What am I in for, /v/?

the greatest space game ever made

>>714981838
fpbp
/thread

2D Warband in space

>>714981769 (OP)
don't forget to install the funny mod

>>714981769 (OP)
The greatest lie space satan ever told

>>714981769 (OP)
zigger trash

>>714981769 (OP)
Autiscally detailed game, good, if you can pass the shit combat and ass UI filter.

>>714981921
What's the funny mod, Anon?

>>714981838
How does it compare to Star Valor?

>>714981838
fpbp. I don't even play with mods and it's amazing.

>>714982151
rapesector

Xe/Xir

>>714981769 (OP)
how does it compare to x4 foundations

>>714982728
Don't/Care

Please steer clear of the modding sphere. You can easily sink 100+ hours into this game without touching a single mod.

The modding community is full of transsexuals.

>>714982864
...Can you not be transphobic for 10 seconds? Gosh.

>>714981769 (OP)
mountain blade warband in space
very fun battles
cool ships
weak lategame
With the sheer amount of mods there are you can easily put a thousand hours into it though, enjoy.

>>714983009
No

>>714982728

>>714982560
Being honest, was expecting a nazi faction.

>>714981769 (OP)
LET SHINE THE LIGHT OF LUDD

>>714982754
it's kinda different.
X4 has better universe simulation and economy
Starsector has better combat, great ship variety and more customization.
I like them both, if you like one of them, certainly give the other one a shot.

>>714981838
This.

>>714982864
This. At some point after playing with mods you will realise that most of them add nothing of value. I discarded practically all of them, starting even avoid my own setting edits.
Only recommended are speed up, portraits mod of choice anc maybe, maybe starpocalypse

>>714981769 (OP)
Tax evasion, but in space

Is it possible to go from game start to endgame main story complete with one ship only scavenging and upgrading with scavenged parts/ships?
All I want to do in space games is rip pieces off of derelicts and weld them to my ship until I'm an amalgamation of ill-fitting parts that create a far greater whole.

>>714984216
No. You can try play with one ship but there are limits.

>>714984216
you scrap derelicts for supplies and weapons or salvage them to pilot.

>>714984585
>>714984501
I suppose a scrap fleet is an acceptable compromise.

>>714985528
There's a skill dedicated to scrap fleets that makes ships cheaper to deploy the more busted they are, its very fun to use

>>714984216
>space hulk simulator

>>714981769 (OP)
The cultists will tell you its the best game ever, but it's actually really weak. The game appeals to math-obsessed minmaxer retards who think the point of any game is optimizing builds to efficiently beat the game easier and/or faster. They don't realize that playing this way means the game is over once you've optimized your character making there no challenge left. Usually that's when the minmaxer seeks out other games to repeat the process all over again. These people believe there is no other way possible to enjoy a video game.

Roleplaying is much funner, more creative, and rewarding. While I'm certainly not arguing one should completely avoid the math involved in building their character, it should never be the primary and/or sole emphasis. Judging the game on these merits it's quite weak. It boasts a "sandbox" type experience but the options are quite limited and most of the time you'll be flying around for long periods of time wondering if mowing your lawn would be more rewarding.

Install Superweapons. Find the manta ray. Nuke everything from stealth.

>>714986218
tl;dr I'm too casual to engage with real gameplay and just want to read event text all day

>>714986483
no

>>714981838
Space Mount and Blade

Honestly, I'd rather play Escape Velocity.

So is the modding scene still full of a trannies who put malware in their mods that brick your game if you play with other mods they don't like?

>>714981769 (OP)
>>714981838
This
Everything Star Citizen promised is what StarSector actually is and more

>>714981769 (OP)
A very shallow game despite being in development for more than 10 years and glacially slow "development" that is more like a cosmetic update to the game once a year that adds absolutely nothing of consequence.

The game's combat system is good, and then everything surrounding that combat system is total garbage. The game only remains fun for as long as you're problem solving fits and ships to more efficiently beat other fleets and once you've got something that works the fun drops off a cliff.

I can't recommend this game, not even mods save it because the tranny troons who mod this game just add more spaceships or similarly pointless and shallow mechanics. There's nothing that actually fleshes this game out where it needs it.

I rate starsector a 6.7 out of 10

>>714986218
Roleplaying and minmaxing are not opposed, in fact roleplaying and minmaxing are usualy most fun when done at the same time. Limitation breeds creativity, and a character with specific goals, ambitions, and scruples is a great way to limit yourself in a fun way.

You don't really roleplay, you craft hamfisted characters and stories that conform to known metas. You use roleplay as an excuse to not learn, or enjoy, the games you play.

>>714989121
>The game only remains fun for as long as you're engaging with the core gameplay loop
wow! insight!

>>714989121
Exactly my feelings on it, anon, but its more like a 6/10 for me.

>>714989229
Personally I think it's more of a 3/5

It is one of those games that looks deep but is in fact very shallow. The only fun part is combat which still gets boring after some time

>he uses Nexerelin
gay gay homosexual gay gay

>>714989415
I won't play through your boring story Alex.

>>714984216
Entirely possible except the one ship part. Salvage runs are great. Loot the fuck out of whatever you find and don't buy anything except supplies and fuel. You end up with some wacky fleets which is fun.

>fuel tankers full of antimatter fuel don't explode into a screen-wide instant-kill nuke

TOTAL
HEGEMONKEY
DEATH

>>714981769 (OP)
one of the best mech games I've ever played

>>714989986
I don't imagine the ai could handle ship explosions dealing damage, they have a hard enough time keeping their distance as it is.

I'm sure it's an idea alex has had before, the pather prometheus is proof enough of that

>>714982864
The only mod you really need is speedup because the vanilla game is unbearably slow.

sseth's key still work?

>>714986218
This. The general progression is fucked and its very easy jump to end game skipping most of the game.
Alex either seem to be not aware or do not care

>>714988946
Yes and no. Alex manned up and fixed malware problem. Still, most mods are bloatware so not much was gain.

>>714989121
Eh, if you play with self challenge rules and some slight modding its easily 8/10. But I agree with setniment.

>>714993314
Yes.

>>714989312
Why rank it so much lower than him?

>>714981769 (OP)
Fun naval combat pretending to be space combat. Still a fun game, albeit with a shallow global layer.

>>714984216
It's not a game where you rip pieces off derelicts and weld them to your ship.
It's a game where you weld the derelicts back together until you have a horrifying fleet of barely functional scrap.

>>714981769 (OP)
modding community drama because those fucking subhumans can't help it.

>>714981838
>>714981769 (OP)
>cant retry battle if the AI has a sudden bout of full retardation so mandatory quick save b4 every battle
>have to manually press the keybutton to activate auto pilot every fucking time
The exprience is fresh when you first try it but once the honeymoon wears out. You will grow tired fast
I dont even know why the faggotdev havent implement simple
QoL feautures after like what? 10+ years

>>714994651
I wish I could see the faces of the men I force to crew my fleet of deathtraps.

>>714981769 (OP)
A very good space mount and blade. The combat is good and fun and the strategy layer does a good job of supporting it and making the combat meaningful and decently diverse.
It's also near unique in properly giving you a good framework to prepare for an expedition, go exploring, find neat stuff, then return and try to exploit the neat stuff you found. It seems simple and dumb but there's very few games that have the systems in place to make all of those elements feel meaningful, space or otherwise.

>>714994709
Having to push a button to initiate autopilot might be the most bitch complaint I've ever heard.

>>714994709
There is so much content in mods that you'll never run out of fresh content even if Vanilla becomes boring

>>714983434

>>714995269
Yeah now try doing x100000 times gayretard. I have probably played this game more than you before i uninstalled it

>>714995446
If you have played a game enough that your complaint is the game not playing itself enough you should probably stop you inbred fucking retard.

>>714989121
>that adds absolutely nothing of consequence.
THREAT and Nightmare demons are fun

>>714995550
I play it like a rts you fucking nigger. Kys.
Im not wasting anymore time explaining to low temp iq monkey

>sensor ghost appears

>>714995724
You play it like a faggot, nigger.
You are literally bitching about a game not playing itself, you have no room to call anyone low IQ.

>>714981769 (OP)
you need autism to fully enjoy starsector

>>714995550
not him but not automating any process the player's going to be doing hundreds if not thousands or tens of thousands of times, when it's something that easily could be automated, is always a legitimate flaw that should be criticized so devs correct it in future
it's like having to hold a run button in a game where you're running 95% of your playtime, it just shouldn't have a run button

Make sure to respond to distress beacons without delay.

>>714995882
This isn't a run button, it's a fucking autopilot. The game shouldn't automatically take control away from because the idea of ever because you stop wanting to after hundreds of hours.

>>714995749
They're all still way too easy to fall for, be it the giant ones that move way too fast for their size or the little ones that move in completely nonsensical patterns.

The ones that harass you are annoying until you realize you can shoo them away with a pulse of your own.

>>714996004
too obvious to fall for, rather

>>714995882
Should the game automate giving your fleet orders too? You certainly do that hundreds of times as well.

>>714995986
and why shouldn't the game have an automatic autopilot button, if a player's going to be engaging it hundreds or thousands of times, why not, it's something that would take the devs thirty seconds to make

>>714996229
i do think every game where there's a chance you'll be giving the same command repeatedly should let you set an automatic default command that executes unless you override it, like the gambit system, yes

The funniest part is you can simply not deploy your flagship and not have to bother in the first place.

MIDLINE BEST LINE

>>714996438
just play distant worlds at that point

>>714996505
That's what this guy seems to want anyway.

>>714996483
frontline of low tech cannon fodder wrecks followed by midline cleanup is my go-to

Let's discuss how updates have made this game far worse and how much drama there is between modders.

>>714996993
Lets not for once.

>>714996993
I only play vanilla, as Ludd intended.

>>714995630
So what's the endgame at this point? Yeah the abyss is scary and all, but even then the THREAT and abyssal demons don't try to venture into the actual civilized parts of the Persean sector proper. Some gates gets activated at the end of the main Galatia Academy storyline, but then what? There's so many flags for certain choices you make during all these quests, but none of them really have any lasting impact beyond the crisis resolutions giving your colonies better bonuses.

>>714996993
no
let's discuss THIS instead

>>714997874
The only media this has ever been cool in is ZoE/2, Macross/Plus and LoGH, every single other thing with space robots is terrible. ESPECIALLY gundam.

>>714996993
every starsector thread i've seen has died from this

>ruins literally everything in you're path
Give me one reason why Eochu Bres shouldn't be glassed in every playthrough.

>>714998086
logh doesn't have mechs you fraud

>>714997874
I don't like to sound like a fun vacuum but shit like this never fit in at all and I don't get people forcing mechs and more into the game when they clearly just do not fit. The most advanced jet systems in the game are on an uptuned shuttle, and low tech shit like that is not by any means or even remotely practice mobile. It doesn't even have some mid tech aesthetics for some Conquest like systems or an eagle, no, it has to break the entire aetshetic of the game for the sake of being some obscure reference material from a series that only survives due to figurine sales and genuinely barely functioning autistic people into it.

They're not even fucking trying man, I'm sorry, its fucking wasted effort. Call me when you have a faction that's at least a little more cohesive and some not literally just mechsuits in a setting that doesn't have them, or at the very least make them fucking setting apropriate-ish. Get some generic scrappier shit with low-med tech for balistics, or some actually high tech blue for lasers and shit.

>>714998546
I can buy cheap drugs there and sell them to pathers and pirates CIA style.

>>714998546
Because Kazeron gets the nukes first

>>714998546
Is reopening the gates a reason?

What the hell are the point of mid-tech ships. They're like the worst of both low-tech and high-tech combined in a single ship.

>>714999624
Maneuverability-maxxing with a broadside Conquest setup.

>>714997874
kino

>>714999624
Some of the newer midline ships are alright. The original concept is kinda weird and does not really work very well, you can try beating the fall of Mayasura mission in the main menu ("the last hurrah") to see what alex wanted you to do with midline.

>>714998556
Their melee suits are powered armor, technically making them space robots.

>>714986218
First playthrough is really nice simply because you don't know what to expect and the exploration is cool.
The pacing of the games is garbage and can easily be fixed but the dev won't do it.

>best faction soundtrack in you are path

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q36z94LRfps

Beam missiles!
Absolute cancer, who the fuck think its even fun?

>>715000412
Hey at least midline faction fleets are not a complete joke anymore

It's just alright.

>>714997874
cringe

>>714993539
>Alex either seem to be not aware or do not care
It's over, game is almost 1.0. There won't be any significant changes.
Would have been absolute 10/10 if the story and roleplaying element was done by someone who can write and is not retarded fag.

>>715000237
Those aren't mechs or robots you little nigger and you know it

>>715000782
>game is almost 1.0
*laughs in version .0989t RC69

>>714999624
Eagles can outrange and outmaneuver most ships and still output good damage with hypervelocities and be harassing machines
Champions are tough tanky line holders that can really do a lot without much investment, they work great with an auto pulse
Pegasus allows pretty much a perfect domination of the field with a ton of ballistics and missile spam with ok shields, its kinda retard proof
Herons are pretty good fighter ships with little to no issues to them whatsoever
Gryphons permit a fuckload of missile support for basically no real cost so even the mildest of mid equips lets you have a lot more decisive victories
Hammerheads are just good
The one military ship is alright

>>715000985
>Hammerheads are just good
I found them fragile as hell whose only real use are Safety Override builds.

The AI/System/Competitors not really functioning on any common sense, economy, or resource. Is such a drag. Even the overspace/map or whatever is full of immersion breaking stuff that pulls me out of the game everytime.

Here I am avoid hazards, paying fuel costs, supply costs, and eating tons of losses.
My competitors are bravely flying into storms, bouncing off the sun, creating more ships for free when you aren't looking and just summoning an endless supply of whatever it needs to exist for the next minute for the player to see. It's all just too fuckin GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY. Everyone gets to break or ignore the rules and do whatever it wants for free, while the player exists as the last human on earth paying taxes on everything and getting constantly fucked in the ass.

The late game is also abysmal and rapid devolves into what I can only describe as an annoyance simulator, or a brave test of someones patience. As every faction in the game relentlessly bombards you with infinity attacks and infinity demands from the player that they most pointlessly meet for eternity.

I don't know.
Whatever.
It's fun for a bit, but fuck this game entirely at the end of the day.

>>714995882
>it's like having to hold a run button in a game where you're running 95% of your playtime
no it's like having to hit a sprint key once to start running which many games have in addition to a hold to sprint option. your analogy is disingenuous

I got 30 hours into the game, started a colony and then immediately stopped having fun.

>>715001171
You need to unretard them with some decent weapons, railguns and a decent officer with some hardened shield mods makes them surprisingly alright
>>715001252
You couldn't make it any more obvious you haven't played it in the last 4 months.

>>715001252
reddit

>>714999624
Eagle, Falcon, Gryphon, Sunder (for the player), and Hammerhead are good, the rest I don't care for.

>>715001289
it wasn't an analogy it was an example

>>714993539
The point of the game is the space combat. The campaign is just a sandbox for space combat to happen in.

>>715001512
Is that a problem? Should I be returning to this unfair bullshit every month and trying it? What's changed in the last 4 months. Cause I probably touched it in 5. I'm on 0.98a-RC5.

>>715001498
Sounds about right.

>>714998645

>>715001760
Anon, if you're actually getting raided every single month somehow as a colony, you're actually either playing pre rework of the system or you're just kinda colonizing in the most dangerous ass possible location in existence with 0 hampering protocols like just having a high command which reduces your global threat or the like 4 different ways to stop raiding and general issues. So yeah, you should try to go back because your talk feels like infinite pirate station old shit rather than the new somehow.
>>715001908
Yes, if you're going to have fun, make it well.

>>715001849
I was kinda hoping that starting a colony would allow me to gain a passive income which would allow me to do all the things I was doing in order to amass the capital I needed to start a colony at a much larger scale. Larger fleet, larger battles, deeper exploration, all that stuff. But I had to dedicate all of my time to running the colony just to get it to break even.

I probably wasn't doing something right or optimally but I didn't really feel like looking up some guide on how to exploit something.

>>715002116
>not allowed to have fun if it doesn't completely satisfy some faggot's autism
I don't think so.
And by the way, the mech from that one gif is painfully rare. The vast majority of ones that you encounter naturally (which is still incredibly rare) are basically just some sort of slightly modified pre-existing frigate (such as a Brawler or Vigilance) role-wise that more-or-less fits with a vanilla fleet aesthetic-wise, if we go by Low-Mid-High Tech coloring.

>>715001252
yeah other factions just pulling massive fleets surpassing old Hege AI inspectors out of their ass just to bully you is kinda stupid.

>>714997874
I only use ArmaA for the Wing Commander stuff.

>>715002959
Ah yes, the eternal modder fallback, the "rarity" where they also make busted setting breaking bullshit and then claim its super fine because its super rare where it then ends up in the nexerelin store where everything rare is super common and with a minimal price hike.

I don't want to be a negative nancy, but this shit's a disc that's been spinning for over 8 years, it's a repeating pattern. People gotta learn to do this shit right eventually, the most high tech wings are basically mini strike groups, and even if what you're syaing is true as some modifications, well congrats you're also putting shit like legs and useless dangly bits on a normal ass ship, I got no clue why you'd do that in general, or magically have super rare mega cool mechs.

You wanna know what's rare in this game on the default? The Anubis and the Apogee. You might make the argument the Anubis is a hyperweapon but man, we all know it ain't against basically any ship fleet worth a shit, and modderns doing this self asshole licking about rarity gets really old when its often an excuse to inflate numbers like a US economist.

>>715003447
Based

>>715002771
>I probably wasn't doing something right or optimally but I didn't really feel like looking up some guide on how to exploit something.
There is just no point of having colonies (except that I just like the idea of them and they add some more gameplay), they suck too much money when you are noob and they give too much money when you know what you are doing. But the problem is that they provide pretty much nothing, you have to babysit them for nothing.
Would have been cool if industry three was balanced around them with allowing you to have stuff like 3rd S mod and some small improvements for your ships that you produced if you have good colony with industry.
Terraforming is a must for autists like me who just need the perfect planet.

modders should make grappler ships like in outlaw star since that's what their actual mechs end up playing like anyway

>>714983252
in a way nearly every faction is the nazi faction.
just in different ways.

the truest test for how a faction really is, is to see what they do when you give them things.
like AI cores.
Even the full on luddite jihadists will scramble to install AI cores in their stations, which is hilarious.
>its a necessary evil!

>>715003447
>I got no clue why you'd do that in general, or magically have super rare mega cool mechs.
because people want to fly "super rare mega cool mechs" dumbass, simple as. no need for a hyper-deep justification.
you sound like one of those insufferable fags who keep comparing mechs to tanks because of realism or whatever the fuck

>>714982864
I fully disagree.
you can mod the shit out of it and avoid dealing with any faggotry.

>>714985528
I once made a "miners union" that was mostly a growing horde of cheap mining ships I got as scrap. I chose one model and would just keep acquiring more from combat and fixing them up.
I would descend upon a planet or gas giant like a swarm of locusts and strip mine most of its resources in one go, selling them to fuel my horde.
My miners were ONLY equipped with mining weapons in a simple combo I have forgotten that maximized income.

In fights we would simply charge the enemy.
I always pretended there were generous death benefits in the Union.

>>714981769 (OP)
Fun.

Be careful of not starting/increasing the capabilities of colony too early. The colony crisis mechanics mean that you are committing to babysitting your colony for awhile and being able to resolve them.

I recommend sticking to farming, mining, light industry only for awhile, maybe forever for your first planet. Dealing with luddics is one of the easier resolutions.

>>715003989
If you can't even try and justify it then yeah its pretty retarded. I like mechs and tanks both, but I consider mechs best as heavy cavalry, which is pretty good given they're not meant to be the average line, that's the ships and infantry and more. If you make a phase coil mech, an assassin one, or a flanking side sniper, or wings of smaller ones meant to be hyper specialized ones to synch with others (while following technological limitations) you're operating with the mechs as a purpose and right within the setting, making them the line is just self masturbatory "I want a mod of women anally pounding my ass because I want them" without a deep justification. In fact, without any justification at all.

You don't get that being pro everything isn't as glorious as you thin, that's how we have stat inflationist, mega frigate slop, anime waifus up your asshole, power creep galore and 0 aesthetic cohesion or balance and then grudgecode. If you have no standards for making even Mechs good, then all you're getting is the most subpar product you could ever ask for and then being glad you have that horrid shit.

Have some standards for yourself and for the sake of everyone else, will you. The average mecha fag is already an obnoxious retard, at the very least ask for a mod that is done right rather than as an exercise in pogging out because of eastern reference humour where you recognise the cool mech from the one show. Its cringe inducing when you guys claim to be enlightened and then jack yourselves off to shit like one of the twelve hundred branches of Gundam being a painjob option, its like a toddler hyped up because his two favorite shows did a crossover.

>>715004638
>If you make a phase coil mech, an assassin one, or a flanking side sniper, or wings of smaller ones meant to be hyper specialized ones to synch with others (while following technological limitations)
nta but I'm pretty sure the majority of the mechs in that mod are literally that.

>>715004924
If so, good then, I'm glad for it as long as it is operating within relatively normal weapon stat parameters and generally isn't an excuse to have a faction have absolute ship superiority because the creator pogged out with his favorite media franchise. I doubt that's the case, but if it is legit then wonderful, and a pox upon every single other mech that isn't basically that then or operates as some kind of mega line holder or other jacking themselves off situation.

>>715001512
Not him but I found pather base in black hold with few pather fleets blazing around this. I do not need npc play with the same rules but make it at last believable ffs.
And no matter if he playin last four months or not he is sadly righy.

>>715001701
So it fail even that then. Combat really become less fun.

can you faggots at least learn english before posting

>>715006478
kek

>>715006478
No

>>715006478
you are of bitch posting not, subhuman

>>715001685
it actually was an analogy and your second post was something called pedantry (in addition to just being incorrect). the fact that that was all you could muster in response is a concession in itself though so whatever

>>715000237
This is no zaku boy, no zaku.

Gonna ask Alex for always on auto pilot button or option.

>>715006296
So you're telling me the radical zealot terrorists who exist on the verges of society and are majority tithe seeking bandits doing drugs and more don't bend their own code, have capital at all despite raiding commerce and extorting plenty of people while having also the sneaky support opf the church can't have a fleet when they have a patrol center, which you too can have.

Anon that's the point. You're very fucking clearly the exact same poster, your lying is dogshit, but that's exactly the same mechanics as the player. If your base was there and with a patrol sending building your ass would have patrols near a black hole too.

>>714996993

OK I'll bite. How have the updates made the game worse? Especially the last one that has added a bunch of endgame threats that the game was sorely needing.

>>715009463
>men with rifles have cocky smiles shooting at turns in power armor
>shots bounce off
>still grinning until an axe is buried in their head
Are they high or retarded? Serious question.

>>715010969
They're Earth Cultists, so both.

>>715010527
Not that asshole but the basic AI of ships used to be a lot more competent. It capitalized on high flux enemies, it backed off when needed.

Now it just often floats at the edge of weapons range with their dick in their hand, or the complete opposite and charge head first into an onslaughts frontal guns.

When's 1.0?

>>715009506
>Gonna ask Alex for always on auto pilot button or option.
did you press U?

Tried the game like a year or two ago. Should I get back into it?

>>715011518
sure

Salvaged fleets are actually completely broken lol You pay a fraction of what a real fleet pays in logistics, and you get to deploy way more shit in the battle and to top it off, losses mean nothing for you since at most it means your ship you lost is now cheaper to field in the next battle.

Is this a starsector sci op? Never hear shit about this game, then all of a sudden a thread pops up with everyone deep throating it

>>715012425
>am I a newfag?
>no it's everyone else who is wrong

>>714984216
You want Cosmoteer instead, which is pretty much exactly as you described.

>>715010969
They were jacked on stims, this was depicting the last stand of a violent terrorist cult and a government kill squad coming to clean them up.

Blue(and white) fren balls

>>714996993
I still hadn't gotten over the downgrades to carrier based fleets that came post 0.6. I missed craft being their own units instead of retarded flying blobs that only vaguely follow your commands and sometimes not at all.

>>715012425
starsector is a /v/ core game

>>715010969
Both.
https://files.catbox.moe/mszr7r.webm
https://files.catbox.moe/9z03kt.webm

I wish the Core Systems was like twice the size and that wars and missions had more character. Do favors and rub shoulders with Hegemony Politicians or Tri-Tachyon Board Members.

I really don't care about exploration I just like Space Battles and Missions

>>714995724
>RTS
Why? You give your other ships general orders they try to fulfill but you should always pilot your own ship. This isn't a starcraft 2 clickfest simulator.

>>715013339
Man, LOGH was so fucking good.

>>714995724
I like the concept but generally think the game doesn't serve that idea very well. As an RTS the game behaves rather clunky even if your ships are generally bright enough to do well with general orders.

Are there any particularly good mods for feeling more like an admiral directing the fleet instead of just your specific ship?

>>715012425
go back.

>>715014218
Starsector definitely cannot function as an RTS game, Alex made his intent pretty clear early on, that command points were strictly limited and were meant to only serve as a "general framework of orders" and not as something that allows you to micromanage your fleet. The onus will always be on the player ship, at most what you should expect from your fleet is to hold the line or run interference.

>>714995724
>I play it like a rts
You're either very good or very bad at video games.

>>715014004
I wish starsector combat was less flux-based and more like this. The lasers in SS are so piss weak.

>>715013339
why are those ships suffering from epilepsy

>>715014553
Phase lances not going through frigates is definitely something that the game lacks. Lasers are good in low tech environment, but shields completely ruin the lethality of space combat in SS.

>>715014739
DIVE DIVE DIVE HIT YOUR BURNERS PILOT
>fs2 trauma intensifies

Half baked game with no endgame because devs started relying on mods for content.
Alright build autism doe

>>715014387
I get that but Personally I think it seems like a counter intuitive design. A few of the game's features are like that. If you wanted everything to hinge on one specific ship in a fight, why make fleet composition Fleet based instead of focusing on relatively much smaller numbers, like PIRATES! or HighFleet.

Similarly If you wanted to focus on exploring and colonizing parts of space across the whole of the Sector instead of focusing on Faction Wars, then why not space out the major factions so that exploration becomes a natural extension of the player getting involved in their interactions with each other?

how do I git gud at combat

>>715014994
IIRC this shit started as him posting just animations of space combat on a chan spinoff and he didn't plan it out well leaving a lot of code debt. Might've been tgchan.
It just kinda spiraled

*Mogs your colony*

>>715015176
I too can use mods to give myself OP shit.

Man, I just want rapesector to update.
It makes so many mods playable.

>>715015075
Learn to not use shift. It's a crutch.

I wish it was possible to send raiding/invasion forces to other faction planets/regions once your colonies become sufficiently powerful.

>>715015318
that is in fact the least profitable Tri-Tachyon base.

Game manages to scratch the exact same itch as M&B Warband once you have your fleet set up.
Zooming in and watching dozens of fighters fly in while your point defense go crazy, with hundreds of missiles launching as your capitals start blasting their payloads is on par with archer/crossbow formations supported by sweeping cavalry.
I almost feel bad that i've never actually bought the game and just used that one key forever.

>>714984216
Lets say you supposedly scavenge a derelict legion/onslaught
You still will get crushed by 30 wolves

>>715015075
swap the keybinds for turning and strafing

>>714986218
Haha I beat the game with only grendel

>>715015176
>mods
Not canon
Go play ur fanfic somewhere else

2.5D space naval strategy game with a surprisingly functional economy, lots of shit to explore, and where you slowly go from a small piss shit fleet held together with ducktape to the single most powerful fleet in the entire system.
Its amazing, and despite being made for over 10 years, its been done by barely a couple of guys, with the ocassional artist getting comissioned for artwork and soundtracks.
Also, enough mods to last for the entire development of the game. Just be careful, recently some retards started to post mods with Malware. Hopefully thats resolved already.

>>714993314
They won't patch that ever, based dev

>>715016073
>2.5D
How is SS not a 2D game? U retarded?

>>715016073
that was resolved years ago

>>715002771
>>715003646
The trick is to have a single colony with a decent industry and smuggle/explore/bounty hunt until you save up roughly 10 million credits, then you should have enough to instantly plop down good colonies in self-sufficient star systems and beeline defenses before other factions decide to kick your teeth in.

>>715016303
also remember to not use AI cores right away unless you want the Hegemony up your ass with their infinite supply of inspection groups violating your star systems with 0 way of defending yourself diplomatically.

>>714984216
Its insane, but it is possible with the right upgrades, story point alocations, and lots and lots of sweat. Especially when you start needing some practical stuff for long range travel such as fuel.
You will be likely getting your shit kicked in, too.
A lot.
Be mindful, im taking in consideration that the Academy's main storyline up to when you eventually get into some issues with Baird as the main campaign.
If you go for anything else, you will likely get destroyed.

>>715016473
just bribe them bwo

>>715012525
The problem of Cosmoteer is that it's as wide as an ocean but as deep as a puddle. And you can't make cool but functional ships in it. You have to choose.

>>715016562
Theres unscheduled ones that harass you and your traders/patrols for inspections, who those cocksuckers think they are? it's my star system and they're blatantly trespassing, I should be able to gun them down in self defense but no, apparently I'm the asshole.

>>715016169
Anon, im going to blow your mind.
>Go to random planet
>Wait until you got the image of the planet rotating in your screen.
>Now spin it
Congratulations.
You just now realized that the planets in the game are not a bunch of circular gifs.
They are not planes, they are objects.
Thats right, anon. The planets aren't flat. They are spherical.

>>714981769 (OP)
Cool shipbuilding, but the combat may as well be an autobattler, and the missions get old. I prefer Starcom Nexus, where you only control 1 ship that you can build in any way you like.

>>715016303
money is never problem once you figure out the game, the problem is how little stuff is here to be done with colonies.
Actually money are problem because at some point you get so much you can't spend them on meaningful stuff.
The game has a lot of potential, too bad it has to be realised through mods.

>>715014553
Lasers in general seem really weak compared to pure ballistics. It doesn't help that Ballistic Mastery is so much better than Energy weaponry mastery that it hurts. Even a mod ship that had like 15 small laser mounts, all tac lasers, felt like they barely tickled even cruisers ffs

>>715019389
I wish everything was Missile Spam. I love missiles. I love point defence spazzing out to stop missiles. I love salvos of explosives slamming into the side of a Capital in flux. I love seeing frigates spin wildly out of control after getting their engine clipped just to sail into the loving arms of a Torpedo meant for something else.

>>715019389
Graviton beams and tac lasers could definitely use a little more damage.

Lots of beams are great though. Phase, ion, tach, paladin are all really, really strong, easily boasting absurd ranges. They're so good that [redacted] beam weapons are only slightly better.

>>715016742
You can. You take barely any rep loss for killing unofficial raiders.

>>715009463
LoGH always waiting to spring the surprise ultraviolence on you after a dozen episodes of people talking at eacher ohter

How do I get into high tech ships? Only 2 high tech ships I use is Apogee and Paragon.

>space exploration game
>look inside
>it's 2D

>>715020390
You don't.

Reject high tech, embrace the wisdom of Ludd.

>>715020764
I really wish the game let you go full Pather and made a point of you stealing Pre-Fall tech from other factions and crusading against AI Systems

>>715020883
I mean after the main quest there's nothing to do. A handful of sidequests, make a colony if you want. The game's still fun but I do hunger for more story stuff. Jaydee Piracy and Knights of Ludd have some very broken shit, but the extra side content having some story made me devour it like a ravenous wolf.

Hell, even a mod that adds airheaded submissive foxgirls with petting mechanics has more content than some of the sidequests.

>>715020390
Stack shield buffs (Hardened Shields, s-modded Stabilized Shields) to make your ships unkillable bricks.
Getting as close as you can get to 360 degree shield coverage helps a lot with fast ships like Wolves, Tempests, and Auroras.
Safety Overrides Aurora and Fury can shit on most things.

>>715020491
No expense was spared.

I like to disable my spaceport, intentionally have the luddic church take over 1 of my colonies and just raid it a bunch and occasionally selling supplies to it

>>714997874
this is retarded

>>715020491
name one 3D space game that isn't half baked shit.

>>714982728
Is there an actual confirmation of him being an enby tranny either ingame or by one of the developers, or is it just because one of the retards (probably Alex) forgot to add his sex in the code and the discord parasites ran with it?

>>714986218
You got better recommendations?
No, seriously. I like immersive sandboxes to wander in, I'll take your directions if you have them.

>>715026071
No confirmation at all, he's just only ever referred to by name ingame so no pronouns are used. It's unclear whether that's deliberate or just how the dialogue happened to end up.

>>714986218
I've never played the game like that. I just installed ALL of the mods, except for the ones made by the fucking deranged forum leftists and then had massive space battles.

>>715026275
Try X-universe games, like X-3 or X-4. Although those games actually are German math space autism.

>>714989121
>Planet A exports ore to Planet B
>It does so via an actual physical trade fleet that travels between the two
>You can destroy the fleet
>Planet B will end up not having the ore delivered
>Planet B will not be able to make metal alloys because it has no ore as it wasn't delivered by the trade fleet you sacked
>Planet B has no alloys on the market and is desperate for an import, thus giving extra money for any ore sold there
>The more ore you sell - the more stable the market becomes, thus lowering prices eventually until it's fully stable
If this is shallow, I want to see your deep.

>>715026458
>Although those games actually are German math space autism.
Then why are you recommending them to someone looking to be immersed in a space-themed roleplaying experience?
>>715026370
So just like before, then. I figured with the direction the game has been going Alex would confirm it by now. It's good to know that he hasn't. It'll be a dealbreaker for me if that ever happens.

>>715026978
Because they are rather immersive, when you actually start to understand the world, its rules and begin to play around them? It's one of the best games for simulation of a military-industrial conmplex CEO mindset.

>>715015430
you can do this in nexarelin

>>715027104
>It's actually immersive if you're a soulless automaton who immerses himself in math problems
Please stop having opinions for as long as you remain autistic. Last (you).

>>715025043
FTL
Star Control 2
Starflight 1-2
Freespace 1-2

You got me on Freelancer though, Chris Roberts sucks.

>>714997838
For now. Obviously we are missing the last or last 2 acts of the story that will climax with using the Hypershunt and attempting to re-esthablish contact with the Dominion. Then we will get some final boss to decide the fate of the sector.

>tfw the Ssethtide was almost six years ago
>most interesting mods from the Ssethtide and post-Ssethtide era are dead
A moment of silence for all the good mods abandoned and forgotten

>>715003941
They don't, you're playing with some shitty modded factions or a really old version before it's patch.

>>715014218
>>715014387
Grab a Kite (s), install Operations centre and S mod it then park on as many command points as possible and you should have enough to play as an RTS. Remember that you don't have to micro your ships, they understand target priority and self preservation IF YOU GIVE THEM THE RIGHT ORDERS.

>>715029060
Doesn't command center scale with ship size? Does a kite really give much of a benefit?

>>715016709
You can absolutely make cool ships. The problem is that the WH40k style of human powered logistics means it's better off to isolate sections of the ship and make >50% of it Armor and empty space. It's fine for making ships that look great on the outside but the inside is completely unintuitive.

>>714981769 (OP)
>bluesky
lol

>>714981769 (OP)
dont download any ship or weapon mods they're all gay and overpowered

>>715029249
https://starsector.fandom.com/wiki/Command_Points
No, it doesn't scale with ship size and the point of the kite s is so that it doesn't take up DP meant for actual combat ships when it's DP is sacrificed for Ops Centre.

>>715028563
There better be multiple endings that actually indicate the consequences of the player's actions. Faction-specific endings that get affected by faction quests would almost make me forgive Alex of all this waiting and modfag dramashit that's plagued Starsector for years
>luddic church or luddic path ending
>changes based on triggers in the knight errant and false idols quests and whether jethro returns safely, sedge lives or dies by your hands, giving the planet killer to the path
>sindrian diktat ending
>continuing the status quo of pretending the lion isn't a vegetable OR
>install dolos, oxana, or horacio as the new lion and it changes how the diktat continues to function OR
>make them all consume each other and seize power as the new lion yourself
>persean league
>a lot of what happens in the main academy questline and your personal colony crisis resolution with them will determine their fate as a power in the sector
>choice of turbo embarrassing the reynard hannon from said crisis resolution or embarrassing the yaribay family through multiple instances in the academy quest and false idols quest
>supporting or going against reconciliation with the hegemony
Maybe I'm spoiled by how New Vegas did faction endings and crpgs in general but fuck man, there's a lot of potential for what Starsector already has. There just needs to be an update that's solely dedicated to fleshing this out instead of all this balance/rework/QOL stuff.

>>715028563
>>715029925
Also forgot to mention
>what happens to the player if you decided to breathe in the space aids at Jangala during the pilgrim's path quest

>>715009783
Retard.

>>715028004
>FTL
>3D

>>714981769 (OP)
A good time

May Ludd's Light banish the fear and darkness in all your hearts

Flagship PDslaught, 10 wolves with mercs and two officers ( all of them with Systems Expertise ), 6 shunted dominators with mjolnirs and devas. My favourite fleet comp
>>715032575
Also remember to donate your mechs and anti-tank weapons to the nice lady on Volturn, friend. I've heard that It's a very important part of Ludd's teachings or something like that

>>715032575
I'm still not drink your tea, Cotton

>>715032575
>>715033449
drinking*
I'm retarded

>>715020329
I'd post the battle of vermillion scene, but eh

>>715012425
No but the game is overrated and a sseth game

>>715015356
God I wish poopjeets never discovered this game.

>>715032575
How about the Ludds make something good instead so I can banish the dark huh? The Retribution sucks ass, the Invictus is the most impractical brick that currently exists and isn't even good at banishing [Demons] even as the churches nº1 enemy, their erradicators are alright in the sense they're a good market to check but I'm frankly shocked they don't even try to make their own version at all even if its with a paintjob, and then the only LC stuff we have is like hounds and lashers with a basic coat of paint. I get it, anti tech but if these fuckers can have Asher as a base, I think they can also just have some special building hand manufacturing "blessed ships" and the like to have some energy resistance like how the Sindrians have it.

I like being a Ludd ingame but fuck me if they're more underwhelming than even the Sindrians. There's a reason for the like 3+ Luddic Expansions, Alex and company have been beefing this for a while.

>>714981769 (OP)
The Reaper.

>people still think the collapse wasn't purposely caused by the tri-tachs so they could have a sector's market all to themselves to manipulate
>implying the luddic church wasn't a psy-op created by an advanced tri-tach AI

>>715040123
TriTach fucking dreams of actually being that big brained long term planner but no, they're just not that "smart" and that plan is in truth one of the most retarded things ever. Even their AIs would try and crucify TriTach for the sheer fact that the Collapse would reduce the sheer corporate power and available tech by an exponential amount, limit market space, would increase the Luddic Faith tenfold, lead to the extremist branches, inevitably have the Hegemony fund both due to personal ties, belief and politics as a disposable non tethered enforcement force, and also just the simple fact that TriTach has been so retarded in general that nobody actually likes them, even less than just the Perseans.

They're so self predatory they couldn't execute that plan if they wanted to anyways. Over half their corporate ladder is self sabotaging murderers with 0 empathy ruining great potential having human resources for the sake of a power and control fetish while also abstracting themselves from reality. The fact the Church has basically dogshit equipment and more but can still stand tall and fight on kinda equal terms while fielding fucking 4k people bricks should tell you everything you need to know about TriTach.

If you want a more modern equivalent analogy, it's like if Amazon tried to become world leader by atomizing every single road in existence, but then most everyone banded with the Catholic Church and the Military Industrial Complex anyways and instead of having normal highways everyone's riding offroad jeeps. They just ruined everything and now you have priests with m80s and actual soldiers on gatlings around and they are kinda bumping fists and hating on your drone combat abusing ass.

Oh this is the game where modding scene consists solely of
>trannies
>degenerate commers(also trannies)
No wonder this tranny shit is /v/core
HAHAHAH
But yeah tell me how your chud mod actually is le based and not tranny at all.

>>715040782
>year old modding drama
Fucking hell dude move on.

>>715026071
>>715026370
His gender in game code is set to Gender.Any

post that webm with the modded stick ship punting frigates

>>715041046
>he knows when some modding drama happened
not beating trannycore allegations tranny

Mod ships and factions are bloated, power creep and mostly stupid looking. There I said it, vanilla ships and meta are superior.

>>715041163
Well you better know about it otherwise you'll end up downloading malware lmao

>>715041173
Imagine not downloading all the weirdass chinese mods from Fossic.

>>715041227
>tranny modders put malware in their mods
>you have get into tranny mod drama so you know which ones are have tranny malware
holy fuck tranny you really are digging a tranny hole under yourself

>>715041282
Calm down Rajeesh, as long as you don't move to Canada the trannies can't hurt you.

>>715041359
>he knows where trannies are
CALM DOWN WITH THIS TRANNY SHIT TRANNY HOLY SHIT

>>715041173
Yes, we've been saying this for a while Anon, its not new. I think the only mod that's even remotely decent I've played before was the Ko Combine, that was fairly vanilla+ and not shit like the mayasuran hyper planet or VIC with its weird morph ships and shit. Luddic Enhancement felt mostly alright however, most of it didn't feel like mega bloat or special prototype cope shit.

>>714981769 (OP)
fun

>>715041391
>Ko Combine
>Salamanders with Zig-tier EMP damage everywhere
>Carriers with 8 fighter bays + reserve deployment for 20 DP
>pure phase fleets that shit as many mines as humanly possible
>decent
>decent

>>715043294
Salamanders have never been an actual issue ever, the big carriers were kind of a meme rather than anything, mines aren't as good as you think and are especially a pain to operate logistically. If you'd mention the PDC you'd have a bit more of a leg to stand on desu.

>>714981769 (OP)
It's pretty good as far as space fleet games go, the writing is pretty good but holy shit the DEI is so obnoxious the dev must be a total cuck.
The rejection of pleasant aesthetics extends to most of the ships too. Most of the ships are weird looking just for the sake of it.
>yeah I could have put more conventionally good-looking ships and characters in the game but BRAAAAAP *huffs fart* I didn't want to.

>>715040716
hegemonkey hands wrote this post

>>715043865
>>715043865
>Salamanders have never been an actual issue ever
They deal Zig-tier EMP damage through shields, they're designed to be annoying as possible especially when you encounter a Ko Combine fleet that spams them.
>the big carriers were kind of a meme rather than anything
My framerate dying because I have 120+ talons from two Atlas (C)s covering the screen is a pain in the ass and the literal opposite of fun.
>If you'd mention the PDC you'd have a bit more of a leg to stand on desu.
It's just a heavy blaster sidegrade that's usable on ballistic slots, unremarkable.
The mod is just annoying as shit and doesn't add anything worthwile.

>>715045035
You don't have to double quote me Anon, I'm not a big guy 4(You)

>emp damage through shields
I have never struggled with PD in my life. Ever. I dunno what to tell you, I just never had that problem.

>framerate dying because I have 120+ talons
Anon how the fuck did you make that happen, I have literally never seen this or even heard of it and I definitely do not remember my PC turning into a jet engine either from it. 120 PLUS talons would be a core memory, I'm not saying its technically impossible but I'm doubtful you aren't exaggerating a lot when you say this.

>heavy blaster sidegrade
Its a great weapon with solid stats, energy classification so they get even better from just being closer and it being usable on balistics came in clutch surprisingly often, its a pretty versatile gun and having a kinetic slot heavy blaster is pretty good given the alternatives tend to be shit like the heavy mortar, the disgusting fucking thing.

I just don't have the same experiences as you Anon I dunno what to tell you. I never said it was amazing or great, just that it was remotely decent, as in, not even that good but alright.

>>715028649
Well name a few anon

fuck the hegemony
all my homies join the league and make shodan and friends run everything for them

>>715026567
That's impressive number of scenarios. I love deep simulations games like that which aren't roguelike/roguelites

/v/ shilled me into thinking this game would be deep and grand in scope.
but there's like 3 things you can do and the combat is a flash game.
what am I missing?
>trade
>do quest for faction (kill someone)
>travel

>>715046280
>join the league
>he pays taxes

>>715047418
There's a storyline, so add
>read
to the list

I dont play star sector much, and i definitly never got to end game, story missions or large colony management.
But i love the shrike.

>>715047418
Establishing colonies on planets (especially in the edge of the galaxy) is pretty based, although the fucking developers keep pushing a bunch of restrictions on your planets and effectively limiting your choices.

>>715049124
What do you do with it? It's poorly named imo. The monster it's referencing is an invincible killing machine from across space and time, not an annoyance.

>>715049505
Lasers, and more lasers.
Then 3 of them in the fleet, with lasers.
Is it good? No. Does it feel good? Yeah.

>>715049702
Fukken basado

>>715028738
aw, they changed it over time then.
that was really funny, too

>>714981769 (OP)
Is this game finished yet? I know it was in a perpetual beta(kinda like ur life lmao) for years and then mods started popping up. I don't want to download a cool mod and then it breaks because the dev updates the game.

>>715046070
>Neutrino
>Dassault-Mikoyan
>Sanguinary
>Pearson
to name a few long dead, though some of them are updated unofficially

>>715055407
Ain't Mikoyan the one with the OC mary sue ceo or am I thinking somethin else?

>>714981769 (OP)
Amazing combat mechanics. Probably the best combat mechanics for real time ship battles in all of videogames (surprisingly low bar).
Absolute dog shit everything else, including the actual combat.

>>714982728
>>714982804
>>715026071
>>715041049
>>715026370
>>714983170
Shan't be buying. I do not support developers who want to see me and others like me erased

>>714982864
you could also not live your life being a fucking nigger but here we are
playing starsector without mods because of "The Trannies" is fucking retarded. kill yourself

>>714981769 (OP)
it's pretty good, but once you get good at it you realise that space combat is little more than tard wrangling, and making sure the ennemy tards out, it gets old. Plus, if the only real difficulty slider you have access to is "more ennemy ship at once". Alex can't/donesn't want to/doesn't know it exists, so this game will forever be "meh". QOL of life updates that take 10 years.
Last update was pretty gud, though.

>>715049505
It's kind of between a frigate and a destroyer, good at punching down on smaller ships. Likes SO, alpha strike weapons and general swarm/wolfpack tactics. AI pilots WILL get in the faces of larger ships and suffer for it. Falters against larger foes and with supporting larger ships, there's better things for that like the Sunder or Manticore. Pirate version is a good sidegrade, loses a bit of OP but gains a small universal mount which really likes to have a railgun.

>>715056817
>buying

What really annoys me about starsector is how many aspects of it are still bare-bones after being "worked on" for ten years. The comm-link is bare bones you can't do fuck-all with it. Colonies are still the most bare-bones fisher price bullshit it's so bad. The bars and missions are bare bones like a 1-year old game not 10.
At a bare minimum blowing someones battlestation/fleet/military up should give more dialog options. This is so fucking lazy.

I enjoyed this game a lot but realized I just liked the colony side much more and started getting burnt out as I kept feeling more and more limited by it.

Haven't played in like three years now, is a vanilla run finally worth playing through now that I'm back or should I just look to see what funny mods are updated?

>>715058504
What are you allowed to do in the colony side? You mean like diplomacy?

>>715059507
yeah they added a lot in 3 years, its worth it

>>715002116
You're still going to get harassed by massive Tri-Tachyon and League fleets sooner or later even if you stack as many negative colony crisis modifiers as possible, dumbass.

>>715056871
It becomes an issue when said trannies install malware into their mods because someone made a rape mod that allows you to rape their OCs and fursonas

>>715060624
Tritach crisis is the easiest shit ever, you even get an acessibility bonus for it, just raid their trade convoys for cash and bombard a few bases, you get it done in 2 months. Same with League, you just kill their refueling fleet when they do the blockade and they fuck off and you're then an established polity for +10% accessibility.

Holy shit you're a fucking scrub mate. Build a command center if you're in that dangerous of a situation, its a global 50% threat scale reduction but you can even fucking ignore most pirates and most path shit by paying them off, either giving Kanta the lamp or some dolla, or even paying off the path for like 5 months sometimes. Shit's so easy.

>>715062641
Still doesn't justify every faction outside of yours pulling massive amounts of fleets out of their ass just to harass you for practically no reason.
>hurr it's the easiest shit ever
Yeah, no shit retard. Doesn't mean I enjoy fighting 3 fleets lead by two Pegasi each everytime I enter my system.
>kowtowing to pirates and pathers
kwab
I bet you sucked Hannan's cock too, fucking faggot.

>>715023714
>>715026567
i need advice anons
how do i get my colonies to produce more ships in their commerce stores?
is it better to have high command bases and one central heavy industry that trades to them
or do i plop heavy industry everywhere?

i'm using the derelict operations skill that reduces ship deployment costs by 6% per d-mod, and i need to go gambling/shopping for the ones that don't have shitty shields and flux stats d-mods

>>715063351
While I agree that you should very much have a Nexerelin like situation where you can invoke your own fleets to fuck shit up, I have never had an issue with pegasi because again, the Perseans are so fucking easy to deal with Anon. Even an executor can just tank multiple fast racks red laser spamming pegasi, and it gets boring, not difficult, and again retard, you just kill the supply fleets, thats how you avoid fighting the 20 groups. Are you even reading or what

>>>/vg/

>>715063946
I'm not talking about the crisis fleet you braindead nigger, I'm talking about the Enforcers constantly spawning in every affected system and randomly intercepting your fleet like a bunch of flies.
Nowhere did I state that it's difficult, it turns flying into your colony into a massive chore after the first few battles.

>>715063559
high command is exclusively for the size/number of security fleets that patrol the system, commerce and industry determines what's for sale.