Who is the strongest Final Fantasy antagonist? Pic not related.

>>712618838 (OP)
Kefka won for what it's worth

>>712618838 (OP)
the 30+ hours of cutscenes and scripted events that stop your gameplay in your tracks.

>>712618838 (OP)
This faggot is just an embarassing idiot with a nice theme music. Only the OG got the valid one.

the god my Goddess beat up

>>712618838 (OP)
Unironically Bhunivelze

A
FUCKING
TREE

Cloud of Darkness or Bhunivelze, Ultimecia is behind them.

>>712618838 (OP)

Meteion destroyed uncountable worlds.

I knew some embarrssing xivfag was going to show up and pretend Endsinger is even close to top tier. Endsinger is only powerful in a specific circumstance surrounded by a specific energy type. Dilate.

How did we go from this >>712621349
to this>>712621470

Kefka is the weakest since he failed at all his goals and jobbed to a loli with a paintbrush

>>712618838 (OP)
You really aren't going to like FF7 part 3.

>>712621720
Kefka didn't have any goals, that's the point of his character. He just did whatever seemed funny at the moment and ultimately had no real driving purpose and as a result thought life was pointless. It's why fags like >>712618910 parroting this same line for 20 years are retarded. He could never win because he didn't even want anything to begin with.

>>712618838 (OP)
Bahamut.

>>712621527
>Dynamis is the natural opposite of magic
>It exists primarily in space because space is a lifeless void
>Meteion literally controls Dynamis and can send ungodly amounts at whatever world she targets to cause a literal Armageddon.
>She destroyed literally uncountable worlds
>She only gets beaten because of the power of hope via WoL wanting to save her
>Somehow this means she's not one of the strongest antagonists despite half of them dying easier than she did
I get not liking XIV. That's your choice, but saying Meteion is weak is like saying Shantotto isn't canonically the strongest Black Mage in the entire series.

>>712621349
Yeah, probably Exdeath. He was invincible and he only became vulnerable once he sought out the power of Void. Which should've been the ultimate power that could wipe out everything, but plot armor prevented the heroes from being dying by it. If Exdeath just avoided the Cleft of Dimensions entirely, he'd be unbeatable.

>>712621635
>Tree borne of sealed evil energy
>Cute Birb made by depressed man
Weird right? And then you have turbo fag Ultima from XVI kek

>>712618838 (OP)
All these ff threads feel so forced. Especially because I remember when they didn’t happen. Its like a bot, posting a new thread once an hour.

>>712621781
>yfw Jenova is an 'Ultima' and the Black Materia is just Black Auracite in a imperfect form

>>712621886
The same guy who became a splinter just to spy on the party?

>>712622040
Same guy

>>712621868
Dynamis isn't the opposite of magic, it's the root of magic. Magic happens when emotional energy directs dynamis to shape aether. You don't even know the lore of the only game you've ever played. Endsinger isn't strong because her power level is entirely circumstantial and the destructive potential of dynamis relies on a population falling into a feedback loop of fear and despair. Endsinger has no raw power, the entire fight takes place in a fake blob of emotion where everything is feels instead of reals.

>>712621819
>kefka didn't have any goals
I hate to do this, but you're wrong.
It's well known that Kefka's nihilism develops throughout the game becoming more complex in its philosophical nature.
The goal is that it doesn't matter, so it should not exist.
Which is very paradoxical and fitting for his character.

>>712622040
He seemed kinda bumbling and "let himself lose" along the way, but you were just playing into his scheme the entire time. Everything you do in FF5 enables him to get the power of Void.

>>712621349
>heavily armored dude casting magic
Exdeath and Golbez are kino

Gestahl and the Empire were better antagonists than Kefka.

Rufus and Shinra were better antagonists than Sephiroth.

>>712622217
Rufus was for sure.
The idea of a purely for profit to idealist for profit villain was so much more fitting.

>>712622082
Dynamis is the FF equivalent of 'Dark Energy'

>>712622362
It's just emotional energy.

XI Cloud of Darkness. Multidimensional anti-existence roomba is hard to top.

Where does Seymour rank?

>>712622509
he steams a good ham.

>>712622509
Pretty low. He's nothing impressive, not even the strongest antagonist in his game.

>>712622401
Yeah, but it's not Aether. Y'know, magic.

>>712622629
Magic is the phenomenon that occurs when dynamis shapes aether according to a mage's emotions. It uses both dynamis and aether.

>>712622509
Planetary threat. That's like a C in FF land.

>>712622509
He's never been the same ever since that ginger dun wrecked his house

>>712622697
Literally says otherwise in game. Aether is magic, Dynamis is the opposite. It literally says this

>>712622795
No, and I'll be happy to prove you wrong if you can't accept that you're a speedreading lorelet retard. What it says is that extremely high densities of aether block the movement of dynamis.

>>712622697
How did the Ancients cast such powerful magic then? They could barely tap into Dynamis.

>>712622905
The Ancients could tap into dynamis, they just couldn't physically mesh with it. External dynamis still reacted to their emotions, as displayed with Meteion and with the elpis flower. The importance of emotion in their magic is drilled into your head all through Amaurot in ShB.

>>712622903
Aether is literally the source of both life and magic. Dynamis snuffs both out if it somehow manages to smother it. Aether however, can't do that to Dynamis

>>712622960
>Calls other anons a speed reader
>Shows that he is actually the speed reader

>gets defeated
>goes to hell
>finds satan
>kicks the shit out him
>takes his castle
>returns back to life taking the castle with him to rule the world

>>712623067
No, you are wrong. Dynamis doesn't snuff out life or aether, it's an emotional force that lingers around both and just does whatever the emotions of the things nearby tell it to do. Endsinger killed worlds with dynamis by scaring people into feedback loops where they summoned monsters to kill them, not because dynamis is fundamentally anti-life.
>>712623120
I really do not understand how such a simple story is so fucking hard for you retards to follow, but I'm happy to gape your asshole if you can't admit you're wrong. While you're reading pic related, can you tell me how you think Meteion and the elpis flower detected Hermes's emotions if he couldn't influence dynamis? Would you mind telling me why Hades's creations in ShB were influenced by his subconscious emotions? Would you mind telling me why the shades in Amaurot tell you about a dozen times that the emotional state of a mage is the most vital part of creation magic? Good God you niggers are so fucking obnoxious.

>>712618838 (OP)
No, Sephiroth is a legit contender since Remake turned him into a demi-god who transcends time.

>>712622697
Dynamis and aether are like fucking oil and water. They don't mix. Dynamis is a completely separate thing. It's the whole reason why the ancients were completely fucked because they were super aether beings and dynamis was like anti matter to them.

>>712623279
>gets absolutely manhandled by Jack

>>712623509
>Dynamis and aether are like fucking oil and water. They don't mix.
How are you here jacking off FFXIV when you don't even know what a fucking entelechy is? They absolutely mix. Just not at extremely high densities of aether. My fucking GOD GO CRAWL BACK TO YOUR FUCKING GAME AND ACTUALLY PLAY IT THIS TIME.

>>712622192
Antagonists haven't been the same since. We need to RETVRN

>>712623067
>>712623509
>"And those entities like the Elpis flower, that have the ability to interact with this energy, converting emotions into tangible phenomena..."
>“One last word of advice, from a former student of the Studium. Set aside practicing healing incantations for the time being, and focus solely on manipulating the mammet. Magic is the power to convert one’s aether into tangible phenomena. The key is to visualize precisely what it is you wish to bring forth."
>“Fearful that the gods meant to purge the land of mankind once and for all, the people abandoned their homes and towns and fled underground into caves. Awaiting them here, however, was not salvation, but death, for the caves became breeding grounds for pestilence and plague. As the people sat trapped in darkness, watching their families meet slow, painful ends, they concentrated their efforts on the one path left to them - prayer. Theologians believe it is this mixture of desperation and focused prayer that gave way to the very first magical incantations.”
>“Now fully aware of the land’s boundless anger, mankind turned to the heavens for strength. Through prayer, the people of Eorzea discovered that hidden within words lies magic - magic that, when fueled by faith, can empower.”
>“As the rise of organized faith ushered mankind from the bloody chaos of the First Astral Era, so were the secrets of aether manipulation - the secrets of magic - revealed unto the masses. What began as fervent prayer and choral hymns unexpectantly transformed into basic spells when paired with certain religious paraphernalia..."

Void
How do you beat a black hole?

>>712623864
Bartz tanked that.

>>712623864
have sex with it

>killed untold civilisations
X-bird wins. Second is probably Kefka and Exdeath. I want to say XI's Promathia was fairly strong as well but in the grand scheme of thing it was more or less a jobber.

>>712623864
fill it with love

I don't think Endsinger counts because her power is requires specific circumstances. Yeah she destroyed life on thousands maybe millions of planets, but OP asked for the strongest villain not the most destructive.

>>712624031
>X-bird wins.
Endsinger isn't actually powerful, it killed planets by spooking everyone into killing themselves.
>Second is probably Kefka and Exdeath.
Kefka doesn't even break top 5 in terms of power levels.
>I want to say XI's Promathia was fairly strong as well but in the grand scheme of thing it was more or less a jobber.
He was a higher dimensional creator god on par with Bhunivelze but the Promathia you meet in the game isn't even half-formed, he's just a small mass reshaped from the darkness of the Zilart population that was trapped in Al'taeiu.

Technically, Golbez was successful in all of his goals.

Since every single FF villain gets beaten by the power of friendship, measuring relative success makes more sense than "who is most powerful", because none of them are at that logic. And that doesn't even tackle the mess that is Dissidia, which puts characters like Y'shtola on par with Sephiroth and Kefka.

>>712624214
What goals? His brain was just Zemus's cocksleeve.

>>712624347
Dissidia characters are juiced up manikins, not the actual characters.

I don't give a FUCK about the XIII trilogy nor do I give a fuck about XIV.
>Literal God Tier
Garland/Chaos/Jack: Mostly because SOP and Dissidia gave massive buffs to the character. Jack smashed through the dimensional crystal matrix which can reset and recreate worlds per the Lufenian logs. He also defeated a powered-up Omega in a CANON fight, and Omega, in its base form, was created to fight Shinryu. Plus, it took all the heroes combined in Dissidia to get Chaos to stop. Jack is so powerful that he had to PLAN for his own defeat.

Mateus: He held his own against Jack in his Emperor of Hell form, and his Emperor of Heaven form is even stronger. It took a macguffin in the form of Ultima to defeat Mateus since we see Firion use it in Dawn of Souls. Ultima just seals away Pandemonium, so it explains why Mateus is still alive in SOP. He was never truly defeated nor killed. Plus he usurped God and the devil with sheer willpower and ambition.

>Void CHADS
Cloud of Darkness: CoD is the Void itself which is why she ranks higher than ExDeath. Even if ExDeath dies, the Void will live and so would CoD. ExDeath is more dependent on the Void than the Void is of him. The Void connects all FF worlds, so CoD is a primordial force.
ExDeath: He was about to erase all existence and all dimensions through the power of the Void.

>Space-Time Fuckers
Ultimecia: She was going to kompress all of space-time into a single moment. Not as impressive as the sheer destructive power of the Void, but still impressive.
Remake/Post-AC Sephiroth: Transcends space-time since he can alter history and travel through time. Rebirth introduced multiverse nonsense, so it's very likely that Sephiroth will get even stronger.

>(Potential) Planet Busters
Kuja: His ultima is more impressive than anything Kefa's done.
Kefka: Honestly more of a low-end planet buster. He didn't planet bust, but he made it irrepairable.

>The Rest
Jecht/Sin
Zeromus
Orphan
Ardyn
Vayne

>>712623790
>has never played the game and latches onto plot point that actually contradicts his weird trolling attempt
ok retard

>>712624347
Y'shtola, Prishe and Terra are actually extremely strong and competent fighters among the entire protag cast. Shantotto depending on how much you buy the memes about her abilities, would be the strongest.

>>712624608
Embarrassing display. Next time actually watch the fucking cutscenes you jack off so much.

>>712624530
>Ultimecia: She was going to kompress all of space-time into a single moment.
She succeeded too, since you use the time compression to move across time in the first place. Time compression has already succeeded by the time you start the game in FFVIII since she casts the spell at every moment in time at once.

>>712618838 (OP)
Definitively the Emperor from Final Fantasy 2. The Emperor literally KILLS....

The Jewish, Christian, etc God AND the Devil.

There is no logical explanation the Emperor is simply outright stronger than the God of real world religion. And if he kills God and the Devil its also implied the Emperor killed the Archangels and the Deadly Sins. He is low key the most powerful villain in Final Fantasy.

>>712618838 (OP)
I have no idea what I'm doing but I'll just throw some shit together off the top of my head without thinking about it for more than a few seconds/deeply refreshing my memory because I'm bored.
CoD (XI) >= CoD (III) > Endsinger > Necron > Ultimecia > Exdeath > Promathia > Hydaelyn > Zodiark > Lilith Ascendant > Kuja > Kefka > Sephiroth > Chaos > Orphan > Athena > Mateus > Alexander (XIV) > Zenos > Omega (XIV) > Bahamut (XIV) > Ultima (XVI) > Queen Eternal > Elidibus (XIV) > Hades (XI) > Hades (XIV) > Zeromus > Sin > Jecht > Heavens' Ward > Ardyn > Nidhogg > Ultima Weapon (XIV) > Alexander (XI) > Eden's Promise > Shadow Lord > The Undying > Zoraal Ja > Tsukuyomi > Golbez > Eald'narche

I started regretting the shit out of this by the time I got to the MMOs but that wasn't gonna stop me. Would have ranked the XVI Eikons too solely because Bahamut was pretty cool but I'm tired now.

>>712624896
Shadow Lord should definitely be higher. Remember that he was so unbeatable in Lilith's timeline that Altana had to intervene and make the cope timeline you play in.

I only played XIV and the PSP remake of 1. What FF game should I start with?

>>712625016
FF5 or FF7 (original) are both good benchmarks.

>>712625016
7

He is the only villain to actually tap into the "Power of Friendship" BS.

>>712625068
>He is the only villain to actually tap into the "Power of Friendship" BS.
golly!

>>712625068
>He is the only villain to actually tap into the "Power of Friendship" BS.

>>712625016
If you like retro stuff, V and VI are good. VII if the blocky overworld graphics don't put you off. Other wise X it is an excellent FF game and modern enough to be played by younger audiences.

>>712623790
Does XIV actually have a good FF story?

>>712624981
Yeah desu I just terribly phoned it in past a certain point. (that point being Chaos)
I actually forgot that we're in a cope timeline. That was the one I was taking into consideration, but that said I also don't remember much about the Shadow Lord aside from being some giganigga.

>>712625016
10

>>712625294
It's drawn out a bit because it's an MMO but overall I think it's pretty solid

>>712625294
There's a lot of filler and some really stupid writing here and there but it's pretty good, yeah. The emotional highs are raw kino. Just stop before Dawntrail.

>>712622347
Rufus didn't do anything for profit. Rufus' motivation was that he was a sadist tyrant. According to the original game he hated how his father wasted money on maintaining a good image for the Shinra Company.

Rufus wanted to rule the world using fear. Rufus was never concerned with profit. Its just that in the entire game life kicks Rufus ass brutally. Turns out that when you're a spoiled rich brat acting all tough you're going to end up with lots of enemies. Rufus' father used deception exceedingly well. Rufus was young and prideful and pride always comes before the fall.

Well until they invented the bullshit in Advent Children that Rufus survived which I hated. The fact that the world's population isn't hunting to lynch Rufus and the Turks is bullshit. Creating a global catastrophe would lead to many Shinra Employees getting hunted and killed on sight. Especially Reno since he killed thousands with the plate crushing thousands of civilians.

>>712622217
Isn't Jenova the main antagonist of FF7? I'm not trying to be a smartass or anything, but isn't Sephiroth basically just controlled by Jenova after he burned Nibelheim down?

The end of FF7 when Cloud kills Sephiroth feels more personal than anything

>>712623569
?
Like two thirds of EW's plot hinges on the fact that Dynamis is in polar opposition to and incompatible with magic. It's the entire reason why the planet is still alive, because it's high aether density is suppressing the effects of the Endsinger's dynamis-based influence.
It's very explicit that Dynamis and magic do not mix, and that aether-based life cannot use or interact with it except in very extreme, usually faith based, cases with the mc being able to limit break as the main exception seen.

>>712625343
>but that said I also don't remember much about the Shadow Lord aside from being some giganigga.
He was a Galka named Raogrimm who made a pact with Odin and got mad as hell. And since he was the Talekeeper of the Galka he had an entire race's worth of white hot rage to tap into plus the Zvahl mothercrystal underneath his castle. Odin just used him to start the Crystal War so he could kidnap a choir girl from Tavnazia and get out of his whack ass crystal prison.

>>712625481
Jesus fucking Christ dude, READ READ READ READ READ >>712623790
HOW IS THIS SO FUCKING HARD FOR YOU
WHY CAN YOU NOT FOLLOW SIMPLE FUCKING CUTSCENES IN THE ONLY GAME YOU FUCKING PLAY
DYNAMIS IS THE FUCKING ROOT OF MAGIC, MAGIC IS WHEN EMOTION CAUSES AETHER TO RESHAPE ITSELF, DYNAMIS IS THE HANDS SHAPING THE AETHER ACCORDING TO THE EMOTION DIRECTING IT HOLY FUCKING CHRIST DUDE WHY IS THIS SO HARD FOR YOU

>>712625294
The pacing is awful at times, but yeah it is classic FF kino.
Your XIV adventure party is in the top 5 over all in FF.

>>712625481
Pretty sure it's Zodiark's presence that is protecting the shards from Endsinger's song.

>>712625481
I'll zoom in on this part for you since you have so much fucking trouble, let me know if you need your hand held further.

>>712621819
billions must die was his goal

>>712625489
Oh no I remember the story kinda I just don't remember much with regards to his power for powerfagging purposes. Odin is pretty scary from what I remember but I wasn't sure where to put him especially since I didn't play TVR and AFAIK he's also pretty relevant there.

>>712625016
The nes/snes games are worth playing if you dont mind the 2d aesthetics. 4/5/6 especially.
7 is a very solid starting point, despite the basic graphics the game still holds up really well. And it opens the door to play remake/rebirth
other than that, the best starting point in general I'd say is 10. The game holds up incredibly well and its just one of the best adventures in gaming imo, also love the exotic aesthetics, you dont really find many modern games looking like it unfortunately

>>712625571
Zodiark was moving the aether in a current to prevent any one spot in the ambient aether from staying weak enough for the Dynamis to force through, but it's still the aether that repels it.

>>712625016
FF4 if you want a simple and straight forwards story.
FF5 if you'd like a more in depth intro to FF's job system.
FF6 if you want a more complex story and character customization system
FF7's nice and simple and straight forwards.
FF8 or 9... minigames, minigames, minigames. Play if you want to follow a walkthrough and have something trying to distract you ever other minute.
FFX, it's back to turn based gameplay, and you have your entire party ready on standby for every fight.
FFXII, the game plays itself, and you have your entire party ready on standby for every fight.
FFXIII, the game wants you to think you're playing this time, but it really wants to play itself.

>>712625453
No, it's the opposite. Sephiroth's will overtook Jenova and he's controlling her body for his own ends.

>>712625650
Yeah. You definitely haven't played the game.

>>712625705
X is neat but I'd already consider it modern "FF" even if it was far closer to classic than whatever the fuck we're doing now.

>>712625817
If I post my /playtime will you actually learn to fucking read?

>>712625569

I still cannot believe how much better the main characters in XIV get after Shadowbringers starts. Its like the entire cast get redesigned, reevaluated, reassigned jobs and roles and it all just works fantastic for them. They should have done it sooner.

>>712625294
It has an ungodly amount of filler, copies a ton of XI's homework, shits itself hard at SB, never recovers and goes all out on the runbacks, retcons and DBZ escalation, but it's not the worst thing in the world I suppose.

>anon posts dialogue directly from the game and official lorebooks to back up his claim
>only response is "y-y-you didn't p-play it..."

>>712624530
>him. The Void connects all FF worlds, so CoD is a primordial force.

It connects all Square Enix worlds. In Kingdom Hearts 2 Xemnas says:

"Why do you fear the void!?"

During one of his battle quotes. The void is a universal element in the entire multiverse. And it extends beyond Square Enix. Even Mario has a Void.

>>712625912
It won't be yours, you never played and it shows. You're posting EE pictures for some reason, about lore that is extensively covered in-game, and you don't even realize that you're posting plot elements that very particularly oppose your bullshit.
You woukd have to sleep through literal hours of cutscenes to come out this way.

>>712626290
>You're posting EE pictures for some reason
Yes, because you need them.
>about lore that is extensively covered in-game
You're right, it is extensively covered in-game. And somehow you still fucked up in understanding it. I really don't get it. They say about a dozen fucking times in Elpis alone that aether only blocks dynamis in extremely high densities. The entire existence of entelechies refutes your fucked up understanding of things but somehow you don't get it.
>and you don't even realize that you're posting plot elements that very particularly oppose your bullshit.
You can't read, but we already knew that.

>>712626375
>aether only blocks dynamis in extremely high densities
Changing gears and dialing back now that you read the wiki a little further?
Weak.

>>712626521
LEARN
TO
READ
>>712622903
YOU FUCKING MONGREL NIGGER APE

uhoh xivvie meltie

>>712626557
stop crashing out and go watch almost any cutscene from elpis or ultima thule and they'll probably bring up the exact opposite of whatever you're saying
since you never saw it for yourself, and it's such a bizarre thing to pretend over

having heat death be an inevitability in your universe dictated by the elements is kinda retarded doe

>>712626960
Do you notice how you can't actually post anything yourself, unlike me? Do you notice how you're only speaking in vague terms, unlike me? It's because you don't actually know what you're talking about. I've already explained several times how Elpis refutes you multiple times, and you just refuse to accept it. I'll try one more time:
ENTELECHIES EXIST YOU MONGREL NIGGER APE, METEION FUCKING EXISTS, METEION'S WHOLE THING IS THAT HER AETHER IS THIN ENOUGH TO MESH WITH DYNAMIS WHICH ALLOWS IT TO FLOW THROUGH HER AND INTERACT WITH IT, AND SHE CALLS YOU THE SAME TYPE OF BEING BECAUSE YOUR SUNDERED AETHER IS THIN ENOUGH TO DO THE SAME
LEARN
TO
READ

Kefka

>>712626960
Tell me how you think Meteion works

NPCs in Elpis also constantly mention how thin your Aether is and wonder how you even exist

>>712627073
>he's hitting the wiki harder
none of that is relevant to magic and dynamis being incompatible
dynamis is used in very specific cases, and is explicitly as against it in all others

>>712621819
Anon, 1994 was 31 years ago, not 20.

Can any mainline antagonists beat Sora in a fight? Some people are gonna say Sephiroth but there's a literal cutscene of him being super winded if you beat him in KH1

Probably Kefka.
Surprised nobody mentioned Caius ballad though.
Dude is practicly immortal under the right conditions and can just travel back in time to kill kefka in his crib.

>>712621470
The only correct answer.
>Auto transforms blackpilled retards into monsters
>Those monsters blackpill everyone else
>Did it because she saw a bunch of dead worlds and thought waiting for them to die was pointless
Nobody else in the series ever did so much damage of a universal scale.

>>712627261
>muh wiki
I've been posting my personal screenshots from the game and my lorebook. You've posted jack and shit.
>none of that is relevant to magic and dynamis being incompatible
It absolutely is. Maybe you should learn to read and check this post again >>712623790
Emotional power is at the root of magic. All magic uses emotion as its driving force. Dynamis is not incompatible with magic, it's what causes magic in the first place.
>dynamis is used in very specific cases, and is explicitly as against it in all others
You're wrong, and you will never be able to post anything from the game or any lorebook that backs up your dumbfuck understanding of things. You're completely stuck on the fact that aether blocks out dynamis in extremely high densities and you've decided that this means that it's just completely incompatible at all levels despite the villain of that entire storyline being an aetherial entity that fully meshes with dynamis. You're so unbelievably stupid and arrogant. All lorelet niggers like you are arrogant beyond belief.

i think you guys are being slightly retarded
When the ancients lose control of their powers in the Final Days they create Dynamis beasts like the ones from EW, this implies they absolutely can manipulate Dynamis in some way.

>>712627434
Yes, anyone equal to or stronger than Kuja can beat Sora. A lot of the shit you see on powerscaler videos and VSBattles is wank.

>>712627478
isn't that just the dynamis from Endsinger's influence affecting their creations?

>>712621349
>Top tier in Dissidia
All but confirms it

>>712627478
Of course, it's explicitly stated that Hermes influences the dynamis in the flowers and in Meteion. It's incredible how bad the average XIV player is at following cutscenes. Thanks for actually being able to read, anon.

>>712627462
>Surprised nobody mentioned Caius ballad though.
Because he's not even the strongest in XIII.
>Dude is practicly immortal under the right conditions and can just travel back in time to kill kefka in his crib.
In that case Ultimecia and Remake Sephiroth are stronger than Kefka they are btw

Sephiroth prior to remake was a pathetic jobber who scored a few hundred kills and jobbed to a retarded sperg like 3 different times

>>712627587
Endsinger just preys on your negative emotions.
I think it's safe to say most Amaurot creations do not have emotions, so the only thing Endsinger can manipulate is the ancients minds themselves.
There's a side quest in Amaurot that foreshadows this where the dude says a single negative emotion can be enough to render a creation deadly violent - their emotions, and thus their dynamis, was the basis of their creation magicks, they just had to work around it so it would be as little of a factor as possible.

>>712627823
There's also the lodestone story that mentions a kid getting scared and accidentally summoning a whole tower of horrors that Venat had to go clean up.

>>712627617
Influencing != Controlling
It's like leaving footprints in sand.

Shantotto was a villain of her own expansion, and she's the strongest FF character, so.

>>712627901
Yeah, they weren't actively manipulating it because they didn't even know it existed, but it was a factor in their magic. That's also why Emet was the most powerful sorcerer, because he was way too emotional.

>>712627804
He still jobs in the remake too, he just hides it better by acting like a smug retard 24/7. The best example of this is at the end of Rebirth where Cloud and Aerith beat his ass to the point where he is visibly seething only to fly away five seconds later giggling like an autist pretending he just didn't get beat up by a twink and a flower girl.

>>712627823
Isn't there a dungeon in Amaurot where a dude loses control over one of his creations from panic?

>>712618838 (OP)
Chaos.

>>712627982
This implies she wasn't also a villain outside her expansion.

>>712627982
Warrior of Crystal beats up two Shantottos at once albeit

>>712628072
This is stuff that's in the lore notes nobody actually reads.

who is the most powerful FF hero

>>712628335
Ought to be Clive right?

>>712628335
Lightning but her games were so bad she should be disqualified.

>>712627587
yes, but this retard cannot understand the most basic of concepts in the game

Ancients are immune to Dynamis, their creations are not. Creation magic in inherently unstable with the slightest imbalance making horrors, it's why they are cautious of children creating things

Final Days corrupts their creations, they're spooked, make more corrupted creations,destruction is inevitable

>>712628335
Lightning

>>712628497
which retard? they were both wrong

>>712621349
This
/thread

>>712628335
Lightning, not even close

>>712628431

>>712628598
>>712628504
>>712628464
ok besides lightning

>>712628335
Unfortunately, Lightning.

>>712628683
Cloud

What makes Lightning so powerful?

>>712628335
Adventurer
You all keep sleeping on XI it's the most batshit one

>>712628683
Bartz. He's a mimic with all jobs' abilities from his game, and can also copies other people if we count that one time he met Thancred.

>>712628730
Creator God Bhunivelze nominates her to become the new goddess of death to replace Etro, and then she kills Bhunivelze and becomes the Creator God of the real world Earth.

>>712628659
Yeah I forgot about Lightning. Didn't take XIII sequels into account.

>>712628730
lightning replaces literal God in her games and evolves into God-II multiversally

>>712618838 (OP)

>>712628683
Clive then Noctis?

>>712628835
>>712628876
the director's boner for Lightning was crazy

>>712628784
XI is the most kino game but I don't think Warrior of Crystal is the most powerful protag. Temporarily during the fight against the dark WoC maybe when he gets elevated to godhood, but that doesn't last. He even dies fighting Cloud of Darkness and that alone puts him behind the FF3 crew.

>>712628335
Probably Barret because he overcomes diversity (one arm, person of color, single adoptive father, from the ghetto, speech impediment/retardation, overweight)

>>712628335
Jack

Literally the only FF character with a 100% winrate.

>>712629489
Shantotto is that but actually. You can't even beat her in Dissidia matches, because she is always revealed as a fake in her loss animation.

>>712618838 (OP)

>>712618838 (OP)
Well, judging by crossovers
>Top Tiers
Shinryu
Jack/Garland/Chaos
>fought Jack and did decently tier
The Emperor
Bahamut (XV)
>Buddha Tier
Bhunivelze
>wait until remake tier
Sephiroth
>??? tier
Nekron
Ultimecia (Time Kompression)
>No crossovers yet tier
Ultima (XVI)
>Cameo tier
XIV villains
The Creator
>Above dudes in the Warriors of Chaos tier
Zeromus
Caius
>Warriors of Chaos tier
Everyone else from Dissidia
>Below the main villain tier
Gilgamesh
>jobber tier
Lv.1 Goblins

Sephiroth is the strongest though
He's a momma's boy but he throws meteor and shit

>>712628335
It's Lightning due to Goddess bullshit or Bartz with every job mastered, or Warrior of Light post Jack grinding.
Honorable mentions to Clive, Noctis and the PSX trio.

>>712630375
Poor Gilgamesh. I feel like he could actually have a shot power-wise against some of the weaker warriors of chaos like Golbez or Vayne if he wasn't such a retard. Taking down Seifer was impressive.

>>712627478
I think the final days was my favorite apocalypse in a game, you got all these mostly super nice people that might as well be gods in their own right and it even they are running away from what's going on

>>712628857
Clive beats pretty much every FF protagonist 1V1 outside of True King Noctis and Lighting after she becomes a goddess

>>712631883
Why do you guys keep saying Clive like he's notable at all? He can't even cast Raise.

I've forgotten a lot but I'll just throw it out there.

>A - Multiversal threat
Jack
XI CoD
Sephiroth, they'll put him here, don't fight it, I don't like it any more than you do
>B - Universal threat
III CoD
Exdeath
Ultimecia
Necron
Endsinger
>C - Planetary threat
Zeromus
Kefka
Yu Yevon
Shuyin
>D - Continental threat
Vayne
>Who were you again
XII-2 guy
XIII people
XV people

I don't know where to put Emperor after SoP.

>>712621470
I figured it'd be this cunt. Literally entropy itself or whatever. And if you've got too much power, she fucks up your magic, and if you've got too little, and you're depressed, she fucks you up.
Also somehow managed to hoard resentful echoes of fallen civilizations and turn them into shades.
That said, it took like a thousand+ Meteia. Just one of them can't do that, so it might not be a fair comparison.

>>712632389
Emperor is a multiversal threat since he has the power to usurp God and knows how to get to other dimensions.

>>712621470
>>712627463
Meteion was also responsible for the deaths of countless civilizations. Many of those civilizations fell apart because of her showing up which in turn pushed her further down her apex doomer path.

>>712632465
>Also somehow managed to hoard resentful echoes of fallen civilizations and turn them into shades.
She didn't 'figure out' how to do that. That's what the Endsinger actually is. It's not Meteion, it's just the Meteion hivemind network that all those trillions of seething emotion ghosts have invaded.

>>712632584
Yeah, sorry. I simplified it a bit.

>>712621635
I thought her final form was kino personally.

>>712625917
the power of having a good writer for 2 expansions

>>712631638
Well, their strength is their unfettered ability to create basically anything they can imagine so long as they're focused. And the more aether they have, the better they are at it, and the more bombastic the things are they can create.
The Final Days turn that against them. It'd be like being the world's strongest swordsman but some fucking invisible miglymagoogly comes out of nowhere and makes your sword curve around and prod you in the heart. You have no way of fighting back because it weaponizes your very strength and sets it against you.

>>712632678
Jobbed to hope btw.

>>712633089
>every JRPG villain ever
At least the MMO follows the same tradition.

>>712632678
sex

>>712632389
Emperor post-SoP is legit hard to place. On one hand, he’s still the same scheming manipulator with a sick magic kit, but after absorbing that weird crystal power and making a bid at godhood in that secret ending, dude basically pulls a Zeromus and comes back from raw hate. That’s edging into multiversal territory IMO, especially since SoP spells out that the whole chaos loop spans multiple realities.

If he actually managed to control the loop instead of being stuck in it? He’s easily A-tier. Right now I’d put him between A and B, depending on if we’re counting base Dissidia Emperor or that near-deification moment where he stares down the Darkness Beyond Time and goes "I can work with this."

>>712633261
(she has no lower body)

>>712618838 (OP)
Ultimecia compresses all of time and space onto herself so her.

>>712633680
she has a a mouth though

>>712633261
If she'd just landed on Planet Goon...

>>712628335
Everybody who says Lightning is wrong. Jack has better feats, and he made sure that WoL became powerful enough to defeat him. WoL is the strongest because he can 1v1 Jack. Bhunivelze is NOTHING in the overall FF cosmology. SOP shows that the Lufenians can use the Dimensional Crystal Matrix to remake world, so if a janny Lufenian decided that the FFXIII needs a reset then Bhunivelze would sit there and do NOTHING. Jack canonically beat Omega, a weapon designed to fight Shinryu, and then he went on to beat Omega in a powered-up state. The Jack would FOLD Bhunivelze and Savior Lightning at the same time. Even in crossovers, Jack scales above Bhunivelze since his presence alone was enough to tip the balance towards darkness. And WoL managed to best Jack in a 1v1 at the peak of his power. The OG hero and the OG villain? THE STRONGEST AND IT'S NOT EVEN CLOSE. You're not dealing with retarded Personafags who aren't aware of the numbers 1 and 2. The strongest will always be where it all started.

>>712621819
Retard

nobody cares about the trance monkey

>>712634139
>no argument
Play the game

>>712634119
The strongest persona protagonist is Door kun by literal statements in the game thoughever. Tatsuya is weaker

>>712634285
>Tatsuya is weaker
Nobody is stronger than onii-sama

>>712634119
>The OG hero and the OG villain? THE STRONGEST AND IT'S NOT EVEN CLOSE.
I love Final Fantasy so much /v/ros
It's so kino

>>712625294
one of if not the best FF story

>>712632389
>Sephiroth, they'll put him here, don't fight it, I don't like it any more than you do
But no matter what they do, the unchecked autism of Nojima made sure that Jack is forever at the top.
>beat Mateus, Omega and the Transcendant back-to-back
BEAST

>>712634119
>>712634415
I think this guy has a serious boner for Jack. Settle down young man

>>712634495
I respect his power. Jack Garland truly is the best.

>>712634495
Not him but I respect Jack's strength

>>712634495
Chaos we know it's you

>>712632389
III COD and ExDeath might be A-rank because of the Void. Not sure if Necron is universal, but Kuja is definitely C-rank since he wrecked a planet. Your list is pretty spot-on for not having remembered much.

Jack missed Rage of Halone

>>712633838
are you sure about this?

>>712634976
Necron is the end of all life so yeah probably

>>712635101
snrrk

>>712632389
>>712634976
Necron isn't universal, it's the personification of death created by FF9's World Crystal as a response to Kuja firing the Ultima nuke
Its strength is based off of the World Crystal so it's a little better than a planet buster so it's around Zeromus level but nowhere near on the scale of things like Exdeath or CoD

If Necron was the personification of death itself but on a higher pure primordial level like the CoD is for the Void then it'd be up there
Necron's just the FF9's planet response to things that want to destroy it like how FF7's planet created the Weapons

>>712632389
>>712634976
III CoD and XI CoD are the same entity, so they should be together in A rank.

>wins throughout the game
>gains the power of the capital V Void, the real deal
>had to be nerfed during the final battle by the Warriors of Dawn

>>712636371
>Barely beats one old man
Fuck off tree

>>712636371
Mogged by Galuf

>>712635170
my dick can take a few vuln stacks

>>712621819
He does have a semblance of a goal, just nothing that's in any way sustainable. When he becomes the god of magic and has everything he could want, he switches focus to forcing the entire world to share his nihilism by continuously magic nuking villages and encouraging collective despair. Breaking the party's spirit would be his ultimate triumph, and when they all reject his worldview at the end, something that is incomprehensible to him, he loses it completely.

>>712633460
Where did Emperor power up post-SoP? Last I saw him a moogle Cid said he was just a normal human with no magic then Jack yeeted him into a portal

>>712636484
Galuf is the ultimate chad though. Nowhere near as pathetic as Golbez getting dunked on by Tellah.

>>712635170
>Endsinger will never puke on your dick
why even live