Thread 12167398

The world looks like a giant brown bowl of shit, every NPC just feels like a static object that exists purely to infodump bland, copy-pasted garbage to you about the same generic topics, combat is fucking abysmal, missing 90% of attacks against a fucking unmoving worm, and I dared to try to attack a generic peasant in a shack and couldn't even hit him one single time before giving up and reloading, and the armor system makes zero sense as the light armor the shopkeeper sells has 4x as much armor as the heavy armor despite being much cheaper and more lightweight.

It's just boring, dry, unintuitive garbage. Honestly I don't know how people even still play these games, they've aged so poorly. I remember liking this game as a kid, but I was stupid with no standards back then.

And I'm not jaded or zoomer or anything, I can still play shit like Max Payne 1 or ALttP or Star Fox 64 or DKC and realize "yeah this game is still a fucking classic and for good reason". Meanwhile Morrowind feels like it was only ever good to one small niche of tabletop autists for one small window of time where its early 3D jank was acceptable and before later (and honestly earlier) RPGs ran circles around it.

play Max Payne 1 or ALttP or Star Fox 64 or DKC then who is stopping you

>>12167398 (OP)
Didn't read. This entire series is gay casual shit. No wonder they bought Fallout

I didn't care for how dialogue was implemented. It's like every NPC is hooked up to a central glossary, as opposed to being individual characters with their own personalities.
That's what actually filtered me about it, as opposed to the things people complain about, like the combat.
Also, there's like one piece of music that plays the whole game?

>>12167456
Yeah it feels like a game for autists, the weird, socially retarded ones, not the savants.

>>12167473
And you're the savant, I assume?

>>12167478
No, I'm just not autistic.

Not every RPG needs to be combat focused, but give me *something* to work with. These NPCs are about as interesting as a piece of cardboard, the quests are of the bland fetch variety, and sure I can have some different stat numbers that make me better or worse in certain categories but where's the actual role-playing, the interactivity, the player choice and agency?

>>12167473
people who read wikis for fun

shit gameplay and fetch quests dont matter to normies who want to be "immersed" in a heckin fantasy world

>>12167473
The autist savants make true accomplishments IRL instead of wasting their time on games and cartoons.

Playing Morrowind made me realize two things:
1) Skyrim may have butchered many of the RPG elements but at least it's fun to play (unlike Morrowind)
2) Oblivion (but really Fallout 3 which is just Oblivion but better in nearly every way) is still the undisputed king

>>12167492
morrowind was singleplayer everquest for xbox. its dialogue system resembles eq's text parser and the game as a whole is about reading books in between of munchkin whoring stats, enchants and spells until you become an overpowered demigod. i'm not sure what game was hyped up to you

>>12167504
understanding daggerfall will make you understand all of the bethesda game studios design ambitions (or lack there of). daggerfall was a space sim with radiant quests and rudimentary dungeon crawling. morrowind is believed to standout from the rest of bethslop because of the actually good fluff writing

>>12167504
Okay, probably not for me then. Honestly I never even knew people would actually sit there and read the lore flavortext books in Oblivion, I guess Morrowind is for that type of weirdo.

>>12167492
I am autistic, and I got filtered hard by this as well.
I love Deus Ex, which is an older game, with equal levels of "jank", but what Deus Ex has is tone and mood, artisinal qualities like a well crafted soundtrack, and individual characters you can talk to who feel like real people.
The entire time I'm playing Morrowind, I'm like "when do I get my meeting Gunther and Anna moment?", and it just doesn't happen.

>>12167456
I like the dialog system. It lets you do stuff like talk to someone you made friends with in a previous quest in the area to get directions for another quest that's set to need a high affinity for NPCs to be OK talking about it. If it were a normal dialog tree system the guy you know from the previous quest is effectively dead for eternity now and you need to go crack into a different one-off NPC's dialog tree to get directions. And there's nothing stopping you from having traditional dialog trees when appropriate, like having a unique dialog with Vivec. They should have kept refining it and putting more work into it.

>>12167534
*with the caveat that of course they couldn't do it with voiced dialogs and that was the fashion in Oblivion's time so RIP

>>12167398 (OP)
>and the armor system makes zero sense as the light armor the shopkeeper sells has 4x as much armor as the heavy armor
You had more skill points in light armor. Your armor skill increases your armor rating with that type of armor.

>>12167456
>It's like every NPC is hooked up to a central glossary, as opposed to being individual characters with their own personalities.
I don't mind this for generic hub NPCs if that's what you mean, they're mostly just there to give you directions to things in town or tell you about any possible quests in the area you could do. Unique characters did have their own personalities even if they had some overlapping dialogue options for information you might need.

>Also, there's like one piece of music that plays the whole game?
This really bothered me though. The music is good, but the game is so long that eventually it becomes torturous to listen to because it's like 30 minutes of music but you can be playing it for 50+ hours. Eventually I had to just turn it off though some people expand the music playlist too.

>>12167398 (OP)
OP, play it for a few hours. I first hated it when I played it. Same issues you had. The more I played it, the more I began to enjoy it. It became one of my favorite games. Same thing happened with many of what would become my favorite games. Eventually things will "click". You may even want to restart with a fresh character and appropriate skills. Redguard is a good noob class.

>Bland info dump
Yeah, but I still felt like many characters had personalities even in spite of this. It's also nice being able to quickly scan and decide whether you've already seen something and can move on to another topic. I much prefer it to sitting through voice acted boring dialogue delivered one line at a time. But I get that's a preference not all people might have

>Missing in battle, weird armor ratings, peasant killed me
Increase your skills.

>Music
There's not very many tracks so it can get repetitive, but I do like all of the tracks in the game. Sometimes the right one would come on at the right time and it would just add some magic to the world.

>>12167398 (OP)
>Hating on morrowind without mentioning cliff racers
Try actually playing the game next time

>>12167626
They're so much less of an issue in OpenMW because they don't just hover in the air above you without coming down anymore.

>>12167398 (OP)
>>12167438
Every time I come here thinking I'll get comfy retro talk, I'm quickly reminded that everyone here is actually just an unhappy faggot.

>>12167398 (OP)
babby's first rpg. accessible escapism for xbox kiddies but utterly boring if you want an actually engaging game

>>12167398 (OP)
I like Bloodmoon and Tribunal more than the main game

>>12167631
Good thing you have /v/ and /vrpg/ if you need a thread every ten minutes for this shit for underage retards

>>12167659
Why?

>>12167667
Shorter travel distances, more engaging story, more interesting npcs

>>12167668
Thank you

>>12167659
Bloodmoon is a 10/10 video game expansion, but Tribunal is falls a bit short imo. The series of fetch quests it sends you on is way too long and doesn't really get interesting until the very end.
Having eventually to duel the peasant you kept donating money to was a phenomenal side quest though.
>>12167662
>I DONT LIKE IT I DONT LIKE IT I DONT LIKE ITTT

>>12167402
i am stopping him

>>12167398 (OP)
>the world
Is beautiful. Brown is a beautiful color. It's the color of the earth, pulsating with life. Not that you'd ever get it.

>NPCs
Not everyone is important, just like in real life. There ARE some people in life who you come across once just to ask them for directions.

>missing attacks
Just so old at this point. Read stats, just like any other RPG. Too lazy? Roll a Dark Elf (like you were supposed to anyway for lore purposes), pick Short Blade as your main skill, Speed and Endurance (or whichever one increases your hit chance, don't remember) for hit chance + Short Blade bonus, plus Steed or Lady signs. You'll hit 90% of your attacks as soon as you step off the boat.

>armor system
It obviously scales according to the armor SKILL you picked. If you picked light armor, you'll get better protection using that rather than heavy armor.

>It's boring! It's dry!
Since you mentioned mostly Nintendo games after this I can only assume you have the brain of a toddler and therefore reading is boring for you. Plus the lack of fisher pryce colors.

Here's general advice for any retard who thinks like OP. Don't even think about mods and downgrade the base game to 1.0. Then roll the character I described and play the MAIN QUEST, and the main quest only. No more fetching bullshit, no more busywork, just experience the actual classic Hero's Journey. Read some of Varg Vikernes' incoherent ramblings about ancestral cults to enhance the experience too (optional but recommended).

How the fuck do prices work? I go to a merchant to buy a longsword, the gold value shows as 160, but when I try to buy it shows it only costs me 20? Same with an iron curiass that shows 70 but she sells for only 4? But then after I buy them the gold value they show in my inventory when I try to sell them back has gone down to what I bought them for?

But random garbage like commoner clothes cost me exactly the price of the gold value shown.

What the fuck is this autism?

>>12167732
https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Mercantile

>>12167732
depends on your mercantile, personality, and npc disposition toward you. if they get low enough the merchant can start overcharging you too.

>>12167742
It's the same merchant, just different items, most reflect their gold value, while some are way under.

I think it's because it was in such poor condition though is why it was so cheap. Kinda odd you have to attempt to buy an item just to see the price

>>12167756
>I think it's because it was in such poor condition though is why it was so cheap
oh, yeah. lower durability reduces value too. sometimes you'll want to repair things before selling.

i guess it kind of makes sense to show you the base value so you know how much more or less the current price is for the actual transaction though.

>>12167501
Oblivion is trash
but Fallout 3 was kino, people call it Oblivion with guns but it's very very diffrent, for example stealth actually works NPC's are not hedious potato faced abominations level scalling is not fucked up and there is cunny (and shota if you're gay) in the game

Hanlons razor tells me not to do anything about retards but you guys all got filtered hard

>>12167786
Oblivion is kino of the highest magnitude. Maybe you're just gay and slightly under the weather and have poor judgement, it's all right you go on being you

9 out of 10 "Morrowind is hard/bad/confusing" complaints are solved by RTFM or looking at the lovely map that came with the game.
The other 1 out of 10 is just wrong

>>12168632
10 times out of 10 it's bait to get a fat morrowboomer to mansplain the basics

>>12167398 (OP)
overrated shit made for uppity ass crackaz

>>12167398 (OP)
>Star Fox 64
opinion discounted

>>12168842
>it's bait
But what if it isn't? What if it's genuinely OP's dogshit opinion?

>>12169128
>Star Fox 64 le bad
retard

>>12169492
He didn't say that. But that's a favorite of console gamers, so his opinions on PC games are rendered a bit suspect. Like somebody who's really into freeform jazz telling you that a techno artist's music is bad.

>>12169550
a person who's into freeform jazz is probably into IDM and i'd trust their opinion on techno

>>12169553
Point is, somebody who prefers X over Y is probably not a good judge of whether Y is a good Y

I hate how this board is becoming more and more like /v/

>>12169793
now that xbox and ps2 are being called "retro" expect more of this in the future

>>12169550
morrowind is a console game

after losing 3 men and completely failing to retake Fort Firemoth from the Lich's undead army, this Imperial Knight wears an iron mask of shame.
He self-isolates to Solsthiem, one of the most remote and punishing holdings in the empire.

>>12167398 (OP)
It's shit, yes. It was bad then and time didn't do it any favors.
But so is every single Bethesda game without mods. Just shit.

>>12169550
So are ALttP and DKC. Max Payne is a PC game. Morrowind is a console game. What's your point

>>12170869
Did he try turn undead on them?

>>12167398 (OP)
Nah, it's great. Fantastic sense of exploration and character progression. Very interesting world, lore and story.

>>12170130
port

>>12170916
the humble Turn Undead, you say?
no he did not think to try that.

That just might be crazy enough to work.

it isnt the skellie army thats the problem. an Endurance/Heavy armor/Block build with enough agility to not get knocked down can crowd control well-enough. this character never turned any undead because he is so slow and melee focused that I didnt want shit running away. TR's Grurn himself tho is the craziest Morrowind nigga I've encountered so far. I don't really know how magic resistance works so when it says "target resisted magic" and all my stats get nuked and the shock damage outpaces all my heals I lose my nerves and Divine Intervention out of there. Absolutely dooming the rest of the party. When I return I might be able to Turn undead on him and trap him in a corner though, I don't think he has any resistance to that spell effect. You're actually genius.

>>12170130
>>12170914
It's a console port of a pc game series, of a sort of game that consoles didn't really do. Xbox had a lot of those "PC games, but on a console" games early in its library.

>>12170130
wrong

>>12167473
indeed

The only reason people like games like this is because of the fucking lore. It'd be better presented a a god damn book.

>>12171040
It's easy to forget those approaches when playing on normal difficulty, but they can be quite effective.
Resist shock potion or spell could also come in handy as a backup.

>Morrowind is.... le bad
/vr/ has fallen, millions must go back to /v/

>>12172293
>It'd be better presented a a god damn book.
Morrowind wouldn't work as a book because of the free-form hyperlinked dialogue and the way lorebooks are dispersed around the game world. A book can't present things in this way and I actually think there's a good argument that this is the superior way to convey worldbuilding.

>>12167398 (OP)
It was the first game I played that let me shoplift and kill absolutely anyone I wanted so I instantly liked it as a kid.

imagine how terrible it would be if every NPC did have their own 'character'.

i'm not playing for 'the story' in the sense of 'characters that talk at you', i'm playing for the actual story. i will sit and read the books. but even i don't want a book for every single NPC, god damn.

I just installed Open Morrowind Expanded Vanilla and it's the same experience as when I played Morrowind for the first time, lost in a huge alien world.

Morrowind is a video game for people who don't like video games I guess, the gameplay is legit crap, but I love just wandering around and getting lost in it when I am too tired to do anything productive.

>>12173125
I tried playing pathfinder with the purple lady on the cover and every NPC had their own "character" and it was so bad and annoying, because there's no way to tell if a given NPC has a quest or no, so you're forced to learn everyone's gay life stories and go through quirky dialogue.

>>12173139
>the gameplay is legit crap
A staple of the RPG genre

>>12173139
>the gameplay is legit crap
true. i love Morrowind, and i think the spell/enchanting system is great. but even for an RPG the dice rolls are annoying. they patched in '[ ] always use best attack' because why wouldn't you? at least in Daggerfall, the different attacks were fun to execute.

there are a couple of 'better combat' mods but all i really want is a dedicated block/shield button, and any attack that physically connects registers a hit. that was something Oblivion got right.

>there's no way to tell if a given NPC has a quest or no, so you're forced to learn everyone's gay life stories and go through quirky dialogue.
it's also worth keeping in mind pre-patch Morrowind didn't have the full journal system so you were meant to just explore and learn this stuff, yourself. the dialogue that pops up if you kill an important NPC is a decent out-of-game quality-of-life thing. but KNOWING the game is setting quest_flag_a ruins things a bit IMO.

but having glowing green NPCs or exclamation points above their head is DEFINITELY too far. pig disgusting design. i want to be the one who figures things out. some clues in books aren't even quests in the game, they're just part of the world.

>>12173145
True, RPGs are have either bad shooter or bad tactics gameplay.

(>>12173157, more waffling)

e.g. as a sneaky thief i naturally broke into Hlaalo Manor in Balmora, why not. oh, there's a corpse. maybe that's some quest line, might even run into it later. we'll see.

but then you interact with the body, the journal tells you it's a "Hlaalu: " quest even if you're not part of House Hlaalu. "I have found the body of Ralen Hlaalo..."
ruins muh immersion compared to it just being some mystery.

>>12173157
Meh Morrowind combat system is fine for what it is. I never had a problem with it. It's as symbolic as everything else in the game, if you're a legendary fighter you just click at things and don't bother to block or dodge as your character does it for you. I don't wanna have to focus for close combat like I do in Mount&Blade if I am playing TES.

>>12173125
rpgs already figured this out by giving non important characters basic barks or very limited dialogue trees
>>12173145
RPGs tend to focus on one aspect at detriment to the other aspects. morrowind is good for escapism in muh open world filled with mmo quests. you can find rpgs with good combat gameplay like temple of elemental evil, but you will be disappointing going around the starting town and realize there's nothing of substance there

>>12173168
Morrowind legit turned me into a kleptomaniac. After playing it as a teen I started shoplifting.

>>12167784
There are a few sellers that sell broken weapons made of good materials. You can buy them dirt cheap and repair them at a fraction of the cost of buying them new.

>why do I keep missing when blacksmithing
>how hard is it to hit a dagger with a fucking hammer

>>12173157
>true. i love Morrowind, and i think the spell/enchanting system is great. but even for an RPG the dice rolls are annoying. they patched in '[ ] always use best attack' because why wouldn't you?
For the longswords, "enabling best attack" makes it always use the thrust but the slashes all do the most damage.

>>12171040
if you go talk to the nord lady in the back of the imperial temple in pelagiad you can buy a rly strong turn undead spell that costs very little magicka and never fails
divine touch or something like that
its supposed to be an ability, but for whatever reason she sells it

if thats too cheesy for you, turn undead itself is a pretty cheap spell effect

>>12169550
PC games aren't a genre. Console games are not a genre.

>>12169661
You can only like and be knowledgeable about one thing is a fucking stupid argument. You can only have opinions on things you like is also stupid as fuck. Do you enjoy scat porn? If the answer is no then your opinion on it should be immediately discarded. If you say it's gross, disgusting, you're obviously not informed enough on the subject matter.

>>12173197
You're not very bright, are you?

The entire TES series is like this. The only criticism that was necessary to write down for Bethesda's entire catalogue is as follows: "Wide as the ocean, deep as a puddle." All that changes is the gimmick of the game. It's kusoge and always has been.

>>12173197
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/impartial
>>12173206
your analogy is dogshit thoughbeit

The fact that they didn't gimp the game is what makes it fun. Sure enchanting is broken, so is magic, leveling, etc. but you're never going to figure this out on a normal FAQ-free playthrough. It leaves the game open to more unconventional styles of play on a secon go around. Why not just supercharge yourself, levitate up and kill Vivec and just skip the whole game? You can do that. It also makes it much more open for the new player, you can solve most of the quests by multiple means. This means people can adapt the game to their own play style somewhat.

I'm playing another game from scratch, I just solved the tax collector's murder quest and have decided to just do a coastal tour of the entire game before I embark any further on the main quest. By the time I'm done I'll have a very agile character with incredible athletics and acrobatics, archery, light armor and small blades, magic, etc. Maybe in a guild or something, who knows. I will let the assassins come at me too, people complain about them but they are some of the easiest enemies in the game and they have like 50,000 gold worth of loot each. This money can go right into enchanting weapons or other fun stuff, who knows.

>>12173886
>I will let the assassins come at me too, people complain about them but they are some of the easiest enemies in the game and they have like 50,000 gold worth of loot each. This money can go right into enchanting weapons or other fun stuff, who knows.
It’s funny: The assassins are delayed by a few levels for the Xbox version of the GOTY edition. On PC they can come after you at level 1 during your first ever rest.

>>12167731
>Roll a Dark Elf (like you were supposed to anyway for lore purposes)
That doesn't even make sense. The lore specifically states that the Nerevarine reincarnate will not be of any particular or specified race. In fact, lore-wise it makes LESS sense to roll Dark Elf because Vvardenfelloans will instinctively know you're an outlander, but there's no way they could know that without you speaking. Like, Scots can't tell who Brits are until they hear their accent.

>>12167731
>Then roll the character I described and play the MAIN QUEST, and the main quest only
That's the worst advice I've ever heard. I think I probably played about 100 hours of Morrowind before I looked for the Dwemer Puzzle Box. That quest is some of the most bullshit bullshit in the game, too.

One piece of advice: get comfortable looking up solutions or directions online. Some of the stuff in the game is incredibly cryptic, but it's all part of the adventure IMO.

>>12167501
>>12167786
Fallout isn't good and it isn't retro either

>>12173229
He's not describing someone impartial, he's saying someone with a positive bias will have better opinions about something.

I haven't finished it but I really enjoyed what I've played of it. Using a physical map to get around based on NPC directions is super fun

>>12173976
>That's the worst advice I've ever heard.
I think I recognize his posting style, he showed up prominently in this thread:
>https://warosu.org/vr/thread/11680990
>>11682264

>>12174006
*Fallout 3

>>12173969
Well I think they assumed you'd already be pretty far along in Morrowind considering it was an expansion. So it makes more sense for an elite assassin to wake you up in the middle of the night in this case.

It's kinda broken that they show up (and level scaled) right off the bat, but I'll take the free loot of course.

>>12173976
Just read the lore, it's required for the game. Even the journal won't do sometimes. It's supposed to be a fun adventure, not some "follow the magic dot on the compass" type thing. Like almost all games are these days.