Others may come and go but at the end of the day the OGs are forever and ever

>>58069002 (OP)
Charizard sucks but blastoise is worse

>>58069002 (OP)
Perfection does not exi-

>>58069014
-st

>>58069002 (OP)
It's a shame how many of these got butchered with gross revisions like evos, prevos, regionals, megas... Yuck

>>58069010
Garbage taste.

>>58069002 (OP)
You can really tell the designers gave up and padded the dex out with filler shit when they started putting multiple "copy the last evolution 3 times in a row onto the same design" in.
>what if diglett, but we have 3 digletts?!
>what if magnemite, but we have 3 magnemite?!
>what if doduo, but it has 3 heads?!

>>58069059
It's relieving how many of these got much better upgrades like evos, prevos, regionals, megas... Hell yeah

>>58069082
And don't forget the half assed designs like
>What if the rat that becomes a bigger rat?
>What if the snake that becomes a bigger snake?
>What seal named seel and a dugong named dewgong?
>What if the pile of sludge turned into a bigger pile of sludge?
>What if pokeball with eyes that turns upside down?

>Butterfree and Venomoth swap
how to identify low-functioning autism at a glance

>>58069098
>No argument
i accept your concession

>>58069010
Venutard detected

>>58069002 (OP)
Based. Imagine not living through pokemania in prime pokemon age, zoomies will never get it

>>58069095
>hating rat but bigger

>>58069002 (OP)
This is Pokémon.

>>58069082
>>what if diglett, but we have 3 digletts?!
wack-a-mole heads
>>what if magnemite, but we have 3 magnemite?!
magnets stuck together
>>what if doduo, but it has 3 heads?!
"Two heads are better than one – but three is even better."

all of these have explanations

>>58069421
its baffling how zoomongrels have a hard time deciphering such simple and effective design concepts.

>>58069002 (OP)
Remove Ivysaur and this is will be perfect

>>58069428
Based. Total ivytroon death.

>>58069095
>>What if the rat that becomes a bigger rat?
Raticate is a brown rat, which is basically just the bigger rat. Raticate and similar mons are bland on purpose because the idea was to make them as seamlessly replaceable of IRL animals as possible in order to create the feeling that this is fictional world is almost as familiar and plausible as the real one.
Also, early on they mostly wanted to make sure the mons felt like creatures and not characters (which more detail tends to endanger), which is why the ones that feel more like the latter are one-of's.

>>58069095
>>What if the snake that becomes a bigger snake?
It's not that simple. It evolves from a "regular" tube-shaped snake (but in fact, this is a rattlesnake) into a "winged" cobra (which is "Arbok" backwards), with the added detail now of having a face-like pattern on its stomach that is said to intimidate and paralyze beholders, which is a nod also to Medusa.
>>What if pokeball with eyes that turns upside down?
it's a joke

>>58069002 (OP)
>Legendaries are just technicolor birds
>One dragon type and it only learns a single dragon type move
>Predominantly remembered for the anime and its godawful balancing
Get the hell outta here, gramps. Fug BTFOs your earrape cry abortions

>>58069428
>>58069429
>letting one guy living rent free inside you
Gay

>>58069462
>>Legendaries are just technicolor birds
wrong
>>One dragon type and it only learns a single dragon type move
loreful
>>Predominantly remembered for the anime and its godawful balancing
imagination and opinion

>>58069095
>What if your head was not so up your ass?

>>58069505
>wrong
eggs plain

>>58069517
>all three are different bird species whose typing and morphology are based on the behavior and lore of their inspirations
>Moltres is a phoenix based on herons, which are themselves tied to phoenix to Egyptian lore:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bennu
>Zapdos is a hummingbird whose rapid wing flapping generates static electricity (hence why it has the highest speed)
>Articuno is a bluejay with an aurora tail; bluejay are a boreal species that often don't migrate south during winter and are known to be cold-adapted; hence why is has the best defenses
>Moltres's beak is the strongest, has the highest Atk; Zapdos's beak is also strong, has the average Atk; Articuno's beak is weak, has the lowest Atk
the truth is the legendary birds are more clever than most people realize or appreciate; they're only superficially shallow

It's fine if you prefer The Pokémon Company's sequel products. I like Game Freak's original passion project.

>>58069555
I prefer GameFreak's second passion project.

>>58069550
ZAPDOS IS A FUCKING CANARY WHY WON'T YOU PEOPLE UNDERSTAND AAAIIIEEE

>>58069587
this theory doesn't seem to extend beyond its coloring

>what if ice cream cone, but we have 2 ice cream cones?!

>>58069707
double sundae

>>58069082
It wouldn't surprise me that was an intended gameplay evolution mechanic they dropped, possibly too hard to implement

Capture 3 Diglett = evolve to Dugtrio
Capture 3 Magnemite = evolve to Magneton
Capture 2 Koffing = evolve to Weezing
Capture 1 Slowpoke + 1 Shellder = evolve to Slowbro

>>58069095
Voltorb always pissed off frowning = negative electric charge
>Reverse the polarity by turning it upside down
Electrode is always smiling = positive electric charge

It's cleverer than most people realize. It's like plusle and minun but done right with proper nuance and less on the nose.

>>58069756
would have been more interesting

genuinely one of the worst dexes

>>58069002 (OP)
*153.

>>58069002 (OP)
They’re like soft drinks…

>>58069462
>One dragon type and it only learns a single dragon type move
The point was to make Dragonite extra special, it's literally after the legendary birds in the dex, it's the goddamn final boss's(before the rival plot twist) ace

Just look at the dragon type resistances: grass, fire, water, electric. The intention was to make Dragonite resist your starter, electric nullifies the weakness it would get from being part flying

>>58069059
Aren’t the regionals basically just homages? Weren’t regional variations confirmed as early as the Orange Islands arc?

>>58069002 (OP)
ALL of them will eventually get minifig-scale molds when Lego Pokemon sets start coming out in February. Oh, and yes, the starters (including pikachu and eevee) will be getting life-sized brick-built models, too.

>>58069082
that was only sugimori, he design every design like that even in gen 5 designed klink like

>>58069899
In your dreams.

>>58069903
Nope, that was James Turner. He was responsible for all of the bad designs.

>>58069915
You joke but James actually did the ice cream with the same philosophy. Gen 5 was deliberately aping gen 1

>>58069924
Sharty brains explode now if you ask them whether this was a good thing or not.
>i want to shit on gen 5 and say it's bad like I have for 10 years
>but I also want to defend gen 1 and say it was good pokemon (to contrast with bad pokemon that I say gen 5 is)

>>58069899
>ALL of them will eventually get minifig-scale molds when Lego Pokemon sets start coming out in February
Lol no

>>58069002 (OP)
I never was a big Gen 1 fan, Gen 3 is still the best one

>>58069983
You do not understand the concept of shitty low quality imitation?
One aped the other =/= they are the same

>>58069924
I am curious to hear which pokemon Vanillite aped from Gen 1

>>58070004
He means that like kling it uses the concept of the multiplying heads so prevalent in gen 1. Deino also does it

Are you people that fucking stupid or is it just an act?

>>58070036
Is that a bad thing though? 2 heads are better than 1
3 heads are better than 2
7 heads are better than 3

>>58069905
>>58069987
>corporations hate money
is this what /vp/ussies actually believe?

>>58070052
Lego is stingy with molds because they know you'll buy it anyway. Look at animal crossing, a tiny selection of characters because of the unique head molds. Lego Mario doesn't even have true minifigs and all enemies are entirely brickbuilt.

If you're lucky you'll get your Pikachu, your Eevee, your Meowth, your Jigglypuff, your 3 starters and the rest will be giant brickbuilt sculpture monstrosities to stick on a shelf collecting dust a la megabloks but at a higher price.

>>58069777
Based trips of truth. I will always defend my bro

>>58069059
Most of them were already ruined by the FRLG art shift

>>58069877
no, they're replacements. that's why only Pokemon not from gen 1 that are despised by Game Freak and fans got them.

>>58069877
You can't google "your favorite pokemon" and have its nasty meme facial hair version not show up. They are a major permanent part of the discourse of that pokemon going forward

>>58069002 (OP)
Without the scope creep of more none these could have been getting perfected(rebalanced stats, types, movepools) and by now we would have Pokken-tier battle system in the main game

>>58070258
Why are genwunners so retarded?

>>58069002 (OP)
I have been angry at Dragonite’s existence for 27 years

>>58069002 (OP)
Technically speaking these arent the og 151, as even by the time Sugi did the drawn art they were getting revisions as the TRUE og 151 are the red/green sprites.

>>58070458
Og dratini shared it's stripes. Og Dragonite was also a bit more serpentine

>>58070485
these most gen 1 pokemon got redesign for be more cute and marketable in gen 2

For me it's the stadium models.

>>58069002 (OP)
My childhood :)

>>58070491
No, they got a redesign to be more cute and marketable in Gen 1 official art instead of shitty programmer art, got redesigned for Blue for some reason (perhaps to appeal more to western audiences) then immediately went back to normal until the Gen 3 official art made them more cute and marketable.

>>58069002 (OP)
So much great pokemon! Bulbasaur, Squirtle, Pikachu, Slowpoke, Hypno, Eevee, Lapras, Gyarados, Snorlax, Pysduck, Mewtwo and best of all....CHARIZARD! from KANTOOOOOOOOO!!!

>>58071337
>Hypno
>No Gengar
Really?

>>58069082
And they're all really good designs, funny enough.
If you're going to bitch about a design bitch about one that's actually bad, like Voltorb/Electrode.

>>58071475
>one that's actually bad, like Voltorb/Electrode.
Slice your wrists

>>58070656
Floppy friend!

Still boring crap, amazing how people say new design are bad when Pokemon started being the most boring crap monsters designs from any game, digi mog all these

And best waifumons too

https://youtu.be/eTzViKuA33I

dq designs were better they look like monsters instead the my mom animal or toy lol the only good thing pokemon had was marketing

>>58072324
Amazing how zoomiggers can never live through pokemania and will never understand nor be a true part of anything

>>58072673
Pokemania only happened because of the anime and merch push though. The games alone would have flopped.

>>58072695
>Anime and merch
so you're now admitting this was all successful because of how great the original 151 set of pokemon were, right? based retard.

>>58072708
Nope. They were only percieved as great because the anime redesigned a lot of them to look better. See how Pikachu is the loveable electric mouse we all know as a result of the anime, rather than the obese ugly blob he was in Red and Blue.
The games didn't get acceptable until Gen 2 and didn't get GOOD until Gen 3, by which point the fad had died out (as all fads do). But genwunners will claim that later games "killed" Pokemania, when the truth is the original games were shit and had very little to do with Pokemania at all. The anime caused Pokemania, which saved the mediocre Gen 1 games from being total flops.

>>58069002 (OP)
You say that but the only reason they're not forgotten is because tpc keeps shilling them and not because they're popular but because they have the gen 1 privilege

>>58072727
So the designs were not good because they were only percieved to be good? What level of sophistry is this lol

>>58072743
No, the original designs weren't good. The refined designs made by the anime crew are good, and are the reason Pokemon survived.
Though then again 90s kids were retarded so that probably helped shitters like Seel and Lickitung from being rightfully forgotten about.

>>58072748
Zoomie cargo cultist is seething. The OP stated that the original 151 are eternal, and you starting arguing over which games are good and how the designs process of coming into being somehow makes them not good but only perceived to be good. Designs are usually percieved with the eyes, yes?

>>58072778
And the original 151 didn't even make it past Gen 1; the REFINED 151 from the anime are what people like.

>>58072782
Whatever helps you sleep at night having missed out on pokemania

>>58072792
>Y-You missed out on a soulless marketing fad!
I accept your concession.

>>58069426
>>58069421
i always took doduo/dodrio to evoke the image of a bird's nest with baby bird heads sticking out, but if the birds' legs stuck through the nest and they ran around with it flintstones car style

>>58072794
You have no argument just pedantic goalpost shifting and hair splitting. The games, anime, and merch were all rolled into what made pokemon into what it is. Just saying "well, it was just marketing, you werent really having fun, it was a trick!" is the real concession. The original 151 are eternal, you have not refuted that

>>58072811
If they were eternal they wouldn't have needed to be redesigned.
Also reminder a lot of them got dexcut from SwSh, the best game in the series; if they were so "eternal" they'd have made it in.

>>58069010
Design-wise, Blastoise is the best starter they've ever made. There's a reason he and Charizard are on the fucking boxes.

>>58072817
Again you're just trying to shift the argument to which of the games are good. And the dexcut was extremely controversial and done because of other constraints not the designs. If an early draft is refined that's not really invalidating the premise that the original 151 are eternal, they are still the 151 that are remembered and how they are remembered is what makes them eternal

>>58072830
>And the dexcut was extremely controversial
Only to fake fans. True fans know it was for the best.
> If an early draft is refined that's not really invalidating the premise that the original 151 are eternal
So you agree the "original" 151 were an early draft for the refined anime versions, got it. If they're refined, they're by definition not the original.

>>58072834
You're arbitratily splitting the anime and the games. They are both equally important and part of the original process of the OG 151 coming into being

venusaur > charizard > blastoise

>>58072834
Us true fans loved the dex cut, and we also understand pokemon is only popular because of soulless marketing. We dont care about gay ANIME, we are hardened gamers who have walled our hearts to all sentimentality and who need serious, adult games becaus we're not children and we'll never waste our time procreating

>>58072847
that is the order they appear in the pokedex, yes

https://youtu.be/YdCVFWnIdYs

>>58072882
>We dont care about gay ANIME
Then you don't like Pokemon and are not a true fan.

>>58069550
Book cover ignores psyducks existence

>>58069707
peak

>>58072820

>>58072963
So is your argument that since the pixel sprites on an early game boy game have differences to the anime that the memory of the 151 is invalidated? They are completely different mediums. Also the sprites are based, and the anime is based, they are both true. The essence of the mons remains eternal and untouched by your hand wringing protests

>>58072782
Baby a lot of that art on the OP is on the japanese red and green manual. Hell that Charizard and Venusaur are right on the damn cover.

>>58072995
NTA but the argument is that the "original" 151 were shit. The 151 people remember and care for are not the originals, they're the refined, superior anime designs.
Compare the deformed gimp Mewtwo in OP's pic to the infinitely better design used from the first movie onwards.
> Also the sprites are based
Absolutely not. The Kanto sprites didn't get good until Gen 3 with FRLG.
>>58073113
And how many non-Japanese kids would be even aware of the Japanese manuals?

>>58073119
Just because you don't like them or because you're a games over anime supremacist doesn't change the fact that the og 151 that people remember and love are eternal

>>58073119
>And how many non-Japanese kids would be even aware of the Japanese manuals?
By then there were plenty of other sources of to see the pokemon(and the red and blue manual had plenty of water color art too). There was a time where official supplemental material was expected to give audiences a better framework to imagine the world as the tiny pixel art was by itself too much of a rough abstraction.

Zoomie nominalist heretics ITT will never touch the essence of the 151

>>58069002 (OP)
It's no coincidence pokemon go unleashed the closest thing there ever will be to pokemania when it only had the og 151

>>58073119
If I go out into nature and find two pidgeons, I observe a multitude of variations between the two individuals. They may even look wildly different depending on the circumstances of their life. But I dont therefore conclude that there is no such thing as the species of Pidgeon. Likewise, I may be a fat slob, like pikachu. I may decide to then start going to the gym, eating better, and getting fit. Afterwards, I dont say that I have somehow become a different person. Unless I am a nominalist atheist who is totally absorbed in the sensuous world, like most zoomies are

>>58073190
Pokemon isn't IRL nature, stupid.
>Unless I am a nominalist atheist who is totally absorbed in the sensuous world, like most zoomies are
So genwunners are tradlarping jew-on-a-stick worshippers too? Not a good look.

>>58073222
>zoomie cant understand analogy
What I'm saying would if anything be even more true of a created fictional world. And there are more religions than just christianity anon
>>58073183
Great point. It would seem that the vast majority of pokemon fans are most familiar with gen 1

>>58073252
>And there are more religions than just christianity anon
And they're all nonsense. Your point being?

>>58073255
That you're a fedora tipping childless athiest who is cut off from your fellow man and the spirit of pokemon

>>58073119
>The Kanto sprites didn't get good until Gen 3 with FRLG.
Most of them were worse than one of the options from gen 2

>>58073260
>Buzzwords and ad hominem
Concession accepted.
>>58073263
Wrong.

>>58073273
Says he who called genwunners tradlarping jew on stick worshippers. I accept your concession

>>58073280
>Says he who called genwunners tradlarping jew on stick worshippers.
That's true though.
> I accept your concession
Parroting is an admission of defeat.

>>58069421
Grasping at straws

>>58073282
The eternal spirit of the 151 remains untouched by your pharisaical hairsplitting jewry.

https://youtu.be/iqvBT9fSEHw?si=s5HICC5jyE6-jNHB

>>58073292
Can't touch something that isn't real I guess.

>>58073323
Not while here in this vale of tears. But on the Last Day, I will rejoice with the 151 on elysian fields, while you will be hewn down, and cast into the fire

>>58073336
OK kike-worshipping retard. Enjoy your oldslop I guess.

>>58073338
Its funny because your arguments are so inherently Jewish in form. "Those Pokemon you love? They arent even REAL! There are slight variations in the texts, rendering your precious pokemon meaningless.you worship a lie! All is matter and marketing" Etc.. ok rabbi, enjoy your trannymons

>>58073347
>Being able to distinguish fantasy from reality and having basic critical thinking skills are actually Jewish concepts!
Nice try Goldberg, but your crypto-yiddish reverse psychology isn't going to work.

>>58073360
>n-no, you!
I accept your concession. You may continue to consume new shitmons. My friends and I, who all have wives and families now, will be rearing our children with the 151 greatest pokemon, while your sloppamons will be consigned to the dustbin of history.

>>58073374
>I accept your concession
Well you can't have it, because I don't have one.
>My friends and I, who all have wives and families now, will be rearing our children
Imagine actually believing this.
>with the 151 greatest pokemon
Which are? 'cuz they certainly aren't KANTOOOOOO's old and busted protomons.

>You're the Jew!
>No, you're the Jew!
I wonder (((who))) could be behind this?

>>58073423
Notice who first brpught the topic of judaism into the conversation. The existence of universals is a philosophical concept, not tied to any religion. And the elysian fields are from greek mythology. Simply read plato and aristotle to understand why the original 151 pokemon are eternal

>>58073432
But they're not eternal. The original versions are in the trash where they belong. They had to be redesigned to be good. And even then, most of them are forgotten in favour of actually popular Pokemon like Lucario or Garchomp. Like who the fuck is going to pick a shitter like Krabby or Grimer over actually good, modern Pokemon?

>>58069059
Most of them were butchered from the start
>Voltorb
>Grimer
>Magnemite
>Bellsprout
>Diglett
>Seel
>Drowzee
>Paras
>Oddish
>Magmar
>Jynx
>Mr. Mime
>Koffing
>Staryu
>Omanyte
>Zapdos
>Goldeen
>Horsea
>Zubat
>Ratatta
You could cut these fucks and nobody would give a shit. Pokemon is and always has been steaming hot dogshit.

>>58073622
What an embarrassing post to make holy shit

>>58073432
>if I call my opinion philosophy and vaguely mention greece I can just claim it's always been that way and dare you to prove it wrong

nigga it's pokemon plato did not give a FUCK about bulbasaur

>>58073683
Read between the lines, all 151 pokemon are there in Platos dialogues

>>58069002 (OP)
there's a lot of them that are just "the same but bugger", but also a lot of those are just "life stage" style evolutions and I don't know how to feel about them. On the one hand it makes sense and there shouldn't be radical changes from one stage to the next unless it is based on a creature that undergoes significant figurative or literal metamorphosis over its life cycle. On the other hand it does feel kind of lazy and makes the evolutions rather insignificant or less impactful.Like just look at clefairy to clefable, jigglypuff to wigglytuff, manky to primape, growlithe to arcanine, grimer to muk, krabby to Kingler, or seadra to kingdra, there's nothing really imaginative there, they just get bigger, but yeah none of those radically change as they age so I don't know if it's good or bad

but then you have shit like graveller to golem where it goes from a cool living rock to a .... weird rock lizard out of nowhere? there aren't any animalistic features in geodude or graveller but for some reason golem has a separate head and distinct arms and legs with a different colouration to the rest of its body. It's almost like it's a third stage to sandslash instead of geodude. Or you have ones like whole poliwag line where it doesn't change when it should change. they're all just "the tadpole pokemon" when a tadpole or just a frog based pokemon in general should have significant changes between its evolutions. the difference between poliwhirl and poliwrath are almost non-existent outside of getting weirdly buffer and more angry, a complete waste of a slot.

there's very few that are offensive to look at as far as their visual design goes in gen1 compared to later gens, but there are also a lot of ones you have to ask why did they even bother adding a next stage for outside of needing to adhere to the gimmick of having your monsters change and (literally) evolve over time.

>>58072727
The games became hits before the anime was a thing in Japan.
>>58072963
Why don't people like this sprite? It's fucking boss

>>58073788
This. Unsuccessful games, especially from an indie company, don't ever get to the point of having anime adaptations

>>58069002 (OP)
le epic switch of Venomoth and Butterfree xd
did you know Mario bros 2 was actually called doki doki panic in Japan, fellow redditor? :o

>>58072820
Blastoise was literally the last one to be included in the box. Venusaur was picked over it on release

>>58072995
the anime fucking sucks
>>58073273
>wrong
no one on the planet agrees with you on this

>>58073831
Wrong.

>>58072963
Absolute UNIT. I fucking love this sprite.

>>58073282

>>58069002 (OP)
The only ones who get to stay forever are Pikachu, Eevee, Magnemite and Psyduck.
Not even CHARIZARD is safe from dexcut (see: Legends Arceus).

>>58073824
They intended to do blue/red(in Japan) from the jump, they just ended up thinking they did such a great job and we're so proud of Venusaur(lol) that they changed their mind before release

>>58072820
I think all of the kanto starters are pretty solid. Charizard is overrated as fuck though.

>>58072918
Psyduck is a mammal.

>>58069002 (OP)
>the OGs are forever and ever
So true OP! Charizard and Gyarados are my 2 favorite Pokemon.

>>58074422
Good taste

>>58073873
>Venusaur is so fucking cool they change their original plan just to include it in the cover
Venuchads we can't stop winning

>>58074623
even when we shouldn't