Thread 722935880

What happened to optional tutorial levels? Why don't games use those anymore?

why bother when you can just flash button prompts on the hud at the beginning

good tutorial design is a lost art, now it's just pop ups, or even worse
>click here to open up a youtube video

These were not good. You're doing the classic /v/ thing of having nostalgia over a shitty thing again.

Modern gamers have retard ADD and skip the tutorial.
I have one friend who's playing some classic games right now
>skipped tutorial of VTMB
>no free xp and lockpick, also doesn't know how to use computers
>skipped tutorial of deus ex
>never realized it's a stealth game, dies repeatedly

>>722935880 (OP)
having worked on some commercial games myself, most players feel insulted by tutorials or having to pick easy mode. they also get mad and blame the game if they don't get it, even if it's not the game's fault because they skipped the tutorial or whatever. real frustrating shit.

People under 20 don't even play real games at all.

>>722936493
>feel insulted by tutorials
The problem is that more often than not it keeps retreading super basic shit and lock you in place until you do things you've done a hundred times before in other games. I think a good tutorial is one that lets you fuck around and lets you learn the more advanced mechanics along the way

>>722936347
How were those shitty?

>>722937063
Because its an older thing and you like it.

>>722935880 (OP)
Because modern devs are all cut from the same cloth, and by cloth I mean used toilet paper

>>722937063
They're fucking boring. Seamlessly explaining how the game works intuitively is something that is unironically an older practice. This kind of shit was basically exclusive to some 80s games and 90s pc games.

>>722935880 (OP)
I remember Dishonored you could play hide and seek if you wanted and that was like an optional tutorial built straight into it.
Some games need a tutorial, but not really Doom or Half Life, Half Life lets you try on the Jump Pack for a second but I didn't really know how it all worked until I played the Xen remake

>>722935880 (OP)
Actual reason is that games don't come with manuals anymore so you have to build it into the game.

>>722935880 (OP)
>Player skips tutorial
>Encounters difficulty due to skipping tutorial
>Whines online, leaves a negative review, tells others not to buy the game

Times have changed, the modern audience isn't going to spend time getting good at a game or consider any failure their own fault instead of the blaming the game.

>>722935880 (OP)
They include them in the story now to help pad out the game through the refund period.

>>722937298
>Seamlessly explaining how the game works intuitively is something that is unironically an older practice.
But that would leave you with the start of the game being all a long ass semi-tutorial if there is a lot to explain. Games with more complicated systems do profit from a seperate tutorial. Plus you can add some worldbuilding or narrative in the tutorial mission to still make it engaging.

>>722938175
If the modern audience is too stupid to learn how to play the game, they clearly weren't my audience to begin with, nomalfags fuck off.

At one point cowadooties ended up with tutorial levels longer than the actual game.

>>722938754
I agree with this high-mindedness but if you want to actually sell something then you need a peanut-brain way to get into it or experience some significant portion of it.

>>722939323
I don't want normalfags playing video games.

>>722935880 (OP)
>"optional" tutorial level
>contains permanent character bonuses

>>722936446
Did anyone actually play the Deus Ex tutorial level? The game's start is already tutorial island anyway

>>722936160
Wait, are there actually games that do that?

>>722939629
yes, cant remember any titles but i remember how fucking low effort it was

>>722939629
nta but Satisfactory comes to mind.

>>722939629
A whole bunch of strategy games do it. IIRC Foxhole and Hearts of Iron are guilty

>>722939629
yeah like Dead Island and shit
"How to Survive" is a piece of trash but as it's functional it's a laugh to play and they have god awful fake-Russian accents with a bunch of video tutorials for every thing, like thirty minutes of it or something's worth through the game maybe

>>722936775
>People under 20
>People

I blame rogueli*es for popularizing the concept of having the player figure it all out (he'll read a wikia anyway).

>>722939629
I bet they monetize the videos too.

>>722935880 (OP)
I didn't even know Half Life had tutorial levels. I just played the game and beat it no problem

>>722935880 (OP)
>lust provoking image

>>722939629
Line War did that and for a game with a completely new control scheme it should've had a tutorial. It also initially didn't have an AI skirmish opponent to practice on, you could only switch between players to control both sides like a dumbass.

>>722936347
this. tutorials were always considered shit game design

>>722935880 (OP)
I'm also sad to see manuals gone. It was nice to read a quick start guide, digest finer details about some less obvious mechanics, go over the hints and tips, have a handy cheat sheet for future reference, and see some lore tidbits here and there. Making a nice manual was an art form by itself.

>>722936347
I really liked it in Deus Ex. Giving you a place to set up your buttons and resolution and shit without it feeling like part of the story is great.

tutorials are only good if they have fun secrets like lara's mansion in tomb raider

>>722942228
They're good if they have their own little mini stories or they flesh out the world. Fire Emblem: The Blazing Blade (Lyn's story) and Half-Life (hazard course) both nailed it in their own ways