Why is she just not connecting with the masses?

>>57974161 (OP)
She is. It's only autistic Ashtards that refuse to embrace her.

>>57974161 (OP)
I don't mind Liko personally but I don't really want to look at that abomination Meowscarada all the time, if she ditched it for Charizard I'd be glued to the series

She's an OC doughnut steel.
People would much rather watch the protags of their respective games as the MC. Same reason why people are turned-off by trAsh

>>57974183
Ash wasn't an OC, he was literally just Red

Why do people focus on Liko when Horizons has two protagonists? Roy is just as much "the protagonist" as Liko is. Both are equal.

>>57974189
The donut steel OC version of red

>>57974189
Red won the Indigo League though.
Also why'd they change his design so much when most of the other characters remained mostly intact?

>>57974161 (OP)
>White
>Female

>>57974195
>Roy is just as much "the protagonist" as Liko is. Both are equal.

>>57974195
Roy is so boring he makes people prefer the purple haired bitch that barely does anything instead

>>57974161 (OP)
Hollow, cheap, insincere and unsatisfying like every game since we hit the 3ds

>>57974161 (OP)
why?
>Boring design
>Generic personality
>Basic story
He is a faggot

Like is a generic shojo protagonist inserted into Pokemon. And that's the problem. This isn't a shojo series. She doesn't fit.

>>57974220
>This isn't a shojo series.
It is now.

>>57974222
Pretty sure it's still kodomo

>Shillcario (Piss color)
>Shillkachu
>Shillgimmick
>And yet he's STILL less popular than the fucking sideline purple character
Name a bigger flop

>>57974254
Tracey

>>57974254
Any mcu series

>>57974254
Your mom

>descendant of a legendary hero
>has a legendary handed to her that was previously owned by said legendary ancestor's wife
>is always bailed out by the plot or other characters (usually Friede), almost never has to solve any problems herself

She's a modern anime protagonist in all the worst ways

don't ask nigko troons why the series is failing
>>57974254
>terashit is so ugly and stupid they have to shove in BOTH shiny and mega into the anime to make everyone like niggoy

>>57974161 (OP)
The masses want the same thing over and over again. Fuck the masses, they're why the games don't innovate anymore. The only argument people have against Liko is that she isn't Ash.

>>57974168
/thread

>>57974319
No, the masses just want something good, and Liko isn't a good protagonist

sametrannying won't save your dying series, troonko shilljeets

>>57974313
>they have to shove in BOTH shiny and mega into the anime
And yet it still flopped

>>57974319
If your protagonist doesn't appeal to the masses, your series is going to fail. Protagonists are limited by the fact that they have to be super generic in order to appeal to as many people as possible. Whereas with side characters, a creator can do whatever they want

>>57974168
Ratings say otherwise. No one cares about hero-ancestry, one-dimensional, gets-legendaries-on-silver-platter, absolutely-no-goals-in-life vanilla girl outside of gooners.

>>57974254
Pokémon related? Zeraora

shes popular in spain and korea for some reason

>>57974347
"Ratings" also said that nobody cares about SM and JN Ash that won everything all the time btw

>i share a board with autistic self-inserting browns who JUST can't accept life moved on
You should all kill yourselves.

>>57974478
Liko is prime self-insert material for girls.

>>57974189
Loved it when Red lost at Sinnoh.
>>57974275
Aside from the third thing being blatantly false, what you described is a huge improvement.

>>57974313
In order to answer why the series is failing we have to accept it doing so first, and you haven't ever posted any proof about the show that released alongside the second most sold pair of games failing.

>>57974325
>the masses just want something good
If that were the case Ash would've been retired long ago.

>>57974488
Ash has nothing to do with why the anime sucked

>>57974494
Ash isn't a real person anon.

>>57974486
Liko's entire arc is almost entirely defined by who she's related to rather than anything she herself does

>Grandma is a famous explorer
>Descendant of a legendary hero who had a freaking Rayquaza and five other special snowflakes.
>Has Terapagos as her family heirloom
>Literally described as the key to finding Rakua
>Literally looks like a female version of her legendary ancestor

If she was male, people would be calling her a blatant self-insert character, and that'd be right.

>>57974505
>Liko's entire arc is almost entirely defined by who she's related to rather than anything she herself does
The plot is, her growth and her goal of understanding the feelings of pokemon came out from her.
But you kind of have to actually watch the show to know what we're talking about and it seems you phisically can't, as ash isn't in it.
>If she was male, people would be calling her a blatant self-insert character, and that'd be right.
You ashfags already do this with her being female.

>>57974161 (OP)
I wonder how long will this thread last, they report everything saying something bad about their series under "genwarring" but they can call everyone they don't like an Ashfag, do the same and call them Likofags or Horizonfags? You get banned

>>57974161 (OP)
The while anime both this and the Ashime have been shit since the end of the DP era

>>57974254
They really did all of this just for the anime to keep flopping Fucking Kek

>>57974559
*whole

>>57974535
A lot of the deleted posts in question are just either turning it into /pol/territory or obsess over trannies out of nowhere. Doesn't help that those retards are doing it sometimes back to back only to then throw a fit when their shit gets wiped faster every time.

>>57974168
>if I say it loud enough it’ll become real
look at the numbers

>>57974442
>Ratings" also said that nobody cares about SM
Correct. Are you trying to make a point?

>>57974424
Well, she's spanish.

>>57974161 (OP)
Alienated the core audience in hopes to nabbing the girl audience

>>57974486
games =/= anime
really tells a lot about cringeko slop when you have to flaunt the sales of the games (worst looking and running games in the entire series, yet one of the best selling pokemon titles, unlike the failing cringeko slop)

>>57974442
>"Ratings" also said that nobody cares about SM
Because it was trash, with a fucking abhorrent artstyle desperately trying to emulate Yokai Watch.
>JN
the worst season of the anime period.
>that won everything all the time btw
Ash's win in Alola's """league""" was purely in response to the backlash over Ash losing in Kalos. Reminder that all of the OG writers left the show over that, btw.

The anime has been downhill for years

Believe in DotLiko.

>>57975341
Gross no

>>57974347
>hero-ancestry, one-dimensional, gets-legendaries-on-silver-platter
Ash?

>>57975341
t. Meowscarada

>>57975341
Peak Ashnime romance was a literal kiss from Serena to Ash.

Unless Liko kisses Dot or vice versa, there's nothing of value to discuss.

>>57975497
>mu-muh childhoods am revelant
Funny, you'd think the series retrospective would have hinted towards that if so. Instead, they focused on an entirely different girl, who kissed Ash to far greater reaction.

>>57975704
Dumb furfag.

>>57975711
Seething self-inserter.

>>57974161 (OP)
She is, and that makes you angry. You're one of the few remaining holdouts that's unable to appreciate cute little girls.

>>57974161 (OP)
Because it's just a solid 7/10 and to be viral in the modern world, you need it to be either a generational masterpiece or horrendous slop, and HZ is neither

Plus the last 8-9 years of ashnime left everyone exhausted and most people moved on from pokémon altogether long before it even ended. Most people hardly heard about HZ's existence. So you have just a small group of people who gave it a shot and liked it, and another small group of seething ashfags and that's the entire conversation about the series

I predict it will go down as some niche "cult" series to rediscover in a few years

>>57975875
>I predict it will go down as some niche "cult" series to rediscover in a few years
I can see that happening.

>>57975704
>>57975740
Ngl, it's pretty neat that she won.

why do tranime cringeko spicjeet simps get so mad at people pointing out their series is failing?

>>57974254
Greninja

>>57975465
hey now!
ash doesnt have a hero ancestry, it was actually part of the point hes a nobody from a town of nobodys
those other things however are sadly true

>>57977376
He didn't start his journey with Melmetal nor Solgaleo tho, Poipole fucked off to his world too and they weren't hand me downs from his legendary family with books talking about their legendary adventures.

And he raised Solgaleo since he was an egg

It’s actually doing fine in anywhere but America fgt :)

>>57974161 (OP)
She's just kind of boring, especially for a series like Pokémon.

>>57974347
What do TV ratings even mean anymore? Do kids even watch TV anymore?

>>57974161 (OP)
She has the personality of a cardboard or so do the other two
Also she's plain as shit design wise too

>>57974161 (OP)
She’s connecting just fine with my penis

>>57974161 (OP)
We want Ash

They really need to either get rid of Roy or get rid of Uruto and replace them with the Litten girl and Anne, this Pokemon is no longer for boys but hte Percure audience no one cares about the Rising Volt Tacklers either young cute girls sell much better now than back in the day boys are off watching hyper violent anime while manchildren and girls are watching this stuff now

>>57978143
They completely fucked up with Roy.
You just can tell he was shoehorned in by some exec as a safeline in case people wouldn't like Liko and gotta have a backup male MC think of the Ash self-inserters what if the kids think a FemMC is yucky.
And then they double downed on him after the time-skip. And now he's by far the most hated character in the series.
>no one cares about the Rising Volt Tacklers
I dipped out when Friede got revealed, and the RVT just made me more secure on my choice. Nothing I've heard or about of Horizons has made me regret my decision. I'm truly fucking sick and tired of OC and I don't understand why the anime is so fucking obsessed with them.

>>57978143
>no one cares about the Rising Volt Tacklers

The writers aren't doing enough to make us care. Funny thing is, the writers are very much capable of it. For whatever reason, they just wanna sideline the crew so hard.

>>57974856
That's more as a source than everything you ever said these last 2 years.

>>57975875
The idea makes sense and this appears an honest answer.
But you're assuming what OP said is right.

>>57977336
Greninja merch is still selling to this day unlike floprace

>>57978156
>OC
Pretty much all of the ashnime characters aside from Cynthia I guess were basically OCs (because Cynthia was pretty much the only one who had an accurate personality of an in game character).

Brock is nothing like in Firered. May is way way different than she is in Emerald.

OCs are nice. I guess Horizons problems mostly stem from the anime not being "brave" enough to commit to making Liko the solo MC, as in with Roy around he always keep distracting the viewer from the story without adding any entertainment value. They don't really have that wholesome ashnime team dynamic either.

Yeah if they hadn't added Roy and made it initially more Liko focused Horizons would have been way more wholesome to watch.

>>57977376
>ash doesnt have a hero ancestry
Isn't he a descendant of the dude from the Lucario movie? That's how he can manipulate aura

>>57978637
No but he shares the same signature as that guy, which is the same shit as making it a blood relation.

>>57974161 (OP)
I like her though. Wouldn't be watching the show if she wasn't around.

>>57978589
>But you're assuming what OP said is right.
Unfortunately there's some truth. Forget about ratings or dodgy "analytics" sites, people in social media are indeed not talking enough about HZ and I say this as someone who likes it.
I don't know what the suits were expecting from the series, maybe HZ is doing just like expected, maybe they thought it would be as big as prime ashnime, I don't really know. The fact now OLM is outsourcing this to hell while their best staff moves onto some seasonal slop signals they stopped giving a fuck.

Although it's hilarious that the more they try to turn Roy into Ash, the less popular he is. This shows nobody likes Ash except ashfags who won't give anyone else a chance

>>57978780
>Unfortunately there's some truth.
Where?
>This shows nobody likes Ash except ashfags who won't give anyone else a chance
You're doing a terrible job at selling that you're not an ashfag you know.

>>57978156
>And then they double downed on him after the time-skip. And now he's by far the most hated character in the series.
I felt alright about Roy pre timeskip, at least he was the warm happy-go-lucky genki boy to make the contrast with Liko's quiet and melancholic nature. Now they're pushing him as the cool serious shonen MC and it just doesn't click.
The additions around him are awful too, Ult's entire purpose seems to make Roy look serious and mature while being an extremely unlikeable, bitter flanderization of pre timeskip Roy himself. At least Roy was a positive boy who always was ready to help, Ult is basically a redditor that yells at people.
Lucario has no flashback, no personality, no interactions, it's just a big shiny gun. It's like an anime version of a genned pokémon (I mean it's even shiny). Using it to beat Nemona was truly jumping the shark, at least using his loyal Crocalor would have been more palatable. This is the most blatant suit order, of course they have to promote Megas again.

>I'm truly fucking sick and tired of OC
I think the message is "if you want to follow the game's story and characters, play the games". An adaptation from SV's story would be kino, but they don't want to repeat stories across the franchise and I can see where they're coming from.
And as >>57978628 points out, most anime characters are OCs; they just have a skin you're familiar with. Their game counterparts aren't well fleshed out enough in the first place, so the anime has to expand and improvise. This is hardly different to just putting an OC.
OCs can be done the right way, just look at Paldean Winds. The problem is the suits. Always has been.

>>57978780
You can't really "turn" Roy into Ash without at least committing him to at least one Gym+League cycle and by the time Roy would go through that, he'd naturally get his own battling style and Pokemon personality.

The thing about Ash is, he may not be the coolest but he's gone through the grind, way more than any other shonen character except for Kenichi maybe. That summons respect for the character that's hard to replicate in a premise like Horizons where Roy feels extremely out of place.

Since Horizons is directed by the Eureka 7 guy Dai Satou, Roy had to be more like Renton, a somewhat angsty "in search of a purpose dude" in ashnime equation it would be something like Drew from the Advanced seasons.

>>57978764
OH YES! I WANT HER TO GRIND A MUDSDALE'S DICK AGAINST HER CHEST LIKE SHE'S BRUSHING HER TEETH!

>>57978800
>he's gone through the grind, way more than any other shonen character
And achieved less.

I agree you can't turn Roy into Ash because Roy doesn't have simps that are willing to see a character fail for 20+ years.

>>57978800
Those equations are fucking dogshit. Roy knew what he wanted and that was Fug. Now something more urgent came up that is also a giant middle finger to Fug itself and he got his ass up to do something about it. Forcing those parallels ends up being 80% of the time retarded.

tpc dont care, riko is staying, new event soon !

>>57978812
>Roy knew what he wanted and that was Fug. Now something more urgent came up that is also a giant middle finger to Fug itself and he got his ass up to do something about it.
This is very complex and deep storytelling for ashfags to be fair.

>>57978817
Shut the fuck up falseflagging fucker, I wasn't talking to you

>getting mad at someone agreeing with you

>>57974161 (OP)
she lacks Ash's aura

>>57978825
He's probably disappointed that the people that agree with him just hide behind their dislike of Ash and sperg out like babies. With friends like these..

>>57978853
He's dissapointed people who don't like ash indeed do not like ash?

>>57978825
I am not mad, I am just not gonna put up with a single retard who feels the need to chip in everywhere even when not asked or being talked.

>>57978861
>Shut the fuck up falseflagging fucker
>not mad

>>57978864
>Thinking this is getting mad on 4chan of all places
How much of a baby are you?

>the guy who insults someone literally agreeing calls anyone else a baby

I find pretty interesting how some individuals accuse Liko of being too special while defending Ash who:

>has been the chosen one for about a billion times
>has a special Pikachu who is strong and different from other Pikachu for plot-mandated reasons
>can wield aura powers and use those same powers to allow ghosts to move on from earthly realm (yes, really)
>can somehow use his aura abilities to power up his bullshit Lucario (naturally, this is just a cheap writing technique to let him win stuff)
>was granted a special Ash-Greninja form that nobody else has because god forbid he got a mega evolution like the average joe
>was targeted by Lysandre because our special boy unlocked a special phenomenon that nobody in the world has
>was given a female companion who canonically has feelings for him and who kissed him
>was given an amateur rival who wants to be like him (lol)
>was unable to beat a singular league until the pathetic Alola League, at which point the writers decided he's now on the same level as veteran Champions (literally what the fuck)
>conquered several veteran Champions and their seasoned teams with his 5 freshly caught Pokemon + Pikachu, one of whom is literally a babymon Lucario who hatched from an egg like a month ago
>somehow defeated Cynthia and Leon, Champions previously presented as untouchable and unbeatable (WHAT THE FUCK????????)
>somehow won the title of world champion and the strongest trainer in the world

Ash used to be a cool character, but at some point his character morphed into a hollow shell of his former self who primarily exists for wish fulfillment and fanservice. I'll take a character like Liko over a character like Ash any day of the week.

She is the first new main character in nearly 30 years, and the format is just very different now. The show doesn't follow a Pokemon League style progression or an adventure across the latest Region anymore, and is doing its own original thing.

Ash was on this huge, sort of linear journey competing for Gym Badges and exploring the world. Badges, tournament arcs, rival battles, easy checkpoints to follow like the games. For better or worse, people got so invested in this that we had huge meltdowns and news headlines over him.

>>57978950
Ash started from zero and Pikachu wasn't special at all, how come retards always mention that without even knowing basic stuff like Pikachu blowing up TR the first time after being powered by a dozen or more of his kin in the Pokémon Center or he was a jobber that only got strong until Hoenn?

>>57974173
LIZARDON! UUUOOOOOOO
KANTOOOOOOO

>>57974161 (OP)
No fanservice scenes

>>57974161 (OP)
TPC overestimated their pedophile base.

>>57979035
Yeah, everyone knows furryfags are like 70% of their audience, scalpers 15%, kids 5% and pedos 10%

>>57975711
Is it really even furry if she has a human form she uses liberally? She's sort of like a manakete from FE or one of those dragon gods from Rune Factory.

Audiences don't connect to Mary Sues that get everything handed to them by the plot.

the pokemo anime is fucking ugly and terrible even other long running anime like bayblade x, one piece precure etc,, look so fucking better, better artstyle and animation, pokeshit is in the bottom barrel trash lol tpc really dont give a shit

>>57979292
even western cartoons look better than pokemon anime, sad

>>57974197
You guys know that if they made an anime more closely based on red he would end up deviating from the original if it went past like 1 season. Making the anime characters the same as the main characters would have zero impact on the story are you retarded? Did you want a retread of the exact same story in the games?

>>57978639
Nope Ash only reminded Lucario 9f Aaron due to their similar attitudes and both having aura abilities, nothing else. No other connection between the two therwise.

>>57974183
>Same reason why people are turned-off by trAsh
ah yes let's ignore the entire world rushing to spectate with bated breath and streamer cannons at the ready peak Shounen Ash finally securing his long awaited first League win
that definitely didn't happen

>>57978956
this loss literally killed the anime so badly they tried to make up for it by having him win the next 2 (and final) leagues back to back, and it *still* didn't work

Fool us once, shame on you
Fool us twice, shame on us
Fool us three times, can't get fooled again

Three strikes and we checked out for good
Fuck those cunts

>>57978573
The older characters are the best part for sure, it brings in some of the more "mature" elements people want without being grimdark edgy which would be a dumb cringe direction to go. The kid characters suck and are annoying but they're on par with ash and his companions. Liko is kinda just the opposite of early ash personality wise, he was overconfident arrogant and hot headed although he did calm down as the series went on. They didn't really write the development well and he ended up coming across as more childlike and it could just be a change of direction with the writing and not actual character development. Conversely Liko is introverted and heavily self doubting but they are writing her maturing much more realistically which is promising. I lost interest once they started doing the gym and terastal stuff but I've been catching up since the time skip. I think it's about as good as we're gonna get considering pokemon will always be a kid centric franchise, it doesn't really matter if it's a boy character with a girl sidekick or vice versa imo.

>>57978628
>>57978950
CYNTHIA PERSONALITY IS GOYSLOP NIGGER

STOP SIMPING FOR LYING FHETAING SKANKS AND KIKES SIMP

STAY DELUSIONAL AND ON WASTING WELAFRE

The thing beside her looks like shit.

>>57980882
If you even got to Kalos you were fooled 5 times already. Its entirely on you.

>>57982040
>her

>>57974161 (OP)
Because my cock should be connecting with her cunny instead.

>>57982197

>>57983209
>IMG_
cringe faggot kys

Autism ITT

nobody likes new protagonist other anime tried and flopped even dbz tried with gohan lol didnt work, my hero academia vigilantes was the biggest flop last season without deku and bakugo

>>57983300
No one cares about dekucuck

That is one FAT pawmot

Well, it's because she's boring. She's the typical girl, but in the main protagonist role. I know that anons will seethe about Ash, but at least he had bants with Brock and Misty back in the day. Liko just has no spice to her.