution I personally found satisfying, but I don't. True Faith just never satisfied once you get into the how and why.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 8:59:24 PM No.95979206
>>95979185
Sorry buddy but my truth faith in Money means I can throw up a few thousand dollars and shield my eyes from the gamma rays of light
God Bless the Almighty Dollar!
Replies: >>95979259
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 9:00:46 PM No.95979216
>>95979185
>doesn't actually have True Faith but repels the vamps nonetheless by invoking the Consensus Reality that says they can't exist
Replies: >>95979228
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 9:01:17 PM No.95979220
Ghost Girl_thumb.jpg
Ghost Girl_thumb.jpg
md5: 1135f317ce59205f470ab906ed829385🔍
>>95976548
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 9:02:47 PM No.95979228
>>95979216
>invoking the Consensus Reality
Vampires don't give a shit about consensus. There are many supernaturals out there that don't.
Replies: >>95979268
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 9:09:20 PM No.95979259
>>95979206
>doesn't actually have true faith but is protected by invoking the Wyrm spirit Almighty Dollar
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 9:11:40 PM No.95979268
>>95979228
Aren't only like, playable splats are exceptions?
Arguable Changeling with Banality and Disbelief also counts.
Dragons, Giants, Spirits, Aliens etc. got fucked.
Replies: >>95979327 >>95979540
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 9:24:36 PM No.95979327
>>95979268
Spirits also don't care about concensus and there are more of them than every other supernatural combined.
Biggest issue is for them is that the Weaver is pro-humanity and consensus.
Replies: >>95979914
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:07:46 PM No.95979531
>>95978061
I'm not really up on my dogfucking lore, but not all wolves are like, kin wolves, right? So if a garou just fucks a normal wolf, does that have a chance to pop out a full garou or a kinfolk wolf?
Replies: >>95979541 >>95979592
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:09:45 PM No.95979540
>>95979268
Demons also have a harder time manifesting their apocalyptic forms among active disbelievers.
Replies: >>95979603
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:09:51 PM No.95979541
>>95979531
Same chance as with humans, 1%, and 1 per litter unless the ST wants to be special.
Replies: >>95979636
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:16:48 PM No.95979592
>>95979531
Wolves reach first-change age in less than 2 years compared to a human's 13-18. This mean 9 generations of wolf kin and lupus garou can be born in the time it takes a single human kin/homid generation to change.
Going by even basic population math, Every wolf in the wild should be kinfolk, Woofs shouldn't be having population issues ever, and the ananasi would have enslaved humanity because they'd outnumber the humans 30-to-1.
Replies: >>95979636 >>95979649
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:18:36 PM No.95979603
>>95979540
But they also get a larger hit of faith when they do shift because revelation would hit harder. Demons are pretty much built to shatter the masquerade/veil/consensus and the corebook comes out to say as much directly to the reader.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:20:05 PM No.95979612
>>95979185
It's funny because in WoD Science is just the Technocrats' made up bullshit and your sky daddy is the atom instead of a white guy with a beard and anger issues.
Replies: >>95979631
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:22:49 PM No.95979631
>>95979612
>in WoD Science is just the Technocrats' made up bullshit
Mage itself literally comes out to say this is tradition propaganda. Earthly Foundations, the things that exist whether or not consensus exists, have been a thing since 2e. Tradition mages just have the unfortunate disability of being organized by the order of hermes, whose entire paradigm is built on believing all of reality is a lie.
Replies: >>95979646 >>95979939 >>95979992 >>95981940
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:23:54 PM No.95979636
>>95979541
Thank you, anon.

>>95979592
I'm not contesting the math I just wanted to make sure I was following along properly.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:26:08 PM No.95979646
The Horizon's Worth - TRAD MAGE VICTORY
The Horizon's Worth - TRAD MAGE VICTORY
md5: 283a37faeb5d127ffdc97cf30aed697b🔍
>>95979631
I guess pic related is from an older edition then? I saved it from some magefag arguing the opposite of what you're telling me.
Replies: >>95979660 >>95979672
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:26:33 PM No.95979649
>>95979592
>and the ananasi would have enslaved humanity because they'd outnumber the humans 30-to-1.
More proof whitewolf can't do math.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:28:56 PM No.95979660
>>95979646
That's from Horizon, a 2e book.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:30:58 PM No.95979672
>>95979646
I don't understand the point being made that relates the pic to the thing I said?
Replies: >>95979728
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 10:39:19 PM No.95979728
>>95979672
You know you're right I remember it saying something else and got mixed up. I'm sorry.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:11:10 PM No.95979914
Materialize
Materialize
md5: 129242a4b37211fc2062e0cac92276a5🔍
>>95979327
Anon, most Spirits can't even Materialize and those who can only do it for short amounts of time. This is literally the core of their stuff. Hell, it says "Most spirits won’t use this Charm
except in extraordinary circumstances; the modern world is far from welcoming to their kind."
Like Dragons and other stuff, they are stuck on their other side vast majority of time.
Replies: >>95979931
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:13:29 PM No.95979931
>>95979914
Anon, the WtA books make it clear that this is because of the Weaver.
The gauntlet is reversed for Weaver-aligned spirits(low in cities, high in the wild).
Replies: >>95979958
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:14:48 PM No.95979939
Format Space
Format Space
md5: e26b5f087e3385e410f090f55694578a🔍
>>95979631
Earth foundations aren't Technocratic science.
Earthly foundations are things like Time, Death, something that resembles Grativity, etc. And really, only truly present on Earth. It exists mostly because of historical inertia.

Hell, that was a plot point in one of ToJ, where the Technocratic paradigm collapsed and the friction mostly went away.
Replies: >>95979992 >>95980040 >>95980060
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:17:54 PM No.95979958
Barriers
Barriers
md5: 225d843230d8cc6820bc3e64ada137ae🔍
>>95979931
Oh please, if we go back to books on "who did what", we will be debating until the end of time.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:24:01 PM No.95979992
>>95979631
>>95979939
>Earthly Foundations, the things that exist whether or not consensus exists, have been a thing since 2e.
>It exists mostly because of historical inertia.
The books waffle back and forth on this Hard. Some books say things exist regardless of consensus, others say consensus is everything, and it's pretty clear the authors disagreed. Mage is just straight-up inconsistent.
I personally hate "consensus is everything", it literally defeats itself when you think about the nitty-gritty and it makes mage extra-hostile to crossover.
Replies: >>95980028
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:31:40 PM No.95980028
Anthropic Principle
Anthropic Principle
md5: a835ecaf71411178374312303aecdcf5🔍
>>95979992
I mean, it is pretty simple. Hell, even the Technocracy explains it.

There is the classic deep umbra nonsense, on top of it the Consensus of Nature aka Gaia, and then on top of it the Consensus of Humanity. The Earthly Foundations are the Consensus of Nature.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:33:46 PM No.95980040
>>95979939
Earthly foundations are different from historical inertia. Foundations are specifically truths independent of consensus, historical inertia are things that do bend to consensus, but were around so long they don't change very fast. Revised also introduced "Cosmological Constats" which are magical things that exist in all realities, but also different from mythic threads entirely... This shit is too complicated.
Anonymous
6/29/2025, 11:37:39 PM No.95980060
>>95979939
>Earth foundations aren't Technocratic science.
Not enlightened science. "Science" is still a thing independant of consensus, because the things outside consensus have Rules that can be studied. There are technological tools that function just fine in reality zones that are actively hostile to technology.
Technically, Sorcery should be considered a branch of true science in WoD.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:00:44 AM No.95980182
has anyone here played the text based games for VTM? dunno if the price is worth it for them
night road, parliament of knives, etc.
I know it's not board game material but idk if any other boards would have played these desu
Replies: >>95980200 >>95980209 >>95980627
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:04:01 AM No.95980200
1748769570486747_thumb.jpg
1748769570486747_thumb.jpg
md5: 3ec774b51ec0af186cb03b8ecb3f232c🔍
>>95980182
I've played night road, parliament of knives and sins of the sires. The last one sucks, but the first two are pretty good (the dogboy game is pretty good too- and I don't even like werewolf)
You can always pirate them and decide if it's worth buying later.
Replies: >>95980237 >>95980494
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:05:22 AM No.95980209
>>95980182
>idk if any other boards would have played these desu
You can join our friendly "Choose your own adventure games" on /vrpg/
Replies: >>95980494
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:09:51 AM No.95980237
>>95980200
>spidy is trying so fucking hard
How did your ananasi survive this long?
Replies: >>95980262 >>95980724
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:13:15 AM No.95980262
>>95980237
>your ananasi
Not mine.

>survive this long?
Rectal feeding.
Replies: >>95980539
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:52:18 AM No.95980494
>>95980200
>>95980209
I might try them then. so little content that is good for such a large world, I am starved.
Replies: >>95980509
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 12:54:52 AM No.95980509
jailbreak
jailbreak
md5: 278bbd21eb59be7b6e6b7ab951336073🔍
>>95980494
Go to piratebay and get parliament of knives, night road and book of hungry names. Be sure to get the latest version.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 1:00:11 AM No.95980539
>>95980262
>Rectal feeding
Why would you waste seed on anal instead of breeding your goth gf like gaia intended?
Replies: >>95980563 >>95980764
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 1:03:17 AM No.95980563
breathing
breathing
md5: 780fde7b14ea062192dcab43e11eafba🔍
>>95980539
Because the future is rectal-everything.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 1:18:23 AM No.95980627
file
file
md5: 7b6a3d119c7cabc5b73eb9484e9d8f2d🔍
>>95980182
honestly pirate them first, i bought them because i wanted to support the devs
parliament and night road are very good, absolutely loved W:TA - Heart of the Forest, amazing atmosphere and art. ending is a bit abrupt though but thats just kind of the nature of these games. havent played HoTF's sequel, heard its good, its up next for me
the 'of New York' VNs are good, heard the newest one is mid, LOVED shadows of new york
Replies: >>95980884
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 1:38:04 AM No.95980724
>>95980237
I'ma guess hiding and carefully screening for marks as easy as mealworms. You just know she does that every time and she's still fat with all those extra calories to spend webbing tunnels.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 1:45:21 AM No.95980764
>>95980539
Ananasi don't need the help being bred. Their multi-spider form means their lupus equivalent can birth millions of kinfolk every batch, that all mature within 2 weeks to a month, each with a 1% chance to create another anansai.
Spiders are also one of the few animals that've done even Better after humans moved in, since all the human garbage means their food sources get plenty of nutrition to multiply.
If they really wanted to , they could replace the garou as gaia's shock-troops by weight of numbers alone.
Replies: >>95981940
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 2:04:22 AM No.95980884
>>95980627
>havent played HoTF's sequel, heard its good, its up next for me
Please don't. I refunded it after the first chapter. It was seriously insulting.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 2:29:02 AM No.95981002
>>95978740
Just copy paste the Exalted Oricalcum.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 3:04:24 AM No.95981176
>>95978740
Isn't moonsilver that metal that gives everyone who holds it a permanent gnosis point, act like silver as a weapon, does aggravated damage to everything, and does double damage on top of that to anything vulnerable to silver, All Before being made into a fetish?
I'm honestly kind of glad the sun version never became a thing. One substance players can hoard to become a gnosis 20 demigod is too much already.
Replies: >>95981525 >>95981781
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 3:21:32 AM No.95981245
today i learned that a group of virtual adepts tried to delete a random city in germany from the consensus for 25 years and the syndicate had to step in to stop it
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bielefeld_conspiracy
Replies: >>95981290
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 3:28:53 AM No.95981290
>>95981245
someone already made a book on it
>https://legacy.drivethrurpg.com/product/476183/Bielefeld-Files?manufacturers_id=1
i haven't read it
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:01:26 AM No.95981421
>>95978413
I recall it being mention in something that when vampires go above the arctic circle to spend a lot of time awake they get a bit weird. I can’t recall what talked about it though…maybe Dark Ages: Europe but maybe not.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:08:20 AM No.95981466
>>95977891
Banes?
Replies: >>95981491 >>95981994
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:13:12 AM No.95981491
>>95981466
If Pentex is going to rape my games, they should at least give me a cool bane.
Replies: >>95981994
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:19:11 AM No.95981525
>>95981176
>All Before being made into a fetish?
Yes, It's fucking great. Just dipping an unfinished klaive in that shit qualifies it as a level 6 fetish!
Replies: >>95982154
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:02:19 AM No.95981760
>>95978729
What if I'm NOT a baali?
Replies: >>95993989
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:04:44 AM No.95981781
>>95981176
Wait, couldn't an abomination just hold onto a moonsilver fetish and ignore the effects of gnosis degeneration?
Replies: >>95981823
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:15:12 AM No.95981823
>>95981781
yes, it's the only reason why that one bastet abomination in the true black hand is still around
Replies: >>95981947
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:24:07 AM No.95981867
Fag anons, favorite splat for each gameline?
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:41:51 AM No.95981940
>>95974531
W:tA never kept many porn-brained folk around for long. To be frank, I'd rather have them around than the one true wayers that formed the Nordic LARP clique at Paradox and gave us W5.

>>95977440
The Nordic LARP clique said so.

>>95978170
It scans that Garou aren't super rational. After all, they're part human.

>>95979631
In Mage and perhaps some others, but W:tA took the position that science is a correct way of discovering things about the world, which is why the Weaver is interested in it, as the Weaver itself does not know the entirety of what it spun. Its goal is very much like the Infosphere from Futurama. At any rate, in Werewolf, the planet is billions of years old, dinosaurs and other prehistoric animals actually existed, and space is space rather than a part of the spirit world.

>>95980764
Not really. They require far too much human blood to operate at high spec, and lack a great deal of emotional impetus, making them less likely to do anything.
Replies: >>95981951 >>95982003 >>95983151
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:42:51 AM No.95981947
>>95981823
Bastet abomination? who?
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:44:50 AM No.95981951
>>95981940
>They require far too much human blood to operate at high spec
They don't need human blood, just blood from mammals. Unlike vampires they can survive off animals with zero issues. The meat industry alone could feed armies of them with all the blood it throws away.
Replies: >>95982065
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:46:39 AM No.95981960
>>95977440
Even going by current paradox red talon lore, that's not what they're about. They're still the super edgy anti-human faction, it's just now humans make up their ranks and spread aids.
Replies: >>95981977
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:50:21 AM No.95981977
>>95981960
Paradox lore is fake and gay.
Replies: >>95981990
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:52:13 AM No.95981990
>>95981977
As someone who's fake and gay I take offense.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:53:06 AM No.95981994
>>95981466
>>95981491
If I destroy that fetish, will you die?
Replies: >>95982065
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:55:33 AM No.95982003
>>95981940
>In Mage and perhaps some others, but W:tA took the position that science is a correct way of discovering things about the world
Did you reply to the wrong anon? Your statement agrees with the guy you're currently replying to, but you phrased it like an argument.
Replies: >>95982065
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:07:21 AM No.95982047
Fc8faJPaUAIgOlM (1)
Fc8faJPaUAIgOlM (1)
md5: b1742a735190a2a57364809c73127677🔍
i wanted to talk about this earlier but i ate two ip range bans behind each other, but this weekend i ran a inqusitor one shot game set in modern time for my group

the group was working for the society of leopold and been investigating serial disappearances which at first they thought would be vampire related till the latest victim disappeared during day. In the end it was a fomori family that had some d'habi revenants (who also had investments) over for marriage talks (i admit i based the entire scenario on this pic) and i also threw some demonic servitors and zombies in there

in the end it didn't played all that different from htr without second sight and i ripped off resident evil 1 and 7 a lot, but my players really liked it and now want me to run a full game of that, but here is the thing i haven't actually taken the time to read up all that much on inqusitors. there is only the two books right? and society of leopold stuff is most just hunters hunted 1 and 2 right?
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:11:54 AM No.95982065
>>95982003
Yeah, meant to be the anon before in the chain.

>>95981951
An army living off the land depletes the land, and if Ananasi did actually get things done instead of being seduced by various minions of the Triat there probably wouldn't be much of a meat industry left.

(That dumb passage also raises the question of how Ananasi managed to get one over on the Insect Races, since mammals didn't exist then. Even if you're being generous and setting the bar back to Therapsids, that's still a long, long wait.

>>95981994
No, but they'll be unable to do any shit that they require Gnosis to accomplish, which can be summed up as "a lot of things in Werewolf".
Replies: >>95982154
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:26:28 AM No.95982154
>>95982065
>That dumb passage also raises the question of how Ananasi managed to get one over on the Insect Races, since mammals didn't exist then.
Whitewolf writers and consistency is a venn-diagram where both circles are on entirely different sheets of paper.
>>95981525
Looking this shit up sent me down a rabbit hole that led me to discovering there are rank 7 and 8 fetishes in WtA.
So we have confirmation that there are ranks above 6 from the kitsune, the schizo wyrm book, and rage against appalachia. We just don't know Anything about those ranks other than the fact all rank 7+ fera become incarnae.
Replies: >>95982171
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:31:41 AM No.95982171
>>95982154
The 1e Werewolf core had an entry for Rank 7 back when Renown was ever-expanding and had no limit. You'd have to bring that back in order to manage it. Which would also probably make having Renown-based effects in Gifts a lot more complicated.
Replies: >>95982266
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:58:17 AM No.95982266
>>95982171
>You'd have to bring that back in order to manage it.
Becoming rank 6 in modern wta isn't a matter of renown in the first place so I don't think ranks 7+ needs to be either.
Granted, the only Known sure-fire way to progress beyond 6th is to dance corresponding black spiral layers. The kitsune have no clue how to get their 7th tail and the legends surrounding how the garou got to 7+ to make their ancient fetishes have long since been lost.
On another note, while ranks 7 through 9 are incarnae, there's evidence that celestine is a title for a spirit that achieved rank 10. It's only revealed in the WtA: Apocalypse book, but it's possible for the mightiest incarnae to rank up to celestine. So in practice spirits may operate on the rank structure exaclty as fera do, but starting as gafflings to jaggling for ranks 1-6 before becoming incarnae at 7+.
Replies: >>95983077
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:07:29 AM No.95982761
cqt332jnoy9f1
cqt332jnoy9f1
md5: 876f4999cb7557cea99c9d48e7b2061f🔍
Tribebook Black Spiral Dancer is releasing.

The team is good but I wonder how 18+ content will be handled.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:08:39 AM No.95982768
can possessed (fomori, drones, kami) still do sorcery?
Replies: >>95982877
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:39:52 AM No.95982877
>>95982768
Depending on what your ST thinks about metaphysics, anyone can do Sorcery. But possessed are the only group that are overtly capable of it; many sorcerers (shamanchads) even let themselves become possessed willingly.
Replies: >>95982968
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:15:00 AM No.95982968
>>95982877
i am the st, but i know very little about werewolf and one of my players want to do
> many sorcerers (shamanchads) even let themselves become possessed willingly.
exactly that
Replies: >>95984419
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:50:45 AM No.95983077
>>95982266
>Becoming Rank 6 not a matter of Renown

You literally have to get 10 dots in all categories just to get your foot in the door.
Replies: >>95983108
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 11:04:36 AM No.95983108
1722288866841388
1722288866841388
md5: 9f5d59e651c6b3b412a8f033f1998948🔍
>>95983077
This is W20, renown isn't a part of it
Replies: >>95983488
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 11:22:17 AM No.95983151
Deep Umbra
Deep Umbra
md5: a80e52ad935e11137ff951ee9ad8209a🔍
>>95981940
>In Mage and perhaps some others, but W:tA took the position that science is a correct way of discovering things about the world, which is why the Weaver is interested in it, as the Weaver itself does not know the entirety of what it spun. Its goal is very much like the Infosphere from Futurama. At any rate, in Werewolf, the planet is billions of years old, dinosaurs and other prehistoric animals actually existed, and space is space rather than a part of the spirit world.
At least don't speak out of your ass anon.
Replies: >>95983488 >>95984428
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 1:06:53 PM No.95983488
>>95983151
Check Mokole pg 103, in the text box "Mages and the Umbra". States the division plainly and without equivocation, and not contradicted by anything in the meandering description of the Deep Umbra you've posted there.

>>95983108
My bad, had it mixed up with creating legendary fetishes in Hammer and Klaive.
Replies: >>95983706
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 2:18:05 PM No.95983706
Corax
Corax
md5: fcc67266d29b566a7c7d9a6bf9d57c17🔍
>>95983488
Mokole sourcebook is not only 1999, but also outdated and also literally used "for simplicity's sake"
Plus, it is contradicted. Astral Umbra is known to Werewolves (and Mokole) in W20 Velvet Shadows, unlike that 1999's take.
Furthermore, it is contradicted by Corax sourcebook (who knows the difference between Astral Umbra, Deep Umbra)
So please, stop spreading misinformation.
Replies: >>95984428 >>95990355
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:47:16 PM No.95984419
>>95982968
They'll probably want to make a Static Shaman then, which is a type of Sorcerer. The rules for this aren't in the Revised Sorcerer book, which is where one would expect to find them. Instead, they're on page 64-65 of the Revised Dreamspeaker Tradition Book. They still use the other rules for Rev. Sorcerers, and I would suggest using the options that make sorcery take less time and sorcerers have supernatural starting statlines. That should be around the chargen section for Rev. Sorcery. Anyway, I don't know enough about the Werewolf part of the setting to say what being Possessed does, but there's at least one sorcerer background and a few merits that make you/the spirit possessing you have an easier time using their powers.
Replies: >>95984456
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:49:30 PM No.95984428
>>95983151
>>95983706
Nothing you've posted has contradicted the anon saying space is real. The fact the deep umbra exists is not proof that space does not exist.
Replies: >>95985919
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 4:54:24 PM No.95984456
>>95984419
>I don't know enough about the Werewolf part of the setting to say what being Possessed does
The rule for possession are in the WtA book "possessed". I'd assume most static shamans would become Kami by making contracts with gaian spirits.
How the sorcerer Rev. background "Chole" affects possession is up in the air. It's basically an upgrade to the "Natural Channel" merit in Mage, so it might give a straight difficulty reduction to All possessed powers(which is overpowered as hell, but that's pretty in line with a lot of the poorly thought out mechanics in sorcerer).
Replies: >>95984779
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:30:35 PM No.95984779
>>95984456
If they're playing a sorcerer in a Werewolf campaign, taking 3 to 5 dots in Chole + Natural Channel might be necessary to put their character on par with the Garou. Or I'm speaking out of my ass and it breaks the game, but it does sound fun.
Replies: >>95984841
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:38:17 PM No.95984841
>>95984779
Anon, that would allow possessed with certain powers to get a -4 to -6 to all rolls involving certain attributes. They'd be able to build a character that could always soak at difficulty 2-4 against everything, including aggravated.
Replies: >>95984910 >>95984943 >>95985128
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:48:24 PM No.95984910
>>95984841
Considering possessed are giving up their free will for this, sounds find to me. It's still a Human trying to survive in a werewolf game.
Not to mention this goes both ways. There are far, Far more fomori than kami...
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:52:17 PM No.95984943
1732353980883642
1732353980883642
md5: b81e075454d062187b62bc3ad4fec603🔍
>>95984841
That's good. Is there a way to arbitrarily increase the die pool for those rolls? Kami Shamanchad has an entire wyrm to kill, garou or no.
Replies: >>95984978 >>95985128
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 5:57:40 PM No.95984978
>>95984943
not sure about kami but fomori can just raise stats with gifts that they can buy with exp
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:15:55 PM No.95985128
>>95984943
For sorcerer's in general sure. Enchanters can create magic items that let them add extra dots to any attribute, ability, or roll(think virtues, willpower, humanity, etc), with a maximum bonus equal to their enchantment rating. The max for enchanment is, and these bonuses can stack. If you have a level 6 item for dex and a level 6 item for firearms, you have a total bonus of +12.
The books examples show item with a bunch of restrictions and drawback, but if you actually read the text blurbs, it takes extra work to add restrictions and you only get a drawback if you botch. By default enchanted items have no downside, you just keep them on your person and they give you the bonus.
>>95984841
Anon, enchanted items can also reduce difficulty by up to the enchanment level instead for adding dice. The -6 difficulty to all rolls thing was core to sorcerer revised from the start.
Replies: >>95985136 >>95985205 >>95985894
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:16:55 PM No.95985136
>>95985128
>The max for enchanment is,
*6
The maximum dot level in enchantment is 6
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 6:24:44 PM No.95985205
>>95985128
All this only for a master sorcerer to still get turned into chunky salsa if he gets in melee range of a freshly turned ahroun cub.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 7:51:06 PM No.95985894
>>95985128
Problem is finding that legendary enchanter and create that legendary enchantments.
Replies: >>95986182
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 7:53:05 PM No.95985919
>>95984428
Nta but Mokole thing he is talking about assumes Deep Umbra is Space for simplicity sake in 1999.
But we know for a fact that it isn't in any other source.
Replies: >>95990355
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 8:17:34 PM No.95986182
>>95985894
>finding that legendary enchanter
Anon, a shaman is a sorcerer. He can Be that legendary enchanter. Sorcerers get 5 numen dots at character gen and are given permission by the book to throw it all into one path.
In the books own words, "the benefit of specialization". The only fly in the ointment is that each item is its own ritual, each ritual needs to be researched individually, and you need 2 months to research a new ritual. Most sorcerers die of old age Long before they become demigods(and the alchemists are still Laughing).
Replies: >>95986336
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 8:33:13 PM No.95986336
>>95986182
From Halls of Arcanum to the Order of Hermes books to anything else you can read shows it is a lifetime's worth to get Mastery of a single path.
Legendary Alchemists, Enchanters, Masters of Hellfire etc don't grow on trees.
Replies: >>95986391 >>95986443
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 8:41:05 PM No.95986391
>>95986336
The akashics also take a lifetime to awaken, but I only have one thing to say to that: "Paradigm Issue". There've been examples of NPCs with multi-path mastery in VtM of all places.
Replies: >>95986594
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 8:48:14 PM No.95986443
>>95986336
Who cares how hard it is to find one when you're the one making the character?
Vampires and mages are 1/100,000. Doesn't stop me from playing one.
Replies: >>95986594
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:11:09 PM No.95986594
>>95986391
All I am saying is, when there are like three dudes with multi path Mastery, two of them centuries old Sorcerers and one is basically Tremere's bitch and Arcanum deemed Sorcery not worth studying most of the time, it is hilarius to hear "Oh you can get Enchantment 6s"
>>95986443
Your ST, when you show up with a Mastery of Alchemy at the age of 30.
Replies: >>95986631 >>95986684
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:16:18 PM No.95986631
>>95986594
Shut the fuck up travis, nobody asked your opinion. Especially when it's a retard take like "there are fewer master sorcerers than archmages". Sorcerer20 was dogshit and everyone hated it.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:18:42 PM No.95986651
Levels of WoD magic

>True Magick/Enlightened Science
Using your very will to shape reality

>Hedge Magic
Only works by throughly following rigid and time-consuming rituals
>B-but they don’t have to deal with parado-
*Drops acid and replaces the Dorkcerer’s skin with actual fire*
>AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>True Faith
A collective of wills subconsciously shaping reality with limited effects through an agreed-upon doctrine

>Numina
Fringe benefits from humanity’s ‘main character’ status.
Replies: >>95986701 >>95986705
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:22:06 PM No.95986680
What is the best resource to find an online group to play with? Sorry for the beginner question and asking to be spoon-fed. Particularly interested in vtm: Dark Ages, if that changes anything.
Replies: >>95986861
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:22:57 PM No.95986684
>>95986594
Anon, I don't care what you do at your table, but stop acting like you're an authority that can police others like your headcanon is gospel.
I disagree with your take, and if that gets under your skin? That's your problem.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:25:46 PM No.95986701
>>95986651
>A collective of wills subconsciously shaping reality with limited effects through an agreed-upon doctrine
Correction, some of the books come out to say that if you aren't worshipping a god that both exists and is a generally benevolent deity, the tf doesn't work. By "some" I mean the splat books that aren't mage or masquerade. Vampire got stuck with all beliefs working ever since it printed the credit card shit and most mage books just assume Everything works because of belief.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:26:49 PM No.95986705
>>95986651
Always cracks me up that technically the Technocracy did the Index Railgun thing and made their own ripoff version of sorcery in psychic powers which are more specialised but limited.
Replies: >>95986766 >>95987386
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:34:54 PM No.95986766
>>95986705
Pychic powers also don't take 3-5 turns to cast, so while your average sorcerer would have his dick peeled apart like a banana before he got his first spell off, the psychic can at least put up a fight. If it's a psychic with one of the better powers like telepathy, then there's a good chance he trapped the other guy in his own mind-palace.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:37:42 PM No.95986775
That Verbena pussy got me acting most unwise.
Replies: >>95986954
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 9:50:23 PM No.95986861
>>95986680
Honestly it's a crapshoot. Online games with randos is (especially since WoD attracts weirdos like crazy) going to be a chore in patience, trying to find decent players instead of one of the twelve flavors of That Guy.

Any chance you could get IRL friends into it? VtM has a fairly easy sell in my experience. Only HtV has an easier sell.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:06:05 PM No.95986954
>>95986775
Don't verbena collect STDs like pokemon cards? They're life mages, they use them as actual weapons.
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:43:45 PM No.95987205
Are there any fucking places to actually nerd out about this game that aren't dead or half-dead?
God I miss the old ass whitewolf forums.
Replies: >>95987293
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:51:06 PM No.95987268
>Playing Chronicles
>Player rolls Occult to know stuff about the supernatural and fails
>To represent this failure, player confidently relays oWoD lore that sounds correct but isn't
Replies: >>95987315
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:53:21 PM No.95987293
>>95987205
Here and plebbit.
I wanted to make a WoD discord but I have no interest in moderating such a potential shithole.
Replies: >>95987317 >>95988794
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:55:16 PM No.95987315
>>95987268
based
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 10:55:36 PM No.95987317
>>95987293
That sounds like it'd quickly become a truly wretched place.
Replies: >>95987878 >>95989567
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 11:03:29 PM No.95987386
>>95986705
Where do you think the index author got the idea from? Both index and fate stole all their ideas from classic WoD, they've both talked about how they took ideas from ttrpgs.
Replies: >>95987528
Anonymous
6/30/2025, 11:23:09 PM No.95987528
>>95987386
WoD in general and VtM especially were amazingly influential in the late 90's/early 2000's. The original Blade movie had VtM books on set as reference material, the makers of fate and index used their homebrew setting for it to create video gamees/novels, the goth gf meme originated from vtm larp groups, etc.
And then ww managed to burn it to the ground so hard it had to sell the IP.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 12:08:28 AM No.95987878
>>95987317
It'd quickly become a...
World of Darkness
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:20:38 AM No.95988781
Where's the kalif?
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:22:50 AM No.95988794
>>95987293
Reddit has been more of a shithole than usual, it's also basically dead as far as engagement goes. This thread is also dead whenever the autists slapfights die down.
Onyxpath forums are also dead. 10 years ago the thcategories had entire pages of active threads, but now not even VtM gets a reply a day.
How does one find WoD nerds?
Replies: >>95988868 >>95989575
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:37:14 AM No.95988868
>>95988794
Sadly, this is general is still your best bet.
Replies: >>95988912
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:45:45 AM No.95988912
>>95988868
At the current rate? It won't be for much longer. 4chan is going to die the slow death of drowning in its own shit if the mods don't knuckle-up and reset all the boards to the original 4. Like the april fools event, 4chan would revert to its old self and be able to grow again.
Burn it all down. Let the past go so a better future can be born.
Replies: >>95988989
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 3:01:01 AM No.95988989
>>95988912
Wishful thinking. The old internet you remember fondly is dead, and you can't bring it back. The userbase is different, the culture is different, the world is different.

I'm not trying to be a doomer about this or anything. It is what it is.
Replies: >>95989017
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 3:06:56 AM No.95989017
>>95988989
I'm not trying to bring back the old internet. I'm saying this site doesn't have enough dedicated users to support the current board bloat. I just did it in unnecessarily flowery prose in WoD tradition.
This sign needs a serious paring down. We've already had this experiment ran and proven with examples like the april 1st "prank" that saw the remain 4 boards start to rediscover what building board culture is like.
We have the historic president, the math agrees with theory, and evidence from expirement confirms. The majority of boards need to die.
The next iteration of 4chan will be nothing like the eras before, but it'll be better than the fake and gay shit we have now.
Replies: >>95991197
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:10:33 AM No.95989516
Awakeningfags, tell me about your Dedicated tools.
Replies: >>95989546
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:19:55 AM No.95989546
>>95989516
>Thyrsus Arrow
It's a hunting knife.

He stabs enemies mainly for the purpose of using Adamant Hand to touch-cast "fuck up your health."
Replies: >>95989579
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:24:37 AM No.95989567
>>95987317
I wanna groom kidsinto playing something other than VtM with me and hating 5e like an adult did with me when I was young.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:26:46 AM No.95989575
>>95988794
I see daily new posts on reddit with at least a dozen replies and people posting art of their characters.
That said, they banned my previous account for shitting on Ross the shewolf
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:28:20 AM No.95989579
>>95989546
kek
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:31:43 AM No.95989590
In the interest of sparking some more substantial and interactive discussion, I have a broad question to ask the thread. Do your games include intra-party conflict (this doesn't mean outright PvP per se) and if so, how often and how intensely?

In the game of HtV I'm currently playing in, I have noticed there's a lot of in-character arguments. Don't worry, this isn't some reddit "Am I The Asshole pls validate me" bitching about my group, I'm completely fine with it out of character, in fact I kind of enjoy it. The one that has really jumped out at me and has kept coming back up is a disagreement between my character Ephraim, and another character, Catherine. Essentially their argument is over how much risk one should take on in pursuit of their Hunter duties. Ephraim is of the position that there's no half-assing being a hunter, and that anything not outright suicidal is a reasonable risk to take in protecting our fellow man. Catherine however is on team "acceptable losses" and has made it clear on multiple occasions that she doesn't really mind if some randoms bite it as long as we accomplish our goals. Of course she'd rather they live, but it's not as high on her list of priorities. I am slightly worried if we don't reach some resolution it could cause problems for the cell but I also like having PCs that have strongly different views on something important. That's not very common at my table.

We did have some PvP in VtM some years ago but that was just between two specific players who liked to fight.
Replies: >>95989839 >>95990077 >>95990661
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:42:09 AM No.95989839
>>95989590
It's funny, Hunter: the Reckoning is pretty much designed around PCs getting into serious conflict with each other relatively often, but being unable to go full PvP due to how complimentary edges of opposing creeds are and due to how the "softie" edges can pretty much disarm most extremists and force them to drop their weapons.
As for your question:
My VtM games have constantly had a lot of intra-party conflicts, even more so if they're Sabbat because half of the party just wants to pay lip service and do their own thing while the Lasombra player tried to wrangle everyone into actually doing Sabbat stuff.
My WtA game didn't have any conflicts until a player joined wanting to play a different Fera (Corax). In-character, he left after being disgusted with the Garou. First they had a big argument about the War of Rage, with the wolves generally taking the "the fucking bats had it coming" position. Then they massacred a bunch of normal human workers at a fracking town and the crow had enough of it. He later came back with a Mokole friend to give the wolves a good scare.
My MtA have been surprisingly civil. Most of the time PCs end up saying "yeah I kinda disagree with you killing that guy but go off queen do your Samsara wheel greasing thing" or something similar. There's been a few love triangles though.
My CtD and DtF games died after session zero due to players fighting over retarded unrelated shit.
I wanna play Wraith. Something tells me it's perfect for those dynamics.
Replies: >>95990185
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:01:01 AM No.95990077
>>95989590
One large scale public discord game I was in had the resident nosferatu 'assassin' really intent on killing me off, due to my character making not-so-veiled threats at anyone who tried to screw him over (primarily the haxxor nossie that was too useful to wipe out but too greedy to be reliable).
Misunderstandings can lead to fun avenues if both players are willing to indulge them. Doubly so if they actually believe in the misunderstanding.
Replies: >>95990185
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:41:13 AM No.95990185
>>95989839
>Sabbat because half of the party just wants to pay lip service and do their own thing while the Lasombra player tried to wrangle everyone into actually doing Sabbat stuff.

Honestly that sounds about right. The Sabbat is barely held together by useful idiots who actually believe in the sect. Surprised the Lasombra was the one true believer in the pack.

Aside from short one-shots and mini-games we only played one long VtM game, and it was Camarilla. We had two PCs deaths that were sort-of PvP related. First was the Ravnos whose player made it his goal for the game to wassail. He had been beefing with the Lasombra Antitribu since night one and decided to dick his ghouls over on the way out. We ended up all having to put him down since he had gone wight. The second was that same Lasombra who had gotten cucked out of a satisfactory revenge on the Ravnos during the bloodhunt (long story) and eventually decided the only reasonable thing to do was sell the rest of the coterie out to a Baali so she could help him kill his deeply religious sire. He narrowly succeeded despite the intervention of the Ravnos player's replacement character, a Ventrue. However, he and the Baali both met final death in the same scene. He met his final death from his sister in blood who finished him off (the Ventrue and his sire did most of the work), and the Baali got her head cut off by the coterie Nosferatu in signature obfuscate+potence sneak attack fashion.

>>95990077
>large scale public discord game

I'd expect that to be synonymous with "nightmare game" but you seem to have had fun. Any good stories?
Replies: >>95990305 >>95991192
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:44:11 AM No.95990305
>>95990185
>Surprised the Lasombra was the one true believer in the pack.
More like the "one true ambition driven girlboss" of the pack. It's not that she was an ardent Sabbat defender, it's just that she believed her key to success was to climb her way up the Sabbat's broken ladder.
The Tzimisce learned from his Sire to just do the bare minimum for the Sabbat and instead focus on his own growth, play with vicissitude all day and essentially use everything and everyone to further his goals.
The Harbinger just wanted to do spooky shit and maybe kill a few Giovanni. Got exactly what he wanted.
The Blood Brothers (or sisters, it was a single person playing five Hermanas Hambrientas) wanted to subvert everything to photocopy themselves, which the Tzim ended up stopping because he's really racist towards BBs.
The Pander simp just wanted to be respected while simultaneously sucking up to the Lasombra. He ended pulling an overly dramatic murder suicide, killing the Lasombra after he confessed his feelings and she laughed at him.
Replies: >>95990427 >>95993200
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:07:54 AM No.95990355
>>95983706
>Mokole outdated

Most of the Mokole entry of W20 Changing Breeds is based on the material in Mokole. The only retcon that W20 even made to the Umbra in W20 with regard to the Mokole is that they aren't entering the Astral Umbra anymore and that the Deep Umbra got disengaged.

Also, check out the entries on the Aetherial Realm that give outer space a Gauntlet rating.

>>95985919
Again, check the Aetherial Realm section of any given Umbra book.

W:tA does not go in for mashing together what Mage does. It never has. I can't really say it never will, because M5 is probably going to be some stupid shit to go along with the even stupider shit that is W5, but Werewolf and Mage have been famously incompatible in their outline of the spirit worlds since Mage existed.
Replies: >>95990385
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:17:31 AM No.95990385
>>95990355
It's always a fun time trying to figure out which middle umbra you're in.
>Mars (Reality)
>Mars (Shard Realm) (Deep Umbra) (Celestine)
>Mars (Shade Realm) (Middle Umbra/Horizon)
>Nerigal (Deep Umbra) (Incarna)

And it's like this for all the planets in the solar system. Unless it's the True Horizon which is both a Gauntlet AND an Incarna.
Replies: >>95990425
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:25:42 AM No.95990412
🤴's 🐱
🤴's 🐱
md5: 085460af1c3064d2453045bc2a49e146🔍
Doesn't seem like a smart idea
Replies: >>95991013 >>95991076
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:30:55 AM No.95990425
>>95990385
Nerigal would be in the Near Umbra or straight-up Penumbra, since he's the Incarna of Mars in the Aetherial Realm. The Aetherial Realm is in a weird ground of being considered a Near Realm, but it also immediately adjoins physical reality via the Gauntlet, which you can step across if you are on Mars in space to enter its Aetherial reflection.
Replies: >>95990434
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:32:24 AM No.95990427
>>95990305
>The Pander simp just wanted to be respected while simultaneously sucking up to the Lasombra. He ended pulling an overly dramatic murder suicide, killing the Lasombra after he confessed his feelings and she laughed at him.
WTF, he's literally me
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:35:04 AM No.95990434
>>95990425
Right yeah, sorry. It's just that from a logical point of view, once you've gone into space you're in the deep Umbra, but it's more like you're communicating with constellations or something.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:54:41 AM No.95990661
>>95989590
Defined on a game to game basis. Part of what session 0 is for. I've had both good and terrible games with either. No personal strong opinion.
Full open hostility game between players can be very fun. With the right crew, you barely even need a scenario, they'll make all the work of making bad things happen to everyone involved, themselves included. I have fond memories of running Dust to Dust that way to completely mad conclusions.
One thing to consider is making the level of antagonism you're going for well defined. To some people, fucking around with other PCs is ok, but killing is not.
The one thing I don't ever want to have again is what happened decades ago in my first Sabbat game, in which a PC was eventually killed as the end result of session after session of what ended up amounting to player in-game bullying. Certainly, the death and the process leading to it made perfect sense in the context of the narrative (always the justification they're going for), but the player hadn't signed for that, and in retrospect I should have intervened sooner.

Another big issue to look out for, of course, is /character/ social manipulation. Some players are are very adverse to the idea of having control of their PC taken from them in any way (see the reactions of some to Hunger Dice, or Wraith's Shadow mechanics). So being made to do things against their will by dice roll can leave them sour very fast, even when they were the ones advocating for player vs players interactions. ("Yes, you character /was/ seduced/fast talked/threatened into doing that").
Replies: >>95993200
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:55:06 AM No.95990664
quant
quant
md5: 697f5730cc17fc5bf257c6248ba44032🔍
Uhh.. guys, the sleepers on /sci/ are awakening.
Replies: >>95990755 >>95992436
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 12:23:49 PM No.95990755
>>95990664
>Somewhere out there, the Sons of Ether laugh at the Technocracy
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 1:32:40 PM No.95990964
Is wanting a Demon the Fallen v20 a Monkey Paw or a never ever
Replies: >>95990988 >>95991411 >>95992516 >>95992799
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 1:38:11 PM No.95990988
>>95990964
I recall hearing that Opp tried pitching D20 and H20 to paradox, but both got veto'd (H20 probably because they wanted to make H5 instead, D20 probably for the same reason they didn't want Baali in V5)
So, never ever. You're more likely to get D5 at this point, and who fucking knows what that would be like.
Replies: >>95991002
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 1:40:34 PM No.95991002
>>95990988
>D5
One shudders to think
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 1:44:53 PM No.95991013
>>95990412
A pig farm does the same job and generates revenue.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:06:17 PM No.95991076
>>95990412
The only setup that makes sense is if the Prince is spamming Dominate and using you as a guard dog but Something Happened and now it’s no longer working. Guardian ghost shielding you maybe. That proposed setup is dumb.
Replies: >>95991543
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:33:32 PM No.95991192
>>95990185
>you seem to have had fun
In spite of said nightmares. The rules were a mess. They allegedly hated V5 and wanted to stick to V20 pure, but then snipped off and tacked on everything they found (in)convenient for their favored players/characters.
>Computers skill was not needed to know everything they ooc knew about technology, they all used phones and the Internet despite having it at 0. I felt right foolish I put precious starting points into it just so I could communicate with anyone, and they refused to refund me my points
>Rules literally (I'm using the word properly, trust me) changed overnight, from how hunting worked, to how XP was doled out, to how crafting skills and backgrounds interacted
>That last one was particularly shit. You weren't allowed to craft anything without having resources and/or influence, even macgyvering. If you had resources/influence, you could only craft/obtain stuff up to a certain level (i.e crafting was worthless but they didn't want to outright state it)
>Their choice of levels was also retarded. You needed rank 4+ in resources/influence to get a shotgun. And this wasn't even bongland or some other retarded 2Alet country. Body armor was impossible for anyone short of rank 5
>ERP (the nossies prince was explicitly dual gender)
>STPCs (guess who had the highest backgrounds and thus ability on the game)
>One of the STs outright DMd me it was a split between guys that wanted me gone because I asked too many questions about the ramshackle rules and guys that wanted me to stay because I actually seemed interested
>We had Garou in the area, the moment we started bringing in silver countermeasures, an ST threw a pack leader at us to piss on our faces, slag our silver, and tell us to never try that again (in the prince's territory btw)
>By that point, I was so fed up I told the prince to his face to act like one and keep his territory safe from outsiders (two guesses how well that went)
Replies: >>95992245 >>95993200
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 2:34:53 PM No.95991197
>>95989017
That's not the problem with this board though since there's still only one tabletop games board. The problem with /tg/ is that jannies don't do there job so outside the generals it's all just bait and inane bullshit, and that drove most of the good posters away.
Replies: >>95992195
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 3:18:32 PM No.95991411
>>95990964
If they'd done a Mummy 20 it's what our group would be playing right now. : (
Replies: >>95992799
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 3:45:51 PM No.95991543
>>95991076
I presume any stupid thing princes do is a bad joke about an enemy nobody else remembers. I'd think bro ran a rival out of the territory and kept one of their spawn as a circus geek for private amusement.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 4:59:05 PM No.95991914
>>95973656
Didn't LARPers build most of the WoD communities in the 90s and early 2000s?
Replies: >>95992312
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:08:46 PM No.95991978
>>95973711
Yeah, actually pretty well explained. Wish more people did this.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:12:48 PM No.95992003
>>95973899
Thats one WoD way to see it.

All of the WoD games are pretty wacky if you look close enough. Juts dont have to see it through Mister Edge McDark all the time.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:23:56 PM No.95992078
>>95974705
Absolutely Based Hunter Talk
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:39:56 PM No.95992195
>>95991197
I'm gonna be honest, I think /tg/ is one of the boards that needs to be deleted. When I say 4 boards total, I Mean 4 boards total. Reset everything to the start, they'll be no more room for bait posters because the constant flow of posts will kill off the low-effort shit.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:48:08 PM No.95992241
>>95977278
I imagine someone playing my shadow in a bugsbunny type of way. Dumb and silly but truly malicious at heart.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 5:48:57 PM No.95992245
>>95991192
Sounds like the STs didn't actually want to ST, they wanted to be players with an Audience
Replies: >>95992939
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:00:33 PM No.95992312
>>95991914
>Didn't LARPers build most of the WoD communities in the 90s and early 2000s?
I wasn't around, but that's my understanding. Some also say it's responsible for opening up interest in RPGs to people other than basement-dwelling autists (up to you whether that was a good thing or a bad thing).
Replies: >>95992383
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:10:18 PM No.95992383
>>95992312
I agree but now I don't see a lot of LARPers. Most of the LARP i know is basically WoD related.
I don't like it but not gonna deny it to someone that enjoy it. I just hope for the best and wait till i get more books for Hunter.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:17:01 PM No.95992436
>>95990664
>when you actually realize how much of "science" is bullshit fabricated by those who engaged in elaborate homebrew to scam money out of the institutions with whimsical promise beyond their capacity to easily understand because it was actually completely made up
Replies: >>95992469 >>95992503
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:20:55 PM No.95992469
>>95992436
Not to be confused with how much "science" these days is totally made up either because of personal agenda or because someone was willing to pay a lot of money for proof to corroborate something, and so the result was a dossier that seemed complex to trick idiots. A medieval coffee table book of fake science.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:25:30 PM No.95992503
>>95992436
This is when institutions need competition as much as corporations. Fusion research had stalled for 40 years because america's to scientists were "Making progress and just needed a Little more grant money", but the moment europe and canada started making actual progress in the last 10 years, suddenly measurable progress in the US was on the table again.
You can't let these hacks think they're the only game in town. They Absolutely will suck up grant money while spending all day playing videogames in the break room.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:26:52 PM No.95992516
>>95990964
Considering how things are going i would push for the Demon 5V but there is most likely to be Changeling 5V before that and HOPEFULLY Mage 5V even sooner than those two combined
Replies: >>95992662 >>95992799
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 6:47:38 PM No.95992662
>>95992516
>how things are going
To hell in a hand basket?
Replies: >>95993159
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 7:07:49 PM No.95992799
>>95990964
>>95991411
Any more 20ths are certified Never Evers.
I also have to question why you would want those given what they did to Wraith20 and Sorcerer20 on their way out?
>>95992516
Now these are monkey's paws. The writers took a bigger shit on each WoD5 splat they released.
Do Really want an M5 after the shit they did to werewolf?
Not only that you want them to Keep Going instead of taking WoD5 behind the shed like it deserves?
Replies: >>95993159
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 7:30:27 PM No.95992939
>>95992245
There were four
>Guy who started the thing, on vacation throughout my stay, liked my interest
>Co-starter, femoid, has a PC and explicitly hates thinking too hard about the rules/ramifications of her rules. Wanted me kicked
>Primary NPC vehicle, flavorful, hated my guts and missed no chance to express it
>Friend who started out playing, then joined as an ST because XP was doled out based on post count and he wanted to cheese it. Hated the holes in the game I kept showing him, but in a "I was happier ignorant" sort of way
It's not fair to claim they were malicious, but to borrow other game terminology, I was the d&d 4e player joining a 5e game by vibes-DMs
Replies: >>95992979
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 7:35:54 PM No.95992979
>>95992939
>explicitly hates thinking too hard about the rules/ramifications of her rules
Why the fuck was she allowed to ST? The ST is the one than needs to memorize All the the rules to keep things consistent.
Not to mention being an STPCer, she needed to be kicked off the roster. The game would have been objectively better.
Replies: >>95993090
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 7:53:12 PM No.95993090
>>95992979
>Why the fuck was she allowed to ST?
See: "Co-founder".
There also weren't a lot of people willing to ST. Even with 4 (3), they were a bit understaffed.
>needs to memorize All the the rules
Blessing and curse. The haxxor nossie got away with a lot of tech wiz shit that would otherwise be impossible because she's tech-illiterate. On the other hand, basic "I wanna hack the CCTV to find a guy" got met with "no, CCTV can't do that" (2010 metropolitan Capital with one of the highest CCTV densities in the world, but good luck posting those statistics at her without getting considered for a kick).
>kicked off the roster
By whom? All but one of the STs firmly liked her.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:03:37 PM No.95993159
>>95992662
Not really. It's on life support at this point.
>>95992799
If they are still doint it it means tkhat people are buying them and learning with them. We can't look everuthing and say "Le V20 was better" which is most cases looking at it now. We could at least hope this is the first WoD thing someones gonna pick and probly gonna like it or porbly not. Sometimes you have to give it a chance to everybody. Most find the books online so its not tkhat big of a loss if they dont like it. Maybe we are looking at extreme cases when thinking they are dogshit and nobody likes them?
Replies: >>95993175 >>95993204
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:07:20 PM No.95993175
>>95993159
>If they are still doint it it means tkhat people are buying them and learning with them
Not necessarily. Businesses push games at a deficit when they're trying to create a market. they lost profits are a tax write-off and they stand to lose More money in stocks by admitting to investors they fucked up with a product that has no future.
If businesses only provided product that made immediate returns, exactly zero businesses would make it past their first 5 years.
Replies: >>95993247
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:11:07 PM No.95993200
>>95990305
>spoiler
Goddamn that the most Lasombra ending I've ever read. How exactly did mister pander do it if I might ask?

>>95990661
Yeah OOC bleedthrough is something I'm always cautious about now after the beef between the Ravnos and Lasombra. My group is annoyingly hard to pin down for a session 0. I've managed to wrangle it a couple of times, but for some reason people are a lot more laissez-faire about session 0.

Personally I don't like removing agency from a player character through mundane means. I generally trust my players to actually roleplay out how a character is feeling. Of course there are always some exceptions, like fear. But if I intimidate a PC, all I can say is they're afraid (depending on the system that may have some mechanical effect). Some people meekly comply, some just run, others get extremely aggressive when afraid. Or I'll roll to have an NPC lie to a player, but that doesn't control their actions, just the information the player has. I've not really had problems with PCs always responding "optimally" under social pressures since high school, so I believe that taking away control of a player character should be the domain of the supernatural. Dominate and such.

>>95991192
Ah yeah, that's about what I was expecting. I can kinda defend the computers thing, my ruling on the computers skill is that at computers 0 you're an average normie. You can use a computer, a cell-phone, have an email, but that's about it. You don't even know what BIOS is. Same logic behind drive. Drive 0 doesn't mean you can't drive a car, it just means you aren't particularly good at it, like most drivers. That being said
>dual gender nosferatu prince ERP

You are a man of greater constitution than I.
Replies: >>95993287 >>95994502
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:11:43 PM No.95993204
>>95993159
>It's on life support at this point.
It was on life support in 2010 when the vtm 20th kickstarter made bank. WoD used be so popular it nearly dethroned D&D at it's peak.
Right now it's more like if a suicide bomber blow up half the hospital and then there was an unrelated mass shooting in the same hospital.
Replies: >>95993257 >>95993505 >>95993624
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:19:00 PM No.95993247
>>95993175
I guess i fucked up. Still im trying to be hopeful about it and wait to not fuck up the next sourcebook.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:20:36 PM No.95993257
>>95993204
Damn...that's just depressing to look at it that way. Hope it becomes better than it is today. Maybe not like the 20th editions but closer to that goalpost.
Replies: >>95993344
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:25:16 PM No.95993287
>>95993200
>at computers 0 you're an average normie
The issue with that is that the rules weren't made clear in any of the homebrew docs, I only noticed it after I was given access to the RP channels.
Computers 0 making you not even know what a touch screen is makes sense to demonstrate elders and older being out of touch with tech. As it stands, the 1st rank is necessary for any non-hick neonate, and it makes sense to give everyone the first dot for free to make gameplay convenient. Giving everyone an effective free dot without actually giving them that dot penalizes people who want to specialize in tech, because then their first dot feels more like a tax than something beneficial.
>greater constitution than I
I tried having fun with it. My PC was an old fashioned misogynist (wasn't the only one, I just didn't take it in an erp angle) that made it a point to not even shake hands with women, but he shook the prince's hand without even batting an eyelid. Nobody caught on, to my disappointment.
Replies: >>95993344 >>95993392
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:34:44 PM No.95993344
>>95993257
People today have no idea how good we used to have it. Understanding the things we've lost have broken many people.
>>95993287
I personally give characters a "modern education" merit(works like "Jack of all trades", but only for computers, academics, and other info any normie would have) for free and let them get freebies for dropping it.
Replies: >>95993408
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:41:52 PM No.95993392
>>95993287
I can see your point and if I were running a game I'd gladly let you re-allocate points if you made your character under a different understanding. From my perspective, requiring a dot of computers to operate a touchscreen (something even babies can figure out after a bit of experimentation) or have an email is just taxing everyone who doesn't want to play a tech-illiterate elder born in 937. In my own personal experience old people can figure out how to basically work a computer if they try. Heck, what rolls are you even making to do basic computer tasks? Using a search engine maybe? I think computer specialists do just fine under this assumption since there's a lot you can do with a computer that the average joe doesn't even know about.

I suppose I can see the logic behind giving everyone modern enough a free dot in certain skills, but at a certain point it feels almost like we're backporting something like backgrounds to WoD.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 8:44:28 PM No.95993408
>>95993344
Understable. That's why I hope the new wave of players dont have to experience the crushing feeling of losting something good but the heavly experience of finding and old awesome alternative to play or to even complement their more recent games.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:00:02 PM No.95993505
>>95993204
I only got into these games recently, but I was on /tg/ in 2010, and I seem to remember there was quite a bit of WoD activity around then. Lost and Vigil were already out by then, and even Requiem, Awakening, etc seemed to be accepted.
Replies: >>95993527 >>95993549
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:03:45 PM No.95993527
>>95993505
>Lost and Vigil were already out by then, and even Requiem, Awakening, etc seemed to be accepted.

Yeah this general shifted pretty hard towards oWoD in the last few years. Nowadays I pretty much only get to talk Vigil when an occasional anon is running a game and wants some advice.
Replies: >>95993560 >>95994353
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:04:05 PM No.95993532
>>95975361
>Toreador will freak out and Nosferatu and start screeching and spraying pepper spray at it
>Ventrue will start being a fucking snob as usual, pissing off Tzimisce and will end up being turned into a sentient briefcase.
>Brujah is just retarded by nature
Nice coterie there
Replies: >>95994288 >>95995929
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:06:53 PM No.95993549
>>95993505
Anon, using the activity on 4chan threads as measure of success is like trying to measure the temperature of your oven by seeing if your phone still had internet connection. WW wouldn't have merged in 2006, nor would it have been sold in 2015, if the company was doing well.
Especially not compared to pre-2004 when it was the 2nd most popular ttrpg on the planet.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:08:29 PM No.95993560
>>95993527
>Yeah this general shifted pretty hard towards oWoD in the last few years.
That tends to happen when the company making a product announces they've dropped it. We'd be talking about CofD if they drop WoD5 to print that instead.
Replies: >>95993582 >>95993584
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:12:48 PM No.95993582
>>95993560
>That tends to happen when the company making a product announces they've dropped it.
Wait, what? When did that happen?
Replies: >>95993612 >>95993623
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:12:54 PM No.95993584
>>95993560
I'm not sure that tracks, since very few people are talking about WoD5. The discussion is about at best WoD20 which is also not getting anything new save STV content.

Personally I also don't understand the need some people have to play the most recent edition of something. I'll always give a new game a look, but I'm not going to change if I don't like it. There's a lot of old games that are still playable, even dare I say fun.
Replies: >>95993605
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:17:34 PM No.95993605
>>95993584
Remember anon, Hatred and Spite are just as powerful a motivator as Love and Joy. The Shadow is as much a part of us as the psyche.
People talking about WoD20 started as a comparison to talk about how much they Hated WoD5. WoD5 is still talked about, largely to shit on it and that encourages discussion of previous editions.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:18:48 PM No.95993612
>>95993582
https://www.enworld.org/threads/paradox-kills-chronicles-of-darkness-with-the-hedge-being-the-last-changeling-the-lost-book.703634/
Replies: >>95993784
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:20:00 PM No.95993623
>>95993582
Chronicles has been dead for over a year now anon, where the fuck have you been?
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:20:01 PM No.95993624
>>95993204
>WoD used be so popular it nearly dethroned D&D at it's peak.
Wasn't that during the TSR death spiral era though?
Replies: >>95993632
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:21:41 PM No.95993632
>>95993624
TSR wasn't a straight death-spiral. Don't forget it had massive hits like Planescape.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:46:44 PM No.95993784
>>95993612
Thank you for answering my question and not being an autistic loser. Well, my GM will be happy on principle; he HATED 2nd edition NWoD.
Replies: >>95993847
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 9:56:16 PM No.95993847
>>95993784
Does he ever post here? We used to have a guy who would go on longwinded rants about how much he hated 2e, how it "isn't the same game", and seemed to have a personal grudge against some of the developers.

personally I view 1e and 2e as a mixed bag. Some things are done better in 1e, others in 2e.
Replies: >>95993872 >>95993948
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:02:10 PM No.95993872
>>95993847
I'm on the side of this anon, its pretty clear come stuff was made better but not all and that was a tremendous shame.

I really liked Hunter: The Vigil and thanks to the sourcebook of Slshaer, a friend of mine wanted to try it out (first as an antagonist and then becoming part of the cell, yes yes, pretty anime imo). Another friend of mine started looking into Hunter 5 which I ST thanks to him starting Watching Supernatural and even wanted to try the old version of Hunter.
Replies: >>95994070
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:15:00 PM No.95993948
>>95993847
>Does he ever post here?
No; and even if he did, he's not a "stop liking what I don't like" kind of person.
Replies: >>95994070
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:20:38 PM No.95993989
>>95981760
Tremere lies
Replies: >>95995200
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:25:08 PM No.95994030
>>95976699
The main problem with the wod metaphor was always that all the important characters were retarded msry sues. The events in themselves were also usually retarded, but the main problem was show much of any givne book was devoted to telling us the escapades of the dmpcs and their bullshit chosen one nonsense.
Replies: >>95994349
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:29:24 PM No.95994070
>>95993872
My group basically runs a "1.5", essentially a mix of the 1e and 2e rules we prefer.

>>95993948
Just checking. We get the occasional unhinged poster for up to months at a time and I can never understand what goes on in their heads.
Replies: >>95999274
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:44:28 PM No.95994216
>>95977903
I always thought the idea of sabbat tremre was stupid, given that the sabbat is in part led by the tzimisce.
Like they made a whole thing out of how integrated the tremrre are with the camarilla because it's a.shield between them and all the people who want them ashed, and then there's also some who just hang out in the sabbat and that's ok?
So when I run the game I take advantage of the fact that roughly 90% of sabbat lore is bullshit or contradicts other sabbat lore.so you can just pick and choose which parts are relevant.
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:53:11 PM No.95994288
>>95993532
>One of the Nosferatu blurbs references a Tory sleeping with them because they were hipsters
>Ventrue are CHARISMATIC snobs, if they piss someone off they don't want to, they're doing something wrong
>Find a clan that isn't
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:54:26 PM No.95994295
>>95977903
Was that a V5 thing or a Saulot thing? Can't recall.
Can't believe they missed the chance of having the irony of the sabbat tremere being the only ones still easily enslaved.
Replies: >>95994309
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 10:56:11 PM No.95994309
>>95994295
They did a whole switcheroo thing with the sabbat tremere being the real tremere and then they all died. That was pre v5 and part of the saulot thing
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:02:23 PM No.95994349
>>95994030
Are you talking about signature characters (Beckett, Lucita) or a more general issue with canon VtM characters?

The latter is a mixed bag for me, there's some I like and others I will happily delete from the setting. The former... well I must admit VtMB left me with a favorable view on Beckett and I never really read any of the full-on books. I think some of the signature characters actually work better if you take them at face value and strip away any writer's favoritism.

Take a look at Lucita objectively. She's a daddy issues gigaslut who doesn't really believe in anything and wants to have it both ways in every dilemma. We're constantly told how smart and manipulative she is but she never does anything particularly clever and it feels that most of the time she's protected from consequences on account of her powerful sire that she hates. She isn't cool, she's pathetic. A nepo-baby that still manages to underachieve politically and spends all her time going from gimmick to gimmick. If she weren't low generation, hot, and with a powerful sire I doubt she'd have made it through 50 years of unlife.
Replies: >>95999291
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:03:06 PM No.95994353
Splash Image
Splash Image
md5: 245c6f6c747cf1f3efb4bd8d6625d0ce🔍
>>95993527
What would you like to talk about Vigil anon? I'm preparing to run my first proper campaign outside of one-shots, I've heard that Athletics being removed from Defence is a common house rule, do you have any other pearls of wisdom to share?
Replies: >>95994413
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:12:04 PM No.95994413
>>95994353
Honestly, anything. I'm a big advocate for removing athletics to defense personally. My group also ignores initiative modifiers to weapons. Now that's not because I think it's an inherently bad idea but because I find it annoying to have initiatives that can change on a round to round basis as ST. I've got a lot of little biases, I mentioned in an earlier post my group kinda runs a "1.5" mishmash of preferred rules from the two separate editions.

Still, I love helping people plan their vigil games. What do you have cooking for this campaign of yours, Anon?
Replies: >>95994499 >>95994907
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:26:27 PM No.95994499
>>95994413
That doesn't sound unreasonable honestly. For my game I've posted about it a month or so ago. It's a Slasher campaign in a small town in the UK in the early 80s, a Genius is on a rampage killing people who he's calculated will serve as supernatural vectors in the future. He's got most of the local slasher population doing his bidding. In my mind, the campaign has him as a hidden figure who the PCs uncover too late, realising that his Tell is present in every other Slasher's. Someone (it may have even been you) recommended I try numerology as his means of determining peoples futures, which I do like.

The campaign is still in the prep stage, all I know is that one PC works on a train and another is a thrill-seeking safari-esque hunter who's the heir of a wealthy family. My current idea for a first session is to start en media res, and have the party being chased by a monster (a zombie that eats people whole, then regurgitates them as a fresh zombie) and cut back to them earlier that day at a VE day street party that was gatecrashed by said zombie. Ideally this will serve as the formation of the cell, and then they can start looking at the news reports and learn that the Nevendon Ripper has killed again as well as others that I can't come up with good names for (Binman, Bouncer. Feh), and be galvanised into action.
Replies: >>95994628
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:26:57 PM No.95994502
>>95993200
>How exactly did mister pander do it if I might ask?
So the party had just wiped out a Baali sect on behalf of the Inquisitor at an abandoned mansion. This caused a bit of division because Lasombra and Tzimisce were already toying around with the ideas of infernalism and Lilith worship, but the former was more concerned with growing within the organization. She got the support of the Sisters (because they were angry at the Tzim for essentially killing a few of them and putting a muzzle on the remaining ones) and the Pander. The Tzim and the Harbinger were bros. Mind you, the Tzim didn't want to spare the Baali nor join them, he had his own views on infernalism. He just wanted to steal their books and torture them for knowledge.
Anyway, Pander and Lasombra stay behind to burn everything down. They have a moment where they open up about their ambitions, Pander misinterprets this and confesses to her. After she laughs at him, hurling all kinds of abuse, he snaps and uses Celerity and Potence to grab her tight and hurl the both of them out of a five story building, landing on a sharp spike in the mansion's courtyard, impaling the both of them. Now, she tried to defend herself but botched every roll.
Harbinger, Tzim and the Sisters found them about forty minutes before sunrise. They could've helped them, but the Tzim outright said "Let the lovers enjoy themselves. There's nothing more romantic than watching the sun rise after getting screwed!"
He went on to enslave the Sisters and the Harbinger took over a Giovanni crypt.
Replies: >>95994654
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:39:30 PM No.95994628
>>95994499
Oh yeah, I vaguely recall the bit about the zombie from a while back. Can't take credit for the numerology thing though, that wasn't me. Do you plan on having "monster of the week" type sessions unrelated to the main plot, or will it just be the slashers and their overlord?

Wild card suggestion, have the wealthy thrill-seeker get talent scouted by the Ashwood Abbey. It's a good way to throw the unhealthy aspects of his lifestyle in his face, and if he decides he likes what they're about, it gives him a support network.
Replies: >>95994718
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:43:12 PM No.95994654
>>95994502
>hurl abuse at someone who is stronger and faster than you when you have zero back-up.

PEAK Lasombra. Also peak dickass Tzimisce. Were they just unable to move or did the damage render both torpid?
Replies: >>95995184
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:49:52 PM No.95994718
>>95994628
My current plan is vaguely monster-of-the-week presenting, but behind the scenes it's 90% part of the Geniuses 5d Chess plan to rid the town of supernatural influence entirely. I plan to keep it relatively ambiguous if he's actually working successfully towards this goal or not, because everyone he kills is a regular human, it's only his mad science that says that they may become a Ghoul or whatever. In an ideal world I want to present most monsters as Slashers first, and then perhaps throw a few wildcards in there. One player plays a lot of WtA so I think it'd be fun to have them corner a "Slasher" and then have them turn into a giant hulking Werewolf. Also an idea I want to have is that there is only one Vampire left in town, a Nosferatu prepper convinced that nuclear armageddon is imminent. That he's hidden so deeply underground is the only reason he's survived the packs of Amaranthine Cats that have diablerised the rest of the Kindred in town, causing a spate of "arson attacks" caused by the vamps exploding into flame when they're ambushed in the day by a pack of cannibalistic ghoul-cats, the PCs should have to dig a bit to uncover this one.

The campaign is largely tier one in intent, at least to begin with. The Genius is actually a former member of Task Force: Valkyrie, who had to kill his team when they were compromised by either a vampire or something else (not sure yet), and it sent him off the deep end. I want it to be a fun reveal when the PCs finally find his lair and it's filled to the brim with insane graphs and charts for his profiling means, but also US Government documentation. If I did include Ashwood Abbey (and I think I might), it'd just be the one Hunter who comes to town. Perhaps on a Safari for a Werewolf and it coincides with the PCs finding out the hard way that Werewolves exist?
Replies: >>95994796
Anonymous
7/1/2025, 11:54:04 PM No.95994742
I've been thinking about using the shades and horrors from Orpheus in Wraith since guilds fucking suck. Has anyone ever tried something like this? Do they translate easily?
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:02:21 AM No.95994796
>>95994718
You have quite the ambitious game in mind. Fair warning, it'll be a lot of work, speaking from experience here. Do you plan on using actual splats for the Nosferatu and others or will you just simulate them with Dread Powers? If you're mentioning Amaranthine Cats I would assume so, since they're in a Requiem book.

As for the Ashwood Abbey, a single hunter could work fine. Hell, it could be a good opportunity to have Mr. Genius be forced to reveal more of his hand than he'd like. If he wants to keep other compacts and conspiracies out, he might be forced to try and whack the Abbey guy before he can report back. The Abbey canonically likes to skin werewolves while they're still alive for coats and rugs, so yeah it'd be easy to tie them into a werewolf hunt.
Replies: >>95994857
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:09:29 AM No.95994857
>>95994796
It's easy to be ambitious when the game hasn't actually started yet, I'm sure I'll dial some stuff back when push comes to shove. Unfortunately.

I think it's best to keep as much as possible to the HtV2 book when it comes to monsters, if there's something specific that I need to lift over then I'll do that, but a meek Nosferatu would just use Madness and Terror, and Dread Attacks will cover Vigor for the Cats etc.. Really, I just like the Amaranthine Cats and I want to use them to throw the players a bit of a curveball. I've never played Werewolf but I know they have 5 different forms, I think for the purposes of this game I'd just flavour their forms around their Dread Powers (Dread Attack only in wolfman and warform, whatever they're called, that sorta thing) rather than wholesale try and port over an Uratha.

For Ashwood Abbey that's a very fun idea. Perhaps it could be the case that this Hunter has hounded the Werewolf to the PCs town for a cleaner kill, unheeding of the consequences of his actions? The PCs may assume he's the last of his cell and he's driven by revenge, but actually, he's always been this batshit crazy. That his cell died isn't contributing too much to that.
Replies: >>95994929
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:18:16 AM No.95994907
>>95994413
You say removing athletics from defense. Does anything get added to it or does defense cap at 3 for characters without celerity or something else to boost Dex?
Replies: >>95994988
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:21:45 AM No.95994929
>>95994857
Sticking to just HtV is a good way to avoid being mechanically overwhelmed. I know most other splats well enough to incorporate them without issue but that's a special case. I don't know your WtA player well but I will warn you they tend to have high expectations for how werewolves perform. At the same time, don't feel obligated to stay accurate to WtA, it's not even in the same system as HtV.

On the Abbey thing, that sounds good to me. A small town has a bunch of countryside to hunt the werewolf down without causing a stink. Come to think of it, one question that might come up. The game is set in the U.K., yeah? Valkyrie was doing something here, which does make sense because America but... would they have been working jointly with a U.K. equivalent or were they cutting the brits out of the loop in their own country? I tend to give most developed countries a (smaller and less advanced) TF:V equivalent. For the U.K. I called them MI13.
Replies: >>95994956
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:26:04 AM No.95994956
>>95994929
TF:V are in the UK because Margaret Thatcher got assassinated by three Vampires in a one-shot I ran for a different group and my autism won't let me ignore that and just run a self-contained game, so TF:V sent a team over to investigate the assassination of the UK Prime Minister and the team was compromised.
Replies: >>95994988
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:31:23 AM No.95994988
>>95994907
Without athletics mortal defense theoretically caps at 5, since it's the lower of wits or dex and both cap out at 5. At character creation it's possible, albeit very minmaxxy to get defense 4. Certain fighting styles can also boost defense in general or in certain circumstances. Spears and shields also grant extra defense. If you want you could retool defensive combat (I think that's what the merit is called) to have brawl/weaponry dots replace wits/dex for defense rather than add to it.

I think a common defense range of 2-4 before any modifiers plays better than the alternative. 3 str and 3 weaponry is 6 dice. -2 from a joe shmo is already four dice. Four dice is more likely than not to get 1 success, but can still easily miss. That is a strong and competent attacker v.s. a random dude. I've found that with athletics to defense melee combat gets very miss and glancing blow heavy which makes encounters less engaging and firearms are already really good, we don't need the guy who wants to use a knife or sword to struggle more.

>>95994956
I see well say no more.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:45:50 AM No.95995079
How far away would you guys have the local (American) prince care about breaches of the masquerade by way something ripping ghouls and herd kine to shreds.
Like obviously they won't care too much if someone was ripped limb from limb on another continent. But how close before they start to take notice. Next town over? A couple towns over? Same state? A state or two over?
Replies: >>95995125 >>95995181 >>95995193
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 12:52:18 AM No.95995125
>>95995079
Depends on his domain, personality, and court toxicity. A guy juggling a dozen Ventrue upstarts, sabbat invasions, and Garou incursions probably won't add anything to his plate until it starts affecting his rep or direct holdings. Similarly, a Malkavian might ignore the literal fire in his mansion to check on the crop circles on the other side of the continent.

Ultimately though, most princes are hands-off until their subjects start getting affected. After which they might send the sheriff or an up-and-coming coterie of neonates to check if there's somebody conducting unsanctioned skullduggery.
Replies: >>95995181
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 1:02:52 AM No.95995181
>>95995079
What >>95995125 says is pretty spot on. I'd add that it depends heavily on how far the domain's territory stretches. I'm not a big fan of "vampires are only urban" so I tend to extend the average domain's borders out to the suburbs and satellite towns. In that case they'd have more land to consider for when it's "their problem" to maintain the masquerade.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 1:03:45 AM No.95995184
>>95994654
>Were they just unable to move or did the damage render both torpid?
See that was the best part. The Pander went straight into torpor while the Lasombra was just incapacitated, but conscious.
We joked about her not knowing what was worse: meeting final death by being scorched under the sun or doing so while her simp lackey used her tits as a pillow.
Replies: >>95995402
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 1:04:53 AM No.95995193
>>95995079
It depends less on if he would care and more on if he can exert his influence and power there. A prince would absolutely swing his dick around and squash someone violating the masquerade on another continent, if he could. But princes don't have that much power, their power rarely actually extends past the borders of their city and even then what they can actually get away with within their demesne is a balancing act. Look at Chicago under Hardestadt. The model of vicious authoritarian prince who rules via an iron fist. There is still a large Anarch contingent in Chicago.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 1:06:31 AM No.95995200
>>95993989
Bro, I can't into Obfuscate and needed a teacher for Presence.
Meanwhile, Auspex and Dominate just came naturally (some of Thaumaturgy too).
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 1:38:46 AM No.95995402
>>95995184
diabolical
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 2:47:36 AM No.95995847
shutterstock_242315404-1448x2048
shutterstock_242315404-1448x2048
md5: cb3710be781229c04e55ce75f2d12d48🔍
Besides Vampire, What splat has the best power to enslave people?
Replies: >>95995872 >>95995997 >>95996000 >>95996051 >>95996168 >>95996339 >>95996344
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 2:51:07 AM No.95995872
>>95995847
Mage, probably? Depends on if you're trying to target regular humies or other supernaturals.
Replies: >>95995957
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:00:15 AM No.95995929
>>95993532
squabbling vampires barely getting by despite each other is the best kind of coterie
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:03:19 AM No.95995957
287af34b7ecd26ff9ec2919635f559bc
287af34b7ecd26ff9ec2919635f559bc
md5: 2f5fe654b0dc3fb5ddff98a4cef31456🔍
>>95995872
I was thinking about mortals because binding other supernaturals is covered by a sorcery line and not much else.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:09:49 AM No.95995997
>>95995847
Not an expert on changelings but it seems like something they should be able to do.
Replies: >>95996068
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:10:09 AM No.95996000
>>95995847
Wraith and it's no contest. Multiple arcanoi are dedicated to mindfucking you so hard you learn to love it.
Kenning, Phantasm, Pandemonium, Intimation, Mnemosynis, etc. A wraith can may you feel any emotion they want, reprogram your basic instincts, make you experience reality only how they want you to, and rewrite your memories so you think this is how it always was all before we even get into tempers.
Let also not forget Arcanoi are Cheap to learn too.
Replies: >>95996068 >>95996072 >>95996206 >>95996344
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:17:37 AM No.95996051
>>95995847
It’s literally Demon they have an entire path dedicated to dominating Man and that includes supernatural variants. Unless you’re a Demon or completely immune to mind control the dot 1 of Lore of Humanity alone forces you to do as they say. Changeling has a similar power but it’s at a higher rank, but they actually work pretty much the same. You can’t even not hear it, it works on the deaf and no matter how loud or quiet it is the demon is always heard fully and clearly as they intend.
Replies: >>95996095 >>95996133
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:20:26 AM No.95996068
>>95995997
I can see the Lostlings pulling that kind of shit via dream manipulation. No idea if the Dreamlings can do that.

>>95996000
Not gonna lie I thought that type of stuff was reserved for the Specters.
Replies: >>95996098 >>95996240
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:21:00 AM No.95996072
>>95996000
I second wraith. The shear variety of ways they have to mess with your brain is staggering. Most of the other splats just have some variant of dominate for their mind control.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:23:45 AM No.95996095
>>95996051
Meant Lore of Radiance not Humanity

It gets a lot more wild if you include other powers on top of it but as far as 1 dot powers Radiance is absolutely insane.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:23:55 AM No.95996098
>>95996068
>Specters
Every arcanoi I mentioned was the normal psyche arcanoi. Spectres have Even More with corruption and malefiscence, they even have arcanoi for mind-fucking other wraiths with contaminate and varients of hive-mind.
Replies: >>95996498
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:31:04 AM No.95996133
>>95996051
Earthbound are even better/worse. They can make people who see their apocalyptic form worship them on sight if they fail a check and eventually completely override the wills of their thralls.
Then there's Lore of Violation for literal mind rape.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:36:41 AM No.95996168
>>95995847
It's a toss up between demon and wraith.
Demon have more inherent and passive abilities to mind-fuck people, but the best lores for it are gated separately behind membership between specific houses. You aren't going to have both the lore of celestials and lore of longing on the same character for a long time.
Wraith don't start out with any passive abilities to mind-program people, but they far more options than any other splat and their powers are cheap. A wraith with some xp can basically able to rewrite consciousness like a master linux dev.
Replies: >>95996191 >>95996273 >>95996344
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:41:16 AM No.95996191
>>95996168
Just eat a Devil/Devourer after starting as a Devourer/Devil kappa
Replies: >>95996211
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:43:35 AM No.95996206
>>95996000
Wraith doesn't get nearly the recognition it deserves and I blame VtM for this. Necromancy in VtM paints wraith as just invisible scouts that can scare people and occasionally do physcial damage via spooky ghost magic. Meanwhile, Wraiths in the oblivion actually have half their fucking arcanoi dedicated to mind-bending people so hard their basic personality traits are just playthings to you.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:44:39 AM No.95996211
>>95996191
Devourers don't get lore of longing anon.
Replies: >>95996245
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:50:34 AM No.95996240
>>95996068
>Dreamlings
The sovereign Art is extremely good for this sort of stuff, Dreamlings might be better than Lostling at this
Replies: >>95996503
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:51:22 AM No.95996245
>>95996211
Defiler. I always get the Houses wrong.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 3:56:07 AM No.95996273
>>95996168
The difference is pretty hammer vs scalpel. Demons are much better at manipulating larger groups of people, earthbound even more so, but their abilities aren't particularly in-depth. Wraiths are great at latering every aspect of a person from their emotions, memories, thoughts, instincts, dreams/higher aspirations, etc, basically letting them mold human souls like clay in the hand of a master sculpter, but they target one person or a small group at most.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:13:17 AM No.95996339
>>95995847
Wraith is literally built around slavery. 2ed book makes that very clear from the get go. You can enslave wraiths, turn them into money, weapons, bullets, buttplugs... it's encouraged to do so. You can also enslave people, take over their lives, manipulate their memories... fun for all family.
Demon can also devolve into slave collecting real quick. Although at some point your slaves essentially do your bidding out of their own free will, unless they're bound by a pact.
Mage has great potential for that too. And you can enslave pretty much anything you want.
Replies: >>95996344 >>95996362
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:15:49 AM No.95996344
wraith harvesting
wraith harvesting
md5: a3702228ffbb81e4532f759b8321d78d🔍
>>95996339
>>95995847
>>95996168
>>95996000
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:21:54 AM No.95996362
>>95996339
It's even built to resist abolition, until you're ready to give up the foundation keeping you from dropping down a black hole and any tools useful to defending yourself.
Replies: >>95996518
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:51:29 AM No.95996498
>>95996098
Neat.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:52:30 AM No.95996503
>>95996240
>Dreamlings might be better than Lostling at this
For once they get a W.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:55:30 AM No.95996518
>>95996362
>It's even built to resist abolition, until you're ready to give up the foundation keeping you from dropping down a black hole and any tools useful to defending yourself.
You can always "just" get your shit together and end your existence as a ghost.
Replies: >>95996654 >>95999132
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:28:03 AM No.95996654
>>95996518
But I like turning ghosts into shotguns and chainsaws to enter labyrinths and exterminate evil ghosts.
What better afterlife can there be?
Replies: >>95996670
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:32:52 AM No.95996670
>>95996654
One where another part of you isn't constantly whispering at you to shoot that other wraith in the back because they got promoted instead of you.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:36:03 AM No.95996690
How far can you stretch Entropy spells before they become Vulgar? If the entire hit squad’s guns all malfunction at once, is that Vulgar? If a plane flying over head falls out of the sky and lands on the house of the guy who tucked your girlfriend, is that Vulgar? If three people charging you with knives all trip and impale themselves, is that Vulgar?
Replies: >>95996774 >>95996793
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:00:13 AM No.95996774
>>95996690
>How far can you stretch Entropy spells before they become Vulgar?
As long as the ST lets you get away with it. In general as long as you can give a reasonable explanation you should be fine. Hell, you can even use a spell to facilitate another.
Replies: >>95996792
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:10:22 AM No.95996792
>>95996774
So is it not just the most broken Sphere?
Replies: >>95996820 >>95996862 >>95996870 >>95996882
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:11:13 AM No.95996793
>>95996690
When coincidence becomes consistent, it becomes vulgar.
Think of it this way: if you toss a coin three times and you get three heads, winning a game of chance, it's still statistically plausible. How many coin tosses would it take for you (or your opponent) to say "wait why is this only landing one way? Is this coin tricked?" Then you show your opponent the coin isn't tricked, but that only raises even more questions as to how you're manipulating the outcome.
Now take it a step further. You toss a coin and bet on the coin landing on its edge three times. Statistically speaking, it's possible for the coin to land on its edge once every few thousand, maybe every few hundred times if you're really lucky. How improbable would it be for you to win?
To answer your questions:
>Entire hit squad's guns malfunction
Depends on you explain it. Maybe it's raining, or the squad just crossed a swamp. The environmental conditions can make guns unreliable, you know?
Vulgar effects can become coincidental with the correct explanation (he didn't shoot lightning, it was a malfunctioning powerline!)
>Targeted plane accident
Convoluted, not sure if Entropy alone would even cut it for such an effect. Also huge collateral.
But if it happens once? Sure. Freak accidents happen all the time. Everyone's seen Breaking Bad, right?
That said, if other people you dislike keep getting into freak accidents then the single coincidental effects can retroactively become vulgar.
>Three stooges knife skit
Again, explanation matters. One charges at you, so you judo-throw him in just the right angle for him to impale himself in the chest. The second one lunges, so you do a swipe kick and he falls while holding his knife high, stabbing himself in the throat. That's two unfortunate accidents already, so for the third guy you may want to use a different effect. For example, you use Entropy to identify his posture and grip's weak spots, you disarm the thug manually and stab him.
Replies: >>95996882
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:19:26 AM No.95996820
>>95996792
I mean... all Spheres are pretty broken.
But Entropy and Time tend to have as their drawback some of the scariest Paradox spirits and realms. There's also just how creative your ST is when it comes to giving you backlashes.
The very same good luck you once abused is just one botch away from turning on you. Raising difficulties to 10, forcing bad outcomes out of nowhere, creating new foes, creating MORE paradox just by existing... Your choice.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:33:30 AM No.95996862
>>95996792
If you want to white-room it and assume that your theoretical ST says "okay" to every form of coincidence that you invoke without questioning it, then yeah, it's broken.
This is why theory-crafters love both versions of Mage, as both of them rely on Storytellers who are willing to put their foot down and say 'no' when players are pushing their luck. These STs don't exist when you're posting about theoretical white-room mages on the internet, which is why this general tends to attract a lot of power level autism surrounding mages.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:36:30 AM No.95996870
>>95996792
Just because it's coincidental doesn't mean it'll succeed.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:40:13 AM No.95996882
>>95996792
>So is it not just the most broken Sphere?
It is the one with the most coincidental bullshit but "luck" will only get you so far against some scenarios and foes.

>>95996793
>Depends on you explain it.
Summarizing the entirety of Mage in 5 words. As for fucking up guns with Entropy, you can almost always say "They got some overcharged ammo".
Replies: >>95996995
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 7:16:45 AM No.95996995
>>95996882
>As for fucking up guns with Entropy, you can almost always say "They got some overcharged ammo".
This, "manufacturer error" works too.
Replies: >>95997016
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 7:24:23 AM No.95997016
>>95996995
That's a good one in general.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:10:30 AM No.95997138
>People on plebbit complain about the Verbena being antivaxxers
By the Goddess, they're getting written out of M5, aren't they?
Replies: >>95997267 >>95997273 >>95997394 >>95997427 >>95997943 >>95998809 >>95999250
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:40:07 AM No.95997267
>>95997138
>By the Goddess, they're getting written out of M5, aren't they?
Yes and that's a good thing.
Replies: >>95997280
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:42:38 AM No.95997273
>>95997138
>M5
I sense much butthurt in the near future.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:45:07 AM No.95997280
>>95997267
I would be more careful with my words, anon.
Verbena are the first ones to pull out the testicular torsion rote.
Replies: >>95997290
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:51:16 AM No.95997290
>>95997280
>Verbena are the first ones to pull out the testicular torsion rote.
What do you think I am fishing for?
Replies: >>95997299
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:56:06 AM No.95997299
testicleclamps
testicleclamps
md5: f786e6ca6fb538778b8a7fb6b8498aa1🔍
>>95997290
Closest I have right now.
Replies: >>95997311
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 9:03:45 AM No.95997311
6ffe9dc6eb6e7316ae830bb6c50eaaa5
6ffe9dc6eb6e7316ae830bb6c50eaaa5
md5: 9937187a337e3e6ae410ade80ef8c10c🔍
>>95997299
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 9:44:51 AM No.95997394
>>95997138
Pray that Karim doesn't learn about the Iron Circle. And if he does, I have a solution, but you're not going to like it.

Pray for death.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 9:57:20 AM No.95997427
>>95997138
I wanted to prove the inferiority of the Verbena. But not like this. Not like this.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 1:05:32 PM No.95997943
>>95997138
I don't think so, "woke" types love pretending to be witches, Verbena is the closest to that. They'll just become Reddit/Tumblr witches, and the anti vaxx parts will be an antagonist faction.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 4:31:49 PM No.95998809
>>95997138
ALL traditions will be written out of M5, it will be MtAw-lite without even the barest flavour it gave to its paths and orders.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:22:35 PM No.95999132
>>95996518
If wraiths did that en masse, all of existence would end. The underworld is the only thing between oblivion and the rest of reality. No Wraiths = Oblivion eats the material world.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:40:55 PM No.95999250
>>95997138
Most of the traditions would be antivaxxers, even the ones who take them would be weird about it. Etherites probably try to brew their own homemade stuff.
Replies: >>95999278
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:45:16 PM No.95999274
>>95994070
Sounds pretty nice. Hope it keeps working. With my playgroup, we started with the 5e stuff and we looked back to the classics 20th editions when we want to experiment with other stuff.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:46:14 PM No.95999278
>>95999250
Etherites believe vaccines give you autism but also that's a good thing
Replies: >>95999453
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 5:48:44 PM No.95999291
>>95994349
What happend to the super powerfull guy in the old WoD lore thta had almost everyaspect of the supernatural creatures? I don't remember his name but I remmember that he drank blankbody vitae to be stronger and also was related to werewolfs to some measure and also wasa pretty good Hunter of the supernatural I think he even had some magik or something? i think the only stuff missing was the wraith stuff and changeling. Anyone remmembers who im talking about?
Replies: >>95999369
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:01:12 PM No.95999369
>>95999291
>blankbody
I loathe Alfabusa for popularizing that stupid-ass term.

Anyway you're thinking of Samuel Haight, the "ultimate badass". Kinfolk ghoul who used a fucked up ritual to become a real werewolf and could cast mage magic with some shibbledibble he stole in another adventure (where you aren't allowed to stop him). Everyone mocks him and WW swear he was always supposed to be parody. Despite this your average whiteroomer here unironically wants to make Sam Haight but better, probably with more dex.
Replies: >>95999413
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:06:41 PM No.95999398
Hey there, i have a question for any experience ST for Hunter, any edition, even Vigil.

How beta or weak has to be the Blankbody to be helpful to cell but not a threat in any way?
I'm planing to use a kindered as a type of snitch (talking in code and all because muh masquerade) and was giving info on different supernaturals the kindered want out or to observe. Was planning that the kindered was extored by the Master Hunter(TM) of the Cell by having the info on the touchstones of the vamp. Any suggestions?
Replies: >>95999875
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:09:21 PM No.95999413
>>95999369
riiiight... Samuel Haight. What happend to him? Was is it cannon or mentioned in other places or even hinted? I find it funny that they made that type of character.
Replies: >>95999455
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:14:41 PM No.95999443
So if you go with Everything is Chaos and Chaos Magick, you can basically cobble together your magic from various traditions and even folklore and pop culture as long as the stuff you’re doing makes sense to you, right?
So if you want to shapeshift, what makes sense to you is Navajo Skinwalker style wearing the pelt of an animal to turn into that animal, so that’s what you do. But then you’ve watched too many exorcism movies, so you’d cat out spirits by chanting in Latin and waving around a cross. But then you want to make that person immune to possession in the future, so you tattoo the anti-possession symbol from Supernatural on them. And then you want to throw a fireball, but you were a massive D&D nerd before you awakened, so your idea of how to throw a fireball is say an incantation and make a magical gesture while throwing bay guano at your target.
These are all wildly disparate methods of casting magic, but they should work if that’s your idea of how to do those things, right?
Or if we’re ignoring pop culture, if you believe that all magic is ultimately the same thing, you can crib pieces of it from actual traditions in universe? If you could convince a Hermetic to teach you a ritual, that would work for you. But you could also go learn how to cast a different spell via drugs and orgy from an Ecstatic and that one would work for you, too?
Replies: >>95999473
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:15:34 PM No.95999453
>>95999278
Brave New World-ass servitor castes gotta come from somewhere.
Replies: >>95999477
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:16:36 PM No.95999455
>>95999413
he was killed, became a wraith, got moliated into an ashtray, and vanished shortly afterwards.
Replies: >>95999519
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:18:49 PM No.95999473
>>95999443
That's how being an Orphan works yes (There's even a merit to learn techniques from other mages who show them to you)
Everyone else thinks they're insane
Replies: >>95999566
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:19:15 PM No.95999477
>>95999453
I think that's more of a Progenitor thing
Replies: >>95999510
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:24:31 PM No.95999510
>>95999477
All eugenics just sounds Etheric to me up until gene theory.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:25:47 PM No.95999519
>>95999455
kek, an ashtray of all things. Deserved fate for something so silly.
Replies: >>95999612
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:33:32 PM No.95999566
>>95999473
So basically, Orphans gain some degree of flexibility at the cost of having zilch in terms of organizational support? You can learn to do any kind of magic, but you have to scrape and scramble for it because you can’t just go to a mentor or colleague that has centuries of inherited knowledge in how to perform magic in your tradition and consult them?
Replies: >>95999588 >>95999639
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:37:40 PM No.95999588
>>95999566
Same is true of all three outcast splats. Caitiff can learn any discipline they want and have now in-clan/out-of-clan bonus/penalty, Ronin woofs have no restrictions on tribe or auspice for their gifts, etc.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:40:46 PM No.95999612
>>95999519
>Deserved fate for something so silly.
Height wasn't even all that bad until Rage across the Amazon made him into a Mage and an author self-insert.
Before then he was a ghouled garou with a rite that let him turn kinfolk into garou. He was essentially a walking embodyment of the backlash for how poorly garou had been treating their kinfolk throughout the editions until then. The initial concept was Amazing, and then they fucked it up Hard.
Replies: >>95999746
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:44:48 PM No.95999639
>>95999566
It's more that your paradigm doesn't fit into a box. You don't have flexibility, you have individuality. If you know anything about an Akashic, then you know they channel their magic with kung fu, so you have to shut down their body to stop them in any meaningful way. An ecstatic? Shut down their senses. A Hermetic? Crush their sigils and cut out their tongue.

An Orphan? He casts fireball by whistling in harmonic baritone at the just the right frequency to ignite the nitrogen gas in the air because he knows that they use nitrogen in bombs, so surely its explosive as a gas, right? You, as an opposing mage, have absolutely no idea what he's most likely going to do, so there's no way to predict him.
Replies: >>95999693
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:51:02 PM No.95999693
>>95999639
But they could still potentially have those other ways of doing things, too, right? Say their enemy figures out that they can stop the fireballs by stopping the whistling. But then that Orphan ALSO was a big fan of Kung Fu movies, so he learned how to “channel his Chi” into supernatural martial arts like an Akashic and one inch punch someone through a brick wall?
Replies: >>95999830
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:56:18 PM No.95999746
>>95999612
Oh man, thats actually pretty cool. The beginnings its pretty neat. Hope we can get a new equivalent to him a little less bullshit and balanced?
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 6:58:05 PM No.95999768
Mage desperately needs a "Paradigm Damage" mechanic.
Mages should have their ability to do magic fucked with whenever they encounter something that shakes their belief in their paradigm, which would add mechanics to the supposed benefits of being part of a mage organization vs being a "magic is whatever I want" orphan.
Replies: >>95999805
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 7:02:17 PM No.95999805
>>95999768
I thought that in the modern day, the traditions all pretty much know that their way of doing magic isn’t a singular universal truth. I mean, they understand the consensus, so I thought they extrapolated that their magic was effectively a personal extension of the same thing.
Replies: >>95999841 >>96001378
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 7:05:04 PM No.95999830
>>95999693
Yeah but then you've got to fit all of your methods into one cohesive paradigm. That's the tricky part. You're still restricted by tools and practices, probably ones that don't work so well together. It's the harder path, but in a game about individuality it's definitely rewarding.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 7:06:07 PM No.95999841
>>95999805
Nope, the tradition books go into this. Every tradition is under the delusion that their personal paradigm is the One True way to do magic and they every other tradition is using the "Right Way" without knowing it because they add a bunch of unnecessary bullshit that "proves" their incorrect delusions.
Literally every single tradition is full schizo.
This was written because the writer decided to overlook and ignore the possibility of mages having a "crisis of faith" rather than add a new mechanic for it.
Replies: >>96000580
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 7:10:00 PM No.95999875
>>95999398
General info brokers are Nosferatu. They can get away by pretending the cell is just another client they didn't know wasn't kindred, as long as they don't snitch on their own clan (think 4chan tiers of Shia Lebouf tracking otherwise)
Replies: >>96000328 >>96000341
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:16:14 PM No.96000328
>>95999875
Oh I see. Althought aren't Nosferatu are like super paranoid and would be invisible or a form to track their info is given to the kindered and not Hunters? I know i can just say so because im the ST but I wanted to be as attached to the current lore and representation based on H5 and V5.
Replies: >>96000341 >>96000850 >>96001108
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:19:00 PM No.96000341
>>95999875
Sorry, im stupid and didn't read well sentence. Ignore my replay here >>96000328
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 8:52:19 PM No.96000580
>>95999841
That’s kinda dumb. Does ANYONE in the setting realize the truth about how magic works? Do high Arete master mages have an inkling of it, at least?
Replies: >>96000745 >>96000965 >>96001378
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 9:13:45 PM No.96000745
>>96000580
Up to your ST, but generally the writers lean "No" and make fun of any character that knows the truth by calling them a "Purple Paradigm Twink".
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 9:27:53 PM No.96000850
>>96000328
>but I wanted to be as attached to the current lore and representation based on H5 and V5.

Ew.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 9:43:04 PM No.96000965
>>96000580
Anon, you have to understand, a mage who truly understands 'how magic works' wouldn't be a very good mage, because in order to reach a higher level of understanding of your paradigm, you need to actually BELIEVE in that paradigm.
The higher a mage's Arete rating, the more they have to believe in the truth of their paradigm. It's the main flaw of both the traditions and especially the technocracy, all their most powerful mages are simultaneously completely out of touch with reality and also the ones making the big decisions.
Replies: >>96001155
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:00:11 PM No.96001108
>>96000328
There can be a multitude of ways to link one to the players. Could be a recent embrace that was a friend of one of the squad. Could be they have blackmail on him that'd get him blood hunted or excommunicated at least, thus he goes "in for a penny in for a pound". Could be they have access to a guy that blood-bonded him ages ago in their church's basement and he's willing to do anything for a fix.
Nosferatu are one of the most mercenary clans, loyal only unto their own clan.
Replies: >>96001229
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:08:14 PM No.96001155
>>96000965
Wouldn’t that literally just be Chaos Magick? So that “understanding how reality works“ is just their own delusional belief in that the same as every tradition believes they “understand how reality works”? The fact that they’re technically more “right” doesn’t actually matter on any real level. Except I could see it leading them to be more likely to turn into a Marauder or even just a more mundanely insane solipsistic schizo.
Replies: >>96001383
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:19:17 PM No.96001229
>>96001108
wow, that's actually sound pretty well thought! Thanks! I'll get to draft some stuff and put it to the plot convienience.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:35:40 PM No.96001342
Give me a good tq.
Replies: >>96001379
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:40:18 PM No.96001378
We are Gods in Disguise - All the World's a Stage
We are Gods in Disguise - All the World's a Stage
md5: 932e6af2b329d8e7a4b64b98de246d40🔍
>>95999805
>>96000580
I mean, they do, but there is a difference between hearing it, knowing it and believing in it.
Also, it's not like their way of doing is wrong. You will not get stronger or better benefits with using "We are all Gods" paradigm. An Apparentice Hermetic and an Archmage Hermetic believes in the same things.
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:40:21 PM No.96001379
>>96001342
>Sidekick edition
>How do you utilise ghouls/kinfolk/etc. in your games, both as a player and a storyteller. Have you ever had any experiences playing as one?
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:40:59 PM No.96001383
>>96001155
>The fact that they’re technically more “right” doesn’t actually matter on any real level.
Well, that's not entirely true. There are definitely paradigms that are more right than others and have mechanical benefits to prove it.
Specifically:
Hermetics, Akashics, Choiristers, and Dreamspeakers all have unique mechanical abilities that make them stronger than mages of other paradigms
All other traditions either get no benefits Or like the Virtual adepts, their paradigm actually get Punished for being farther from "the truth" despite being in line with consensus.
All 4 of the traditions with in-house benefits also happen to align with a static numen of some form. Hermetics=Sorcery, Akashics=Shih, Choiristers=True Faith/Inquisitors, Dreamspeakers=Kinfolk Shamans.
Replies: >>96001414
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:42:33 PM No.96001398
New bread:
>>96001393
Anonymous
7/2/2025, 10:44:43 PM No.96001414
Kopa Loei
Kopa Loei
md5: 27973eae899cb99119b85cf5d3e823de🔍
>>96001383
That isn't because they are more "right", that is because their paradigms have in built mechanisms for it. This is why some paradigms are suckier than the others, like Kopa Loei not being able to create Force effects out of nowhere.
(Hell, Dremaspeakers prefer to keep away from Kinfolks since Werewolves are angry at them too.)