Thread 720653341

Does anyone else love Metroidvanias but find both Hollow Knight games incredibly boring? Theyre good and extremely polished and I cant really put my finger on why theyre so uninteresting, but I dont feel like they really excel at anything that isnt done better elsewhere in the genre and they have such a full aesthetic

There is a large subset of people, on /v/ no less, who literally only play souls games. And this is the closest thing to a 2D version of it.

>>720653341 (OP)
the background art all looks the same it starts to blurred together

They make exploration dangerous, tedious, and unfun in a genre all about exploring.
They make combat the main focus in a genre where it's usually an afterthought and easier on purpose.
They're stingier with powerups, and the ones you do get never feel game breaking.
In old metroidvanias you go from "this is dangerous, I must be careful exploring" early game to "hahaha I am a god!" HK and SS never let you feel powerful.
They're going for a different experience than most metroidvanias.

Because there's no sequence breaking. They're extremely non-linear compared to most metroidvanias, which require sequence breaking to make them not so.

I liked Miriam's game even in spite of picrel

>>720656042
>HK and SS never let you feel powerful.
do you just suck at pressing buttons or what
how are you not harpooning and deleting the enemies with busted tools?
also

>the game with a super vast world with significant route variety and better ways to carve your own path totally makes the combat the main focus at the detriment of exploration. it does because it just does okay

>>720653341 (OP)
I agree wholeheartedly

Bloodstained was just completely superior to HK and Silksong in every conceivable way. Better music, a more interesting world, the actual gameplay and powers, the easter eggs and bonus modes.

>>720653341 (OP)
I just chalk it up to not every game is for everyone and leave it at that.

>>720653341 (OP)
I really like Metroidvanias. But never played, or have any interest in Hollow Knight. I don't know much about it, but from the little I've seen about it, it don't seems like a fun place to explore. Metroid got plenty of fun and unique places. Blasphemous 1 have fantastic lore and locations, and especially music. Castlevania is iconic in its own right. Bloodstained while not pretty, does have an really impressive amount of fun spells and weapons
>>720661085
It's a gimmicky and funny place, even if it is tedious. But at least it's really late in the game so you have a lot of tools

>>720662434
try getting your opinions from places other than /v/ shitpost threads

>>720663883
Fair enough. It's just that the little I've seen of it gives me no drive to play it. It's most likely a great game. I've seen everyone praise it since it released. I just don't feel like playing it

>>720653341 (OP)
I like sidescrollers but don't really see the appeal of metroid is just whatever. CV is fine.

>>720653341 (OP)
Hollow Knight was an okay metroidvania at first and I lost interest towards the end.
Silksong is much better so far, but I still think they do too much to discourage exploration in these games.

>>720663883
Lmao imagine using /v/ as anything but noise to zone out to. But honestly, even outside of this cesspool, HK is like one of those art house films people swear by but when you ask them to explain why it's good they just start using words like "atmosphere" and "vibe" as if that covers for the pacing issues and backtracking bloat. Great polish, sure, but soul? If I wanted to play a sad bug simulator with a map that hates me, I'd just play Dark Souls with insect mods.

>>720653341 (OP)
The ''popular'' indie before this was Shovel Knight. You still hear about random cameos of Shovel Knight. Imagine shilling for such an average game. I can only be glad that good or not, it's better than Shovel Knight(very low bar).

>>720653341 (OP)
Because the world is completely uninteresting making the exploration pointless. Oh wow an ant area because ants are insects I wonder if I will see an ant that is not like the other ants and can talk to me and he is sad because he is not like the other ants and wants to make the other ants like him too. And a swamp area because mosquitos are annoying. Oh wow a beetle.Oh wow he's talking. And then you have to find where he hid. And he's talking again. And talking. And he moves and you play hide and seek so you can hear his dialogue that's a reference to another reference. Like who gives a shit man.

>>720655738
Are you retarded?

>>720656042
>They make combat the main focus in a genre where it's usually an afterthought and easier on purpose.
But at the same time the combat isn't complex enough to warrant it, so the only way for it to become more difficult is to make enemies faster and harder to react to, and input read to avoid your attacks. This design is exacerbated by Silksong's 2-damage boss standard whereas other games could do something like enemies having damage types that your gear mitigates or exacerbates. It's got the combat depth of a Castlevania game but with far more of a focus on it.

>>720661835
>how are you not harpooning and deleting the enemies with busted tools?
The mechanics disincentivises using tools against mooks because of the currency of which you can only carry a limited amount of at a time and how quickly you burn through it when actually going all out with tools when fighting a boss. The utterly fucked rosary economy also impacts this as an aside by making it so buying shards with rosaries is never even worth considering, but I guess the first patch might've eased that concern somewhat.

>>720653341 (OP)
Yes.
I tried the demo for this game https://store.steampowered.com/app/3512750/Vampires_Veil/ lured by the art it turned out it has great controls and proper weight. Very recommended.

>>720653341 (OP)

number no go up

>>720653341 (OP)
Yeah. Most, if not all, indie Metroidvanias completely miss the mark

>>720663883
I miss how colorful and varied this map is. So far Silksong's map just feels like dank dark underground shithole from one area to the next.