Now that the dust has settled, was the discourse over this card an overreaction?

>>717168339 (OP)
Yes, Ben. You can go back to developing shit games again.

TROGG RULE

>>717168339 (OP)
Would it even be played now if it was just a textless 4mana 7/7?

>>717168339 (OP)
it was an S+ tier card

>>717168339 (OP)
No? At the time it was an amazing card on its own, but it reached insane levels with the amount of synergy it had with Tunnel Trogg and other cheap shaman cards.. The nerf to BGH also made answering it a lot more costly for most of the classes.

>>717168339 (OP)
>people still play this shit

Your move.

>>717168339 (OP)
Shaman had an absurd winrate during that cards lifespan and only counter to the deck was to play that exact deck and pull better. If you played ranked 90% of ladder was just shaman.

>>717171586
What are you gonna do about the 2 troggs, the 2 mana 3/4, and the tuskarr

>>717168339 (OP)
If they released the card today it would cost real life money

>>717168339 (OP)
This was the expansion that literally killed hearthstone. After this expansion the numbers started dropping never to trend up again. Even demon hunter didn’t bring the game back

>>717168339 (OP)
4 Mana 7/7 is the last thing I remember about Hearthstone.
It made for a good punchline back in the day.

>the esg dei check is cleared
>suits tell the artists to remake all cards immediately

>>717173906
Kek has anyone ever contacted the artists behind this card to find out who took the artistic liberty? The artist or the Down syndrome studio ?

>>717173906
It's been almost 3 years anon everyone moved on already. Why do we have to talk about black aragorn in fucking Hearthstone and YGO threads?

I still play battlegrounds everyday.
It's fun enough and it's free to play.

>>717173906
Magic sucks so much ass because there’s no art continuity. I can have a card of goblin Tommy and his crew and it’s an ultra realistic 3D rendition and then i play his loyal ally Billy the goblin and it was drawn by a three year old with colored pencils

>>717173906
Tolkien never said Aragorn couldnt be black. Races arent even real chuds

>>717174075
I actually like the Make a Wish foundation cards thank you very much
>>717174070
It's really the only thing I play with Hearthstone
>>717174235
samefag

>>717172887
I think during Old Gods there were more fucked up decks and Shaman didn't see nearly as much play comparatively, but in an attempt to argue every single meta article during the time has been purged.
It's actually really disappointing nearly a decade worth of old meta information on TS just got completely nuked for some shitty backpack hero clone.

>>717173642
pretty sure hearthstone was still doing fine, right until witchwood 2 years later which really killed the game

>ruins your game with midrange slop

>>717174527
I still don't know what midrange/tempo is

Im sure they are doing great, they even added Gacha into the game now

>>717174658
It's gone now actually and isn't the game a gacha anyway with cardpacks and all that?

>>717168339 (OP)
I want a card game where Silence Priest / Permission decks are actually strong.

>>717174591
Playing to hold board during the middle of the game with highly valuable, relatively low cost creatures. You aren't looking to rush the opponent down with 1 and 2 drops early and you're not looking to win with a late game combo or high cost closer.

>>717174591
Midrange is winning via attrition. Essentially, just consistently 2-for-1 your opponent until you have a sufficient resource advantage.
Tempo is aggro-control. You play a powerful early threat like Delver of Secrets or Bitterblossom, put your enemy in the backfoot, then ride that threat to victory while consistently disrupting their moves.

>>717174527
sorry boomer san, this is unplayable trash now
it doesn't replace itself and generate 2 cards worth of value just for entering the battlefield

>>717168339 (OP)
i have no idea how this game works. what is overload?

>>717174857
It's still playable in quite a few formats. Hell, it'd be an utter monster in Standard now with the Golgari/Jund Roots deck.

>>717174695
Im not sure if opening packs would be considered a "gacha" but well thats just me, and yeah it is gone now because the "event" ended but there will be more im sure considering how many people ended up paying the +150 bucks to obtain this pet.

>>717174903
You cannot play any cards for the next 2 turns

I only played this game again because forsen was playing.
Quit again

>>717174906
lol dont look up the new goyf who got printed in current set

>>717174903
less mana next turn
you play that on turn 4, you get two less mana on turn 5 (so you'd have 3)

>>717174903
card cost 4 mana now, but in the next turn you have 2 less mana to use

>>717174906
Everyone would rather play Bowmaster than Goyf; sorry boomer-san. Your green bro is dead and forgotten.

>>717174903
each turn you have a mana pool you use to play cards, it starts at 1 and grows by 1 each turn (until turn 10, 10 is the limit)
overload makes it so in your next turn you can't use mana equal to the number it shows, in this case if you dropped it in turn 4, next turn you get 3 mana instead of 5 to use next turn

>>717174973
>>717175072
>>717175084
>>717175192
thanks anons!

>>717174494
Quit playing after they nerfed auctioneer miracle rogue with questing adventurer. That deck was so high skill cap because u had to mentally calculate the odds every card draw. Like it was a type of gambling I guess, but tards could not play that deck nearly as well as me. It was like the only deck that I felt strong playing, becuz most of the matches would be determined by an actual cheating algorithm lol. Like srsly u would play one deck n go against ur counter 20 times. N if u changed decks, u wld immediately go against THAT DECKS counter. That shit was so homo erotic asphyxiation, but miracle rogue could pound all their boypussies if u had high skill. 477 man was alright but iirc that deck was plagued by a counter and it had a 50% win rate becuz they literally wld rig the games to retain players.

>>717175047
I play Cosmogoyf in my own deck but it's absolutely not as good as its older cousin, even when my gameplan actively involves exiling lots of stuff from my grave I still only run it as an one-off. You have to actively work to make it grow while Tarm just grows with the progression of the game, so it's way less versatile and fits less decks. It's more of a cheeky "oh, you played Rest in Peace? woe, 34/34 be upon ye" play then anything.

>>717175151
No reason you can't run both desu, and Bowmasters isn't playable everywhere. Tarmogoyf wasn't ever a guaranteed early play either.

>>717174903
It's Jewish bank interest as a card resource.

>Pay less now
>Pay some more next turn
>Pay more overal

>>717174494
Witchwood was still fun to play, Rastakhan's Rumble was when the game just became boring

>>717175406
Actually was a joke about the male refractory period.

>>717174527
What??? There's more than one Lhurgoyf???

>>717175072
>>717175084
so this stat line normally costs something like 5 mana, right? it can't be 6 given that you're getting it out a few turns earlier than normal

>>717175431
Rasta is like a weed joke. So they named that basically “u can smoke weed at least”. And it was a rumble. Becuz u dont wanna smoke weed. U want ur dignity back. Stolen, witout a trace of remorse from a giant brain.

>>717175676
Lhurgoyf was a whole tribe of creatures since the beginning...

>>717175681
there's been incredible powercreep over the years, but back then that statline was like 6 mana
the reason the card was so busted back when it released
>by getting it out early, you're getting ahead in board precense
>shaman has a lot of cards that synergize with overload, like the already mentioned Tunnel Trogg

>>717175681
in the base set, a 7/7 was actually 7 mana
a 6/7 was 6 though, but it's still about 6-7 mana realistically

>>717168339 (OP)
We didn't know how good we had it, modern hs is a travesty

what was the name of that card that gives -1 to all cards in your hand each turn
that was really good once

>>717168339 (OP)
It's still being memed on by the current devs because they have nothing original and are creatively bankrupt

>>717174591
>aggro
Kill the enemy as fast as possible, nothing else matters. The example card is Goblin Guide; decks running it not only win with no cards on hand, they even feed their opponent extra cards in exchange for even more damage.
>control
Control the board and exhaust your opponent's resources until you reach a boardstate where you have total ability to decide what happens on the game; from there, anything can be the wincon; even decking out your enemy. A good example card is Wrath of God, that resets the board and deals with multiple threats on its own.
>combo
Like you said, self-explanatory. Make a combination of cards that autowins. The rest is protecting and ensuring it. Classic card is Illusions of Grandeur. It pretty much wins once you do what you want to do with it (give it to the opponent).
>midrange
Win by attrition. Slower then aggro, faster then control. Play efficient disruption, answers and threats to consistently block off your enemy in the earlygame while playing stuff that gives you more resources then you invest into it; then 2-for-1 the opponent until you have a good enough advantage to win. Example card is Fable of the Mirror-Breaker. It generates card flow, mana, and a body all in one package, creating value in all sorts of different directions to work fine in almost any game state.
>tempo
Reverse midrange. Present a powerful earlygame threat and protect it while disrupting your opponent and their plays. An example card is Delver of Secrets: It forces your opponent on the backfoot as an oversized earlygame flier and decks running it are engineered to make it consistently transform.

>>717176750
true statement

>>717176750
I think the game just doesn't have enough going on that you can infinitely make more and more expansions for it.

>>717176750
i figured the game would be dead by this point

>>717177348
it kinda is; HSfags are saying this current environment is the worst its ever been and even some longtime content creators have stopped playing altogether

>>717177348
without battlegrounds it would be

>>717176750
Damn that's unironically cringe

>>717175804
That's not possible because Gerard's last words were "Ack! Hannah! Run! It's the Lhurgoyf!"

>>717179080
Why do you think he was telling her to run instead of getting on their flying ship? He knew the Lhurgoyf could fly and would get her there.

>>717177348
it basically is, just on a zombie state
>>717177430 is correct, and not only that but the environment has been the worst its ever been for at least 3 consecutive years

Is there really not a decent online card game anymore? I was excited for Shadowverse 2 but it seems like it has been received very poorly.

jesus people still playing hearthstone?

>>717182238
Riot made an amazingly generous online card game but had shit gameplay then decided to make a card game with good gameplay but make it a physical so its by default awful to play since you will have to open expensive booster packs and go to a stinky place to play once a week.

some cursed shit.

I’m still angry that instead of going the conservative route and making most expansion cards simply blank alternates for base decks with a few feature cards, they turbo charged every expansion, making it impossible to let off the gas and have any kind of deterrence to the inevitable power creep. Those early days were supreme cozy.

>>717172887
Nah after trogg & company rotated out shaman was literally the worst class.

>>717168339 (OP)
It wasn't even that important. it could be any tempo based 4 drop with Overload (2). It was strong because it was following up on
>Tunnel Trogg t1
>Totem Golem (Overload (1)) t2
>A second trogg + Lightning bolt/ a second Totem Goglem t3 if you have coin, otherwise unbound elementa/mana tide totem t3

A 1/3 is hard to remove t1. And by t2 it can either go face or value trade anything with 2 attack or less. And if you don't remove it, it won the game as it quickly becomes a 1mana 4/3 or 5/3.
And if you do, you've blown multiple resources on a t1 1 drop, just to be started in the face by a t2 3/4.

Shamans basically played bigger threats faster than you could deal with them and the overload didnt slow them down enough to stop them because of the Overload synergy.
A 7/7 with no other effect was neither here nor there at that point. It was probably like the 5th or 6th most important card in the deck, behind trogg, totem golem, lightning bolt, lava lash, maybe doomhammer

>>717174235
Didn't he describe Aragorn as having a Pale face one of the books?

>>717177290
In Alpha/Beta you had shit like a Graveyard and they removed it for simplicity. They obviously made a choice to go the simple route and now its biting them in the ass, both because they decided to move away from Warcraft lore and characters as a base (Mistake) and because they thought a simple game would have more legs than a complex one (mistake again)

Meanwhile in current HS...
Fucking infinite repeatable quests

>>717185728
HS was originally meant to be a card game for people who don't know card games.

Now it's spiraled into what is is

>>717182956
Naxx was literally turbo-powercreep incarnate right form the get go.
Goblins and Gnomes was similar but less so, they obviously tried to step off the gas a bit not anticipating that people would never let go of the broken naxx cards.
The next year they really let off the gas with BRM and TGT, again not anticipating that they cant just print weaker cards now that they've let the genie out of the lamp with Naxx. Which led to the standard format getting created.

They never knew what makes good card games in the first place, they were making it up as they went along

>>717185858
I saw this card recently and I thought it sounds pretty garbage without a lot of support in the set
>The entire paladin set for this expac is murloc stuff except for 1-2 cards
Holy forced archetype batman

>>717177348
the current meta is quest murloc paladin who can only lose if they brick badly. and its hard to brick badly when your highest mana card is 6

People always complain about powercreep but if every single card game does it then how bad is it really? Unless you‘re trying to tell me that all of those devs are idiots

>>717186451
Essentially card games are a lot hard to design and balance than people realise and the devs that work on card games are not as talented as they think they are.

>then how bad is it really

There are no good online card games on the market. Thats the extent of the damage

>>717188214
Idk man, if every game ends up powercreeping i think it‘s just necessary. People are way too scared of it. Hearthstone is the most boring it has ever been right now and it‘s mainly because the devs are actively trying to lower the power level and releasing shit expansions as a result. Balance != fun

>>717188703
It's "necessary" because the model of card games requires the continuous unending consumption of product. A card game with such a model will only escape it if the cards aren't selling on the basis of being game pieces (ie pokemon, where there's graphic design creep instead).

>>717168339 (OP)
Blood manos is my favorite card, I don't play that shit game, btw.

>>717176750
Whizbang's Workshop is full of self-references, it's basically '4th wall, the expansion'
Also, the expansion after that was literally a beach episode lel

People got tired of that nonsense, so now they made 2 actually seriously themed expansions that also (tried) to lower the ridiculous power level.
Unfortunately, right now, no one is actually playing around with the new cards, and instead the meta is basically old decks from the previous year.
The only hope is that the next rotation actually saves this game from the current god awful meta. Either that, or they drop a nuclear nerf patch.

>>717191415
>or they drop a nuclear nerf patch.
And then what? You have a bunch of shitty, boring arena decks. They need to stop listening to morons and just make fun fucking decks. The current devs couldn‘t even dream of making decks that are as fun as the ones in united in stormwind

Tried to get back into Hearthstone after I quit during League of EVIL (2019). This game has been assfucked to hell and back it seems. Crafted a Loh druid deck only for the key card to get nerfed to the ground. I quit again just 2 weeks after I came back. My gambling addiction isn't strong enough to keep me invested.

I just want classic mode back so I can go back to playing Handlock

>>717191690
What do you mean 'and then what'?
Then we actually get to play and enjoy some of the new cards, and not have a meta where you have 2 types of decks.
Ones that cheat the ever living fuck out of mana, and aggro decks that exist only because they can counter the first type.

That is the idea, anyway. Most likely nothing major happens 'till the rotation, and then we pray they don't relapse.
Also, I'm a hopeful bastard that still thinks twist might return, or the rotation happens early.

>>717192459
Oh man i can‘t wait to play zoo druid and discover mage with no win con. The new decks they‘re pushing are boring as shit

>>717192019
People hyper-optimized and raped that format the millisecond it was brought back. just like WoW Classic, you can't go back

>>717192870
And I still had more fun playing it than I ever had with nu-stone.

>>717174003
>s-stop caring!!!
lmao

>>717194204
Not saying to stop caring but the fucking Spiderman set came out so anons should talk about that ruining MTG instead

>>717185858
was hoping they'd address this in tomorrow's balancing patch
completely absent

>>717194407
because its a battlegrounds patch.

the only times i've beaten murloc paladin (as a quest DK) is when i managed to discover multiple corpse explosions or dirty ratted his Braingill so he ran out of gas

my own fault for not having 7 board clears i suppose

>>717194635
>if i can‘t remove every single threat my opponent has his deck is broken
How about actually playing hearthstone and fighting for board

>>717176061
That is for neutrals, class cards had better stat budget.
Issue is that the deck had a whole lot of other bullshit, namely trogg and claw.
So basically on T4 they had a strong high attack board and suddenly dropped another huge creature.

>>717195304
NTA: i have zero respect for people who defend the current murloc paladin

>>717195304
haven't played in awhile now have you

paladins can clear the board and summon 3-5 minions per turn. and with that quest reward the murlocs get stats passively.

but thats ok anon, i'm sure you can figure out how to outboard this. which the paladin can discover multiple of. and if you kill it it advances the quest further so he gets more stats

>>717195304
Murloc Paladin is legit broken anon it's ok to admit it

Current Murloc paladin exists only to bring the whales back in hopes of them buying that $150 pet

>>717196970
>>717197069
>>717197243
It‘s broken if you have no intention to do anything other than stalling and running your opponent out of stuff. If you play a deck that tries to win through board it‘s not good because it‘s an aggro deck that passes on turn 1 and has no way to come back if it loses the board

>>717197427
>It‘s broken
This is all that I read and I suggest the same for the other anons he replied too.

>>717197427
ok, i'll bite. what aggro deck out aggros murloc paladin

i'm going to work and will not be reading your reply, but i hope its funny for the other people in the thread

>turn 1 Tunnel Trogg
>turn 2 Tuskarr Totemic (it summons a Totem Golem pre-nerf)
>turn 3 coin Flamewreathed Faceless
This shit was bonkers at the time, the reaction was completely justified.

>>717191415
I just want fun stupid shit, having an entire expansion to "lower the power level" failed already with Rastakahn's Rumble.

I'd rather just see fun and interesting cards to put in my deck or just let them fuck around and do something else.

>>717185858
So is Pala murloc actually good today? I some of the premade decks in the tavern brawl and the Pala murloc was fucking braindead overpowered.

>>717197609
All of them because the deck passes on turn 1 and then plays a murloc tidehunter on turn 2 in 2025

Paladin players have been retarded since the year fucking 2004 and literally nothing has changed, it's genuinely fascinating to see

Now there's 4 mana 7/7 with upside and it barely sees play.

>>717197982
I don't think quest Death Knight can really beat it unless they spam things like Blood Boil and Corpse Explosion

>>717198310
what's kindred?

>>717174269
>playing beast endgame in the current meta

>>717198508
It worked, I usually go undead but didn't that time

>>717198441
Active if you played a card of the same type the previous turn

>>717198750
If you want some cool builds look this side. Its curated by Jeef a very good Battleground player.

https://hsreplay.net/battlegrounds/comps/

>>717199618
Thanks anon

>>717197729
You can't have 'fun and interesting' cards in a meta like around the Emerald Dream, where decks were turn 7 OTKs and armor DK that gives you a migraine to play against.
You can't have it now either, when you either get Dorian'd or blown out of the game by aggro.

It's brought about because the increasing power level of the game, increases the difficulty of balancing the game. At this point in time, you either play the really good cards, or you get utterly fucked. Nothing in between.
It's a Herculean task to perfectly balance a card now, I feel bad because I know some of the designers care about HS, yet they can't do much to change the entire state of the game.
Lowering the power level will widen the middle power span, making it easier to balance shit, and this in turn means bad cards become okay, and horrible cards become bad, but still playable. Same thing on the other side of the scale, good is now in the okay zone, insanely powerful is now merely good.
THIS is where you can play stupid shit and have it have actual IMPACT. That's where the fun times are, even if you lose.

>I once served a drink to a PS5. It ported to PC, right in his hands!

>>717199824
No problem!

>>717194314
>came out
Its not out yet

>>717199973
Is Bob the most based character Blizzard made?

>>717200371
I like him. The hearthstone characters that made it into worlo are pretty good

>>717174235
stfu nigger

this dead game doesn't matter, stop bringing it up because it will never revive

>>717201537
battlegrounds is fun though

>>717168339 (OP)
jumped the shark

>>717174003
>e-everything is political
>n-no not like that
kek

>>717202118
I'm terrified to look into what BG has become after seeing what has happened to constructed

>>717200371
why did brode have a blackface self insert anyway

>>717202687
Deathrattle pirates isn't a thing any more. Quilboar are the cancer

>>717202118
because you have fried dopamine receptors and like gambling yeah. Battlegrouns is like pulling slots but with the difference that you need to pick your win after a pull.

>>717203052
i like it when minion have big number :)

>>717203052
If you'd like to minimize rng I recommend chess. Just a coin flip at the start to see who goes first

I miss playing Hearthstone on release and during Naxx

>>717168339 (OP)
I assumed HS had reached EoL at some point during these years, how come it's still going?

>>717202560
What did he mean by this?

>>717203469
as usual retarded whales that can't let go
like lol

>>717203469
Still makes bank from the few dozen whales who play it

>>717202687
Murlocs dominate thanks to a spell that under the right condition can give like 200/200 stats when everything align, but new patch this Tuesday will change things

>>717203449
>bring out your dead

>>717197069
the blizzard artstyle is so bad, on par with ai slop

>>717203449
No one misses Takerstone you lying faggot.

>>717204297
If I could play that version of the game right now I'd climb straight into legend without playing any other video games

so is control still removed from the game?

>>717175406
>>Pay more overal
it's actually 1 stat point better than a regular 6 mana minion

>>717204361
You and everyone else playing deathrattle hunter. Be sure you concede if you dont mully into coin undertaker and zombie chow

I was there when 4mana 7/7 came out. On curve, played on turn4. My opponent always, ALWAYS, just used removal to get rid of it and then I had a stifled turn5 due to the overload.

>>717204635
EXACTLY, but I'd lean slightly into warlock zoo and giant control later on, maybe

>>717203158
Yeah I don't mean it like the standard heartstone is much better but battlegrounds made me feel like a bot. I sometimes play arena and that's it but the people who use addons to draft their decks and see everything are so fucking retarded it's like nobody wants to actually play the video game.

>>717203449
>Why yes I do Play Handlock, what gave it away.

>>717203469
Besides the whales, it's still pretty big in China. They got big live events and shit

>>717168339 (OP)
Yugioh is better.

Hearthstone is a great game and will be around for a long time.

>>717205761
It needs sexy cards again

>>717176981
>aggro
Wins
>control
Loses to aggro, beats combo and midrange
>combo
Loses to aggro, beast midrange on slot machine
>midrange
Loses to aggro, beats combo on slot machine
>tempo
Not a real type, you are control in a dress.

at least hearthstone is honest about what it is instead of pretending that card games are anything more than netdecking and gambling

>>717174527
>Guys, remember when they printed a rare greenslop 1 mana cheaper than intended and it fucked the game for a decade because literally every deck would splash for it? YEEPPP those were the days magic is truly the game of all time *manly tears*

>>717177348
It's dead. I got a legend a couple of months ago on weapon rogue and it was the dumbest thing I've ever seen
>A lot of cheap draw
>Plenty of cheap removals and table control from the hand
>Need to draw one of the 4 cards before the 3rd turn to basically guarantee victory
>The only way for enemy to win is to kill you before you kill him (so within 5-6 turns)
It's like one of the worst hunter metas, only worse, because you don't even need creatures, you hit 15 with your weapon on the 4th turn

>>717208194
>weapon rogue
Was there a new one after Draka? It was so funny to play 30 cards in 1 turn and get a 30 dmg weapon, while also ending with two 30/30 stealth minions on board, all just from 5 mana turn or something.

I only ever bothered for bgs, sometimes the rng can really fuck you over though, and I'm bad at pivoting when that happens (which sometimes won't even help)

For me?
It's wildychud.

>>717208313
I don't know, I just took the cheapest rogue deck that caught my eye. It's not even a meta deck, the site said it had a win rate of just over 50% (which is complete bullshit)

>>717208194
You decided to play a deck that just equips a weapon, plays buffs and attacks face every turn and you‘re surprised it‘s braindead

>>717208862
I was surprised at how effective it was. Besides it wasn't that braindead, just very fast. You still had to think about the order of the cards, what might come out of the draw, and so on. At least it wasn't as braindead as the Zerg and Protoss decks I had to play against
I mainly complain about the pace of the game which has become even faster

>>717174075
Magic art used to kick ass because there was no art continuity, you had fucking master painters like adam rex, jesper ejsing, rebecca guay, drew tucker, rk post, seb mckinnon, harold mcneill, therese nielsen, kev walker, foglio, richard kane ferguson, mark tedin and all the other artists each with their distinct style, so that they could all draw the same thing and have it come out radically different

>>717204635
Zoo was good enough to counter hunter. Yes, you had to bring your own Undertaker, but the unnerfed version of Abusive Sergeant as well as the egg was usually good enough to stabilize the board around turn 3, when their hand dried up.

Hearthstone is a baby game with no complexity and the most disrepectful monetization I've seen

>>717210509
>the most disrepectful monetization I've seen
have you seen pokemon tcg pocket?

>>717211267
Two wrongs don't make a right.

bump

>>717211719
Yes but only one winner can exist, and "the most" was claimed

>>717207304
>aggro wins
mfw i give my 2/2 first strike and the rednigger is seething for the next 4 turns while i kill his shit for free

>>717205350
>MIBRY

>>717204058

>>717215760
>world of warcraft is a world with specific themes
>well akshully world of warcraft is just like our world and they do things like us do waow so heckin relatable
This just makes it lose personality. Many games do this. Just focus on the fucking thing the game is supposed to be about, please.

>>717204058

>Blackrock was 10 Years Ago
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsH9w5HW-9w
FACT: Hearthstone lost its soul when they stopped doing Adventures.

>>717216004
this card was available at release