Thread 11896143

This game was rightfully considered a classic until about a few years ago when a bunch of faggot youtubers started complaining about "no map" and retarded zoomers starting repeating it instead of forming their own opinions.

Same thing with the original kid icarus

>>11896143 (OP)
I beat this game when I was 10 years old and I didn't even draw a map. Kept it all in my head. Zoomers' brains are fried. They probably would like the GBA remake where, not only is there an automapper, but they also put unavoidable Chozo statues in the middle of corridors that tell you exactly where to go next at all times.

>>11896143 (OP)
>was rightfully considered a classic
As if zoomers and youtubers have a say in any of that. Get real, OP.

every -oomerposter should be permabanned so that /vr/ becomes usable

>>11896192
Zoomer detected.

>>11896143 (OP)
I'd tolerate it more if it started you with half of your total health, grinding from 30 to any meaningful amount is boring and resetting after death to restore e-tanks kind of goes against the game's structure. sadly most hacks restore full health only making it too easy.

>>11896284
If you have to grind in Metroid, you're bad at the game.

>>11896143 (OP)
Many such cases

>>11896143 (OP)
I think it's less YouTubers and more just that it's getting older and older every year. It's like movies that were considered classics in the 50s but obviously as we move further away from that, people give less and less of a shit. Like how many people really care about silent films or watch them casually on the regular?

Unironically what youtubers you people are always talking about? I've always been curious
>>11896143 (OP)
>>11896149
And as for Metroid and Kid Icarus in particular, basically what you are saying is that a few years ago some youtubers started saying something that led to both games being stripped of their classic status? Wtf
Also what I've always found weird is that most people here assume that zoomers all play /vr/ games, I highly doubt that people who barely even game outside of modern multiplayer stuff and mobile shit care about NEStroid and Kid Icarus. Of course there are some gamer zoomers but for them even the PS2 is ancient

>>11896324
NTA, but AVGN recently made a Metroid video where he acknowledged that the original is a classic and a pioneer in its genre before going on to say it sucks to actually play, citing a whole bunch of gripes he has with its gameplay and design.

>>11896294
Yes and everyone is bad at it there first time. No shit you pathetic idiot.

>>11896341
I remember Mike Matei saying that he prefers Zero Mission because of the map too which is pretty weird

>>11896351
>there first time

>>11896316
>Like how many people really care about silent films or watch them casually on the regular?
Anybody with taste.

>>11896316
>like people that watch silent movies
Yeaahh those guys are super weird. Not like us chads, talking about our favorite c64 games..

I don't think metroid nes really serves what people enjoy about super and zero mission. in super and zero every new area is its own intricately designed environmental puzzle with a unique layout and often a new gimmick to play with. enemies are more like passive obstacles rather than immediate threats that demand your attention, you have room to breathe and feel out the levels.
in nestroid 90% of the game is going to either be a platform shaft or a relentless enemy corridor. there's an argument for it having a greater sense of exploration at a high level due to the lack of a map but in terms of the individual areas themselves there's not a lot of creativity or design there.

>>11896387
The map in the original is also more open abd doesn't railroad you as much as Super or especially ZM.

>>11896367
95% chance you're a poser if you're actually claiming that you regularly watch silent movies
>>11896371
I'm talking about mainstream audiences, genius. No need to get defensive because I pointed out the march of time exists.

>>11896143 (OP)
I liked the game. Who cares what anyone thinks. Its true I would have preferred it with a map and actual backgrounds but who cares what we did get is great anyways. Actually save rooms would have been really nice.

>>11896143 (OP)
>>11896149
i agree. they were only classics because of novelty. they're not very fun. kid icarus is fucking abhorrent.

>>11896592
Kid Icarus is a fun platformer though

>>11896143 (OP)
I had it as a kid, bought it as a teen, tried it again as an adult, and never played far. I enjoyed every Metroid but not the first one. Never played the second.

>>11896591
>and actual backgrounds
With Metroid the black background actually adds to the atmosphere, unironically. Same for 2 on the GB

>>11896603
Eh somewhat but I've seen some rom hacks that add backgrounds and imo it looks better that way.

it doesn't have as much replay value as super metroid because there's not many speedrunning tricks

>>11896616
wrong file asdfghjkjjlkl;

>>11896616
The hardest boss in the series got absolutely destroyed

>>11896619
Emperor ing?

>>11896596
Yeah I played Metroid when it was new and tried Kid Icarus for the first time only a few years ago and I liked them both.

>>11896624
Close but Mother Brain from ZM is still harder in my opinion

>>11896596
i don't find it fun at all. almost every other NES platformer blows it out the water.

>>11896143 (OP)
daily reminder nestroid>super for the simple fact its actually challenging and feels like a hostile alien environment instead of a hold your hand heres a map and nothing will ever threaten you walk in the park like every other metroid game.

>>11896628
i don't agree the hardest boss in the metroid series is super metroid ridley way harder than mother brain

i had a mental block on how to defeat ridley for years until i read his ASM code block and was like ohhhhhhhhhhhhh

>>11896649
super metroid is faceroll if you go 100% but if you go low% speedrun then uh no it isn't easy at all

>>11896660
Ridley in Super is good ol
>I hope that fucker dies before I do
boss when you just unload everything you have on him. Same for Kraid and Ridley in 1. But yeah that fight in Super is hard

>>11896680
the thing about ridley was until i read his battle script i needed more E tanks than the optimal route of the era required or i'd die (it was before people figured out how to break into norfair first, and i think moonfall changed the route back)

sometimes i'd take a safety save right before ridley cause he'd kill me so often

>>11896341
It does suck to actually play, not because of the map but because the jumping feels like shit and you spend the whole game trying to dodge endlessly respawning bugs while platforming.

>>11896757
>spend the whole game trying to [play the game]
Whoah, watch it fella. That's mighty close to an actual criticism... Not like other games where you have to... press buttons all day!

>>11896649
NEStroid isn't challenging in the slightest once you actually know how to navigate, why would you think this

>>11896757
I think Metroid might be the most repetitive game I know.. at least among the games some people claim to like

>>11896284
>started you with half of your total health
I'd say there's more to it than just the starting value
Let's say you make it through a difficult section and your health is really low now. The same problem of recovering health applies there too.
Metroid just has a fundamental problem with health recovery. Zelda did a good job with that with the faeries.
Metroid's still a solidly good game though.

>>11896960
>the most repetitive game
>at least among the games some people claim to like
Most 8 bit JRPGs

It's a classic in the sense that it's an old game that established a lot. It's not like it's a perfect game, or ever was.
It doesn't need a map, however. That's for weaklings.

>>11897047
You inevitably just grind health against popcorn enemies. They may as well give you a full bar when you respawn.

>>11896592
Metroid is a speed running classic and popularized a whole genre. Just because you're bad at it doesn't mean it's not a great game.

>>11896395
95% you're a faggot who can't enjoy movies made before 2000.

>>11897047
Metroid is supposed to feel like being stuck on a hostile planet. Health shouldn't just be given to you.

>>11896143 (OP)
Classic =/= good game. Yes the game was genre defining but almost every game even inside it's own franchise is miles better than the first one.

>>11897115
The Original is a great pick up and play title with the best exploration on the series.

I've only ever had trouble with Metroid when I needed to refill all my energy and missiles after entering the password. Anyone who can't figure out where they are is dumb.

>>11897123
>the best exploration on the series.
Which is... pretty low bar desu

>>11897137
The low bar is what they made you fat ass jump over in gym class, faggot.

It's a game where you explore and become an unstoppable god as you do it. The series had some great improvements in later games but everything you need to have a good time is already here

>>11897142
Sorry for being honest about your favorite series anon...

>>11896662
>b-but its hard if youre a speedtrooner!
yeah Im sure it is, but 99% of people arent. on my casual playthrough I only died a couple times to ridley (was a great boss fight and definitely the best version of ridley in any metroid game to be fair). in NES you have to be careful at every junction past brinstar

>>11896143 (OP)
why do you care what some youtuber says

>>11897160
>being honest
*being retarded

>>11897151
yeah this is what really impressed me my first time playing it. like damn, everything thats core to the metroid experience is right here in this tiny 8 bit game. and in some ways its better done than any game after it. "OH NO THE CLUNKYNESSS" casual scum can all get the rope.

>>11896143 (OP)
what's the problem here? a game was considered a classic, still is by retro boomers, but a bunch of insignificant video game secondaries were told it's actually kinda ass and not deserving of being a classic? who cares, they'll never touch retro vidya in their lives.
this is like if anyone cared what my opinion of lebron james is, good or bad, even though i never watched or played basketball.

>>11896143 (OP)
>youtubers
Ironically enough, this one girl recenly streamed it while playing it, and she ended up enjoying it. https://youtu.be/T2V6UuJyAyQ

>>11896143 (OP)
>This game was NOT considered a classic until about a few years ago until tendies decided to updot it to bore others

>>11896143 (OP)
People have had conflicting opinions on this game since long before YouTube was a thing. Either you're too young to remember or you blanked out the memory because people disagreeing with you cause you to sperg out.

>>11897867
You were considered a faggot from day 1.
>>11897903
The praise for it was near universal before 2029.

>>11897965
>2029
*2020

>>11896143 (OP)
you can clearly see how a lot of elements that made super metroid a masterpiece have already been in that game
if you didn't know anything else it surely was a good time or if you can get into it it's probably nice even today

>>11897965
>>11897969
It always lived in the shadow of Super

>>11897978
the thing about metroid NES is that it's like a first generation athlete in the NBA/NFL or something...it might have been godly for its time, but it doesn't really hold up too well compared to Zero Mission/Super/Fusion they took the formula and improved the hell out of it

was it good in the '80s? yeah, but i'm never planning on replaying it

i've been considering going on a super metroid romhack binge though (problem is with my old man reflexes i cant do tricks very well now)

>>11897980
Super and ZM degraded both the exploration and challenge of the original.

>>11898019
there's nothing challenging about the original just stand right next to kraid/ridley and mash button

>>11898030
Don't be glob. Moment by moment the original is much tougher than Super or ZM.

>>11898143
no it's not here's the file i deleted

the any% speedrun and 100% speedrun for super metroid are waaaaaay harder than metroid 1 in terms of how many tricks you gotta do

the whole object of metroid is to beat it as fast as possible not just do some casual baby 100% run shit and beat it in 3 hours git gud

I feel like the difficulty of M1 is overrated because you keep your progression between deaths in M1, while every other Metroid boots you back to your last save.
You will die more in M1, but how many of those deaths are actually setting you back?

>>11898159
how the hell do you die in metroid 1 unless you're 6 years old nothing hurts you can just get stuck in doors and teleport through ceilings and skip half the game

>>11898019
>exploration and challenge of the original.
Exploring copy pasted rooms with zoomers

HPRShredder's review is still the best video on the original Metroid.
https://youtu.be/hbiIPnxY0ak?si=MwaF5oS4AZPaAAyg

>>11898565
Metroid was originally an FDS game, so it couldn't take advantage of more advanced MMC chips. Even if you discount that, copy-pasted areas in Metroid are DELIBERATELY copy-pasted because the entire point of the world is that it's supposed to be disorienting and confusing. If you pay close attention to the map, you notice that rooms start out looking similar before changing the further you go in, this is done to make you feel like a rat in a maze.

Metroid is an example of the developers wringing absolutely everything they could out of the limited storage space and resources available. It's a masterclass of game design.

>>11898602
>copy-pasted areas in Metroid are DELIBERATELY copy-pasted because the entire point of the world is that it's supposed to be disorienting and confusing.
To me it was just repetitive and boring

>>11898618
To less subtle minds, it is.

>>11898623
>subtle minds enjoy copy paste
Kek

>>11897980
Yeah honestly this is pretty spot on. They're still important as part of gaming history of course but expecting people to still consider them 10/10 perfect experiences even today is just delusional.

>>11898159
It also makes the brainlet mistake of thinking difficulty= quality.

>>11896143 (OP)
Fuck you man, i've hated this game since I first played it in 1992. The concept was amazing for the time, but I perpetually felt lost and it was frustrating.

>>11898629
>Why didn't they make this maze game confusing? Me no understand.

>>11898659
It's not confusing

>>11898648
You sound like a cretin who can't appreciate anything from before your time on its own terms.
>>11898651
>Games should not be challenging.
Okay, retard.

>>11898662
Then what are you complaining about?
>>11898657
>I was a faggot then, and I'm a faggot now.

Zero Mission sucks. It's like an overpolished Disney remake of the original game.

>>11898667
>>Games should not be challenging.
Notice how you have to make up something I didn't say not even imply in order to feel superior and like you 'beat' me? That's another clear sign of being a low IQ moron.

For the record challenge is good but saying something is inherently better because it's more challenging is a dumb take. I could beat your balls with a hammer and tell you to go have sex afterwards and that would be harder than normal sex, doesn't mean it's a better experience. Hopefully that was easy and crude enough for someone of your brain power to understand.

>>11898668
>Then what are you complaining about?
>>11898618
>To me it was just repetitive and boring
You got a poor memory, no wonder you find Metroid confusing

>>11898672
This may be difficult for your syphilis-riddled faggot brain to gasp, but games are meant to be challenges. Therefore being challenging is indeed a desirable trait in them.
>>11898680
And your original criticism is still shallow and uninformed.

>>11898671
> It's like an overpolished Disney remake
Should've just called it reddit because calling it disney makes even less sense

>>11898721
>He's still too stupid to grasp the point even with a low brow metaphor
Sad! But I guess when you're as stupid as you are, challenge is the only thing that matters because you need the fake cred

>>11898789
Beating a game is an achievement to unemployed people, and you offend them personally by insinuating it isn't important. Now you understand the autism surrounding this subject here.

>>11896143 (OP)
>until about a few years ago when a bunch of faggot youtubers
holy shit who gives a fuck

>>11897980
>but it doesn't really hold up too well compared to Zero Mission/Super/Fusion they took the formula and improved the hell out of it
You mean simplified everything by making everything more lineal and easy.

>>11899427
if you were arguing about the gap between super and zero mission yeah i'd agree but you're talking about an NES game with basically no mechanics so no

how about you state your argument as to WHY it's harder instead of just be iT's SooOoOoo mUcH hArDerRrrR

>>11898789
>>11898813
>If you want play a challenging game you are stupid and unemployed.
This us a strange cope.

>>11899643
If you think of it as an achievement, yes you're probably stupid and unemployed. You're certainly not a child anymore.

>>11899658
>overcoming a challenge is not an accomplishment
By definition, yeah. Not a large, life-defining accomplishment like you would put in your obituary, but an accomplishment all the same.

>>11899726
Or just consumption of entertainment. Not a bad thing by itself

>>11896143 (OP)
I was able to beat this game with 0 issues when I was ~10 and there are things about me that some people would probably call clinically retarded. I also am hugely reliant on GPS to get anywhere new. The lack of a map is annoying but it's easily beaten without one, and there are hacks to fix this non-issue. The only valid complaint is the energy grind.

>>11899610
You go first instead of spouting that NES games are barebones and lacking in gameplay on a board about old games. Or better yet, play the game.

>>11896387
>Games that iterate well on a good foundation are better than good game that formed that foundation from nowhere
This is why people get annoyed at this shitty form of "critique."

>>11896149
Kid Icarus has a weird thing where the way everyone played it in the '80s and had fun with it doesn't resemble how people playing it as a retrogame do. Nobody sat there grinding to max firepower and HP and getting the barrel on the first level. That optimization mindset didn't exist.

do you start a map at the center of the sheet of paper?

>>11899808
Even the energy grind is overstated because people do dumb shit like sit there and grind grind out 5-energy on a hard target instead of going after 20-energy drops from things.
Plus people think there's a timer running in their head. Like sure it's possible to beat it in sub 30 minutes but when you're starting out and suck at predicting basic enemies because you still suck... well you can just... stop your movement for a fraction of a second to avoid shit. People play Metroid like bad/new gamers play racing games without ever letting off of throttle or hitting brake... you're gonna take needless hits if you don't pay attention to your speed and position.
Like god damn people... slow down... you can relax. The game isn't going anywhere.

>>11898030
Glib... and no, they're right. The boss fights in SM are harder by far. The only two things that are harder are getting stuck in a lava pit you need to bomb hop to get out of and don't know how then you're done completely once you fall in, like you're already dead and you don't even know it. Beyond that... neither are overly hard and NEStroid is among one of the easiest games on the NES period.

>>11899643
Still making up things neither of us said. Sad.

>>11900586
Still sucking cock like a fucking faggot. Sad.

>>11900583
>Even the energy grind is overstated because people do dumb shit like sit there and grind grind out 5-energy on a hard target instead of going after 20-energy drops from things.
This is especially true if you've reached Mother Brain. Metroids drop tons of energy but people will choose to slowly grind at the pipes instead.

>>11900636
lmao you're so mad

>>11900638
To be fair. Metroids do have a psychological factor for a lot of new players. Until you're good, once they latch people freak out trying to get out and even if you know how... sometimes that kinda traumatizes people into wanting to avoid them.Combing that with a required 5 missile hit to kill them - and a tendency for people to not want to "lose" things... it "looks" like high risk low reward. But it's actually decent if you take your time and do well and they drop loads of missiles to offset their cost as well.

>>11896143 (OP)
metroid suffers from the same problem that all first-entry games suffer from, it's unfairly judged against everything that came after. every thread about this game, i see stuff like
>uhhhh super metroid is better teehee :3
wow you mean the game they made 8 years later is better? no fuckin shit
the only way to have an interesting discussion about such a big game that launched such a big franchise is to compare it to its contemporaries. there's a lot of trash on the famicom that never made it out of japan, some of it was even made by nintendo themselves. what makes metroid not suck has nothing to do with everything that comes after it, it's the fact that while nowadays it may be a sloppy 5/10 overshadowed by literally everything, in its day it was a crowning achievement of chilly environmental sci-fi gaming that was hard to not notice because everyone else was too busy porting fucking trite arcade games or slapping manga licenses on shitty rebranded platformers to make a quick buck.

also green-hair samus is cool and her leotard is cool and i like it when she waves at me

Here's another great review.
https://youtu.be/kIFMVtSZhW8?si=3BK8AaND_UdlkRda

>>11901016
>while nowadays it may be a sloppy 5/10 overshadowed by literally everything
I'd argue it still holds up because the ideas behind it are so solid.

>>11901016
>have an interesting discussion about such a big game that launched such a big franchise is to compare it to its contemporaries
>nowadays it may be a sloppy 5/10
Unfortunately I PLAY games. Even nowadays. Today, even.

>modern games SUCK!!
>okay old games suck BUT consider that..
Yeah I'm not interested in cope

>>11896154
>>11896173
As much as I love to shit on zoomers, I was born in '89 and I feel this way. I was like 4 when I got a Genesis and also played SNES at my friends houses, it's what I started with.

Some 8 bit games I can play just fine even if they're not as polished, like say platformers, but yeah when I go back to obtuse shit like NES Zelda and Metroid, I just feel it's a shit/primitive version of the 16 bit games, and no I'm not drawing a map, when I wanna play a video game I'm not also looking for an arts and crafts project as well. For 80s kids into adventure/roleplay shit, a lot of you probably played D&D anyway and were used to that kind of thing, I never had such inclinations

>>11901108
There's nothing obtuse about NES Zelda or Metroid. Children could beat them, you absolute cretin.

>>11901016
People wouldn't be so harsh if there weren't retards seething nonstop at anyone that likes any other game in the series more. Just look at this thread where a retard has to cling to difficulty as the only deciding factor in a game (while ignoring that Metroid isn't even hard anyways).

>>11901147
>Just look at this thread where a retard has to cling to difficulty as the only deciding factor in a game
Nobody said that, you disingenuous faggot.

>>11901108
>obtuse shit
>shit/primitive version
>I'm not drawing a map
Maybe you're just retarded, anon. I was born in '88 and I don't share in your subnormality. I find games like NES Zelda and Metroid a breath of fresh air compared to the bullshit they're pumping out today. Creating your own vidya materials is dope as fuck. You're really missing out. Regardless, I'd rather deal with a few inconveniences to have sick music and tight gameplay than fucking trannies and bloat. To each his own.

>>11901143
You're a fucking idiot. If a game doesn't give you instructions of what to do, that's the literal definition of "obtuse", go back to school retard.

>>11901168
Music sounded better on SNES/Genesis, everything was better on those than their 8 bit ancestors.

>>11901180
>If a game doesn't give you instructions of what to do, that's the literal definition of "obtuse"
That's what the instruction manual is for, you mongrel.

>>11901229
Pablos bootleg cart didn't come with a manual and he can't read. Checkmate literate grownup.

>>11900151
oh man
no i totally did do that once
but then i wrote down a password so i didnt have to do it again

>>11896143 (OP)
OMG you're so unique anon

>>11901167
He literally double downed on it multiple times, retard.

>>11896143 (OP)
> see some shekel hungry attention whore on youtube
> says "this game was considered a classic"
> magically becomes a fact
> let's just ignore the massive programming errors that cause slowdown in the cart version
> nooo! they're now saying it doesn't have a map!
i can't imagine being so intellectually bankrupt that i would need my opinions formed by dancing monkeys on a video website. what's most insulting is calling this broken game a "classic". the only version worth playing is the FDS version as it's not broken.

>>11901853
Stay mad, zoomie.

>>11901963
Maybe in your retarded imagination.

>>11896850
Damn, are you the smartest person alive? I'm shocked you were able to find time between curing cancer and designing rockets to write this.

>>11902252
Finally realized how braindead you were, huh?

>>11901705
Zoomer doesn't realize that decade old games didn't come with books in the 90s, they rarely had boxes

>>11901050
the concepts in the game hold up, but that is not the same thing as the execution holding up, which is what most people judge the game by.
>>11901147
some of the rage is probably people thinking that if we move on from talking about this game and admit later entries play better and have more polish, that it'll somehow diminish this game's legacy or it'll be "forgotten" or some bullshit

Nobody outside of the U.S. even knew about Metroid back in the day. Meanwhile in reality, there were bigger non-linear platformers, such as Jet Set Willy. It's the truth.

>>11902775
Nobody cares about speccy shit, britfag.

I'm sure you're all familiar with certain similarities between Metroid and the Alien series. But I replayed Super Metroid recently, and a few more popped out at me. In the map rooms, the grid for the map display is very similar to the little video display that they use in the original Alien film.

Also, the overall size, shape and general look of Samus's gunship is very close to that of the Narcissus, Ripley's escape shuttle.

>>11896143 (OP)
>This game was rightfully considered a classic until about a few years
Opinions on the original Metroid have actually fluctuated quite a lot over the years.

>>11902775
don't make me tell the rozzers you're using a vpn, limey, hop off

>>11900842
It's way more effective game anxiety to me than any horror game I've played

>>11902615
>later entries play better and have more polish
>it'll somehow diminish this game's legacy or it'll be "forgotten"
That's not how it works, buster. Old games still compete with new games because for every bit of "polish" and "better" gameplay, they sacrifice something in order to achieve that and it changes the experience entirely.

>>11902869
You really think Alien invented the square-based map grid?

>>11902929

Of course not, but the very simple bright-line-on small black-screen in both cases is at least suggestive. I probably should have led with the similarity between the two personal ships, that's much more convincing when you see them side by side. Turns out there's a whole page of suggested similarities between the two franchies, goes deeper than the repeated use of "Ridley", well-liked female lead, escaping from a site that's about to explode etc.

I'm going to ask in this thread instead of making a new one, but if I wanted to play the Prime trilogy what would be the best way to emulate them?

>>11902118
>i can't imagine 99.999% of 4chin exists
I try to do the same

>>11902952
Yeah, you should've led with the other stuff for sure.

>>11903216
primehack with dolphin. as for the original vs romhack debate I'd just say that being able to freely look around while moving is too beneficial to pass up, the levels are convoluted enough with forcing you to lock in place to turn your head up.

>>11903592
*convoluted enough without

>>11902540
Pablo doesn't realize that he's humiliating himself with his esl cope

>>11903895
Shut up schizo zoomer, you're not from the 90s, you never went to funcoland, go spam more Dreamcast threads faggot

>>11903592
Thanks for the info. Appreciate it.

>>11903936
>you're not from the 90s
The child taps the truth. I'm from the 60s. Cry harder little zoomie.

Metroid 1 is fine but it's always been the faggot Icycalm/Malstrom contrarian pick

>>11904902
>contrarian
Meaningless accusation in a world of plebs. The game will always be great regardless of what the idiot masses think.

>>11902869
> moron thinks this kind of display is only unique to alien so it must be a nod to alien
>>11902886
> schizophrenia
what a dumpster fire of a mental illness board

>>11897084
i will not watch anything shot on film because that's gross

>>11902118
>> let's just ignore the massive programming errors that cause slowdown in the cart version

>cool vid talking about the game's code
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3G6vkRz-_0I

>as a disk game, and a 1st ge cart game outside of japan had no features of later memory mapper chips
>crazy solution to scrolling that was very resource intensive compared to later mapper chips that would come along with features built in.
>gets dismissed as massive programming errors by people with no perspective on programming

Zoomers couldn't figure out that the bombs were how you fought short enemies and then bitched that Samus can't duck

>>11906010
Incidentally, that video illustrates one way modern "metroidvanias" lack soul: the level design doesn't consist of repeating tile "macros".

>>11906069
>have a gun
>don't use it against short kings
Video game logic

>>11896143 (OP)
>blatant false advertisement

>>11906010
The comments were unbearable.

>>11904902
Maelstrom's right more often than not, though.

>>11896143 (OP)
This thread inspired me to finally play Metroid start to finish. I love super and the advance games, the original always filtered me, until today.

>>11900638
This post specifically made me want to get to the end. satisfying .gif and it's good to know endgame enemies drop way more health. Early game makes grinding seem stupid slow.

Played on N64 everdrive NES emulator on CRT. Used snarfblam's "Metroid + Saving" mod which ditches the password system and adds a cool little map.
Also referred to pic related a few times.

>Game needs a map unless you're a masochist or savant. 80s niggas used Nintendo power for this, nobody sane is going in blind.
>Grinding is gay and starting with low health every death is gay
>Kraid/brinstar depths area was outrageous without the varia suit

But other than that, idk it was pretty sick. Took 3-4 hours. Wanted to give up twice.
Oh also I think my patched ROM allows ice and wave beam to be combined if you find both. Because I was still freezing stuff even though I chose wave beam, which shouldn't have worked from what I understand. NOT complaining though, I think being forced to choose between the two endgame beams and wave being a punishingly incorrect choice is a bad quirk of this game that I'm glad I didn't have to learn the hard way. I got stuck in some glitchy bullshit a few times.

But it is finished and I feel satisfied. In my ending she took off her helmet and had reddish brown hair. This game probably gets more interesting replaying over and over, but I'd rather replay zero mission.

This must've ruled when it came out. tho. Better than just some historical curiosity but I wouldn't recommend it to any of my friends. Would recommend ZM and Super tho

>>11896143 (OP)
They could always play Metroid Planets. It addresses both the 30 health restart and map issues, though the latter isn't really necessary.

>>11908836
So you didn't beat the game. Great.

>>11900151
zoomer detected. Stop talking nonesense as if you were there retarded faggot.

>>11909831
Debatable. You're basically trolling and i shouldn't feed you but I'd like to make a case for hacks and mods in general.

purity is a spiral. If someone plays the GBA port, did they not beat the NES game? Technically they beat that specific port, nothing more nothing less.
But if they beat it on Switch NSO's official NES emulator, is that the REAL NES Metroid? Not really, it is a ROM with built in savestates and rewind that they may or may not have fallen back on.
what if someone plays the FamicomDisc Japanese version with saves instead of passwords, did they not beat the game? American players had to write down passwords, is that part of the experience?
Is using a paper map cheating too because it is a supplemental out-of-game material?

everybody must draw their line somewhere.

I reject your purity spiral and posit that I DID beat the game. And I could do it again without all the bells and whistles now that I know what to do. But I'd still need a paper map at the very least, and I'd much prefer not to have to write down passwords so I'd prob just play the community hack again or straight up ZeroMission
You're never going to convince me, a Morrowind/Tamriel Rebuilt player, that community mods, hacks, and QOL patches aren't a blessing to gaming. I hack and mod everything. patches can make or break experiences.

>tldr personal experience and enjoyment > purity completionist autism

I don't think there is a higher power keeping tabs on who beat which version of things. Personal achievement is in the eye of the gamer/experiencer.

>>11910252
Didn't read any of that. I don't care about your cope. Write a book about it. It won't change anything.
>You didn't beat the game.
You didn't even play the game, either. All you did was cheat yourself out of a genuine experience. Sucks to suck, loser.

>>11896192
you'd have to get rid of all the larpers too

>>11896143 (OP)
>ever caring about youtube people or zoomers’ opinions

>>11896316
If you haven't seen M it's genuinely kino

>>11896316
>games aging
SAY IT AIN'T SO-OH-WHOA
6TH GEN HAS BECAME RETRO-OH-WHOA

sucks we didn't get a spiritual successor to Metroid 1 until 2017

>>11910252
nah hes literally just right
and youre just coping. pretty hard, too.
you cant combine wave and ice beam. that leaves you ludicrously overpowered for basically the whole game. both beams can be gotten extremely quickly.

the """choice""" between wave and ice beam isnt really a choice: its a trap. and its intended to narratively show you that the metroids are unbeatable via normal weaponry. wave beam can be nice for clearing rooms in some of the harder rooms, but you need ice beam to kill metroids. period. its kinda like the whole point, is that the metroids absorb all power shot at them unless cryogenically frozen. so you HAVE to trade the extra wave beam power back for ice beam at the very end and/or just run screaming through the whole tourian section before mother brain

and you can tell it was actually an important part of the game design, and not JUST some 8bit memory limitation bullshit, because its the same exact thing in literally every other metroid game ever made since. you NEED ice beam to kill metroids. period. the space pirates bred/studied them because they can absorb energy from anything. thats what makes them the bioweapon that they are

>>11911235
NTA but metroids only exist in the final area, I dont know if I would call the choice between them a trap, you can rely on it until the end.

No map is probably the best thing about it.

>>11911262
>you can rely on it until the end.
and then in the end, you get swarmed by metroids and have no recourse since you cant hurt them
so you need to go back and get ice beam. which isnt even that far away
its an extremely important part of the hardest part of the game

that other anon was unironically right:
he didnt beat the game

>>11911409
That's what I'm saying, you can use the wave beam until you reach tourian. Even when it comes to speedrunning, there's a super secret ice beam in the first area you start in if you are going for record time.

>>11896143 (OP)
it's absolutely insane for anyone, including OP, to claim that this game has at any fucking point NOT even considered a classic
are you just baiting or something???

>>11896143 (OP)
It's a classic in the sense that barely anyone actually plays it, they just talk about it. It's laggy, basic, and short. If you want a game like that, go ahead and enjoy. I will stick with Super.

>>11896143 (OP)
Played the game for the first time about a couple weeks ago (FDS version). Absolute kino. Most of the complaints about the game are totally overblown. Drawing my own map was really fun, and you realize that it really isn't that confusing to navigate once you're familiar with it, especially compared to later games. Starting at 30 health any time you die sucks, but it's also good encouragement to not die. Getting good is really the best advice you can give anyone playing the game.

>>11911730
>Starting at 30 health any time you die sucks, but it's also good encouragement to not die.
this is a fact, and one step farther and you realize the true purpose of energy tanks isn't just increasing your health it's shaving off time spent refueling it

>>11896143 (OP)
It was ambitious at the time but it just didn't age well compared to super or even 2
Deal with it

>can't shoot diagonally or while crouching
Nah it sucks

It aged like garbage and Zero Mission is better in almost every aspect. Why replay it for any reason outside of nostalgic and historical value?

>>11903216
Wii trilogy if you have a Wiimote

>ctrl f
>zoomer 14 results
Man this board sucks now

>>11911794
They're placed incredibly strategically, which you may only start to notice in the latter half of your first run. Both bosses have an energy tank just nearby alongside one near the entrance to each lair. Six energy tanks is really enough for the late game to not be either too hard or too easy, and the two surplus energy tanks still act as free refills if you need them and can plan a good route around them. Even then, the Metroids in Tourian drop so much health and ammo that you can also just refill that way. Metroid's design is smarter and more generous than people give it credit for.

it's pronounced ME-TROID

>>11909865
Not a single person did that. You are a slav that played Kid Icarus for the first time in 2021 with a guide from a dot matrix printer on your lap

>>11900151
>people didn't grind rpgs to outlevel content back in the 80s!
imagine believing this

>>11911946
>Meetroid

meatroid

>>11911841
Zero Mission is for babies, you big baby retard.

>>11911946
it's actually pronounced metro-id

>>11911946
>>11912143
The last Metter-oid is in cuhpivity. The guhlexie is at pee-ace

I first beat this game by using a guide after going in circles around Norfair 20 times. Now that I've mostly forgotten the layout and know what to look for, I wanna try again. I wish I'd stuck it out the first time around

The thing that annoys me about the game more is the idea of needing to randomly bomb an arbitrary tile to progress.
Or some of the pools of lava being fake and needing to jump into them to progress.
I ended up damage boosting to get the ice beam in norfair because I couldn't remember where to go.

>>11914582
it needed to have that for its 72 KB of game to last long enough to be worth whatever a NES cartridge cost in 1986

>>11914582
it's SO MUCH BETTER than Zelda 1 about that sort of thing. count your lucky stars you can spam as many bombs as you want

>ctrl f zoomer
>15 results
NEStroid chads holding the ground
Based

Kino game, but the enemies hitting you between rooms and not being able to crouch kind of suck.

>>11914582
It's not arbitrary. Once you notice the patterns you can figure out where to go.

>>11914582
Rooms in this game are locked into either scrolling vertically or horizontally; a combination of both is not possible. With this in mind, the only surfaces you need to check for secrets are the topmost ceiling/bottom most floor in vertically oriented rooms, and the rare walls with no doors in horizontally oriented rooms. Note that seemingly single screen rooms are always vertical. Anyone with even the most basic pattern recognition will notice this almost immediately, and it makes Metroid the least cryptic of the games in the Metroid series. You only have to check a handful of tiles per room. Its a massive non-issue.

>>11911961
Sounds comfy honestly

>>11901143
that's because they had infinite time and no other games

>>11896149
Nope

>>11917437
So you're saying you have no concentration?

>>11906010
>mapper chips
lmao.
>>gets dismissed as massive programming errors by people with no perspective on programming
clearly demonstrates that they did nothing to fix the nes cart version at all. and yes - laziness and sloppy work are considered to be errors, especially with 6502 cpus where you need to save as many cycles as possible. it's truly amazing how this board will still suck on nintendo's cock this hard despite being shown in a fucking video just how lazy their programmers were.

>>11920673
And it's truly amazing how faggots like you will take anything a youtuber says as gospel.

>>11920272
Sounds to me like he has finite time and other games

>>11920687
> nooo! you have no perspective on programming!
> anon demonstrates that he does
> nooo! why are you taking a youtuber's word for it?!
nintentoddler shills and fanboys taking massive losses today.

i came here to post this.

>>11920702
> anon demonstrates that he does
How? By pointing at the video like a retard?

I never clicked with 1, but 2 is one of my favorite Metroids despite sharing some of the "flaws" people keep talking about
>no map
>weird jump physics (made me feel like I was actually in a planet with different gravity)
>limited combat kit
>weird music
Honestly I don't know what makes me feel meh about 1 while I deeply appreciate 2, it's not like gameplay was greatly improved, so I guess it's just the atmosphere that does it for me

>>11920712
There's been a guy spamming /vr/ with stuff like that for the past week, he'll make 8 threads each basically identical but with one word swapped out

>>11896143 (OP)
Metroid 1 was always terrible. Even the basic game boy one was seen as a huge improvement (and it was). There was a period in the early 00’s when Nintendo literally couldn’t give the ROM away. They packed it in to prime, ZM, even gave it its own cartridge release and NOBODY gave a shit.

>>11920908
I got it for NES as a kid, played it a bit before switching to something better like Megaman

>>11906010
I hate this youtuber like you wouldn't believe.

Like how he pointed out that the hit detection for this trap for off a few pixels as a way to explain why players think this level sucks.
Except that
>in action it's not noticeable at all
>this trap only appears once and is part of a multi path, so not only you can avoid it altogether but the other path is the better path anyway

And then all the retards, including on this board, starting spouting
>I've know this was broken since I was a kid!!!!
Literally nobody talked about this particular trap before... Retards saw something in a video that isn't a problem, that nobody noticed before, and lie to themselves to pretend "they've always known about it". This youtuber does more harm than good and alongside the likes of AVGN contributes in making retards believe "NES is all barely functional shovelware crap".

>>11906010
I hate this youtuber like you wouldn't believe.

Like how he pointed out that the hit detection for this trap was off a few pixels as a way to explain why players think this level sucks.
Except that
>in action it's not noticeable at all
>this trap only appears once and is part of a multi path, so not only you can avoid it altogether but the other path is the better path anyway

And then all the retards, including on this board, starting spouting
>I've know this was broken since I was a kid!!!!
Literally nobody talked about this particular trap before... Retards saw something in a video that isn't a problem, that nobody noticed before, and lie to themselves to pretend "they've always known about it". This youtuber does more harm than good and alongside the likes of AVGN contributes in making retards believe "NES is all barely functional shovelware crap".

>>11920719
> tries to lie about a video
> HOW?! what do you mean?!
it's not just the mental illness of nintentoddlers that is disturbing, it's like they pick and choose which parts of reality exist, even if it's in a video they posted themselves. nintendies just getting man handled on this board lately. if you're going to shill for such trash, try and do it without making yourself look like a window licking, special bus riding, padded jack wearing, drooling retard.

>>11920719
> tries to lie about a video
> HOW?! what do you mean?!
it's not just the mental illness of nintentoddlers that is disturbing, it's like they pick and choose which parts of reality exist, even if it's in a video they posted themselves. nintendies just getting man handled on this board lately. if you're going to shill for such trash, try and do it without making yourself look like a window licking, special bus riding, padded jacket wearing, drooling retard.

>>11920924
>"NES is all barely functional shovelware crap".
this is accurate, especially in asia. not sure how that offends you so deeply. it's like you forgot about the ocean of bootlegs, rom hacks and 3rd party junk that gave it such a shit reputation for the latter part of its life.

>>11920924
>making retards believe "NES is all barely functional shovelware crap".
It seems like the opposite is true? Just look at the comments on any of his videos. People are enamored by assembly programmers. In my opinion, too much so.

>>11920828
2 is a video game player's video game. Singular objective, rising stakes, a climb to power. It's easy to see why people enjoyed it so much it got a fan and an official remake, and people had already been trying to remake it for years. I'm shocked that there aren't more
>Put the player on a world or facility or xyz and have them hunt down a steadily evolving threat
video games in existence. It's such a great formula.

>>11896149
I played Kid Icarus a few years ago (I think it was right before Uprising came out) for the first time without having read any reviews or seen any impressions, and I hated it. The way you die if you touch the bottom of the screen is bullshit considering it's a vertically scrolling level and there was a platform right there before it scrolled a pixel down.

The fact that the Gameboy version can scroll back down and because of this alone I was able to beat it on my first try while the NES game is considered one of the harder games on the system says a lot about how bullshit that mechanic was.

>>11920990
>while the NES game is considered one of the harder games on the system

Only by idiots who only play first party games. Holy shit.

>>11920990
I mean just don't fall

>>11920917
Definition of filtered.

>>11922167
filtered
verb
Simple past tense and past participle of filter.

Anyone played X-Fusion? It's really impressive and way beyond any other romhack.
The last third feels like a train wreck though. Not gonna replay that one for sure.

>>11904902
Icycalm is still alive? Is the ubergame out yet?

literally and genuinely why can't metroid crawl

>>11922719
What's the point of crawling when you can roll?

>>11922719
He can. But he's too much of a pretty cool guy to do it.

>>11896143 (OP)
Why are you watching them? You know they can't play games without auto-maps and tutorial modes.

>>11920990
>I played Kid Icarus a few years ago (I think it was right before Uprising came out)
That was more than a decade ago

>>11922719
You know what's funny about this meme? The point where the screenshot was taken was *after* a moment when you need to use the ball to go through a small pace.

But no, everyone thought they were so smart and the guy was retarded for not realizing you can transform into a ball....

He genuinely was asking why you can't *crawl* in Metroid all along.

>>11920990
Really? I found Myths and Monsters the harder KI game

>>11896143 (OP)
Metroid was and still is a classic, but younger generations don't always understand classics from before their time. Not even zoomers, there are a lot of millennials who don't think Monty Python is funny.

>>11918842
You never browsed Nsider? I remember when people were treating the game like some second coming of Jesus just because they recently brought back the Metroid series prior and the Pit trophy in Melee.

Nowadays I seen people just trash it because it's too old school

>>11926810
NTA but I disagree, it's definitely easier on all counts

>>11897613
Uh oooooh this doesn't fit my 4chimp narrative!!
Quick, everyone defend Zero Mission!!

>>11912143
Sounds authoritarian.

>>11922625
>Not gonna replay that one for sure.
The dev thinks you're a faggot btw LOL!!

>>11926814
Did they parody the Ben-Hur logo?

>>11926881
It's a direct satire take on Ben-Hur, plus Sparticus, so yes.

>>11926814
Is the joke that "Brian" is a relatively ordinary and unmarkable name, so the implausible suggestion that an ordinary person named Brian would have a "secret life" warranting further examination is what creates the humour? Heh, I guess that's kind of funny, in an abstract sense. To Britons inhabit an abstract reality filled with the sounds of abstract laughter (while they play ZX Spectrum games and perceive more than what's its rudimentary colour palette might suggest)?

>>11927926
I've never heard it called secret life before so I assume that's a bts documentary or something. Just life of brian

I really fucking despise this sacred cow culture /vr/ and dare I say society at large has

>>11928093
I dunno I hate social media contrarianism and rank autism a lot more.

>>11928101
>rank autism
Like in Battle Garegga?

>>11896660
>>11896687
>i had a mental block on how to defeat ridley for years until i read his ASM code block and was like ohhhhhhhhhhhhh
Can you elaborate on this? I don't understand his behavior particularly well either

>>11896143 (OP)
It was never considered a classic by anyonne outside a small number of nitendo owners . Its not even a good game. Its speedrunner shit= for chrischans

>>11920924
>contributes in making retards believe "NES is all barely functional shovelware crap".

your take-away from those videos is off the wall. Where are you finding people who get that impression from watching this specific programming content? Genuinely curious because as >>11920970 pointed out, not really seeing it...

>clearly demonstrates that they did nothing to fix the nes cart version at all.

yet you didn't offer any suggestion on how to save more cycles that they should have realized. Could you educate us? or are you just a salty bitchposter with no practical connection to what your criticizing, only a childish whine to offer?

>>11920990
>Kid Icarus

another game probably designed around limitation with its one directional scroll as well

>>11896143 (OP)
It's important to call out historical revisionism when you see it. Far more people have played Metroid than any of the other classic Metroid games. Metroid was the only game in the series to sell 2 million copies until Prime. Super Metroid was the worst selling classic Metroid game. When GenX/Boomers think Metroid, they think the NES game. The only people who think Super Metroid is where the series got good are petulant zoomers or millenials who came of age when bloggers and video game magazines were overrating Super Metroid and Castlevania: SotN harder than any other two games in history.

You can't really understand how innovative the original Metroid was until you understand that Super Metroid and SotN''s retroactive praise was entirely a marketing scheme for used games in the early 2000s by collectors, bloggers, and magazine writers during the brief window of time where $100-$200 for a not-even-rare PS1 game was acceptable because "it's the only way to play it" other than building a PC that could run a PS1 emulator, which cost more than just buying a PS1/SNES + the game you want. Earthbound and FF7 were the other two games that this happened to, at least Earthbound is actually rare.

Something similar to this happened many years ago with the Elder Scrolls series, nobody under-50 made any attempt to play TES1 or TES2 until a few years ago, because there was this misconception among younger gamers that the series developed its core gameplay with Morrowind, which is not the case at all. Morrowind just improved on an already good formula. Same with Metroid and Super Metroid.

>>11896143 (OP)
I don;t even think its a clasic now. Vastly over rated and over shilled. A rygar rip off and very narrow biring and linear wuthout even rygars immersion typical nintendo slop bright colours and little else.

>>11928295
Most people who are into retro gaming don;t actually give a fuck about nintendo outside of japan and some spoilt normie urbabintes in the USA, people were in arcdes or on home computers. The nes sold 60 millon units but 20 million of those werejust in japan. There were 17 million of just Commodore 64s sold.....there is WAY to mcuh emphasis on nintendo here, mostly by people who probably were not even alive at the time, or if they wree were small chilren and had no idea what older people or nerds on computers were doing.

>>11928402
Most families didn't have computers in the early-mid 90s
>youre poor
I had the entire toylines of beast wars, street sharks, extreme dinosaurs, and skeleton warriors. I had many bikes and skateboards and not cheap ones.

No computer, too expensive and my parents, like most, saw absolutely no purpose of owning one.

>>11920990
>Gameboy version can scroll back down
It's weird how oftentimes the handheld gameboy version felt more advanced than the console NES game it was based on.

>>11928270
Nta but if I was tasked with fixing the lag, what I would do is make the level decoding routine be spread out across multiple iterations of the game loop instead of just shoving it into one. It would probably end up looking like this:
>Move the level decoding routine to the end of the game loop so that it is the code that is running while waiting for NMI.
>Check if NMI has come and gone at the end of each iteration of the level decoding routine loop so level decoding doesn't spill into the beginning of the next iteration of the game loop.
>Rewrite the level decoding routine to be controlled by various flags in memory that it checks on each iteration of its loop. This would allow it to resume decoding level data from where it left off after being cut off by the start of the next game loop iteration.
>Place code in location of the old level decoding routine that sets the flags to initiate level decoding when Samus passes certain a threshold on the screen. I would move these thresholds back a little from where they currently are to account for level decoding now taking more than one game loop iteration.
>Implement an "emergency override" flag that allows the game to lag to finish decoding the level segment if the player is less than one frame away from scrolling it one screen before it is finished.
That's a lot of refactoring code to fix a problem that is barely noticeable. The reality of commercial software development is that you can't polish your work forever. There are deadlines you need to meet and you need to make tradeoffs for what to spend time working on.

>>11928407
Absolute horseshit, the spectrum shipped over give million units, the commodire 17 million VIC-20 sold over 2.5 million, 1.5 million BBC Micro, the TRS-80 2.4 million, TI-99/4A 2.8 million units, and I could keep going and all of these were sold long before 1990, the AMiga lauched in 1985 and sold 4.85 million, the atari 400 and 600 sold 2 million etc etc etc and there are plenty more. You just don;t have fucking clue what you are talking about. I'm not even talking about CP/M but home computers marketed for kids Stop shitting on about fucking nintendo 24/7. It sucked, you could not copy tapes for it because it had retarded cartridges

>>11928407
>No computer, too expensive and my parents, like most, saw absolutely no purpose of owning one.
You're a pure normie. I won my first computer at 9 in a programminng competition I completed using a pencil and a sheet of paper from what I had learned from readinng computer magazies in libraries. You and you nintendo shit. Poor kids all over Europe had them as well as the US. Your parents wree just dumb and you wree a simpleton normie.

>>11928407
The
>people were in arcades or on home computers
bit makes me think he's from Europe, where indeed lots of people did have the Commodore and ZX Spectrum in the 80s. Commodore was a lot more than NES, at $500, but the Spectrum wasn't, hence so many UKfags talking about 80s pc gaming on it. £125 was absurdly cheap for a computer, even one that was made of rubber and had absolutely no business applications.

If you know enough boomers you start to realize that 8-bit computers had a moment in the early 80s, and a lot of people who ended up not bothering with computers again until the mid-2000s had one. Something to do with a widespread belief among 8-bit PC guys that the newer 16/32 bit PCs the industry started building were a scam designed to sell people a new $2,000 computer every year, which is also what killed Atari's console business. This is referenced all over 90s pop culture too, in case you need confirmation on it.

"You think your Commodore 64 is, "really neato!" what kinda chip you got in there? A Dorito?"
-Weird Al, All About The Pentiums (1999)

All the best selling single models of PCs are from the 80s, unless you count all Macbooks as a single model, which isn't really accurate.

In Japan, Metroid sold 1 million copies on FDS but Super Metroid sold 500k.

And there are two things to consider about that 1 million: half of the reported sales are from the Disk Writer re-release, a re-release several years after the original release where instead of buying the game for 30 bucks you'd bring a disk and they're write the game on it for 5 bucks. Which if you ask me would be the equivalent of counting rentals in the US and adding those to the "sales" charts.

What this means is that the game original sold 500k copies, but when coming out in 1986, right in the middle of the Japanese Famicom boom, before RPGs hoggled all the sales, and when almost every single release including third parties would sell like hot cakes

Is Metroid a classic in Japan? I guess yes, on the same level as Kid Icarus and Ice Climber. Super Metroid though, 500k for a first party SFC game is nothing. Which is why there is no N64 Metroid, at the time Nintendo did not think in terms of "what can we do for the west" (where Metroid was more successfull).
The only reason Metroid Prime existed was because the series was dead and Nintendo wasn't going to do anything with it, so giving it to gaijins was okay since the series was already dead they could do whatever they wanted with it and it didn't matter if they fucked it up because it was already dead. That's not me saying that, but the MP devs themselves.

>>11928431
teh The Amstrad CPC three million units,
1.5 million, ZX81, Acord atom and Electon etc etc etc Atari ST shipped June 1985 and sold 3-6 million (no one fucking knows how many). That' snot even including CP/M machies or IBM machines , the Apple 2e sold 4,5 million.

Hoe computers were WAY more important to gaming that the fucking NES and mamy of them were in homes playig games BEFORE the NES even shipped.

(cont) and I forgot to say but my point was, Metroid Prime's success coincides with the point in time when Super Metroid was started to be seen as an "all time influencial classic". It was the 00's equivalent of Dark Souls zoomies pretending that they knew about King's Field all along.

>>11928439
The Atari ST and Amiga were excellent gaming machiens, 16 bit and sold rought 10 million units between them inn the 80s and fucing crushed somthing like the NES in quality and range of games, they had a mouse and a eyoard for a start


Its like 20 years form now people pretending the PC did not esist and peoplejust used the swicth 2

>>11928431
He said that most families didn't have a computer. Do you actually think those numbers you spat out disprove that fact?

>>11928449
No one gave a fuck about Metriod. Its old 2 million units less than most home computer models for fuck sake. It was anoting out side your tiny nintendo revisionist fake history mind. It did not even win a golden joystick aware. Itv was fucking nothing and its not a great game compared to rygar either.

>>11928451
Do you acually tuink the 40 million nes that existed outside Japan and the tiny 2 million copies fo metroid that sold make it a 'classic'? It sold 2.7 million units. Something like Jet set willy sold over a million and that's just on the fucking spectrum.

You ninntendo faggots and your revisionst bullshit and hyberbolic crap. Nerds had computers, you were normies, late to the party and tarded

>>11928459
>>11928452
You know what I miss the most about old /vr/ ? Your retarded console warring ass being b& half the times.

>>11928449
That's all true, especially the Dark Souls zoomies part, but it's not because of Metroid Prime. From 2001-2005 you couldn't open a gaming magazine or website or watch a gaming TV show without hearing about how Earthbound, Super Metroid, Symphony of the Night, and Final Fantasy 7 were the four greatest games in the history of mankind, and how if you hadn't played them you weren't a real gamer and how you needed to go out and buy a copy from Funco/EB/Gamestop right now, even if it costs $100.

You can pinpoint the exact moment this started, because Circle of the Moon may be a Metroidvania, but it doesn't try to look or feel like Symphony, it just plays kind of like it. Then Symphonymania started taking off internationally, and Igarashi was brought in and explicitly told to make a Symphony clone that looks, plays, and felates Symphony of the Night as much as possible. Electronic Gaming Monthly's 1997 "100 games of all time" list features Tetris at #1, Super Metroid at #6, and SotN at #12. When they redid the list in 2001, Super Metroid was #1 and SotN was #4.

https://backloggd.com/u/Tzurki2/list/egm-100-best-games-of-all-time-2001/

I remember when they released this list, gamers were confused. How were there all these games that were supposedly better than Sonic/Mario/Metal Gear/Resident Evil, and why do I not know anyone who has them? Well basically, all English game journalists and bloggers were the same group of fags going to conventions together and they just arbitrarily decided that the greatest games of all time were a bunch of shit no one actually played, not just Super Metroid and SotN, but also FFV (which they were playing a fucking inaccurate fan translation of), Soul Caliber 1, Panzer Dragoon Saga, Dragon Force, Chrono Trigger, and Sonic CD.

By mere virtue of its existence as a Metroidvania game, 2001 EGM declared Circle of the Moon the 35th best game in human history 2 months after its release. Higher than every mainline Pokemon/Sonic.

>>11928451
More had them than catalogs of overpriced cartridges. for the NES which is one of the main reason sit never really sold inn places like teh UK. The console could be affiorded but teh cartrdiges wree extortionate. With home computers piracy was the norm and tapes were distributed with trails and samples on magazines everywhere. Aside rom that for arcade games. people went to..arcades...computer games had arcade style but the had adventures that took a month to finish and stuff like strategy games that you never got inn arcades. The nintendo cancer o this board is out of control

>>11928465
>You know what I miss the most about old /vr/ ?
The strong smell of your won farts? This board has onnly been around sine 2014, it barely fucinng exists. Or are you tryinng to tell me that pure innsane nintendo vomit now counts as a board culture? Where the fuck are the threads on all the other systems from teh 80s? Oh that's right no one fucking bothers to post here because its shit. Metroid was not some special fucking thinng at all. The TI99 sold more and you've probably never even heard of it. It had a great port of the ghostbusters game by the way more of a cross platform classic that metroid will ever be

>>11928480
>FFV (which they were playing a fucking inaccurate fan translation of)
Why do people always act like FFV never made it to the states?

>>11928489
>The TI99 sold more and you've probably never even heard of it. It had a great port of the ghostbusters game by the way more of a cross platform classic that metroid will ever be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsSIrhDXVHM&pp=0gcJCcMJAYcqIYzv

>>11928495
he's wrong by the way, I played this on a friens Ti99 as a kid in the early 80s.

>>11928494
Because the same magazine writers who were telling you to play it explicitly told you to find the fan translation and complained about the load times in the PS1. The same writers told you to also play the FFIV fan translation from the same guys instead of playing FF2. In modern times, that FFIV fan translation is regarded as one of the worst translation patches in the history of rom-hacking, but it didn't matter back then. There's a whole era of people who were convinced FF2 had a bunch of censorship it never had because the FFIV patch made the script much edgier.

Shitty ninntendo board larping as a retro board. Like a landwahale girl doing a tombraider cosplay.

>>11928506
I never got Finnal fantays fill stop. I was ufottinate enought to get a PS1 with the FF7 bundle and thought it was shit then and still think its shit now. Stuff like crash, spyro, wipeout, tekken 3 and tombraider crushed it.

>>11926873
>The dev thinks you're a faggot btw LOL!!
that's rich coming from a spastic running a website that has exceeded his monthly traffic limit and nobody can download anything at all.
>dev
that's a strong word to describe a lamer with a hex editor and patching tool.

>>11928506
Oh, I see.

>>11928514
FF7-9 are there own thing, and very much a product of their time. Much like platformers of the time were padded collectathons, 7-9 are padded to 100 hours by cryptic map locations, sidequests, and megabosses. They don't really resemble the prior or later Final Fantasy games at all.

FF7 was a big deal though, and turned a bunch of anime weeabs into gamers. This crowd was pretty gullible, which is how a bunch of fan translators and magazine writers and bloggers in the late 90s and early 2000s convinced them that Ted Woolsy was Satan and FF1-6 were censored or something because they weren't as dark and edgy as FF7. In reality, other than 2 and 4, none of those games are particularly dark, and 2 and 4 aren't so much edgy as they just like to kill their characters off. They don't really have all this existential whining about it like FF7/Phantasy Star 2 do though. Because of this, when some guys released innaccurate patches of 4 and 5, they were regarded as amazing definitive ways to play the game, a reputation they held until people who knew Japanese blew the whistle on them being even more inaccurate than the SNES/PS1 originals.

Anyway, if you thought retro gaming was a shitshow full of gullible idiots following the leader now, just always remember, in 2001 we were playing a TL hack of FFIV that put 2000s pop music references and dick jokes into the script. And we were eating it up so much we were telling all the non-retro gamers that, "Umm actually, FFIV is the dark and edgy one, makes 6 and 7 look like a kid's game."

The kid who told me to play the FFIV romhack was also the kid who told me about a new fake secret unlockable way to revive Aeris in FF7 every day in class. He eventually got expelled for shooting staples into his arm almost every day in class for attention. Then he killed himself with pills.

>>11928530
Dude, it's full of this shit. We were so retarded.

>>11928489
>Or are you tryinng to tell me that pure innsane nintendo vomit now counts as a board culture?
never was, never will be.
>Oh that's right no one fucking bothers to post here because its shit
it's difficult to post a thread about systems without losers arriving and start posting about nes in a thread about spectrum or apple 2 or whatever. you can report them all day and the moderator and janny of this board does nothing about it.

>>11928534
O I know they have a huge followinng and I have them on a shelf, 7 and 8 at least but I just never got them. There were so many great games on the PS1 though. I love shit like cardial syn two player and wipeout, tekken 3 and, worms, die hard, rage racer tombraider 2, g police, colony wars, and other people on the same machine loved crash, spyro. gex, medieval Any driving game with drum and base! Final fantasy was on for one night with everyone around the playstaion collectively going what the fuck though. I still ahve the same copy and I don;t think its been back in the playstaionn since. 8 I got in a eastate sale stuck inn the bottom of a box of other stuff like buzz buzzers and a wheel

>>11928536
The best place to talk about other sytems is in nintendo threads then. I have quite litreally thousands od retro games and computers as well as everythinng down to cod elisting for them. Time to up this boards game and stop it being so cancerous and irrelevent, I'd love to see someoen do a thread on the atari 800/400. I knew one of the designers of teh Atari 2600 quite well by the way, lovely guy. I knew a lot of people who wrote NES games and SNES and N64 stuff too. Fun fact they all hated dealing with Nintendo because Nintendo were a bunch of crooks.

>>11928480
>From 2001-2005 you couldn't open a gaming magazine or website or watch a gaming TV show without hearing about how Earthbound, Super Metroid, Symphony of the Night, and Final Fantasy 7 were the four greatest games in the history of mankind,

Horsheshit no one gave a flying fuck about nintendo games in the PS2 era. The general assumption was that Nintendo was going the cease to exist. No harm if they had ceased to exist might have saved us from the abomination and waste of tech that was waving you arms around like someone with a brain tumour
The horror of the motion control era the horror.
And you know I would mind except the fucking PS2 eyetoy actualy worked better than the wii and no one gave a fuck because motion controls were obviously nonsense. Did you know there is actually a motion controlled eyetoy sonic game that inolves waving your arms around like a luatic. Might have stopped christ chan going to the dark side.

>>11928559
>i'd love to see someoen do a thread on the atari 800/400.
we had one a few weeks ago.. or maybe a few days ago.. i forget. great machine.
> I knew a lot of people who wrote NES games and SNES and N64 stuff too.
i still know quite a few people from that world. some are good friends to this day.
>Fun fact they all hated dealing with Nintendo because Nintendo were a bunch of crooks.
never heard anyone i know of that did contract work for nintendo software development have anything great to say about that corporation. only ever heard praise about the hardware. i don't think anybody liked to deal with them but they didn't have much of a choice if they wanted to release software for their latest devices.

>>11928536
As someone who mostly agrees with you, I can tell you it'd be healthy to just get over it.
Because what you're dealing with is not a /vr/ problem, it's a reality problem. Nintendo has just been too dominant at too many different points in time, in too many places. And all of this success has culminated at the same time in the very moment that we're in. What I mean by that is, Nintendo has been dominant in the NES, Game Boy, Wii, and Switch eras. 50 year olds, 40 year olds, 25-35 year olds, teenagers. You're living in a moment in time when everybody on a family vacation could be a hardcore nintentard who grew up in a period where Nintendo was the #1 console. For us people over 30 who grew up with Playstation or PCs it's just bizarre because they're always clueless and show up in weird places at weird times.

But it's not a /vr/ thing. If you go to places like Akihabara right now they're everywhere. Every self-respecting PC-88/X68000 playing old man in Akiba has the front of his store lined with hundreds of GBCs and copies of Pokemon Yellow. He knows that he can rip these guys off because their kid will cry if Dad doesn't pay 25,000 yen for the GBC. 1 floor up all his PC98, Amiga, Playstation and Sega games and consoles are all priced reasonably. The good news is, I don't think it can get any worse than it is right now. And if you have Nintendo shit to sell, it's a good time to unload.

>>11928551
PS1 and Saturn had a lot of great games that were just straight up arcade quality and still had solid framerates. But for some reason we all obsessed over FMV cutscenes in stuff like Final Fantasy and Panzer Dragoon. Random amazing stuff like Crime Killer, 60 FPS Carmageddon/Chase HQ type game.

>>11928574
You're right. They only influenced us pirates and retro nerds. That's why all those magazines are dead, LOL. Still though, what I told you is why a bunch of random 90s games are overpriced to this day. Look up the lists in the magazines if you don't believe me.

>>11928585
>X68000
i love this machine so much that it's unreal
>Nintendo has just been too dominant at too many different points in time
yeah. you're right.
> That's why all those magazines are dead
some of them dug their own graves pretty deep or were never profitable. some i'm not upset over seeing gone.

>>11928605
>>X68000
Never saw one, only jap machines that had the slightest visibility in that era was the MSXs but I doubt they sold moire tan a few hundred thousand outside of Japan, they wre eliek teh Jupiter Ace (the one that had to be different and had fortran instean of basic)

>>11928585
>intendo has just been too dominant at too many different points in time
Its was entirely irrelevent to me in the 70s, 80s and the first time I probably ever saw one was a gaboy in the mid 90s, I did see MANY different home computers and arcade machines and even sega machines with soic and ecco the dolphin, amigas, sts, even cpm and mpm mavhines and PCs but nintendo had no impact on me at all, they were completley dead anoyt of it in the 90s as well that was all amiga, st, pc and ps1 an sega shit, same inthe 00s that wsas PS2. The ONLY time they have been dominant is the switch 1 era and let's face it that's been shit. I think that's where all these die hard loons who know fuck all about gaming with strong and completely surreal opinions about the importantce of nintendo in the past come from. When you cosider that they sold 34 million nes is in the US it's fuck all and it was a toy that ran janky arcade ports, no one wrote games on it, its not like jeff minter gave a fuck about it.

The PET

>>11928605
>> That's why all those magazines are dead
>some of them dug their own graves pretty deep or were never profitable. some i'm not upset over seeing gone.
https://fusionretrobooks.com/collections/crash-magazine

>>11928626
My favorite surreal Nintendo Switch guy opinion is that Doom 64 is a good Doom game. If you didn't know it got re-released on the Switch you'd have woken up one day and just thought everyone went crazy.
>>11928605
>>11928613
The closest machine we got in the west was the Amiga.
X68000 wasn't the best seller, but it left a really big impression on Japanese PC gamers and game collectors. The giant boxes the games came in were beautiful and the manuals were also usually massive.

>>11928648
>The closest machine we got in the west was the Amiga.
The ST was a beast of a bachine as well, its midi capabilities put it in a lot of recordig studios, you can hear it in a lot of 80s movies sountracks running cubase. It sounds like neat machine but I'm blocked by moon runes and imperial glyphs, that's the 16 bit mavhes wree you start to see whole genres explode like god games, sim city, management games, combat flight games games and of course civilisation. The 16 bit computer era hold up really well

Did xwing runon a 286? I think red barron and gunship did anyway.

>>11928648
Fun fact the first time I played doom I played it on sun OS and we got it to run multiplayer that was just the end of the BBS era before the internet which is what made toom and wolfenstein 3D as their demos were by dar the most popular BBS downloads. I'm ancient enough to have been a reciever tapping phreaker.

>>11928667
The X68000s clock rate was pretty good for 87. Quite a few notable 3D games on it, including a version of Star Cruiser that isn't quite as ugly as the PC88/98 versions. Less useful for than the ST and Amiga for stuff outside of gaming though. The Japanese were still using Amigas for pre-renders and cutscenes well into the western Silicon Graphics era. D on PS1/Saturn was entirely rendered on later model Amigas.

This guy has a video of xwing on his 286, so I guess so, you have to watch an 8088 demo first for some reason though.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8SR2XdJdYQ

>>11928673
I came about later during the AOL and early internet era. I know doom demos and map development was booming on Compuserve at one point though, and quite a few of those maps that didn't end up on shovelware disks are lost.

>>11896143 (OP)
The problem with this game is you need to draw a map, which is annoying

>>11928702
Well actually you don't need to draw a map

All you need to do is learn the environments through weeks on end of playing blindly because you have absolutely no other distractions because you're a nerd who doesn't play outside.

>>11928613
> but I doubt they sold moire tan a few hundred thousand outside of Japan,
sales figures for x68000 aren't exactly known but it's estimated around 1 million at most, in japan. including the revisions that came later. finding them outside of japan was exceptionally rare as all the software for x68k is all in japanese. the operating system is in japanese too.

>>11928648
i loved the amiga but its lack of tile graphics mode made it painful for any kind of ports from consoles and arcade.

>>11926873
Toning difficulty down isn't going to help it much imo, because the instakills are ingrained into the design. I respect what it does in the end, but simply put I don't want to play it again because of THAT moment, except said moment extends through long parts of the hack.

>This game was rightfully considered a classic until about a few years ago
I'm guessing zoomers are playing these games for real and not savestating through them on emulators like millennials.

>>11928428

I like how your suggestions still operate with the design paradigm of the original level encode. Most people even if they tackled it would have bitched and moaned about that being the solution in the first place, it would seem.

>>Place code in location of the old level decoding routine that sets the flags to initiate level decoding when Samus passes certain a threshold on the screen. I would move these thresholds back a little from where they currently are to account for level decoding now taking more than one game loop iteration.

I feel like this has the best chance to make a difference where refinement was potentially missed. you can take other things into account, like Samus's current and max speeds and then dynamically change the load-in threshold point.

>>Implement an "emergency override" flag that allows the game to lag to finish decoding the level segment if the player is less than one frame away from scrolling it one screen before it is finished.

how would you determine such a threshold?

>That's a lot of refactoring code to fix a problem that is barely noticeable. The reality of commercial software development is that you can't polish your work forever. There are deadlines you need to meet and you need to make tradeoffs for what to spend time working on.

this was kinda the point that other shitposters want to dismiss or handwave as laziness. After all, we don't know how much time was actually given and at exactly what point in JP development they knew it was going to us and on cart. Were they handed a finished game? lots of variables to factor into that bullshit.

>>11896143 (OP)
>>11896149
Both of these games were always shitty games hyped to hell and back by Nintendo faggots who have never played anything that isn't 1st party Nintendo in their entire lives. same goes for shitty ass star fox. All of these games are mediocre but praised as godly by nintodlers who's only other frame of reference is mario.

>>11929991
You got it backwards dumbass.

>>11930115
Go on and tell us a more impressive console game in 1986.

>>11896143 (OP)
It was always considered a staple growing up (we were 7-9 and weren’t calling things classics since they just came out although we weren’t saying staples either, hey fuck you we weren’t even ten yet) I just never got into it myself personally. Never really gave it a fair try to be honest tho. I love Sotn so I should love this right, some similar elements?

>>11930031
Dynamically changing the threshold based on speed is overkill. Samus isn't that fast and her speed isn't very dynamic. Just have it be based on position. I don't know enough about the thresholds in the vanilla game to comment on them. For the new design, I would make it so loading for the next screen starts as soon as you cross the halfway point of the current screen. If you cross over the halfway threshold again before the level is finished decoding, it wouldn't matter since the flags would be reset and the level decoder routine would just start over without causing any problems. As far as the emergency override goes, you could probably forgo checking Samus's position entirely and set it based on whatever variable updates the PPU's scroll register during NMI. Basically, if the next NMI is going to scroll the next nametable on camera before the next level segment is finished decoding, don't let NMI occur.

These changes would have probably been made for the original Japanese disk version since that also has lag frames when decoding some rooms. But again, the lag from scrolling rooms is very subtle during actual gameplay. Dropping to 30 fps for a single frame isn't an Earth shattering problem. There's a chance the developers didn't even notice it.

>>11930195
Okay "don't let NMI occur" is bad phrasing. I mean don't draw the next frame during NMI. Cause a lag frame, essentially.