What's with the myth that Tails, Rouge, and Shadow weren't originally playable? Why would they have 2 good characters and 1 evil character? Why wouldn't they bring back Tails? Why wouldn't they utilize two brand new extremely marketable characters as playable characters in their new game when they did that with Big and Gamma in SA1? There's no actual evidence to suggest they were never intended to be playable. Sonic, Knuckles, and Eggman just had more work done on their levels first and that was who they decided to show off.

>>11838713 (OP)
I've never even heard of that rumor and I got this game on release on DC and GC. Where did you hear that rumor from?

here's another question.
what Sonic games in existence did not actually introduce a new character?

>>11838728
i've also heard it thrown around but cannot find any evidence for it yet.

>>11838729
Sonic 2 I think if you don't count Super Sonic

>>11838728
A lot of websites say that Shadow, Rouge, and Tails were made playable after they thought the game was too short originally or that fan revolt from not seeing Tails in the trailers made them add him and the others late in development. This doesn't really make any sense though and no developers or people who worked on the game have confirmed any of this. Some may point to re-used assets but Sonic, Knuckles, and Eggman share certain assets in stages with each other, or even Tails and Shadow. Some of Tails/Shadow/Rouge's stages are wholly original, others are not.

Similarly, Knuckles having a Jamaican accent/being Jamaican has also taken on a mythical status. There's one strategy guide that has Knuckles talking in a Jamaican accent around Sonic 3's release, but this isn't hard canon and the creators never spoke of an intent to make him explicitly Jamaican. Rather he (and the Echidnas in Sonic) are inspired by all sorts of tropical or ancient cultures.

>>11838729
Sonic Chaos. It's the most by-the-numbers Sonic game.

>>11838713 (OP)
It's because the original trailer only shows Sonic, Knuckles, and Eggman https://youtu.be/xmbnZa9H6go

There were also leaks beforehand where people revealed info ahead of time and claimed only those 3 were playable. They must have seen the trailer before everyone else. Other details they claimed were true like Eggman being playable and the names of City Escape and White Jungle.

>>11838735
uh

>>11838750
Were these leaks that came around in early 2000? Do you have any articles or forums talking about it?

Maybe only their levels were in playable condition at the time, but I highly doubt that Shadow, Rouge, and Tails were all NEVER intended originally to be playable. They would have to revamp/rewrite a lot of stuff in a short amount of time and given the hero/dark stuff in the trailer, it wouldn't make any sense.

>>11838741
>Sonic Chaos.
now, if you want to get real technical
Sonic Chaos came out 2 days before Sonic 2, so the answer is still >>11838754

>>11838761
Sonic Chaos came out in 1993. Sonic 2 came out in 1992. The 8-bit version in October, the 16-bit version in November.

>>11838759
i bet it was just because those are the three they worked on first and so had the most to even show in a trailer

>>11838762
i concede getting the dates confused. i never owned a SMS.

>>11838713 (OP)
Knuckles could still be interpreted as a neutral character back then. It shows in the final story too, where he mostly does his own thing.

>>11838759
Sorry I'm just going from memory. I saw it on some sonic fan site browsing from my dreamcast in like 2000

>>11838754
oh I'm retarded. Thanks anon. I thought he was in sonic 1

I found this article from December 2000 that claims Tails won't be in the game.

https://www.sonicstadium.org/news/features/previews/the-road-to-sonic-adventure-2-what-we-know-so-far/

>>11838729
so the answer is 1? other games that people might give as answers, Sonic 2 8-bit, Sonic Pocket Adventure, both released before their "original" counterparts.

it took decades, but eventually all the old characters came back, save for villains (this is an Eggman franchise) and the "dead" ones (because they're dead). even if only as cameos in other games like Olympic Games.

what if the reason for these most recent leaks is to FORCE an answer out of Sega once and for all?
all the JP characters came back, what about the rest?

>>11838729
>A bunch of Game Gear games, unless you count those appearances seperately, in which case it becomes Chaos, Drift & 2, Labyrinth and Blast
>Pocket Adventure as >>11838871 mentions
>Sonic Advance
>Sonic Generations
>Sonic 4
>Probably some obscure games

>>11839085
that's still a pretty low ratio compared to all Sonic games.
most of them are Game Gear titles, including Labyrinth and Blast. but even then some GG titles did introduce new characters (Fang/Nack, the Kukkus).
and like i said Pocket Adventure and Sonic 2 SMS might get off on technicalities, just by being released first.
i'm not even sure it's fair to count Generations, a game about looking back. and i'm not even sure it does count, if you want to count the introduction of the Time Eater.
so other than 4 GG games (does GG Mean Bean have the freedom fighters in it?) you've got one GBA game and Ep4.

>>11838729
Blue Sphere

>>11839154
that's basically an included minigame

>>11838729
3D Bl-
>OC Flickies
Never mind

>>11838909
>mobile shit

>>11838909
What leaks?

>>11839631
correct, 3D Blast introduced flickies to the Sonic universe. otherwise you'd only have ever heard of them if you had played pic.

>>11839645
I posted a pic. the latest Blitz update still has some of the freedom fighters in it.

>>11838741
>Similarly, Knuckles having a Jamaican accent/being Jamaican has also taken on a mythical status. There's one strategy guide that has Knuckles talking in a Jamaican accent around Sonic 3's release, but this isn't hard canon and the creators never spoke of an intent to make him explicitly Jamaican. Rather he (and the Echidnas in Sonic) are inspired by all sorts of tropical or ancient cultures.
Knuckles' early placeholder name was Rastafari. At least, that's how Sega presented him to journalists in early Sonic 3 showcases.
Also, the shoes colors kinda give it away that he has a rasta theme.
Also, because it wasn't specified that it was a male, many people thought it was a girl because of the fuchsia color (later changed to red in Sonic & Knuckles)

>>11839772
Not entirely true. Some of the animals released from destroyed badniks were Flickies in the 2d games.

>>11841497
looks like you're right, they actually are named in the JP manual.
but if we're pulling out JP manuals, i would argue they tried to give them enough personality to make them "new characters."

>>11838729
>what Sonic games in existence did not actually introduce a new character?
Were there any new characters in Sonic Advance or Heroes?

>>11842540
Omega was introduced in Heroes. Technically Cream as she was meant to debut in Heroes, but Advance 2 came out sooner than expected.

>>11842574
Oh right, how about the first Sonic Advance game?

>>11841567
Is that Takumi Miyake art?

>>11842596
Advance was already mentioned
>4 GG games (does GG Mean Bean have the freedom fighters in it?) one GBA game and Ep4.
still not a lot of games, when you consider there's like a hundred.

>>11842671
he's credited with work on 3D Blast, so maybe.

>>11839098
If you consider Sonic 2 SMS to have come first, then that would mean that Sonic 2 Genesis would be the one that didn't introduce a new character, since Tails (and Mecha Sonic, if you consider all three variants to be the same) was in that version.
>i'm not even sure it does count, if you want to count the introduction of the Time Eater.
Well the Time Eater spends most of its screentime as a mecha due to Eggman so I don't really count it.
>does GG Mean Bean have the freedom fighters in it?
Neither version of Mean Bean does. You're thinking of Spinball,in which case no - The Game Gear bonus stages are completely different. Mean Bean does still have the AOSTH bots though.

>>11843137
>what came first
it's not just that they came first, but also they released so close to their counterparts they might as well be considered part of the introduction.
>Generations
could go either way. if you don't want to count the Time Eater that is fine, but it's still a game all about looking back, less so about dropping new things.
and you're right, i was thinking of Spinball.
so we've got 6 GG games, a GBA game, Sonic R and Ep4. still a pretty dang low ratio.
Sonic Jam was a compilation, Sonic the Fighters WAS going to introduce Honey's mobian OC and eventually did, Sonic's schoolhouse has new characters...
it seems like the vast, overwhelming majority of Sonic games try to introduce a new character.

>>11843189
>Sonic R
Doesn't count. It had Metal Knuckles and the Tails Doll.
>Sonic The Fighters
Had Bean, who's based on Bin from Dynamite Dux.
>it seems like the vast, overwhelming majority of Sonic games try to introduce a new character.
True, but I feel like that it's not the only one. Mario for example arguably introduced a new character for each game up until the New series (and first introduced Dry Bowser as a concept). Even SMB2 JP technically has the Fake Bowser that was considered his twin brother for a time. The Mega Man games are technically another example as the boss enemies (robot master, mavericks, navis, etc) are usually given some characteristics, even if only in supplementary material.

>>11838729
Pretty sure Spinball didn't introduce anyone new

>>11838871
This, also Sonic 2 (8-Bit) didn't only introduce Tails, but also Silver Sonic.

>>11843423
you do have a point, but it seems like Mario treats its older characters with more regard. it's funny, Nintendo embraced all the dumb American bullshit we came up with. Bowser being called Bowser, Brooklyn. SEGA rejects it.
Mega Man is a great comparison, because Robot Masters / reploids are meant and made to be disposable. of course you get a new roster the next game, that's the whole point. a few old mainstays may show up (Cut Man, Guts Man), but when's the last time Sting Chameleon dropped by, or Charge Man showed up?
SEGA treats Sonic characters like that.

>>11839772
Flickies were there before Sonic was introduced and Day 1 though

>>11839772
>the latest Blitz update still has some of the freedom fighters in it.
Literally who cares about these knockoff furries, nobody watched the comics and TV shows.
Also this doesn't sound like a retro game, did jannies gave up on let /v/tards reek havoc here?

Shadow stages are actually the way Sega wanted to take the games. If anything, sonic stages are leftovers from SA1

>>11843469
Hip and Hop

>>11841436
Wasn't his early name Dreads?

>>11838713 (OP)
>>11838750
FYI, that trailer came from here: https://tcrf.net/Proto:Sonic_Adventure_2_(Dreamcast)/The_Trial
However, datamining reveals that the six characters were already in development at that build, so it was just typical BS.
...with a kernal of truth.
What's true is that the mecha gameplay style is internally called "EGGMAN", which indicates that Tails was a late addition after all. Additionally, Amy had the most work put in out of the 2P characters, so it's believed that she was removed from 1P rather late. This is why she has a few important scenes, like busting Sonic out of prison when the previous level was Tails'.

>>11838750
Sonic in Sky Rail

>>11846520
>Amy had the most work put in out of the 2P characters, so it's believed that she was removed from 1P rather late. This is why she has a few important scenes, like busting Sonic out of prison when the previous level was Tails'.

Iizuka stated that he wanted Amy to be playable in Hero Story, but he couldn't find a place for her, and he regretted it

>>11846520
I don't think it means they added Tails last minute after originally having him not playable, but simply that maybe they were possibly unsure about giving Tails such a radical departure in gameplay with the mech which is more Eggman's style.