Thread 713440741

Why does every action game nowadays need attack magnetism? Even Ninja Gaiden 4 has it.

>>713440741 (OP)
Not even Bayonetta 3 with its oversized arenas was this bad.

>>713440741 (OP)
Because Platinum is trash

>>713440741 (OP)
Holy shit that delimb animation is so bad.

>>713440741 (OP)
Awful

>>713440741 (OP)
>left-to-right swing
>raises the sword above his head into a vertical swing
>suddenly cuts into another left-to-right swing
what the fuck

>>713440741 (OP)
consequences of bamham's success

>>713440741 (OP)
If you're action game has small targets, your only two viable options for combat are magnetism or z targeting. MH has none of these but you're fighting giants monsters so its fine, otherwise every other game has elther lf the two

>>713440741 (OP)
Console players.

>>713440741 (OP)
what do you mean by magnetism
the targeting or the sliding

>>713440741 (OP)
It's fair play for enemies having the same.

>retards are mistaking basic momentum from attack for magnetism
this board is cooked
>>713440863
Dawg when it comes to disregarding spacing trannynetta has been a bigger offender than any bamham since the first game and it didn't even need magnetism for that.

>>713443686
>you're action
GOOD MORNING SAAR

>>713443875
The guys who were the first to be exposed to hack n slash action games like DMC and Ninja Gaiden? What about them?

>>713445164
Please answer his actual post instead of calling him brown while you yourself are BROWN AS FUCK too.

>>713445294
>Please answer his actual post
I'll do it once he improves his grammar.

>>713445020
you don't know what momentum means, esl avatarfag

>>713445590
>lowercase nigger
Call it movement then I don't care. I just woke up. Point is it's not magnetism.

Because games made for gamepad are dumb for dummies.

>>713443686
lmao no

>>713446536
Dark Souls doesn't have that.

>>713440741 (OP)
>miss 2 attacks in point blank
Where's magnet?

>>713446536
DMC (any) with M+KB is actually really freeing, especially if you rebind shoot to an additional mouse key on the side for charged shots. Plus the added benefit (when a part of the level allows it) of looser camera control.

>>713449903
DMC had really shitty MKB controls until the reboot.

>>713450843
4 is great for M+KB, literally makes guard flying, charged shots, judgement cut loops feel good. I would only meet you halfway and say both ports run well.

>>713440741 (OP)
So its not clunky as your old games, unc

>>713440741 (OP)
stellar blade doesn’t have dat

>>713440741 (OP)
Ninja gaiden always had attack magnetism. Its been casual from the start.

>>713449903
>>713451010
Found the perfect controller for you. No need for thanx

>>713451453
?

>>713451679
?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

>>713451960
YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO-OOOOOOOOOOOH

>>713452019
BACK FORWARD ATTACK ATTACK ATTACK (mash) STYLE BUTTON JUGGLE REV VROOM VROOM TRICKSTER (mash)

>>713452307
>implying accordions aren't based, and don't require high APM
What's the controller equivalent to an instrument? A symbol?

>>713452438
Controller is the baseline instrument that trannies think they're too good for. So I guess it needs more cowbell.

>>713443179
looks like a return to idle, then the player inputted another attack.

>>713452624
>baseline
So...the normalfag setup, got it.
>T-tranny!
Most troon runners are gamepad toddlers, anyone worth a shit speed running anything requiring M+KB is european and comfortable in their skin. Take that how you will.
>baseline instrument
So a Recorder, cause they blow.

>>713443686
DMC, Bayonetta, God Hand, old NG have none of that.

NG has soft lock-on but that is not the same as having the character zoom on skates to attack an enemey.

>>713445020
You prove yourself to be dumber and dumber every single thread. Avatar fagging itagaki + zoomer slang + retarded statements like that make me believe you're some 19 year old brown skin turd worlder

>>713453062
NG 3 changes roll to slide, so you quite literally spend most the game zooming to attack an enemy. It even staggers.

>>713452790
>Starts rattling off a bunch of garbage about troon running like it matters
*tips el le fedorarino*

Mr. Hardcore gamer.

Ur S-Ranks sirah??????

>>713453312
You have to be an actual retard to think having a literal slide move is the same as having basic attacks skate across the ground

>>713444074
>targeting
Players too dumb to use lock on systems, let alone decide when not to use them and aim at the space between enemies for collateral damage.
>sliding
Players too dumb to leverage separate movement options for offense, so now they must be built into the attacks themselves.

>>713453657
>Brings trannies in general out of no where
>>le
go back

We've already known this for a while
NG4 is a shit game for casuals

>>713453948
>Ohh nooooo if u keep paying attention to it the problem le grows le biggererer so just le ignore it xD

>>713454097
I don't even know what you're post-ironically kvetching about. I just know retards like you kept rageface-reddit talk alive.

>>713453062
I am 25 and white. Which part of the post buckbroke you?

>>713454234
>Catalog psy-opera plays stupid
Was wondering when you fags would ever join the conversation

>>713454362
>paranoid schizo speak
Yeah dude, I'm Barry, Eric and Todd Howard.

>>713454494
>Damage controlling psy opera wants the last word
*Yawn*

*Marks another internet win tally*

>25 years old
>wakes up and immediately goes to 4chan to avatarfag
>does this every single day of his life

>>713445020
what a dumb fucking nigger you are

/v/ in 2012 would be having a universal colossal fit over this but instead you have people either defending it, pretending it's not magnetism, or arguing about something else

>>713454724
*erases tally*
*puts finger in ass*
*draws dick-butt on your board*
*sniffs finger*
*Do 360 and moonwalks away*

>>713440741 (OP)
is this ff7r?

>>713454835
Yeah and now I am gonna play some NG. Living the boss life.

>>713456110
post your gameplay then

>>713457334
I am not playing in the normal sense atm, more like studying it. I've posted my gameplay in previous threads, not my problem you're new.

>>713458120
>n-no I wont post it b-because I posted it before h-haha
So you have no gameplay to post, that's exactly what I expected from a loser like you

>>713458120
You clear your 3RE OLB UN run?

>>713458324
fucking own that fraud, king

>>713440741 (OP)
>attacks where the character steps forward bad
>flying swallow where the character automatically flies through the air towards the nearest enemy while attacking good

NGB fans are the biggest poser faggots in gaming history.

>>713458876
Stop being disingenuous for once in your life

>>713451960
Still think this one looks pretty badass

>>713458969
reminder oatmeal cookie-san swore up and down that being able to control the camera in the original release of ninja gaiden would ruin the game and people who actually want to fucking see the enemies they're fighting in an action game are just suffering from a skill issue
then he added camera control in NGB anyway, then he made 1 other pretty good game (NG2) before literally never making a good game again as long as he's lived. if he's such a genius auteur game designer why did he make devils third lmao

>>713458876
>NG2 fans are the biggest poser faggots in gaming history.
Get it right next time.

>>713440741 (OP)
To appeal to casuals.

>>713458547
Yeah got it done yesterday. The part after the Cliff fight was the hardest in the run, I messed up so bad early on and had very little ki & health coming into the fights with claw fiends + alchemists and then sword alchemists + gorillas. Toughed it out in the end though, and then skipped the first wave of the imperfect goddesses. Had to get cheesy in the Canna's 1st phase but managed to do it with the sword in the end.

>>713459430
>skipped
with the true inferno I mean

>>713459430
Good fucking shit anon. How do you fight Cliff? He still gives me trouble.
>the first wave
Lol I don't blame you. That part is killer.

>>713459110
I did my entire first playthrough without knowing you could control the camera and never had a problem.

>>713459110
He's right that tard-wrangling the camera in an action game is not something you should have to do.

>>713459110
Ninja Gaidens camera is misunderstood, somehow. I played NG for the first time with NGB 5 years ago and it did not take me long at all to start using the camera recenter button to quickly and easily control the camera while fighting and it gave me no issues.

>>713459430
>No gameplay

>>713459430
Done already!? Sick, and doing phase 1 with the sword, mad respect, did it take you a lot of time/retries? Oh and I'd love to see your gane clear screen, this was mine for the no lifebar ext run (can't remember if I posted it in the thread we last talked)

>>713440741 (OP)
>Why does every action game nowadays need attack magnetism?
Neutral skip nigga

They dumbed down pretty much everything. In case nobody remembers in old games like Tomb Raider you had to jump almost perfectly or you would fall.
In modern games you don't even need to try everything is casualised.

>>713440741 (OP)
in ninja gaiden your attacks are automatically directed towards the nearest enemy, or whatever direction you hold the stick towards
imo it's a good system because you fight fluidly at a fast pace. a lockon is only suitable in slow games
perhaps there could be a hard mode where this is disabled entirely but I think it makes more sense to keep the controls the same and add stronger enemies to fight

>>713440741 (OP)
Literally unplayable.

>>713460457
>the camera recenter button
in literally every other 3D action game made after the year 2000, the button you press to refocus the camera to look at your next target "the lock on button" but ninja gaiden fans swear their game doesn't have and doesn't need one

>>713461048
>in ninja gaiden your attacks are automatically directed towards the nearest enemy
that's completely different from what's happening in the webm
that's called soft lock on, the webm is called magnetism
learn the difference

>>713440741 (OP)
>daintily falls over after having his leg cut off
lmao

>>713459842
Don't really have anything in particular as it's my least fought boss, I think I was just using XX>Y as the go to punish since it deals the most damage in that timeframe and recovers the fastest. He kinda looped himself a few times throughout the fight when he would do his light string, I'd counter it and then he would do it again a few more times, which did some decent damage as well.
>>713460535
it took less time than the gauntlets before goddesses. I already had a general idea of what to do so it was just a matter of sticking to the plan. I dont think I took a screenshot of the game clear screen but here's the clip of me opening the skill menu during the 2nd phase.

>>713440741 (OP)
It's just a huge Qol feature. The older games without it are kinda boring and need it desperately.

>>713461976
Salute

>>713462252
>Qol feature
More like "destroying the most fundamental part of any melee combat" feature. I don't need my games to be automatized.

>>713461234
>but ninja gaiden fans swear their game doesn't have and doesn't need one
Nice strawman but no one has ever said any of that

>>713459842
I'm this guy(>>713460535) and I have the following pointers for you: You can get away with punishing Cliff after every string he ends (you do need to gauge/learn his combos) with a almost full X/weak slash combo, I usually refrain from using the last hit. If he starts blocking at any point, I stop the string and slide out. You need to be always ready to cicada surge when he goes for his grab if you do this(and then punish with Y for the SoB), but if you master this style he'll be both very easy and incredibly fun! good luck!

>>713461976
I knew you were legit, but it's still nice to see. I'm curious, why did you buy the twin swords/lv2 and the wind blades?

>>713462805
I thought the most fundamental part of melee was combos or parry timings. Having your combo interrupted by an attack is fair since you fucked up. Having your combo stopped because some faggot enemy sits on the sidelines and refuses to run up to you is boring. Swooceing is fun.

>>713462823
literally two posts above the one you quoted genius >>713461048
>a lockon is only suitable in slow games

>>713451451
Compare vanilla NG2 to the remake. The difference is noticeable.

>>713462878
I didn't buy the level 2 dual swords, the upgrade icon is white to indicate its availability. The weapon itself is given to you in Day 5, it's unmissable. The upgraded windblades are really good, I went over it in >>713310301. Thought I was talking to you in that thread but apparently there's another 3RE enjoyer out there, which is nice.

>>713440741 (OP)
needs sf6 drive rush slime effect

>>713463891
Ratio fixed.

>>713440741 (OP)
Because Ninja Gaiden is trash

>>713464017
Fuck I am blind. Damn so I really have been sleeping on the windblades, yet another thing to try out in the next run, appreciate it!

>>713463631
I skimmed through your post and when you said lock on I was in the mind that you were referring to the center camera button when you said lock-on. That's my mistake and that's why I thought it was absurd to suggest people saying a recenter button doesn't exist.

Anyways. Yes, it's true, ninja gaiden does not have a real "lock-on" button and it definitely doesn't need one. Ninja gaiden has soft lock-on which has your attack face the direction of an enemy closest to the direction you're pressing. This is necessary for the game because of the speed and it's also why an actual lock-on button would not work because enemies would be moving around too much and there to be too many enemies on screen to make it work properly. This is a big part of what makes the game feel so fluid to people who actually understand how it works.

I remember there being a pretty good explanation + visual guide on how ninja gaidens soft lock-on works but I don't remember exactly where I saw it, might've been on lparchive

>>713465175
Found it. Also generally the best tutorial for ninja gaiden

https://lparchive.org/Ninja-Gaiden-Black-Sigma/Update%2015/

>>713440741 (OP)
It's looking better than Razor's Edge at least.

>>713440741 (OP)
This franchise died once Itagaki left. We won't ever get a good 3D game ever again. Maybe some hope for a 2D game.

>>713465617
not it in a million years

>>713466458
This looks fucking awful

>>713467351
poser

bump

>>713467351
Filtered

>>713466458
That's awful but ng4 looks worse somehow

>>713454008
probably worth mentioning this isn't present on either GoW's highest difficulty albeit.

>>713469649
high difficulty NG2 gameplay truly makes you feel like games never evolved past goomba stomping.

>>713469649
HOLY FUCKING KINOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!

Boomers don't want to admit this but Ninja Gaiden has long-since been surpassed by Nioh.

>>713443875
bingo

>>713443875
>>713446536
>>713474152
This makes no sense. Keyboards don’t have a magical ability to move your character faster than a joystick. Leave your insecurities at the door.

The real answer is simple: the Batman games did it and were immensely popular, so Japan copied them.

>>713474362
bamham games haven't been relevant in literally 10 years

>>713454008
There's no magnetism in the NG clip retard, just some fixed forward movement.

post how far they move while attacking when no enemies are present

>>713440741 (OP)
Because they are made for cucksoles with clunky ass cucktrollers that can't aim to save their fucking lives, and hence need to save the players from their own stupidity by dumbing the game down to kindergarten level

>>713443686
>z targeting.
Anyone who calls lock on z targeting is a retarded tendie who knows less than nothing about game design. No exceptions.

>>713440741 (OP)
Navigating in a 3D environment with 2D controllers is very complicated

>>713466458
>immediately starts with steel on bone
No thanks. I'm glad there's been no sign of that mechanic coming back.

>>713476729
and your webm proves that wrong how?

>>713453062
DMC has insane magnetism and basically auto lock on
bayo has magnetism out the wazoo and any movement snaps to enemies as well
god hand doesn't but that due its controls and movement.
old NG does not, you are correct

>>713474068
>by the same company
>the same studio
>with some of the games having the same directors
wtf are you talking about?
nioh 1 and NG3 are literally made by the same directors
nioh 2's director is also the director of NG4
even when itagaki was still at TN and in charge all of the people who went on to make nioh were high up in the company worked on NG2

its many of the same people who were always making the games still making them now

>>713477367
Still moving
>>713479223
You can see him whiff the starting hit in both clips, it wouldn't be possible with magnetism.

>>713480310
nta but the forward momentum from basic attack looks to be overtuned, almost like plat gave little to no shit about positioning

this looks way worse than the last ninja gaydens, did they fire the og devs?

>>713480310
This may be unrelated to magnetism, but with that much forward movement on the attack, shouldn't you be zipping past/through enemies if you initiate it while standing directly next to them? Or does the game decide that you've collided or are close enough to the target, and then cuts the forward movement short?

>>713481302
>shouldn't you be zipping past/through enemies if you initiate it while standing directly next to them?
Not him but there are several times when it does happen due to forward momentum and soft-lock messing up and the player ends going behind the target or locking-on to a different enemy by accident.

>>713479419
Post examples of magnetism in those games

>>713458876
I wish flying swallow did that. Instead it gets confused and makes you do the drop attack straight down since your slightly out of range or pointing slightly the wrong way.

>>713445020
>>retards are mistaking basic momentum from attack for magnetism
You cant blame them, the momentum in this game is so extremely overtuned that it just looks as if it was magnetism
In fact, its so strong that what makes excessive magnetism shitty is basically built-in

>>713445590
>>713453062
>>713454904
hes responding like a retard but hes unequivocally correct
Its not actual magnetism to the enemies, the attacks themselves just have retardly high forward movement

>>713440741 (OP)
are you sure that isnt that "boost forward" move every ninja gaiden has?

>>713482662
NG doesn't have that, closest thing is NG3 slide but that's intended to be a slide. Not magically skating along the ground

>>713481302
Isn't that just another form of magnetism? Not one that brings you closer to a target, but one that prevents you from pulling away or flying off course.

>>713482980
That delimb animation might be one of the worst things I've ever seen. It's insane how Team Ninja's animations from 2008 were so much better. They really were the best of the best back then.

>>713463371
>Parry timing is "combat" to zoomers
The consequences of Sekiro have been disasterous. No spacing and positioning, just tap the I win button to the beat. Red light, green light.

>>713482224
>go dig up your versions of them games
>setup to record them
>and then post it for me
>all before this thread dies
>or its not true
are you retarded?
if you haven't played them just say so.

>>713440741 (OP)
nigger ninja gaiden started that shit like 18 years ago.

>>713440741 (OP)
Every platinum games game has it. Mgr has it, bayonetta has it.
Lack of a good lock on sysyem requires auto aim and platinum games have a bad camera. Its basically a design to make the game feel more fluid.

>>713444074
The character moves towards a target that is far away.
In some cases dev make the character do a gap closer move so the player dashes onto the character

>>713483167
Their animations still are the best. I really really wish we knew the real reason team ninja isn't the lead and ONLY developers on this project. I am absolutely not buying the "oh we think platinum is a great fit, we don't believe we can do it!" because I unironically beleve Team Ninja can do it, there is no reason they can't unless you wanna believe the "le itagaki is the only reason NG is good" shit. They clearly love Ninja Gaiden and the director of Nioh who has gotten continuously promoted over and over has expressed wanting to bring NG back for YEARS and this is what they allow? I don't buy it man, I don't. Team Ninja could've hit it out of the park...or at the very least it would've been something that didn't feel like a complete betrayal to NG's legacy.

>>713483565
So you have no proof? Gotcha. If magnetism did exist then it would not be hard to look through gameplay footage online to find it and record it.

The main point is that I said those games don't have magnetism, your claim is that they do. There is no argument to be had without video proof. It's a lot easier to prove magnetism does exist than it doesn't. There's also the fact that your definition of "magnetism" might be completely off so that's why you need to show video proof of what you believe to be magnetism.

>darks souls becomes game of the year for over a decade straight
>people still don't understand why it was actually good

>>713482980
Yakumo seems to be missing a couple of frames in the slide animation, looks like Plat outsourced some of the work to india by the looks of things.

>>713484104
A big part of it is community, journalists, and the bamco marketing team making the souls series out to be some incredibly super hard difficult game and then later fromsoft fully realizing that consensus but purposefully making their games more difficult (read: unfair) because they believed that's the only reason people cared about their games.

I'm not quite sure where the waters got so muddled where people completely forgot about every other thing the souls series was praised for too tho, something that fromsoft themselves have forgot about as well.

>>713484268
It's called a bad animation, doesn't need to be outsourced for it to happen numbnuts.

>>713484083
>your claim is that they do
no, your claim is that they don't, you are the person claiming they don't have it in your initial post.
you about YOU post some proof since you demand it so? you are claiming they don't have it after all

any claim backed with no proof is just as easily dismissed with no proof, no proof, so your claim of no magnetism is bullshit off of that alone.
they have it, play the games instead of larping.

>>713484268
>>713484429
with how animations are done with interpolation between keyframes in engine its just a low fps video and potentially the game running at a lower fps making it even worse.

>>713484745
Not reading your post. Give me video proof of your claims or fuck off.

>>713448850
he was clearly sucked to target but missed the hitbox when the enemy was prone, the basic two hit attack is still terrible, the first or second chain in the combo should have been a vertical slice, you'd think platinum would playtest this and figure this out on their own

>>713485002
uhh dude clearly you're just meant use the big red stick!!!

RETVRN

>>713484919
>I can't defend my claims
I accept your concession

>>713485134
why are you quoting yourself

>>713445164
only americans mistake "your" and "you're", actually
which means he's white

>>713481302
>Or does the game decide that you've collided or are close enough to the target, and then cuts the forward movement short?
That, same as in the older games.

bump

>>713483894
I think it was probably Phil Spencer decision. Microsoft offered offered to fund development, but Team Ninja was too busy with SoP, Wo Long, RoTR.

>>713440741 (OP)
good question lemme ask you something is your mom still a bitch?

>>713441061
this