Why does nobody do baked lighting nowadays?

That webm literally answers your question

The same reason why white women dont fuck wh*te “men” anymore. They want stronger & bigger hung men of color.

>>712700801 (OP)
Because most people would immediately uninstall a game if something like your webm happened.

the real reason is that the indian code monkeys doing the majority of the coding for modern AAA games unironically do NOT KNOW HOW to do baked lighting.
Hell, they probably don't even know what the word "optimization" means. They just import a 9trillion polygon tooth model to put on the model for the background NPC with no LOD and then sets the game to generate 1000 of them at all times even if they're not visible of them and let the engine handle the rest

>>712700801 (OP)
Because everyone's PC and/or console has been able to handle realtime lighting for years now. It gives you more realistic and interactive lighting options. Same reason we don't leave out texture filtering or rigidbody physics.

>>712700801 (OP)
Games being easy to run would be bad for the hardware business.

>>712701230
I doubt it, I think most people wouldn't notice and thats how most games used to be made

why did you make this thread again

>>712700801 (OP)
>Nobody
Call Of Duty
Dead Island 2
Need For Speed
Counter Strike 2
Dragon Age Veilguard
Assassin's Creed Mirage

>>712701758
Yes because devs aren't dumb enough to bake for dynamic objects

>>712700801 (OP)
Could you make a basic dynamic lighting but set it to only apply to the select few moving objects/characters and then bake everything else that's static? Or would this not save any processing power?

>>712700801 (OP)
baked lighting is only good in retroslop n64/ps1-styled games. in every other context it sucks ass

>>712700801 (OP)
Because it requires a slight bit of work and modern devs are lazy as fuck.
They just going to have Unreal Engine do everything dynamically for them and offload the dev work to the customers GPU. So you pay the price for their laziness.

>>712703018
That's how it always worked. Physics enabled objects don't get baked and objects that never move do.

>>712703095
Baked lighting is good for anything that doesn't move which is 90% of environments.
>but muh dynamic day/night cycles
slop.

>>712703018
>Or would this not save any processing power?
it would save an insane amount. it's what your supposed to do. just this one thing would make modern games run so much better if devs would just do their fucking job.

>>712703186
>>712703287
why don't devs do this then?

>>712700801 (OP)
>why don’t people open cans with knives anymore?
Because can openers exist.

OP + baked lighting adds multiple gigabytes to game levels.
everyone complained about doom dark ages being RTX only but it's 60 gigs.

>>712701013
Then don't make movable objects have baked lighting? duh.

>>712700801 (OP)
it's still the norm.

Many games now insist on having day/night cycles and weather systems, which I'm not a fan of because I like when environments are made with a specific, consistent look in mind, they look way better.

>>712703564
This what most people tend to mess
>OMG WHY IS BATTLEFIELD 1 150 GB DESPITE HAVING 10 BIG MAPS
Well there's your answer

>>712703343
Hardware and software with the "bigger and better" marketing sells more because of hype. Raytracing isn't new technology but NVIDIA didn't want everyone only buying GTX so they had to force a gimmick that wasn't just cryptomining. RTX as your marketing, hiking prices while stagnating on hardware, deals with gaming and software companies to promote your gimmick, it's all just an effort for more profits with less innovation.
AAA games can't just be big, recognizable titles that everyone looks forward to anymore- they have to be yearly sales that rehash the same concept reusing the same code and assets as last year.
Thats why. It's all a farce for you to put more cash into the CEOs wallets.

>>712703343
They're Lazy. they click 1 button for dynamic lighting in Unreal Engine and leave it at that.
Creating a custom mix of dynamic and prebaked lighting takes actual artistic effort.

They do, nearly every game has baked lighting, you fucking retard

>>712703343
They do

>>712703750
>>712703804
barely at all.
in E33 for instance. Almost every shadow jitters because it's dynamic instead of pre-baked maps.
There's no reason for them to be dynamic, the game has no weather system. it's just pure laziness and bad development.

>>712701374
It is actually this, just turn on noclipoing and examine landscapes. It’s like sculptures in Warframe Dojos. I have literally seen a high poly rock repeated hundreds of times just to use a flat part of it for a road with a different texture to the general tileset.

>>712703343
The development experience with baked lighting is shit. You can't just place down a box and see what it will actually look like in the final game, you have to go through a very expensive recompile. And high-resolution lightmaps take up a huge amount of space (unlike textures, lightmaps cannot be reused). Combine that with the added complexity of having multiple incongruent lighting systems for static and dynamic geometry that still need to look good together.

>>712703974
This shit annoys the fuck out of me.
Not only are FF7Rs assets pure garbage but all of these little assets have just been lazily dragged clipping into each other and the polys that are not visible are still there wasting GPU.

>>712703934
>one game that takes place mainly outdoors doesnt use baked lighting therefore no games do
/v/ should stop trying to talk about game development

>>712700801 (OP)
Cool, another thread where a bunch of neet faggots pretend like they know something about engines and game development.

>Why does nobody do baked lighting nowadays?
Maybe they do where the dev team thinks it's appropriate to do so, and not in every game ever made. Did you ever think of that you pea brained cock licker?

>>712704198
>the polys that are not visible are still there wasting GPU.
they get culled so not really

>>712704229
Modern games don't use it where they should.

>>712704284
They do, it's in pretty much every game, probably E33 but I haven't played it so I don't know
It's not simply use it or you don't, baked and dynamic lighting and shadows are combined in various ways depending on the requirements of the game
From what I saw of E33 it takes place in outdoor areas with foliage and baked lighting is not good for that for various reasons

>>712704278
They're not all backfacing and They have to be processed to be culled. so yes.
more importantly having some pajeet clipping asset farm shit into each other is not how you make environments.

>>712704372
>They're not all backfacing
so? They get depth clipped, or they might be omitted before they're even drawn if there's static occlusion culling
If it's a repeated mesh then there's barely any cost

>>712701138
keep watching cope porn brown boi

>>712704448
Z culling happens on a fragment basis after the Vertexes are processed.
this is why devs remove uneeded polys. obscured polys are not free.

>>712704695
and the fragment shader is like 95% of the work
triangles are cheap

How many games even NEED dynamism like destructible environments and shit? Like, The Finals, Battlefield, I can see it whatever, but did Doom need raytraced global illumination by default for what amounts to blowing up boxes and platforms strewn about?

>>712700801 (OP)
seriously can somebody telled me they doesn't doed this

>>712704815
the fragment shader would never have to run or depth test at all for any of those pixels if the polys were removed by Samir like they should be.

I'd like to know why Project TurboBlast run like ass.

>>712704930
the fragment shader doesn't have to run if they fail the depth test, and the depth test is cheap

>>712704892
>but did Doom need raytraced global illumination by default for what amounts to blowing up boxes and platforms strewn about?
They probably did that because of "muh technology", but the first thing they're going to do for Switch 2 port is baked lighting

>>712704984
depth test is the first step in the fragment shader and it's nowhere near as cheap as never having to process 1000s of polys and pixels.

>>712705128
depth test usually comes before the fragment shader depending on how you wrote your fragment shader
discarded fragments are cheap, triangles are never the bottleneck in rendering modern video games

>>712701013
>modern games still have less interactivity with the world despite having dynamic lighting
surely this is baked lightings fault!

>>712705128
>>712704198
nta but the point is that in your example pic all of the obscured triangles actually do not cost barely anything at all because they are either backfaced culled or depthtest culled.
Overdraw is an expensive thing that needs to be reduced but that mostly comes in the form of sorting mesh draw order and occlusion algorithms that omit the mesh entirely.
That said it definitely is still better to have more minimal meshes where possible, but whether that is worth the extra time cost is up to the devs because it's not actually that simple compared to bashing full models together

>>712705185
Triangles might not be the main bottleneck anymore, but pretending like they're completely free is cope. GPU memory bandwidth, vertex transforms, and cache misses still matter, especially when you’re stacking up thousands of useless tris inside geometry that’s never seen. It adds up. And depth pre-pass doesn’t magically save you from shit draw call planning or sloppy asset pipelines. Just because GPUs are dumb fast now doesn’t mean you throw optimization out the window like a Unity intern.

>>712705575
having things clip into each other is also garbage.
you can slap things together for the first draft but for the final environment you should go over the topology and optimize it while removing all clipping.
rocks do not clip IRL, they stack.

>>712700801 (OP)
one of the reason should be "because you can't bake destructible/modifiable environment".
But in 2025 fps still have doors and potted plants that resist rockets explosions.

>>712705824
>It adds up
With triangles it really doesn't, they're that cheap
If you took the FF7 remake or any other game and ran the static backgrounds through an optimizer that removed every non-visible triangle you would get like a 1% performance increase at most
And this is all assuming they aren't using occlusion culling which would mean that non-visible things would have literally no cost

>>712705843
>you should go over the topology and optimize it while removing all clipping.
Are you saying they should make a custom mesh every time something overlaps just to make it look a little bit nicer? Because that's retarded, every game has meshes clipping into each other, rocks and trees clip through the ground they're placed in

Mario Kart World has baked lighting. Which is doubly surprising because all the tracks have a day/evening/night cycle.

>>712705843
true but that is due to the artists not creating a bigger custom mesh, or using some kind of dynamic terrain system (displacement maps, meshgen etc), so the rock clipping issue would still be there even if they removed all the unseen triangles and compiled it all into one mesh.
so really the complaint should mostly be about artistic laziness/standards and not that there are too many obscured triangles because the hardware and engine techniques are far past that being a big issue compared to anything else

>>712706040
have a look at the starting line on acorn heights though, they werent completely thorough with the lightmap resolution. overall works well though

>>712700801 (OP)
It's probably nVidia approaching companies with piles of money.

>>712703343
Stop The Anti Semitism Now!

>>712704892
I think the devs were under the impression that raytracing + 50 projectiles on screen would make some pretty fireworks effect.
It should have, to be honest. The game is so dull.

>>712700801 (OP)
Why do you hate Indian devs? They are very much just as good

>>712704229
you can bake outdoor lighting, just dont be an unreal engine dev (lazy piece of shit, probably a jeet too)

>>712703343
baking lights on 4K renders would require you to have 32 or even 64 Gb of ram on the card.

>>712706214
You can but
a) it takes a lot of space because outdoor enviroments are large
b) you can't really notice any GI because it's nearly all sunlight
c) outdoor enviroments are full of foliage which moves

>>712701494
>Because everyone's PC and/or console has been able to handle realtime lighting for years now
what you see in the webm is baked in ray tracing, with the WHITE light from the light above the objects reflecting onto the colored walls to result in colored shadows below the objects
you can't seriously belive that everyone's PC and/or console has been able to handle THAT for years when enabling RT at the level of complexity and object density of current modern games results in games stuttering even on a fucking 5090(and "everyone's PC" is worse than that) and in consoles having to drop the internal resolution below 720p to then upscale it to 1440p or worse 4K resulting in noise and ghosting and still have bad performance which can only be mitigated with framegeneration which introduces more ghosting and artifacts

>>712706329
alternative is everyone has to wait 10-20 yrs for hardware to catch up so there are no artifacts. but the devs predictably will just do it now while its sorta becoming feasible, theres no way they would have decided otherwise

>>712703343
>why don't devs do this then?
because real time lighting allows them to be lazy with level design and lets them change things at the last second if they want to
imagine your level designer decides to remove one large box from a level which had several objects beside it in the shaded side of it, what does that mean for real time lighting? nothing, or very little, real time in engine lighting will adapt to removing it in a matter of seconds
but what if lighting is baked in? good, now you have to rebake all the shadows that were affected by that box, all the AO maps for all the several object that were beside that box, as well as potentially rebaking the environment AO map of the entire area.

this is what we mean when we say baking light takes skill, not cause the act itself of baking it takes any skill at all, the skill is in carefully placing all the objects how you want them, careful level design and decoration planning so that everyhing is as you want it to be, and locked in, no room for second guessing your work at the last minute.
but with real time lighting, you can change the entire decorations of an entire map in a few minutes and you can do that even a week before the game goes gold, when it would have taken more than a month with baked lighting

>>712700801 (OP)
Valve still does