I don't know about you but everytime I see a setting's attempt at making a not!China expy, I just cringe, because most of the time they end up being just China with some mythological creatures thrown in there for good measure. Or at least that's what I think because, being a westerner, I do not bat an eye at our own settings fill to the brim with obviously European inspired factions and cultures. If I think that just porting China from the real world into a setting is lazy, then I should think the same about Europe expies right?
For some reason the thought of it being obvious pandering remains in my head, but hasn't most of fantasy been pandering to most westerners since its inception?

China/Cathay has been part of Western fantasy since the middle ages. There's an inherent exotic-ness to it. I like having it be a distant and vague realm but not somewhere the players will ever go.

>>96006407 (OP)
For me it's less that it tends to be lazy and more that the fantasy versions tend to be dramatically more boring than the real life historical China. It makes me feel like I would have a more interesting time just cracking open a history book than reading the setting material every time.

>notnot

>>96006407 (OP)
This but with Egypt. Tomb kings are extremely lazy.

>>96006511
Tomb Kings are basically Hotep Liches. Nothing in their background indicates that they're Egyptian.

>>96006531
>Nothing in their background indicates that they're Egyptian.
You might need to explain this take more anon
what makes Tomb King a bunch of Hoteps vs being Egyptian?

>>96006407 (OP)
I think its weird that fantasy china always just sits there waiting to be relevant. !japan, !korea, !india and all of !southeast asia should be right there, but apparently they have nothing domestic to do except flourish in some glorious but broadly unproductive golden age.

Theres plenty of other issues too, like them sitting on a bunch of arbitrarily exclusive colour-coded faction-specific magic tech and units, and the desperate need to appease chinese censors.

Actually i hated total war's kiselv for pretty much those exact reasons. "Oh a russian. Shes an ice wizard. And wears all blue you say. How creative."
Maybe theres more to it but it doesnt matter if ive already checked out

>>96006594
The 2nd edition whrp kisliv book is rad as hell, actually.

>>96006625
Sure maybe, but i already checked out

>>96006594
I think you could say the same about WFB' Empire. It's a mishmash of every colonial powers during the Early Modern Period with a dash of HRE during the Renaissance. I think we're more lenient with it because we are familiar with these old countries and can spot the obvious differences between them and the Empire. It being pagan and with some kind of culture going on makes it all neat. But one could completely look at them and say "huh, that's lazy"

>>96006573
Egyptians were pretty sternly lawful good and believed that their kings passed on to the afterlife.
They were not Manicheans either, they literally named children after their underworld ruler.
They also did not believe in bodily resurrection the way it's portrayed in the lore.
They were part of a network of near eastern ancient empires, in terms of economy, politics and culture.

>>96006407 (OP)
Fantasy cant pander to westerners anymore, they're all poor and browbeaten now. China is the dynamic new market to appeal to.

>>96006920
>Egyptians were pretty sternly lawful good
They practiced slavery
>believed that their kings passed on to the afterlife
>were not Manicheans either, they literally named children after their underworld ruler
Both of these are true of the Tomb Kings. Usirian isn't evil, and the resurrection of the tomb kings is a curse and subversion of their actual mortuary cult practices
>They were part of a network of near eastern ancient empires, in terms of economy, politics and culture
So were the Tomb Kings tho

The Tomb Kings are a faction of mummies on the Nile who worship animal headed gods and build pyramids, whose entire set of aesthetic and cultural trappings are taken from ancient Egypt. They're basically as Egyptian as the Empire is German or Cathay is Chinese.

>>96006722
>I played a bad version in a videogame, so it's bad

Secondary thinking.

>>96006960
>They practiced slavery?
And?

>>96007024
Under the alignment system, slavery is Evil. Therefore the egyptians are not lawful good.
Nothing about their culture says they're lawful good either. Most early empires are evil, and the egyptians are no exceptions.

>>96006511
Tomb Kings are possibly the laziest faction in Warhammer, which is saying alot given how ridiculously lazy Warhammer is.

>>96007122

According to Gygax slavery is perfectly lawful and good, isn't it? Maybe not torture your slaves, but that's it.

Not that I'm saying Gygax wasn't full of shit, but this is the OG alignment.

I love China when it's just wuxia shit, you literally need nothing more than that. Even stuff like AtLA or Dragon Ball are just wuxia/xianxia with twists. Of course it always depends if the writer actually cares

>>96006741
The empire is at least a multi-ethnic confederation of states. We know who founded it and why they're significant in the current era, we know they have ongoing complex relationships with most of their neighbours, and we know their short term goals

Why dont any ogre mercenaries or giants serve grand cathay when the maw is right next door? Do they have beastmen? They border the chaos wastes too, so where's their norsca? Are there scaven under their cities? Do they have their own gelt-like figure making the lanterns?

I dont care if its derivative, its implementation feels artificial

>>96007010
>played
I saw screenshots of the trailer acksually

>>96006407 (OP)
There is a worldbuilding general.

>>96006960
>They practiced slavery
Everyone has always practiced slavery. Even the countries that ended slavery still practiced slavery. We practice slavery today in the west all the time.

>>96006418
but wat if the players go there

>>96006407 (OP)
Besides beastfolk of animals native to China, what races would work for a not!China setting?