>people assume megas and tera being in means all gimmicks are in
>the reality is they are just the two currently relevant mechanics used in gen 9

Dynashit and cringe moves weren't particularly liked by competitive players, or anyone for that matter. Why would they bother?

>>57986668 (OP)
Isn't Dynamax the most praised by the competitive crowd with Megas being more popular among casuals?

>>57986668 (OP)
Mega Evolution is a very independent mechanic (essentially, it's just a form change) while Z-Moves/Dynamax/Tera conflict with each other in many points. This is the real reason why Z-Moves and Dynamax won't be in, they can hardly coexist.

>>57986700
>Isn't Dynamax the most praised by the competitive crowd

doesn't showdown have everything anyway? who cares about this?

Through to be honest, I'm rather curious since a Tera is an outside source rather than a held item like a z crystal could a teralized pokemon activate a Z move? would the Z move's power be boosted by the tera's boost? would they stack

That could be bullshit even more than dynamax and mega, wait, dynamax is an outside source as well so could a tera pokemon dynamax while holding a z crystal to fire off a triple boosted z move?!

>>57986767
I would assume that all Pokemon are capable of Tera, but if you mega evolve (or activate another gimmick), then they can't tera anymore. At least that's how it should be, it would bridge the power gap between megas and normal Pokemon a little bit.

>>57986700
That largely depends on the community. VGC players like Dynamax. Smogon players hate Dynamax. If we're talking from a casual standpoint, Dynamax is the most polarizing mechanic in a Pokemon game

>>57986700
Are you fucking retarded?

>>57987315
Dynamax is too swingy in singles-- no wonder that Smogon hates it. But as much as TPC wants to believe that most people will play doubles; if players are given the option in Champions, they will choose singles (choose 3) most of the time.

>>57987315
>VGC players like Dynamax
Wrong, it was kinda fun at the beginning but you won't find many people that liked at by the end of gen 8

>>57987327
Dynamax was fine I played Swsh doubles a lot more than SV doubles, that’s partially because SV had a bunch of stupid shit day one though like Dondozo

>>57987331
Dondozo was only stupid in the first few rulesets, dynamax was an overpowered cancer that lasted the whole generation

>>57987327
My only gripe with it was how it paired extremely well with Weakness Policy. I think that a meta that allows Dynamax should also not allow the Weakness Policy item, since the natural weakness of Dynamaxed Pokemon is that you cannot swap out without wasting your Dynamax, and covering yourself by slapping on a Weakness Policy and also being able to utilize moves that target the entire field sometimes feels like you're doing way too much in a single turn for it not to be an overpowered tactic.
Other than that, Dynamax was great because the effects of the moves supported a specific archtype which was predictable (ex: if I see a Flying type Pokemon, it probably has Max Airstream or whatever the fuck that move was called so I can expect speed control).

>>57986700
>implying casualfags opinion matters
They'd just use "Aura" and "Hype" as an argument it's not worth it

>>57987348
Dynamax doesn’t really occupy a design space where you can say it’s OP

>>57987315
>VGC players like Dynamax
no we don't. A vocal minority does.
there's a reason why Spikemuth Doubles caught steam

>>57987362
It's OP in the sense that 3 turns of your dynamax mon basically controls the pace of the whole match, they have too many bonuses.

>*Spores your dynamax mon*
Now what retard?

>>57987390
Sleep? What's that?

Tera forms sucks

Only singlesfags like megas

>>57987524
>Tera forms
No such thing exist

>>57986668 (OP)
btw this was conceived from the champions tournament from the anime. It will have all gimmicks. The next direct will show Pikachu's Z move and G-Max Charizard. It's a battle-only game focused on battle mechanics. They're not going to blow their content load in the introduction trailer.

>>57986668 (OP)
Champions is a direct response to everyone who whined about Journeys mixing and matching gimmicks, even down to letting Ash use a Mega, a Dynamax AND a Z-Move all in the same fight.
The mechanics are bound to rotate, but there WILL be periods where you can utilize at least three at a time, maybe even special occasions where ALL of them are usable.

>>57987543
>>57987572
I don't really see it that way at all. Rather, Champions is the result of mainline games experimenting with different battle systems, giving a platform for things like new megas that otherwise wouldn't be implemented in the next competitive game, i.e. gen 10.

Is anyone else preparing for VGC 2026? I've been breeding for a shiny Metagross in ORAS and I've got my Charizard and Venusaur from SWSH ready to go.

>>57986668 (OP)
Why would the game advertise 2 out of the 4 gimmicks and not have all 4?
That’s like saying any Pokemon not found in the advertisement isn’t going to being in the game.

>>57987883
I think it could be just tera and megas since teras are the current gimmick and they're bringing back megas for A-Z. I'm not saying they'll never have dynamax or z-moves, but it might not be at launch.

Terrastellization and megas don't really interact, even on the same pokemon, so it seems like it would be easier to implement than juggling all 4.

>>57987648
For me, it's all about marks since they're relatively new and also have an effect in battle. I have been hitting up the days of the month that are one specific weather type for specific weather related marks in Sword, and in Scarlet while I haven't found an exact target to go for, I'm pretty much ready to kick it off at any point.
I also have a Catch-of-the-day Lapras.

>>57986668 (OP)
I can't see Dynamax appearing in the same battles with Megas and Teras, but maybe they'll give it it's own mode.

>>57987648
Yes, I'm guessing some genmons will be released at launch (+the mons that have mega), guessing mechanics and breeding teams accordingly.
If I'm right, its a upstart, if I'm wrong whelp, breeding is fun I guess.

>>57986700
Tera has passed Dynamax at this point, but yes, before Gen 9 Dynamax was praised over Megas. The fact any Pokemon can do it and it doesn't take an item means you aren't constrained at the team building or team preview stages like you are with Megas. You can ALWAYS find a good Max user in any game, but if you don't like the megas available or your mega has a bad matchup into the other team, you're fucked.

Betting its seasons

>>57987883
I don't doubt we'll see Z moves and Dynamax eventually, but I suspect the 2026 season is probably going to be Tera Season in the fall, PLZA comes out, Mega Season in the winter and spring, Tera + Mega season in the summer for Worlds. It lines up with the release dates of the games.

>>57986700
Yes. At least in VGC. I went to a number of VGC tournaments during the Gen 8 days (well what few they held in person due to Covid) and almost everyone loved Dynamax.

I want to know if we'll be able to change Tera types on Pokemon that aren't in Scarlet or Violet. Foe example, can I get a Water-Tera Jynx?

>>57987327
>>57987377
They loved Dynamax. I've interacted with thousands of VGC players and most of them liked Dynamax. Also looking up 'Spikemuth Doubles' yields no results.

>>57987327
Did Wolfey tell you that?

I can't speak for singles or Smogon because I haven't played either of those formats seriously since 2006 but in VGC, Terastalization and Dynamax are about equally good, with a power gap between them and Z-Moves, then Gems, and then Megas. Mega formats might as well be single restricted formats, given that
you build your team around your mega and if yours doesn't match up well against your opponent you're kinda fucked. Even on a meta level, you're kinda stuck using 3-5 viable choices for Mega based on what's strong and what can beat the other strong Megas, with the rest of them being essentially cannon fodder. I do like that certain megas have some utility in their base forms (Kangaskhan having Scrappy Fake Out, Manectric having Lightning Rod, Salamence having Intimidate, etc) but I don't think it's often enough to justify dropping an item on two mons, and dual mega teams fizzled out pretty early in 2014 for that reason. There's also the last wrinkle (shared by Z moves and gems) that at least with Dynamax and Terastalizing, if your main user can't use the gimmick for whatever reason you can still reasonably get some mileage out of the gimmick with your other mons. That's not the case with Megas, where if you lose your Mega for nothing in return you've pretty much lost the game right there.

>>57988315
Wolfey actually came up with an argument no one has yet deconstructed and i doubt megafags are even mentally capable of doing such

They already confirmed there's going to be regulation sets and most likely availability rotations, due to announcing not everything in Home will be able to go to Champions.
What's most likely to happen is Tera and Megas appear at launch. then as rotations occur and rulesets change, they add Dynamax, Z-Moves (can't see 'em adding Gen 10's gimmick until Gen 10 sales settle down to a trickle. Can't overshadow the VGC games).

>>57988423
As long as availability rotations only matter for competitive and not casual battles.It'd suck to not be allowed to use your Bannette against your friend in season 3 because they decided to only add it for season 2

The problem with Dynamax was fucking Flying Type not getting the same damage nerf that Fighting and Poison got. In fact it might've even needed to be weaker than those.

>>57988501
>CHARIZARD’s secondary type got the most broken Max move
Surprise surprise

>>57988506
This is unironically why Max Airstream is so good, by the way. Air Slash or Hurricane are ALWAYS on Leon's Charizard.

>>57988460
>not understanding
They've already TOLD you they're not adding everything ever available in-series, you spastic fucking child. That means you're gonna have to deal with Bannete being benched in time, just as it only showed up in 3 of the last 7 game releases stretching back 9 years.

>>57986700
I liked Dynamax. Using things like Weakness Policy and Beat Up to boost stats was fun.

>>57988501
No the problem with Dynamax is that you got so much from using it.
>Double HP let any Pokemon with even sub-par bulk tank any neutral attack and even super effective hits.
>Not only that, but that Double HP halved indirect damage too because I guess fuck you
>It didn’t require an item, so you could use Life Orb (recoil being half), Weakness Policy (took SE hits effectively like they are neutral), Weakness Berries, Choice items (that would become disabled once your Dynamaxed and would be re-enabled afterwards), etc.
>This also meant at any time, any Pokemon could Dynamax (in contrast, Z moves required you to choose 1 Pokemon and what type you’d be using too)
>Max Moves were around 130 BP, but because you can hold Life Orb, they would be as strong as Z-moves.
>You got 3, got to choose each move, and each move also sets up at the same time which also sets up your ally in Doubles
>In addition to Double HP, 3 even better Z-moves, and ability to use Dynamax on anything, you also get a bunch of random immunities to different thing like
>Flinching (specifically from Fake Out)
>Encore
>Destiny Bond
>Phaze moved
>Torment
>Disable
>Skill Swap
>Weight based moves
>Oh and using a glitch, you can have +1 Trick Room. Not Trick Room getting -6 priority, but Trick Room having the same priority as Quick Attack

>>57986668 (OP)
If only they made Dyna and Z-moves faster, I would have no problem with those in that piece of shit game, I would also love to murder Dynamax Pokémon with megas.

>>57986700
No, absolutely not.
Dynamax was competetively awful because it was straight up broken on paper and in practice.
>Doubles HP
>Dmax can hold items, like life orb
>moves become 100-150BP
>moves have status, buff, debuff, terrain, weather, or 1/6 damage to ALL opposing mons every turn
>Max moves hit through protect at 25% damage which is still massive
>Max mons keep their abilities

The only people who really, really like the meta game being that ridiculously powerful were those who enjoy double restricted formats like we have now. The instances where D-max wasn't just a rich get richer were few and far between to the point where only a few singular instances try to be cited as if that's representative.
You were D-maxing Kyogre and bringing Tacian every time, don't pretend.

If you want to take a look at some damage calcs, look up what Solar Power G-Max Charizard does in the sun with life orb, if you had Groudon next to it to set the sun, Charizard was a nuke that was literally 2x as powerful as Mega Charizard Y ever was plus the Max Wildfire did 1/6 damage to opposing mons every turn.

>>57988398
Wolfe's argument was just
>I like really powerful metas
Yeah, good for you bud. I too like it when every team has Zacian on it and your other restricted is generally Kyogre(resists behemoth blade and life orb, rain boosted max geyser was insane too)
I think he's just disappointed that the meta didn't get the opportunity to mature, but I really think the centralization would ended in the same result.

If Dynamax is gonna come back, it needs to be nerfed severally.
Not only because its just broken, but because it invalidates Z moves entirely.

>>57990253
Not only does it invalidate Z moves, it makes megas completely pointless too.
Dynamax being in the game would be so centralizing that if you had to make a choice between the different gimmicks, you'd choose it every time.
There's actually no way to balance it unless you severely cripple it, like capping max moves to 120BP, making health bonus just 1.5x, nerfing some of the bespoke moves some mons have like Gmax wildfire's passive damage, making the damage through protect a mere 12.5%, max airstream caps out at 100BP like the other team buffing moves, PREVENTING HELD ITEMS from working during those 3 turns, etc.
It would really need to be carefully tested to ensure it could coexist and still produce value.

>>57990296
There are some megas that you’d use over Dynamax mostly because of their abilities and longevity, but yeah it invalidates basically every other gimmick.

But anyways, here’s how at least I’d nerf it.
>Dynamax now requires a Dynamax Orb
>Dynamax HP now acts like a “Super Substitute”. You get choose how much HP you sacrifice for the Substitute and that amount of HP*2 (capped at 75% user’s Max HP) how much the Substitute has.
>So for example, if you have 400 max HP and want to sacrifice 100, the Super Sub will have 150 HP and your Dynamax Pokemon will have 300 HP left. If you want to sacrifice 250 HP, it only gives you a 300 HP Super Sub and you’ll have 150 HP remaining on the Pokemon.
>The Super Sub otherwise acts like a normal Sub but despawns after 3 turns
>Max Moves are identical besides 2 aspects. Being that only the first move in your moveslot becomes a Max/GMax move, and any affects stat increases affect only the Dynamax users for how ever long they Dynamaxed
>Remove all the nonsensical immunities Dynamax has too. Only immunities you should have are the ones you get from the Super Substitute and those immunities stop existing once the Super Sub is broken
The mechanic is way less broken now but still keeps it identity and is still worth using.

>>57990789
>Dynamax now requires a Dynamax Orb
If Dynamax gets nerfs then one of them is 100% gonna be needing to hold an item. Would also be an easy way to tell if something is going to be Gigantamax too, as they could have a Dynamax Orb and Gigantamax Orb.

>>57990084
>doesnt know what he's talking about
retarded

>>57986700
I see people say this anecdotally, but I never really see any actual source or stats.

>>57987323
Delusional smogite.

>>57987606
It's an excuse to shut down showdown. The very fact they're releasing a F2P battle sim means they're now directly competing vs showdown, which means they're going to a judge for a shutdown order.#
>>57987883
Because they're starting with those two, then likely removing one to add a different one (or removing both and adding the other two).

>>57988636
Why get so angry at a post you can't read properly?

>>57987883
The general public likes the quirky hats and megas, so dynamax and Z-shitters are being removed permanently. If only.

>>57991289
>It's an excuse to shut down showdown
If they wanted to shut down Showdown they could have easily done so years ago. Showdown gives Gamefreak way too much free data on competitive pokemon to ever shut down.

>>57991235
That was his argument effectively.
I watched it and he cited less than 5 unusual uses for dynamax and then proceeded to glaze the insane power it offered. Rich get richer.
He liked that meta, I and a portion of players didn't. In fact I really liked almost nothing about gen 8, but that's not a unique opinion.
Ask players which meta they liked best and I bet many of them will say 2018.

>>57986668 (OP)
CVCK CHAMPIONS!

>>57987648
I'm gonna use the shiny Pidgey I caught in HGSS and get the legend ribbon before transferring it to home.

>>57991312
No it doesn't. Most of mongos play singles, in one the smoggy tiers. The online Vs system gives them better, more correlatable data than a bunch of western retards ever will. They didn't bother as it wasn't worth their arse (they weren't copying the games, just the engine). Now they have an app EXPLICITLY based around the battle engine (and monetised) thus having an actual "valid" reason to shut them down (interfering with our delivery of our products) and not put the fear of fuck into ALL the faggot fan content creators.

>>57986767
No. They refuse to implement a format with all gimmicks out of spite.

>>57986767
I was under the assumption that you'd only get to choose 1 gimmick to have on your team, not all 4 at once.

>>57986668 (OP)
Doesn't really matter if it launches with just Megas and Teras; I just hope it happens eventually.

>>57986700
>Isn't Dynamax the most praised by the competitive crowd with Megas being more popular among casuals?
Lmao anon. The only people who praised the MAX mechanic were shills and grifters, they jumped ship as soon as Tera was announced, praising it as the best and most balanced mechanic and saying MAX was shit all along.

>>57986668 (OP)
I just want more fucking info on this game. We can only barely form assumptions with what little we know about Champions.
>can we freely edit our pokemon like showdown?
>how do we obtain pokemon ingame?
>will all 4 gimmicks be in the game?
>can we use all the gimmicks on one team or only choose one gimmick per team?
>will it have a single player mode like Stadium?
>how jewish is the monetization?
>will it actually release in 2025?
Too many questions with no answers. The next Pokemon Presents can't come soon enough

>>57988257
>The fact any Pokemon can do it and it doesn't take an item means you aren't constrained at the team building or team preview stages like you are with Megas.
except why dynamax a shitmon to make it good when you can dynamax a good mon to make it busted

>>57992069
That's the crux.
We can find a handful of instances where it was used creatively, but generally it was always used on your best mon to do shitloads of damage.
I call it my Kyogre postulate, sure you could Dmax another mon, but you're just going to use it on Kyogre basically every time.

>>57986668 (OP)
>just the two currently relevant mechanics used in gen 9
You mean the two that are actually balanced around competitive play.

>>57992069
That’s the point. The fact that you have a choice means there’s room for outplay in very niche situations.

>>57992109
Considering gens 6 & 7 had the most unbalanced VGCs in the games history I wouldn't exactly call megas "balanced around competitive play".

>>57992214
Only 2016 and 2019.
2015 wasn't good, but Japan solved the meta that year before anyone had a counter.

>f2p
>home compatible
>on switch, switch 2, and MOBILE
Hopefully anyone with a mainline game + Home can freely transfer teams to Champions and mobile only kiddies are stuck in microtransaction hell to get mons.