Thread 95997412

Grand Procession Edition

Resources:
WFB: https://pastebin.com/qVGrgwwh
WM: https://pastebin.com/EsDAgeba
WFRP: https://pastebin.com/inbyBsR6
Novels: https://pastebin.com/PFqPDr0H
>Warhammer Chronicles:
https://files (dot) catbox (dot) moe/0xt777 (dot) zip
>Time of Legends:
https://files (dot) catbox (dot) moe/q46ut6 (dot) zip
>The End Times:
https://files (dot) catbox (dot) moe/j7d0t5 (dot) zip
>TOW:
https://gofile.io/d/fxFgXS
https://www.warhammer-community.com/the-old-world-downloads/
>Alternative Models:
https://pastebin.com/xPeM9szL
>FAQ/Errata
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/wgp83jlw/old-world-faq-and-errata-designers-notes/

>Previous Thread:
>>95986560

>Thread Question:
Which army are you thinking of starting? Or are you thinking of expanding your current army?

>>95997412 (OP)
I've lost control of my life

Kislev when it releases, I've completed my current armies of Empire/Beastmen and Tomb Keks.

>TQ
Still on and probably gonna have to only stick to wood elves. Here's hoping people like playing at 2500 points in 2 years

>>95997412 (OP)
>TQ
I'm currently extending my 500pts Beastmen to 1k, doing my cockatrice right now (report from last thread)
>>95997400
That's why I bought it, the new one was looking meh to me, everyone will have that single model, and it's mostly base anyway.

>>95997412 (OP)

I often think of starting an Araby or turko-mongol style army so that I could actually play with my historical models, but none of the army rosters fit what I'm looking for exactly. Some of the army limitations in TOW are frustrating, like the hard caps on knightly orders for empire armies for example. I guess bretonnia and empire get the closest to the playstyle I'd be looking for, the Cathay roster is still way too small. The lack of ranged options for chaos is an issue, and I think I already have like 4000 points of chaos warriors and chaos dwarfs.

>>95997529
Just go high elves. Cathay already said fuck it with WS5 basic human infantry, what's ws4 bs4 on cavalry?

>>95997412 (OP)
This piece of artwork always fascinated me, but it felt just a tad out of place with how 'grand' it tries to be. I love the bleak Blanchian vision of Warhammer world but those were mostly smaller moments, like the weird dudes in Mordheim rulebook illustrations. Fat knife juggler with a domino mask and two peg legs. That kinda stuff.
Then again, wouldn't grandiose stuff like AUTOMORIAL OF MIDDENHEIM DELIVERED FROM DARKNESS be just the right fit for AoS? 10000 crazy people dragging this hunkajunk around would be more of a concept for a cosmic fantasy where one doesn't have to worry about scale or logistics. Yet most things in AoS are lame and gay. What happen?

>>95997586

Here are my swordmasters bro

>>95997600
>Then again, wouldn't grandiose stuff like AUTOMORIAL OF MIDDENHEIM DELIVERED FROM DARKNESS be just the right fit for AoS?
It would be if an untold amount of them were built and their processions were scheduled every other Sigmarsday from 16pm to 24pm in all important cities of the realms, instead of it being a one-off thing in the wake of the most significant chaos invasions in 200 years.
It is ok for the warhammer fantasy world to have exceptionally fantastical stuff, as long as they're given their contextualised corner instead of being thrown into a blender together with everything else and applied homogeneously on the widest canvas possible until you can't tell anymore whether you have added a layer of worldbuilding or a wash of nuln oil.

>>95997412 (OP)
>TQ
Still waiting for Kislev.

>>95997423
why did you texture the insides of the movement trays?

>>95997600
Gone is the macabre, and to some degree, heroism and scene setting.

>>95997666
Not him but I guess it's so it still looks like terrain when casualties are removed.

>>95997436
Hmm, I don't remember this pic. From what article did it come from?

>>95997412 (OP)
>tq
I might expand my empire army, or start a new one (probably VC, Dwarves or Chorfs). I want to make an oldhammer army, not sure what though.

>>95997412 (OP)
TQ: Cathay

>>95997412 (OP)
First I get some dragon princes and reavers. Then and only once my high elves are painted will I buy Cathay.

>if you want to have your lector on war altar of sigmar be your general, you can't bring a captain now
>need to be nuln if you want to have a bsb

>>95997412 (OP)
>>95997436
>>95997646
GW already said don't expect Kislev to come to the Old World for the foreseeable future. GW technically DID NOT LIE because they used "Or" instead of "And" meaning one these two ain't coming to the Old World and GW finally made their choice with Cathay. If neither Kislev and Cathay were coming, they would have used "And" instead.

Until that dang war is over, GW can basically stall by releasing all the legacy armies first. Now that the Cathay region is on the map, GW can also stall even further by releasing other armies like Nippon, Khuresh, Araby, Ind, the fishmen, etc.

>>95997746
That's not how words work.

>>95997746
This may be the worst interpretation of the English language I have ever seen.

I hope they release a monstrous arcanum or similar before any other armies.

Why such seethe for Kislev? Coping Cathayfags feeling insecure?

>>95997746
lmao

>>95997746
What an absolute goober.

>>95997761

Because the Kislev roster looks really dumb and flanderized with all the ice and bears.

>>95997761
Has there really been a lot of seethe? I bought into Cathay and I don't enjoy the modern interpretation of Kislev i.e. bears and ice and ice bears etc, but obviously Kislev is coming to TOW. Some people have said that Kislev aren't coming due to le russia but that's fucking retarded.

>>95997761
Because we don't like glazing Russian imperialism.

>>95997771
Why are you redditspacing? It makes your posts look ugly and anons will disregard anything you say

>>95997761
I see a number of people being hopeful for kiskev if anything

>>95997761
Because it pisses the Slavs off.

>>95997780
>here's the Russia faction, they are good guys and the bastion against Swedish aggression

I dont get the appeal of kislev.

>>95997783
I thought Nordland was suppose the Scandinavian province of the Empire of man?

>>95997787
There's a literal Norseca where most chaos warrior in the old world invade out of.

>>95997785
>cool aesthetics
>interesting playstyle mixing light infantry, light and medium cavalry, with mobile fortifications
>has anime waifu

>>95997804
Not a single truth hete

Cathay is cool and I am glad people like it but I am waiting for Kislev. Why? I think bear winged hussars are neat.

>>95997746
Let's say hypothetically this was typo by an intern where they put "or" instead of "and" because they didn't really know what's the difference and thought and/or being interchangeable and GW was basically lying from the start. Why didn't they release Kislev first if the war in Ukraine had nothing do with GW's decision? Total War: Warhammer 3 player metrics has shown Kislev being more popular than Cathay in every single region except Asia. Asia earned less than even Australia last year. By all the data, Kislev should have come out first.
.

>>95997787
Nordlanders have Norscan blood, they'd be Danish at most whereas Norscans are the real Nordics

>>95997797
>>95997831
As a Norwegian, I resent that!

Cathay is genuinely Lumineth-tier ugly.

>>95997804
>ROOOSHAN ACCENTS! WODKA! BEARS! ICE ICE ICE!
>cool aesthetics

>>95997787
Nordland is Lower Saxony/Schleswig-Holstein of the Empire, with Salzenmund based on Hamburg

>>95997827
but they realized kislev is boring and ugly so they went with the superior cathay.

>>95997846
bear cavalry is fun and winged lancers are cool

everything that gets flanderised gets lame, but if it gets flanderised in the first place it's because there's something fun or cool underneath

>>95997827
>Let's say hypothetically this was typo by an intern where they put "or" instead of "and" because they didn't really know what's the difference and thought and/or being interchangeable and GW was basically lying from the start.
This is obviously the case, anon. It should be written as "neither Kislev nor Cathay" but this is often neglected in informal writing. The natural reading is that Kislev and Cathay weren't planned to be added, but we know now that this was a lie.
>Why didn't they release Kislev first if the war in Ukraine had nothing do with GW's decision?
Because they're trying to expand into the Asian market. That's literally the main reason. Asia is fucking massive.
Another reason I can think of is that bringing back Kislev would mean once again selling older models with probably 3 or so new kits. Meanwhile Cathay is brand new, never seen before on the tabletop. The preview show where they revealed Cathay had me thinking that GW is serious about its support for TOW since they're releasing entirely new armies for it instead of rereleasing old ones and giving us pity models.
Furthermore, people don't even associate Kislev with Russia specifically. They're a hodgepodge of Slavic and even Eurasian peoples. Kislev famously has Winged Hussars who are very specifically Polish in the real world.
Kislev is coming soon. Probably sometime next year.

>>95997716
pretty much the OG TOW article

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/MzN3fQTQ/the-old-world-ice-guard-of-kislev/

>>95997412 (OP)
When Kislev arrives, please refrain from making snow bases. It looks like shit.

>>95997746
Kislev is unavoidable if they ever want to break into the Great War narrative and they've already touched on it and made the Knights Panther a big deal.

>>95997932
nah people just don't knw how to use snow texture pastes and compact it rather than scattering it so it is broken up in drifts. Also helps to use foliage with ice and snow on it and elevated rocks etc for some contrast so they aren't just white blocks. Mud/blood is also a great way to introduce variation.

>>95997932
skill issue

>>95997841
So it’s the best thing to grace the old world?

>>95997956
Lol no, dealing with those fuckers makes me appreciate the high elves for their cartoons elegance.
Speaking of, here's a silverhelm I'm painting. I know they have silver in the name, but a bronze cuirass seems appropriate to me.

>>95997967
>makes comment on aesthetics of faction
>likes goonerbait weebtoons
opinion discarded, and I don't even like Cathay.

>>95997910
>bringing back Kislev would mean once again selling older models with probably 3 or so new kits.
Are you talking about these?

>>95997979
Everyone on this website, this board especially, has dogshit tastes for asthetics anon. Don’t take it too seriously.

>>95997979
What's the difference between coomer and gooner?

>>95997979
Ignoring the retarded hats and kangaroos, and triple stringed bows. and cow giant, AoS models are incredibly fiddly and unfun to assemble as a general rule.
If I wanted Malifaux, I'd get those kits.

>>95998002
Even outside of all that they are ugly. Awful looking armour, weapons, proportions, and posing. They are the most irredeemable models they've ever made and I'm genuinely impressed by them

>besmirching hats
Now that’s a grudge-
Er. I guess chorfs don’t have that gimmick now do they.

>>95998016
Chorf hats are ugly and are the product of malicious compliance, made deliberately shit on purpose to spite managers abusing the sculptors. Anyone who likes them has fallen for a meme.

>>95998027
>Anyone who likes them has fallen for a meme.
I feel like this line can be used on a lot of things gw related.

WD anon here, got another article from the golden years.

>>95998027
They're great, don't they?

Why are high elf spearmen, who wear nail coats, breastplates and full helms only classified as wearing light armour?

>>95998057
They arent wearing anything underneath

>>95998027
Correction: chorf hats are the result of a project leader's vision coming to fruition despite the inability of the sculptor to visualise or appreciate that vision.

Sculptors aren't necessarily good designers even when they're technically brilliant, that's one of the reasons why the roles are often separated.

>>95998057
Because armor.is arbitrary.

>>95997910
I asked ChatGPT explain why GW wouldn't want to release Kislev at this time:


"Yes, the release of Kislev-related content — especially during or amid ongoing real-world tensions like the Russian invasion of Ukraine — can be problematic from a public relations (PR) perspective, though it depends heavily on how the content is framed, updated, and presented. Let’s break down why this could be sensitive, and how it's been handled so far.

# Why Kislev Could Be Problematic PR-Wise (During the Ukraine War)

>1. Russian Aesthetic Dominance
Kislev is still largely viewed by many fans as “Warhammer Russia,” especially because of:

* The Tsarina (Katarin).
* Orthodox-style architecture.
* Russian-inspired names and titles (Boyars, Oblasts).

With Russia being the aggressor in a brutal war, this strong imperial-Russian aesthetic could evoke negative associations — particularly in Eastern Europe and among Ukrainian fans.

>2. Conflation with Modern Geopolitics
The use of Russian-style symbols or romanticized Tsarist themes can seem tone-deaf or insensitive during a real-world invasion.
Even if unintentional, it might look like glamorizing or normalizing Russian imperialism — a sensitive topic in post-Soviet and NATO countries.

>3. Cultural Misrepresentation
Kislev borrows from Russian, Ukrainian, and Polish culture, but most casual players don’t recognize the Ukrainian (Cossack) and Polish (Winged Lancers) elements.
This can make Ukrainians and Poles feel their heritage is co-opted under a “Russian-coded” umbrella, especially painful during a time when cultural identity is under attack.

>4. Fan Perception and Memes
The Warhammer community is known for edgy humor. Some memes or mods may intentionally misuse Kislev for pro-Russian or offensive satire, which can snowball into a PR issue for developers.

>>95998064
Reminder that naked elves are the most powerful warriors in the world.

>>95998057
Refuses from old standards for rules.

>>95998047
Gnoatse.

>>95998078
AI aske-

>>95998086
you made it worth peaking in this thread today

>>95998074
Condescending faggot who doesn't know what he's talking about. The project lead was being micromanaged by his boss, who kept telling him to 'make the hats bigger' without bothering to look at them. When he finally did see them, he thought they were shit too.

>>95998078
Yeah this is your warhammer fan I guess.

>>95998027
The real chaos dwarfs that the tall hat redditors don't know about.

>>95998078
While sensitivity during global conflicts is important, the idea that Kislev content in Warhammer is inherently problematic due to the Ukraine war is an overreach. Here's why:

>1. Fiction ≠ Endorsement:
Kislev has existed for decades as a fantasy faction inspired by a mix of Russian, Ukrainian, and Polish elements. Just like the Empire isn't glorifying medieval Germany, Kislev isn’t promoting Russian imperialism.

>2. Historical Roots Matter:
Kislev wasn’t created in response to modern politics. It’s a longstanding part of Warhammer lore. Suggesting its continued inclusion is "problematic" erases its deep history in the setting — and risks setting a precedent of censoring fictional content based on current events.

>3. Cultural Blending Isn’t Erasure:
Kislev includes Ukrainian Cossack and Polish Winged Hussar inspirations alongside Russian motifs. If anything, the faction presents a fusion of Slavic identities, not a glorification of one. Instead of removal, there’s room to highlight these diverse influences more clearly.

>4. Memes Are Not Developer Responsibility:
Some fans will make edgy or offensive content regardless of faction. That’s a community moderation issue — not a reason to limit creative output. Blaming devs for fan memes isn’t fair or realistic.

>5. Tone and Framing Matter More Than Silence:
Rather than avoid Kislev, developers can frame its content responsibly. Contextual storytelling, diverse representation, and thoughtful presentation are better tools than censorship.

>Conclusion:
Kislev is a beloved fantasy faction — not a political statement. Its continued presence in Warhammer isn’t tone-deaf; it’s consistent with a rich fictional world that draws from history without being defined by it.

You should kill yourself man

>>95998093
>The project lead was being micromanaged by his boss, who kept telling him to 'make the hats bigger' without bothering to look at them.
What caused this?

>>95998078
>>95998101
Where did you people hear this rumor that the Ukraine war caused Kislev to be shelved or delayed?

>>95998103
He was a slimy, disinterested cunt who wasn't even in the country when the design work was being done. He thought the sculptor's tendencies for more grounded designs was a problem and thought he needed to be overdirected in order to get a marketable result.

>>95998110
>He thought the sculptor's tendencies for more grounded designs was a problem and thought he needed to be overdirected in order to get a marketable result.
basado

>>95998027
>its bad that the design of a chaos faction clashed against authority
thats the entire point of chaos

>>95998109
It's just speculation. Kislev has kept getting support in the video game despite the war.

>>95998116
Nah the sculptor was absolutely in the right to sabotage the project. I just despise Redditors who sóy out over the shit models that were the result. Legion of Azgorh was a good correction.

>>95998125

Yeah, those are the best chaos dwarf designs done so far.

Does anyone here play larger than 2000 points games, I reckon a lot of grogs have large collections and the game tends to have a pretty low model count.

>>95998093
>The project lead was being micromanaged by his boss
No, the boss was ultimately and factually the project lead.
>When he finally did see them, he thought they were shit too.
And yet he greenlit them, so maybe what you think here is wrong.

>>95998110
>in order to get a marketable result.
And he was right, hats are the one thing that made chorfs memorable in the end, not the beards, not the guns, and certainly not the bulls.

>>95998160
>>95998164
You slop-inhaling drones are really a gift to companies like GW. Perfect consumers. I bet you both have multiple AoS armies.

>>95998170
>you're a slop-loving AoS GW consoomer if you like 30-year old models

>>95998181
Those models have AoS design sensibilities. They are ugly, flanderised garbage and you think that makes them 'bold and iconic'. You may as well just post your cow aelves now and be done with it.

>>95998170
>How dares the boss of a fantasy miniatures company make the sculptor sculpt something more fantastical than usual because he correctly gauged that's what people would end up liking!
Keep being a contrarian and making up strawmen, that will surely solve your problems and convince people of your opinions

>>95998191
you're a 6th edition baby

>>95998191
>epitome of oldhammer
>AoS design sensibilities
You've hit rock bottom now

Hmm I didn't expect to get bodies that can only wield great weapons and bodies that can only wield 1 or 2 hand weapons.

Anyway is it a mistake to give these guys just a 1h weapon and shield or should they use 2 hand weapons? Or can they use both two weapons + shield?

>>95998098
3rd Edition Chorfs are so underrated.
Really wish GW brought them back; they could even return as a mercenary option, similarly to the Imperial Dorfs & the Dragon Company.

>>95998191
TWWonly please go

>>95998205
6th edition baby here and i dont really have a problem with over designed inpractical dynamic models anymore because they already fixed that problem for the most part by making TOW bases much larger
or atleast i assume thats why they made them bases bigger
t. eri

>>95998219
It's not really strictly necessary for all the models to wield the same equipment, visually, black orcs even more so because for the longest time in various editions black orcs were 'armed to the teeth', they had a rule that had them carry multiple weapons and choose what to use at any point, when that wasn't the norm or commonplace.
If you really want your unit to be uniformly equipped you could cut off part of the length of what are supposed to be great weapons and have them simply hold the one handed weapon with two hands while the shield is momentarily strapped to the back, or strapped to the left arm.
But I'm not sure the kit comes with enough shields with all of them, it was designed to make you assemble them with heterogeneous equipments.

>>95998232

You can buy similar designs from knightmare miniatures. Warp miniatures also made STLs for old-school chaos dwarfs.

>>95998232
>chaos warrior (comically short)
They would be underrated if there was any value to them that people could miss, but there's nothing.

>>95998219
i suggest you go with great weapons solely because they will be much easier to rank up
not much fun fiddling them around for 5 minutes every time you use them unless you want to number every singe one

>>95998263
No there are only 8 shields and 10 have to have great weapons. But there are no armed to the teeth rule, right? If I built all models with what I have wouldn't I have to use the motley crew rule?

should I built jade warrior with shields or with halberds?

>>95998219
Blorcs used to be armed to the teeth and could just pick any weapon to fight with per turn.

>>95998320
One unit of each.

>>95998320
If I were you I'd build half and half for variety in the collection and simply put the ones armed with the equipment I choose for a game at the front of the unit, to avoid any confusion.

gameplay-wise, hand and shield is most probably the ideal way to play them because they reach 3+ in combat, and you need them as an anvil, rather than to deal damage, for that you've got other tools in the roster.

Had a beautiful moment I wanted to share.
In the process of rebasing used dwarfs I got cheap online. Realised they have been rebased once already. The minis are standing on cut square bases on top of the round sigmar bases.
Warhammer is healing! Death to round bases!

>>95997932
>>95997948
One thing I never see people do but rank n flank is perfect for is modeling how snow tends to melt in large regions due to sun and tree coverage, it would be cool to see a regiment where the left half is in a shaded snowy side and the right is muddy fresh melted grass

>>95998546
nice1

>>95998546
glad to hear anon, also death to those who use superglue for basing their minis as a fuck you to second hand buyers

>>95998600
What would you use if not superglue? Superglue is super easy to remove as well.

>>95998276
>dwarves can't just go renegade and get mutated by chaos into cool miniatures, they have to be special niggurath ziggurath gremlins

>>95998191
>red era aesthetic is aos now

>>95998607
well elmers because that way you can strip the bases separately by using just water

>>95998607
generally pva is used for flock/sand and super glue reserved for things like 3d printed base details or the like.

>>95998618
Nta but Elmer's would be far too much of a good guy move for me. I use plastic cement whenever possible. For metal minis, I'd be really worried that they'd fall off of their bases if I didn't use superglue.

>>95998609
Tainted Dwarfs are still in canon ,so Dwarfs but their Chaos Warriors/Mutants exist

>>95998630
he said for basing (applying whatever you're using to texture the bases), not for putting models on their bases (it's normal to use plastic glue or superglue for this. I'd actually recomend super glue even for plastic models because it's much easier to get a clean break if you ever need to down the road).

>>95998609
plenty of shit can get mutated by chaos, not all of those shits can be cool miniatures, and only an even smaller fraction of those who could potentially be cool offer something that isn't boring or redundant or way too niche, and chaos dwarfs who are just chaos warriors but short certainly aren't in this subgroup, hell, they don't even get past the cool filter.

>>95998654
Chaos dwarves that are short chaos warriors with gun powder would be kinda cool

>>95998658
Buy chorfs {hashut [forge world (recast)]} then.

>>95998674
Considering they're a Forgeworld army and TOW is made by the Forgeworld team it's actually kinda weird they haven't brought Chorfs back.

>>95998674
These don't look like chaos warriors though, too uniform

How the hell are you even supposed to stick on this cape on the high elf dragon guy?
(pardon the ebay image, too lazy to take a picture of the bit in question)

>>95997412 (OP)
What is the timeline of the initial release of faction and the second wave of minis? Wondering when can we expect more beastmen?

>>95998724
arn't most of the models up for sale already, except the Preyton?

>>95998654
>they are bad because I don't like them
Fantastic argument. Chaos dwarf renegades are way more chaotic and a shambling mass of gibbering mutated freaks than the chaos warriors clad in identical armor you seem to think they're identical to.

>>95998695
An army that doesn't have a core of units in plastic is simply not going to sell much, so if they eventually reintroduce the forge world models, I think they should as mercenaries for the chaos warriors army, rather than something you necessarily have to build a while resin army for.
But they would need to have the moulds somewhere in a usable state (and allegedly they weren't when they got discontinued) and not have mainline GW shoot the idea down because they're making them for aos and want chorfs to be a selling point for aos alone (I don't particularly think this makes sense to be the case, but who knows)

>>95998714
ah yes, how could we forget the boundless variety of designs in the chaos warriors units?

>>95998744
to be fair, so were their contemporary chaos warriors

a little ranger

>>95998752
These don't look like chaos warriors either

>>95998744
How convenient of you to miss the part of the argument that highlights how short warriors offer nothing new.
Chaos warriors are not meant to be uniform, and chaos norse dwarfs are not meant to be any more mutated or varied than chaos warriors are meant to be.

>>95998357
>>95998363
thanks for the input.
one unit of each a 15 models it is.

>>95998674
I prefer the Tortuga ones
They're cleaner than the originals

this is a pretty big if but IF vampire counts were the next one to get a book do you think they will nerf the invocation of nehek and that staff that lets you reanimate twice every turn

If they ever redo WoC then I hope they go back to take elements from the older design.

>>95998788
Staff could use a price hike, and the might change how invo hits certain targets, but they need invocation to be good to function as an army. If you don't run mortis engines and scream spam VC are quite fair.

>>95998767
what the fuck are you even on about at this point

>>95998609
they can go renegade, but it's not worth it to explore that instead of fleshing out a new aesthetic and culture.
skaven are cooler than simply having beastmen but with rat heads.
dark elves are cooler than simply having chaos warriors but thin.
hashut dwarfs are cooler than simply having chaos warriors but squat.
and similarly, the fan iterations of snakemen with their own kureshi cultural stylings makes them far more interesting than the original pitch of them being just chaos warriors but with snake heads and tails.

>>95998797
those chaos warrior models do not look like chaos warriors, similar to how primaris space marines do not look like space marines or cruel boys do not look like orcs despite claiming to be these things

>>95998808
I run chaos dwarves of this type as kitbashes that just fill my warrior units, they don't need to be their whole own unit

>>95998815
>old thing good new thing bad
ah okay I understand now

>>95998827
those models are not the new thing, the new thing is significantly better than them

While still quite uniform (all having the leather boots instead of not a single pair of sabatons, and generally the same armor) the poses make them much better as mutation canvases, and the variety of textures for their capes is very nice.

The monopose marchers are by far the worst iteration of chaos warrior models, and, like the other things I mentioned, totally fail to achieve what a "chaos warrior" is. Hint: chaotic

>>95998815
>those chaos warrior models do not look like chaos warriors
yes, they do
>primaris space marines do not look like space marines
yea, they do
>cruel boys do not look like orcs despite claiming to be these things
those lanklets aren't presented as a new standard, but as a distinct subspecies

whats wrong with these, they look the part, are easy to paint and rank

>>95998904
They need to get rid of the capes.
Knights and Chosen also don't have capes.

>>95998904
>CHAOS warriors, servant of the gods of chaos all of whom bare the stigmata of their service to evil, wield unique rune wrought weapons,
>uniform, difficult to convert, monopose

They're cool models but totally fail to capture the fantasy of the unit

>>95998904
too static, too plain, and they're not conversions-friendly
they're cool, don't get me wrong, and certainly easy, but it's a very specific look for chaos warriors, not really the standard slate they are presented as.

the cape should ideally be removed to make the arms more posable at the shoulder and the designs of armors and helmets should be a bit more decorated and varied, essentially to the level and extent they did for chaos knights, really.
and ideally there should be a few leg poses that aren't just "calmly marching forward", even if I can understand that's a problem for ranking stuff up.

>>95998941
BOOBA

>>95998078
>I asked ChatGPT
Go stick a soldering iron in your urethra.

>>95997669
While a giant cannon is cool, that also looks less practical than many smaller batteries of cannons.

>>95998941
That kind of variety can't really be expected out of one modular kit of chaos warriors, and if you made the kit varied but not modular then you run problems when you have to get multiples for multiple units or larger units.

I think the best approaches are either to leave that type of variety to hobby conversions, even if it's not ideal, or to make at least 3 kits that explore the 3 main archetypes of warriors (freakish mutant, bulky brute, refined dark knight) and try to make the 3 kits somewhat modular by dividing the bits into legs, torsos, heads, ball jointed arms and pauldrons to cover those joints, + gribbles, trophies, chains, cloths and shields that can be attached anywhere including on the back. but it's not realistic, it's a huge endeavour, especially if then people start expecting you to make 3 kits of chosen, 3 kits for cavalry and so on for heroes and more.

>>95999043
Not when shit like this could show up on the other side of the battlefield.

>>95999060
i remember there being some white dwarf siege rules to faba back in the day with specialised chaos units with hook hand conversions
cannot for the life of me remember what that was but i think they were made with chaos warrior sprue

>>95999060
Of course there's a limit to what a plastic kit can achieve, but you can absolutely make a kit that is more or less accepting to chaos-ification. Pic related shows that even with an enthuiast putting in some effort, any unit purely of the cape warriors is going to look like a big uniform brick. The old hunchback chaos warriors, while really not great models, are much better in this specific regard, because less restrictive designs makes them much easier to convert, and they're less uniform to begin with, so just building them out of the box doesn't have that terrible of a result. Same with the newer aos models.

Also what you described is not that unrealistic as aos/40k has done just that with the god themes, not that I believe the gods need their own armies in fantasy.

Bros I need a Sylvanian GF

>>95999196
If you want a blood sucking GF get an Italian girl

>>95999196
The average syvlanian is not a hot vampire babe, they're a literally retarded inbred freak who makes brettonian peasents look human with at least 1 ghoul grandparent

>>95999202
I want a girl who will shave her mustashe tho

>>95999196
Go to San Francisco’s gay bars

>>95997771
Learn a new word

>>95999211
Sounds like someone's never had a girls moustache tickle their balls while you throat fuck them. You've clearly never lived anon.

>>95997761
we already got one release slot wasted on dogshit tww designs, we don't need 2

>>95999210
>The average syvlanian is not a hot vampire babe
And the average Averlander is a schlub, but when I say I want one I mean the proper short-haired tomboy that curses in Khazalid.

>>95999196
I want golden girl dressed as every whfb faction
She can be an empire greatsword, a bretonnian damsel, a chaos lord, an orc warboss, the ice queen
I want a whole series

Has the matched play changes made White Lions any more worth running?

>>95999260
Great weapon infantry is much much better than it used to be

>>95999260
its funny how white lions and swordmasters went back and forth in who was the auto include. In 6e my swordmasters were a vital tool
Than in 8th they had to sit back to the white lions

>>95999266
>>95999269
Why is that? I'm still pretty new to the actual match playing as opposed to greytide hoarding and painting side

>>95997412 (OP)
Next arcane journal is going to be skaven and and they're going to fix everything and make them good again. They're going to bring back shooting into combat and it'll be super fun and they'll bring back rules like hot warp lead and and we'll get characters that are flippin sweet and we'll get new units and they'll be cool as fuck and then maybe people will take us seriously

>>95997412 (OP)
>people see this art and think this setting is in any way believable, logical, or worth your time
lol, lel even

>>95999275
in 6th, it was the 1 time it sucked to play High Elves (though they werent as boned as dark elves) and a big part of that was everyone was expensive, hit like wet noodles and because there was no step up or always strikes first "speed" was really about who charged first.
If you had to deal with high toughness you had 3 main options: A balista that could wiff if you needed it for high strength (rapid fire was usually the best bet), knights that could fail if they wiffed their initial charge (thank Isha they had a looong range) and swordmasters.
The fact they had the swordmaster rule ment they did not strike last so charging was actually a good idea.
(remember in these days you did not have "Always strikes first"

>>95999275
a second rank can now fight
it's technically a boon to all weapon types, but way less so for spears (which increase the attacks they make by 50% rather than a flat doubling) and multiple hand weapons (which can't make more than one attack from the second rank) than it is for other weapons, and great weapons in particular are priced a certain way because they strike later, and without step up they usually don't strike with many models, but with an extra rank in the fight you have more chances to strike well against those units whose survivability depended on striking you first and hard enough to not receive any attack back.

>>95999277
After the flop that was skaventide and the success of Cathay, they will entirely abandon the concept of the legacy armies and will forever explore new armies since that’s what sells out.

>>95999281
kopinski didn't understand 40k and fantasy are slightly different in scale, but his art is quite cool

>>95999311
>but way less so for spears (which increase the attacks they make by 50% rather than a flat doubling
Let me tell you about 8th editions elven tidal wave.
50 elves, all falling on you at once before you get a word in. When YOU charged them

>>95999324
Don't say that man what the fuck

>>95998737
razorgor chariot and preyton. Herdstone probably as well as it was in AoS though every self respecting beastmen player will make their own pile of dung.

>>95999281
>implying those are the only or main ideals for a fantasy setting
You're free to go away anytime with your shit taste.

For those that were around back then, what would you say were the main factors causing WHFB's problems that eventually lead to the end times and all that ensues.

And what (if anything) do you think GW is doing so that TOW avoids the same fate ? If nothing, What do you think gw SHOULD be doing differently ?

Not trying to be incendiary, just a total war zoomer interested in the time period

>>95999412
GW had much lower production capacity back then, ran by lower iq boomers, and didn't understand the value of it's ip or importance of rules, and the overall miniature market back then was much smaller. Basically they only had room for 2 games, and fantasy got hardcore mogged by 40k, and the managment being retarded basically thought "well why aren't both IPs doing equally well then?!" as if that were what anyone would expect, and tried the whole AoS thing in hopes of bringing fantasy up to par with 40k.

Since then, gw's production capacity has grown absurdly, to the point they 2 main games that are both much larger miniature ranges than fantasy or 40k were back when fantasy was killed, 2 semi-main games, and several side games, the ovverall gw range is probably pretty close to 10 times what it was 10 years ago in terms of plastic kits in active manufacturing. They also now understand that fantasy is a very valuable IP they would be retarded to ignore thanks to the titanic success of tww and vermintide (which occured at the worst possible time to cross polinate with their miniatures due to their foolishness).

>>95999412
Biggest ones I remember was
>codex creep paired with slow release of armies meant some factions were turbo shit or op for years
>focus on increasingly large armies
>paired with increasingly expensive money cost
>with many alternatives emerging
It's crazy to think now but 40k used to be a cheaper and smoother game to play. To avoid it keep a focus on not huge armies, on Heros, and find a happy medium rate of refreshing rules and armies.

Why is Greasus called "The Shockingly Obese"? Dude just looks like some random guy you'd see at Walmart on a typical day.

>>95999490
imagine how much food someone like amberlynn would have to eat to have those proportions at 11 feet tall

wood elf fluff reads like shit man. I think im starting to understand why people called them one of the bastards of fantasy, I mean shit how do you make the wild hunt so....lame? It should be their defining trait and somehow its super forgettable. Their dynamic with beastmen doesnt really help either, "oooh the super elite scary elves take on the jobbers of the forests, so cool!". The tree characters also arent really inspiring either.

>>95999412
>what (if anything) do you think GW is doing so that TOW avoids the same fate ? If nothing, What do you think gw SHOULD be doing differently ?
they're riding a nostalgia wave, while also trying to appeal to new fans by pursuing new territory that GW never wanted to explore back in fantasy that the fans, quite explicitly, never wanted, because it would "ruin the setting", and clash with- ah ill just that there. Really though? they arent really doing much different, old stuff will likely have to be switched to online only, to make way for the new, because let me tell you, stocking 12 battalion boxes alone takes a fuck ton of space for a lgs.
Anyways I dont really care, im getting a model or two I missed and thats all that TOW will ever mean to me.

>>95999516
>no one called them the bastards if fantasy
>wood elves aren't supposed to be the main protagonists of the setting, they are a part of the world and flesh it out
>Wild Hunt isn't THE defining trait but a way to have wood elves to be more engaging with those around them as baseline they are isolationists
>fighting beastmen I agree is weird as historically it was orcs, gobbos, and then dwarfs they despised and this was fine. I don't think the secret war added much to either faction.

>>95998768
>if I repeatedly claim that the miniatures with two heads using mismatched armor and weapons fill the same aesthetic niche as regimented men clad in identical armor it will magically come true
My question to you is: have you ever seen a chaos warrior?

>>95999571
The chaos warriors that are contemporary with the old chaos dwarves are the same way. You are just comparing the old chaos warrior aesthetic to the new one, nothing to do with dwarves.

>>95999412
>old, outdated basic units aren't updated, instead each army gets an unnecessary (and often ugly) new monster/monstrous cavalry/chariot
>ruleset almost requires hordes of those old ugly basic infantry units, and makes elite infantry or cavalry and monsters unfavourable and almost extinct after making cannons way too accurate
>in an attempt to "balance" things, wizards are given spells that can delete huge amounts of models, making big powerful wizards also near obligatory, and the games rely on them too much
>we see the first units getting sold with a price of over 4€ per infantry model, and we see the massive replacement of metal as a material with "fine"cast, which is catastrophically flawed and also even more overpriced
>rulescreep that's visible even between what should be similar armies (tomb kings, vampire counts) which generally brought the already underdog armies to sell even less
>rules were generally additional stuff added to the previous editions, making the rules appear bloated and intimidating to a newcomer, reducing new blood massively, once compounded with the entry cost due to the infantry meta and the mounting sweaty competitive mentality

TOW did well by selling units in larger bundles, giving a relatively better price per model ratio
TOW did well also by expanding the points allowance for lords so that big heroes on monsters could be viable* (they were virtually absent in 8th), and these points sinks prevent armies from having to be made effectively of hundreds of dollars of (old and outdated) basic troops
On this line, TOW also did well by proposing armies of infamy where you can build armies around nicher more elite concepts, which may or may not what attracts someone to that faction in the first place, as well as giving somewhat widespread options to include some elite and cavalry units in the core requirements of way more factions
TOW did well by making magic relatively weaker, even more so now after the errata

>>95999606
But tow is NOT doing well on all the problems that 8th had: the rules are arguably even more dispersed through the big rulebook, making the game for new people clunky and unappealing, and some unit profiles' total rules daunting to keep track of, to say the least; what used to be old models are now downright comically ancient, despite the attempt to drum them up as vintage or classic; cannons are still way more accurate than they have any right to be, and while you may think they're required because (*)now monsters are viable, the truth is that only monsters with lords on top that stack an unreasonable amount of saves, saves shouldn't have been allowed to be taken by them in the first place, are actually played, the other types of monsters are hardly present; another problem is that with the errata we might end up returning to a meta of unmoving infantry units, perhaps going back to the problem of the entry cost; and now TOW has to contend not only with normal army creep, but also with the asymmetrical support between core factions and legacy factions.

if TOW was a mainline new edition released after 8th instead of the end times and aos, it would have been even more catastrophic than 8th in terms of sales. currently the project stays afloat because it doesn't have to sell as much as a mainline game but can produce stock piecemeal, to meet demand almost to a T and never overextend or overproduce or have too much unmoving stock on the shelf space (since they have less shelf space now).

>>95999606
unfortunately several tow armies are still built around totally dogshit infantry models, namely high elves and tomb kings. Everyone else has aged gracefully, but goddamn those are bad models

>>95999606
> old, outdated basic units aren't updated, instead each army gets an unnecessary (and often ugly) new monster/monstrous cavalry/chariot
Unless you were elves. Then you got the space marine treatment with constant refreshes. Well, besides wood elves.

>>95998808
Fleshing out the setting by highlighting how the already extant cultures interact with each other and how that gives rise to degenerated dwarfs and imperial renegades is more interesting than monolithic trash like 𒆪𒋾𒀀𒂍𒈗𒊏 the big hat midget and his dark satanic mills.

>>95999637
High elves are one of very few armies I'd never consider because their core is so visually dated, with such a specific aesthetic that alternatives don't really work. Unless you built an army entirely off the back of IoB lothern sea guard, they're just not an option if you don't have some nostalgia for these ugly fucks

>>95999628
Most of the High Elves hold up well, it's really just the spearmen and archers that look old.

Back when the MMO came out I knew a bunch of people who wanted to get into the tabletop, but pretty much all of them ended up going to 40K because it was easier and cheaper.

>>95999596
Which faction were chaos dwarf renegades part of, again?

>>95999699
those models are for the generic chaos list, and I believe the khorne specific one also had chaos dwarves but none of the other gods did.

>>95999667
Nah the silverhelms are total fucking dogshit.
Thank goodness for 3dp

>>95999625
>unmoving infantry
Yeah this is a nogames fear. If nothing else 1 side will be mismatched in ranged firepower, making them plunge in if only to avoid being shot or whittled down. You might see 1 turn of maneuvering to bait or set up flankncharges but there's going to be a clash sooner or later

>>95999637
>Unless you were elves.
>besides wood elves
debatable, I have to remind you that the wide range update of dark elves infantry happened less than a year before the end times kicked off, the update that wood elves got (who also updated a lot of stuff, really) happened a few months before, while the update of high elves happened "only" 2 years before the end, and even then the update didn't touch the old ass spearmen, archers and silver helms and instead dropped on the army an ugly stiff phoenix and an unnecessary and even uglier flying chariot.
hell, even the lothern sea guards, swordmasters and ellyrian reavers weren't really updated, they were stuck exclusively in the starter set.
so elves did definitely suffer much of the same problems of everyone else for most of the edition, even if their rules were stupidly strong.

>>95999606
>>95999659
I don't think the "no model releases" angle is really all that accurate. I've heard it before, but after going through the 8th edition releases most of the factions seem to get a decent amount. Looking at ranges that made up the CoS in AoS (that's how the spreadsheet is ordered), HE, DE, Dorfs, Empire, partially WE: >Dark elves got their darkshards, bleakswords, dreadspears, hydra kit, dragon kit, dark riders, black guard and executioners plus a handful of characters between 2011 and 2013. >High elves got island of blood and later the phoenixes, skycutters, shadow warriors and sisters.
>Dwarfs got hammerers, longbears, irondrakes and ironbreakers, plus gyrocopters and again some characters.
>Wood elves got their basic infantry and cavalry.
Empire seems to be the only one without core releases, but they still got their griffons, demigryphs, the war altar stuff and again a handful of characters (general, engineer,..)

>>95999753
I hate to be that guy but I need to see a chart of all the kits elves got, because I’m pretty sure high elves had like 4-5 different spearmen at some point.

>>95999799
you're wrong

>>95999788
>"no model releases"
At least in my case, I wasn't arguing that fantasy didn't get releases at all, I was arguing that the shit that needed to be updated got ignored (all while making it increasingly more expected to be bought in bulk over more appealing stuff), while the releases focused on completely new centerpieces that were often unnecessary or ugly.

I won't say that tomb kings shouldn't have gotten snakes or sphinxes, but I will say that their basic skeletons should have been updated instead of giving vampire counts a monstrous infantry they didn't need, another giant monster they didn't need, and another giant chariot they didn't need.

>>95999799
>lothern
>spears
>maidenguard
Am I missing any? I could have swore they had a special city guard spear/bow unit too for a campgain at some point

>>95997423
2 Warp Lightnings.... well anon hope you are playing renegade ruleset or I have some bad news.

>>95999549
>>fighting beastmen I agree is weird
How's it weird? They both live in the woods.

>>95999881
Its weird that it's hyped as a big deal I should have said, obviously they'd fight but it didn't add much to wood elf lore other than "yes the lovers of nature hate the literal personification of warping nature too!"

>>95999799
>I need to see a chart of all the kits elves got
give me one sec

>>95999848
year fair enough, some factions (dwarfs, dark elves, wood elves a bit) seem to have gotten some attention to their main infantry backbone, but for others (high elves, tk) their big 8th edition releases were either centrepieces, or a wing of the army that was kind of a different direction.

>>95999848
if tk basic skeletons were on part with tombguard/2008 vc skellies they'd be a really cool army, but as is they're terminally dated

>>95999799
>>95999910
This is everything those 3 ranges got during 8th edition.

>>96000076
weird that dark elves aren't ToW when they have such a complete range and very little of it is used in sigmar

>>96000084
wood elves got removed first because aos got the tree elves
high elves then got removed shortly before aos got their light elves
dark elves will likely get removed the moment aos has the shadow elves ready to release

Why aren't we talking about the HECKIN amazing new cubicle 7 whrpg?
I can't wait to play as a black empire swordsman, a dwarf female, or another minority/woman!!!!

Interview with C7 writer about TOW RPG
He does explain why some development decisions, like focusing on Talagaad.
Some new books were teased like a starter Kit and a separate Adventures around Talagaad PDF, along with the guy giving some strong hints for future books not related to Talagaad, like Nuln, Brettonia and a Cathay book.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Q_EVW6QQoY

>>96000134
You know, I'm extremely racist, but whining about this kind of thing isn't good for your mental health anon.

>>95999848
You have to remember the crowd GW was dealing with.
WHFB players literally wouldn't buy it if they could just use their 20 year old models. They released new shit without updating so much of the ranges because it forced players to actually BUY something

>>96000134
Because we only have the player guide out right now, there isn't much to discuss system-wise that hasn't already been so.
and WFRP not going to be discussed until the next High elf or Marianburg book comes out

>>95997646
I hate this faggot and his expressionless sameface lifeless artstyle. He's like the anti-mossa

>>96000191
i thought that was known as the tumblr style and its supposed to be infuriating

>>96000197
It's more like someone is doing a bad copy of Mike Mignola than a tumblr look

>>96000152
That's a bold faced lie, if that behaviour was ever any more true for fantasy than it was or is for 40k and aos, it has entirely to do with how little new blood fantasy got SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE gw didn't update the old shitty basic troops that newcomers were essentially filtered by.

>>95997761
People want Kislev, but they want fantasy Rus-Varangians and such, not Ice Witch on Ice Bear wielding Ice Staff of Permafrost leading a unit of Ice Knights of the Order of Icy Chill, supported by Ice Archers using Ice Bows

>>96000144
i like this art a lot

>>96000144
>and a Cathay book
fingers crossed for them to worldbuild the faction better.
>inb4 the finger on the monkey paw curls and by better they make the nation even more flawless

>>95998746
Kinda funny that Forgeworld made Legion of Azgorh because GW said they couldn't do normla chaos dwarfs as the main team wanted to do them, only for them to instead rip off the forgeworld design and so now the Forgeworld team can't use Legion of Azgorh.

>>96000208
you might be reading too much into it but there is this certain art style that pisses everyone off even if you cant really point out why and thats the tumblr

>>95999412
The sequence of events I’ve seen is that
>veteran players had all the models they could ever need so they stopped buying models
>the mode ranges themselves were old as shit and some potential new players were put off
>sales plummet
>instead of just refreshing their ranges, they killed the whole setting and then refreshed the models and made the setting Fantasy 40K
>some ranges still didn’t actually get refreshes until years into AoS’s life, some like Ogres are unchanged outside of pity heroes
I’d say 40K handled poor sales marginally better with Primaris. A lot of the changes were unnecessary, but ultimately they didn’t literally blow the whole setting and throw everything that came before away.

>>95999464
>>96000265
Thanks everybody. It seems like the main reason people point to nowadays is the steep cost of entry for new players, combined with the inability to convince existing players to buy into the new kits. Pretty shitty combination for sure.

And if I understand correctly, gw seems to be at least somewhat interested in avoiding a similar fate for tow, by adjusting rules, army structures and friendlier ways to 'get into' an army via batallion boxes ?
>>96000076
In hindsight it's very curious that gw would release very clasically fantasy models so close to AoS' launch (dwarfs and especially wood elves in 2014). Especially considering AoS went in a pretty different direction for both those factions. Wood elves, for example, got a very different vibe to them in aos' Sylvaneth, which has a very different take (more focused on trees & spirits and whatnot).

I wonder what this means for the timing of the launch of AoS. It definitely had to be in development for a while, as 1e launched with several new armies that had to take quite a bit to go from concept art (picrel is Blanche's take on stormcast) to eventual execution. On the other hand, a lot of other aspects seem very rushed (maps, art, and rules were infamously awful in the first few months after AoS' launch). I wonder if they planned to launch it later, but pushed it up for whatever reason.

>>95998759
Gorgeous anon, especially the back/shield. Wow.

>AoS is dying
>GW decides to pull the plug
>but to not waste the cash they invested into the designs they decide to add sigmarines and sky dwarves to whfb
>black uggo chicks are now 1/2 the generals in empire armies and your bretonnian questing knight better not bitch when the "Damsel" he rescues has a 5 o'clock shadow bigot
Truely a ghastly monkey paw

>>96000433
>Boris Todbringer sees what sigmar worship leads to
>never felt more vindicated in his whole life

I winder why certain types just make shit up to be angry.

>>96000463
No lives, in dire need of a hobby.

>>95999412

A combination of herohammer, the start of big "miniature" centerpieces instead of a focus on skirmish, magic akin to dragon ball Z, the full swing of fine cast aka shitcast... 40k was very hot as well back then. It's death was 101% the fault of GW alone.

>>96000433
I keep saying we don’t want AoS to die. Being a specialist game is great. Look at their two mainline games. 40K has been dumbed down into a sterile competitive friendly board game and AoS 4e is trying to mimic it as hard as possible.

>>95999848
One of the key selling points of TOW was that players could finally get ahold of kits that are ludicrously expensive on the second-hand market, such as the TK kits (including the skellies). An update will perhaps come later but I prefer their current strategy because it's killing ebay hogs

Does no one seriously think that maybe fantasy died just because of time? All things must end, and gw only managed to bring it back from leisure’s position. Maybe from a place of malice too when they saw kow was getting a new edition.

>>96000481
>8th edition
>hero hammer
Are you trolling or just so contrarian you have to pick the opposite viewpoint even if it's divulged from reality?

>>96000432
i can't tell if it is sarcasm; honestly.
if it isn't : thank you; the shield was done quickly as i need 7 more; i did not spent more than 20mn on that shield; at longest estimates
if it is : what is that pretty lie bringing you ?

>>96000490
Yeah, I don't want to see bullshit like gitmob in Fantasy.
>$200+ army box of 9 fucking figures
>heroes over $100
> >=50% centerpieces in an army
Cancer.

>>96000520
he was probably too young to know that era and started parroting thing he read here

>>96000520
>>96000481
8th editon was defined by big blocks of infantry and cav not being able to break them, even when flanking
Tows problem is that cav is too good.

>>96000570
Perfect balance
>Charging a large block of infantry head on should not be a good idea unless its either small unit, you are SUPER elite, they are skirmish glass cannon type infantry
>charging a flank however should be DEVESTATING especially if they were already engaged and all but the heaviest infantries (like dorfs) should be freaking out

>>96000512
The thing is for those of us who were active during the time it wasn't a sudden death. It wasn't like LotR wasn't popular or people didn't want to buy models, hell fantasy as a culutre setting ws sjusy getting mass appeal. it was that kits were expensive (many elite infantry kits are cheaper per a model today than 8th for example) and the total amount needed to field an army kept creeping up. It became harder to start or even finish the army you had. Hell even beastmen which I collected I never think I got to 2k points without making my already overpriced (in points) army even shittier. Then add in army books being wildly different in internal and external balance, half the armies never getting updates, and games like WMH/Malifaux and others being a fresh breathe of air, GW simply refused to spend the capital rebuilding like they've done in TOW at the time and blew it up for AoS. It's been talked to death decade before I'm sure most people here even knew of this website, but GW decided they'd make WHFB into 40k instead of trying to innovate or make better value boxes. People simply started to drop GW as a fantasy game because it continued to be a poorer investment of time and money.

Going to make a handful of undead "critters" that aren't clearly anything in particular and use them to bulk up units of ghouls, zombies, or skeletons as needed for any particular game

>>96000570
Yeah infantry being stubborn essentially, and magic being so swingy and op for some races it was GG round 2 if a purple sun hit your lines, and monsters being relatively easy to snipe with artillery.

>>96000570
>>96000618
quick tow rules question here
can cathay lances hit from 2 ranks on a charge

>>96000685
cannons should be unpredictable but devastating
I have mixed feelings on the predicting measure mini-game but it added drama

>>96000693
Yes. That's their special rule. It sorta makes up for only being +1 strength rather than the usual +2. But not really, it means they're not gonna go for actual tough targets.

>>95999281
You forgot "everyone ate rotten meat" and "spices were used to mask the taste of rotten meat" lmao.

>>96000712
thank you

>>96000481
>101%
With a 1% margin of error

>>96000463
>high elves on roundies
VILE

What's the verdict on bases and basing? I've decided on a goblin green rim but don't know if I'll go for simple gravel or flock/static grass/leaves etc. Might be fun to try a forest base.

>>96000234
>even more flawless
As it should be

>>96000835
base to either
>tell a story/set a scene (the empire is defending a city on cobblestone bases)
>contrast the main colours of your army scheme to make it pop more (black armored choas warriors marching in snow)

>>96000835
whats that thin plate between gobbo and that base

>>96000835
Have you tried asking them yourself?

Anyone have archived links of the the early articles?
With the newer (and shittier) website design, the early TOW articles were removed.

>>96000835
Should be done in consideration of your overall aesthetic goal. If you're going for an orthodox paint scheme black rim + dark brown or black earth and small patches of grass is almost always correct, but if you're being more adventurous, you may want to consider deviating. Intensely saturated red era models might look good with goblin green, a blanche paint scheme army should have a blanche paint scheme base, ect

>>96000835
Man, that base is way too tall for that goblin.

>>96000835
I like to base my minis to reflect the area they're in, in my beastmens case they're from a very boreal forest, so I tried to add a feeling of moss, a bit of a muddy/damp soil as well as including larger stuff like ferns and mushrooms.
And like how another Anon put it; it contrasts their pale skin with the dark brown soil texture.

>>96000835
I think goblin green rims look like shit in most cases and people who like it only do so because they have nostalgia glasses on.. Fantasy is the only side of the hobby that can possibly get away with it, but that's because they still have the occasional idyllic meadow. I feel there's a lack of contrast between it and your goblin. my own recipe for forest bases would be brown grit, then top it with some kind of herb mix like italian seasoning. you can leave the leaves alone if you want or paint them and drybrush, but it looks like fallen forest leaves.

>>96000150
It's actually very good, it's based on the ancient stoic technique of negative visualisation.

>>96000835
The setting is and should always retain its goofy roots. Warhammer is not a serious setting, and should be reflected as such, no matter what 6th attempted.

>>96001024
So what you’re saying is that it’s rent free.

>>96001033
Not at all, it pays its way by helping one to appreciate what he has, and by mentally fortifying him for future hardships.

>>96001015
sure there is nostalgia in there somewhere not to mention lack of actual static grass playing mats going out of fashion
it can look really garish on top of battlemat

>>96000944
Wow, it's almost like they were trying to sweep it under the rug or something...

>>96000944
>>96001105
Almost, yeah.
Luckily I just noticed that one of their articles still has a hyperlink to a removed article, which allows me to look through the Archives.

https://web.archive.org/web/20200210212842/https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/02/06/cartography-in-the-old-worldgw-homepage-post-1fw-homepage-post-1/
https://web.archive.org/web/20220711222322/https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/11/15/old-world-new-warhammer/

hell is coming, best pray for a quick ending.
dying on your own volition will be a luxury

>>96001250
no way chaod daemons were shit to begin with
they should have just stayed as a part of general chaos armies

>>96000835
I'm painting up some WoC as my first mini army ever but have absolutely no idea how to base them yet. I want to go for a sort dark of chaos wastes look. Bought some dark grey hobby sand from gsw but I accidentally got the thick instead of the thin and I'm not sure how good it'll look if I apply it.

>>96000433
I can tell you were masturbating while you typed this post.

The general has been so fucked up recently it has me reminiscing about the perrynigger days

>>96001072
This is done by meditating on likely sources of strife in your life to prepare yourself for them, such as misfortune in your buisness ventures, the death of loved ones, or other such forms of strife.

It is not done by falling for attention seeking marketing done by media companies and seething about them in public.

>>96000134
>a dwarf female
literally nothing wrong that this

>>96001345
>This is done by meditating on likely sources of strife in your life to prepare yourself for them, such as the corruption and desecration of a beloved hobby
See? Easy.

Do anons paint their characters (General, BSB, Wizard etc...) as part of the army or do you give them personality and make them stand out with a different scheme?

>>96001072
>needing to be mentally fortified for the impermanence of hobbies because one is incapable of holding onto their own memories or even going their own direction
When WHFB died in the shitwinds of end times I never despaired as tho I thought jt was over I still held onto a few minis and my and my freinds still occasionally talk about some of the craziest games we had. Spending all your time obsessing over what could will leave you only bitter memories.

>>96001482
dunno about painting bsbs but i started doing paper banners for the longest time and now its hard to tell them apart because everything stands out so much

>>96001487
>Spending all your time obsessing over what could will leave you only bitter memories.
You don't need to spend all you're time doing it. Negative visualisation actually helps your life to feel sweeter because you have the contrast of imagining not having the things you enjoy. I'd heartily recommend the practice.

>>96001437
Anon, if you are so retarded you think falling for psyops and seething about them is stoic behavior you are unsaveable

>>96001517
Do you treat the paper at all? Or do you just hope it doesn’t rip?

>>96001517
Love this, really great

>>96001482
Generally you should do both, by which I mean paint them in a way that both ties them in and makes them stand out

>>96001552
>Generally you should do both, by which I mean paint them in a way that both ties them in and makes them stand out
This.

>>96001545
What's the psyop exactly? Negative visualisation is a pillar of stoicism.

>>96001551
nta but I just coat mine in white glue and that does the trick pretty well

>>96001561
If you don’t mind me asking, what sort of glue? Would like to know for future reference whenever I make another banner.

>>96001561
Very nice. Could we get a closer picture of that banner on the left?

I’m starting to think this place may host people of unsound minds

>>96001551
>>96001561
i soak them trough with spray matte varnish that seems to work and keep the shape
>>96001552
thank you anon

>>96001518
Are you autistic? Most of us can be grateful and content without mental gymnastics. Especially for hobbies.

>>96001561
Wow, those are some incredible units. Loving the creative kitbashes. Banner on the right goes nuts too.

>>96001517
>>96001561
Good shit anons, love to see it.

>>96001580
Why would you want to have your mind sounded?

>>96001598
>Are you autistic?
No.
>Most of us can be grateful and content without mental gymnastics.
Well you seem upset about this.
Try it, stoicism is good for the mind.

>>96001635
>projecting and misrepresenting stoicism
zoomers are cooked

>>96001551
If durability is something youre worried about you can cut slices of aluminium from a drinks can and use that instead of paper, holds its shape well too.
Make sure to sand the edges before you start working with it though or it will slice your shit

>>96001662
What's been misrepresented?
Negative visualisation is an important part of stoicism.

>>96001635
>stoicism
>Stoicism is an ancient school of philosophy that emphasizes living in accordance with nature and virtue, focusing on what is within one's control and accepting what is not. It was prominent in both Greek and Roman history and continues to influence thought today. Stoics believe that by cultivating wisdom, justice, courage, and moderation, one can achieve inner peace and a virtuous life.
and this relates to seething about women and minorities in the warhammer thread how exactly ?

>>96001722
The usage of negative visualisation.

>>96001678
REEEing about your hobby possibly being tainted by things you don't like isn't part of stoic tradition but negative visualization claimed by pop stoics isnt really a trait; Seneca and Marcus stated they liked it but this technique originates with hedonic schools of thought and while practiced by later stoics, wasn't part of the original schools (not that stoicism was ever really codified). further, as here, being able to actually accept things and not dwell constantly is a more consistent virtue to work towards. Moreso inflicting these thoughts on others these anxieties all run counter to the idealized stoic virtues.
in short, you are whining on an internet board and then pretending it wasn't isn't stoic, its just shitposting and you should accept that and go paint some models instead.

>>96000388
You can see some of the Wood Elf designs in the Kurnothi designs

>>96001770
>I-it's not even stoic
>Okay some of the greatest stoics liked it but... anyway...
The stoics knew that to be a prefect stoic sage is impossible, we can but strive to use the philosophical tools we learn of to cultivate virtue in ourselves.
Nothing I do has any power over you. Your problems are your own, I can lead you to the water but not force you to drink.

>>96001749
negative visualization is about visualizing and coming to terms with possible future events that would be upsetting or pose setbacks you absolute retard. this is not what you are doing as you are 1. clearly not content with cubicle 7's practices, and 2. whining about something that you believe to have already happened.
you are publicly obsessing over something that is not within your control. i wonder what stoicism has to do with that.
this is all bait anyhow so i shouldn't even be responding

>>96001817
>the stoics knew to be a perfect sage
>stoic sage
yeah you are shitposting. spending time doing that instead of models in a hobby board. sad but hey, you do you. Enjoy the last (you)

>>96001825
>negative visualization is about visualizing and coming to terms with possible future events that would be upsetting or pose setbacks
And the further enshitification of warhammer could prove upsetting.
>whining about something that you believe to have already happened.
If a room in your house burns down, can you not visualise how much worse it could be if another room burns down?
>you are publicly obsessing over something that is not within your control
No, it's a public negative visualisation.

>>96001855
What's your problem with sages?

>>96001778
Afaik that's only the one underworlds warband (for now)

'ate boomers
'ate zoomers
'ate the red(dit) era
'ate the end times
'ate cathay (not racist, just dont like em)
love me paper banners
love me storm of chaos
love me army books
love me metal sculpts
simple as

>>96001904
there is something nice knowing that my models could be used as a bludgeon if needed

>>96001895
There was one in the Cursed City who fits in with the wood elf range I think once they run out of ideas with tree people we'll get more AoS Wood Elves

for the past few weeks ive been hearing that warhammer fantasy is going to have the biggest greatest new player boom games workshop has ever seen even with dawn of war and total war combined because of the cathay release
so whats the appeal

>>96001778
Not bad, the slayers mohawks are kinda a strange add though

>>96002008
Okay, are you sitting for this?

Square bases.

>>96002008
They think it will be like TOW but by the time they are 300 bucks in its too late and GW got it's nut

>>96001938
Didn't they recently remove all elves from the sylvaneth?

>>96002029
>the slayers mohawks are kinda a strange add though
Are they?

>>96002008
tww is dead man

>>95991306
Still here, I've just taken a break from this general because I've finished my WHFB armies and started a Ukraine war project. Also got tired of dealing with the anons ITT. I love WHFB but it genuinely seems like everyone in here is a maladjusted loser in a childlike emotional state, and worse still is the fact not a single faggot in here bothers to paint their terrain or models anymore. Maybe I'm the last of a dying breed, a man amongst the ruins, but to me The Spirit of the Hobby™ requires effort, and the nu40kiddies and AoSissies that swarmed this thread once TOW released really can't seem to understand the concept.

>>96002086
>the kids are gay
>posts his off topic shit instead of his warhammer models
sure thing faggot...lets see those warhammer models?

>>96002102
>maladjusted loser in a childlike emotional state
you just proved him right

>>95997412 (OP)
>Thread Question
I'm getting back on my Bretonnians. Ive let my daughter pick the colour for these flowers, and she has also requested 'the princess' gets a pink dress.

>>96002066
Maybe not lol. Though it does inspire a different feeling than most of my models

>>96002114
>calling a faggot a faggot
beyond how cringe it be to own those, posting them off topic to be a faggot is in fact, faggotry. The only child would be the one wasting their time trying to rile up others on purpose.

>>96002139
Not sure what this ESL is trying to say

>>96002086
>no games
>no one else to talk to about hobby
>no GW minis
>diorama
Hmm seen this before

>>96002162
in europe we get drunk on wendesdays, we call it little saturday
so anon might be wasted off his ass
t. eri

>>96001569
mod modge, which is cheap and pretty good to have around for bases and sealing foam on terrain too.
>>96001579
sure

>>96002178
Looks like the type of shit those fags at 28mag are into

>>96002178
Love those, good work anon

>>96002178
i like your banners anon
you nailed the illusion of those things hopping out from the canvas

>>96002178
kino

>>96002235
meds

>>96002235
they sound cool

>>96002178
Absolutely kino banners. Gorgeous

Bros..I just want Kislev already

>>96002334
how many faba anons have their ages old white metal kislev armies lying around in waiting or is this one of those total war things

>>96002334
>the third human empire isn't enough for me
>I need slightly reflavored northern empire

>>96002334
Kislev are cool. But I want Legacy armies to come back in full force.

>>96002346
>faba
how do you come up with this shit

"Then and Now"
I already have a saphery army but I felt like painting some avelorn for brutality skirmish thus the rounds.
It is and always will be my favorite kingdom

>>96002504
The rest of the crew, the melee guy will get put on a steed soon

>>96002510
Damn gurl
Shake those hips

>>96002548
My friend made me promise I wouldnt get a model with oversized tits
So big ass it was

>>96002465
where i live it has been called faba for over 25 years as far as i know
ive also been posting my shit here before there was /tg/ to begin with so i might have heard that one few times before

>>96002170
>>96002086
it's not like there's any whfb players left in wfg anyhow, what's the difference

>>96002565
Interesting, I've never heard that. Where you from, Spain?

>>96002587
i was pretty drunk today and there was this other anon who posted his oc so atleast two older anons
>>96002637
finland and in case you were wondering there used to be these things called forums, they were really big deal at the turn of the century

im going back to sleep now gn /wfg/

>>96002653
Drink water.

>chaos humans
>chaos dwarfs
>chaos elves
>chaos daemons
>chaos beastmen
>chaos beastmen
All fine.
>Kislev
Absolutely excessive, we can't have that it's redundant to have another pseudo historical human army.

>>96002086
Who makes these? I didn't even know gaming modern wars was a thing

>>95998191
Oh boy another middle hammer kiddo who thinks warhammer is meant to be a gritty down to earth setting.

>>96002693
Warhammer started with 6th edition.

>>95998609
Yeah they can't, dwarves are naturally resistant to magic and chaos, that's a core part of their identity. Something crazy would have to happen for them to be chaos aligned like a group of holds being abandoned by their gods and kin with the only thing left to keep their homes from crumbling being to turn to chaos.

>>96002693
Only mordheim was born grimdark
Warhammer is a cartoony setting

>>96002693
Middlehammer was twenty years ago. If you're calling someone who is likely in their mid-thirties 'kiddo', you should probably get off the internet and see a doctor about your canteloupe-sized prostate.

>>96002712
WFRP1e was also pretty grimdark but still had pletnly of goofy punnames for all the towns

>>95999412
They thought they didn't need to support the game at all and it would just make money all by itself.

No really, look at the release schedules, they only released codexes for armies like every other edition (if that) and didn'trelease many new models up until they decided to kill the setting off

>>96000152
Right but the idea isn't to get the veterans to re-buy their armies, it's to get new people invested in the army.

>>96002712
>Here, let me post some redditors artwork to prove my point!

>>96001086
as someone who has a grass mat somewhere, this is the only
>>96002235
28 mag would be pretty cool if not for this shit. just focus on cool conversions and lore for said conversions, not a whole multi page article about "hurr durr, what if space marines are gay and they just haven't told us?" as if this fucking setting isn't the most documented one in existence. i told them so on their survey, they seemed to listen to some extent since then.

>>96002805
>he doesn't know
Some people never knew the joy of having so much cardboard

>>96001437
Anon what stoci told you that posting on 4chan was part of meditation

>>96001874
>>negative visualization is about visualizing and coming to terms with possible future events that would be upsetting or pose setbacks
>And the further enshitification of warhammer could prove upsetting.

"Coming to terms with" is the important thing you're missing here

>>96002801
I feel like with how collecting models is such an integral part of the hobby, those veteran players would buy the new kits anyways to have the best looking versions of their guys (assuming they don’t fuck up the new models)

>>96002735
I'm calling him kiddo as an insult anon not because I think he's actually a child. Goddamn autists are so annoying.

>>96002805
that's art from David Gallagher. yes, it was collected and posted on reddit, but it was collected from the artist's insta. he's responsible for a bunch of art from the old era.

>>96002861
>ugh these autists amirite guys
You are a catty effeminate loser. I can see why you hate middlehammer.

>>96002680
I wish there were more beastmen flavoured for a specific god. I'd even kill for some basic bitch upgrade sprues. Absolute pain in the ass having to kitbash or greenstuff the shit out of everything just to get a theme going.

>>96002818
>(you can tell i forgot to finish writing that first one)
-only way green bases look good.

>>96002178
Cool as hell man. Inspires me to put some extra effort into my chaos boys

>>96002882
I remember those margin drawings

>>96002117
Based.

Should WoC have mechanics to summon daemon units?

They should add a Daemons of Chaos Undivided faction exclusive to the Old World lead by Balgorg and the six Baalrukh

>>96002680
>core
>legacy
>legacy
>legacy
>core
So two supported chaos options, and three human empires already?

>>96002680
At least Cathay's gimick is that it is technically ripping off 40k with Big E now being a dragon and the Primarchs being shapeshifting dragons. Even the Jade Warriors are basically Star Wars Stormtroopers where they're only slightly above average with better equipment, but still end up being cannon fodder. GW already did this before by putting "Space Marines" into Age of Sigmar and calling them Stormcast Eternals.

>>96003031
It would be pretty neat

>>96003031
Yes
Id also like Araby summoners for dogs of war, fire elementals and earth elementals

>>96002510
>>96002504
What models are those, anon? Also good improvement on the paint jobs

>>96002712
these doodles were from 5th edition. Most of em anyway. 5th, though still relatively cartoony, had more serious plots and themes. the rpg had things pretty serious and grim too. 6th just saw the tabletop game match up to the tone that every other piece of warhammer media was going at the time.

Remember, 6th had little roster changes in terms of writers. The writing was already getting more and more serious, especially with the advent and popularity of mordheim.

>>96003390
From left to right >>96002510
Artisan Guild "Noble Alfar set" with a highlands shield
Highlands "Aegan elf archer" set
Highlands "aegan Maid" set
Ghamak "High elf queen"
Highlands "Nemean Archer set" Namely the musician
Artisan guild, same set as the first

>>96003504
oh and the bases are from battleyak

>>96002712
Warhammer is cartoony ideas carried out in a realistic way, which is in reality horrific, grim, and dark as fuck. That's why it's kino and sovl. It's the dreamland of a cruel child.

Thinking of nabbing a empire battalion for cheap from a friend. I know it's not the greatest starting point for empire but the price is right. How would you guys suggest to kit out the battalion? My instinct was 2 x14man infantry (spears then halbs), and 3x 10 man ranged state troops, and kitbash 2 remaining dudes as like a witch hunter or hero or engineer. Thoughts?

>cathay in two days
finally

>>96003418
>6th just saw the tabletop game match up to the tone that every other piece of warhammer media was going at the time.

Which is retarded, the game is the primary form of media, everything else should change to suit its tone

>>96003598
>warhammer
>realistic

>>96003940
If you're playing a smaller point game maybe, but if you're playing 1500 or 2000 you'll want those state troops in a one big blob

>>96003940
The phalanx looks so bad with those tiny toothpick spears.

>>96004228
>state troops one bob
so long term I'm probably better off going all say halbs for the melee guys? Maybe giving them that 2x rank bonus banner and getting a character in there and that's my "anvil" so to speak that I can build around?

>>96004224
>duhhhh it's fantasy that's not realistic
Kys you know what I meant, pedantic fuck

>setting with cities named Arschel, Wurstheim, Kotzenheim and Furzhausen
>people take it seriously
lol

>>96004362
Those are pretty mild compared to some real locations.

>>96004463
to add to this, I woudn't be surprised if they werent named after real locations.

>>96003031
Yes: paying their point cost to include them in your army

Got the base model and the basing complete, it's only missing the wings

>>96004586
NICE COCK

>>96003031
1000%. Been waiting to emulate Mark of Chaos where you csn field daemons alongside your army

>inb4 6th

I only got on the Chaos train lately.

Are slaughtermasters worthwhile post faq? And on the opposite side, are level 1 firebellies with a great weapon and hammerhand worth chucking in like ogre bulls to add some extra damage?

>>96002235
I unironically know some of these people in real life. (By way of the Hive Scum crew) They run fantastic events and make fantastic converted models. If you're not a psychopath, you'll end up playing with a mix of conservative Catholics, gay dudes, boomers, stoners, etc. now contrast the 28 community with the legions of people playing unpainted armies on shitty-looking tables, people who never concert, people who never write custom rules, etc. I know whose games I prefer.

>>96002039
They were never part of Sylvaneth the actual elves were put into their own thing called "Wanderers". They did release an Underworlds Warband and that Cursed City girl who were part of the Sylvaneth and called "Kurnothi" though. But yeah Wanderers were squatted late 2023 I think, just before Old World came out, presumably to stop people buying AoS stuff for Old World and vice versa.

>>96001938
>we'll get more AoS Wood Elves
rumors have that aos is going to see more of pic related, up to you whether they count as that

Apropos of nothing, today I was reminded that most people still into GW games today are slop-guzzling faggots who will slurp up any pile of dogshit served up to them. Even Blizzard/WoW fans have more spine to reject stupid shit these days.

>>96004989
It's always been like that, dude, grow up and vet your gaming circle.

>>96004989
you're surprised by this because...?

let's consider the facts:
#1 GW has got noticeably shittier every year since about 2000
#2 every year, an existing GW player sees it getting shittier and either decides to stay or leave
#3 if you're still in, you've either so complacent to shittification that you've just accepted it every year for 25 straight years, OR you're a newer player who saw a product that has been on a continuous downward trajectory and thought "yeah, I want in on that".

tldr anybody who was capable of positive change or intelligent decision making has not done current GW in decades

Almost done with those

I'm no longer feeling the bronze breastplate.

>>96005231
>>96005231
>>96005231

>>95999111
Storm of Chaos Flayerkin I think, but they were made from orc bodies