>franchise without a single good game
>still has millions of die hard fans

any other examples of this?

Picrel is the best game I've played in my life

>>715396226 (OP)
>first game stops being fast after green hill
>second game wont let you go fast by putting obstacles that appear faster than you can react
>third game is just climbing
>cd is just climbing
>mania is just climbing
>superstars is just climbing and has shit level deisgn
>3d games just suck in general
>still makes millions
its because the characters are pandered to furries and manchildren.

Why are there retards who unironically believe Sonic was never good.

Sonic was never good

>Actually has lore unlike Mario
>Amazing music unlike Mario
>Optimistic, almost christian like undertones
>Not afraid to try new things
>Actually likes his own fans unlike Mario/Nintendo

Theres a reason Sonic rubs atheists like Egoraptor and reddit the wrong way

>>715396226 (OP)
Superstars is actually the only bad Sonic game. Cope and seethe.

>>715396562
They were born yesterday

>>715396226 (OP)
Do you have a single example of this phenomena, OP?

>>715396667
>Actually likes his own fans

>>715396667
>>Optimistic, almost christian like undertones
What's not optimistic about Mario?

>>715396703
No one sane actually believes this btw

>>715396753
Sonic

>>715396226 (OP)
This

>>715396850
wrong

>>715396776
Mario never gets the girl.

>>715396776
Nothing. In fact there’s nothing to mario, it’s just bing, bing, and maybe a wahoo here and there. Mindless slop through and through

>>715396226 (OP)
Silent Hill

>>715396776
Mario is just a brand mascot doing vanilla good things like saving the princess while some jingle plays in the background.

Sonic is about taking down actual forces of evil, with a moral lesson to be learned. Almost every villain in Sonic has a tragic backstory and want to play God. Even in all the songs theres a case made for either the villain, or Sonic, or the adventure itself.

>>715396776
mario gets cucked canonically

>>715396562
It really does feel that way when everything released after Mania (8 years ago) is mediocre at best.

>>715396226 (OP)
Everything
Also you're a faggot

>>715397003
Mario and Sonic are barely in the same League character wise. Sonic is larger than life and closer to someone inspiring like Goku or Spiderman. Mario is just mickey Mouse but even less animated and never talks. Does anyone even know what Mario's motives and morals are?

>>715397609
Kinda the point I was getting at. Sonic is a character and mario is, well, boring. His whole world is boring

>>715397272
>Almost every villain in Sonic has a tragic backstory and want to play God. Even in all the songs theres a case made for either the villain,
>villains are sympathetic
Yeah, not falling for your satanic shit.

>>715398106
Im just saying Sonic has layers to it and is more than bing bing wahoo save the princess oldest story in the book. Sonic is fighting actual evil

>>715398392
Good is good and evil is evil. Saying things have layers and villains can be sympathetic is how satanists trick you into believing moral relativism.

>>715397285
Who's the cute blue haired girl?

>>715398618
its clear that their sin is pride, the root of all evil. its pretty simple.

>>715398876
So now it's simple? Which is it?

>>715396226 (OP)
furry autism

project moon

Why are Sonicfags so obsessed with Mario?

>>715399082
Its simple presented in a movie-like world building manner. So, you know, you're actually invested and the climax is more impactful

>>715396562
Dumb bait threads that's all
Just ignore them

>>715396562
Raised on videos made in the mid-2010's by contrarian soilennials.

>>715396226 (OP)
>franchise without a single good game
>sonic 1, Sonic 2, Sonic and Knuckles, Sonic Adventures, Sonic and all stars racing transformed, Sonic Unleashed, Sonic generations
>not good
C'mon now...

>>715399237
>So, you know, you're actually invested and the climax is more impactful
Sure, if the deepest movie you've ever seen was MCU slop.

>>715396226 (OP)

Sonic is bad because..... HE JUST IS OK!

>>715396667
Mario Land 1, 2 and 3 all had lore connecting with each other and is the reason why Wario even has a castle to begin with.

>>715396703
>Sonic 06 is good
>Sonic Superstars
>Sonic 4 episode 1
>Sonic the Dark brotherhood
>Sonic Frontiers
>Sonic Forces
End yourself, kid

>>715396667
>Sonic is better if you ignore the actual video game aspect.

>>715396226 (OP)
The characters are appealing enough to carry it

Superstars is fine.

The first game is good

>>715396562
The last Sonic game that was unanimously agreed to be good (Mania) came out nearly a decade ago.

>>715401239
>see the mass fellation to Mania
>play to see what's the thing around it
>it's only Sonic CD tier over designed stages with huge nostalgiabait rehashing old stages
>mfw
It's not that good, it's ok. Just ok

>>715401424
that's literally want people want and have wanted for years
I have to assume that SEGA just doesn't want to make games like that because it is honestly mindblowing how they can just keep shitting up their games by adding shit like the wisps

>>715400538
That's genuinely it. Sonic as a series is carried by everything but the gameplay.

>>715401239
SxS Generations came out less than a year ago, people just don't like to bring it up because it goes against the "Sonic games are always bad" narrative.

>>715401530
I see the excess of nostalgia as a detriment and negative point against it

>>715396667
>>Actually has lore unlike Mario
Sonic lore is super retarded
>>Amazing music unlike Mario
True, but Mario's music is more iconic. Even people who don't play video games recognize World 1-1
>>Not afraid to try new things
Experimental does not imply good.

>t. Sonic fan when I was younger

>>715396226 (OP)
The early Sonic games on the Genesis were obviously great. Stop being a contrarian faggot.

>>715401698
>I see the excess of nostalgia as a detriment and negative point against it
for sure, what they don't know is that you can reuse things from the past and still make it work

the new zones in Mania were like a compendium of things from the past yet they are the most memorable zones in the game
Sonic Superstars just hits you in the nose with the nostalgia
>"HERE IS METAL SONIC, AGAIN, AGAIN"

>>715401698
>>715402108
I think nostalgia bait is only an issue if the thing can't really stand, even worse if it makes little sense without having prior knowledge. In the case of Mania, I think a lot of the nostalgia elements are genuinely appealing on their own, and I think a person who has never seen the Genesis-era games before would enjoy them if they assumed it was all brand new material. The only exception being the Puyo boss, which I think ends up just being awkward and out-of-place if you have know nostalgia for Mean Bean Machine

Otherwise, nostalgia would only be an issue if it's been down to death, like with Green Hills and Chemical Plant, which, unfortunately, Mania brings back, but the other returning at least haven't been abused yet.

>>715402742
>I think nostalgia bait is only an issue if the thing can't really stand
Which is my gripe with Sonic Mania; it doesn't have an identity of its own. Meanwhile the only nostalgia on Mario mostly comes from being a longtime IP and using 2D platformer/3D platformer angle; always keeps itself fresh and solid at its worst. I didn't like Odyssey but that game was a fresh take on Galaxy

>>715403007
>it doesn't have an identity of its own
it's the best 2D sonic game. few new entries to a long-dormant series manage to stick a perfect landing like mania. it felt as if we were still in 1997 yet it managed to address numerous complaints of its predecessors (separate super toggle button, 1P tails flight controls)
you're an idiot without taste
>inb4 recycled levels
that was all sega's doing. the team's plan was to give us all-new zones

>>715403397
>it's the best 2D sonic game
2, S&K are far better.

>>715399176
Presentation carries that series really hard, the gameplay demands a lot of patience no matter which installment you play.