Solar Leaks edition

Previous Thread: >>96142375

>HH 3.0 Leaks
https://imgur.com/a/jYokLre
https://files.catbox.moe/98h6h7.pdf
https://litter.catbox.moe/9zh539zknqu9vqso.pdf
https://gofile.io/d/cnJk0N
>Mech Leaks
https://imgur.com/a/lRaqKSw
>SA Gofile
https://gofile.io/d/YEEqBN

>New Edition upon us
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)
https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS
>30k TACTICA & TIPS
https://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLp
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/2.0_Tactics/General_Tactics

『Adeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialis』
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/
>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colours
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview
>More lists
https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions
>What size magnets do I need?
5x1mm
>Tactics
https://1d6chan.miraheze.orug/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics

>Thread question:
What Command and High Command will you be bringing in your lists?

>>96150900 (OP)
Praetor on jetbike with either a jetbike command squad or golden keshig

If they do a champion on bike profile, I may go for that as well.

>>96150900 (OP)
>What Command and High Command will you be bringing in your lists?
Erebus, Lorgar and Kor Phaeron

Augur Squad

So, does this mean bayonets can be made to attack earlier than power spears, at Initiative Infinite?
Meanwhile, SM bayonets do jackshit (AP5). I had hoped they would let you charge despite having fired Rapid Fire weapons, but now it seems even Heavy Weapons don't block you from charging. It's all schizo.
I just think bayonets are cool, and want a reason to have a Centurion with a bayonet

>>96150900 (OP)
>DA
Centurions and Praetor
>AL
Champions and Praetor
>NL
2x Masters of Descent
>RG
???

>>96150937
>So, does this mean bayonets can be made to attack earlier than power spears, at Initiative Infinite?
Functionally yes, but in reality it's 10 WS3 S3 AP5 attacks, so it's likely worse than just firing overwatch.
Bayonets are only 1 point, but lasrifle auxilia are only 4 points, so it's a 25% increase to give them AP5 and access to this reaction.

>>96150937
>So, does this mean bayonets can be made to attack earlier than power spears, at Initiative Infinite?
Yes

Reposting from last thread since it was at the end. Saturnine test.

>TQ
probably a saturnine command squad, and two cata command squads.

>>96150932
Oof
That's it, as soon as the rapier crews hit recast sites, I'm buying 5
They're just too useful
Some for rapiers, some for this unit and some I'm sticking the old missile devastator power pack on (the one with the servo arm) to make hordes of tech marines

>>96150900 (OP)
>What Command and High Command will you be bringing in your lists?
Praetor, either a herald or vigilator (maybe MoD), two centurions

>>96150937
reaction points are valuable. That's 1 reaction point to do 0-1 wounds to a squad of basic tactical marines. Entirely pointless unless you're fighting like basic guard conscripts with your guard conscripts.

>>96150900 (OP)
>The Auxilia mechanised cohort gets the DG legion rule on their tanks
>the Malcador Infernus Hellstorm flamer is S6, AP3 when stationary and D2 at all times.
>also just an armour slot now and not a lord of war so you can spam them.

>>96150956
>>96150971
Oooh what if a bayonet made whatever it was mounted on (bolter, lasrifle, etc) into an Assault weapon? That way you'd get to shoot it in Volley fires, seeing how you don't have to switch to a bolt pistol and sword to melee.

>take alpharius
>pop up 4 tactical squads in response to a single enemy units move and pin them in place with just MEN
speaking of, wouldnt an interdiction cadre be a counter to rhino rush?
you react to the rhinos movement and block off the direction the unit inside wants to to go/go on the point yourself

and also
>take a centurion
>take rewards of teachery (i.e logistical benefit+)
>troops takes logistical benefit
>centurion unlocks 2 detachments, both are headhunter leviathal
>prime slot recon takes 1 logistical benefit each
>4 logistical benefits already from 1 centurion and some units you were gonna take anyway

>>96150971
The Auxilia Ultima pattern Cohorts get 1 free reaction every movement, shooting and charge phase to spend on Auxilia riflemen, there are better assault reactions those riflemen can do but it is pretty funny still.

>even mechanic turned on 2.0 and is making 3.0 content
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7vf8VKcQ86Y&t=2s
It's over 2.0 / 1.0 sisters...
We need that indian guy who keeps posting about the saturnine boxes sold quantities back again.

>>96150964
>They're just too useful
I, too, am starved for Reaction points

>>96150900 (OP)
>What Command and High Command will you be bringing in your lists?
Im gonna bring a moritat with out a jump pa- oh.....

>>96150900 (OP)
>high command
As cool as the saturnine praetor is, I will probably be sticking with a cataphractii praetor
>command
Heralds, champions, MoD, MoS, and Librarians are the ones I'm most interested in trying out. Currently all I have is an artificer armour herald & vigilator.

>>96151006
>Shills shilling
Surprised pikachu face dot jpeg


Buy an ad.

>>96151006
youtubers are paid servants of GW, they will always shill the newest system out of fear GW will stop giving them a free car's worth of plastic bribes and early access content.
HH3 the actual edition is absolutely dead. The customers, who don't get free boxes, are simply not buying it. Between 7/12 and 7/21 (that's 9 days) a national U.S. webstore here has gone from 15 boxes available to currently 16 boxes available after cancellation. That's negative one total sales in 9 days. Worse than selling zero boxes.

Space Marine Siege Breakers on suicide watch. Masters of Signal glad they picked a different gig.

>>96151049
The various SA commanders are fun, but theyre also going to just die to snipers. They have no saves and 2w. Headhunters finally earn their keep.

>>96151040
Bro you've been staring at that site and schizo posting their numbers every 15 minutes for 2 weeks
Give it a rest already

Master of descent taken solely to allow a thunderhawk to succeed on its reserve rolls for combat missions every turn, y/n?

It'll get to shoot every turn and there'll be next to nothing that can actually kill it in reactions

>>96151049
>the line modifier, repairs, artillery modifier, etc are all 18" bubble
I'm buggin out. All hail the clearly supreme leadership of the Solar Auxilia.

>>96151049
MoS may be slightly better as a pure nerd, but he provides zero other value.
The Siege Breaker adds Panic(3) phosphex with 31" threat range to the army, makes indirect artillery shoot more accurately, while also being able to hop in a squad with great WS5 Thunderhammer attacks and the ability to toss a Panic(3) phosphex grenade onto a 2nd unit his squad isn't charging and scare it to the corner of the board instead of contesting an objective.
MoS doesnt even get a chainsword.

Its weird that SA have no officers of the line. I suppose thats what tercios are for, but theyre weirdly strapped for detachments.

>>96151068
>next to nothing that can actually kill it in reactions
you underestimate the capabilities of 40 tarantulas.

>>96151088
You know what, if you own and bring 40 tarantulas, I'd do it just to help validate that purchase.

>>96151068
Master of descent only guarantees Deep Strike reserve rolls. Not aerial reserves.

>>96151090
You're a good person.

>>96151086
SA officers have been locked in their command squads
Probably because no one was taking these squads in 2.0 and the kits were collecting dust on the shelves

>>96151040
this the indian guy?

>>96151088
Alpha Legion can use prime slots to promote 2 squads of 2 tarrantulas into 4 Malefic Daemon Tarrantulas, forever bound to sit in one spot really angry.
And RAW they're entirely immune to S4 bolter and chainsword attacks forever as malefic vehicles never suffer statuses and Malefic doesn't deal hull points to vehicles, only wounds.

>>96151092
Gotta wait for tactical journal #136 for the Master of the Air

>>96151100
I'm in the United States, so no. Stores in LA, NY, Texas and Florida have all been showing the same thing, boxes aren't getting moved from shelves.

>>96150997
Pool is CLOSED. I liked that. After looking at Legion-specific detachments, I'm seeing they are rather starved of Heavy Transports.
...then I noticed Land Raiders Explorator are technically scouts :^)
Boo hoo, my Cataphractii won't be taking their 1" Set Up move, and won't get to do volley fire. Woe is me.

>>96151092
Damn. Do any of the voxes do anything to help reserve rolls?

I know Qin Xa guarantees a reserve roll to go off, which isn't restricted to deep strike. But that's just once.

>>96151068
Master of Signals would help you better
>>96151088
Someone please post the "I'm behind 1000 Tarantulas" pic please

>>96151108
Transport capacity 8 though.

>>96151120
8 HP, 10 capacity

>>96151059
>take unit entry
>copy-paste a few times
>add a random rule
Would it have been too hard to just make a single entry with a list of options? This is just blatant padding.

Also, thanks for fucking over my marshal, GW. I'm glad I decided to just ignore 3.0, there is nothing here that interests me.

>>96151116
Command vox relay gives +1

>>96151107
Good morning saar. I am also from united states.

>>96151127
>Also, thanks for fucking over my marshal
?

>>96150900 (OP)
>auxilia barrage guns get to play by 2.0 rules (2d6-BS) so long as the ordinance master is within 18" of the unit shooting.
>Not the unit getting shot at, The unit shooting.

Thats cute. Combine that with siege cohorts getting +1 to pinning and the Nu medusa can fire Breaching 5+ D2 Pinning (3) shots 36" away from out of line of sight while only scattering 4" on average with the big 5" blasts

Also the Medusa is down to 140 points from the old 200 point premium, you love to see it.

All the auxilia got cheaper honestly, even lasrifles are down to 50 points naked now with 4ppm afterwards. You can take 20 auxilia with a vexila and vox for the same price as 10 naked tacticals, shits crazy.

The SA might actually be playable again.

>>96151067
actually it takes 1 second each day to press refresh and get a hearty laugh watching GW get the karma it deserves for this garbage 3 year refresh. It's like taking medicine and it costs me nothing at all.

>>96151129
Neat, thank you.
So maybe Qin Xa + a MoS to make 2 turns of shooting very likely, and 3 probable.

>>96151140
I think if I was prescribed medicine that would make me constantly refresh this thread every single day out of sheer, inconsolable rage, I would flush it down the toilet

>>96151086
Tactical command section senpai, the specialised command sections are the auxilias Consul equivalents.

>>96151006
He never said he wasn't going to make 3.0 content, just that he wouldn't stop making 2.0 content in favor of it.

>>96151139
>The SA might actually be playable again.

Yet another reason to stick to 2.0. SA always lose against marines in the lore, they shouldn't be able to win against marines in the game period.

>>96150900 (OP)
What should I take for anti-tank In a list if I didn't build tons of lascannon support squads? Would a conversion beamer predator be okay?

>>96151178
vehicles seem like the best way to deal with tanks besides some melee units, so far

>>96151138
Used the old Strategos model to make an artillery officer who'll babysit a rapier battery with his loyal orderly (medic). Now he cannot be fielded without a command squad (which I don't have, it was just a fun little detachment for my Legion) and medics themselves do not exist, despite being featured in the fluff.

>>96151178
Melta TSS
Twin melta proteus
Kratos
Las destroyer rapiers
Vindicators
cerberus

Lots of options.

>>96151178
The various neutron weapons seem decent. Laser destroyer rapiers.

>>96151140
1 second each day to press refresh and 3 hours every day making 200 posts about it

>>96151187
Medics are in the Legacies PDF because they've never had an official model and thats were gw dumps all conversions now.

>>96151175
>staying in 1.0 but worse.

>>96151220
pulling random exaggerations out of your ass just makes you look like a pitiful dancing monkey. Link these "hundreds of posts", oh wait, you simply made it all up because you're a sad little child.

>>96151081
>MoS doesnt even get a chainsword.
He doesn't even have a bolter! MoS, stop! MoS!

>>96151231
Buddy, holding a one sided shitposting vendetta on 4chan is what sad little children do.

>>96151231
You made six posts like this just in the last thread

>>96151081
I think VP manipulation is fine. A proper commander's task, and I'm glad that's the approach they're taking, not just Beatstick HQs

>>96151006
macca is the only youtuber that isnt a shill

>>96151199
>cerberus is 400
I guess I know what I'm doing this weekend.

>>96151081
Vanguard, even (1) is really powerful in shooty armies. And giving Line to something that has no business having it is pretty valuable.

I, for one, enjoy the website sales updates. They give me a little chuckle every time.
Also 3.0 is gay and dead niggers lol
long live 1.0

>>96151258
Maccas not a GW shill.

>>96151258
macca is shilling his own shitty 3d designs and garbage homebrew tier ruleset

>>96151271
>garbage homebrew tier ruleset
better than 3.0 and 2.0 thoughever

>>96151278
Not an accomplishment, on top of being very doubtful. Anybody who thinks a 3+ FnP that can't be negated needs to deep strike off a chair.

>>96151278
tell me literally five things about it

With 4 per detachment and being sub-150 in all configurations, are Laser/Melta Predators the most cost effective anti-tank platforms now? Tarantulas seem cheap, but they die hard and cant effectively pick what they shoot at.

What seems most effective between Neutron/Lascannon/Melta Predators?

>>96151271
Brother have you read the garbage that is 3.0? Brother have you seen the saturnine range? His shit is somehow better (which isn’t saying much)

Sooner people make a version halfway between 1.0 and 2.0 we can ignore GWs enshitification

>>96151139
>1ppm militia

>>96151290
>>96151278
If he never releases his rules no one can prove they're dogshit
Therefore they're always better than any other ruleset out there

>>96151290
its 1.0 but fixed

>>96151301
Lmaooooo you're right, that fat cunt is never actually gonna release that ruleset is he. It will forever be work in progress lol.

>>96150958
God this is embarrassingly better than what we got.
>Thinner, longer legs with a slimmer pelvis leading to a more upright torso/head and a, still ridiculous but more reasonable, pauldron assembly.

>>96151302
Macca fixed 1.0 same way I fixed my dog

>Legiones Auxilia only get their yummy wummy reactionarino if they act as NPC support for Space Marines
>they also get no art plates, those are reserved for independent non-marinefag cohorts
What did James mean by this?

>>96151298
I'm seeing levys costing like, 30 points base for 20 and then 2ppm afterwards capping out at 50 dudes for 90 points.

And a ten man tac squad will kill 13 in a single shooting phase. Lmao.

>>96151350
He meant that it wasn't the fucking space marines who kept mankind alive 10k years after the Heresy.

Since GW refuses to make Redloss this is my current WIP for redloss, i still have work to do on green stuffing some things, but you get the idea.
I could not find a good use to this model and i hated the base model so i had to hack off the stupid Nut Holster, and a few of the dinner plates where i could.

>>96150964
I have 4 I did up in the back. Next game I am going to maximize war crimes with them.

Also red based my XIXth breachers, still drying. Going to stick them with a Siege Breaker in a Storm Eagle and drop them off on an objective while phosphex rapiers rain around him.

To that end also general thread post models.

>1 Knight Lord Scion can take 40 BS4/WS4 Veletarii with either volkite chargers, heavy flamers, or better power axes in 2 dracosans
>Plus some fucking lasrifle sections if you're a faggot
>God only knows what militia get
What the fuck?

>>96151142
Command Vox is not flyers though. Aerial Reserve modifications have to explicitly mention Aerial Reserves.

>>96151430
Tercios have always been about slot efficiency, militia is about unit size

>>96151454
Yeah but if Militia can shovel 30 stormtroopers into a crassus each...

>All that tarantula talk made me want to get a couple for fun
>My group isn't going to play 3.0 (or at least the guys I usually play with and I aren't going to)
>No point and no space to getting new models after that.

>>96151221
I didn't find Gatling Veletarii, I had expected them to be an option for the heavy flamer ones. I hope it'll be in the pdf

>>96150869

So they CAN look good, but at the same time the ratio of gun-size to dreadnought-size is still way off. Like this big mother is supposed to have the same stats as a leviathan +1W? That's it?

>>96151646
Those feathers are amazing, they carry the entire paint job

>>96151646
Uhhh, macca the outer circle said the new saturnine models look woke and if you play 3.0 your a goy shill. You should play his circle heresy and use his 3d printed 30k models.

>>96151646
Well, given that TrueScale Leviathan are supposed to be 110mm, everything checks out.

>>96151706
You're probably joking but with him you never know

>>96151708
This

>>96151646
They are, down to the millimeter, the size the leviathan should have had before FW chickened out because a billion dollars company couldn't figure out how to make a top heavy model that big in resin.

So I'm new to this, but I want to play Auxilia. It seems that Auxilia don't want to do CC, so why are all the options for their command squads CC upgrades?

>listening to horus heresy novel audiobooks
>marines take stormbirds everywhere regardless of deployment size
>but all are equipped with just a bolter and chainsword / combat blade

Am I missing something or can vehicles just tokyo drift their full movement and fire all their weapons now? There has to be some random little cliff note I've missed cause otherwise vehicles seem insane this edition

>>96151706
Fuck off, frogspammer.

Should we expect new resin kits?

>>96151789
>seem insane this edition
Vehicles are insane this edition. They are only held back by Status effects not easily going away. Even with self repair, most vehicles might struggle to remove a couple statuses in time, now that the game only lasts 4 turns.
This means "mobility kills" can be a thing

Should I get a kratos or a saturnine dread?

>>96151774
The legions were hundreds of thousands strong so they weren't all running around with OC donut steal loadouts

>>96151770
Melee for most non-marine factions serves as a “get off me”/self defence measure more so than a way to smack the shit out of the enemy offensively. If your command sections get jumped and all they have is bayonets then they’re gonna die to marines in melee, but if one or two of them are packing a melee weapon there’s a chance they get lucky and stave them off. Most command sections you never want to have in the fight, they’re basically just cheerleaders you have to try and keep safe. Think of it as spending points on insurance; there’s no guarantee that they’ll get to use their thunder hammer or power fist, but if shit hits the fan or someone deepstrikes an assault squad next to you, you’ll be more grateful for spending those 10pts on a melee weapon than just keeping a shitty lasrifle

>>96151835
I don’t think there was that many explicitly stated. Think altogether with all the legions it was around 100,000.

>>96151830
Kratos.

Can you sell me on Alpha Legion and Iron Warriors? I hear Lerneans are fine, but I don't think Hatred will help their thunder hammers much. And Saboteurs seem pointless now a meltabomb can't even kill a rhino, or winning a combat can't result in a sweep. And Headhunters' Banestrike seems to be not that different from just Tacticals doing their thing. And power daggers now replace a power weapon instead of being an add-on.
As for IW, Tyrants are 60 pts for a single krak shot. Ouch. Iron Circle seem fine, but I'm more into artillery than robots.

I just need a second opinion, is all

>>96151848
The bigger ones like Ultramarines were 150k+ and rest were around 100k except outliers like the Thousand Sons. Ravens Guard for example were at 80k before Istvaan where ~75k died

>>96151861

Such bad lore. They should have been ten or a hundred times larger than that.

>>96151859
Iron Warriors are cool.

>>96151864
The day GW understand their own setting, Legions will be bump to 100 million each.

They have a setting where out SOL system alone has 15 quadrillion beings and there a multiple millions of such systems.

100K is literally a non existent blimp on the radar.

>>96151835
I get that, but it's just humorous how mundane the weaponry has been so far, at least that I've heard a description of being used. Think there was a terminator with lightning claws once.

>>96151891
This and also the biggest battles shaterring the whole settings have less death than a random country town of France during WW2.

Something like Verdun would create 8 completely new chaos god. That's how retarded GW is with numbers.

>>96151861
How big were companies at the time? It's weird thinking about companies, when their captains seem to know everybody by name but there don't seem to be many companies per chapter.

>>96151894
In the novels the Primarchs personal posse of terminators usually have the fancy weapons

>>96151108
>Can't charge after Outflank
Aight these are useless to terminators

>>96151830
Do you have eyes?>>96151965

Bit of a long shot, but does anyone hete own a Solarite Power Gauntlet, from the Templar Brethren? I was wondering about that little shape in the middle of the armour panel - what it is, or at least the complete shape of it. Looks like an inlaid gemstone, or power generator?

How do so many random ass normal people get their hands on boxes before release?

>>96152055
Their LGS is breaking street date to give it to them

I'm too stupid and disorganised to effectively write a prospective list with the mess of leaks we currently have. What do?

>>96152055
Not just LGSes, I ordered 60 mk2 on ebay and just got a shipping notif that they'll be here by Friday

>>96152068
Continue to play 2.0.

>>96152072
Got my last game on Friday

>>96152074
Please don't tell me you're LGS or play group are seriously considering moving to 3.0

>>96152093
Why would it bother you? You don't play

>play popular legion
>stuck seeing a bunch of mirror matches and feeling like a basic bitch
>play unpopular legion
>get absolute bare minimum of unique units / legion sculpts of generic units / named characters
There isn't any winning is there?

>>96152103
For someone asking us to netlist for them you seem awful argumentative. You seem like some random troll looking to argue rather than have an actual issue that a gamer player would have.

>>96152068
What do you currently have built and painted?
>>96152129
Not at all what he said. Asking 'what is going to be meta' or 'what's a competitive list going to look like this edition' would be netlisting. Shut up, sour grape.

>>96151006
>>96151040
Kek I did the Canadian store updates and it went from 30 to 27 available after launch weekend. To 24 available a few days later to 25 available now. So someone also cancelled a pre order here.

sooooo i've got a 3ed event incoming (yeah, already), playing as ultramarines, what do you think of my list?

Points: 1500
Faction: Ultramarines

Crusade detachment
Command
1. Moritat (95); - prime advantage Logisticae [95]

Logisticae: Heavy Transport
1. Land Raider Carrier (265); [265]

Troops
1. Assault squad (140); x10 Assault Legionaires (120) - prime advantage logistical benefit [260]
2. Tactical squad (100); [100]
3. Tactical squad (100); [100]

Transports
1. Rhino (60); [60]
2. Rhino (60); [60]

Logistical benefit: Elite
1. Invictarus Suzerain Squad (175); x5 Suzerains (150); [325]

Armoured Support (Auxilary detachment)
1. Predator (100); Turret Mounted twin lascannon (10); x2 sponson mounted lascanons (20); [130]
2. Predator (100); Turret Mounted magna-melta cannon (20); x2 sponson mounted volkite culevrins (10); [130]

>>96152149
A lil out of whack in priorities I think. 590 points for a big brick and transport at 1500 but no melee character.

>TQ
Ahriman, Paragon of Battle Librarian with Divination and Biomancy, and a Master of Signals.

I want to fit in a prosperine sorcerer for that juicy +1S wildfire power, but I don't really have a unit to add him to.

Here's hoping the legacy PDF gives our characters the option to buy psychic disciplines again. Having Ahriman and a librarian be my army's duelists instead of a psychic praetor or champion feels weird.

Having fun finding little combos so far though. Corvidae autocannon HSS or seekers for rend+breaching is neat. Pavoni +2T Sekhmet as well.

>>96151433
the gayest shit, i bet goonhammer playtested it and loved it

>>96152167
>not running a t10 saturnine dreadnought

>>96152160

well, the plan was that 20 man assault squad jumps on points with moritat and contests them

meanwhile tactical squads roll on uncontested points and chill/shoot from them

and the invictarus brick goes against the other players biggest and meanest brick

predators just shoot enemy armour and transport


i can assemble a champion/some other character, i guess, but i don't think I can squeeze anything more than 95 points for them

>>96151646
I thought the same. Such a big diff but only +1 wound? I wonder what loadout people are considering on the Sat given it can double up.

>>96152149
you'd be better off with 2x of your lascannon predators and no shitty 12" melta predator. Or replacing the melta predator with laser destroyer rapiers. Meltas now are basically harmless outside their melta rule distance (12" for predator)

Ultramarines strength is if enemy shoots one of your units, once per game you can advanced reaction to shoot back with 2 units instead of 1. This requires your shooting units to have enough range to both shoot the same target. Melta won't be within 12" of the unit that decides to vaporize your lascannon predator, so he could free-kill one predator while laughing at that melta/volkite harmless one from 13" away.

You don't have any melee characters to justify a landraider. 10 naked assault marines with no thunderhammers isn't going to even dent enemy terminators. Enemy can just focus the 5 suzerains or immobilize your landraider and that army is basically harmless.

And enemy not wasting their prime advantage on logisticae for a single random squad would mean the enemy squad is stronger than your melee squads. Common would be a character in 2+ armor leading a squad with a thunderhammer champion +1WS +1A master sergeant prime. The suzerains would kill a couple random unimportant assaults or maybe 1 or 2 terminators, then all 5 suzerain die to getting hit on 3+, wounded on 2+, knocked to 4++ and dmg2 insta-killing every suzerain that rolls a 1-3 on armor.

As it is now, your list is like a 3/10 melee army and maybe 5/10 entirely average shooting. It will get massacred by a real gunline or a real melee force.

>>96152180
It looks stupid and the osiron is better.

But that's still a good idea, I'll keep it in mind. I thought about running 6 apothecaries solo with raptora for 40pt mini lascannons to cause a nuisance, that sounds hilarious.

>>96152208
>mini apothecary lascannons
Genuinely makes me a lil mad how cool TSons rules are compared to other legions. I don't want to bandwagon on principle but god is it tempting. Or maybe I'll just run a lil tsons allied contingent.

>>96152208
For reference, since space wizards have wonky rules. Forcing your opponents to divert an entire unit's shooting to kill yoir 40pt apothecaries is a great distraction. Obviously keep them off of objectives to avoid vanguard, and they'll pop to any minor melee threat, but its fun to think about.

>>96152134
Bunch of Centurions, Praetors of different loadouts, 40 Tacticals, Apothecaries 3 AT Predators, 20 Terminators in a mix of ranged and CC loadouts, some Rapiers, a couple of Land Raiders and Spartans, a Kratos with full AT loadout, 2 Contemptors, a Deredeo, and also a bunch of Mech allies lying about.

If I'm being perfectly honest, I just can't keep track of it all on separate pdfs without the books in my hand

>>96152129
Calm down nogames

>>96152207

landraider is for 10 suzerains
there are 20 assault marines

sorry, should've written it clearer

i have to spend a prime slot for logisticae to fit a landraider and suzerains

about las-predators - maybe you are right, but I will have to find a lascannon, i only have a spare volkite..


for clarity
two squads of 10 tacticals in rhinos
one squad of 20 assault marines, joined by a moritat
one squad of 10 suzerains in land raider
two preds, one melta with volk sponsons, one las with las sponsons

>>96152217
Hopefully the legacy PDF brings the rest in line. I've had my 1ksons on the shelf all of 2nd edition for how they neutered us, so it feels good to break out my nerds again. My asphyx rotor cannons and aetherfire plasma support squads are feeling quite left out, though.

>>96152207
and god I wish I had rapiers, but GW doesn't play games with my country and the event is in less than 2 weeks, so I will not have enough time to have it shipped, hell, I wonder if I have enough time to paint all of the guys I listed..

>>96152223
With a marine force that big I'd just make some solar aux or militia allies if I were you.

>>96152207
>Meltas now are basically harmless outside
>I still don't know what the D stat means

>>96152207
Meltas pop termies with decent effeciency at range.

>>96152244
D stands for damage, higher damage means the attacks deal multiple wounds or hull points. One melta gun at full range deals 3 damage, enough to kill a saturnine terminator. In half range it'll deal 6 damage to a dreadnought or vehicle. Pretty great, but you have to deliver it properly. Reactive moves or just backing a vehicle up is usually enough to avoid some melta sources. Kind of hard to avoid a drop pod full of multimeltas, though.

are there any rules that prevent just a random character from scoring?
my opponent just split off a herald and had it sit inside a ruin, scoring 2 points a turn by himself last week and I need to know if I got outplayed or we missed a rule

>>96152256
>6 damage to dreadnought
>he doesn't know

>>96152266
Oh fuck they're not vehicles, are they.

>>96152272
Monstrous creatures since 2.0, anon :^)

>>96152266
am I misremembering or did warcom not have an article claiming meltas could one shot deredeos?

>>96151302
not it isn't, it is much closer to 2.0 than 1.0 by his own admission.

>>96152296
TBF I skipped pretty much all of 2.0 for 40k, so it makes sense now. Still, a squad of 5-10 melta guns is gonna ruin someone's day. I'm just thankful that access to massed support slots seems fairly restricted now, for better or worse.

Volkite tarantulas to wipe out power armour, or lascannons for popping rhino's?

>>96150271
Thank you very much anon.
SA seems pretty interesting so far. Multilasers getting suppressive (i.e., suppressive checks after every shot) seems strong, especially taking into account Veletary axes attack at i-1 (better axes than IH and SoH have; who would have thought SA is so advanced?).
Cohorts grant pretty substantial bonuses for certain types of troops. Medusa with a Blast 5 pinning 3 weapon sounds hilarious. SA Gambit can actually take down a sergeant in 2+ before he hits you. Form Ranks gives 5++ against shooting in the opponent's movement phase till THE END of his turn. Insane. 20 Fix Bayonets! Kill 5 1w 3+ marines before they kill you, crazy (if I'm getting it right?). Some Legion-related SA reactions (like the DA one) are kino.

Are tarantulas the only marine unit that functions like a talon that splits after deployment in 3e?

>>96152307
I think warcom's article just lied and said "Meltaguns are as devastating as ever, and worse at close range. Melta (6) grants Armourbane within 6” and doubles damage to a mighty six – enough to pop a Predator Tank in a single hit."

And since they said it doubles damage to 6, the community breathed a sigh of release and said "GW realized dreadnoughts were cancer and finally cured them with melta"
Without realizing GW are talentless cocksucking faggots who can't write a single rulebook to save their life since the company became filled by DEI hires as the older creators retired.

>>96152252
if by decent range you mean 12" that's not decent range, and no they also do not have decent efficiency against terminators either.

>>96151770
The Veletarii command Squad kinda DOES want to be in CC because they can all take storm axes. If the first prime had an invulnerable save he'd be an OK duelist honestly.

>>96152363
12" rhino, 7" move, 12" melta gun, thats 31", pretty decent range to most things on the opponent's side of the board if you want to get there.

>>96152324
Putting Suppressive on the second most common weapon in the army is asking for trouble, lol.

>>96152208
Here's another thought for your consideration: small squads of outriders / single javelins with a shooting psychic weapon. Plasma outriders with 2 shots from pavoni via firestorm, or bolter ones tagging panic (1) onto multiple units. Javelins have firing protocols (3) and so could fire with a cyclone missile launcher, a heavy bolter, and a psychic weapon.

>>96152307
>>96152357
They edited the article to remove the bit about the dreadnought. They've had to go back and fix a lot of the Heresy articles. Centurion statline was the other big one.

>>96152357
>lied
Do not attribute to malice what can be explained away by incompetence

>>96152363
>wound termies on 2's
>ap2
>multiple damage
I'm not sure what you are looking for that they don't have. Not that many marine ranged weapons have that combo, without paying significantly more per shot count. Laser destroyer rapiers are better, so if you really want to minmax hard, go for those.

>>96152363
There was not a single meltagun in that list, retard.

>>96152390
Iron warriors could never

>>96152390
>Leman russ with battlecannon with multilaser on hull and pintle mounted is just 150
Behold marines, for I am the bearer of status.

>>96152357

I'm reading the Auxilia book now and the way it's written comes off like bad AI.

>>96152466
>AI.
at this point this sounds like 2/10 bait

>>96152425

If Vets could take more Disintigrator Blasters they'd be great. Saturnines with Twin D-Blasters work just as well with double the range... Overheats on a 2 though...

>>96152456
Nah man, you do it like this.
>Malcador independent fire rule let's all its guns fire at full BS when shooting different targets.
>2 sponson mounted multilasers, one front hull mounted multilaser, one pintle mounted multilaser and a battlecannon.
>force a suppression check on 4 different units every turn and attempt to pin a fifth for 225 points, stick on a flare shield for an extra 20 if you have the points.

SOMEONE is getting suppressed by this thing every turn.

>>96152485
>>96152425

Is the 3" blast template the big one or the small one? Because a Dread with a pair of Conversion Beamers sitting on the edge of a board could do good work with a 3" template, AP2 and S8. Also, Inversion Beamers at close range on the Saturnine will absolutely delete Terminators.

>>96152324
>the DA Auxilia remembered you could melta bomb a dreadnought.
>the DA legionnaires forgot.

>>96152485
the disintegrator-saturnines are strictly inferior models. Rolling 1-2 makes them just vaporise themselves with no sacrificial models. Vets overload half as often and always just pass it onto a regular bolter model. And you get the same 2 shots per heavy disintegrator as a whole twin heavy disintegrator as long as you're standing still, reacting or a 4" walking deathguard (who will be using heavy vets constantly)

230 points gets you 3 instantly self-destructing saturnine ones. The 10 veterans with 2 heavy disintegrators is 190 instead and for 20 wounds instead of the 9 wounds of saturnines (which almost instantly becomes 3/6 wounds due to overload2)

Vets are also superior to saturnines because BS5 instead of BS4. So not only do saturnines overload twice as often, but miss twice as often as well.

Saturnines might have a little play with the indirect fire thing, but they're dogshit with the disintegrator overload. If it was overload(1) they would have a role. They have none as they are. They are not actually tanky for the cost if everytime they participate in the game they drop 1 or 2 of the 3man squad.

Can somebody post implacable advance? Still can't find it.

>>96152485
Also, you entirely imagined saturnines having any extra range whatsoever.
Disintegrator Rifles are 24" and Heavy Disintegrators are 24" range and Twin Heavy Disintegrators are 24" range.
A TacVets squad will all be 24" range (bolters, rifles and heavy disintegrators)

>>96152501
Malcador stonks go up

>>96152466
Sure champ now post pics

>>96152572
The whole liber is in the OP senpai.

>>96152556
We must be blind, for I also cannot find it

Why is it always that tank commanders of regular human factions in any of GW's games HAVE to be mounted in a Leman Russ or it's variant? I want one in something else.

>>96152319
If you want to kill power armour you want hyperios missiles

>>96152590
We're absolutely getting malcador tank commanders in one of the DLC books.

>>96152590
It is incredibly easy to house rule at least. Take your chassis, add ~10% cost, and give it tank commander stat boost and rules. If it's a superheavy, make it count towards the superheavy & primarch points limit.

>>96152548
>the DA legionnaires forgot.
They are just that relentless that they can take down dreadnoughts and monsters despite detonation restrictions (also affects Bulky 3+ kek).

I don't get it, though. It is said that "the reactive player resolves steps 3-10 of the resolving at initiative steps for the reacting unit," but krak grenades and melta bombs strike at -3i. Is it an oversight? Maybe I'm just reading it wrong, and that reaction entirely ignores the -i modifier.

>>96152625
That would be nice. An armoured war supplement would be neat, give vehicle stuff for all factions.

>>96152590
We have Kratos tank commanders in LIMP, but I agree. I wish the bonus was % based and you could upgrade anything.

appropriate lore question in the appropriate lore general

So Lorgar was actually really successful in making the handful of his great crusade conquests into emperor worshiping utopias. It's the main reason the emperor actually bothered to jump in and bomb monarchia. Too much quality not enough quantity.

So when the Lectitio Divinitatus eventually falls into loyalist hands post heresy and becomes the foundation of the imperial cult. Everything goes to shit and the great religious dogma that got slow but quality results becomes the oppressive religious dogma that 40k is known for.

What happened? Shouldn't a perfect copy get the same results? Who was the jackass that copied wrong and where?

>>96152635
>resolving at initiative step for the reacting unit
Initiative step is determined by combat initiative, which is post modifier. You do not get to ignore the penalty.

>>96152653
>What happened?
Non Astartes where put in control.

>>96152635
You got the pages of the other auxiliae?

>>96152653
>Shouldn't a perfect copy get the same results?
Well the Great Crusade was the product of an advanced and functional Imperium lead by a singular person of grand vision. By the time the Imperium starts worshiping the Emprah as a God they've lost a lot of technology, suffered through a devastating civil war, and have fallen into a oligarchical dictatorship that is ambivalent towards it's population in favour of resource demands.

>>96152548
FWIW it still is probably trash. Your opponent chooses to charge whatever pathetic idiots have the melta bomb, and you burn a reaction point to throw one melta bomb at ws4 i1.

>>96152653
Lorgars Utopias were Utopias because Lorgar wanted to build utopias, the reason each conquest took so long was because Lorgar was obsessed with leaving perfect worlds behind as emblems of devotion to his father.

His utopias were not natural consequences of his faith, they took effort.

I know it's likely a waste, but I'm going to make sure to take a power fist master sergeant in all my rifleman platoons, just on the off chance I get to use the WB legiones reaction to sucker punch 20 marines

>>96152695
Sad that we can't all take Meltabombs honestly.
Sad that the Auxilia lost companion squads so se can't take meltas at all anymore, or plasma. Plasma on a bunch of cheap auxilia could be pretty good.

>>96152699
Its only 10 points, in ultima cohorts you can get 2 master sarges per line command squad and react for free once per phase.

Bring 2 line command sections, use your prime troop + 4 line terico prime troops and you can get 100 dudes for 500 points when you factor in the mandatory vexila + Vox interlock.

5 powerfists is only 50 points on top of that, its really not that expensive.

>>96152661
>You do not get to ignore the penalty.
>steps 3-10
I think they just copy-pasted that from Bayonets! reaction. The intention is to kill Bulky units with explosives. There are no detonation weapons outside of Melta bombs and krak grenades in the SA book.
>>96152665
>You got the pages of the other auxiliae?
go file in the OP thanks to the leaker anon

>>96151906
Depends on whom is writing at the time

A company is either 1000 or 100 usually

Death company are also super inconsistent with their 7 great companies in 30k and 40k but art plates in black books don't list great companies at all

>>96152556
>implacable advance
Implacable Advance: can Volley Fire with any non-Heavy or Ordnance weapon
We didn't have the page, but I swear I've seen it somewhere and didn't save it. It's also described in the WarCom article about Saturnite.
>Implacable Advance means that they can volley fire with their guns when being charged, for example. - Warcom

>>96152635
>It is said that "the reactive player resolves steps 3-10 of the resolving at initiative steps for the reacting unit," but krak grenades and melta bombs strike at -3i. Is it an oversight? Maybe I'm just reading it wrong, and that reaction entirely ignores the -i modifier.
Yes, you resolve those initiative steps during the reaction (which is made during the charge phase, and therefore before the combat's own initiative steps) - then you resolve the combat, including all initiative steps.

>>96152674
>they've lost a lot of technology
How does this happen?
>suffered through a devastating civil war,
Can't really avoid that at this juncture.
>and have fallen into a oligarchical dictatorship that is ambivalent towards it's population in favor of resource demands.
How does this happen?

>>96152697
You'd think he'd put in step by step guide on how to make a perfect society in his little fanfiction

>>96152775
>How does this happen?
You should probably go on a wiki dive or something if you know this little about the setting.

>>96152775
>step guide on how to make a perfect society in his little fanfiction
Dad kept calling him a faggot so he got discouraged

I guess the torrent rule is gone now?

I feel like I am missing something because this seems so mind warpingly broken. So if I am reading this right I:
>react when my opponent shoots anything in my army that could have shot an infantry unit within 12" of the targeting unit
>my opponent takes a cool test for the shooting unit
>if they fail, they shoot the reacting infantry
>if they pass they snapshot the original unit
So I am envisioning the following scenario. I have a few solar aux infantry units in front of an imperial knight. You shoot my knight with whatever anti tank unit you have. I react and either you snapshot the knight or blast a poor las rifle man. If you bring ultima pattern and a command and control squad you could do this up to 5 times if you have enough different infantry units to allocate to. Even if this gets changed so the unit being shot at has to also be infantry this will still lead to untouchable hss or whatnot.

>>96152828
Seems so. guess it was too easy access to ranged panic 2 on stuff like predators

>>96152775
>You'd think he'd put in step by step guide on how to make a perfect society in his little fanfiction
No such thing as a one size fits all solution for utopia, every city is its own problem nevermind every world.

>>96152590
For some reason, super-heavy tanks can never be command tanks, despite almost always being so in lore.

>>96152832
Sure, that's what meatshields are for
It's definitely a good reaction for protecting super heavies

>>96152832
https://youtu.be/AQnEBSwdAXw?si=mkG4TdoqqICgk-ma
>Alpharius talking to a bonded Auxilia cohort the day before a battle.

>>96152501
>>96152832
The era of broken SA has begun! Rejoice!

>>96152832
>shoot at knight
>be vehicle
>can't fail cool check anyway

>shoot at knight
>be infantry
>your shooting barely matters anyway

>>96152775
>How does this happen?
So there's this small thing called "our entire technological and manufacturing base got bombed to shit and deliberately sabotaged for a decade, massive cyber-warfare, and we can't currently meet maintenance needs, never mind reconstruction". It may seem trivial, but this actually leads to a minor case of catabolic collapse.

>>96152869
I'm pretty sure if you haven't failed a cool check, you have succeeded. And thus, are snapshotting.

>>96152847
There was 1 (one) that I am aware of. Maximillian Weisemann. He had rules back in the early/original Imperial Armour. He also had forge world resin minis made of him, too, one on foot and one in the tank hatch. But back then super heavies were 'army of one' attachments she despite being a commander of tank forces, could have any with him in his own detachment.

>>96152849
I would like it a lot more if it didn't make you take a test and then fuck you over regardless.

>>96152832
It seems like a good way to protect Tacticals with Line(X) on the objective.

>>96152888
Idunno, makes sense to me. The reaction represents the auxilia moving to screen in some way, making it difficult not to just shoot them, and even if you can keep steady on target it's going to be more difficult to get a clear shot.

>>96152858

Yeah, it seems like GW sometimes lets sub-par lists in previous editions be a bit busted, as a tasty treat now.
Like with Orcs and Bretts in ToW. Well, initially.

>>96152858
Wouldn't call them broken, you need to keep in mind their infantry are still comprehensively inferior to their marine counterparts.

Auxilia tanks are tougher than marine tanks but theyre also less accurate and not as well armed. The principle advantages of the auxilia are in their efficiency

>>96152832
Wow AL has an annoyingly strong rule, again! I am shocked!

Finished off a 10 man squad for the IVth.
Post models!

>>96152980
>>96153015
It is not really a complaint, I genuinely looking forward to play SA

>>96153046

wasn't inteded as such. Lord knows Orcs and Goblins deserved it after how they'd been treated for god knows how many editions.
Not sure what Eldar did to deserve the ridiculous glazing they got at the start of 10th though.

>>96152882
>I'm pretty sure if you haven't failed a cool check, you have succeeded.
Is this in the rules?

>>96153042

>>96153057
Eldar have been game-ruiningly overpowered every time they've had a new book.
They ruined 2E with Warp Spiders
They ruined 3E with Starcannons
They ruined 4E with HoloFalcons
They ruined 6E with Wave Serpents and Wraithknights
They ruined 7E with fucking everything holy shit this book
They ruined 8E with Alaitoc flyers

They were OK in 5E because they didn't get a new book specifically tailored to fuck the edition.

>>96153078

Hasn't it been more of a whip-saw effect, where they osscilate with being either useless or broken?

This could be one sentence

>>96153078
9th was the only balanced codex the eldar have ever got, because it was the dark eldars turn to be broken in 9th lol.

>>96153078
I'll tell ya - Overwatch was changed specifically because of them, and also highlighted why stratagems are dumb because they're always gonna be most efficient on the biggest most expensive unit you can:

You spent CP to overwatch with something titanic e.g. a wraithknight. You then used your fate dice to guarantee as many shots and automatic hits, with rerolls as you wanted, and also used fate dice to automatically proc devastating wounds which can't be saved. Eldar was just an insta-kill any unit you want because guaranteeing and mitigating the RNG in an inherently RNG game widens the gap between the have and have-not factions.

>>96150900 (OP)
When's Questoris leaks?

>>96153042
That particular red (purple?) goes really well with the rest of that scheme. Neat.

Working on some more terminator consuls myself – (illegal) Armistos and Warmonger.

>>96153106
>>96153057
Oh and you could spend CP to after nuking any 2 units off the board to hop back and be untargetable with said wraithknight

>>96153085
Convey all of that information in one sentence that isn’t a comma-filled run on nightmare.

>>96153078
>They ruined 2E with Warp Spiders

Then the Chaos codex reamed the fuck out of warp spiders. I made a kid cry possessing his spiders with flesh hounds. That was a good day.

>>96153134
"The Veletarii Prime in this Unit may have it's volkite charger exchanged for one laspistol and one charnabal tabar for Free, and may exchange the laspistol for one item from the Auxilia Pistols list and may exchange the charnabal tabar for one item from the Auxilia Melee Weapons list."

And I'm sure someone can cut down that a little further too.

So this used book store down the street from me has the 2.0 rulebook for half price, you think it's worth it to pick up and read to help familiarize myself with rules or just shell out for 3.0

>>96153162
Well, 3.0 is dogshit, so there's that.

>>96151891

Ya. Best to add some more 000's to the end of the GW numbers.

In a lot of ways the HH series made the mistake of going into too much details of the heresy.

It would've been better for the setting to paint a very very vague list of main events and characters with the idea that this was only a very very tiny part of what went on.

Dates on a timeline also was a mistake. It all makes the HH seem less than it should be.

A bit more ambiguity like it used to have. Nowadays people have to spend time speculating on th DAoT instead. A shame .

>>96153042
Nigger do you even work

>>96151830
Wait patiently for the fellblade to release.

>>96151798

Probably only for minor special characters.

At some point Primarchs will go plastic along with legion special units and generic characters.

>>96153090
You clearly never played against exarch spam
They needed 6 nerfs before they were brought back in line

>>96153182
Yeah. I have a full time job, a partner and 2 kids, I just squeeze in little bits where I can and the projects just kinda do themselves.

>>96150964
Why not convert some?

I have a 3rd edition game later
wish me luck

taking a centurion, 2 units of tacticals, 2 rhinos, 2 units of seekers, 2 units of 4 bikes and 3 predators for 1500pts

>>96153090
Undefeated with my 9th ed DEldar to the extent that many of my games weren't even that fun.

>>96150971
Maybe, but its very cool. Much like the SA gambit it wont help you, if your rifles are in combat chances are youre already fucked, but it lets you do some defiant gesture at the enemy.

>>96153042
Working on some tiny dudes while I wait for my phoenix termies washes to dry

>>96151859
>Tyrants are 60 pts for a single krak shot
Wrong way of looking at it. That missile is S9 armorbane, its not a krak missile, its a lascannon. Remember, you dont need to charge what you fire at any more. Tyrant terminators are just slightly better cataphrachti that double as a HSS for dealing with vehicles. The small rockets are also pretty decent now.

>>96153134
The Veletarii Prime may exchange its Volkite Charger for a Laspistol for free or one weapon from the Auxilia Pistols list, and a Charnable Tabar for free or one weapon from the Auxilia Melee Weapons list.

>>96153143
The version in the liber could definitely be shorter but this conveys the contingency really awkwardly. Two sentences is still massively shorter without having to cludge like this.

>>96152324
>suppressive checks after every shot
No, its at the end of the phase. You can put one million different suppressive weapons into a single unit and its still only one check. Everything works like blind and concussive now, rather than pinning.

New dioarama for warhammer world

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/9ytcm21f/witness-the-horror-of-the-dropsite-massacre-in-this-incredible-new-warhammer-world-diorama/

>>96153260
Yeah, yeah, I meant there are so many of them in SA; it's kind of maybe way too OP.

>>96152324
>Who would have thought SA is so advanced?

The old Saturnyne and Jovian Ordos were advanced spacer societies that survived the DAOT far better than Earth did. They had a lot of fancy shit they just never figured out how to mass produce power armour the way the Emperor did.

The OG solar auxilia were a tradition of "Void Hoplites" raised by the Jovian and Saturnine colony stations for boarding and counter boarding operations, the Veletaris still fight in the traditional way while the other tericos were later editions to the Auxilia formed by studying the Emperors Terran Regiments.

Of course the Terrans had been fighting planet bound for thousands of years so the old 100 are still better than the Auxilia at that.

>>96153304
Worst case, the edition devolves to people playing for fun and everyone else spamming SA, Automata, and True Believers in a sick parody of Rock Paper Scissors.

>>96153225
Kill them all, Anon

>>96153300
That field of dead tanks is like viagra, bros

So its basically impossible to charge NL right:? Their advanced reaction is just "if you use this, the enemy fails their charge". I dont know if they can do it if the enemy manages to setup move into them (I would assume/hope not), but if they ever do end up using it (because the enemy hasnt managed to make contact yet) they move away a minimum of like 5", which means that the charge is now essentially impossible.

And its not limited to 1/game, you can just do it three times in a row (with different units) if you want to make the world eaters player not play with you any more. You need to be right in their face so your setup gets into b2b with them.

>>96153329
playing my alpha legion against thousand sons, should be fun

>>96153327
>True Believers
Why are you all convinced this is a good idea?
You are giving a basic havoc launcher the ability in inflict unsavable wounds on you

>>96153350
Someone needs to be paper.

>>96153327
>I can't play for fun while playing the SA.

I did my time in the 2.0 mines, I'm allowed to win again.

>>96153350
D3 wounds is better than failing to score.
True believers is quite a strong prime, status immunity - even at the cost of maybe taking some wounds - is worth it, the issue is that its a prime benefit and that it limits your access to characters unless youre WB or big horus(?).

Ironically traitor DA might be the best at it due to stormwing spam.

>>96153344
Just stun them retard

>>96153377
With what, a shotgun? Unlike pinning, suppressive or even panic there really arent many good stun weapons.

>>96151139
what in the everloving abhuman FUCK is going on with his thumb

>>96153380
Like just thinking about it I can only think of the astartes shotgun and what, the havoc launcher, for stun? Maybe some other niche weapons. But it definetly seems to be the rarest status effect.

>>96153377
WE players never want to do anything but spam despoilers, the smartest among their number will put the Despoilers in transports so they move faster.

And if "spam despoilers" is ever a suboptimal approach to playing HH they'll bitch about how melee is impossible.

>>96153380
NTA, but Ally EC with Kakophoni 36 range, 7 move with 3A Stun (2) weapon.

>>96153391
Finally, a use for kakophoni!

Shit maybe I night lords should ally some in too

>>96153162
You can probably get it on ebay for cheaper.

>>96153390
Jokes on you. That shit works really well now.
Take angron and interdiction cadre 60 despoilers down your opponents asscrack turn 1.

>Contemptor dreadnoughts might actually lose combat to 3 ogryn Charonites now

>>96153300
Saw the warlord and at first I thought "oh that's neat - looks like we might be getting the saturnine stuff for LIMP sooner than expected!"

And then I noticed it wasn't 8mm...

>>96153344
>Their advanced reaction is just "if you use this, the enemy fails their charge"
No? It's "if you charge me, I run like a bitch"
Which can get you out of an objective or out of the board.
Everyone can use the reposition reaction to do the same thing, it has the same downside. NL are just a bit better at it since they add d6 to the running distance. Tho that might not be good depending on the situation
It's a good reaction tho. You can shoot volley fire and then run away I think

>>96153420
Sounds like I'm not the only one getting a perverse sense of satisfaction from seeing how hard dreadnoughts got nerfed in 3.0

>>96153380
Havoc launcher is probably the most easily accessible one

>>96153430
Would it be crazy to want everything to simply be balanced? I don't see lascannon HSS nerfed sufficiently.

>>96153389
You can get stunned every time you fail a charge
Demolisher and dreadhammer cannons also have it

>>96153344
Take some graviton weapons. Pinning 2 or 3 means most units will have to roll against Cool 4 or be stuck in place, and if they fail they aren't allowed to move even during reactions.

This is going to be a retarded question but is there any way to play WH TT online? I want to play but I also don't want to invest heavily in figures and have to drive out to play

>>96153437
Nah lascannon HSS are pretty much neutered. Lost sunder, only 2 damage when stationary, much harder to draw LOS across the table, increased in points. They struggle to kill a single predator tank now, never mind a land raider or spartan.

anyone got a decent proteus land speeder (speeder sofa) stl? can only find redesigns

>>96153447
Tabletop Simulator. There's a huge community playing warhammer that way, with tons of mods and stuff for the models and everything.

>>96153437
They still didn't fix blast weapons.

>>96153447
Table top simulator on steam. It's a bit clunky but it's what most people use I think

>>96152886
It's funny how he is literally Michael Wittmann with the names changed to 40k versions.

>>96153443
>Pinning
You have to wound with pinning and panic. With stun and suppression, this is not necessary, you only need to hit.

I feel like not enough people are talking about the fact that with the reductor prime benefit you can have 3 units of 3+/4++ thallax all with multi meltas or Photon thrusters

>>96153493
having to wound doesn't mean an unsaved wound

>>96153493
Shouldn't be too hard with strength 6 or 9

>>96153502
is the reductor prime benefit a 5++?

>>96153502
isn't it only a 5++?
lacrymaerta and macrotek are both also really powerful

Guys i had a wild shower thought while i was contemplating life and thinking about interesting changes to 2.0 to make a mash up of 2.0 and 3.0 in terms of taking the best of both worlds

Any way, what do you all think about the idea of changing how brutal works to Brutal(x/y)
Where if you roll a to wound roll of x you increase the streangth of that hit by Y

So a profile for TH would be
S +3, Swining at I-2 (So I2 for most things), and doing 1 damage but being brutal(4/2)
Of course this would still exist in a system were ID exists, so if you double it out no FNP and Splat

Just a random thought for what it might look like.

>>96153548
Why waste time trying to fix 2.0 when you can just play 1.0

>>96153258
Fair enough, was originally gonna make it two sentences, but decides to stick to the one since the person I was replying to mentioned a single sentence.

>>96153437
But they are. Theyre more expensive and less reliable vs heavy vehicles. Their ability to react multiple times has been removed and you can no longer make them BS5.

>>96153505
>>96153511
>having to wound doesn't mean an unsaved wound
Thanks, anons; turns out I'm fucking retarded.

>>96153420
>The Aethon Heavy Sentinel kept its 2+ while the Contemptor got nerfed down to a 3+
>a 60 point sentinel is better armoured than a 140 point dreadnought

>>96153567
>when you can just play 1.0
The absurd power creep, for one, is an excellent reason not to.

>>96153594
Contemptors are a 3+ save now? For real?

>>96153594
?????????????????

>>96153598
Still less of a power difference than in 2.0 where you had IF and below that.... everyone else.

>>96153594
>>96153605
>not only wrong, but complaining that units with analogous roles in their armies are similarly durable
>disregards how superior the dread is in all other areas to justify it's point cost
I'd say you were bumpfag were it not such a low iq post.

>>96153502
Ally in a master of descent and turn 1 nuke something

>>96153622
So IF, SW, UM and TS being head and shoulders better (BA get an honorable mention) is better?

>>96153603
Pardon me, was being retarded. Just checked the Contemptor datasheet again and they still have their 2+

>>96153638
>dreads get smokescreen
Wild.

>>96153636
Objectively yes it is better, its still bad but its better.

>>96153594
>they nerfed the hunter killers to being 2 shots at limited (2) so we couldn't just shoot 4 hunter killer missiles per Aethon turn 1.

Sadge.

SA seem sorta balanced around the fact that Ap4 weapons still murder them in droves. Charonites for example seem incredibly well costed at 40pts with the caveat that they will melt to autocannon fire.

>>96153533
>>96153547
Alright I'm mildly retarded, I thought thallax had Phased reactor shielding, never mind

>>96153657
Better than this shit.
18 medusas + 3 artillery command so they don't scatter is only 2700pts

>>96153668
Laughs in helstrike

>>96153694
You have to be able to shoot them all at once. Otherwise you might not even have the chance with how flayers work now

>>96152258
Nope, you got outplayed

>>96153651
Dreadnoughts always had smoke launchers back in the day.

>>96153702
You can, its a vehicle. But it is a "one and done" sort of situation. You fly in, fire off your six s9 missils with your bs3, and then hope that gets the job done, because after that you have a 160pts twin autocannon that cant stand still.

And its not exactly super cheap either.

>>96151278
Genuinely asking, why are people shitting on a rule set they haven’t seen. I gotta respect someone brewing up rules besides complaining about what we have and not doing anything to fix it. Am I missing something?

Can someone post the IH rules.
I haven't been around for like 3 weeks I missed all the drama.
Thanks frens

>>96153731
Gofile in the OP has all the marine leaks

>>96153713
>autocannon
Lascannon profile changed?

>>96152653
>What happened?
The Horus Heresy. The first apostles of the Imperial creed outside the Word Bearers would all have been horrendously fucked up by their experiences.

>>96153731
Your legion trait is the same as before.
You now have terranic greatswords at home

Gorgon terminators lost bolters (probably a mistake) and can cause a status test if they pass a save during volley fire. Also have 3A and FNP making them very tasty.
Immortals kept FNP and have expendable.

All in all IH seem more or less the same as before, you lost the grav moritat that could kill titans in one turn but thats about it.

>>96153752
Right, twin lascannon.
Honestly a twin autocannon would be better, at least thats reliably D2 and has more volume of fire.

>>96151848
I don’t like the numbers for the legions. In my head it makes more sense for these legions to be in the millions. Especially for a huge galaxy and the war should be like more than 10 years.

>>96152028
It looks like a half sphere with 2 square cutouts on the side. They use that in some of the vehicle kits but I can't find any atm

>>96153719
>they haven’t seen
We have though
I've played 3 games, 2 with my mech and vs soh and sa, and 1 with my sa vs da.
Vehicles are scary and occasionally useless, vanguad is fucking op, and conferring vanguard to a shooty unit is nuts.
The leadership mechanics are super meh and didn't need to be split out.
Bolter pigs are in for a world of.pain with ap3 spam.
Terminators feel like the tanks they should be.

>>96153719
>Macca literally squatting over plate
>"How can you tell it's shit, it isn't even out yet!"

Some bits have been shown, and none of it looked good. And that's me being generous.

>>96153719
everyone and their mother has seen the ruleset for weeks at this point

>>96153755
>>96153739
Cool thanks bros

>>96153778
>Bolter pigs are in for a world of.pain with ap3 spam.
? What AP3 is spammable this edition? Phospex rapiers?

>>96153778
>vanguard on shooting units is op
can you tell me in what situation you found yourself in where one point of vanguard made a difference?

>>96153300
Atarus got fukken smoked, lmao.

>>96153598
Out of curiosity, what powercreep examples?

>>96153868
NTA but 1.0 had a horrible problem with Template AP2 and AP3. its was super easy to spam it, and as a result things like SA and knights were stupidly over powered. SA could jsut spam basilisks and Dracon transports and spam Demo canons for cheap as fuck.

Game turned into a series of vehicles just lobbing templates.

>>96153821
Disintegrator weapons have ap3 or better
Conversion beamers have >15" ap3 blasts
Aquitor phosfex and graviton bombard, graviton rapiers too
Plasmaguns, as much as everyone here insist are shit, are pretty cheap and ignore armour pretty consistently too
It definitely feels like it's a lot easier to get weapons that ignore 3+ saves

>>96153859
They really made it a carpet of dead bodies for the loyalists, brutal.
But didn't the Iron Warriors come down after the Salamaders? How do they suddenly have entrenched positions and dug in positions?

>>96153884
First thing the IW did after dropping in was erect prefab fortifications and dig trenches in record time.

>>96153884
The IW airdropped prefab buildings and spent the first few hours just putting them together. The loyalists retreated to the IW fortifications expecting a wall to put between them and the heretics and then the Iron Warriors gunned them down.

This diorama is really cool, there's loads of little details why can't they take larger pictures so you can zoom in more?

>>96153897
Yeah, that part makes the least sense to me

>>96153897
>>96153909
Brutal. Glorious.

>>96153821
Disintegrators, quad launcher phosphex, arquitor posphex, vindicators, conversion beam >15", Typhon's dreadhammer, missile launchers. The grav pulveriser is AP3 3" on saturnine, and inversion beamer is AP3 and can be ap2 5". Can also double up on the same weapon type ala Leviathan.

>>96150958
Reminds me of Lego Bionicles and the movie 'The Fith Element'.

>>96153914

The second wave did not deep strike straight into the fight. They landed far away and spent some time digging in to 'secure a beachhead' while the first wave were fighting. Then when the first wave fell back to the beachhead, turns out it was a trap and they were walking up to an enemy fort.

Like look at the leviathan/saturnine staredown here, that's sick.
I guess the only bad part is all the tanks that can't actually depress their guns on hill dugouts.

>>96153912
So you pay a ticket to see it in person.

>>96153719
>Am I missing something?
Yeah, us having seen the ruleset.

Saturnine looking pretty cool here.

>>96153953

Makes you wonder, all the shitstorm over the past few weeks has been from people who have seen leaks. Either because they frequent here or online social groups.
There's an entirely untapped well of filthy normies completely unaware of what is about to happen.

>>96153978
he's not talking about 3.0

>>96153936
>>96153971
>Mondoshawan

>>96153884
>How do they suddenly have entrenched positions and dug in positions?
The iron warriors landed and started fortifying the lading position, which is their specialty (much like with the IF). This had "legitimate" purpose since (like how it happened) the loyalists already attacking had to fall back they would have a fortified position where they could regroup and rearm. However what happened instead is that the retreating loyalists had the IW turn their guns on them, trapping them in the depression and resulting in the massacre proper.

>>96153878
>>96153920
A lot of these are "big blast guns", which have always been good at killing power armor. Its not like a vindicator or typhon couldnt flatten power armor squads in 2.0 either. Do disintegrator guns make that much of a difference?

>>96153390
fact remains, WE players got fucked.

>>96154090
Conversion weapons were only ap1 at >48"
Plasmaguns were more inaccessible with how stupid expensive TSS were
The phosphex weapons did exist before but they are much easier to include in an army now. And much cheaper in the case of the aquitor. 5p discount on the rapiers too
Disintegrator guns are more for 2W models but Taratulas also have ap3 weapons for relatively cheap

>>96154090
There was a post in the past couple days of someone doing efficiency mathhammer. Wish I could've made heads or tails from the table but from what it looked like, disintegrators are seemingly kinda bad for their pts?

>>96150900 (OP)
So am I to assume these “optional” journals are in fact going to be books like add tons of flavour and units and so aren’t really “optional”

ALSO the fucking Liber books are £44 each KEK I’ve got no idea what army to go for and in total it’s £238 for the starter and all books.

>>96154162
You are better off spamming regular bolter shots if it's against MEQs
Disintegrators are pretty good against the VEQs tho

>>96154128
Angron can stick 60 despoilers up someones ass on their turn 1. I wont speak for the rest of the army, but that singular combination is already enough to make the legion important for the edition.

Its maybe whatever in the marine mirror match where jump units are fairly common and you can have mobile melee responders show up fairly reliably, but how does SA deal with that? Hope you have enough charonites spaced out to get them all? What about Admech that isnt investing bigly into ursarax?

>>96154162
I remember that table. Disintegrators are very specialized. Theyre great (or okay) into multi wound 3+ save models with lower toughness, but arent great vs basically anything else vs conventional weapons (iirc volkite outperforms them into everything else)

>>96154175
>So am I to assume these “optional” journals are in fact going to be books like add tons of flavour and units and so aren’t really “optional”
No its litearlly what everyone is expecting, and if you read between the line of the GW article they put out about a week ago for legacies they quite literally imply that in the last couple of paragraphs.

>>96154162
From what i have seen the ones on the saturnine seem like a complete trap of a weapon.

>>96150900 (OP)
What books do I need for loyalist death guard, is that an actual thing you can do?

Stupid question but let's say you have a fully painted BA army and one day you decided you wanted to play as IF would you have to repaint your whole army?

>>96154218
Yes.

>>96154218
No i would just start a new fucking army and paint them up and keep both BA and IF

>>96153300
Another Istvaan V diorama? What happened to bigger, old one?

>>96154212
You need the rulebook so you know the rules and the liber hereticus book where you have the rules for death guard.

>>96154218
Depends on who you were expecting to play against. If its just a whim and youre playing a friend just tell them "hey so for the next game im using IF rules if you dont mind" and thats that. If you want to play people more generally or use your army as IF long term, repainting will be much easier and save everyone problems.

>>96153694
160 is a bit steep. But guided means you only get snapped back on a strike mission. That's if they want to shoot down a plane that's blew it's load.

Still no pdf of liber questoris, or a full pdf for mechanicum?

>>96153694
Man, theyre pretty fast arent they? A xiphon is only like 20. Mind you a xiphon is a good bit cheaper.

>>96153778
>>96153784
>>96153794
>>96153953
Sorry guys I meant Macca’s ruleset. What have we seen that lends to the idea of his ruleset being shit? We have to see the whole thing right? We all know 3.0 is shit so we don’t even have to talk about that

>>96153755
How do you equip the axe? Obviously it's meant to be a 1:1 for power axe but who can take it? Not all legion weapons are distributed down to Sargeants. See the pistol below, says who gets it.

>>96154251
So far? I think only the iron father or gorgon terminators can get it. Maybe there will be wider access in the legacy pdf or whatever in the future but I kinda doubt it.

>>96154250
macca is a butthurt retard therefore anything he creates will be due to butthurt and be retarded

>>96154212
Just core rules + Liber Hereticus for the base DG ones. You can play either allegiance for a given SM legion; loyalist IW is not uncommon, while something like loyalist WB is perhaps the rarest and more snowflake for much more obvious reasons. It's stuff like Talons and Ruinstorms Daemons that are locked in, as with most named characters and also some certain choices.

>>96154248
Xiphon also didn't get any real rules and doubled down as a fighter Interceptor via air patrol reaction. No guided or stable.

>>96154277
I mean theyre still pretty good for putting shots into heavy infantry (its 3 s8 ap2 d2 from the rotary missile launcher isnt it?) . But yea, the lack of stable or whatever really hurts their nose mounted lascannons.

>>96151770
It is a melee galaxy, anon. They have to be ready.
Say, will we be getting our rightful options back in the PDF or are they just another victim of 3.0's Forced Obsolescence?

>>96154265
I’m not shilling for the guy but doesn’t logic entail there is a chance it might be pretty decent. If it’s shit you just reaffirm what you already thought. Just wait and see? I just don’t subscribe to people complaining about things and not doing anything about it. I respect him for at least attempting to fix things as I would anyone else.

>>96153248
>Tyrant terminators are just slightly better cataphrachti that double as a HSS for dealing with vehicles
Sounds good, but I also heard that only Las HSS or drop pod melta[/spoiler ]had any chance at destroying vehicles.
I should do like Alpharius and erase my memories. Otherwise I start remembering Tyrants used to have twice as many krak shots in 2.0

>>96154286
> will we be getting our rightful options back in the PDF

>>96154250
its just pardocucks seething that macca is saving 30k.

>>96154283
It also can't get damage 2 from its lascannons. I took one in my first game where it sounded a contbeotor and then never returned. We need an air cav character.

>>96154175
Master of Descent is almost mandatory if you want to do Deep Strikes

>>96154175
>so aren’t really “optional”
How new are you here that you think all books aren't optional?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7a3lOIxCOk
The news of 3.0's FAILURE has gone mainstream. Doomposters WON.

>>96154303
Tyrants have, vs vehicles, literally just a lascannon. Same exact profile (as far as any tank is concerned).

Theyre not nearly as good at killing veterans or elite infantry any more, but theyre pretty potent as anti tank goes this edition.

>>96153389
It's so retarded that a simple shotgun can stun an entire squad LMAO

>>96154317
>It also can't get damage 2 from its lascannons
I know, I mentioned that.

>>96154333
Buy an ad.

>>96154328
Literally my first day

>>96154350
I figured

>>96154175
The books will add options, potentially options you want. Theyre still ultimately optional, you probably wont need them if you are already content with your army or simply dont care for those units.

>>96154286
The plasma and melta guns are gone, I hope you enjoyed them while they lasted.

>>96154333
She's fucking awful

>>96154335
tyrants suck in this edition. its fucking 600 points for 10 of them and they are bad vs MEQ, bad vs TEQ and mediocre vs vehicles (bad vs vehicles for their points). they also dont have vanguard so they cant even score VPs.

some fag ruleswriter got smashed by them so he nerfed them into oblivion.

>>96154365
you're literally on 4chan, in a thread where all the books are posted, at the top that you had to scroll past, usually before fucking release day, and you think you have to buy books?

Science needs to study your brain to better understand the retard.

>>96153784
I need this edit

>>96154370
>she

>>96154370
>She
That's a man.

>>96154373
Theyre slightly better cata terminators that double as a lascannon HSS in their spare time. They also cost about as much (slightly less) than a 10 man lascannon HSS (350pts iirc) + 10 cata terminators (like 400?).

I wouldnt consider them exceptional, but they seem reasonable for what they do. You pay for the versitility/slot efficiency but arent as efficient as either element individually.

>>96154373
OMG they don't even have Vanguard. They HH2: Massacre'd my bois.
There has to be something going on for them. I'm seeing they can all have combis now? That makes them even more expensive but...like...stuff?

>>96153859
REMOVE MORTIS

>>96153978
Magnificent

>>96154373
>they also dont have vanguard so they cant even score VPs.
That's not how vanguard works
Having Vanguard makes you only ever score 1VP from controlling an objective. A unit that wants to sit back and defend your own deployment's objectives absolutely does not want to have Vanguard

>>96154409
>Theyre slightly better cata terminators
no they are worse than standard cata because they dont have vanguard. they are useless.

>>96154200
When was the last time a starter box had such a bad set of weapons?

>>96153594

Dreadnaughtbro's flew too close to the sun.

>>96154250
>We have to see the whole thing right?
Not really. If you see a subsection of the rules, and those are clearly not good, you can reasonably observe that at least that much of the ruleset is not good. If that's a large proportion of what the guy thinks is good to show, you can reasonably conclude that the ruleset in toto is not going to be great.

>>96154474
Vanguard isn't the be-all and end-all of this edition

>>96154477
Age of darkness the kratos was poop.

>>96154517
DESU vanguard is the easiest VP to cuck. Just get your toe on an objective, the second a Vanguard unit gets close or tries to do anything move reaction off hte point and cuck them.

>>96154509
Which is how 3.0 rules leak went. We saw it was going to be dog shit but you still had people chanting "wait for the release/libers/PDFs".

>>96154517
Vanguard is for units you throw at your opponents deployment objectives that start with him controlling them. It seems borderline useless otherwise and sometimes an active detriment

>>96154519
Kratos wasn't in a starter box.

>>96154477
Idk about the weapons but the last time they made half the starter box a bunch of new units/faction that no one asked for was in AoS 3.0 and it also sold abysmally.
It seems they didn't learn their lesson

>>96154519
Kratos isn't in the starter - Spartan was, but neither the Kratos nor spartan are bad. Kratos with a decurion has scary return fire, spartan's the ol reliable delivery brick.

When do we get knight leaks?

>>96154409
...wait you're saying they cost more than 9 Lascannon HSS while shooting half as many shots?
>>96154474
I guess they have to be seen like a HSS that can defend itself, more than a Terminator squad that has good firepower.
It's even more dilluted by the fact that now every HSS can move and shoot, where before only they could do that.

>>96154614
Provide me a good way to scrub metadata from phone photos and I'll see if my legs has a copy sat. I am not in the know on that stuff.

>>96154614
Never. The game will be out and you'll still be waiting for a knight leak you knigger.

>>96154623
>I guess they have to be seen like a HSS that can defend itself
The difference is that Tyrants don't lose 3 guys every time a tactical squad shoots at them

Hello, I've been reading Garro and Malcador calls himself the right hand of the emperor, which begs the question whos the Left hand

>>96154404
I was under the impression its just a fucking hideous woman.

>>96154656
doesnt matter when tyrants cost 2x as much as the HSS and have worse than half the firepower

>>96154659
Jenetia/Valdor/Assassin Grandmaster/Horus before the Heresy

>>96154509
Would you cite some examples based on what you saw? I haven’t seen anything yet just heard.

>>96154672
Wasn't malcador the head of the assassins too

>>96154659
https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Hector_Thrane

>>96154659
>>96154681
Hector Thrane
>This also earned him the title, Sinestra of the Emperor, the left hand of the Warlord of Terra, His most fearsome instrument of conquest.
>The continued success of Thrane and the First Legion, saw the Grandmaster rise to become one of the most influential personages in the early Imperial Court. So much so, that Thrane's counsel to the Emperor was second only to that of Malcador and Horus Lupercal.
>This prominence and success, however, caused Thrane and his Legion to develop an extreme arrogance that led them to believe they could not be defeated.
Source: Horus Heresy 9: Whatever (didn't read it)

>>96154649
Doesn't 4chan already scrub all metadata on the upload? That's why phone-posts often rotate; Phone edits often rotate a photo via metadata, not via actual image editing, and so when they're uploaded, it's scrubbed, and it resets.

Pretty sure the metadata scrubbing was added a short while after the lettuce incident.

>>96154681
>>96154704
Literally who

>>96154719
The First Legion's legion-master before the current guy when Lion was found. Dude was basically the very First Legion Master from among all space marines.
Idk why it's that guy instead of Valdor

>>96154718
No way 4chan didn't delete metadata until 2012. Feels way too recent

>>96154770
I've heard it wasn't 'til 2014, a 2-year turnaround fits.

>>96154753
A hand is something that primarily interacts with the outside world. Your right and left hands are outward forces.
Valdor was his confidant, bodyguard, etc, but he wasn't leading armies or extending the Emperor's influence outwards. He's important, just not a hand.

>>96154649
>good way to scrub metadata from phone photos
nta but I was using ExifTool on PC; I just typed a command in cmd and it cleared everything from pictures in a folder (and subfolders) (i checked on metadata viewing sites). There are easier, user-friendly programs, but my PC is way too old for them. There are also websites that clear metadata from PDFs.

So anything can go inside a drop pod now? Or a land raider?

>>96154837
Drop pod has light transport, so nothing with bulky can be in it.

>>96154674
If he replies it will be the "iron warriors can get 3+ FNP by stacking some buffs" spitball macca had.

>>96154855
Sure but I mean in 2.0 you could only get land raiders or drop pods as a transport if the unit profile said you could buy it.

>>96154837
Transports only transport infantry and paragon types. Some other transport can transport other types of units thanks to their special rules.

>>96154798
A hand is also what you use to wank.

>>96154898
You could take as many land raiders as you wanted
Rhinos are a bit more available now, yes

>Rending means the roll to wound automatically wounds
What good is Rending 6 on a S6 weapon? It alrwady wounds T8 on a 6. Are there even Toughness 9 targets in the game?
I really think the team who wrote SA was separate from the main rules teams.
Also, Multilasers are Supressive (1) so SA are the Status Effect faction lmao

>>96154946
Rending also counts as a 6 to wound

>>96154946
>Multilasers are Supressive (1) so SA are the Status Effect faction lmao
5p havoc launchers have suppressive (1) too

>>96154960
whoah so the 6 counts as a 6? game breaking

>>96154966
A 6 to hit counts as a 6 to wound, dumbass

>>96154898
Drop Pods are regular dedicated support slots, yes.

>>96154674
NTA, but the fact it's based off 1.0 means we're losing the granularity of distinct movement values. I know some folks think that's fine, but I think it probably speaks to a general acceptance that granularity isn't so important, which worries me.

>>96154663
Life as a female uggo must be rough these days.

Has anyone developed an army builder yet.

>>96154966
rending is on hits. its basically whfb poison

>>96154920
Then it'd be Krole, not Valdor.

>>96154996
the emperor is a fag so its still valdor

>>96154987
Not using movement charactistics is a very clear indicator that he's not even attempting good game design and is just attempting a very specific appeal to nostalgia. All the time M was missing from 40k is was a really weird omission that just arbitrarily blocked off design space for no good reason and adding it back is completely uncontroversial.

>>96154990
> Decides to be a woman
> But also decided to remain hideous
Literally why

>>96154946
>what good is rending on a S6 weapon?
>posts a S4 weapon.

>>96154946
>>96154960
>>96154976
>>96154994
Ooooh it's on hit. That's better. It's like a lesser critical hit. Autowound on hit, just without the extra damage. Thanks anons

>>96155031
I don't think we're running on the same definition of woman.

>>96155025
I have a lot of respect for all the parts of 1.0 that clearly worked - and for a lot of the old 40k editions with a lot of good ideas. But there are areas where they can be improved, and I think movement characteristics (and variable special rules, like Rending(4+/5+/6+) being better than Rending) are one of those.

>>96155036
>Blast chargers are S4
Yuck!
Say, do you think Militia will have 24" FP2 lasguns, while SA are stuck with 30" FP1 Heavy (FP) lasrifles?

>>96154333
>>96155031
>>96154990
Oi, stop disrespecting Michael Cera

>>96154333
Holy fuck I'm transphobic now

>>96154946
>20 Volley Shots without moving, 3.3 W vs MEQs
>10 Blast shots after moving, 3.35W vs MEQs
What

>>96155083
took you long enough

>>96155049
Yeah movement value works much more smoothly than all the weird special rules needed to modify movement distances build into unit types.

>>96155025
>>96155049
Thanks for the input. I appreciate some honest, down to earth discussion about this. I see the merit in both movement systems. I’m not sure there is a rule set that exists that everyone was perfectly okay with.

>>96151859
>Headhunters' Banestrike seems to be not that different from just Tacticals doing their thing
Seekers >> Headhunters
Vigilator > Exodus, for that matter. Cheaper, can be attached to units, and fills a tax slot to unlock a detachment, as opposed to Exodus who uses up a valuable Elites slot. Bit of a pity Exodus can't get Paragon despite not being Unique. It's either +1 Ld or Logistical for him.

>>96155083
>-phobic
You do not fear it, you dislike it. Misogyny is Hatred (Women). Misandry is Hatred (Men). Misanthropy is Hatred (Humans).
I wonder what "Mis-X" would Hatred (LGBT) be. It's not X-phobia

>>96155186
It's mister

>>96155186
At least attach pic of your models when you post shit like this.

>>96155231
Hey, it's that other guy who said he was transphobic now

>>96155186
Misfaggotry

>>96155168
Personally I still prefer Exodus over a vigilator. A vigilator only ever has the one sniper shot, meanwhile Exodus can zoom around with Light and still 360 no scope a triple of tactical marines with Rapid Shot. And he has the bigger range, vigilator got nerfed to 48"

>>96154623
Each tyrant siege terminator shoots the same number of shots as one heavy support squad marine with a lascannon, and against vehicles they have the same damage profile. Each terminator is 25pts more expensive, but for those points you get a terminator, rather than a marine.

>>96155492
The can also shoot their combi-bolter alongside the missiles at 24" range. So it's more like a tactical squad and a HSS in one.

>>96154965
No, they have stun(1). Suppressive(1) is actually fairly rare for marines. They mostly have assloads of suppressive(2)

>>96154333
>What the hail is go-een on
ugh

>>96155502
pretty much, they probably needed to cost them higher

Is the Saturn Terminator difficult to assemble?
Those ball in socket connections look like you need to spend a good time dry fitting so you don't end up with a silly boi

>>96155532
Nah I don't think that is needed. They can only focus on one unit each phase and don't have line 2, so it's purely their damage output.

Anons do i understand this right? If i take an allied detatchment of SA, do i still get access to their Cohort pattern bonus?
Thinking of taking my Artillery crew
Artillery Command
2 10man las sections for backline camping
2 Basalisks to harass the enemy.
All under 500 points.

>>96155507
Seems (0) is rare, everything has modifiers. Only the shotgun seems to be Stun (0); Havoc launchers are Stun (1)

>>96151049
The cool thing is this stacks with a Siege Breaker's cognis signum, so a siege breaker can give SA artillery line of sight (roll to hit, only scatter 1d6), and on top of the the SA guy can subtract ballistic skill. IW and friends eating good

>>96155532
Nah. A unit that combines multiple units is going to be less effective than those units in isolation. No matter what siege tyrants do they will be less cost effective than a specialist unit. They fight on par with terminators, but are a good 50% more expensive. They shoot as well (vs tanks) as a HSS but are significantly more expensive. Their value is in their utility and ability to fulfill multiple roles (providing AT firepower at the start of the game before wading in to act as a bulkwark in melee for example), but if they JUST sit back and shoot or JUST do combat they will not be cost effective.

>>96155550
I mean yeah, but you can fit 7 basilisks in that list?
>base artillery detachment - 3
>bonus artillery detachment from doctrine - 3
>logistical benefit - 1

>>96151049
I wonder does that aura extend from a transport?
If so.
Take a bunker for like 50 points stuck your commander in there like a true commander and enjoy giving out a big ass buff lol.

>>96155587
I think units are considered to be still on the table when inside a transport, actually :O

>>96155585
Yeah but i only have 3 basalisks and i wanna use it as a addition to my Dark angels.
If i can have my Solar aux objective camp, then have my Dangels moving up in LR and a spartan to deliver terminators i would be AOK with that.

Becuase sure that SA will get wrecked by anything that gets into melee with it, but at the same time, they will have to devote something to killing 500 points that is harassing them all fucking game.

>>96155595
Time to break out one my my imperial bastions.

>>96155585
Are there static artillery pieces that use the Earthshaker cannon?

>>96155615
If those are in the PDF that would be even better because they end up being cheaper. I can 100% stick like 3 of them into a corner and go "LOL have fun."

>>96155595
Someone should verify this, I'm sure I'm missing something or reading wrong

>>96155621
I have 5 from 7th edition Renegades
I wouldn't mind putting them on the table again for giggles.

>>96155595
>They are treated as if they have been removed from pay entirely.

>>96155640
I dont see earthshaker batteries listed which is a fucking shame.

>>96155655
>earthshaker batteries
isn't that just a basilisk that doesn't move
So just a basilisk?

>>96155643
See that's the bit that had me weirded out - why specify that models may not take action whilst embarked if they already said they act as if they had been removed from play??

>>96155669
Yes, but they're cheaper so you can spam them for less

>>96155643
Kind of lame they can't get inside where it's "safe" and remove a status. It takes a whole turn to do it

>>96155672
Extra clarification. Reminder that GW had to clarify through FAQ that if you forfeit the game, you lose - even if you're ahead in VP at the time.

>>96155477
>Exodus can zoom around with Light and still 360 no scope a triple
Alright!
>of tactical marines
Lmao

>>96154333
>The 40gay grift-tuber is now talking about Heresy.
Now I want 3.0 to succeed to spite this bitch.
I remember when this thing was complaining about 2.0 releasing and talking about they didn't understand who Horus Heresy was for

>>96155669
Yes, but its a basilisk that is cheaper because it does not move, because lets be honest, who the fuck is going to move their basilisk?
OH MAN some how im out of my 240" range!

>>96155691
It's more than a vigilator can do when there's no good centurion to try and snipe.

>>96155688
wut

I ordered these assuming they could go on the land raider proteus but I don't think the front door matches. Would it be difficult to cut out the entire symbol to glue into the proteus door or do I need to put it on the sander until I shave off the entire door to get to the symbol which can be glued. Or should I cut out a rectangle and glue the rectangle on the proteus door. I just want to salvage what I paid for.

>>96155709
I'm not sure what level of mismatch there is
But, trimming it then gluing on is the simplest because you don't have a lot of extra space with those lightning bolts to make it fit.

>>96155708
It was for 40k (should tell you more than enough about the kind of people who play 40k)

>>96152635
>GW remembers Gramarye exists.
I am filled with equal parts dread and despair.

>>96152974
Sure, that flavor works until somehow a single rifleman waving his arms around has pissed your cerberus crew off so bad they decide not to shoot the knight they were looking and liquify the rifleman instead.

>>96155708
Welcome to compfag hell.
Don't forget, you're here forever!

>>96155492
Okay sure but an hss lascannon marine is a bad comparison because an hss lascannon squad is bad. I think he wants tyrant siege terminators to be good.

>>96155139
All that putting movement into unit type accomplished was making it impossible to differentiate units of a given type from each other in terms of speed without jumping through hoops. The units still effectively have a movement charactistic, it just can't be tailored to create faster or slower units. Unless you're trying to make a system where units are restricted into a very narrow range of performance for some reason there's not a good to do it at all.

>>96155688
Lmao, how many people have conquered an objective and forfeited immediately for this to be necessary?

Solar aux leaks are down, could anyone recommend a good allied detachment of militia for my AL? Ideally I'd like to get an infernus and some meatshields for my Kratos and other tanks

>>96155783
Enough times to have a rule written to clarify it. I know exactly how this probably went down to.
>Some WAAC faggot goes to tournament
>Gets to a critical match up
>Scores one objective point above his opponent
>Forfeits the game with more points
>Argues that forfeiting is not auto losing and he had more VP at the time so he technically wins.

>>96155550
If you take SA as a primary detachment and LA as allies, do you still get to use their RoW? I think the answer is yes.

>>96155806
Based. absolutely based

>>96155806
Yes absolutely.

>>96155806
sweet i got my artillery section ready to fucking go!

Can we get mods to ban anyone talking about 3.0? We true horus heresy players agreed to play 1.0 and 2.0 and anyone talking about 3.0 is a GW shill.

>>96155793
Just boot this person out of the building immediately.

>>96155934
>Has to cry to mommy when people are talking about things he doesn't like
Utterly pathetic behavior

lost my first 3rd heresy game

tacticals are fucking bullshit
and so is the TS pavoni +2 toughness reaction on terminators, it should only last for the attack, not the entire phase

>>96155934
Sorry anon the only TG mod is a pole who hates /tg/ and will deliberately delete and ban anyone who tries to improve it or stop retarded arguments.

>>96155934
you should just be content to know those people are wasting hours of time they'll never get back

>>96155999
did get into a challenge though, lost it but the power dagger is good when combined with finishing blow, really put my opponent on the backfoot after he took 2 wounds round 1

>>96155934
sorry redditgeta but jannies only care about policing certain game generals and Horus Heresy ain't among them

>>96156017
>the power dagger is good when combined with finishing blow
Fucking knew it. I'd like to know more

>>96155934
I call this form super saiyan third edition.

You wouldn't understand as you can't ascend to the next level

>>96156017
You deserve getting Thousand Sonned for playing Alpha Legion

>>96155934
Meanwhile I'm stuck liking the new status effects, but hating the loss of options.

>>96155765
I do not believe lascannon HSS are bad now. I think they are still one of the best "generalist" heavy weapons teams and are good enough into a wide variety of targets to still end up as a common pick. Theyre just not a particularly reliable solution to Av14 any more.

>>96156063
well a power dagger is +2I, so you're already on an advantage on the focus roll because you're a 7 to a 4 (if not higher due to outside support etc) and kinda forces your opponent to pick certain gambits because of it
+1S offsets the downside of a power dagger and D2 makes it scary if it gets those 5+

you can also do a tactic of maximizing your chance to go first via the AL gambit round 1, wounding and then getting a bigger bonus for round 2 where you follow up with finishing blow or flurry of blows

would recommend against anyone with a power weapon

>>96156124
1. What's your opinion on the new status effects?
2. What's your opinion on the new status effects when considering that Pinning got split into three different statuses?

>>96156176
sorty, 7 to a 5, not a 4

>>96156177
>1. What's your opinion on the new status effects?
NTA but I like them, they feel distinct enough without any of them feeling like particular nothingburgers.

>What's your opinion on the new status effects when considering that Pinning got split into three different statuses?
I think its fine. Pinning being a bit of an all encompassing god status before was probably a bad thing, and kept from being an outright problem by how relatively rare it was. The new system where the statuses are less "this is a non-unit for a turn" (potentially) let them be both more common (in terms of weapons that have them) and be more easily applied. You couldnt have shellshock(2) heavy bolters in 2e, it would be monstrous. Whereas in 3e it will (probably) be fine.

>armiger moirax has rad furnace
>siege claw swings at s12 / 13
>unarmed is s7 ws4 3a
>makes them marginally more effective at kicking dreadnoughts & saturnine termies

>>96155701
Rare instance of "Grifter" actually being an accurate description. The tone of the content is completely insincere, transparently all about farming clicks using emotive language and fake outrage. Worst of the worst tube slop.

I have a breacher squad of volkite with 2 meltas
breachers can't do that anymore. Are they tactical vets now?

>>96155701
>can't even be bothered to use different reaction images

>>96156253
Theyre probably breacher vets now.

>>96156260
Oh cool, I missed that there are breacher vets

>>96156277
GW already revealed a long list of units that are going to be in the legacies rules PDF. Which we'll probably get next week. Most lost options and units are probably in there, but we don't know for sure until we can read it all.

>>96156277
Well, there arent yet. But there will be in legacies. Whether theyre "proper" vets based on breachers (as opposed to tacs/despoilers) or just breachers with more of the missing options available is unknown so far.

>>96156253
>>96156277
TFW i used to run breacher with bolters and 2 meltas
Fuck me i guess thanks GW

>>96156309
Same, but theyre better lascutters now I suppose. Trying them next game.

>>96156309
Me too, but definitely switching them back to lascutters now. The melee profile finally isn't so bad that it's like shooting yourself in the dick.

>>96156072
so it means the best horus heresy edition will be 4.0 or the one made for nostalgia in 10 years?

>>96156176
Right, but it'd be an easier sale if the power dagger didn't fill the same slot as the thunder hammer. At least in 2.0, the main strength of the dagger was that it allowed you to have a backup weapon for when you couldn't afford waiting to i1 to attack and had to be faster.
At least I think every Lernean Harrowmaster sarge knew that

Why the fuck did they make list building so god damn complicated
Am I correct? Am I just retarded?

>>96156277
>>96156298
>>96156260
>>96156256
HSS Vets are going to be interesting 0.0

>>96156392
checks out

>>96156467
>bs5 cognis HSS as its own unit

>>96156256
Which would be acceptable if it were an interesting/funny reaction image used for meme purposes.

But it's not. It's just boring.

>>96150900 (OP)
How the FUCK did you choose your legion anons? It’s fucking impossible I like so many of them

Sons of Horus
Imperial fists
Iron warriors
Iron Hands
Night Lords
Salamanders

>>96156464
It can be much more difficult depending on collection and if your special detach is actually useful. Its impossible to fuck up assembling my TS and I can make a list super quick. But my RG are so elite and odd, and that many units got broke up out of their original role categories, it makes for a slog to build.

>>96156523
I liked the color blue. So it was very easy.

>>96156523
It was easy, Angron is the best primarch, with the best story.

>>96156523
What models do you want to build\paint for these legions the most?

>>96155977

The problem is that there are a lot of toxic TOs who will be ok with their friends squeaking out a victory like this, but will reee the fuck out when someone they don't like does it.

>>96156523
I thought Alpha Legion looked fun to paint

>>96156545

>>96156523
Pick the color that you hate painting the least.

Tie breaker - whichever one makes you immediately think “hell yeah”

>>96156523
went TS, got tired of feeling anachronistic in any matchup not custodes or wolves so went IH, got tired being excluded from half the heresy so eventually settled with WE. By no means a direct path but the eightfold path got a new devotee.

>>96156545
this, just by existing he also makes WE have the best dynamic.

>>96156612
Is that a woman or a twink?

>>96156618
Whatever you want it to be

>>96156623
I want it to be dead.

>>96155539
It happens.
Even if your first guy looks great, as soon as you put him down and see him from a different angle, you'll realize he's 100% retarded and possibly having a seizure.
Just accept you're going to have 1-3 silly boys but you will learn from the experience and pose the next ones better.

maybe I should just play mechanicum

fucking vulturax have a 6 shot gun with shock (suppressed) so its basically guaranteed to fuck over a tank

>>96156618
Angrons daughter from some fanfic.

What's their end game?

>>96155999
How did you do in the back two thirds of the game?

Why aren't Auxilia allowed to have plasma guns or any weapon that can threaten marines on their infantry?

>>96156685
They can if you play a good edition of the game.
In 3.0 it's because GW is adding that turbofaggy "not in the box, not an option" shit to Heresy

>skimming the SA leaks and gwtting first impressions
>Units heavilly relient on command squads to function properly
>Intially thought this was a permanent buff they got from being in a tertio based on how articles talked about it
>They actually need to be within 18" and LOS of the command squad
> your opponent can just shoot the command squads freely since its hard to keep them out of LOS in cover now (and unfluffy)
>This also makes the velataris doubly stupid because you will need a dracosan just gor them if you want to take advantage of the cohort doctrine properly.
>These also only apply to the squad leader so they can just get sniped
>Meanwhile tactical command squads get you more detachments, a better squad leader and a Chohorts vexilla which is really strong for infantry lists

>>96156684
i conceded end of turn 2 it was 21 to 0 with no line on the board

>>96156729
How did that happen?

>>96156744
bad rolls

>>96156685
>Carring about not getting shitty plasma
Anon who cares, you can run a mechanized cohort and run battle canons and get AP3 blasts on your tanks.
Its the era of Battle canons anon.

>>96156523
Unironically which legion stereotype / Primarch's mental illness I most identify with.
You think any of the Iron Warriors players here chose being IW? Half of them have simply come to terms with being autistic. The other half does not suffer autism, they enjoy it.

>>96156729
Oh so you lost the first half, not the first third. Stay strong. But 21 to 0. Damn. That's like a women's soccer team playing a boys' high school team. Daaaaaamn.

>>96156747
Not a lot of info anon.
How the fuck did they get 21 points by turn 2?
Did they vanguard blast your booty off of an objective?

>>96156668
Oh no, he shagged the land whale after all...

>>96156523
nobody else has these .the choice is obvious

>>96156748

There still blast 3, that's not big enough. You'll kill 3 marines tops, if everything goes right and your average is probably like 1.

>>96156760
heart of battle
>3pts from 1 obj with a tac squad on it
>5 pts from a 2nd obj with a tac squad on ig
>1 point from a terminator squad being on an obj
>3 pts from first strike
turn 2
>same 3 objective deal

>>96156749
respect brother me too HH

>>96156523
My list was
Dark Angels
Ultras
Salamanders
Iron Warriors
Sons of Horus (luna wolves)
Thousand Sons
Alpha Legion
I went Salamanders, for cool paint scheme and since I haven't met a Salamanders player.

>>96156673
Turn 4, probably.

>>96156673
Literally who

>>96156774
JFC.
So seeing shit like this, makes me think my idea of taking a Solar Aux basilisk detachment is gonna be really good to deny people objectives because IIRC if you have a status you cant score right?

>>96156774
And you could kick even a single tactical squad off an objective, or at least apply a status effect? What the fuck were you doing?

>>96156673
They look like my 40k mydudes. Awkward.

>>96156720
The fact that you can have your tercio command sniped (some easier than others) is balanced out by the fact they give really powerful buffs. Its counterplay that SHOULD be there, not something that makes the option not worth it.

>>96156778
>after 30+ years GWs answer to balancing space marines is to cut games down to four turns
why is this so depressing?

>>96156791
Yup. Statuses are very strong.

>>96151175
But in the fluff, SA are equal to marines and capable of leading crusade fleets just as well

>>96156811
Because you know better.

>>96156811
Because you know 4 turns is not enough to actually determine an outcome.

>>96156792
rolling really badly, thats what i was doing
plus TS 5+ shrouded reaction bullshit

>>96156665
>6 shot gun with shock (suppressed)
Status effect from shock only procs one time (on hit). Additional damage from reapplying statuses only comes from glancing hits—their results on the vehicle damage table.

>>96156748
>SA are so strong. You have 3 whole AP3 blast weapons to kill marines with.
>It doesn't matter that two of them requires you to stay still and is only blast 3", while the other is on a Super heavy LOW and was nerfed further from 2.0.
>You can kill, like, a whole 3 tactical marine per turn with them.

>>96156848
no, the point was that its 6 shots, you're basically guaranteed to inflict it

then you have the missiles which iirc have a different status effect and shock

>>96156805
>Its counterplay that SHOULD be there
But it shouldn't, other factions don't have counterplay to their faction rules like that, like if you kill a centurion marines don't lose their legion trait (cohort doctrines are not remotley equal to other factions sun-faction rules)

Just notice SA ogryn have been taken down from the store

>>96156863
Marines dont have counterplay like that because marines dont have rules like that. A vigilator doesent make nearby recon marines breach one better or have pinning(2) or whatever. Siege breakers dont make your artillery more accurate, there is no master of armor who gives tanks the DG trait.
The closest they have is the augur squad or whatever, and guess what, you can absolutely just kill them since its four 3+ save marines with 2W.

SA get the "if you kill the commander the rules go away" gameplay because they also get the "commanders actually buff the army around them" gameplay. Admech also have a variant of that going with techpriests/magi, if to a lesser extent. SA get a lot of synergistic rules for low cost models because they also get the downside of having pieces which require that synergy and can therefore suffer vs dedicated answers.

>if you kill a centurion marines don't lose their legion trait (cohort doctrines are not remotley equal to other factions sun-faction rules)
"can rhino rush without being disordered" is absolutely on par with some legion traits. "a free reaction per phase but it can only target tactical marines" is also par with many legion traits.

>>96156791
What status does it give?
The marine grave aquitor has pinning(3) and phospex is panic(3)
Doesn't sound like you need to ally in artillery

>>96156917
For 425 points i could get 3 basalisks that have range on the entire board
With pinning 2, and -3 on their scatter. for another 100 points i could then also get 2 10 man line 1 las sections to camp on backline objectives.

Seems like a cheap and great way to possibly deny my opponent the ability to score on things im not able to reach.

>>96156915
>Siege breakers dont make your artillery more accurate
But they do

>>96156915
>is also par with many legion traits.
Its not about what it does, it isn't the same because only one unit with a specific loadout in the entire army list benefits from it. Only units with vanguard get it and the only unit with vanguard that has any melle ability is velataris with storm axes, Other army rules apply to the entire army.

>>96156836
I think that's GW's aim, game is going to look way more balanced if the pendulum doesn't have time to swing.

>>96156958
None of the legion traits apply to vehicles. They do in fact not apply to the entire army.

whats the size comparison between a vraks blight drone and a vulturax?

>>96156958
>it isn't the same because only one unit with a specific loadout in the entire army list benefits from it
The solar aux list isnt so big that thats a particularly big deal.

>other rules apply to the entire army
How much use do HSS get from the +2" setup move SW get? Do NL seekers get much use out of the +1WS vs statused units? Are IF combat units using their trait much? What about DG bikers?

Yes, many traits are more universal than the solar aux company rules, but thats because marines are designed for a more generalist style of play while the SA army is clearly built more for a specific themed company rules wise. And within the context of those companies their company traits and company commanders are very powerful.

>>96156983
Basically, marines are an army of generally standalone units which perform how they perform, buffed at most by minor but basically universal rules. Solar aux are designed as an army of interlocked pieces that each greatly enhance (and rely on) the other pieces, buffed by targetted but more potent special rules and synergies.

>>96156973
Huge. Vulturax is much larger.

>>96156851
If you want better blasts the Medusa is a 5" breaching 5+ blast thats also pinning 2 and the Executioner plasma is still the good old breaching 4+ but with D2 now so it oneshots terminators.

The battlecannons primary advantage is that you can spam the shit out of it on AV14 tanks, more damaging options are generally also more expensive.

>>96156851
>my cheap spammable Av14 isnt also the most damaging thing in the world? whatever will I do!

>>96156966
Correct, but foesn't really refute the spirit of my point when modt marine armies are 90-100% infantry in my experiance.


>>96156983
>How much use do HSS get from the +2" setup move SW get? etc
A few units not benefiting much isn't the same as most of an army not getting any rules at all.

>>96156983
>The solar aux list isnt so big that thats a particularly big
No, that makes it a much bigger deal since you are heavily restricted in what you can take.

>>96157011
>Solar aux are designed as an army of interlocked pieces that each greatly enhance (and rely on) the other pieces, buffed by targetted but more potent special rules and synergies.
But that doesn't work when your two main rules contradict each other. Cohort doctrines push hyper specilised list while command sections push a combined arms list made up of multiple different elements, they contradict each other.

>>96157079
>No, that makes it a much bigger deal since you are heavily restricted in what you can take.
Proportionately? Not really. Because the roster is small the limited number of units that benefit from each cohort doctrine represent a sizable portion of the army.

>command sections push a combined arms list made up of multiple different elements
Each command section benefits a specific type of unit (you may notice overlap with the units cohort doctrines benefit).
Sure, you CAN take an artillery commander for your solar pattern cohort, but you may get more milage out of the veletaris command. Being able to mix and match units and parts of the force doesent contradict the fact that the army is clearly designed around committing to a specific playstyle and using its gimmick to the fullest.

>>96157092
>>96157092
>>96157092

>>96157052
>>96157066
Or I could play 1.0 Solar Auxilia, where they had tanks and artillery that was good and weapons that could kill actually marine squads.

>>96157105
>Sure, you CAN take an artillery commander for your solar pattern cohort, but you may get more milage out of the veletaris command.
You can take up to five command squads, you take both.

>clearly designed around committing to a specific playstyle and using its gimmick to the fullest.
But that doesn't work, because an army made entirely of velataris models can't function properly.

>>96157079
Why is it a bad thing if Cohort Doctrines only affect parts of your army? Cohort buffs + command section buffs together are stronger than many legion tactica, who cares if only part of your army is getting a global buff to help them do their job.

>>96157110
Who's gonna play you? Even people who play 1.0 aren't touching 5" blast spam, the army list lol.

>>96150900 (OP)
Is there a new mega yet for the siege of terra audiobooks? I finished all the heresy ones and I would love to finsish the series if there is one.
Much obliged. Posting models as recompense

>>96156765
damn never seen top left up close. always thought the photo or mini that GW used was fucked up and that's why it looked smiley