Why did the Atari style joysticks endure for so long? It's just 4 directions and ONE button? Was it really enough for 8 and 16 bit computer games?

>>11902621 (OP)
Yeah it was mostly enough. If you needed more buttons you had the keyboard (space bar or the commodore key for bombs etc. weren't unusual).

>>11902621 (OP)
>It's just 4 directions and ONE button?
Weren't the Atari joysticks actually analog?

>>11902641
No. Apple II and IBM PC used analog joysticks. Pretty much everything else was digital. Atari 5200 had a monstrosity of a controller which did have analog stick, but everybody hated it and Atari went back to digital with 7800 controller.

The rumor tells that Miyamoto wanted to make the GameCube controller to have only one button to simplify control inputs. The big ass green A button was the compromise he had to accept.

If you program your game well enough, you don't need much.

>>11902659
Uh huh, that's the mentality that led to the mess which was Balan Wonderworld

Why didn't it have a button on the top of the stick?
It feels so wrong to not have it.

ONE BUTTON? NO DPAD???

>>11902621 (OP)
>Why weren't old things more like the newer things that they developed into later?
We have a true genius among us

>>11902621 (OP)
Feet
Feet
Feet
FEET
Feet
feet
feeeeeeeeet

>>11902621 (OP)
have you looked at an atari 2600 game? how many buttons do you think you need for those

>>11902913
OP asked if it was enough for computer games, not 2600 games.

>>11902913
Some games like Activision's StarMaster had to resort to using B&W/Color TV switch on the console itself as a button due to one button on the joystick not being enough.

>>11902915
why would he ask such a reality detached question

>how did the apple 1 button mouse endure for so long? was it really enough for quake 3 arena?
that's what he is asking

>>11902659
There's no way that can be true. Even miyamoto isn't that crazy right?

>>11902689
Trying to make games for an audience that doesn't exist anymore is what led to Balan Wonderworld.

>>11902998
Eh, that game suffered from a lot more than that. People were generally pretty hype when they released the initial tidbits about Balan, more so when some of the art and renders came out. What really, really hurt Balan was the type of bizarre development cycle it had. On his previous games Yuji learned to basically outsource the entire development of the actual game portion to studios that would do it super cheap and garnered some success by this method. He'd get a bunch of super talented people to handle the art direction, ost, premise, story, all that stuff, then let literal who's code the actual games portion and thats what ultimately bit Balan in the rear. An inexperienced team who used ai to handle the level design and had very loose notes on what the gameplay was supposed to be.

Its a real shame as if you begin to look at the concept art and read what the premise was supposed to be, that game would have been SOUL personified if the gameplay could have lived up to the rest. Genuinely some of the best concept art I've seen in a game.

>>11902621 (OP)
The 5200 came out in 1982 and has like 20 buttons

>>11902995
It was probably some idea he had for 5 seconds that he threw out during a meeting where someone was like '...nah, that wouldn't work' and they swiftly moved on. Of course some people then exaggerate that to some grand idea he pushed tooth and nail for before being defeated.

>>11902621 (OP)
>Atari style joysticks
>8 and 16 bit computer games
at some point you're just so ignorant that you can't formulate a sensible question.

>>11903015
The game still has plenty of soul, and it has one of my favorite things about any 3D platformer: Using your powers in the wrong intended fashions (especially in 2 player)

You seem to want to autistically want a game that doesn't exist, like some half finished PS1/N64/Saturn artifact, when the game has plenty of appealing aspects as it is currently.

Even so I still think there are a few baffling design decisions (One button because sonic did it, no proper split screen for coop because Sonic did it), which make it clear Yuji wanted the game to appeal to REALLY young kids.

The problem is kids are either playing COD (if their parents allow them to) or Fortnite. Balan Wonderworld doesn't exist in the same space as say Nights Into Dreams did, where just being on the shelf behind glass meant some kids would see the cover and go "wow I gotta have that"

I'm glad the game exists, but there is no world other than the 90's that it could've thrived. It would need to be some internet/indie made for an incredibly low budget thing like FNAF or Minecraft, and FNAF has movies now and Minecraft did huge at the box office and will probably get a sequel.

>>11903015
>>11903041
>I'm glad the game exists, but there is no world other than the 90's that it could've thrived.

I also meant to add: If I were somebody at Square, I would've never approved Balan, but Square does nothing now but fuck shit up.

>>11903041
It has been a fat minute since I played it but my gripes mostly come from the level design thoughtlessly being thrown together (cant remember the deep dive that went into it, but the devs admitted it was some sort of algorithm rather than hand crafted), and the counterintuitive suit switching for basic actions, as well as the time it takes to switch from suit to suit. I have no doubt in my mind that if this was handled a bit better and had the rough spots smoothed out it would have done just fine. I mean, something as simple as having the "jump" function be universal would have gone a long way.

>>11903074
Basically:
>hand craft levels and make em that abstract, artsy fartsy look the concept art showed
>univeral jump button
>instant swapping between suits with maybe a slight effect to show it happened
>make the Balan segments something akin to Nights or even mimic the controls you eventually get when you unlock his suit

I think the game would be above average with some of these in place. If you really wanted to go the extra mile you could include the novels context into the story somehow and actually differentiate some of the more asinine repeat suits, but thats not a huge deal in my book.

>>11903074
Yeah a universal jump feels mandatory in any game, but then you get into why you have the suits as power ups (and probably why you shouldn't), then the whole costume grinding you have to do (which I mostly stayed away from). I think he wanted clearly overpowered suits that became the players preference (basically anything with a jump and an attack), but also, he wanted an isle of the misfit toys kinda deal, where you get these absolutely baffling outfits that almost don't seem to do anything, but eventually find a way to fit in like puzzle pieces. This is particularly clear when the bosses have "goals" meant for specific outfits.

>>11903085
Probably, sadly some of the ideas really should have been challenged and reworked. Again, its not the worst thing in the world, but I think it would have actually landed with a proper audience had it addressed some basic issues. Either way, its long dead now and probably for the best. Just a blip of a rare soulful idea with a wonderful concept and art direction.

I'll never not be sad we didn't get an art book or at the very least a physical copy of the novel.

>>11903106
You need to know your audience and even if one exists. A Hat in Time appealed to Gamecube owning boomers by copying control ideas from Sunshine. When you play A Hat in Time, you know what you're playing and why. I don't know the audience for Balan Wonderworld even if it was super polished. Hipsters who claim the Saturn is great but never actually played Nights?

>>11903112
I suppose it would just be aimed at the people who wanted a nostalgic platformer from that era. It wouldn't have to reinvent the wheel. It had all the pieces in place for something profitable enough so long as the development costs were low. I mean, look at the Lucky's Tale games (I think they're called) and how they have found a decent audience among the nostalgic crowd as well as kids and those games really dont do anything particularly well either but its all put together competently.

Although, its us just arguing over a hypothetical humble success or flop. Of course, wishing anything was a success in this day and age is such a monkeys paw that I think I'm fine with it being a soulful blip of servicable yet wasted potential.

actually, us discussing it has me wanting to play it again so I'm gonna.

Nice to talk to somebody else who actually played and appreciated the game. That in and of itself is a rarity.

>do what the arcades do but make it CHEAP

>>11902659
I found it weird how sonic worked fine with 1 button but so many Amiga games were ruined because of it.

>>11902621 (OP)
Stuff like Wonderboy on c64 are worse for it but the computer does support 2 buttons if wired to use the pots as a 2nd button

>>11902621 (OP)
>Was it really enough for 8 and 16 bit computer games?
No, it's why Europe jumped ship to consoles in the early 1990s as if the micros had 6-8 button controllers (8-10 counting select and start) they would've stayed on PCs.

>>11903175

>>11903181
Thats by the mid 1990s which by then everyone jumped ship to this.

>>11903213
And this.

>>11903217
And lets not forget about this.
Sorry that it's the North American button color pallet.

>>11903220
we like the NA color scheme here.
we are adults, not impresionable children that need everything exploding with colors.
also having concave X and Y is superior.

>>11903041
Kids are not playing COD due to it's M rating, otherwise CPS would be taking the parent's kids away.

Kids are however playing Mario and Kirby, just like their adult counterparts.

>>11903252
>Kids are not playing COD due to it's M rating

Bro I was playing Resident Evil back then. Those kids are definitely playing COD and the lame ones are stuck playing Fortnite.

>>11903257
No you were not, please stop lying.

>>11903041
The game is fucking cringe.

>>11903269
Mad that your parents enforced the ratings?

t. also owned Duke Nukem Zero Hour

>>11903220
Why would you apologize? The SNES controller is superior to the SFC controller.

>>11903027
>that he threw out during a meeting
Yeah, maybe played devil's advocate to focus the discussion on the number of buttons that is actually important.

>>11903283
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcWM_1hBu_c
Everyone enforced the ratings, it's just what normies did.

>>11903474
>Everyone enforced the ratings

WHO enforced the ratings? My local rental place Whistlestop never asked for ID on games.

>>11903220
Damn that looks good. I can literally feel it in my hands. Purple is the color of royalty, you know.

>>11902621 (OP)
It was enough for the kind of crude and rudimentary games you'd see in the 2600 days, but even if they were making and porting such games for home systems like the Commodore 64, those machines could easily do SO much more, it's just that this wasn't always explored.

As for "enough for 8-bit and 16-bit games," clearly it absolutely wasn't, as controllers with multiple buttons were already being sought during the 1980s, and the idea of a stick with a single button would be thought hilariously archaic and insufficient by the time of 16-bit machines.
Tell me, are you just bullshitting for (You)s, or are you an actual kid who don't know better?

>>11902659
Sounds like 100% bullshit and I don't buy it, home console games had already long since evolved past that, even Super Mario Bros. on Famicom/NES used separate buttons for jumping and running/shooting, and Miyamoto had kept advancing from there.

>>11903252
Here's somebody who thinks he knows how the world works.

>>11903476
Please stop lying you delulu retard.

Everyone enforced ratings, otherwise CPS will be taking everyone's kids away.

>>11903502
Because I do know how the world works.

>>11903269
Games I played at the age of 6 or 7
>Doom 2
>Diablo
>Quake 2
>Starcraft
>Warcraft 2
>Goldeneye 007
I also got GTA3 when it came out, and I was 11 at the time.

>>11903510
Thats because your parents were white trash/black/Mexican who neglected you.

>>11903516
When you go out drinking with your friends (assuming you have any), do you ask for a glass of water?

>>11903516
What's the worst message you could get out of those games? Mortal Kombat I might argue could cause a kid to start fighting.

>>11903510
No Famicom, you didn't play those games when you were 6/7 and you didn't play GTA3 when you were 11.

Jesus Fucking Christ that asshole netouyo from /co/ is here, pack it up guys.
>>11903516
The guy lying, CPS would've taken him away if that was the case.

>>11903528
Yea, 6/7 year olds were playing Mario 64 and DKC3 back in 1996 while 11 year olds were playing Paper Mario and Luigi's Mansion back in 2001.

Those computers also had a whole keyboard, so you had plenty extra keys for additional functions.

>>11903528
This guy is right, my parents let me play an M-rated game when I was a kid and a whole SWAT team instantly broke into our house and whisked me away to the nearest adoption agency so I could be re-homed away from my vile law-breaking parents.

>>11902621 (OP)
>Why did the Atari style joysticks endure for so long?
What are you talking about? The very next console after the Atari (the Nintendo) had a d-pad and 2 action buttons.

>>11903542
Great understanding of history, anon!

>>11902621 (OP)
Tranny art.

>>11903252
>Kids are not playing COD due to it's M rating
>otherwise CPS would be taking the parent's kids away.
Cool, just awoken and already read some retardation

>>11903834
Thats not retardation, thats the god's honest truth.

>>11903836
Yes no minor ever watched South Park, an M rated show, and the few unfortunate souls who did got their families in jail and their sorry asses handed to an orphanage

>>11902827
Probably cheaper to produce without button on top. A lot of aftermarket sticks had them though.

>>11903852
TV-MA, but pretty much.

>>11903861

>>11903867
kek'd

>>11903224

>also having concave X and Y is superior.

lmao

>>11903867
I miss this type of shitpost

>>11902621 (OP)
We take it for granted these days, but why are they called "joysticks"? Who came up with that?

>>11904068
>The name joystick is thought to originate with early 20th century French pilot Robert Esnault-Pelterie.[2] There are also competing claims on behalf of fellow pilots Robert Loraine, James Henry Joyce, and A. E. George. Loraine is cited by the Oxford English Dictionary for using the term "joystick" in his diary in 1909 when he went to Pau to learn to fly at Blériot's school. George was a pioneer aviator who with his colleague Jobling built and flew a biplane at Newcastle in England in 1910. The George and Jobling aircraft control column is in the collection of the Discovery Museum in Newcastle upon Tyne, England. Joysticks were present in early planes, though their mechanical origins are uncertain.[3] The coining of the term "joystick" may actually be credited to Loraine, as his is the earliest known usage of the term, although he most certainly did not invent the device.

>>11902621 (OP)
Flight simulators on PCs.

>>11904076
Though Esnault-Pelterie definitely was the first to invent it, I still think the name most likely comes from James Henry Joyce's "Joyce stick".

I can still feel that blister you got on the inside base of your thumb.

>>11903590
Need some art of Princess Highground instead.

>>11903224
>we like the NA color scheme here.

I am genuinely confused about what OP's image is referencing.

Other than being clickbait, of course.

>>11904968
Pole Position was a racing game and it's being used very awkwardly as a double entendre along with joystick for the young man's penis being erect.

>>11905291
I knew about that part. I guess I'm the idiot for thinking there was something more to it.

>>11906187
What's even more confusing is why they're both holding a controller because Pole Position on the 2600 is only one player. Whoever drew that wasn't thinking right.

>>11903252
>>11903041
>Kids are not playing COD due to it's M rating, otherwise CPS would be taking the parent's kids away.
kids are playing COD just not the amount that your average boomer LARPer on 4chan thinks. they're likely playing warzone (because it's F2P) nowadays or whatever the newest COD is on game pass if they have a device to stream it or an xbox.

>The problem is kids are either playing COD (if their parents allow them to) or Fortnite.
most kids are usually playing shit like roblox, fortnite or other F2P games because they're well...free, indie/children's horror games like FNAF or poppy playtime because of youtubers and kids content farms, minecraft for almost a similar reason and finally nintendo & sonic because they're target audience is children & manchildren.

>I'm glad the game exists, but there is no world other than the 90's that it could've thrived.
balan's core problem is that naka is a idea guy at best and total hackfraud at worst. the game could've thrived today in the hands of someone more talented & competent than naka.

>>11903112
>Hipsters who claim the Saturn is great but never actually played Nights?
basically. i feel like most of the hype came from the expectation of it being a spiritual successor to nights.

>>11908195
No, they're not, kids are playing Mario, Sonic and Kirby just like their adult counterparts, also FNAF and Poppy Playtime are aimed at teens and (mostly) young adults because THEY'RE TOO SCARY FOR KIDS.

Please shut the fuck up, you don't know what you're talking about.

>>11902621 (OP)
This is some dobson tier shit.
>ooooh here's my self-insert cartoon character sitting next to my ideal gaymer gurlfrend (who's taller than me because I'm a manlet and I have a fetish for a big woman stepping on my balls because some girl cucked me in highschool and I was raised by a single father.. oooohhh.....)
>get it? this scenario would make my penis hard lol
Embarrassing.

>>11908262
That's quite an elaborate scenario you came up with, is it on your mind a lot?

>>11908306
>is it on your mind a lot?
It is now, after seeing OP's picture.

>>11908251
speaking as someone who works in a school you're full of shit and probably a sheltered retard.

>>11908638
You're the sheltered shit head retard in this thread, I have been a teacher for over 20 years and all kids talk about gaming wise is Mario, Donkey Kong, Kirby and Sonic, they don't talk about the sewage you just shat out of your ass.

>>11908643
>Mario, Donkey Kong, Kirby and Sonic.
Of course, those games are aimed at people 5 to 125.

>>11908643
>"I have been a teacher for over 20 years"
>posts like a 12 year old.
sure thing kiddo.

>>11910554
I am a teacher.

>>11907004
she just thinks every game is Pole Position, so that's what she calls it
my grandpa used to call every game Frogger, he'd see us playing SFII Turbo or something on the SNES and be like
>Is this Frogger again? What level you at?

>>11912319
She survived being in the Pole Position commercial, but now has severe brain damage. She must play Pole Position!

>>11910698
Impressive larp.

>>11908262
That's a very unique interpretation of the picture, anon.

>>11912319
based grandpa

>>11903852
>>11903834
New Ranma disappointing