Thread 279683669

Why modern anime struggles with "overanimation" so much?

And yes, it's absolutely a real thing. Read about "principles of animation", they basically tell you things like "a fast movement should be less frames" or "use more frames to make a slower movement" etc.

It's why shit like "4K AI upscaled interpolated frames" anime looks like garbage.

It looks like modern Japanese animators are utterly clueless novices when it comes to this shit and lack any theory.

>>279683669 (OP)
you don't know shit about animation retard
you're a loser that never drew anything or did anything of value of your whole life

>>279683669 (OP)
It's not modern anime. It's just wan piss. The director knows there's nothing genuinely worthwhile about the story or the characters, so he overcompensates with excessive animation.

>>279683669 (OP)
>lemme speed up this animated scene
>im sure the newfags will fall for my forced animation bait
Your mother never loved you.

>>279683669 (OP)
>It's why shit like "4K AI upscaled interpolated frames" anime looks like garbage.
True. AI interpolation smooths motion artificially, removing the timing, impact, and intention from hand-crafted animation. It looks like soulless soup. There’s no exaggeration, no personality—just floaty garbage. Good animation is about timing and spacing, not frame count. Over-interpolation kills both.

>>279683669 (OP)
>>279683684
>>279683709
>Your kino, sir.

Are any of these "Episode Of" remakes worth watching? I only saw the Alabasta remake and I think the the Drum one.

>>279683847
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>279683669 (OP)
At least it's not beanmouth

>>279683931
The remake hasn't been released yet. Those have to be simple recuts like an official version of One Pace

>>279684289
As if Steven Universe doesn't have better animation than One Piece? It does.

>>279683847
THis is fucking kino though

>>279684885
So much that they now apply filters in their animation.

>>279683669 (OP)
>It looks like modern Japanese animators are utterly clueless novices when it comes to this shit and lack any theory.
Isn't this partly because some studios hired American twitter animators who just constantly did Sakuga to the point where they lost an understanding of timing and impact?

>>279683684
Not that guy, but I actually do draw and animate as a hobby and the whole "overanimation" thing is real. The thing is, doing something that flashes and is "overanimated" is actually a shortcut in a lot of ways. You can almost hide imprecision in flashiness. Putting the choppy linework as erasure on a black background with color in the layer behind it is legit easier than making 8 more frames of the same character all fully-colored and lit properly, and half the time the flash effect of a punch or a sword strike is LITERALLY one or two blank white frames, or white frames with choppy lines drawn over it. That's a labor-saver. It's not even a stylistic choice, they just didn't want to color in the next dozen or so in-betweens to make another 2 seconds of animation.
Overanimation lets you hide the absence of detail behind "style," it lets you hide sloppiness behind noise, it obscures the fact that less was done because visually it's more flashy, it leads to people assuming that grotesquely contorted proportions are some kind of attempt at squash and stretch and not just sloppy work, and it lets you skip entire frames or sets of frames because this one was an impact, oh and another impact, oh and another. 2 frames skipped, 4 frames skipped, 6 frames skipped....
Let's not pretend the complaint fell out of the sky among anime fans. I'm just explaining it. Counterintuitively, overanimation is unironically a labor-saver.

>>279685406
Now explain shit like this

>>279685494
The hardest part of this, 1000%, was Garp walking into the room in the first place. Deadass. That perspective shift was subtle and it's ever-so-slightly choppy but it's there. I know you're looking at the facial animations or impressed by the lighting or whatever, but I guarantee you the actual "hard" part of this sequence just in terms of mental "FUUUUCK" was just Garp walking in and that the sliding door in the background was used as a point of reference to make it happen properly because it's thankfully made of rectangles.

>>279685595
>That perspective shift
The slight pan, you mean

>>279685494
What is this from?

>>279685709
Eve no Jikan

>>279685494
It's weird because anime used to be known for limited animation plus occasional sakuga cinema shots, but this stuff almost has more movement than real life. In real life people don't jiggle every frame like that. We've actually got to the point where the classic style - have the character's shoulders move back and forth and just bob them up and down slightly as we move them in - is actually less far from reality than this. Ofc the defense is that this is a cartoon and is supposed to be cartoony, but none of the wacky frames have any impact if the entire movement is wacky and jiggly. It just gets lost in a sea of jelly.

>>279685781
This. 1000% this. When it's more animated than real-life and looks like bro's face is made of actual jello, it can properly be called "overanimated."

>>279685719
No really, is it the regular One Piece anime? That's crazy if so. I stopped watching the OP anime after Enies Lobby, I know they changed style with Wano, but it didn't look like that from what I saw.

>>279683847
It seems like they maybe try to overcompensate a little bit to "add intensity" to try and make things seem more hype, idk I think it works well a lot of the time though sometimes it might be a little "much", lot of mixed results with those handful of chaotic erratic scenes

>>279683709
It still looks like shit even if you play it at half speed.

>>279685278
That's literally it.
Studios are so understaffed they literally hire shitty Twitter animators who can ONLY draw meme sakuga short clips and have absolutely no foundational knowledge.

>>279683669 (OP)
It can be done well it can be done poorly. TV anime does what it can.

>>279686425
it will always look poorly because it ignores the basic principles of animation

modern anime hacks think that the more frames, effects and fireworks you slap on everything, the better it is, but it's not true, there has to be restraint and if something is idle or doesn't have a lot of action happening, shoving shitty effects because they are too scared of a calm scene (KyoAni is especially guilty of that) will only make it worse

>>279685904
One piece is a constant slog of different animators doing random shit. Sadly, most of the "good" animators they have now are absolute schizos who don't know how to do anything but vapid flashy shit with no real pacing or choreography. They have the perfect vehicle for experimental animation with Gear 5, but keep botching it with nonsensical bullshit.

>>279685595
It's a lot less impressive when the background is CGI.

>>279683669 (OP)
I guess its easier to "lol add frames" to a few specific scenes per episode rather than make the whole thing more coherent. Makes it easier to share on social media and reap the good reputation that comes with it.

>>279683669 (OP)
>Why modern anime struggles with "overanimation" so much
It doesn't, only the garbage you like does. The reason it's purely animated is because, well, the source material is also garbage.

>>279685781
> anime used to be known for limited animation plus occasional sakuga cinema shots
That literally describes current One Piece anon.

>>279683669 (OP)
To be fair the whole chomps the air thing in OP is all on Shida's style

>>279683684
Vincent hands typed this post.

>>279683847
I thought they stopped doing this shit after Porygon

>>279686699
Honestly just make Megumi Ishitani a permanent main director. She knows what she is doing as animation in her episodes actually looks great and fluid, not overly flashy or overanimated

>>279683847
is this an actual scene or did someone make an impact frame supercut?

>>279687495
It's the "previously on one piece" segment they do at the start of every episode

Are we optimistic about The One Piece anime remake?

>>279687552
damn that looks like it could kill someone from a seizure lmao

>>279685494
Luffy vs Kizaru was animated like this too. They make the characters too autistic.

>>279687408
OP has currently started applying filters. But it took them till 2025 to do it.
WCI and Wano were mostly unwatchable during fights to me.

>>279683669 (OP)
>Why modern

ESL monkey.

>>279687596
Its being made by WITs b-team with no good freelance animators and the source material is steaming hot garbage for little kids, so no, not even a little optimistic.

>>279687596
Remake also catches up to the manga and ends up stalling and tanking
Then they start another remake while original and remake 1 are still airing

>>279687596
Absolutely not.
a) the designs we have been shows are ass
b) if it takes that long, like 3 years, to produce East Blue, this remake is hardly going anywhere, we would be lucky to get to Water 7
c) I'm too attached to old VA, I can't hear Luffy with any other voice, his old one is too funny and charismatic

>>279688674
My biggest fear is any other crewmate VA retiring or dying before this shit ends, Luffy's in particular. They are all almost old grannies and grandpa now. Franky's VA leaving is already a huge red flag.
Oda is genuinely a fucking retarded idiot that doesn't know when to stop and how to keep a focus without breeding 100 unnecessary subplots and characters. It's insane how short the big climactic arc from pre ts is compared to how he writes now. Fuck him and his editors for not doing their goddamn job

I’m always bugged by “underanimated” 3DCG. Why do they intentionally make it choppy?

>>279683669 (OP)
slice of life fags really reaching these days

>>279687596
If it's gonna be overanimated seizure inducing garbage then fuck no

>>279689059
>Luffy's in particular
Nah the bitch can die for all I care. Why do you want her to keep doing the role? What lines does Luffy have in the manga that you look forward to hearing in the anime? Besides, here's a list of all her lines:
>GOMU GOMU NO (something)
>GIA SEKANDO/SADO/FOSU/FIFSU
>ZORO/SANJI/NAMI/USOPPU/(other SH name)
>KAIZOKU O NI ORE WA NARU
That's it, a bunch of shit you've heard a hundred times.

>>279687596
Do you have another 20 years to dedicate to One Piece?

>>279683669 (OP)
>modern
that webm is from 8 years ago
>>279683696
>the director
ah yes, the one director that does all of One Piece
>>279687495
what do you think?

>>279683669 (OP)
did luffy just fuck him into the ground?

>>279687495
It's very obviously every impact frame compilation from an episode/multiple episodes

>>279683669 (OP)
*clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack* *clack*

>>279683669 (OP)
>It looks like modern Japanese animators are utterly clueless novices when it comes to this shit and lack any theory.

I agree. Japs' autistic stubbornness is forcing the anime medium into something it is not supposed to be which is Hollywood Blockbuster + videogame cutscene. They try to add all the details and SFX like in movies but it ends up into a jumbled mess.

>>279685781
Jap director probably wanted to emulate cartoon physics but the thing is, One Piece didn't start that way so it is perceived as an oddity instead of an improvement.

The amount of mental illness and insecurity One Piece causes from people who don't actually like it, so they have to come up with excuses why things that surrounded are bad is just fucking sad these days. Sorry your favorite favorite IP doesn't get the money and quality poured into it like One Piece. That doesn't suddenly make it fucking bad. Grow up.

>>279683669 (OP)
>Anime has always been shit unless you are cherry picking. These shows are just 20 something minutes for children, OP, you don't have to watch things you don't enjoy.

>>279683669 (OP)
french and americans poisoning the industry

>>279691306
Yep

>>279683931
No

>>279692383
See this is what I mean with overanimation, top is perfectly fine. We really didn't need all those unnecessary frames.
You get the same story and feeling from both but top is easier to read.

>>279692615
Framing and angles are so much more important to a "cinematic" feel anyway. Look at this timestamp on this (heavily cut up) clip of Goku vs King Piccolo. They look like they are travelling very fast even though the camera isn't zapping everywhere, and that's because of framing, angles, foreshortening, proper perspective etc:
https://youtu.be/azO_2iQJu48?t=54

>>279690742
yeah anime is supposed to be girls sitting around and talking with nothing happening.

>>279683847
>>279683669 (OP)
>>279685494
No talent simple as. Masking the lack of actual proper animation with flashy stuff and pure nonesense. Also this kind of animation makes a particular set of people go "YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO SHIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEET LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO" on their couch making a reaction video.

>>279692383
>>279692615
The bottom is still totally fine, and IMO preferable. It's not disorienting or "overanimated" like recent One Piece is, where I literally have no fucking idea what is going on and get a headache after 30 seconds.

>>279683847
Bruh your epilepsy warning?

The more epilepsy inducing it is the more aura farming we're doing. If you can't even tell what's happening on the screen that's max aura farming yoo let's goo

>>279683847
Holy fuck this almost killed me

>>279683669 (OP)
next time just say "forced animation" and "rotoscoped" and save people the trouble. and ease up on the reddit spacing.

>>279691306
lmao

>>279690008
>the bitch can die for all I care
Rude as fuck

>>279691306
This why I stopped watching anime shows because these artist just want to give you motion sickness and seizure.
>>279683669 (OP)
Honestly could of posted this webm OP since people lack critical thinking.

>>279683669 (OP)
Some times it appears as though they use 3d models for certain character movements and it looks kind of wrong. The same type of animation they used to make picrel

>>279683669 (OP)
IIRC Juan Piss animation is outsourced to brazilians and other third world sweatshop workers. They obviously lack the expertise and resources of real 100 times folded nipponese animators leading to these weird ass sfx-ridden fight sequences

better?

>>279694988
>>279695027
>we live in a world where Tencent produces more high quality content than Bandai

>>279683758
Retarded Luddite faggot.

>>279695179
Truth hurts, doesn't it?

>>279689547
Anime is like 12 frames per second or something, cgi frames coordinate with that

>>279683669 (OP)
Old animators grew up in the real world and worked to imitate realistic movements OR realize their imaginations and passions in other subjects like mechanics.

Modern animators grew up watching anime and idolizing said animation for its own sake as a passion rather than real world experiences or other hobbies so we end up with said animation for it's own sake. You can notice how most overanination is just overly abstract artsy scenes, there is a distinct lack of talent in animating mechanical movement or mecha or realistic human movement for that matter.

>>279692883
This scene had good portrayal of speed as well IMO
https://youtu.be/4l1-UDCHjJs?feature=shared

>>279695210
Not as much as when my uncle came home, but it still hurts.

>>279695388
Slice of life anime is where all the people who can and want to do good character acting go. It's mostly the big battle shonen anime where people go to experiment with "new" (generally shitty looking) techniques which is why stuff like One Piece varies in art and animation style so much.

>>279691306
>>279692383
Agreed, the frenetic camera movement is torture to the eyes. Isn’t even that satisfying to watch either, not much choreography just explosions and characters diving at each other like missiles.

I really like this fight.
Luffy moves around, punches and kicks wildly, using his flexibility. If they have more animation budget I'd prefer they do everything like in that movie instead of the other examples posted here so far.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Xtf3NSPbiU

>>279691306
lmao

>>279695027
>>279694988
Not bad.

>>279696025
Why do the One Piece movies always have odd magic that doesn't fit into the universe. Just make up a Devil Fruit or some shit

>>279683847
I would watch an entire movie of this

>>279699312
Now people teleport with magic seals in official canon

>>279696025
Man, that was great! Especially after all the gear 5 and haki slop we've been fed in recent years.
Actually reminded me that I genuinely liked this series.

>>279699392
>*Blast loud sounds and show nothing but flashing anime lights for an hour and 30 minutes*
>Announcer:"THE AUDIENCE IS NOW DEAD"

>>279691306
Faster for modern cameraman

I'm surprised you have a beef with only the animation. I feel like so many animes have awful monologues that every character has to have before doing anything

I get ya. A lot of stuff doesn't feel solid anymore. Characters move like jello at a rave. Maybe there's too many tools now? I know HnK wasn't exactly stellar in the animation department but the characters at least felt like they had real human bodies and the action was coherent.

>>279683669 (OP)
It's genuinely just filler sometimes, even if it is counterintuitive. Some IPs are such a golden goose for the studio that the way to milk the most money out of them is to stretch the shitty source material into infinite hype moments, doesn't matter the cost, and this is one way to do it. Other times the hype moments justify the garbage writing (one piss, every popular western animation).

>>279683669 (OP)
It's not about quality. They keep doing this crap because retarded normalfags are impressed by it, and the clips get shared on social medias.

>>279687095
Shut the fuck up you tranny freak.

>>279683669 (OP)
Why he laffin

>>279685406
There is no over animation, you stupid fuck. Unless you are doing some stupid shit like 60p or 120p.
Animation is animation, period.

>>279702581
>you can never describe animation, it's just animation and is all the same

>>279696025
There are a decent amount of examples of One Piece anime being done well in terms of choreography/animation, but Toei is retarded and just can't go with a proper or specific direction for the show, so they end up doing whatever crap depending on the animator, pretty much what this anon says >>279686699

>>279703029
Needs more cubes and lightning. Also damn I miss old Chopper.