Thread 3809808

Will AI gonna save indie RPGs? I think everyone is sick of "shitty looking but on purpose clone of ps2/pegasus game" graphics and, worse, gameplay.
I wouldnt mind another Dark Messiah with Songs of Conquest graphics...

>>3809808 (OP)
No AI is shit sloppa.

>>3809814
Being talentless copy-paste maker games about le depression and sadness is sloppa just as well. At least ai being something new on the table

>>3809808 (OP)
>ugly pixel art
>character shrinks while walking
>nonsensical terrain
>10 kilometer tall castle

aijeets are never gonna make it

>>3809830
Nice gif nigger

>>3809830
>nonsensical terrain
>10 kilometer tall castle
Sounds metal as fuck, honestly.

>>3809808 (OP)
AI saves nothing and only makes shit worse. In fact, it convinces utter retards that don't understand what makes games good to think some AI art or some shit will somehow elevate their trash game.
Trash + AI trash = Trash.
Not only that, anyone that thinks AI is actually useful beyond extremely cheap and sloppy upscaling for remasters is an ignorant retard.
AC
2 assholes and some outsourcing made Disco Elysium (or a billion other 1-3 person game core teams). Like it or not, it was a big hit and well received.
What makes a game good or not, or successful or not, is not something AI can fill in for, retard. In fact, using AI cheapens your game and makes it come across as something made by soulless and talentless hacks.

>>3809821
Your genius plan is to overload the entire market with generated sloppa because there already exists hand-made sloppa.

>>3810000
Then i gonna enter the market with my hand crafted RPG maker teenage vs evil god fantasy game. Im going to be rich

I hope eventually I can just describe the game I want to play and AI crunches out a complete game overnight.

>>3810009
You would get bored with vidya in 6 months

>>3810009
>I hope eventually I can just describe the game I want to play and AI crunches out a complete game overnight.
Maybe in 1000 years if you're really lucky.

>>3810012
you're fucking retarded if you think that. how long did it take it to go from literally nothing to generated videos.

>>3810016
>>3810012
Damn man, where do my thread wander at this point? Are we only intelligent spiecies is space?

>>3810005
Don't get me wrong. If you churn out a lot of sloppa you might get rich. The AI bros on Youtube make 50 videos a day across multiple channels, not all of them take off, but those that do pay the bills. All you have to do is churn out 50 AI sloppa games a day.
But is that the world you want to live in? Think about that seriously.

>>3810016
You'd need actual sentient self aware AI that surpass humans in intelligence and creativity, while also being capable of creating entire games from scratch in terms of coding, design, art, sound, ux, ui, writing and more. It would then also effectively understand you so incredibly well to know exactly what kind of game your want in exact detail in how it is designed, balanced and so on.
Which would also be affordable and not draining enough for the average person to use.

Yeah you're right, give it another 10 years and this will happen.

>>3810016
Generate videos is a bit generous here. Anon is thinking about certain specifics and certain quality and consistency. The models cannot be ramped up to self-direct such an experience. It's a fundamental lack of certain techniques and even the basic research to base it on.

>>3810023
The only ones making money off generative AI are the ones selling it (read: scamming) to companies or clickbait.
Players also don't want generative AI in their games. Some tolerate it at best, but would prefer hand crafted.

>>3810027
If it gets to the point where it is possible, then just churn out enough click bait games and you will surely be able to make money. If 50 games a day won't do it then try 100 or 200 games a day.
What a bright future AI has in revolutionizing the indie game industry! /sarcasm

>>3810028
There's a huge difference between click bait trailers on youtube for sequels that don't exist to sucker gullible idiots and selling trash games on storefronts. One is free, the other isn't. One makes money off ads, the other doesn't.

>>3810028
The lower the barrier for entry, the more people will do that, so it'll be you competing with 10000 aislop games made a day, just in the early stages.

AI will destroy itself because AI can't buy games.

>>3809808 (OP)
>Will AI gonna save indie RPGs?
Short answer no.

To elaborate. There are two types of game makers "programmers" and "artists". AI works by training itself on existing works and emulating that.
So "Artists" making games will end up with mechanically soulless slop.
And programmers will end up with artistically soulless slop.

Sadly, the only way for programmers and artists to come together without their conflicting 'tisms causing the project to implode is with the use of a third-party middleman to keep the project on track and push it out the gate, which is where "publishers" come in. Indie devs tend to forego the middleman because it's considered a mark of sin for an indie dev to work with a businessman who knows how the industry works.

>>3810154
Sad truth.

Devbros be gonna be replaced soon, we need to form union

>>3810154
Utterly clueless post by someone that doesn't understand the industry, game development or indie game making at all.
At the indie level, publishers fund games and handle the release of it (a big topic to go into). They are not even remotely actively involved in the development or design desicions.
You're also severely dumbing development down due to ignorance into creatives and techies and then ignorantly trying to peddle the idea that these two groups cannot make good games without an outside party creatively or in terms of direction.
The worst part is that you're also close-minded and will brush all of this away, even if it was meticulously explained to you. But it's mind blowing how so many utterly ignorant people on this board with absolutely zero knowledge and experience from game development speak with authority as if they know what they're talking about, while at the same time dismissing everything else.

>>3810443
Looks cool to me

Like AIslop or not really is an IQ test thing, isn't it?

>>3810449
English pajeet, at least try using it
We need to make qhite internet 2.0 and fucking gatekeep it. Only thing sharty did right was banning india

>>3810444
It's also a short clip that couldn't even be looped and under any scrutiny falls apart. Like the massive hole in the left cliff, the fucked up finger on the left hand, the asymmetrical sword hilt, the strange lighting on the ground leading up to the door, the static lightning in the sky, the fucked up proportions, etc.

AI is utterly useless for game development. Especially if you want quality.

>>3809808 (OP)
>Muh AI!!!!1!!!!1!
AI isn't a person, it can't "save" anything.

>>3809830
>idiotic opinions
>plain wrong observations
>non-animated gif
>retarded
Many such cases.

>>3810460
Youre indie self made dev without funding arent you? Youre about to dinish soon?

>>3810460
and yet it is better than anything you could make in 100 years

>>3810468
>>3810470
>hekkin noooooooo don't insult muh ai, i paid for my sub so i need to justify my slop

I'm waiting for how exactly generative AI can be used to make amazing games, since you clearly have this all figured out. Go ahead and explain why you haven't made your amazing dream game yet with the power of AI.

AI frees gaming from the shackles of voice acting. Imagine all the resources spent on overpriced voice actors now spent on other aspects of a game

Games only become sloppa if they use AI in a sloppy thoughtless manner, but then again, under that kind of direction any game would be slop, AI or not.

>>3810476
>AI frees gaming from the shackles of voice acting.
Except it doesn't and you mark yourself as wanting voice acting, but not wanting good voiceacting.
>Games only become sloppa if they use AI in a sloppy thoughtless manner
Which is always the case. The end result is always inferior. Generative AI will always be thoughtless, since it can't think.

>>3809808 (OP)
The problem with AI is that it's a meme.
It has zero consistency, be it in art or code.

You could maybe get away with shitty AI art if you then slathered it in a billion shaders and filters to hide its ugliness.
But you could also just take photos of your own hands with 5 dollar props bought from aliexpress, and apply filters to those instead.

>>3809962
It really just looks like a painfully small FOV.

>>3810474
I have, I am developing one but because of anti-AI retards brigading everything it will never be given a fair chance.

>>3810510
>fair chance
If the standout thing about your game is AI slop, it isn't worth looking at anyway.

If your game idea doesn't hold up with just prototype assets in a prototype state, it's not a good game. End of story.

>>3810431
Any point you were trying to make has been lost under your obvious 'tism fueled seething. So I'm giving you a fresh opportunity to re-write your post. And for the record, how many indie projects have you worked on, which ones have been successful, and how many have imploded due to the varying 'tisms on your team.

>>3810510
What are you using AI for?

>>3810516
Good job not refuting anything and only deflect because you're close-minded and can't accept you're wrong about anything. The textbook shitpost.
But you go ahead and ignorantly believe that there are only "artists" and "programmers" on game projects and that publishers have extensive creative and design direction and it's critical for a game to be good. I'm sure that all makes perfect sense in your ignorant and deluded mind, for absolutely no reason at all.

Now go ahead and make another predictable deflection post, proving you are indeed close-minded.

>>3810514
blah blah blah
art has no rules

>>3810431
>>3810530
GPT Posts

>>3810539
You thinking AI is what will make or break your game is pretty telling the design of your game is trash. AI can't design RPG systems, quests or anything relevant to RPGs. If that on your end isn't good, the game isn't good. Period.

>>3810516
Where's YOUR indie then? If AI is so awesome and makes everything so easy and simple and quick, why haven't you made any?
I don't even see progress posts in the dev threads from AI-bros. Ever.

>>3810539
Balance
Contrast
Emphasis
Movement
Pattern
Rhythm
Unity/Variety

You are wrong. These are the fundamental principles of art. Any high school required art class will teach this, but I assume you flunked out somehow. It is possible to break these principles intelligently and make something great, but AIslop is not going to do that.

>>3810476
All these resources will be put in corrupted pocket of diversity hires and other undesirables

>>3810510
>because of anti-AI retards brigading everything it will never be given a fair chance

If you think that's why your game isn't being given a 'fair chance' then you're hopeless and retarded. No one's giving your game a chance because you're a creativeless hack.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/3025880/Argonauts_Path/

See this game? This is what your games look like. You have no cohesive vision or proper design for your game.

>>3810605
>Sneaks in his shilling of average slop game
Fucking jew.

>>3810605
>See this game? This is what your games look like. You have no cohesive vision or proper design for your game.
Regular games have similar style inconsistency in spades, be it slop like "Kill the Spire" or global behemoth works like "Arknights" or "Fate: GO". This is common, your sperging is weightless.

>>3810667
See, this is what I'm talking about. You AI retards have no idea what style consistency means.

>>3810605
Holy shit that's awful. There's genuinely some kind of mental illness that allows one to look at AI slop and think "yeah that looks good".

>>3810672
See, this is what I'm talking about. You Anti-AI retards have no idea why style consistency means shit.

>>3810674
>The person enraged by "AI vibes" is accusing others of mental illness.
Many such cases.

>>3810676
>no u
kek
If you look at picrel and aren't immediately put off by how every single element is off, mismatched, and riddled with artifacts and AI hallucinations, there's definitely something wrong with some part of your brain that processes visual input. Asset flip rpgmaker sloppa games that have no style coherence look less revolting than this shit because at least those assets were made by humans.

>>3810667
>Regular games have similar style inconsistency in spades
The difference is that AI generation by default will make absolutely everything very inconsistent. Not just in terms of style, but in quality or is just plain making sense. Like at >>3810443 , the AI flat out didn't draw the inner part of the rockface on the left. It doesn't think and has no awareness, so it doesn't even stop to think "this doesn't make any sense". There is no thought or logic behind anything.

>"Kill the Spire"
You mean Slay the Spire and that game is even a good example of why the fixation idiots have with "needing" to have AI art in their games is absolutely retarded.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLITSvCz2rk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYS2SVny_1A

If the core design, systems, etc. of your game isn't good (i.e.the stuff AI can't do for you) then you slapping on some AI images doesn't matter. Your game is not good. AI or no AI won't save it.
If you cannot even make a solid prototype of your game that only uses placesholder stuff, then you shouldn't even be thinking about art of anything else.

The entire idea these AI evangelists want to peddle is that
>oh it empoweres solo or indie devs!
when the actual "game" part of your game isn't even there. It's lazy "idea people" that just want to press a button and have their poorly thought out superficial ideas translate into a game they can take all the credit for.
Their idea of game development is going to McDonalds, making an order for a burger with 3 extra slices of cheese, then pat themselves on the back for inventing the quad cheese burger.

Come back when you actually have a game prototype worth a shit before you start going on about how generative AI empowers you to make great games.

>>3810683
>AI hallucinations
>mismatched
>riddled with artifacts
I witnessed a lot of such "hallucinations" and "artifacts" done by both amateurs and professionals, both on concept design documents and "playgrounds.com" flash projects. Nobody pays attention to this but people who want to hate AI and simply found a nitpick to convince themselves to do so. And you...

>how every single element is off
>asset flip rpgmaker sloppa games that have no style coherence look less revolting than this shit
Yeah, you qualify.

>>3810687
>Nobody pays attention to this
People throw shitfits over fucking puddles, you gigantic mongoloid.
Even then you're saying non-stop millions of issues in your game "isn't noticeable" and doesn't impact the player impression. Even if you for some reason weren't put off by this, it would create a very strong cheap and lazy look of your game. Because absolutely no aspect of it received any attention or care.
If the dev(s) don't care, why should players?

You're handwaving away issues as if they don't matter, but would then in another thread nitpick endlessly over far fewer and lesser issues. Get a reality check.

>>3809808 (OP)
Absolutely no "this will make development easier and let one person realise their vision!" technology has worked yet, what makes you think this one will?

>>3810685
>The difference is that AI generation by default will make absolutely everything very inconsistent.
Not true anymore. Not in the least.

>If you cannot even make a solid prototype of your game that only uses placesholder stuff, then you shouldn't even be thinking about art of anything else.
So, by your own logic, AI art is fine on a good game. got it.

>It's lazy "idea people" that just want to press a button and have their poorly thought out superficial ideas translate into a game they can take all the credit for. Their idea of game development is going to McDonalds, making an order for a burger with 3 extra slices of cheese, then pat themselves on the back for inventing the quad cheese burger.
Motherfucker, that shit existed long before AI. Before AI there were asset flips, before asset flips there were "flash" and J2ME reskins, ferothe these reskins there were .WAD generators. It's almost like the AI is not the problem, people are.

>>3810693
Lol, an autist asks for a reality check. But more to the point, people didn't nitpich Age of Decadence, Oblivion, Skyrim, Morrowind, BG, Goldsource games and many others for you allegorical puddles (all kind of bugs, graphical errors, et c.). Why? Because games were solid gameplay-wise or nerrative-wise. People are nitpicking graphics (like they did with Avowed) because the game was, at it's core, shit, and they rode on that hate train because it was cool to do. Nobody but neo-luddites will ape out over AI if the game will be enjoyable.

>>3810696
>Not true anymore. Not in the least.
We literally have examples of this in this very thread and this happens every single time and this becomes massively more likely the more stuff it generates. You're clueless.

>So, by your own logic, AI art is fine on a good game. got it.
Nice goalpost moving and deflection. As expected of someone closeminded.

But sure, using generative AI is fine if you don't care about the quality drop, massive amounts of inconsistencies and that no player actually wants AI. It's not appealing and flat out cheapens your game, doing you absolutely no favors. Players outright associate AI art in particular with a cheap assetflips or scams. Is that what you want to associate your game with? Then go right ahead.

>Motherfucker, that shit existed long before AI
Yes, lazy idiots existed before generative AI. But now they feel empowered and are very vocal about it. Too bad they have nothing to show for it. Where are all these amazing games that were held back because some genius dev just couldn't make it without generative AI?

>>3810705
>Lol, an autist asks for a reality check. But more to the point, people didn't nitpich Age of Decadence, Oblivion, Skyrim, Morrowind, BG, Goldsource games and many others for you allegorical puddles

You're one dense tard.
You claimed "no one cares" and that "no one notices" when they very clearly do. If every other character has an extra finger, if every 5th mountain has large chunks outright missing, if every other character has strange inflections and so on, if every 3rd line reads in a very strange disjointed manner, etc. people will notice and it will all impact their overall experience. The end result will be a distinct lack of quality and care, which will also break their immersion and take them out of the game.

>Nobody but neo-luddites will ape out over AI if the game will be enjoyable.
Except people do it all the time. Even over smaller things like with The Alters that received a bunch of negative reviews, refunds, flak and more.
Players do not like generative AI and why should they?

You can live in your little bubble all you like, but generative AI is not effective for game development (especially if your goal is quality) and players don't like it.
So by all means go an make this great game that uses generative AI. No one is stopping you.

>>3810593
That's not an AI problem. It sounds like a human problem.

>>3810477
>Which is always the case
But it doesn't have to be

>and you mark yourself as wanting voice acting, but not wanting good voiceacting.
Good voice acting is overrated and with AI you just need a sample of such good acting to recreate entire scripts

>>3810717
>But it doesn't have to be
Of course it does. So long as it can't think the problems will never go away. This doesn't even factor in that you cannot directly communicate with it or give direct feedback like with a person, or allow it to use their own experiences and improve either the script or direction. Direct communication is by far one of the most important parts of game development.
Even then, it just copies voices of actors you're familiar and you erronously equate that with quality due to familiarity, but under any basic scrutiny it falls apart. Which would happen after repeated exposure to it, like when playing a game.

>Good voice acting is overrated
This is the default defense and deflection of any AI bro.
>no one cares dude
>no one actually wants good stuff
and so on. Which is ironically a misguided and confused idea that is outright hypocritical. Because the very reason people like you would want to use AI is to increase the perceived idea of quality.
To top it off, people like you love to go on about how no one cares yet have nothing to actually back it up with.

Again, no one is stopping you from making this supposed mythical unicorn of a great game that made heavy use of gen AI and "proving the haters wrong".

>>3810721
You are radicalized and incapable of seeing nuance in this subject.

I say good voice acting is "overrated" in the sense that it's a waste of resources to spend millions just on that. Morrowind is a masterpiece and its vocie acting is minimal and could be fully voiced with AI assistance with few resources spent. You'd just need some quality control to make sure everything is good, and some voice samples to feed to it and the end product would be indistinguishable from a human voiced game.

If you have a budget of 5 million for a game and 1 million of that is destined to overpriced "good voice acting" yet you can shave 950k off of that by using AI... That's a lot of resources that can be spent polishing the game in other areas.

You have something personal against AI, when it's just another tool.

>>3810733
>You are radicalized and incapable of seeing nuance in this subject.
I'm objective and you're not. I'm telling you the very real problems with gen AI and how players perceive it. You choose to deny all of it. You are objectivelly the irrational and biased one here.

>I say good voice acting is "overrated" in the sense that it's a waste of resources to spend millions just on that. Morrowind is a masterpiece
It's like you're trying to win some grand prize in writing the dumbest statements possible. Morrowind is not relevant today in the context of voice acting and development.

And good voice acting is absolutely not overrated. Great voice acting massively elevates the material.
One of the main things peope rave about with the Soul Reaver series and what heavily contributes to the enjoyment of those games is the voiceacting. If those games had mediocre voiceacting it's not even unlikely they wouldn't even be half as well regarded.

Sound, music and voiceacting are all very important and impactful in media. If any one of these aspects is great or even good it massively elevates the material.

Again, you can by all means choose to use AI voiceacting for your game, but if you're surprised when players aren't receptive of it that's entirely on you. You can shitpost all you want and stick your head in the sand, but that won't change a thing, regardless of what fallacy you choose to regurgitate next.

>>3810000
Already happened when Valve greenlit letting a bunch of game maker slop on the platform.

>>3810743
>give direct feedback like with a person, or allow it to use their own experiences and improve either the script or direction.
This is wrong, though. It can indeed improve and be receptive to feedback.

>Morrowind is not relevant today in the context of voice acting and development.
I stopped reading right here. Morrowind is the crown jewel of RPGs even to this day. You're a shitter and your opinion is now irrelevant.

>>3810752
>This is wrong, though. It can indeed improve and be receptive to feedback.
Uh huh, clearly like with a human where you can have a back and forth chat, point to specific things, describe stuff, they come with suggestions or feedback, etc. etc. etc.
Stop being disingenuous, it makes you come across as a massive idiot, which I'm assuming you're not. You damn well know the way you can interact with another person is not even close to that of a gen AI.

>I stopped reading right here. Morrowind is the crown jewel of RPGs
Again, I'm going to let this slide because I assume you're not as stupid as you desperately seem to want to paint yourself as.

You tried to make the argument for Morrowind in terms of modern game development in terms of voiceacting.
First off, this thread is about AI and indie development. But for a AAA game like a modern day Morrowind equivalent would be, using AI voiceacting would be incredibly retarded. Can you imagine the massive backlash Bethesda would've gotten if they announced they would not be using any voiceactors, only gen AI voices? They would've been sent to the gallows by literally everyone.
Indie devs, especially ones that would only have like a handful of people at best, should not even consider making a massive open world RPG unless they want to either never finish the game, release it in such a massively unfinished state or take 15 years to make it.
It's an utterly irrelevant goal post to bring up on your end for the point you're trying to make about voiceacting. THAT is what I'm talking about, not you jacking off to how good you think Morrowind is in your most recent post. It's like you're not even aware of what you're talking about and what point you're trying to make.

>>3810752
>This is wrong, though. It can indeed improve and be receptive to feedback

It factually cannot. It is a large language model designed to match tokens to your input. It has no concept of right or wrong or feedback. To believe otherwise is objectively delusional and ignore how they actually function.

>>3810683
Absolute ai sloppa mobile game

This thread is pointless speculation. Where da games? Why do mods hate this board?

>>3809814
seethe. ai can only make copy paste games so the only devs who will suffer are the ones who make copy paste games.
it's like conversations. AI chat bots can replace dull boring people, but only them

>>3810896
Eat cow shit you curry nigger, fuck off to v

>>3810958
>he says, posting in a /v/tier thread

So much AI hate yet not a single fucking game is being brought up that has a similar design or intention or vibes. Nothing at all to uplift real devs.
>AI slop
They type with scorn, but they fucking hate indie devs or otherwise anyways

Here's a quick list so I'm just a fag and not a hypocrite
Wizordum
Eclipsium
Sword Hero
Relics of the Oracle
FIGHT KNIGHT
Northern Journey
Dread Delusion

Looks better than daggerfall....

Kino

>>3811600
Wrong video kek

>>3811535
>So much AI hate yet not a single fucking game is being brought up that has a similar design or intention or vibes.
Anon, OP is nothing special in concept either. We got shit like Hexen or whatever all the time back in the day. And we've gotten games like it constantly that were also good over the years, like Amid Evil or whatever.

Oh and the most important part, OP isn't even a game. Now will AI be useful to make games like it.

>>3811616
Op played Witchhaven as a kid

>>3811616
It's good for concept art direction. We obviosuly arnt spawning in whole games builds with this style but someone can mimic the style and make another Hexen game or whatever in spirit.
or
>>3811616
>Witchhaven

>>3811568
I'm looking at some basic tools. With a vision I bet these tools could be used well.

>>3809808 (OP)
How the fuck did this fool anyone? I instantly recognized it as AI shart and thought it looked like shit

>>3811686
No you didnt!

Bros

>>3811813
what's the name?

>>3811818
Morrowind

>>3811666
>It's good for concept art direction.
No, it's not. Maybe at best just to spew out a bunch of random stuff to get some basic initial inspiration for the actual artist, but that's it.
Actual concept art is very iterative and contextual to the game, which can also involve correct in-game scale and metrics or other important things to consider. This isn't even touching on things like character turnarounds and such.

Actual AI art is useless for game dev, beyond making shitty upscales for remasters.

>>3809821
>about le depression and sadness
can we stop with this meme, it applies to like two well-known games and one of em is lisa which is far from sloppa

>with the use of AI everyone will be able to make their own unique ideas come to life bro
>some AI generated garbage becomes popular with normalfags
>everyone immediately tries to copy it because it became popular
>"generate something like this video"
This is what the gaming industry will devolve into should AI "assisted" development become adopted en masse.

>>3811947
It won't be, because the only ones that think it can don't know anything about game development.

The only ones at mild risk are mobile devs that make nothing but the same constant slop and release the same samey type over games over and over.
We're talking stuff like Candy Crush and all of their variants. Where they basically repackage the same game.
For actual games it will never become a reality with generative AI, for the simple reason it can't think or be directly communicated with. You would need sentient AI. But by that point, half of humanity or more would risk losing their jobs.

>>3811903
Someone please post that Toy Story gif about indie

>>3811953
>You would need sentient AI. But by that point, half of humanity or more would be dead.
Sorry, typo.

>>3811813
modlist?

>>3809808 (OP)
I would play that game.
AAA stuff is all copy-paste already.

>>3811900
The imagery being displayed in the gif has literally never been done.
This aesthetic, this hand drawn pixel like environment with that background (draw distance what-fucking-ever) does not exist 1-1 as shown. Clearly there's an interest and it hasn't been full conceptualized before now or even gotten this much attention if it has. That is the silver lining.
There's opportunity for some fucking dev team to nut up and mastery the intent.

>>3812171
>The imagery being displayed in the gif has literally never been done.
?
There is nothing "new" in that image. A first person game with a sword and a torch. You then walk along something that looks extremely linear, so not even an open world game.
Graphically 2D and 3D has been done a metric fuckton and still is. Like we're talking to an insane degree here.
OP short clip isn't even a useful proof of concept or a sort of pesudo game prototype. It's literally useless and doesn't answer any questions. You then can't even modify it based on feedback (which is actually extremely important during the concepting stage, since this is when most changes happen).
Even visually it looks like ass (no thought put into anything, tons of illogical things which you don't want in concepting, excessively repeated ugly ground, no in-game world logic, nothing) and wouldn't be useful for either 2D or 3D artists, since the result in the vid is inferior to hand crafted stuff.

It's literally a useless. I say this as a principal game and level designer that has worked on many games from inception to release, working with artists, programmers, directors, producers and so on. I'm not mentioning this to brag, but because I want to make it clear I'm actually speaking from understanding of how game development and concepting works.

During pre-prod, what you want is to answer the hard questions. Not stuff you know your team can do. If you have good 2D and 3D artists you know you can make a nice looking 3D game with 2D assets. That is not a problem and is irrelevant for concepting. During pre-prod is when you make your art bible, this would not fit into that in any way.
AI gen is incredibly useless for concepting.

>>3811813
The camera should offset itself so you can actually see what you're targeting.

>>3812219
You just don't get it, do you? Show us a game that looks just like the one in the OP. The closest thing would be modded Daggerfall, but the color palette is a lot less saturated.

>>3812228
>You just don't get it, do you? Show us a game that looks just like the one in the OP
?
How is this relevant. OP isn't a game either and never will be. There is nothing going on in OP beyond basically a still image with nothing interesting at all going on.
It's a generic vista down a straight path, with a generic torch an sword.

Realistically speaking, that couldn't even be translated to a 3D environment, unless you think houses should be flat billboards (basically 2D sprites always facing the player camera). Even old games that image is somewhat trying to replicate had 3D objects like houses as meshes.
Using the argument of "there is no game that looks exactly like that" is moot too, because the same could be said for a billion different images.
This is what I'm talking about when that image is absolutely useless in every sense. You put even less thought to this than the thoughtless AI.

>>3812335
>How is this relevant. OP isn't a game either and never will be
Yeah no you clearly don't get it cause that's exactly the point. It's not that we are expecting AI to makes us that game. It's that someone with a vision but a lack of skills prompted an AI to generate a quick glimpse of what his vision looks like. When you ask the AI to generate faux gameplay footage it doesn't just come out looking like that out of nowhere. But by using the right prompts you get a glimpse's of the requestor's vision. And such vision has become viral, people all over the internet are asking for a game that looks like that but done well (you know, without all the AI artifacting you're missing the point over). No other game looks like that, no other game has that specific focus on its art direction, and everytime a dev tries to point out how there are games that do, they post an example that looks nothing like it, further proving the fact that you don't get it. Are you this fucking uncreative that you're unable to look past the "uh there's a torch and a sword and a vista and its all made of pixels"?
I won't describe what makes people like the video in OP because if you can't see it already, words won't make a difference. But you are entirely missing the point with your example because it looks fucking nothing like it, in fact just seeing the design of that sword makes me wanna vomit. Someone, a real person, designed that shitty ass thing while people here are complaining about how the sword in the OP isn't straight (again missing the forest for the trees).
But you know, its funny. Because if you don't wanna see it, who fucking cares. Someone else will. It's you who is missing the opportunity to make something people actually want for once.

>>3812400
>It's that someone with a vision but a lack of skills prompted an AI to generate a quick glimpse of what his vision looks like.
Except there is not vision. Just some guy randomizing something with prompts until he gets he says "yeah that look cool!" and that's it.
Vision is better communicated with pillars and a prototype.

>And such vision has become viral, people all over the internet are asking for a game that looks like that
lol, talk about delusional. You sound like the guy that made these pointless videos and massively overvalue them, as is common with people dazzled with gen AI.

>No other game looks like that
And no game ever will, for the reasons mentioned.
Notice also how you specifically focus on how it looks at little else. Not how it plays or anything. You focus on the very thing that isn't possible to do. The one that doesn't "get it" is you. You fundamentally don't understand any of this.

>I won't describe what makes people like the video in OP because if you can't see it already, words won't make a difference.
Nice fallacy, it's just you not being able to articulate something. Which cements you do not "get it", you have no idea what this supposed "vision" is or what specifically is even appealing. You put zero thought into any of this. All you did was look at that image and go "that looks neat" and that's the end of it. You don't even "get" why you think it looks neat.

>Are you this fucking uncreative
The irony, this is gen AI lovers to a T. Zero creativity, zero thought.

>It's you who is missing the opportunity to make something people actually want for once.
No, you think "tons of people want this" which isn't the case. Plus it's not possible to make, as already explained. But I'd love to hear you explain how you can translate OP into a fully 3D explorable world using 2D assets. In detail. You can't

You could make this easily on doom engine

>>3812414
>lol, talk about delusional.
I've seen this same video on twitter, instagram, and now here. My friends have seen it and it wasn't because I metioned or shared it, they actually saw it first.
>Notice also how you specifically focus on how it looks at little else. Not how it plays or anything.
Because we only see the character walking in the video? Besides, it's pretty self explanatory what a first person rpg plays like. Sure there are some variables but that's up to whoever wants to make a game that looks like that. Nigger if you don't think we're talking about looks, you're missing the point by a thousand miles.
>You fundamentally don't understand any of this.
I'm an artist. A pixelartist and lowpoly artist to be specific so yeah, I do fucking get it.
>Nice fallacy
Just go get your eyes checked.
>You put zero thought into any of this
It's a 4chan post, I put as much effort here as I give a fuck about the topic.
>he irony, this is gen AI lovers to a T. Zero creativity, zero thought.
"N-no, (You)!"
>which isn't the case
Sure buddy sleep on it, tell yourself that so you feel better when you see someone else make it and become successful overnight.
>I'd love to hear you explain how you can translate OP into a fully 3D explorable world using 2D assets
No because that isn't the fucking point you dense jackass, no one is asking for that. What people see in it is the colors, the mood, the athmosphere and the sense of grandness in the environment. I know you don't fucking get it because you're not talking about what the rest of the thread (and for the record what the people on tw and ig threads) are talking about. Go, make your soulless roguelike deckbuilder #5739548493, surely people will love it just cause you have experience.

>>3812428
>I'm an artist. A pixelartist and lowpoly artist to be specific so yeah, I do fucking get it.
I'm genuinely laughing out loud at how pathetic you sound.

And, just to be clear, I'm not >>3812414, but I feel it would be waste to not share my reaction with the rest of the readers in this thread.

>>3812444
I accept your concession

>>3812428
>I've seen this same video on twitter, instagram, and now here. My friends have seen it and it wasn't because I metioned or shared it, they actually saw it first.
Cognitive bias at its finest.

>Because we only see the character walking in the video?
We haven't even see that.

>it's pretty self explanatory what a first person rpg plays like
Totally, Skyrim plays like Arx Fatalis which plays like Kingdom Come which plays like Might & Magic, etc. You just proved my point.

>Nigger if you don't think we're talking about looks
Good thing it's supposed to be a game, right.
Oh wait
>No because that isn't the fucking point you dense jackass, no one is asking for that. What people see in it is the colors, the mood, the athmosphere and the sense of grandness in the environment.
So you're not talking about making a game, just some shitty videos.

If it IS a game you're talking about, it's impossible in terms of tech.
In the image on the left, if you use 2D sprites (billboards/cards) and the player walks past a house it would either become invisible or look extremely off at certain angles (bottom left) or it would have to rotate to face the player, which means it can't have actual house sizes and shapes, since it's a 2D plane.
In the image on the right, to make it work as a game, you would need to make it a 3D mesh with textures, which then means it can't look like in OP image.
I could go even more in-depth to explain why it's simply impossible, but we both know you will plug your ears, go into hard denial and say
>w-well you don't know! someone much smarter than you will solve it... somehow! I have no idea how! but they will! because """everyone""" wants this! y-you don't get it, fag!

You're dazzled by what is effectively a still image and can never visually be translated into a 3D space and a game.
But if you want to delude yourself into thinking this AI gen still image can and will turn into a game for absolutely no reason, by all means.

>>3812446
You literally conceded to everything >>3812414 said. He asked you how it would visually work as a game and you ignored it. That's called conceding.

>>3812450
I explained to you what people were seeing in OP's video, I clarified specifically that no one is asking for 2D billboards on a 3D plane, I gave you an example of a game that gets close to it (modded Daggerfall) yet here you are explaining it with MsPaint doodles. But I'm the one with no reading comprehension. If you have to resort to making things up you're either not following what I actually said, or you're arguing in bad faith.
>>3812452
I accept your concession.

>>3812428
>>3812450
And just to be extra clear here, 2D billboards work if they aren't that wide, since they can get away with having a cylinder collision the player can bump into. This is why the 2D billboards can work for trees or people, but not a wide fountain, buildings, the ground and so on.
Not only would a building as a 2D billboard have effctively an large invisible wall in front of the player, but it can't look identical from all angles and would look extremely strange if it rotated. Even if you used multiple billboards in a + shape. Because then something like a door would never be accessible.
This and more is why older and newer games that make heavy use of 2D billboards and such didn't do it for a lot of things like the environment or larger shapes like buildings and especially things like a castle.

This is what I'm talking about when you don't understand any of this. You're not thinking about the practical execution and implementation, only the kneejerk "that looks neat" reaction with zero thought beyond that.

>>3812455
>I gave you an example of a game that gets close to it (modded Daggerfall)
lmao a pixel filter? So basically you don't want OP at all.

You are so incredibly stupid and delusional you cannot even articulate what exactly you want, so you resort to midwit "muh mood" and shit.
Ok nevermind, I didn't think you were this far gone. I'll stop replying since I thought you were serious (hence me replying seriously and not outright dismissing you), but all you wanted was to shit up the thread. Well, mission accomplished. But what can you expect from some AI gen bro?

>>3812459
You're still going on about 2D billboard houses, I must've said it like three times by now but here I go again: nobody wants that, that's not the point.
>>3812462
>pixel filter?
I'm gonna ask you the same question, who the fuck said anything about a pixel filter?
>You are so incredibly stupid and delusional you cannot even articulate what exactly you want, so you resort to midwit "muh mood" and shit.
Oh yeah, that's not important? Why is Dark Souls popular? I'll go even deeper, why is a shitty unplayable mess like King's Field popular? And I don't play any of these games so don't call me a fromsoft shill or whatever buzzword you got laying around.

>>3809996
>and some outsourcing
That's the part for AI, dingleberry.

>>3812335
>>3812400
Tainted Grail is the game, it's aesthetic as fuck, actually better than most bethesda games, clearly has AI usage in at least some of it, perhaps not all, and if I can't tell that with 25 years in the IT industry what the fuck does it really matter anymore?

The only thing holding it back is a bit rough around the edges and unfinished feel starting late act 2 but they're still improving it with less effort than massive AAA studio slop.

AI is going to win this, because of course it is. If not by reducing dev time on graphics, then by reducing dev time on coding, level design etc etc etc.
This wailing and gnashing of the teeth over AI is the most normie shit I've ever heard and there's a high overlap with shitty muh art and artist leftists who are probably commissioning dogcock on furaffinity to keep themselves in meth and onlyfans payments budgeted. You should all probably get over it sooner rather than later and criticize games on the usual merits of are they fun, or are they full of propaganda and woke shit run as a AAA halfway house for makework leftist and unimaginative bulk H1B hire positions etc.

>AI bros hype up about new discovery that could revolutionize gaming
>looks inside
>it's just the Sega super scaler from the late 80s
Techbros are never gonna shake off the stereotype of inventing things that already exists, huh?

>>3812516
>That's the part for AI, dingleberry.
Oh I'm sure Disco Elysium would've turned out just as well if they let gen AI do all the UI, art, music, QA, voice acting, additional writing, coding, optimization, animations, sound design.

>>3812475
>an entire thread and can't articulate what he wants
It's comical and ironic, almost as if you were an AI shitpost bot. You couldn't even input prompts into an AI to generate something you want. Thanks for the laughs.

>>3812577
>AI is going to win this, because of course it is.
Only people completely and utterly clueless how game dev works can say this unironically, because they have no idea what they're talking about and because they have never even made simple game prototypes.
It's the same kind of geniuses that think they could give advice to a brain surgeon because they saw a youtube video about it once and now just as much as the surgeon, obviously.
It's actually pretty funny.

>>3812607
It is actually pretty funny, and I accept your concession.

>>3812602
You think they didn't have to negotiate with the third parties they contracted to do the work they needed? You think those third party contractors got that shit 100% right on their first go? You think you hire someone and always get exactly what you want without "dealing" with them? No way, homie. No way. If you hired literally anyone for anything before you'd know it doesn't work like that. Half the time you get shit work unless you watch them like a hawk and hold them accountable. If you think I'm wrong, then you are literally the one being watched like a hawk and held accountable or you're a worthless NEET. AI is no different. If you can't or don't want to do something, then you get someone (or something) else to do it and that's where AI is. Not a big deal.

>>3809821
So are AAAAs Games, like the last star wars game, empty and buggy.

>>3809808 (OP)
It’s all fun and games until you get directions from an NPC, turn around, and it starts hallucinating an entirely different game

>>3812769
Kindly explain how you would use gen AI to do
>UI design (not just making some 2D object), art (3D meshes are a no go and anything involving 2D is a massive problem on a larger scale), music, QA, voice acting, additional writing, coding, optimization, animations, sound design
Then point to a game that did all or most of this.

You're out of your element. Only people thinking AI gen are viable for game dev have never touched anything game dev related or even made a basic prototype or even a game jam. Every single time people like you just move goalposts, deflect or make blanket statements with no backing. Just like our good friend mr manchild here >>3812724 did all thread.
AI bros are always asked "how" and "why" but can never actually answer, instead they keep repeating their mantra
>n-no AI will replace all those shitty game devs so the game of my dreams are made for me! (becuase AI bros are too lazy and incompetent to do even the bare minimum themselves)

>>3812814
Hey I'm the anon who is constantly accepting your concessions. See, you're not getting it, you're arguing against a strawman of your own creation. I never said AI is going to replace you, I even said I'm an artist, and I don't use AI for my art, but that was never the point. The point was always the fact that someone without skills had a vision, and AI gave that person the ability to show others that vision. Now someone with actual skills can bring that vision to reality (or rather an actual doable version of that vision, since your autismo clearly doesn't let you see past the screen shows you). No further involvement from AI needed. You're shitting your drawers in the corner defending your job because you're so scared AI is gonna take over, you refuse to accept there is a way you could be gaining from it. But once again, you've shown that you don't get it by strawmaning me and shoving your head up your high horse's ass so yeah, once again I do accept your concession.

>>3812833
It's fine you can leave now, mr machild. I have enough material to point to how delusional, illiterate and close-minded you are already. You parroting memes won't make you fit in, nor will a mountain of deflections and projections. You're just an example I'll use, so any future (you) is incidental.

Bros

>>3812814
We get it, dude. It's over your head. I am 100% convinced any effort-posting on my behalf will be met with more shitposting by you. If you can't see how a personal assistant program with an ever-expanding suite of capabilities can blow the lid off of personal production, then you're just a lost cause and not worth worrying about. Continue to seethe that nobody is spoon feeding you. Ready, set. Go!

>>3812863
They do look pretty cool, but there's pretty much zero evidence that little forest world is in any way configurable. It's pretty much just an AI video and that's it. Trying to make a game with video footage is not really where we want to be.

>ai fags think this looks good.

lol. pathetic. it dosen't matter how many indians you have the end result of ai will be dumb and gay.

>>3813004
I hate disguating indians but i like how it looks, can we get white AI?

Remember who destroyed Ghibli with AI *shit* (kek)

>>3813052
>>3813023
>>3812863
every single one of these are just people walking forward bc AI is too shitty to generate anything else, and it would turn into Motion Sickness Simulator

>>3812863
>>3813023
>>3813052
These don't even look that great and a lot of parts don't make any real visual sense. Also good job in showing how distinct and new these games will be, now generate another 100 so you really demonstrate your dream slop utopia.

>>3813094
The concept is enticing, making it work is a lot of work. Musk said we will have a good ai game next year.
>pressing X intensifies

>>3813281
>making it work is a lot of work
You're getting taken for a ride. The only people making any money off AI are the ones making it, not using it. Anyone you stop and ask has yet to explain how it will actually work and instead just says trust me bro.
It's just the latest NFT thing, where they sucker large companies and investors to overinvest into it and just lose money. It's a scam.
>Musk said we will have a good ai game next year
Try never. Empty promises to trick people into investing into AI benefits him monetarily.

>>3809808 (OP)
AI won't ever be able to make games in our generations. What it will be is a tool for people to use to help themselves further their projects if used in ways that still show creative talent and capability beyond what others will use it for, which is a selling point to investors and AI-slop lovers

>>3813289
>>3813281
X for doubt. I don't expect it, but maybe I'll be wrong and musk will be proven right. AFAIK the pig cycle already started for regular microchips. Idk what their obviously overpaid chief economists are doing. Smoking crack probably.
>>3813289
Ai will never ammortize for the people pioneering it.

>>3813307
>Ai will never ammortize for the people pioneering it.
There is nothing to pioneer. Games are designed, something which AI can never do.

>>3813311
>There is nothing to pioneer. Games are designed, something which AI can never do.
Anon failing not only comprehending basic text, but also what ai actually does. (it's just math!)

>>3813366
>but also what ai actually does. (it's just math!)
I'm struggling to make sense of your demented statement and find any logic in it. Ironic you go on about reading comprehension, when verbalizing your thoughts is a challenge for you.

>>3813367
>I'm struggling
>it's your fault
That's borderline shizo, but OK. It's your life, so go ahead, avoid any and all books you see and stay smart.

>>3813376
>can't make himself understandable over text or even present a basic point
>blame others for being illiterate
>when pointed out he was unclear, keeps deflecting

>>3809808 (OP)
>Will AI gonna save indie RPGs
Save them from what?
The insurmountable problem is obscurity. If anything, AI will make that worse because there will be even more indie RPGs.

>Will AI gonna save
You should consult AI on writing your thread as well.

>>3813380
>Save them from what?
>The insurmountable problem is obscurity.

In case it wasn't obvious, these people don't make games or know how they're made.

>>3813311
>Games are designed, something which AI can never do.
Anon. The AI is the tool a game designer uses to help them design a game.

>>3813412
>The AI is the tool a game designer uses to help them design a game.
No, it's not.
Can the AI design several classes, with multiple skill trees, skills that all align with what your game is supposed to play like, with good balance, synergy, logic? Absolutely not. It's utterly incapable of it.
Can the AI make good world design that fits in with the narrative, quest, pacing and so on requirements? While at the same time ensuring good flow, orientation, landmarking and so on? Absolutely not.
Can it design good levels and dungeons? Absolutely not.
Can it handle making and implementing proper sound design for movement, animations, attacks and so on? No.
Can it design good quests? No.
Etc. etc. etc.
All the while being incapable of being communicated with directly, to iterate and adapt effectively.

AI is utterly and completely useless when it comes to design. It can only handle very simple basic things passably if trained for years and years with good material, which is extremely difficult to do when it comes to something like design work when compared to art which can just be stolen from google en masse.

AI supporters are completely oblivious to what it can do and what it's actually good at, which is astounding since you'd assume their interest would drive them to be more informed.

>>3813422
>Can the AI design several classes, with multiple skill trees, skills that all align with what your game is supposed to play like, with good balance, synergy, logic?
>Can the AI make good world design that fits in with the narrative, quest, pacing and so on requirements? While at the same time ensuring good flow, orientation, landmarking and so on?
>Can it design good levels and dungeons?
>Can it handle making and implementing proper sound design for movement, animations, attacks and so on?
>Can it design good quests?
Can you?

>>3813425
I sure do love idiots thinking that moving goalposts with logical fallacies is somehow relevant. This is toddler level
>i know you stole those applies anon
>(oh shit, i don't want to admit it, what do i do??? oh i know, i'm so smart!) i bet you can't climb apple trees!
But what can you expect from brainless AI bros.

>>3813422
>>3813429
Honestly I don't disagree with you. I'm just fucking around with the I, Robot image because I saved it a while back and felt like finally using it.

AI shouldn't be relied on for the creative parts of the game. The real gold is in using AI to quickly build tools to help make your game or to help debug faster. Things like simple editors and scripts to make changes and fixes. Stuff that isn't hard to do, but time consuming. AI helps remove a lot of tedious work.

>>3813425
>>3813432
that scene is so dumb anyways
>can a robot create a symphony
>can you?
>yes you dumb fuck any human can

>>3813436
Yeah it was never a good argument

>>3813379
You could've used that time to read a book and not fanfic'ing reality, channo?

>>3813422
Lol, yes to most. With ease. Better than most game designers. Faster, too.
Stories written by llm are lame, sure. So are most vidya stories. Llm have one gigantic advantage: their structure stories perfectly.

>>3813432
>finally using it.
Paid off
>nodding cowboy gif

>>3813453
>Lol, yes to most. With ease. Better than most game designers. Faster, too.
I absolutely love all the facts and proof you posted to support this bold claim. Oh wait. Is this another case of the AI bro just going "trust me bro"

>>3813453
>>3813463
2 more weeks

>>3813465
Ok Elon. I'll tell the other investors their big return is coming in 2 weeks. You totally won't keep moving that date like every other time.

>>3813281
I think you're more enticed by what you see in general which could be any old RPG from the early 90s updated. You don't want AI for that.
Musk is a charlatan. Solar City any day now, right? Hyper Loop any day now, right? Mar colony by 2023, right? Guy needs to come off the ket.

BROS the future is here

>>3813463
>>3813465
You can try it out for yourself. Even the bad online story writing ai programs write structural stories. Better than bg3 for instance. Which btw needed almost 2 years time before actual production even started. So yeah, ai is capable.
If you get actual storage, it will get much better results than the consumer llm.

>>3813523
>Musk is a charlatan
As anyone memeing as billionaire and being completely dependant on goverment gibs.

What is the point of replacing everything with AI? Get more product faster so you can consume product faster? The artistry is gone, not in any technical meaning but at a spiritual level. There is nothing impressive with the AI creation, no toil exerted by anyone who cared enough to create something. There is no passion involved and something about that reality seems abhorrent to me, more abhorrent than bad man-made art as that at least has an ounce of effort put into making it. AI art isn't even worth laughing at for being bad, unlike something along the lines of sonichu or The Eye of Argon. AI makes bad art, but there's nothing funny about how shit it is because there is no creator behind it.

I can be moved to believe that it can be used in tandem with actually making something yourself (that is to say using AI with heavy amounts of human oversight and editing or maybe just using it for a specific part of the process), but I don't know how much more effective that is nor how much the end result would differ from something not using AI. This is something the AI-shills almost never seem to do in their examples as I can clearly see something is AI.

If AI-art is art, then it is the laziest form of art. I'm going to sleep now.

>>3813574
Anon, AI cannot design games. Period.
If you want to stick your head in the sand that's on you. If you want to blindly and ignorantly believe in something despite having no facts to prove it, no game dev experience or even having made simple games yourself that's on you. At this moment you're nothing but an AI cultist.

>>3813707
>What is the point of replacing everything with AI?
Ignorant greedy investors and higher ups wants to reduce costs (but not their multi billion dollar salaries and yearly bonuses they give themselves regardless of how well the company did).
People that don't know how to make games and are too lazy to make something themselves just want to press a button and get their dream games.

Gen AI is good at some thing, but making games is not one of them. But it's the flashy new thing and they're dazzled by it and getting taken for a ride by the AI tool creators.

>>3813933
Are you saying that ai can't make a game with few prompts? Obvious. Ai can pretty much help with every element of game design. Ai's capacity is essentially limited by memory.

>>3813933
>Ignorant greedy investors and higher ups wants to reduce costs
That's not what ai is about, you fool. It's about control. Just how many people follow ai blindly? Usually 30-70 %, depending on the country. Control ai and control the masses. Eu and China want to dictate rules for a reason. No country, not even the US, wants people to be free. They are about market shares and political power secured through military capabilities alone. Ai is a military technology. The more drone swarms you can command, the higher your political power and ultimately your international market shares.

>>3813946
>Ai can pretty much help with every element of game design.
No it can't. You would understand this if you knew anything about game design and had actually designed things yourself beyond just clueless hobbyist level. I could explain in detail why, but we both know you would not understand it and not care, just keep on ignorantly believing that gen AI can do anything, for no reason or facts supporting it. Like a cultist.

>Ai's capacity is essentially limited by memory.
It's limited by not being able to think, not being able to be directly communicated with, only doing random output, not being able to do anything new and only being able to use data it has gathered and the list just keeps going.
It's only good at a very small number of things, yet ignorant idiots tries to push it onto anything.

>>3813952
Ai is used in music for decades, in hiring, too. You are likely not educated, nor a professional, so you are naturally clueless.

>>3813959
>let me just move goalposts to something completely different, that'll prove how right i am
Yeah retard, you totally proved gen AI is amazing for game design. You're totally not a close-minded idiot paralyzed by the thought of being wrong.

>>3813570
kek
Looks better, not pixelshit like AI.

>>3813978
I'm not moving goal posts. It can design games. Step by step obviously. Game design is a process and ai can help, already does help and will in future continue to do so. If that is for the better, we will see. If nothing changes structurally, I doubt it. Games got worse over the decades, not better.

>>3813707
The thing goes into the magical box and out pops something completely different. It's like the rule that all advanced technology looks like magic, except it has more to do with the public getting no education about AI since the 1950s since it started before CS.
The artistry is gone on a technical level too, all most of them do is denoise a statistical amalgamation of finished works based on features. It's not like the AI draws and paints, those models always work with produce end results. If you could ever do it for games the concept of the production process wouldn't just magically pop out of the statistics.

>>3813946
It isn't limited by memory. It's limited by computation. If you had a stack of paper, a pencil, and an eraser, and you could only do computation you could re-implement any AI used on computers. You just wouldn't attribute the same capacities to the stack of paper with computations as you do to the AI on a modern computer. That's just an issue with understanding and how you perceive what is going on.
You can automate many stages of development, they already are, but you would never back down trying to say you only meant automation based on some statistical models. The claim is that AI will direct and produce (part of) the game, but it has no capacity to truly do so and never will.

>>3814012
>I'm not moving goal posts.
Yeah, because game design is like hiring. This is not even opening that stupid can of worms.

>It can design games
No it fucking can't and I told you why, you dense ignorant idiot. You have yet to prove it with literally anything. You keep going "trust me bro" like all braindead AI gen bros do, because that's all they have. Nothing.

>Game design is a process and ai can help
No it doesn't help at all, retard. Stop talking about shit when you haven't even designed a single thing, worked in the industry, know anything about the industry or even made simple game prototypes yourself.
You're a completely ignorant and delusional idiot that keeps saying things with zero backing or understanding.
You can't even give concrete examples either, because again you are so utterly ignorant of the subject matter.

>>3814012
>It can design games
No. It can't. Only humans are capable of that.

>>3813422
>It can only handle very simple basic things
That's called helping, faggot. Your entire premise is convoluted. Nobody thinks AI is actually intelligent. But it can do some things and those things are a great help. I never said it was going to literally create games. I said it can help someone create games. I said it was a tool. You are agreeing with me in an extremely hostile way and it's ridiculous. One thing AI isn't gonna have is attitude, which is a huge pro considering so many (you and all the other faggoty trannies out there) screech like women whenever you engage with anyone. Goodness.

>>3814046
I thought it was clear that ai is a tool, not a core designer. You will need humans for at least 20.years, likely longer. A hammer alone won't build a house.
>>3814046
>The claim is that AI will direct and produce (part of) the game, but it has no capacity to truly do so and never will.
Wrong. Smaller elements are already 100% ai and it shows, in a bad way, that is.
>>3814049
>>3814099
See above

>>3814110
>. I never said it was going to literally create games
No one right in his mind thinks that. Some people are just cuckleberry finn levels of puke looking.

>>3814110
>>3814111
Mongoloid. You keep resorting to the same logical fallacies and plugging your ears while providing zero facts or even elaborations to support your ignorant claims.
You kept moving your goalposts until now you meekly state
>i-it can help design games!
when you have been told it can't. You cannot even explain how exactly it would be used despite going on about this ignorant and stupid shit.
I absolutely despite ignorant and close-minded faggots like you. People incapable of accepting that they're wrong or even engaging in basic discussion.

Get a load of this retard. Totally unhinged. This is exactly the person AI is going to replace. Emotional and mental illness spiraling out of control over a non-issue.
>>3814131
>same logical fallacies and plugging your ears while providing zero facts or even elaborations
You are be projecting. Your entire argument is "I told you it can't, dummy, so it can't, duh!". If you demand we bring forth evidence that it can help, then the least you could do is explain how it can't help. You already conceded it can do simple tasks, which is help, so it's pretty clear you're just talking out your ass at this point. Why does this discussion trigger you so much? Why do you care that people are gonna use another tool to help themselves? Why are you letting a bunch if anonymous posters on a Mongolian underwater basketweaving forum rustle your jimmies?

>>3814169
You literally cannot even answer the simple question of "How?" for the duration of at least half a thread. Instead you dance around it with logical fallacies.
Like you're doing now, you've been asked for half the thread "How" it can, but now you resort to asking others to state "Why it can't" (when btw that already has been stated).

A 4 year old can answer simple questions, but you can't, yet somehow you are still correct. Amazing levels of delusion. You factually cannot answer
>How exactly can gen AI help with game design, with a concrete example
If you were actually capable of this you would've answered it long ago, since it would only help your case. But you can't, but choose to be in denial about it because you're close-minded.
Grow up and learn to handle being wrong about things.

>>3814131
Nah, ain't. You just have severe problems, likely being poor and narrow minded fucks with your mind. Consider getting psychological help. Read a book, maybe about ai. Do post hands.

>>3814169
>This is exactly the person AI is going to replace
Exactly the reason he's sperling day in day out.

>>3810419
Right hand on left side huh?

>>3814389
>Right hand on left side huh?
Never heard of being ambidextrous, chud?

>>3810419
That's the Internet of today. One random piece of trash gets few clicks more and the Internet is flooded with cheap copies. What an innovative society we have!

>>3814440
Yeah, thanks Obama!

>>3814444
>quads of truth
He’s why my truck is so huge now

>>3809808 (OP)
>Will AI gonna save
>>3813281
>Musk said

SAAR

>>3815315
>SAAR
Someone's jelly, stay poor, non musk entity.

>>3814275
It's cute how you can't even explain in detail how gen AI "helps" with game design.
Should be simple if you actually knew, but you clearly don't. Instead you resort to excuse after excuse, just so you never have to answer a simple question. Read: You're just do narrow minded to admit you don't know and can't answer

>>3815717
Maybe I don't care enough? Why not ask your ai how xhe could help?

>>3815763
Cute excuse. You're simply utterly incapable of it because you know you can't but don't want to admit it. You 100% absolutely cannot answer it and you know it.

>>3815774
Ask ai

>>3814244
It is self-evident. You just want to argue for the sake of it. If "how" is so important to you, the least you could do is explain how AI can't help. If you can do that for me, then I'll humor you.

>>3809808 (OP)
The constant AI shilling everywhere on 4chan is becoming unbearable.

>>3815763
>xhe

>>3809808 (OP)
Would be really difficult to pull off. Art assets aside, the computational power is always the main issue with trying to such expanssive open worlds. Adding stuff like those lighting effects just multiplies the difficulty.

>>3809808 (OP)
That does not look shitty to me. That looks charming and I'd love to play it.
The anti-AI stigma is a stinking load of horse shit propagated by hypocrites and shitty artists who are bitter that they can't make a living on Etsy selling dog shit tier furry porn.
Ultimately, it's just simple fact that if you can't compete in an infamously HYPER-competitive market, then, sorry, you need to find another career. Just because you wanna make art doesn't mean you can make a living at it.
When cameras were invented, it was very disruptive for artists who had been historically employed making portraits of people. Photographs were loudly derided as simply not art, not accurate to the actual soul of a memory, lifeless and blurry and blah blah blah.
If game devs can't afford the $50,000 to hire an artist full time to crank out a few dozen concept sketches and then (slowly over the course of a year or two) a few hundred images, then ok, that's just the hard truth of economics. And we aren't even talking about what it's like to have your entire project rely on some sketchy douchebag who may or may not be lazy, who may or may not be very committed to their end of the contract, who may or may not just fucking die before the project is halfway to beta...

Stop worrying and use the fucking AI to crank out the art you need to get your project launched. Fuck the haters. Players want to play a fucking game. We do not give a single fucking FUCK if Vicky_Vixen69 or xXShadow_Kw33nXx can get their manicure this week.

Is your game fun to play? Great. Let's trade.

That's the end of that discussion.

>>3816174
>The constant AI shilling everywhere on 4chan is becoming unbearable.
Just a small vocal number of AI bros.

>>3816522
The self-righteous complex / weaponized victimhood posture you're using to salve your emotional wounds / needs is not a common thing. You are the loud minority posing as a moral majority.

>>3816134
>the least you could do is explain how AI can't help
Already did, which you dismissed and then for half a thread kept repeating it can design game, but then changed it to help design games. Neither of which you ever elaborated on.
Instead you kept resorting to logical fallacies to do everything in your power to never have to elborate.

>You just want to argue for the sake of it. If "how" is so important to you
That's literally you. Whenever someone asks you to elaborate, asks you a question or to back up your points you resort to logical fallacies. You have spent over half this thread just arguing and repeating the same blanket statements like "gen AI can help design games" over and over.

This is all because you are close-minded and cannot accept you are wrong or incapable of answering it. Yet you're delusional enough to not even realize you could be wrong or incapable of something. So you direct your frustration towards others and blame them because you can't even answer a simple question of "how".

You're arguing like a woman. Someone that knows they've lost. So they goad the other party, pushing them to have to do all the legwork until you can find that one tiny thing you think you can poke a hole at, which you would then go all in on and then use as some "proof" to prove everything else you were wrong about was in fact not wrong.

It's downright disrespectful how you behave. Several people took you seriously and responded seriously many times and all you ever did was plug your ears and shitpost.
I should frankly have dismissed you long ago as the mentally immature close-minded person you are. Since you are jus there to argue, not discuss. You will cement this with your next post.

>>3816526
Oh, so you claim a vast majority of 4chan is made up of people with genuine love and interest for generative AI? I bet you have proof of this too.
The facts of reality are agaisnt you. Very few players actually want AI in their games and are quick to jump on games using it, no matter how small. Yet of course you totally have proof to support that everyone apart from a very very small group of people love generative AI.
You surely have proof that almost everyone on the planet see generative AI as being the future of all industries and it can do absolutely anything, will save humanity and the planet.
I'm sure you have facts to support all this and more. That's it's just not blind belief.

>>3816495
Only worthless hacks who think doodling on paper for a couple hours a day is something only a genius can do rely on AI though.

>>3809808 (OP)
>I think everyone is sick of "shitty looking but on purpose clone of ps2/pegasus game" graphics
name one

>>3812863
Can you add a monster?

>>3816531
I did not say anything about 4chan. Do you have proof that 4chan exists? Prove it! If you're so tough, you better put up or shut up - prove that 4chan exists! PROVE IT! PROVE IT, BRO! BLAAAAAARGH.

Shut the fuck up and give me a recipe for syrniki.

>>3816545
Some of us have important shit to do, so we don't have hundreds of hours just laying around to waste. Especially if you're an indie game dev who is literally counting each hour spent on a project.

It's not about whether making shitty art is difficult. It's about the time cost of doing it, too.

>people think ai will save indie

the problem is being noticed and funding, ai helps with neither

>>3817099
Actually, can you add a sexy woman? Try “pixel art firrst person, quest: seduce the evil princess"

>>3816530
Hardly read any of that. DESU, it looks like you are suffering from some sort of psychosis/mental breakdown. You are stuck in some terrible cycle of emotional hysteria. I never said it can design games. I said only humans can do that. I am saying it can help create games, which is something you've already agreed with, so I don't really know why you insist I provide proof when you've already conceded that it can do simple tasks; ergo the mental illness. We all understand that AI can generate assets and even code. You still need to work with it, but it can produce *something* and it does so instantly and without attitude. You can argue 'til you're blue in the face that it's shit or something, but that's not what you've been arguing thus far. Your entire argument thus far has been "it can't do anything" and "i don't like it or you". You should stop. You are being ridiculous.

>>3816545
>You must be 18 to post here.

>>3817249
>ask AI to help get noticed
>AI says shill your game online
>ask AI to help get funding
>AI says get a job
Seems to ve working pretty well, anon. Honestly, if you have no problem whatsoever with iron-manning asset/content creation and programming, then you shouldn't have any trouble getting your game made. If it's good, then it will sell.

>>3810443
Why is it vertical? Is this a phone-only game?

>>3817441
Ai works in mysterious ways
>>3817411
Bullshit, no money, no game.

>>3817502
Looks like you got no game.

>>3817545
Looks like you got no international bank cartel at hand

>>3811601
What are these, smurf houses?

>>3817567
Smurf houses would be mushroom shaped.

>>3817964
Which ai do you use? Bing?

>>3817411
>If it's good, then it will sell.
Completely and utterly wrong. Many "good" games sell extremely poorly or don't even get noticed. Even more true for an indie game. If no one knows about your game, it doesn't matter how good it is. It doesn't matter how good your game is if it doesn't have a big enough audience. It doesn't matter how good your game is if you can't commicate the appeal of it.
Every year many indie or even midsized studios shut down or go into big debt because their games don't sell, regardless of how well received it was by the people that played them.
Not to mention many indie teams need funding, which they can primarily only get from publishers.

>>3817408
>circular argument with himself

>>3817964
Mommy

>>3817964
And that's how AI anon struck gold.

>>3817983
>struck gold

For the ones making the service for gullible coomers? Yep. For anyone trying to make money? Nope.

>>3817986
Anon, they're one and the same. Whales are huge gooners, after all.

>>3817972
>>3817983
Sorry that's handmade by lunarminxdev

>>3817992
Really? No ai at all?

>>3817992
...so? Doesn't make it less of a goldmine.

AI is the future. But not because it'll make good games, but because it'll make a billion games that keep your attention for 15 seconds, before people scroll to the next game.
minigame tiktok is gonna be a goldmine

>>3817990
If you're selling a service on the premise of making money, but the only one making money off it is the original seller then it's a scam by a snake oil salesman. That only makes the Pajeets rich until the well runs dry, not you or anyone else.

>>3818003
>minigame tiktok is gonna be a goldmine
highly unlikely, people with dopamine addiction to that degree will be wiped out in the next drug wave. Probably fentanyl.

>>3818007
Warioware sold. Imagine that but on a bigger scale.

>>3818005
Pajeets win AND porn sellers win. The generative nature means no traceback to the original source, so Hindu can't claim ownership. But they do get revenue for providing service.

That well will dry up fast though, that's for sure.

>>3818008
>Warioware sold. Imagine that but on a bigger scale.
Warioware is one game built on the premise of short appealing and unique games in succession. Not endless copypasted slop.

>>3818008
Neither Zoomies nor Alph-ass like warioware-like games cause they require attention.

>>3818014
>>3818015
you don't see the vision

>>3818016
There is no vision. If you made that people would try it if it was free for maybe a day or two and then move on because of the repetitive nature.
Tiktok appeals to idiots because of the vast variety and they can make their own shitty short tiktoks drinking a grimace shake. But if you want to invest your life savings in that idea go ahead.

>>3809808 (OP)
>short answer
no
>longer answer
putting aside moralfagging or whatever, there's generally just way too much work in constantly having to fix and edit ai assets to realistically make it a solid workflow, considering stuff like issues with text generation, messy pixels in pixel art, often non-sensical hallucinations and so forth - considering the likely appeal of using ai is that it does the art for you, you're essentially still having to constantly clean it up
like maybe it'll get better at some point but that coupled with the fact that a vocal minority of people absolutely loathe hate ai anything (and things like ai suppression on platforms like steam, a growing consensus of visibly "ai"-looking art being associated with scams and so forth) it just seems unlikely that a project so heavily reliant on ai would necessarily end up doing all that well, even if we assume it's got some kind of hook that'd draw people in beyond just "look, a *good* ai game!"

AI is devil tech, I wish it was never invented

>>3818152
Educate men without faith and you make them but clever devils

>>3818152
>>3818168
Speaking of devils, can we get more giant devil women in chains?

>>3811601
>>3809808 (OP)
>>3810419
>>3810443

How you would go about making 3D graphics like this?

>>3819390
First off, you can't. Impossible. Flat 2D sprites for large objects are just one of many things making it impossible.

Realistically, your best option would be to make it 3D but make use of filters to make the 3D look like pixelated 2D, while also using very pixelated textures. Or just go for some PS1 or early 3D PC games visual aesthetic. But neither of these would look like the AI image because that's just a short clip ignoring technical aspects of a 3D world.

Or you just make it a linear on-rail walking sim where you can never move outside of the linear road.

>>3819422
Why? Couldn't you have each "pixel" be a billboard? Something like pseudo minecraft graphics?

>>3819390
the vast majority of these types of graphics probably wouldn't work just as a matter of how billboarding works, like >>3819422
was getting at
but to play devil's advocate, >>3810443 would probably work the best - it's incredibly tightly railroaded and the video itself already seems to show that the building's actually 3d, so you'd probably do that with filter fuckery, clever use of background billboard sprites & lighting, then low-res textures on low-poly 3d models for a "voxel-ish" look (but ideally far away from the "plasticky" vibe)
the anon at >>3819422 made a good point about not being able to move outside of the linear road, though. i guess on that note it's worth noting that grid-based first-person games (like your typical dungeon crawlers) would probably stand the best chance with something like this but i'm guessing the appeal is in the free movement
>>3819424
>each pixel as a billboard
>approx 57,400 billboarded sprites permanently on your screen at all times that have to all change in real time at like min 15fps
surely you're mistaken

>>3819429
The world can be of much lower resolution. Say you had heightmap of 128x128 points and then let each point be an area of say 1/4 m^2 of a single color.

>>3817976
>if it didn't sell well instantly, then it's a failure.
It can take time for things to sell if you don't pay to push out the marketing. I guarantee you if it's good, then it will sell.

>>3819390
You could do 2D sprites in a 3D world or on a flat plane like Daggerfall.
>generate the models in 3D with AI
>convert them to 2D sprites
It's going to take awhile longer until AI can generate 3D models very well, but it can do 2D just fine. From what I understand, AI can't make 3D models very efficiently, so they have way too many polygons, but if you convert it to 2D, then it doesn't matter. The IE games (BG, IWD, etc.) did this and they look great.

>>3819561
>I guarantee you if it's good, then it will sell.
This has been proven wrong an infinite number of times throughout videogame history. You're just ignorant and delusional. Many games frequently discussed on this board didn't sell well and either didn't get a sequel due to it, the studios shut down, received massive layoffs or were sold off. This is even more true for indie games.

>>if it didn't sell well instantly, then it's a failure.
Absolutely. Especially for indie games but isn't exclusive to that.
It's also very rare for games to have a strong tailend over a long time, because the bulk of most sales happen around release or during a significant noticeable push (which most games won't have).
It's like you think studios, especially indie ones, just sit on pots of gold and can pay their employees and studio costs even if a game they just released didn't sell well.

If any studio owner said
>it's cool guys, so long as we make a good game it will sell and we'll be all in the clear, we don't need marketing, to promote our game or anything
that would be such a gigantic red flag them being incompetent and irresponsible you should start looking for a new job asap before the release of the game rolls around and you're on the chopping block.
Jesus christ, it's so incredibly obviously you know fuck all about game development, game business or anything adjacent to it. Just a clueless and delusional gamer.

>>3819581
2D sprites won't help you when it comes to anything of moderate size. A building like a house or church would be impossible.

>>3819593
>impossible
Lmao

>>3819590
Calm down, little anon. Your assumptions are getting the better of you. Minecraft is actually an excellent example of what I'm talking about. Released in 2011 by one man and now it's the best selling game ever. Guess when sales peaked? About 7 years later. You think he was shitting his pants worrying about paying staff? Doubtful. It sold pretty well out of the gate. Do you think he paid some company a enormous amount of cash to push his product out? Naw, dude. It was all word of mouth. When you make something people want it literally sells itself, thus he made a good game and it sold. Every game obviously isn't gonna be as successful as Minecraft, but good games will see their day if they are good and the ability to purchase them is maintained. You put a game out and keep it on the market and every year it can pull in revenue. The older it gets the more chance it has to "catch" and the more money it can have made. This ain't rocket science, dude. You can shit your pants about all your if's, and's or but's, yet it doesn't change anything about the reality of game sales.

>>3819593
That's nonsense. And not just because textured cube houses have been a thing since the '90s with Might & Magic and the Windows "maze" screensaver.

>>3819716
Explain how you would make a house using a flat 2D sprite not look strake when you get close, try to walk around it and want to go inside. Because these AI images use 2D sprites for such things.

>>3820014
A textured 3D mesh won't look like in the videos, which was the point, wasn't it? If that's not the case then there are tons of games both old and new with that look.

>>3819730
>Minecraft is actually an excellent example of what I'm talking about.
It's also an extreme exception. We're talking the planets all aligning kind of exception. It does in fact prove the norm (and you being wrong) so hard it's not even funny.

Can you list 1000 examples like it? A 1000 indie games isn't even a lot, it's a drop in the pond. So if you can't even do that you admit you're clueless and wrong.

The reality is that almost all indie games flop and those devs can't make more games or chose to not make more, regardless of quality. Many even go into heavy debt.

Only someone completely and utterly ignorant of game business and development could ever think "uh, make a good game and it will sell no problem". If you don't even have the mental awareness to think
>well, maybe i don't know a whole lot about this subject, maybe i'm wrong
you're not even worth trying to educate.

>>3820019
I hate to break it to you, but hey aren't making good games if they're flopping, anon.

>>3820115
Oh I'm sure every single game you love or like was a massive hit. I'm sure everyone in the world has ESP and knows every single game being made and has been made, while also knowing if it's "good" as in if they as a person would like it or not. Every single "good" indie game ever made had a very similar success story as Minecraft, you're totally right.
What's that? You struggle naming even 200 such indie success stories of "good" games selling for no other reason than being "good"? Who cares right? You know nothing, yet clearly can't be wrong about anything, that's how it works, right?

What's stopping you from making these "good" games that will have people flock to them automatically? You have AI to help you now, right? What's that? You're already typing up some new excuse...?

>>3820122
Quite the little drama queen, aren't we.

>>3809830
>what is fantasy

BROS

>>3817106
Indie devs only spend a weekend at most on working on a game though. They don't save time because they do not use their time.

Dude doesn't know shit about making fuck

>>3820478
Hes idea man looking for suckers

Dont tell Nintendo about AI...

>>3820530
https://x.com/philipjohnball/status/1952767070623437063

>>3809830
>>ugly pixel art
>>character shrinks while walking
>>nonsensical terrain
>>10 kilometer tall castle
Only 1 of those points is valid. Character shrinking while walking is dumb. The rest is subjective. You might not like the art, but others do.

>>3809814
there will be a point, probably very soon, that AI can write code better than we can. it probably already does. eventually it will do art, too. if AI doesn't kill us, it will revolutionize our way of life.

>>3820619
It will be The Second Renaissance.

>>3820619
Good, fuck those IT dorks thinking they are better than everybody else
Trad power!

>>3820620
>It will be The Second Renaissance.
Part 1 or part 2?

>>3820633
One with guy that got hands and legs ripped off his body by robot opressor
I should be older when i watched it

>>3820636
Part 2. That scene stuck with me, too.

>>3820530
Good thing that's a video and not a game.
Also, good thing you don't care about the quality of the world design, which is the main reason BotW took off.

>>3820619
>that AI can write code better than we can.
Wrong. For coding specifically it can be a tool, but you'd have to be a raving lunatic to replace actual coders with AI.

>>3820633
>>3820636
Peak Scene, even if I prefer World Record as a story.

Just generic pixel slop.

>>3809808 (OP)
>Will AI gonna

>>3822667
Let me holla nigga

>>3820756
World Record, Kids Story, and New Renaissance were the best ones, but overall it was a wholesome movie.

BROS FUTURE IS HERE

>>3825342
>says videogames
>all of those are short shitty videos with not a single mesh generated

>>3825342
>Black Death
A narrative heavy RPG where every person you interact with could be a potential plague bearer.
Want!
>Columbus
Open-world survival RPG
Want!
>Titanic
Rogue-like RPG where you have to complete a number of individual objectives before making it to a lifeboat.
Want!
>Lincoln
Hitman, where you play out the conspiracy to assassinate Lincoln, Seward and Johnson. Narrative paints your troupe has morally positive.
Want!