Any other kino roguelikes on console?

>>11826389 (OP)
there's a few like torneko/shiren
but toejam and earl is really one of a kind

Fatal Labyrinth, titled Shi no Meikyuu: Labyrinth of Death (死の迷宮) in Japan, is a 1990 roguelike role-playing video game developed and published by Sega for the Sega Genesis. Originally available exclusively on the Sega Meganet multiplayer gaming service in Japan, it was later released physically in 1991.[2][3] The game is similar to and shares assets with Dragon Crystal, which was released around that time.ypd8k

>>11826701
it's very basic though, he said kino

>>11826709
how about you go fuck yourself then chump

>>11826709
Yeah but the word kino means you're retarded, so anything basic for retards will do.

>>11826718
damn, you're right

>>11826718
>I'm afraid of neologisms
yeah nothing retarded about that

>>11828719
Nope there isn't zoomie no cap

>>11826389 (OP)
Seconding Shiren. It has a good mix of dungeons allowing levelled gear and lvl1 no gear. Seeing your own improvement is satisfying

>>11826389 (OP)
Roguelites are just arcade games bro

>>11828816
RogueliKes, anon. None of that modern casualized "stronger on your next run" shit.
And also
>just arcade games
you're retarded

>>11828719
The word kino is about 100 years old

>>11828825
You said roguelikes and used toejam and earl as an example anon
You've no business saying others are retarded

>>11828832
toejam and earl is a roguelike.
if you disagree, not only are you retarded, you also don't know what a roguelike is.

>>11828847
A roguelike is literally a game like rogue, such as shiren the wanderer
A roguelite is a game that takes elements from rogue

>>11828853
no, a roguelite is a roguelike that adds progression elements that carry over between runs, like Dead Cells or Hades.
toejam and earl is a roguelike. if you swapped out its style for generic medieval fantasy slop, it would be indistinguishable from games like Fatal Labyrinth.
The fact that same gameplay + different coat of paint = not the same genre in your mind is proof positive that you are retarded and you don't know what you're talking about. Do not post in this thread again.

>>11828872
Ah i see, you are the resident shitposter

>>11828883
>can't refute a single thing I've said
I accept your concession.

>>11828896
It doesn't need refutation, I already said exactly what both genres are

>>11828901
nope, you were dead wrong.

>>11828907
words don't conform to your worldview anon, they have meaning

>>11828915
right, and you don't know the meanings of the words "roguelike" and "roguelite".
this is the last (YOU) I'm gonna give you. maybe go troll the magazines thread or something now.

>>11828872
toejam and earl is real-time, kinda disqualifies it from being a traditional roguelike

>>11828924
You made the thread to troll about genres, you've done it many times before

>>11828932

>>11828945
Are you seriously using wikipedia as your argument here?

>>11828952
same gameplay as the 1991 game btw

>>11828960
Sure, and RE4 is a Doomlike

>>11828952
https://web.archive.org/web/20070210222637/http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=11707
>It was during the course that Johnson encountered the game that would inspireToeJam & Earlmore than anything else - Michael Toy, Glenn Wichman, and Ken Arnold’s 1980 randomised dungeon crawlerRogue. “I ran across it during a programming course at UCSD,” he recalls. “I stayed up many a night until 3 or 4am in the morning trying to get deeper into the dungeon. That was a great game. There were certain things about the mechanics that I just loved.”

>>11828965

>>11828967
>>11828971
And yet, it's not a roguelike, crazy

>>11828975
>i-it just i-isn't
I accept your concession.

>>11828983
Because it's specifically asigned to games like Rogue, what part of that do you not understand?
If I play Diablo 2 in hardcore , is it roguelike to you?

>>11828987
> games like Rogue
yes. like Toejam & Earl (1991).
>procedural level generation
>character progression
>resource management
>permadeath
Holy shit it's nothing like Rogue!
lmfao. retard

>>11826389 (OP)
They were somewhat rare because of the way consoles worked, accessing ROM directly instead of loading it into RAM or storage. There just wasn't anywhere to put a lot of procedural content.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_roguelikes

>>11828996
Why do you think I said Roguelite dumbass

>>11829002
you don't know what that word means.

>>11829008
>meta-progression systems that allows plays to carry over some progress between runs
??? sounds like revisionist nonsense the jewgle AI inserted there. a rogue* game's defining feature was losing all progress on death/reaching end-conditions.

>>11829024
>haha look mom i'm trolling!
ok

>>11828945
>"""action""" roguelike

>>11829050
is this your first time encountering a comma?

>>11829054
why were you trying to cover it up with your scribblings

>>11829057
is this also your first time encountering circles?

>>11829028
i'm not? i'm 100% correct.

>>11829074

>>11829074
You're arguing with a troll that tried to make scotformer a thing

Ok there's A LOT of you faggots who are either dumb or trolling (guessing mostly the former) that STILL do not understand the difference between a roguelike and roguelite.

Rogue (the namesake game) is a turn-based dungeon crawler where everything is laid out on a square grid; every time you move one square, enemies would too. You lose all progress on death.

RogueLIKEs are a very narrow genre of games; essentially Rogue clones. That's it.

RogueLITEs are a much more broad genre; they can be anything from FPSs to platformers to strategy. Their one defining feature, again, is that you lose all progress on death.

That's it. It's that fucking simple. LEARN THE DIFFERENCE AND STOP FUCKING UP.

>>11829117
>Their one defining feature, again, is that you lose all progress on death.
false. rogueLITEs have progression that carries over between runs, which make them less punishing than Rogue, i.e. Rogue Lite.

>>11829142
Not a requirement. I don't think they should be included in the definition but I don't care enough to argue against it.

>>11826389 (OP)
Toejam&Earl is one of the only actual good games of its genre and related genres for the most part even now.
Using random generation to get out of designing levels with purpose, paired with no saving to pad playtime and make your experience the subject of luck became a virulent gimmick crutch of SLOP meant to addict rather than entertain.
This game works hard to rise above all that garbage before most of it even existed. It uses an alien planet narrative, though comedically reversed being that they're on a fragmented Earth, and characters with a good attitude who interact with it both physically and through text, to offset the seemingly random and often frustrating mechanics that form the core of the game. It has an interesting visual style to hide the tile system, and gives you a lot of movement freedom, which along with the map generation tendencies help prevent the feeling of endless walled-in claustrophobic dungeon trudgery. It gives you key item indications and a map. The items have a range of usefulness but are (probably) never absolutely required. There's a very subtle (despite literal fireworks) leveling system which makes your progress useful beyond item hoarding. A lot of difficulty curve mechanics subtly tweaked to make it feel like a proper game instead of a generated endurance gauntlet. Amazing co-op play that has its own mechanics to take advantage of.
Even with access to non-retro I'd struggle to find games that weren't just embarrassing to compare in terms of level of polish, fairness, elevating itself above the genre's pitfalls, and desire to ever play that shit again. Speed, spectacle, and item variety are the only things I could call advancements since this game was made.

>>11829160
This is correct, requiring unlocks to fulfill a genre definition which simply indicates some mechanics loosely resemble another game is revisionism, resulting from many popular roguelites doing it to scale down difficulty over runs so that you keep playing after getting stomped.

>>11826389 (OP)
just play necrodancer bruh

>>11829160
>>11829178
without cross-run progression it's not a roguelite.
you can make up your own definitions if you want, but if they don't match what everybody else uses, you're retarded for getting mad at people who don't agree with your personal definition

>>11829194
revisionist delusion

>>11828952
Yes, faggot Anon poster here. I must defend a Sega Genesis game that is so loosely a roguelike because I can't admit when I'm wrong.

>>11829197
>revisionism
>of a term that literally didn't exist before games with permadeath, procedural generation, and cross-run progression existed
lmfao. retard

>>11829225
>I'm not changing the definition arbitrarily because uh the definition isn't that old and there were no exceptions anyway
maybe you should have played more games instead of practicing asphyxiation

>>11829238
I'm not changing the definition at all. the term literally wasn't used until there was a need to distinguish roguelikes with cross run progression from those that didn't.
you must be very young.

>>11829194
>without cross-run progression it's not a roguelite.
Was never a requirement of the genre. In games like Noita and FTL, you lose everything on death and no one disputes them being roguelites.

You're the one crying here bub.

>>11829251
lmfao. retard

>>11829251
0 for 2!
holy fuckin rekt lmfao

>>11829248
>I "literally" never played a game outside this arbitrary distinction until I heard this term
>but its other people that are newfags not me
project more

>>11829259
Regarding Noita, looks like I have to explain this one to you since you clearly have not played the game. "Unlockable spells" simply means you need to meet some condition (beat a boss whereupon it has a chance to spawn as a reward, open up a chest at the end of a questline where it may spawn there as well, etc.) in order to unlock it. After which, it now also has a chance to spawn in the game world in areas where spells do. This spawn chance does NOT carry over into new runs; you still need to meet the unlock condition if you want it to spawn in the world.

>>11829262
Regarding FTL, I'll concede I don't know off the top of my head what meta-progression elements there are in the game as I haven't played it for that long, but seeing as how you are using Jewgle for your research instead of, you know, your own accumulated knowledge of games you've played, I'm going to (correctly) assume you also haven't played that game either. In which case it's probably a similar situation where the Jewgle AI doesn't actually know enough about the game.

So congratulations, you've BTFO yourself by demonstrating that you've never played the games we're talking about and blindly trusts a hallucinating AI like the unthinking NPC you are.

>>11829321
it's okay to just be wrong, anon, you don't have to spin elaborate lies

>>11829328
>no rebuttal of any kind other than "n-no ur wrong..."
The sound of getting assblasted everyone. Don't reply again because I won't be reading it.

>>11829349
>oh shit he didnt fall for it
>u-uh I'M DONE HERE
yeah, saw that coming
fags like you always run away when your authoritative tone can't carry your horseshit lies into being credible

>>11826389 (OP)
Just play PC roguelikes anon, any console one won't have any of the advances and depth added post the original Rogue.

>phoneposters aren't canc-

>>11829259
>>11829262
>>11829321
raped and gaped

>>11829426
>coming back to samefag himself some high fives
what getting btfo does to a nigga

>>11829438
>everyone is the same poster
sign of immense butthurt lol

>>11829464
not everyone. just (you).

>>11826389 (OP)
Roguelikes don't come into their own until the 2000s

>>11829103
the fuck is a scotformer

>>11830252
portmanteau of mascot platformer

>>11830438
the fuck is a portmanteau

>>11830449
it's a portmanteau of portmante and aubergine

>>11830469
the fuck is aubergine???

people are still participating in semantics over roguelite and roguelike in 2025?

>>11830504
"people"

>>11828883
Is it the same retard shistposter who was desperately trying to claim Megaman Legends has "tank controls"? He types like it.

>>11829008
>asking google ai
You lost

>>11830809
Megaman Legends does have tank controls.

>>11830438
is that a real thing

>>11826389 (OP)
There was a weird action roguelike bundled with picrel on PlayStation.
It was surprisingly good, and I spent a lot more time with it than with the fightan game or the party games.

>>11828832
toejam and earl is sort of an honorary roguelike. Its got literally everything except it's not an rpg.

>>11833636
sure it's an rpg. you can play the role of toejam, or you can play the role of earl

>>11833485
So random to include Dyne in this and put him on the cover.